Common Core teaching thug life

[KAYA]

WTF?


In the second worksheet students had to find the common theme "twist" from words like "tornado," the 50's dance move and a rapper named "twista." The worksheet also references his song "Po-Pimp." "I don't send my son to school to learn these type of life lessons, especially at the age of nine," said Badeaux.


"I'm almost speechless, you know, because I feel like there's so much violence already. How are we going to stop any of it if this is what's being fed to them?," said Badeaux.

Here's a link to the story and video.
http://www1.katc.com/news/fourth-grade-worksheet-references-pimp-and-weapons/

[better-dead-than-fed]

One of the two worksheets Brittney Badeaux's 9-year-old son was asked to complete for homework contains a passages explaining machine guns.

"I think it's appalling," said Badeaux. "Why my 9-year-old needs to know why a machine gun needs to be cooled down, or why holding the trigger will produce rapid fire, I don't understand."http://www1.katc.com/news/fourth-grade-worksheet-references-pimp-and-weapons/

I have no problem with machine guns. Thomas Jefferson was a violent thug. In any case, parents who home-school should receive vouchers to cover costs.

[KAYA]

I have no problem with machine guns. Thomas Jefferson was a violent thug. In any case, parents who home-school should receive vouchers to cover costs.

My point wasn't about machine guns. Did you actually read the article or watch the news report? How do you feel about the ganster rapper Twista and reference to his song "Po Pimp" being used as part of the common core lesson to 4th graders? That's what I was getting at.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Did you actually read the article or watch the news report?

Yes.


My point wasn't about machine guns.... How do you feel about the ganster rapper Twista and reference to his song "Po Pimp" being used as part of the common core lesson to 4th graders? That's what I was getting at.

I think there's nothing worse than government-managed education. That said, I would probably teach 4th graders about gangster rap if I had the opportunity, but I would not tax anyone to fund my operation.

[KAYA]

Yes.



I think there's nothing worse than government-managed education. That said, I would probably teach 4th graders about gangster rap if I had the opportunity, but I would not tax anyone to fund my operation.

Introducing 9year olds to a gangster rapper like Twista with his vile lyrics and forcing parents to explain what a pimp is, is not appropriate elementary school material. Yet that was exactly the type of material presented via Common Core.

[better-dead-than-fed]

material presented via Common Core.

Common Core and all public education should be abolished -- vanquished, as far as I am concerned.


Introducing 9year olds to a gangster rapper like Twista with his vile lyrics and forcing parents to explain what a pimp is, is not appropriate elementary school material.

I respectfully disagree.

[jbauer]

I have no problem with machine guns. Thomas Jefferson was a violent thug. In any case, parents who home-school should receive vouchers to cover costs.

Maybe in your state.

[better-dead-than-fed]

parents who home-school should receive vouchers to cover costs.

Maybe in your state.

I mean "should" as in, it would be a step in the right direction. I don't know if it's reality in any state.

[KAYA]

Common Core and all public education should be abolished -- vanquished, as far as I am concerned.

I respectfully disagree.

Either you are misunderstanding me or you are being ridiculous. If you as a parent want to teach your child about pimping, twista, gangster rap, etc., then that's fine. But that type of subject matter does not belong in an elementary school setting as part of a reading lesson.

[tangent4ronpaul]

Po Pimp, hu? WOW!

made the mistake of looking them up. Glorifying drug use, glorifying working as a prostitute for a pimp and with such incredible one liners like:


But if the head the bonk c'mon suck a nigga dick

http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/doordie/popimp.html

Oh, and their youtube had a "Parental Advisory" notice on it.

Just the sort of things the federal government should be shoving down the throats of elementary school kids!

YEAH FUD FAIL!!!!

-t

[KAYA]

Po Pimp, hu? WOW!

made the mistake of looking them up. Glorifying drug use, glorifying working as a prostitute for a pimp and with such incredible one liners like:



http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/doordie/popimp.html

Oh, and their youtube had a "Parental Advisory" notice on it.

Just the sort of things the federal government should be shoving down the throats of elementary school kids!

YEAH FUD FAIL!!!!

-t
Thank you for contributing some ration thought and perspective to this discussion!

[KAYA]

Here is just a small sample of the lyrics to the song "Po Pimp", which Common Core if perfectly fine with introducing to elementary aged children.


Cause he's a pimp, he gotta be, full of that
M-O, N-E, but why?
Cause nigga be sportin nice cars and fancy clothes
Fresh jewels Girbaud flexin one five oh (chop chop)
Chop up that paper hoe, chop up that paper hoe
Watch where your lips go, caress my tip slow
To the tempo, instrumental
Real simple when you fuckin with a pimp doe

Me and Do or Die dig drinkin love potion
The word that was never said
Twisted be givin women d*ck in the bed, until they sick in the head
And if I ever leave whoever dead
They ain't trickin the Feds or spittin game but it's chicken and bread
Kickin them legs in the air like a playa do
Then belittle in a day or two
After words I'ma slay a crew
Now that's some pimp type shit that B-Low and AK'll do
Wearing gray and blue

[better-dead-than-fed]

Either you are misunderstanding me or you are being ridiculous. If you as a parent want to teach your child about pimping, twista, gangster rap, etc., then that's fine. But that type of subject matter does not belong in an elementary school setting as part of a reading lesson.

