Michael Savage: Ted Cruz is a "snake", "identical to Rubio"

[compromise]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=U3WCOCcCW2c

Has Savage lost his mind?

[Ronin Truth]

Whatsa matter Mike? You haven't noticed the "politician pattern" till now? Wakey, wakey.

[Natural Citizen]

Has Savage lost his mind?

Who cares? There's a gazillion other very important things to hop on. Why do we continue to put these political socialites in the spotlight? These are weapons of mass distraction. Nothing else. This stuff is going to rot yer brain, compromise. Come on, man. Get with it.

Now, everyone is going to be Mike this and Mike that...again...for like the thousandth time. Completely steered away from the stuff they need to be concerned about. Fuck Mike. How's that?

[belian78]

Who cares? There's a gazillion other very important things to hop on. Why do we continue to put these political socialites in the spotlight? These are weapons of mass distraction. Nothing else. This stuff is going to rot yer brain, compromise. Come on, man. Get with it.

Now, everyone is going to be Mike this and Mike that...again...for like the thousandth time. Completely steered away from the stuff they need to be concerned about. Fuck Mike. How's that?
You sound as though you would think compromise is not realizing this already.

[Natural Citizen]

You sound as though you would think compromise is not realizing this already.

Well. Here's the thing. I've been involved with local politics and campaigns and have seen how some of these TEA PARTY Patriots are capable of disorganizing and disrupting what was essentially a coming together of like minds on a larger scale. People around here know the drill and to see it happen here is just reflective of the shenanigans I've seen out in the political wild before. This right here is "the game", we hear so much about from the folks who seem to think we're stupid or something. As I was saying elsewhere, a couple of cycles back we had this group really causing a mess between the Constitution Party, the Ron Paul folks, the "conservative" groups and, of course, stirring up a lot of occupy stuff. They're bad news the way they operate from within. From experience I can say that it has been systematic to disrupt what equated to a mass awakening and synergy among localized political people who desired to come together and then hijack the terms of controversy with this kind of romper room fodder.

Now, what really annoyed me about that is that they were successful. This is actually one of the main reasons I even decided to join this forum. And so, here we are.

To be clear, though, there are some very, very good people involved with the 9/12 movement. I'm not saying there isn't. There are people who have a genuine concern for where their country is headed and are becoming active in getting the word out on some very important issues. I'm not saying that it's a bad thing. But what I am saying is that some "thinkers" over there like to take it up a political notch and create a conflict of interest in order to hijack the terms of controversy. And then we find ourselves arguing over what the heck these political socialites with talk shows and who kickstart these non profit movements think about something that, in many cases, doesn't equate to a mole hill as far as the mountain goes. And, to add to that, it get's spun six way's from Tuesday and all of a sudden you are the one that is said to be creating conflict because...you know...we're talking about Michael freakin Savage over here. Or whomever else has a question mark behind their name in the tread title. You see? It's a damn wrecking ball.

And I really wish that I could go back and bump up the very first post/thread that I started here upon joing the forum.

I'm thinking I should just self ban myself and get back to the things that matter with all of this stuff at the local level. Way too much time blown on a keyboard. Waaay too much.

[enhanced_deficit]

Secular Zionist turning on Christian Zionist... did not see this civil war of neconons coming.

Keep it up Michael Weiner and Rafael Cruz.

[nbruno322]

Neocon civil war is a good thing for liberty. It should be encouraged.

That said, both Michael Weiner and Rafeal Cruz are phony scumbags.

[Pisces]

Unfortunately, Rand Paul agrees with Cruz on massively increasing H1-B visas. This is disappointing to hear from Cruz, though. I never thought he was that great on foreign policy but I thought he was better than Rand on immigration. I guess they all want the big bucks from the Silicon Valley big wigs so they have to promise them cheap labor.

[cajuncocoa]

Michael Savage has his blind squirrel finds nut moment.

[compromise]

Unfortunately, Rand Paul agrees with Cruz on massively increasing H1-B visas. This is disappointing to hear from Cruz, though. I never thought he was that great on foreign policy but I thought he was better than Rand on immigration. I guess they all want the big bucks from the Silicon Valley big wigs so they have to promise them cheap labor.

What do you have against increasing H1-B visas? Are you scared the immigrants will take your jobs?

[Pisces]

What do you have against increasing H1-B visas? Are you scared the immigrants will take your jobs?

Not at all. I just want the younger generations to have the same chance at a middle class lifestyle as our parents did. I'm not in a field that is threatened by these kinds of visas but I just happen to care about my fellow citizens.

