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View Full Version : Farm Bill - Now Handing Out More Goodies to Big Organic, Too




angelatc
01-31-2014, 10:40 AM
Hurrah for lobbiests!


The $500 billion farm bill agreed upon by House and Senate negotiators (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/27/farm-bill-agreement_n_4676618.html) this week holds good tidings for organic farmers, an increasingly prominent constituency long neglected by the federal government.
The draft bill contains several measures likely to benefit organic farms (http://www.politico.com/story/2014/01/farm-bill-review-102726.html), including funding for research in organic agriculture and a federal program to market organic foods. (Keep your eyes peeled for "Got Organic?" billboards to pop up soon on a highway near you.)


My personal favorite:


The most significant change may be a provision that makes federal crop insurance more available (and generous) to organic farmers (http://www.oregonlive.com/business/index.ssf/2014/01/jeff_merkley_organic_growers_w.html).

So we taxpayers get to insure that farmers who don't use technology to protect their crops get paid when they fail. Brilliant.



http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/01/28/farm-bill-organic-farmers_n_4682881.html

ClydeCoulter
01-31-2014, 10:44 AM
You are surprised that government goodies flow like water and go everywhere? It's easy to spend other peoples money.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 10:48 AM
You are surprised that government goodies flow like water and go everywhere? It's easy to spend other peoples money.

Sure. I find it amusing that the government is funding organic advertising when most of the deaths resulting from food comes from organic crops.

Travlyr
01-31-2014, 10:54 AM
Sure. I find it amusing that the government is funding organic advertising when most of the deaths resulting from food comes from organic crops.

How?

ClydeCoulter
01-31-2014, 11:02 AM
Angela's on a button pushing exercise. What will tick you off, comrade?

Travlyr
01-31-2014, 11:07 AM
Angela's on a button pushing exercise. What will tick you off, comrade?

lol. I just wanted it quoted for posterity.

otherone
01-31-2014, 11:10 AM
Angela's on a button pushing exercise. What will tick you off, comrade?

Somebody is anti-business when she thinks the business is owned by Progs.
:rolleyes:

Ender
01-31-2014, 11:19 AM
Sure. I find it amusing that the government is funding organic advertising when most of the deaths resulting from food comes from organic crops.

That is the BIGGEST load of crap I have ever heard.

You are so pro-big government/pharma/agriculture that you will spout any load of shite that you can, to push your personal agenda.

AND- when anyone disagrees with you you cite every MSM propaganda you can find while screaming that alternate accounts are BS- because they're alternate and therefore can have no plausibility because paid-for gov shills and MSM are the only reliable sources.

Just blew your cover Ms Hitlery.

specsaregood
01-31-2014, 11:30 AM
AND- when anyone disagrees with you you cite every MSM propaganda you can find while screaming that alternate accounts are BS- because they're alternate and therefore can have no plausibility because paid-for gov shills and MSM are the only reliable sources.


You say "MSM propaganda"; I say she cites peer reviewed studies and information grounded in near universally accepted science. You say "alternate accounts"; I say made up mumbo jumbo with no actual studies, proof or anything near credible.

I'm about as open minded as they come and fact is the OP generally has real facts and information to back up her assertions.

oyarde
01-31-2014, 11:35 AM
The entire USDA should be abolished .

ClydeCoulter
01-31-2014, 11:38 AM
You say "MSM propaganda"; I say she cites peer reviewed studies and information grounded in near universally accepted science. You say "alternate accounts"; I say made up mumbo jumbo with no actual studies, proof or anything near credible.

I'm about as open minded as they come and fact is the OP generally has real facts and information to back up her assertions.

And it's still big government getting involved in everything. That's the point. What they get involved with will only create more debt.

So, let's get an argument going between one thing the government is involved in being better than something else the government is involved in, because the government is involved in it?

LMAO, it's pathetic.

Travlyr
01-31-2014, 11:39 AM
You say "MSM propaganda"; I say she cites peer reviewed studies and information grounded in near universally accepted science. You say "alternate accounts"; I say made up mumbo jumbo with no actual studies, proof or anything near credible.