I understand you feel certain subjects are "not appropriate" for elementary school, but I respectfully disagree. If you believe you know what's right for every elementary school, I respectfully think you are mistaken, and that you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Glorifying drug use, glorifying working as a prostitute for a pimp

These are choices that should be left to individuals.



Cause he's a pimp, he gotta be, full of that
M-O, N-E, but why?
Cause nigga be sportin nice cars and fancy clothes
Fresh jewels Girbaud flexin one five oh (chop chop)
Chop up that paper hoe, chop up that paper hoe
Watch where your lips go, caress my tip slow
To the tempo, instrumental
Real simple when you fuckin with a pimp doe....

Me and Do or Die dig drinkin love potion
The word that was never said
Twisted be givin women d*ck in the bed, until they sick in the head
And if I ever leave whoever dead
They ain't trickin the Feds or spittin game but it's chicken and bread
Kickin them legs in the air like a playa do
Then belittle in a day or two
After words I'ma slay a crew
Now that's some pimp type shit that B-Low and AK'll do
Wearing gray and blue



But if the head the bonk c'mon suck a nigga dick

What is the problem with this?

[KAYA]

I understand you feel certain subjects are "not appropriate" for elementary school, but I respectfully disagree. If you believe you know what's right for every elementary school, I respectfully think you are mistaken, and that you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself.

You are being ridiculous and absurd.

[better-dead-than-fed]

You are being ridiculous and absurd.

You are being a fascist. You have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. I wish you would stop being a fascist! It's inappropriate.

[KAYA]

You are being fascist.
Because I am exposing flaws in a federally sanctioned education curriculum, and disagreeing with what I find to be your flawed logic, I am being fascist. I guess I had just better fall in line with your way of thinking or risk becoming labeled a fascist.

How selfish of me as a parent of two elementary aged children, to stand up against federal education standards such as Common Core and disagree with them introducing degenerate filth to children as part of a reading lesson. Guess I had better just shut up and take it if I don't want to be labeled a fascist by pseudo intellectuals on the internet.

[belian78]

You are being purposefully obtuse, and for no reason. By default you are saying that teaching about gang life in elementary school is completely appropriate, which is absurd.

*edited to say that was in response to bdtf, don't know why the quote wasn't there.

[RockEnds]

You are being a fascist. You have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. I wish you would stop being a fascist! It's inappropriate.

WTH? Money doesn't fall from the sky to fund this crap. This is funded by taxpayers at the local, state, and federal levels. Of course people should have a voice in it.

[Thor]

Oh look "better-dead-than-fed" is being a dick again... surprise, surprise, surprise... good thing he is still on my block list. Just hard to miss it completely when others include his drivel in their replies. A Federally funded troll?

KAYA, I agree, this Common Core crap has got to go....

[better-dead-than-fed]

You are being purposefully obtuse, and for no reason. By default you are saying that teaching about gang life in elementary school is completely appropriate, which is absurd.

I don't think it is absurd. I have my opinion about what's appropriate, and you have yours. I can live with your backwards opinion, but you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. Your opinion is tolerated but your dictatorship is unwelcome.

[better-dead-than-fed]

..

[better-dead-than-fed]

A Federally funded troll?

You're a genius.


Oh look "better-dead-than-fed" is being a dick again

If not wanting ignorant, backwards fascists straight out of Deliverance to dictate curriculums is being a dick, then okay.

[better-dead-than-fed]

This is funded by taxpayers at the local, state, and federal levels.

I already clarified how extremely opposed to that I am.


Of course people should have a voice in it.

Including me.

[belian78]

I don't think it is absurd. I have my opinion about what's appropriate, and you have yours. I can live with your backwards opinion, but you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. Your opinion is tolerated but your dictatorship is unwelcome.
Trolling, hardcore.

[Natural Citizen]

Trolling, hardcore.

I'm surprised that bdtf hasn't been told to hit the bricks yet. I thought this poster would have been banned a long time ago.

[tod evans]

Ya'll come trying to push this shit out here in the sticks and I'll be leading the band of pitch fork wielding hillbillies...

Fuck a bunch of rap:mad:

[GregSarnowski]

Um "better dead", no doubt I'm wasting my time as you are just another idiot troll, but complaining about top down federal control of local schools is the exact opposite of fascism. The fascists are people like you who support it.

[belian78]

I'm surprised that bdtf hasn't been told to hit the bricks yet. I thought this poster would have been banned a long time ago.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't it come out that bdtf is the guy who was trying to poison the well locally against Gunny? I'm quite surprised that he's still around.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Trolling, hardcore.


There are no trolls here

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?32994-There-are-no-trolls-here


Alleged trolling

An accusation of "trolling" is an easy way to shut down a debate. It is an appeal to motivation; its intent is to shift the conversation away from the soundness, or lack thereof, of the arguments put forth, by focusing instead on the allegedly nefarious goals of the person putting forth the argument. Anything with the potential to rile people up has the potential to be labelled as "trolling"; therefore, people can game the system by voicing outrage at someone's remarks and saying, "The drama will not end until this person is silenced! Look, he must be a troll because he knew that he might anger people with his arguments, but he made those arguments anyway!"...

