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View Full Version : Did Obama Give Iranian President A Fake Ancient Artifact, or...




angelatc
10-13-2013, 10:51 AM
did Homeland Security grab an authentic artifact because it came from Iran, but proclaim it as a fake in order to add value to the King's coffers?

Either way, this is really ugly. And maybe a little bit freaking hysterical if it was indeed a fake.

Originally, the reports were that Obama gave the visiting Iranian President an ancient Persian artifact.
The cup was reportedly found in a cave in Iran and later confiscated by the U.S. after an arts dealer tried to smuggle it into the country, the State department said (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/30/whats-the-2700-year-old-gift-the-u-s-reportedly-gave-irans-president-thats-worth-over-1000000/).

Today, the story that the cup is actually a known fake is starting to circulate:

http://www.tabletmag.com/jewish-arts-and-culture/148365/griffin-rouhani-diplomacy


Sometimes an ancient artifact symbolizes more than its admirers necessarily imagine. Take for example the silver griffin that was returned (http://www.cnn.com/2013/09/28/world/meast/2700-year-old-persian-artifact-iran-cultural-diplomacy/index.html) by the United States to Iran as a gesture of respect and—at least according to tea-leaf readers—a sign of an emerging thaw between the two nations.

There’s only one problem: It’s a fake.

Not only is it a fake, it’s a bad fake. The saga of the griffin, from its production to its much-touted (http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/09/30/whats-the-2700-year-old-gift-the-u-s-reportedly-gave-irans-president-thats-worth-over-1000000/) return (http://news.yahoo.com/rouhani-home-us-gift-silver-griffin-reports-175921221.html) to Iranian President Rouhani during his recent visit (http://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/28/hassan-rouhani-return-to-iran-shoes)[COLOR=#343434] to New York, demonstrates how fakers of ancient art fool the gullible wealthy with the connivance of museums and scholars. More profoundly, it shows how ancient (or not so ancient) artifacts are made to carry cultural and diplomatic weight, in this case for a deeply problematic opening in relations between the United States and Iran.


The griffin was first seen in Geneva in the gallery of prominent Iranian art dealers and in 2002 was purchased by a wealthy New York collector, who not coincidentally was a trustee of the Met. Not confident about the artifact’s bona fides, the collector asked the dealers to provide authentication. Three experts were produced who promptly attested that the object had been produced in western Iran and dated to ca. 700 B.C.E.

But when the griffin arrived in New York in 2003, one of the Iranian-Swiss dealers was arrested by the Department of Homeland Security on the charge of falsifying the object’s place of origin. The next year he pleaded guilty to falsely stating that the griffin had originated in Syria rather than Iran and received one year of probation and a fine of $5,000. The buyer got her money back. The artifact was seized but the market, the game, was barely disturbed.

Then the griffin went into Homeland Security’s deep freeze, residing in a Queens warehouse until this fall. While the artifact was inaccessible to scholars and other investigators, a single photograph made available to Muscarella convinced him that it was a fake. Indeed, anyone with passing familiarity with ancient Near Eastern art, or any kind of art, would become suspicious at the merest glance.

The artifact is made of silver sections joined together to form a winged griffin that walks on splayed, clawed feet. Most improbable are three funnels, two on the sides coming out of the body below the wings and one that protrudes painfully from the creature’s rear end. The griffin-as-saxophone design has no parallels in the ancient world, except perhaps among other objects “said to be” from western Iran that have appeared on the antiquities market. It looks crude and absurd and should have led the buyer to ask what sort of nonsense was being pushed on her.

In the case of the griffin’s putative buyer, a trustee and Metropolitan Museum of Art patron, all is forgiven. The system that tears objects out of the ground in Iran, or Syria, Egypt, Afghanistan, Cambodia, or a hundred other countries, is simply too profitable to shut down. The rich and powerful want what they want, the market provides, and scholars and museums play along in exchange for a piece of the action.

http://www.theblaze.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/09/iran-griffin-gift-008.jpg


(Just as an aside.....buy pot, lose everything you own. Buy a fake artifact worth millions from a trade restricted nation, get your money back and keep your job.)

angelatc
10-13-2013, 11:01 AM
And I have to wonder how the conversation between Obama and DHS went? "Hey - you guys got anything over there that the President of Iran might like? I got grief over the videos and the iPods, so i was thinking maybe you could help me out here."