I'm about as open minded as they come and fact is the OP generally has real facts and information to back up her assertions.

How is organic food killing people?

Tod
01-31-2014, 11:39 AM
The entire USDA should be abolished .


^ this

eduardo89
01-31-2014, 11:40 AM
The entire USDA should be abolished .

And replaced by the USDO.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 11:44 AM
How is organic food killing people?


EColi: http://theprogressivecontrarian.com/2013/02/28/hows-the-safety-of-organic-food-working-out-for-ya/

http://www.realclearscience.com/articles/2011/06/29/blame_organic_industry_for_e_coli_outbreak_106245. html

http://www.americanthinker.com/2011/07/organic_food_deaths_in_europe_could_have_been_prev ented.html

specsaregood
01-31-2014, 11:44 AM
How is organic food killing people?

She didn't say it was the fact that the food is organic was the reason it was killing people.

eduardo89
01-31-2014, 11:44 AM
How is organic food killing people?

Google is difficult to use, so here's some help.

E.Coli in Organic Food Leads to 50 Dead in Germany (http://pjmedia.com/blog/e-coli-in-organic-food-leads-to-50-dead-in-germany/)
Organic Farming Practices Cause 200 Instances Of Serious Food Poisoning (http://www.science20.com/challenging_nature/organic_farming_practices_cause_200_instances_seri ous_food_poisoning-626)

Does Organic Food Have Higher Levels of Fecal Contamination? (http://www.organicconsumers.org/Organic/fecal-contamination.cfm)

A recent comparative analysis of organic produce versus conventional produce from the University of Minnesota shows that the organically grown produce had 9.7 percent positive samples for the presence of generic E. coli bacteria versus only 1.6 percent for conventional produce on farms in Minnesota.

specsaregood
01-31-2014, 11:45 AM
And it's still big government getting involved in everything. That's the point. What they get involved with will only create more debt.

So, let's get an argument going between one thing the government is involved in being better than something else the government is involved in, because the government is involved in it?

LMAO, it's pathetic.

I don't know what that has to do with my comment; but sure ok. I think everybody here is against the govt being involved in much of anything. Since we all pretty much agree on that, it leaves the little things to nitpick and argue about.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 11:45 AM
That is the BIGGEST load of crap I have ever heard.

You are so pro-big government/pharma/agriculture that you will spout any load of shite that you can, to push your personal agenda.

AND- when anyone disagrees with you you cite every MSM propaganda you can find while screaming that alternate accounts are BS- because they're alternate and therefore can have no plausibility because paid-for gov shills and MSM are the only reliable sources.

Just blew your cover Ms Hitlery.


Oh settle down. I can prove that organic food contaminated with Ecoli is directly responsible for consumer death. You can't prove a single person has been harmed with GMO food.

I'm sure this will send you off into an ever bigger shrieking, name-calling fit.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 11:46 AM
You say "MSM propaganda"; I say she cites peer reviewed studies and information grounded in near universally accepted science. You say "alternate accounts"; I say made up mumbo jumbo with no actual studies, proof or anything near credible.

I'm about as open minded as they come and fact is the OP generally has real facts and information to back up her assertions.


You know what they call alternate science that proves itself true? Science.

oyarde
01-31-2014, 11:47 AM
And replaced by the USDO.

Absolutely , the USDO can operate off of a very limited budget with no farm bill , no food stamps etc

Natural Citizen
01-31-2014, 11:48 AM
You can't prove a single person has been harmed with GMO food.


This will change (and is changing) as we see research coming from countries where labeling is practiced and researches have an honest to goodness legitimate and recorded trail that leads back to diet. Really, the only reason these biotech companies and those invested in their products don't want their concoctions labeled is because then there is a means to trace it back to to them.

Stay tuned, angelatc. Oh, yes. A storm is coming.

oyarde
01-31-2014, 11:49 AM
Do not poop where you eat :)

angelatc
01-31-2014, 11:49 AM
This will change (and is changing) as we see research coming from countries where labeling is practiced and researches have an honst to goodness legitimate trail that leads back to diet. Really, the only reason these biotech companies don't want their concoctions labeled is because then there is a means to trace it back to to them.