Accusations of trolling... are a smokescreen involving speculation into the motives of the person (which cannot be known with certainty, until a surefire method of mind-reading is developed)....

Censorship on this grounds has... the... consequence... that the users who are more numerous and more willing to pitch a fit over being offended get their way.

When a person is silenced for "trolling,"... The result... is that the remaining population ... tends to be made up of people who aren't particularly tolerant of divergent viewpoints. It's a recipe for groupthink and stasis, since progress depends upon someone coming up with a divergent viewpoint and winning acceptance of it.

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Viewpoint_censorship

Your backwards opinions should be tolerated, but not your aspirations to dictate. You are a dying Deliverance-breed, and if you advocate dictatorship of the majority, you advocate your own extermination.

[belian78]

LOL you so cute, the way you be trollin. :D

[better-dead-than-fed]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't it come out that bdtf is the guy who was trying to poison the well locally against Gunny? I'm quite surprised that he's still around.

You are wrong. Gunny led a deceitful smear campaign against me; but out of respect for the forum guidelines, Admin overruled it. Gunny had accused me of being one "Dave Goetze" (his opponent in a political race),

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1HCRYCKPIFUP5KyE7_YrL8Ndfo-mtT9_yIwsjTJ0CRJk/pub

but it turned out Gunny was just drunk, delusional, or extremely mistaken.

[better-dead-than-fed]

I'm surprised that bdtf hasn't been told to hit the bricks yet. I thought this poster would have been banned a long time ago.

Why would I be banned? For opposing fascism?

[better-dead-than-fed]

complaining about top down federal control of local schools is the exact opposite of fascism. The fascists are people like you who support it.

You have me confused with someone else, or you're just lying. See what I actually wrote above.

[better-dead-than-fed]

I guess I had just better fall in line with your way of thinking or risk becoming labeled a fascist.

Guess I had better just shut up and take it if I don't want to be labeled a fascist by pseudo intellectuals on the internet.

Yet you don't mind labeling when you are spouting labels like "vile", "ridiculous", "inappropriate", "does not belong in an elementary school setting as part of a reading lesson". Fascists are the ones who believe they have some place dictating their ideals in any school except one they might manage themselves. That's you, not me.

[green73]

You are being a fascist. You have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. I wish you would stop being a fascist! It's inappropriate.

Stop trolling

[better-dead-than-fed]

I understand you feel certain subjects are "not appropriate" for elementary school, but I respectfully disagree. If you believe you know what's right for every elementary school, I respectfully think you are mistaken, and that you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself.You are being ridiculous and absurd.You are being a fascist. You have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. I wish you would stop being a fascist! It's inappropriate.

Stop trolling


There are no trolls here

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?32994-There-are-no-trolls-here


Alleged trolling

An accusation of "trolling" is an easy way to shut down a debate. It is an appeal to motivation; its intent is to shift the conversation away from the soundness, or lack thereof, of the arguments put forth, by focusing instead on the allegedly nefarious goals of the person putting forth the argument. Anything with the potential to rile people up has the potential to be labelled as "trolling"; therefore, people can game the system by voicing outrage at someone's remarks and saying, "The drama will not end until this person is silenced! Look, he must be a troll because he knew that he might anger people with his arguments, but he made those arguments anyway!"...

Accusations of trolling... are a smokescreen involving speculation into the motives of the person (which cannot be known with certainty, until a surefire method of mind-reading is developed)....

Censorship on this grounds has... the... consequence... that the users who are more numerous and more willing to pitch a fit over being offended get their way.

When a person is silenced for "trolling,"... The result... is that the remaining population ... tends to be made up of people who aren't particularly tolerant of divergent viewpoints. It's a recipe for groupthink and stasis, since progress depends upon someone coming up with a divergent viewpoint and winning acceptance of it.

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Viewpoint_censorship

green73, why are you bullying, insulting, and personally attacking me?

[mad cow]

Christmas 2008,I was playing Trivial Pursuit with my niece who was a fourth grade teacher at the time.

A question came up about Tupac Shakur and east coast-west coast rappers.I guessed he was east coast because all I knew about him was that his parents were east coast terrorists and my niece corrected me and gave me chapter and verse about the Crips-Bloods~east coast-west coast rapper wars.

It was part of the fourth grade curriculum she taught,so this is at least 5 years old,in VA, anyway.

[LibertyEagle]

Either you are misunderstanding me or you are being ridiculous. If you as a parent want to teach your child about pimping, twista, gangster rap, etc., then that's fine. But that type of subject matter does not belong in an elementary school setting as part of a reading lesson.

He's being ridiculous. Of course, it's horrible. Common Core needs to be thrown out, just like No Child Left Behind, Outcome-based education, School-to-Work, Goals 2000, and all the rest of the UN-proposed government school brainwashing programs.

[LibertyEagle]

I mean "should" as in, it would be a step in the right direction. I don't know if it's reality in any state.

Be careful about suggesting vouchers. What they would do is to give the federal government an inroad into dictating what private schools teach and if they accepted it, homeschoolers too.