[FSP-Rebel]

Unfortunately, Rand Paul agrees with Cruz on massively increasing H1-B visas. This is disappointing to hear from Cruz, though. I never thought he was that great on foreign policy but I thought he was better than Rand on immigration. I guess they all want the big bucks from the Silicon Valley big wigs so they have to promise them cheap labor.
Rand's plan offers visas to foreigners w/ a certain education level or who have money to invest in business. Cruz, via that Savage clip which I heard on the radio live, actually wants to increase 5x the number of incoming tech workers. As for the current illegals who are already here, Rand proposes to offer permanent working visas to those that have expired which decreases any incentive to actually become a voting citizen as most of these illegals are just here to work, send money back to their families and then retire back to Mexico once they're done. I would assume scaling back or eliminating entitlements for non-citizens is part of the plan but haven't read it in damn near a year. Those illegals that want citizenship would have to wait at the back of the line behind all the other foreigners that want in and are currently engaged. And the cut off in benefits for these illegals would force self-deportation.

[Pisces]

Rand's plan offers visas to foreigners w/ a certain education level or who have money to invest in business. Cruz, via that Savage clip which I heard on the radio live, actually wants to increase 5x the number of incoming tech workers. As for the current illegals who are already here, Rand proposes to offer permanent working visas to those that have expired which decreases any incentive to actually become a voting citizen as most of these illegals are just here to work, send money back to their families and then retire back to Mexico once they're done. I would assume scaling back or eliminating entitlements for non-citizens is part of the plan but haven't read it in damn near a year. Those illegals that want citizenship would have to wait at the back of the line behind all the other foreigners that want in and are currently engaged. And the cut off in benefits for these illegals would force self-deportation.

You're probably right that Rand's plan is not as bad as most of the Chamber of Commerce Republicans. However, I don't think there is a need for much immigration at all when we have so many people out of work, plus there are new people graduating every year from colleges and high schools that need jobs. I do believe there are some areas of the country that have tight labor markets but that doesn't mean we need millions of new immigrants. If businesses couldn't rely on cheap immigrant labor, maybe they would actually push more for other policies that would lower taxes and regulations and make the labor market in the U.S. more flexible.

Also, Rand's position is disappointing to me because I think it hurts him with the grass roots. Will corporate donations help offset that? I'm not so sure. He would gain a lot of more conservative Democrat and Independent votes if he would come out with a position that he wants to see America as close to full employment as possible before any increase in immigration, legal or illegal. And there's nothing racist about this at all. Allowing labor markets to tighten would help blacks and Hispanics and recent immigrants as much as whites. A possible side benefit would be that a tighter labor market would potentially put more money in the pockets of the sort of people that support our candidates.

[torchbearer]

You're probably right that Rand's plan is not as bad as most of the Chamber of Commerce Republicans. However, I don't think there is a need for much immigration at all when we have so many people out of work, plus there are new people graduating every year from colleges and high schools that need jobs. I do believe there are some areas of the country that have tight labor markets but that doesn't mean we need millions of new immigrants. If businesses couldn't rely on cheap immigrant labor, maybe they would actually push more for other policies that would lower taxes and regulations and make the labor market in the U.S. more flexible.

Also, Rand's position is disappointing to me because I think it hurts him with the grass roots. Will corporate donations help offset that? I'm not so sure. He would gain a lot of more conservative Democrat and Independent votes if he would come out with a position that he wants to see America as close to full employment as possible before any increase in immigration, legal or illegal. And there's nothing racist about this at all. Allowing labor markets to tighten would help blacks and Hispanics and recent immigrants as much as whites. A possible side benefit would be that a tighter labor market would potentially put more money in the pockets of the sort of people that support our candidates.

Rand's positions hasn't hurt this grassroot. So don't speak for me.
I have given him forbearance. I'd rather him get elected and have a chance to prove me right, than have anyone else elected.

[Pisces]

Rand's positions hasn't hurt this grassroot. So don't speak for me.
I have given him forbearance. I'd rather him get elected and have a chance to prove me right, than have anyone else elected.

You're right. I should have said some or many of the grass roots. I should have learned a lesson from the Black Student Union thread.

[FSP-Rebel]