Stay tuned, angelatc. Oh, yes. A storm is coming.

You mean like this one? http://ec.europa.eu/research/biosociety/pdf/a_decade_of_eu-funded_gmo_research.pdf

It encompasses 10 years, and concluded no harm from GMO. It also says that unnecessary labeling drives costs up, and creates concern where none is warranted.

Natural Citizen
01-31-2014, 11:50 AM
That's just silly.

Ok then. :)

ClydeCoulter
01-31-2014, 11:50 AM
That's just silly.

Source?

angelatc
01-31-2014, 11:55 AM
Source?


The OP is a reliable source of undocumented hysterical silliness. But I changed the post to show him a study of 10 years.

He will now dismiss it with something silly.



***and right on cue.... we immediately got a silly picture alluding to a conspiracy in lieu of anything substantial. Thank you Natural Citizen.

Natural Citizen
01-31-2014, 11:56 AM
Source?

https://lh3.ggpht.com/-ssvvPEaO0Kc/UeBRF8rZGhI/AAAAAAAABSI/BQzs9-EsFR0/s1600/conspiracy.jpg

Oh well. I have things to do....

otherone
01-31-2014, 11:58 AM
A recent comparative analysis of organic produce versus conventional produce from the University of Minnesota shows that the organically grown produce had 9.7 percent positive samples for the presence of generic E. coli bacteria versus only 1.6 percent for conventional produce on farms in Minnesota.

lol
Man has been farming the same way for thousands of years, yet the use of pesticides, genetically modified seeds, and chemical fertilizers is "conventional".

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:01 PM
lol
Man has been farming the same way for thousands of years, yet the use of pesticides, genetically modified seeds, and chemical fertilizers is "conventional".


The Ancient Chinese used to dump cyanide on their crops. You're fooling yourself if you think that using chemicals to control pests is a modern trend.

otherone
01-31-2014, 12:05 PM
The Ancient Chinese used to dump cyanide on their crops. You're fooling yourself if you think that using chemicals to control pests is a modern trend.

...and I'm sure there was some pro-poison shill back then who argued that the practice wasn't hurting anyone.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:08 PM
...and I'm sure there was some pro-poison shill back then who argued that the practice wasn't hurting anyone.

After they proved it was hurting peope, the practice stopped. Once science proves that the modern pestcides and herbicides are hurting people, they will stop.

But until you have proof, you're the shill.

Travlyr
01-31-2014, 12:12 PM
German officials see no E.coli fault at organic farm


(Reuters) - Officials investigating an organic farm in northern Germany said on Saturday they do not expect to take legal action against it for causing an E.coli outbreak that has killed at least 31 people.

Authorities link the epidemic, the deadliest in modern history, to contaminated bean sprouts and shoots grown at the farm that made their way to restaurants and kitchens across the country.

"Everything we have looked into until now shows the farm was flawless," said Gert Hahne, spokesman for the consumer protection office of Lower Saxony state. "It is hygienic and followed all the regulations.

More at link (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/06/11/us-ecoli-idUSTRE7591HW20110611).

From the comments.

OrganicTrade wrote:
It is important to understand the facts – and spread the word – about organic and food safety.
Sprouts—regardless of their source—have been identified by FDA as requiring special food safety protocols because of the potential for pathogen growth during the sprouting process. Contaminated seed is the likely source for most reported sprout-associated outbreaks.

All food, whether conventionally or organically produced, is susceptible to E. coli. That is why strong food safety regulations and practices are critical. FDA, as recently as last week, and the Centers for Disease Control acknowledge there is no evidence to indicate that organic products are more likely to be contaminated by E. coli.

In the United States, organic farmers and processors have tools in their tool kits that place organic agriculture at no disadvantage in terms of food safety.