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2013, 02:37 PM
A whole bunch of idiocy in this story. Anyone with even a casually trained eye could see red flags on this from a mile away.

angelatc
10-13-2013, 02:47 PM
A whole bunch of idiocy in this story. Anyone with even a casually trained eye could see red flags on this from a mile away.

so do you think the denunciation of the thing as fake is fake, or is the artifact actually fake? I know this is closer to your field.

phill4paul
10-13-2013, 02:53 PM
so do you think the denunciation of the thing as fake is fake, or is the artifact actually fake? I know this is closer to your field.

Sounds like awful close to a conspiracy theory to me. Be careful or you'll be accused of hurting the liberty movement.

angelatc
10-13-2013, 03:37 PM
Be careful or you'll be accused of hurting the liberty movement.


If it were my boards, i would start banning those who have been here for 5 years and knew my rules about where things should be posted but insisted on ignoring my rules.

phill4paul
10-13-2013, 03:40 PM
If it were my boards, i would start banning those who have been here for 5 years and knew my rules about where things should be posted but insisted on ignoring my rules.

If wishes were fishes we'd all cast nets. Why do you hate the liberty movement?

jdmyprez_deo_vindice
10-13-2013, 03:42 PM
so do you think the denunciation of the thing as fake is fake, or is the artifact actually fake? I know this is closer to your field.

I think the artifact itself is fake and never would have spent even a minute in contemplation of a purchase regardless of price.

angelatc
10-13-2013, 03:46 PM
If wishes were fishes we'd all cast nets. Why do you hate the liberty movement?

i am not trying to destroy or hijack the liberty movement.

Brian4Liberty
10-13-2013, 04:01 PM
That's not a fake! It's the best artifact that the NSA, DHS, DoD and CIA can buy. It's more advanced than the Obamacare website.

angelatc
10-13-2013, 04:04 PM
my husband says this pretty much clinches the win in the "worst presidential gift giver" category.

fr33
10-13-2013, 04:11 PM
They should probably saw it in half or melt it down to find the device hidden inside of it.

Natural Citizen
10-13-2013, 04:14 PM
It's an interesting trinket. Whats Obammy know bout some alchemy...:rolleyes:

idiom
10-13-2013, 04:20 PM
my husband says this pretty much clinches the win in the "worst presidential gift giver" category.

Well, he already had that when he gave Gordon Brown 25 region 1 DVDs...

I mean seriously...

(Brown gave Obama a pen holder carved from the timbers of the sister ship of that which gave the wood to create the famous "Resolute Desk," the desk that has been in America's charge since 1880)

oyarde
10-13-2013, 06:37 PM
I think the artifact itself is fake and never would have spent even a minute in contemplation of a purchase regardless of price.

I would be willing to put it on a scale and offer spot price , less 20 % :)

mad cow
10-13-2013, 07:04 PM
It would make one helluva Bong.

paulbot24
10-13-2013, 08:30 PM
Our Prez giving a fake gift masquerading as something of value? Why should this surprise anybody on here? This coming from the country that just prints more worthless FRNs when the bills come. Trillion dollar coins bitchez. Merica!!!! Sorry if I don't answer back right away. Just so damn hard to hear with all this damn exceptionalism going on.

Uriel999
10-13-2013, 09:18 PM
Our Prez giving a fake gift masquerading as something of value? Why should this surprise anybody on here? This coming from the country that just prints more worthless FRNs when the bills come. Trillion dollar coins bitchez. Merica!!!! Sorry if I don't answer back right away. Just so damn hard to hear with all this damn exceptionalism going on.

STFU and go buy something damnt!!!!!

angelatc
10-13-2013, 09:42 PM
It would make one helluva Bong.

Party like a Persian!

oyarde
10-13-2013, 09:50 PM
That's not a fake! It's the best artifact that the NSA, DHS, DoD and CIA can buy. It's more advanced than the Obamacare website.

I wonder what else they have ??