Also, Rand's position is disappointing to me because I think it hurts him with the grass roots. Will corporate donations help offset that? I'm not so sure. He would gain a lot of more conservative Democrat and Independent votes if he would come out with a position that he wants to see America as close to full employment as possible before any increase in immigration, legal or illegal. And there's nothing racist about this at all. Allowing labor markets to tighten would help blacks and Hispanics and recent immigrants as much as whites. A possible side benefit would be that a tighter labor market would potentially put more money in the pockets of the sort of people that support our candidates.
The point is, this plan allows most of these 'illegals' to stay here under permanent visas as they are already here working and subsides any more police state talk + the cost of deporting them all which seems to be the standard talk of the anti-amnesty crowd. The ones that scream "No Amnesty" have their hearts in the right place and while I tend to agree with them under our current dynamic of a welfare state, they have no plan further than that to address this issue unless they're are for mass roundups which sets a poor and tragic precedent for all of us on matters further into the future. But this isn't amnesty in the eyes of the progressives as these people legally can't vote. This is the part that should be noted to these grassroots conservatives that are worried about the future of the GOP and whether or not it will become a permanent minority party. It is true that those that come from left leaning countries by and large always support more of the same and not more liberty, it just is and the degree is so overwhelming. We're so far away from the concept of free market open borders as things stand that the notion is irrelevant in the short term. The border security aspect of his plan states that none of these back of the liners have a chance at citizenship down the line w/o a sealed border w/ proven results. Moreso, Rand's freedom zones can be used to show that free market principles work and can create jobs and get things going in our favor on the economic side of things that has been dominated by progressives of both ilk for 20 years or more. As these zones multiply by showcasing the results and expand everywhere, the model of big government will be castrated and millions of jobs will have been created and the entitlement spending will shrink in many areas and allow younger generations a chance of having promising futures. There are many other policy variables that have to be corrected naturally but this is a good start as far as I can tell since the private sector would be in a renaissance and flourishing once again in such a way that most people can't even comprehend.

[Pisces]

The point is, this plan allows most of these 'illegals' to stay here under permanent visas as they are already here working and subsides any more police state talk + the cost of deporting them all which seems to be the standard talk of the anti-amnesty crowd. The ones that scream "No Amnesty" have their hearts in the right place and while I tend to agree with them under our current dynamic of a welfare state, they have no plan further than that to address this issue unless they're are for mass roundups which sets a poor and tragic precedent for all of us on matters further into the future. But this isn't amnesty in the eyes of the progressives as these people legally can't vote. This is the part that should be noted to these grassroots conservatives that are worried about the future of the GOP and whether or not it will become a permanent minority party. It is true that those that come from left leaning countries by and large always support more of the same and not more liberty, it just is and the degree is so overwhelming. We're so far away from the concept of free market open borders as things stand that the notion is irrelevant in the short term. The border security aspect of his plan states that none of these back of the liners have a chance at citizenship down the line w/o a sealed border w/ proven results. Moreso, Rand's freedom zones can be used to show that free market principles work and can create jobs and get things going in our favor on the economic side of things that has been dominated by progressives of both ilk for 20 years or more. As these zones multiply by showcasing the results and expand everywhere, the model of big government will be castrated and millions of jobs will have been created and the entitlement spending will shrink in many areas and allow younger generations a chance of having promising futures. There are many other policy variables that have to be corrected naturally but this is a good start as far as I can tell since the private sector would be in a renaissance and flourishing once again in such a way that most people can't even comprehend.

I'm actually not as opposed to letting those already here working stay as I am to increasing the numbers of immigrants. However, I don't believe the recently amnestied won't get citizenship or won't be voting. I think that will be seen as creating a permanent serf class and I think the courts would give them citizenship once this is challenged.

I do agree that we need to be careful that "securing the border" doesn't become an excuse to create a police state. I don't think TPTB that want a police state really need that excuse though. They have shown themselves quite able to push for a police state and open borders at the same time.

By the way, I still support Rand, although not as enthusiastically as before.

[RandallFan]

https://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/nrcc-chair-makes-kind-contribution-dccc_775973.html

Bill Kristol will run a candidate to the right of Rand on immigration and split the vote. Jeff Sessions, Allen West or Tom Cotton could steal Pat Buchanan voters and Jindal or Walker wins.

The GOP should not hurt middle class workers. Who do you think is being hurt by Obamacare? Legalizing the illegals means they can work in banks, armored trucks, airports, ports, military bases and all sorts of places. It is better they stay on the farms and restaurants.

Jeff Sessions: “Maybe they were working at a restaurant part time. Now they’re going to be truck drivers, heavy-equipment operators competing at the factories and plants and we’ve got an unemployment rate that’s very high.”



https://cis.org/north/house-committee-votes-admit-more-stem-workers-than-supply

[Pisces]

https://www.weeklystandard.com/blogs/nrcc-chair-makes-kind-contribution-dccc_775973.html

Bill Kristol will run a candidate to the right of Rand on immigration and split the vote. Jeff Sessions, Allen West or Tom Cotton could steal Pat Buchanan voters and Jindal or Walker wins.



That's another thing I'm afraid of. Kristol and his ilk are experts at divide and conquer. They did it in the '90's by pumping up Alan Keyes to take socon votes from Pat Buchanan. They don't really care about middle class workers or socons but they'll use the immigration issue to turn Republican primary voters against Rand so a Romney type will win in the end.