In fact, organic producers take a much broader view of “food safety,” by prohibiting harmful practices such as using toxic and persistent pesticides that have been linked to harming children’s cognitive development, the application of sewage sludge on the land, the sub-therapeutic use of antibiotics that have been linked to breeding antibiotic-resistant bacteria including virulent strains of E. coli, and the use synthetic growth hormones that have questionable effects on humans.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:17 PM
German officials see no E.coli fault at organic farm



More at link (http://www.reuters.com/article/2011/06/11/us-ecoli-idUSTRE7591HW20110611).

From the comments.

Growing crops in feces is the reason that organics have ecoli problems according to this: Like E. Coli? Enjoy Your Organic Produce (http://www.science20.com/science_20/blog/e_coli_enjoy_organic_food-79604)


If E. coli is not to your liking, you can also enjoy pyrethrin, one of several common toxic chemicals sprayed on fruit trees by organic farmers, rotenone, a neurotoxin recently linked to Parkinson's disease, ricin and strychnine - all natural and all organic and all allowed in organic food.

Pesticides are bad enough but what about fertilizer? 'Organic' fertilizer is, of course, feces, and that is what is making all those Europeans sick. Synthetic fertilizer does not contain bacteria of any kind.

otherone
01-31-2014, 12:18 PM
After they proved it was hurting peope, the practice stopped. Once science proves that the modern pestcides and herbicides are hurting people, they will stop.


Yes. Things are ALWAYS safe until they aren't. Trust me.

http://cache.gawker.com/assets/images/consumerist/2009/07/wtc-asbestos-ad.jpg

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:24 PM
Yes. Things are ALWAYS safe until they aren't. Trust me.



I don't see where you've provided any evidence to indicate that you are trustworthy. So at this juncture I will choose to remain skeptical.

donnay
01-31-2014, 12:25 PM
Growing crops in feces is the reason that organics have ecoli problems according to this: Like E. Coli? Enjoy Your Organic Produce (http://www.science20.com/science_20/blog/e_coli_enjoy_organic_food-79604)


Aspartame is made from genetically engineered E.coli feces. Enjoy your diet coke.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:31 PM
Aspartame is made from genetically engineered E.coli feces. Enjoy your diet coke.

Well, thanks for throwing in some information that's entirely unrelated to the conversation at hand! And as usual you couldn't be any more wrong if you tried.

Bacteria are single cell organisms.
Single cell organisms do not have a digestive tract, therefore they do not produce feces.
E.Coli are bacteria.

Therefore, E. Coli do not produce feces.


And I don't drink Diet Coke. (It's a proper name, so it's capitalized.)


And according to Wikipedia, one process used to make aspartame uses an enzyme from Bacillus thermoproteolyticus. That organism is related to the one that causes anthrax, but not related to E Coli at all, except they are both bacteria. And neither one poops.

familydog
01-31-2014, 12:32 PM
Hurrah for lobbiests!

So we taxpayers get to insure that farmers who don't use technology to protect their crops get paid when they fail. Brilliant.

Obvious troll is obvious.

No one here will say that organic farmers need handouts or should get them. Everyone posts about Monsanto's handouts because they are the biggest receivers and they are the biggest influence on legislation.

otherone
01-31-2014, 12:32 PM
I don't see where you've provided any evidence to indicate that you are trustworthy. So at this juncture I will choose to remain skeptical.

Is the category, "things Donnay might say", Dick?

https://encrypted-tbn1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcQo_CjDTg5DFxVCL3jxxmGu4d4uJ3tId zubmY1g7BEPQ-jw68gK

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:38 PM
Is the category, "things Donnay might say", Dick?



Yeah, this conversation is pretty much over now that I've been compared to both Hitler and DonnaY.

You do know there are people that think if the Twin Towers had been allowed to use asbestos on all the floors, instead of being forced to cease at level 64, lives could have been saved?

I did not know that until about 10 minutes ago.

donnay
01-31-2014, 12:38 PM
Well, thanks for throwing in some information that's entirely unrelated to the conversation at hand! And as usual you couldn't be any more wrong if you tried.

Bacteria are single cell organisms.
Single cell organisms do not have a digestive tract, therefore they do not produce feces.
E.Coli are bacteria.

Therefore, E. Coli do not produce feces.