[presence]

Ever have trouble explaining what a pimp is to your child? (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?428202-Ever-have-trouble-explaining-what-a-pimp-is-to-your-child&highlight=po-pimp) Started by jdmyprez_deo_vindice (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/member.php?8751-jdmyprez_deo_vindice), 09-19-2013


son,


you a pimp if you can get the same hoe to wanna freak your friends


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jJOvp7xxoTQ

Do you wanna riiide?
In the backseat, of a Caddy
Chop it up, with Do or Die

[LibertyEagle]

You are being a fascist. You have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. I wish you would stop being a fascist! It's inappropriate.

Actually, parents have the absolute right to dictate what their children are taught. That is one of the many reasons why the United Nations and our federal government should get the heck out of education. We can start with abolishing the federal Department of Education. Haven't you noticed that the more the federal government involves themselves, the lower we rank in Education?

Once upon a time, parents played a huge role in what was taught in their local schools and amazingly we ranked number 1 in education.

[tod evans]

I can see the mandate to teach a bunch of intercity kids how to artificially inseminate cows...

Tractor repair for the projects...

Barrel racing and bull riding clubs after school...

[coastie]

Ah yes, "po pimp" - one of my favorite songs. It came on someone's playlist at work last night, matter of fact.

Thank goodness no hoes were smacked in the process of listening to it, just as no one started laying out rails when Eric Clapton's "Cocaine" came on the radio for the 90th time that day.

But this song showing up in a 4th grader's school work is just a little bit much, methinks.

[mczerone]

WTH? Money doesn't fall from the sky to fund this crap. This is funded by taxpayers at the local, state, and federal levels. Of course people should have a voice in it.

It's NOT funded by taxpayers. It's funded by the State with money that they've extracted from taxpayers.

You don't get a say in how the State spends its money. Common Core is not the issue, it's a wedge device.

Stop complaining about how they spend stolen money, and start complaining about how they steal your money!

[KAYA]

It's NOT funded by taxpayers. It's funded by the State with money that they've extracted from taxpayers.

You don't get a say in how the State spends its money. Common Core is not the issue, it's a wedge device.

Parents absolutely do (or should) have a say in their children's education curriculum.


Stop complaining about how they spend stolen money, and start complaining about how they steal your money!

We can do both.

[LibertyEagle]

We can do both.

Exactly!! We HAVE TO do both.

[LibertyEagle]

It's NOT funded by taxpayers. It's funded by the State with money that they've extracted from taxpayers.

You don't get a say in how the State spends its money. Common Core is not the issue, it's a wedge device.

Stop complaining about how they spend stolen money, and start complaining about how they steal your money!

Duh. That means it IS being funded by taxpayers. Look, this crap has to be attacked at all levels. In the past, parents have successfully gotten these programs thrown out of the state they lived in. It can and must be done again. It is beyond foolhardy to wait until that point in time that we can stop the government from stealing our money before we take a stand against some of the ways in which it is used.

According to your logic, we shouldn't stand up against the government spying on us, starting wars that have nothing to do with our national defense, or the myriad of other things that people around here are upset about. According to you, we should just shut up about those things. :rolleyes:

HUGE FAIL!!

[Snew]

lol I kinda like Twista :D

[Natural Citizen]

In the past, parents have successfully gotten these programs thrown out of the state they lived in. It can and must be done again. It is beyond foolhardy to wait until that point in time that we can stop the government from stealing our money before we take a stand against some of the ways in which it is used.



You have to start at the community level and a per school effort. Can be done. The problem is that you need leaders in the community who understand education in it's current state (meaning curriculum) and where it's headed...which requires an understanding of infrastructure.

Teachers themselves (at least in my experience) hate it.But at the same time the unfortunate reality is that most parents really are clueless and so the teachers don't get relevant/useful support from these parents in dealing with it.

[RockEnds]

It's NOT funded by taxpayers. It's funded by the State with money that they've extracted from taxpayers.

You don't get a say in how the State spends its money. Common Core is not the issue, it's a wedge device.

Stop complaining about how they spend stolen money, and start complaining about how they steal your money!

Hey, check it out. I tuned in, turned on, and dropped out. We home school. If my 9-year-old hears a rap song in school this year, it'll be this onaccounta because this is representative of our neighborhood.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lOfZLb33uCg

But my grandchild attends public schools, and therefore, common core is more than a wedge issue to me. I'll complain about the way the spend money any time I darn well please. My local school district will confirm that. I promise, I complained more than once before I realized I didn't have to do business with them.

[Bryan]

Let's please keep things per the guidelines.

It is certainly valid to object to tax money being spent in such a way as this. Bdtf is right however that educational standards are arbitrary. This is another reason why public schools are a problem, they lead us to fighting between our selves on how we can best arrange the tyranny to our liking.

[Sola_Fide]

Ye That said, I would probably teach 4th graders about gangster rap if I had the opportunity,

Why?

[willwash]

Stormfront is picking up a lot of members over this no doubt.

[mad cow]

Stormfront is picking up a lot of members over this no doubt.

As I have posted before,in 1959-1960 when I was in fourth grade in Virginia,I had to memorize and recite portions of Patrick Henry's "Give me Liberty or give me Death"speech.

I see you are in VA.Do you think it is a step forward that your kids should have to memorize and recite this in the fourth grade?