[NorthCarolinaLiberty]

People need cable TV and radio to make assessments on people? Hell, all you have to do is look at the guy's face.

[RandallFan]

That's another thing I'm afraid of. Kristol and his ilk are experts at divide and conquer. They did it in the '90's by pumping up Alan Keyes to take socon votes from Pat Buchanan. They don't really care about middle class workers or socons but they'll use the immigration issue to turn Republican primary voters against Rand so a Romney type will win in the end.

Jack Kemp was Paul Ryan's mentor.

[Pisces]

Paul Ryan learnt the ways of The Open Border from Jack Kemp.

Exactly. Jack Kemp is also a large part of the reason why we can't enact the libertarian solution of ending the welfare state as a way to limit the damage of open borders. When California voters passed a state constitutional amendment that would outlaw welfare for illegal immigrants, Jack Kemp and William Bennett were all over the airways calling Californians bigots. Then the state courts stepped in and overrode the voters and we can see the results in California today.

[Natural Citizen]

Legalizing the illegals means they can work in banks, armored trucks, airports, ports, military bases....





....and the guy monitoring and censoring your facebook postings that are a product of your first amendment right on The Internet about...oh...let's say immigration. :rolleyes:


Why do we think Zuckerberg and folks like that are all of a sudden interested in immigration reform? And, of course, politicians benefit from having their platform nice and tidy all over the web.

Oh, there are all kinds of jobs in the tech industry that an honest American "just won't do".

[unknown]

Unfortunately, Rand Paul agrees with Cruz on massively increasing H1-B visas. This is disappointing to hear from Cruz, though. I never thought he was that great on foreign policy but I thought he was better than Rand on immigration. I guess they all want the big bucks from the Silicon Valley big wigs so they have to promise them cheap labor.

For me, legal immigration is secondary to illegal immigration.

[William Tell]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=U3WCOCcCW2c

Has Savage lost his mind?

Savage is not a consistent fan of anybody. And he changes his mind on issues, and plays devils advocate all the time. I guess this means Ted Cruz's honeymoon period is finally over. I live in Texas, and I am getting a little sick of the Cruz worship I see among my neighbors. Even though Ted is voting better than I thought he would.

[RonPaulMall]

I'm actually not as opposed to letting those already here working stay as I am to increasing the numbers of immigrants. However, I don't believe the recently amnestied won't get citizenship or won't be voting. I think that will be seen as creating a permanent serf class and I think the courts would give them citizenship once this is challenged.

I do agree that we need to be careful that "securing the border" doesn't become an excuse to create a police state. I don't think TPTB that want a police state really need that excuse though. They have shown themselves quite able to push for a police state and open borders at the same time.

By the way, I still support Rand, although not as enthusiastically as before.

Yeah, I think a lot of people don't really understand that permanent residency (which is what Rand is talking about giving them) is amnesty. The distinction between "permanent resident" and "citizens" is relatively meaningless. "Permanent Residency" is what every immigrant craves, not "citizenship". Why should the 30 million who broke the law be rewarded with the Golden Ticket ahead of all those who are following the proper procedures and patiently waiting their turn overseas? "Citizenship" is a boogeyman trotted out by Pro-Amnesty Republicans to make their "Permanent Resident" offer sound like something less than the total and complete sell out that it is. And of course once the Republicans get Amnesty passed in Permanent Resident form, the Dems will play the "Citizenship" card to hilt in election after election as proof of what horrible racists the GOP are.

Permanent Residency is pretty much the stupidest plan you could possibly put forward. It is a complete and utter surrender on the substantive side while at the same time holding out on the superficial "citizenship" issue. The Dems get everything they want PLUS they get to keep their "Republicans are racists against Mexican" campaign talking points.

And the idea that the only two options are either spending billions rounding people up or granting amnesty is ridiculous. The Dems and Illegals Lobby are pushing amnesty hard for a reason. Living as an illegal is not easy. It is hard getting a job, hard getting benefits in many states, hard to do banking, hard to get documentation, ect. These hardships provide a natural pressure for at least some of the illegal pool to self deport.

Also, I wonder what happens to H1B Visa holders under Rand's plan? It would be bizarre if they weren't all granted automatic permanent residency too, wouldn't it? Because otherwise you aren't just favoring illegals over hopeful immigrants overseas- you are actually favoring illegal workers already here over legal workers already here.

[JustinTime]

What do you have against increasing H1-B visas? Are you scared the immigrants will take your jobs?

My jobs fine, but I know even more immigration will bid down other Americans wages and grease the wheels to everyone becoming a dependent.

If the plan is to decrease legal immigration overall, but increase the number of skilled immigrants, Id be on board for that.