And I don't drink Diet Coke. (It's a proper name, so it's capitalized.)


And according to Wikipedia, one process used to make aspartame uses an enzyme from Bacillus thermoproteolyticus. That organism is related to the one that causes anthrax, but not related to E Coli at all, except they are both bacteria. And neither one poops.

Aspartame patent reveals E. coli feces used

(...)

The patent refers to "cloned microorganisms" later revealed to be genetically modified E. coli bacteria. They are modified to produce an especially large peptide used to create aspartame.

The cultivated and well-fed bacteria then produce proteins which contain the aspartic acid-phenylalanine amino acid segment required to produce the sweetener.

The bacteria waste is then treated to turn the large peptide and a free carboxyl group into a dipeptide. The the dipeptides are then treated with alcohol and methanol to produce aspartame.


Read more: http://www.upi.com/Science_News/Blog/2013/08/26/Aspartame-patent-reveals-E-coli-feces-used/8131377527919/#ixzz2s0ESc1xE

otherone
01-31-2014, 12:43 PM
You do know there are people that think if the Twin Towers had been allowed to use asbestos on all the floors, instead of being forced to cease at level 64, lives could have been saved?


....yeah, and if the terrorists would have eaten food laced by the ancient Chinese with cyanide, then they would have been dead long before getting in those planes.
Some people have a LOT of crazy thoughts about the WTC, don't they, Angela?

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:46 PM
Oh - it appears they use more than one strain of bacteria. I stand corrected. (Something DonnaY will never ever say.)

Something else DonnaY will never say: they are not using the dangerous strain of E-Coli though:

http://skeptoid.com/blog/2013/11/15/aspartame-and-e-coli-oh-my/


So it turns out to be true that the components of aspartame are harvested from E.coli, though actually the patent mentions E.coli, Bacillus subtilis and E.coli K12 strain (harmless).

The author of the NaturalNews article says “common sense dictates that this abomination doesn’t belong anywhere near our bodies”. Does it? Should we be scared?

No, not really. First of all, the word “fecal” is a bit loaded here as it carries the connotation of being analogous to human waste. As a friend so amazingly put it, it’s really only the same in the sense that “we are breathing tree excrement”.

But even getting that out of the way, shouldn’t we be worried that aspartame is made using E.coli? Isn’t that just absolutely disgusting?

Only if you want to think of it that way. The process used is standard now as E.coli is the primary organism used for recombinant DNA (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Recombinant_DNA) processes. So this “excrement” or “fecal matter” is really just proteins made based on modified DNA. Or as stated in the 1981 patent (http://www.freepatentsonline.com/EP0036258.html):


It is known that the nucleotide base sequence GAC comprises a codon for aspartic acid (Asp). It is also known that the nucleotide base sequence TTT comprises a codon for phenylalanine (Phe) . Inserting such codons in the DNA of a microorganism, preceded and followed by appropriate processing or termination codons, under appropriate control, and in the correct reading frame, would result in the microorganism producing the dipeptide Asp-Phe as part of its own protein producing processes.



Basically, awesome, awesome science in action (and this patent is from 1981, the process is probably improved by now).

angelatc
01-31-2014, 12:49 PM
....yeah, and if the terrorists would have eaten food laced by the ancient Chinese with cyanide, then they would have been dead long before getting in those planes.
Some people have a LOT of crazy thoughts about the WTC, don't they, Angela?


I think that it is more accurate to say a LOT of crazy people have a LOT of crazy thoughts about the WTC. Thanks for asking.

IBleedNavyAndOrange
01-31-2014, 01:11 PM
Sure. I find it amusing that the government is funding organic advertising when most of the deaths resulting from food comes from organic crops.

Looks to me your one story from 3 different sites were disproven.

Next?

IBleedNavyAndOrange
01-31-2014, 01:22 PM
Oh settle down. I can prove that organic food contaminated with Ecoli is directly responsible for consumer death. You can't prove a single person has been harmed with GMO food.

I'm sure this will send you off into an ever bigger shrieking, name-calling fit.

Hi kettle.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23756170/

And you know this has to be extra true because its got a .gov link.