Cause he's a pimp, he gotta be, full of that
M-O, N-E, but why?
Cause nigga be sportin nice cars and fancy clothes
Fresh jewels Girbaud flexin one five oh (chop chop)
Chop up that paper hoe, chop up that paper hoe
Watch where your lips go, caress my tip slow
To the tempo, instrumental
Real simple when you fuckin with a pimp doe
Me and Do or Die dig drinkin love potion
The word that was never said
Twisted be givin women d*ck in the bed, until they sick in the head
And if I ever leave whoever dead
They ain't trickin the Feds or spittin game but it's chicken and bread
Kickin them legs in the air like a playa do
Then belittle in a day or two
After words I'ma slay a crew
Now that's some pimp type shit that B-Low and AK'll do
Wearing gray and blue

[better-dead-than-fed]

Do you think it is a step forward that your kids should have to memorize and recite....

I hadn't though any parent or guardian was forced to send his kids to any school in this program. Was I mistaken?

[better-dead-than-fed]

Why?

So many reasons, I don't know where to begin. I would explain to them that when they grow up they will need to get jobs, and that if they are willing to rap about drugs, pimps, and hoes, then indignant cultural conservatives will give them lots of attention for free, thereby promoting their product and making them rich. It's a way to own cultural conservatives and have them work for you, but it's not slavery because the cultural conservatives want to be owned this way.

I'd also explain that some 4th graders across town are being sheltered by their culturally conservative parents for the time being, and as a result, the sheltered 4th graders will make great customers for this kind of music when they grow old enough to decide which music they want to pay money for.

[mad cow]

I hadn't though any parent or guardian was forced to send his kids to any school in this program. Was I mistaken?

They are forced at gunpoint to PAY for this horsecrap,they should have a say in what's shoveled down their kids throats.

For that matter,I have been forced to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for the public education of my nonexistent children and grandchildren throughout my lifetime and will continue to pay until the day I die.
I have never had kids and I have an eighth grade education I assume my Parents paid for in full close to 50 years ago.

If you didn't have to pay for a school unless you sent your kids there,you might have a point.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Actually, parents have the absolute right to dictate what their children are taught.

That is what I have been saying from the start, while others assume they know what's best for all schools:


that type of subject matter does not belong in an elementary school setting as part of a reading lesson.

[CPUd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dRflNtAXPJE

[better-dead-than-fed]

He's being ridiculous.

No, LibertyEagle, you are just being old-school conservative.


Of course, it's horrible. Common Core needs to be thrown out, just like No Child Left Behind, Outcome-based education, School-to-Work, Goals 2000, and all the rest of the UN-proposed government school brainwashing programs.

Yes, all government-regulation of education is horrible and should be thrown out; but no, music about pimps and hoes is not horrible, and only bad people think it is.

[RockEnds]

So many reasons, I don't know where to begin. I would explain to them that when they grow up they will need to get jobs, and that if they are willing to rap about drugs, pimps, and hoes, then indignant cultural conservatives will give them lots of attention for free, thereby promoting their product and making them rich. It's a way to own cultural conservatives and have them work for you, but it's not slavery because the cultural conservatives want to be owned this way.

I'd also explain that some 4th graders across town are being sheltered by their culturally conservative parents for the time being, and as a result, the sheltered 4th graders will make great customers for this kind of music when they grow old enough to decide which music they want to pay money for.

I know this may come as a shock to you, but not everyone's child grows to be a wannabe street punk.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Christmas 2008,I was playing Trivial Pursuit with my niece who was a fourth grade teacher at the time.

A question came up about Tupac Shakur and east coast-west coast rappers.I guessed he was east coast because all I knew about him was that his parents were east coast terrorists and my niece corrected me and gave me chapter and verse about the Crips-Bloods~east coast-west coast rapper wars.

It was part of the fourth grade curriculum she taught,so this is at least 5 years old,in VA, anyway.

You don't know nothin about Tupac. His parents were Black Panthers. His aunt was:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assata_Shakur

"Assata Shakur was involved in a shootout on the New Jersey Turnpike, during which [a] New Jersey State Trooper... [was] killed...."


They claim that I'm violent, just cause I refuse to be silent
These hypocrites are having fits, cause I'm not buying it
Defying it, envious because I will rebel against
Any oppressor, and this is known as self defense
I show no mercy, they claim that I'm the lunatic
But when the shit gets thick, I'm the one you go and get
Don't look confused, the truth is so plain to see
Cause I'm the nigga that you sell-outs are ashamed to be
In every Jeep and every car, brothers stomp this
I'm never ignorant, getting goals accomplished
The underground railroad on an uprise
This time the truth's gettin told, heard enough lies
I told em fight back, attack on society
If this is violence, then violent's what I gotta be
If you investigate you'll find out where it's comin from
Look through our history, America's the violent one
Unlock my brain, break the chains of your misery
It's time for payback for evil shit you did to me
They call me militant, racist cause I will resist
You wanna censor somethin, motherfucker censor this.
My words are weapons, and I'm steppin to the silent
Wakin up the masses, but you, claim that I'm violent