Brian4Liberty
01-31-2014, 01:25 PM
Wow, this thread is derailed.

From another thread on the Farm Bill (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?442718-Tell-me-about-the-Farm-Bill-that-passed-today), here's an article on "log rolling":


Democracy and Power 113: Vote Trading

“I’ll vote for your legislation, if you’ll vote for mine.”

It is never said in public, but the act occurs constantly within our government. Regularly, our leadership requests a specific legislation, and our politicians agree to the request if the leadership includes his project. Politicians trade votes for their respective benefit, which is seldom for the benefit of most Americans.

Political insiders call this “log rolling,” and the expense to the American public is enormous. This blatant taking of property incrementally reduces everyone’s wealth, security and freedom.

Our Federal government oligarchs - Republican and Democrats – have “log rolled” the Farm Bill. Farmers and ranchers exchanged politically poisoning subsidies for crop insurance and food stamps for millions of Americans. Indirectly, our grocery industry benefits tremendously as well. And... our big, deceptive, incompetent government bumbles along reducing every American's wealth, security and freedom.
...
Hoping not to awaken Americans to this “log rolling” deal, Speaker Boehner rushed the bill through the House, where he needed and received Democrat support. Then, Sen. Harry Reid will manipulate the bill through the Senate. Quickly, President Obama will sign the legislation into law.
...
More:
http://www.freedomworks.org/blog/teda/“log-rolling”-the-farm-bill-more-incompetent-and-d

eduardo89
01-31-2014, 01:27 PM
Hi kettle.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/23756170/

And you know this has to be extra true because its got a .gov link.

This is what the study had to say:


These results indicated that low and environmentally relevant concentrations of glyphosate possessed estrogenic activity. Glyphosate-based herbicides are widely used for soybean cultivation, and our results also found that there was an additive estrogenic effect between glyphosate and genistein, a phytoestrogen in soybeans. However, these additive effects of glyphosate contamination in soybeans need further animal study.

Despite the title 'Glyphosate induces human breast cancer cells growth via oestrogen receptors,' that is not what the summary says.

heavenlyboy34
01-31-2014, 01:34 PM
Sure. I find it amusing that the government is funding organic advertising when most of the deaths resulting from food comes from organic crops.
Where are you getting this? It's not in the article.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 01:42 PM
This is what the study had to say:



Despite the title 'Glyphosate induces human breast cancer cells growth via oestrogen receptors,' that is not what the summary says.

If it is true, it is something we need to know. My first question would be is if it is a perti dish test, or an actual human study. It seems to be a given in the science conversations I lurk in that cells behave much differently in a dish than they do in an actual human.

Of course,finding out why is part of their game.


But this study certainly does not prove that anybody died from GMO food in any event.

angelatc
01-31-2014, 01:42 PM
Where are you getting this? It's not in the article.


Links are in the comments following. At this point it's just something I know.

Kelly.
01-31-2014, 04:27 PM
I think that it is more accurate to say a LOT of crazy people have a LOT of crazy thoughts about the WTC. Thanks for asking.

sometimes smart people, sound like crazy people, to stupid people.

have a good weekend :D

heavenlyboy34
01-31-2014, 05:04 PM
sometimes smart people, sound like crazy people, to stupid people.

have a good weekend :D

And vice versa. ;) Happy weekend to you too! :D ~hugs~

Ender
02-01-2014, 10:27 AM
You say "MSM propaganda"; I say she cites peer reviewed studies and information grounded in near universally accepted science. You say "alternate accounts"; I say made up mumbo jumbo with no actual studies, proof or anything near credible.

I'm about as open minded as they come and fact is the OP generally has real facts and information to back up her assertions.

Your "peer reviewed" is paid for by government money.

IBleedNavyAndOrange
02-01-2014, 10:00 PM
Links are in the comments following. At this point it's just something I know.

Did you just miss this or does it not compute because of your agenda:

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?442863-Farm-Bill-Now-Handing-Out-More-Goodies-to-Big-Organic-Too&p=5397460&viewfull=1#post5397460