The cops can't stand me, but they can't touch me
Call me a dope man, cause I rock dope beats
Jacked by the police, didn't have my ID
I said, "Excuse me, why you trying to rob me?"
He had the nerve to say I had a curfew
"Get out the car... or I'll hurt you."
So here I go, I better make my mind up
Pick my nine up, or hit the line-up
I chose B, stepped into the streets
The first cop grabbed me, the other ripped my seat
They grabbed my homie and they threw him to the concrete
("What you doin man?") They tried to frame me
They tried to say I had some dope in the back seat
But I'm a rap fiend, not a crack fiend
My homie panicked, he tried to run
I heard a bullet fire from the cop's gun
My homie dropped so, I hit the cop
I kept swingin, yo, I couldn't stop
Before I knew it, I was beatin the cop senseless
The other cop dropped his gun, he was defenseless
Now I'm against this cop who was racist
Given him a taste, of trading places
And all this, cause this peckerwood was tryin this
Frame up, but I came up
Now they claimin that I'm violent

As I was beatin on the cop, I heard a gun click
Then the gun shot, but I wasn't hit
I turned around it was my homie with the gun in hand
He shot the cop, now he's a dead man
I said, come on, it's time for us to get away
They called for backup, and they'll be on their way
Jumped in the car, and tried to get away quick
The car wouldn't start, we in deep shit
So we jumped out (C'mon let's take the cop's car)
We drove a little ways thinkin that we got far
But I looked up, and all I saw was blue lights
If I die tonight, I'm dying in a gunfight
I grabbed the AK, my homie took the 12 gauge
Load em up quick, it's time for us to spray
We'll shoot em up with they own fuckin weapons
And when we through sprayin, then we steppin

This is a lesson, to the rednecks and crooked cops
You fuck with real niggas, get your fuckin ass dropped
So here we go, the police against us
Dark as dusk, waitin for the guns to bust
What's next, I don't know and I don't care
One things for sure, tomorrow I won't be here
But if I go, I'm takin all these punks with me
Pass me a clip, G, now come and get me

You wanna sweat me, never get me to be silent
Giving them a reason, to claim that I'm violent

[LibertyEagle]

You have to start at the community level and a per school effort. Can be done. The problem is that you need leaders in the community who understand education in it's current state (meaning curriculum) and where it's headed...which requires an understanding of infrastructure.

Teachers themselves (at least in my experience) hate it.But at the same time the unfortunate reality is that most parents really are clueless and so the teachers don't get relevant/useful support from these parents in dealing with it.

I think it takes a couple of very persistent people who are willing to educate themselves about this program in detail, gather the documentation and fight it all the way up the line. My Mother, along with another lady, got outcomes-based education thrown out of their state. So, I KNOW that it can be done.

[LibertyEagle]

Yes, all government-regulation of education is horrible and should be thrown out; but no, music about pimps and hoes is not horrible, and only bad people think it is.

I don't care what music you like. Whatever floats your boat. The issue is that "pimps and hoes" are not exactly suitable curriculum for young children. :rolleyes: Our kids are graduating without knowing how to read, write and do arithmetic. I hardly think it is old school to believe that our children should focus on the basics instead of gangster rap.

[mad cow]

You don't know nothin about Tupac. His parents were Black Panthers. His aunt was:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Assata_Shakur

"Assata Shakur was involved in a shootout on the New Jersey Turnpike, during which [a] New Jersey State Trooper... [was] killed...."

Hey,one man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

[better-dead-than-fed]

The issue is that "pimps and hoes" are not exactly suitable curriculum for young children.

Maybe not in your house or your church, but keep your morals off of me unless you want problems.


Our kids are graduating without knowing how to read, write and do arithmetic. I hardly think it is old school to believe that our children should focus on the basics instead of gangster rap.

It sounds like you have lost track of which kids belong to you.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Hey,one man's alleged terrorist is another man's freedom fighter.

She claims she was denied a fair trial, and I have to give her the benefit of the doubt, having seen firsthand how the government administers those things. And even if she was guilty, you are exactly right about freedom fighters.

[Natural Citizen]

I think it takes a couple of very persistent people who are willing to educate themselves about this program in detail, gather the documentation and fight it all the way up the line. My Mother, along with another lady, got outcomes-based education thrown out of their state. So, I KNOW that it can be done.

By the time I had finished typing a response the site logged me out. I suppose it was a rather long response. This really annoys me when this happens.

But I agree with you. I'm not typing why I agree with you all over again though. I started a thread elsewhere that should suffice. Down the road, that is. Of course, you being a paleo may not accept what I intend to eventually add there but judging by your other post I'll accept that as diverse synergy should opposing visions come up.

[mad cow]

Meanwhile,more rappers die at the hands of other rappers,rather than at the hands of cops or "rednecks and peckerwoods"to quote Tupac.

But they're all heroes to be emulated according to the Department of Education.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Meanwhile,more rappers die at the hands of other rappers,rather than at the hands of cops or "rednecks and peckerwoods"to quote Tupac.

So now all black people are rappers, and all rappers are black people, and you have left reality altogether?


But they're all heroes to be emulated according to the Department of Education.

According to your unreasonably creative interpretation of the original post. Most of the article in the original post is about one gun-hating woman's crusade against references to "machine guns".

[Natural Citizen]

BDTF...I don't know if you know it but you seem to be the shining example of useful idiot for the very people who have been delegated to apply this infrastructure. Take it from someone who has sat in the same room with them many, many times. See, you're down on the bottom end of the totem pole trying to place others who may not understand the issue in scope into a position of useful idiot with things that are only relative to the distance of your own sight/perception/immediate goals in all of this. I promise you that you are so far out of your league that it's laughable. But by all means...keep it up.

[mad cow]

So now all black people are rappers, and all rappers are black people, and you have left reality altogether.

Where did I say all black people are rappers.I said more rappers are killed by other rappers than by cops.rednecks or peckerwoods.

Dispute that.



According to your unreasonably creative interpretation of the original post. Most of the article in the original post is about one gun-hating woman's crusade against references to "machine guns".

My complaint is with the Department of Education glorifying rappers in the fourth grade.

[better-dead-than-fed]

BDTF...I don't know if you know it but you seem to be the shining example of useful idiot for the very people who have been delegated to apply this infrastructure. Take it from someone who has sat in the same room with them many, many times. See, you're down on the bottom end of the totem pole trying to place others who may not understand the issue in scope into a position of useful idiot with things that are only relative to the distance of your own sight/perception/immediate goals in all of this. I promise you that you are so far out of your league that it's laughable. But by all means...keep it up.

Yes, you do have wood for me; as you've already declared about 100 times. Keep crying it out?

[better-dead-than-fed]

My complaint is with the Department of Education glorifying rappers in the fourth grade.

I want the Department of Education abolished as much as you do. As for "rappers", cultural conservatives flipped out in the 50's when Elvis Presley moved his hips around. Just another chapter in the cultural conservatives' campaign to promote entertainers who do things not allowed in church.


more rappers are killed by other rappers than by cops.rednecks or peckerwoods.

Evidence?

[mad cow]

Here is just one link to the deaths of Tupac and Biggie.

http://www.laweekly.com/2011-10-06/news/cop-s-book-says-sean-combs-suge-knight-ordered-tupac-and-biggie-killings/

That's two.Now you show me links to two rappers killed by cops,rednecks or peckerwoods and we'll be even and go on from there.

[Zippyjuan]

Is one question on one worksheet in an entire ciriculum promoting a "gangstah lifestyle"?


Puyau says the worksheet has already been pulled and will not be used again.

[KAYA]

I am reminded of this well known quote:

“Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

― George Carlin

[better-dead-than-fed]

I am reminded of this well known quote:

Says the person who thinks he knows what's best for other people's children.

[KAYA]

Says the person who thinks she knows what's best for other people's children.

I am a father of two elementary aged children and if I want to expose what I see as flaws with the Common Core curriculum (in whole or in part) I have that right. I am speaking on behalf of MY children.

Btw, since you are so wise why did you assume me to be female?

[better-dead-than-fed]

I am a father of two elementary aged children and if I want to expose what I see as flaws with the Common Core curriculum (in whole or in part) I have that right. I am speaking on behalf of MY children.

You can do that without typing out personal attacks against people who hold different opinions about what's "appropriate":

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?428581-Common-Core-teaching-thug-life&p=5238938&viewfull=1#post5238938

You could have moved on when I told you I respectfully disagreed with your opinion on page 1. Instead you set off the moronic witch-hunt that ensued.

[KAYA]

You can do that without typing out personal attacks against people who hold different opinions about what's "appropriate":

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?428581-Common-Core-teaching-thug-life&p=5238938&viewfull=1#post5238938

You could have moved on when I told you I respectfully disagreed with your opinion on page 1. Instead you set off the moronic witch-hunt that ensued.

I will use this dynamic to my advantage. I will write heavy metal music about the devil. You will not always be there to decide which music your children listen to.

You have riddled this thread with "personal attacks". You brought "witch-hunt" on yourself.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Here is just one link to the deaths of Tupac and Biggie.

http://www.laweekly.com/2011-10-06/news/cop-s-book-says-sean-combs-suge-knight-ordered-tupac-and-biggie-killings/

That's two.Now you show me links to two rappers killed by cops,rednecks or peckerwoods and we'll be even and go on from there.

I am not so sure I believe the police as far Shakur's case, but I'll give you those two for the sake of this discussion.

As far as cops, all I have for now is:
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/11/02/nyregion/brooklyn-detective-convicted-of-planting-drugs-on-innocent-people.html?_r=0
http://www.bostonglobe.com/metro/2013/09/02/federal-lawsuit-alleges-lowell-police-informants-planted-drugs-scores-cases/aWbMvZkjQUHBo0Bqrp8xxN/story.html
http://www.copblock.org/36502/police-caught-planting-drugs-in-small-business/
I have to assume lesser known rappers have had years robbed from them, adding up to many, many lifetimes.


Not guilty on the grounds of insanity it was them or me
Bustin at my innocent family, say they lookin for ki's
I was home alone, blind to the prelude
Bust in, talking about, "Where is the quaaludes?" What you say fool?
Where in the hell is the search warrant?
No feedback is what he uttered, before he screamed "Nigga motherfucker"
Dropped me to my knees I proceed to bleed
Suffering a rain of blows to my hands and knees
Will I survive, is God watching?
I grab his gat and bust in self-defense, my only option, God damn
Now they got me goin to the county jail
And my family can't pay this outrageous bail
Try to offer me a deal, they told me if I squeal
move me, and my people, to a mansion in Brazil
Not me, so this is how it ends, no friends
I'll be stressed and they just, reposessed my Benz
Told the judge it was self-defense, he won't listen
So I'm bumping this in federal prison, giving everything I owe

[better-dead-than-fed]

You have riddled this thread with "personal attacks".

Go back and see how it really went down. Look at yourself, initiating the attacks.


You brought "witch-hunt" on yourself.

By holding a view unpopular with cultural conservatives, okay, that's always been the deal with witch hunts.

[bolil]

Fed is right. Get the government out of education, don't merely replace their version with yours.

[LibertyEagle]

Maybe not in your house or your church, but keep your morals off of me unless you want problems.
Just as soon as you get your hand out of my pocket in funding public schools.

With regard to what sounded like a threat, you may want to rethink that.


It sounds like you have lost track of which kids belong to you.

Not at all and I also haven't lost track of whose money is being used to pay for public schools.

[better-dead-than-fed]

With regard to what sounded like a threat, you may want to rethink that.

I'm not threatening you, and I don't know or care who you are. I am promising you political problems if you try to put your morals on me through government.


Just as soon as you get your hand out of my pocket in funding public schools.

I don't want your money. Your morals are becoming less popular, and under dictatorship of the majority, you can look forward to more gangster rap in the classroom.

[LibertyEagle]

I'm not threatening you, and I don't know or care who you are. Don't flatter yourself. I am promising you political problems if you try to put your morals on me through government.

I don't want your smelly GOP money. Your morals are becoming less popular, and under dictatorship of the majority, you can look forward to more gangster rap in the classroom.

Over my dead body. Our children need to be taught the basics; reading, writing and arithmetic. We used to be ranked number 1 and now, we are sinking to the bottom. You may think that is progress, but it's not.

If some parents want to teach their children how to be felons, they should do it at home. Schools are not for that purpose. :rolleyes:

[better-dead-than-fed]

Over my dead body.

Not afraid of you.

[LibertyEagle]

Not afraid of you.

:rolleyes:

I wasn't threatening you.

[better-dead-than-fed]

You may think that is progress, but it's not.

I don't think it's progress, but I think your dictatorship would be even worse.


Schools are not for that purpose.

As long as schools are dictated by the majority, you don't get to decide the purpose of schools.


Our children need to be taught the basics; reading, writing and arithmetic.

Says you, but not the market.


If some parents want to teach their children how to be felons, they should do it at home.

Can't read, write, or do arithmetic if you're being beaten down by police; and the the Tupac songs I quoted don't teach how to be felons, they teach self-defense against felons.

[RockEnds]

I'm not threatening you, and I don't know or care who you are. Don't flatter yourself. I am promising you political problems if you try to put your morals on me through government.



I don't want your smelly GOP money. Your morals are becoming less popular, and under dictatorship of the majority, you can look forward to more gangster rap in the classroom.

Do you see one person here threatening to use government money to "put their morals" on you? Do you see one person here who has even suggested that this music should be prohibited? I don't.

You are the one wishing to subject 9-year-olds to filthy language and sexual content. WTF does that have to do with any legitimate educational objective? No one here has even suggested that elementary students shouldn't be allowed to possess this material at school. Only that unrelated adults have no business pushing this garbage upon children at taxpayer expense. If you want to teach your daughters to be good little hose bags, you go right on ahead, but don't act all morally superior when other people tell you to keep it at home.

This doesn't belong on the curriculum any more than tears in beers or riding cowboys. If acting out the lyrics will land a kid in juvenile detention, there's really no reason they should learn it in school. People don't send their children to school to learn prison culture and develop the need to hire a defense attorney. They send them to learn to learn reading, writing, arithmetic, and etc.

Getting rid of the Department of Education is a fine goal. It's not likely to happen today or tomorrow. In the meantime, surely the department could ask to be limited to education.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Do you see one person here threatening to use government money to "put their morals" on you?

Yes; for example your insistence that "reading, writing, arithmetic" are the proper subject matter for schools, more than, for example, pimping and hoeing. Your view is not implied by a pro-liberty philosophy.


You are the one wishing to subject 9-year-olds to filthy language and sexual content. WTF does that have to do with any legitimate educational objective? No one here has even suggested that elementary students shouldn't be allowed to possess this material at school. Only that unrelated adults have no business pushing this garbage upon children at taxpayer expense. If you want to teach your daughters to be good little hose bags, you go right on ahead....

This doesn't belong on the curriculum any more than tears in beers or riding cowboys. If acting out the lyrics will land a kid in juvenile detention, there's really no reason they should learn it in school. People don't send their children to school to learn prison culture and develop the need to hire a defense attorney. They send them to learn to learn reading, writing, arithmetic, and etc.

Getting rid of the Department of Education is a fine goal. It's not likely to happen today or tomorrow. In the meantime, surely the department could ask to be limited to education.

That department doesn't revolve around people on farms in Iowa who believe that sex is "filthy garbage" and can't tell the difference between tremendously successful musicians and "wannabe street punks". Your ideas about "legitimate education" and what "belongs on the curriculum" are not universal; they are arbitrary.


don't act all morally superior

Look who's talking.

[tod evans]

All the more reason to end federal funding of schools/housing/medical and food.

Everything the federal government gets involved in it screws up, everything!

[RockEnds]

Yes; for example your insistence that "reading, writing, arithmetic" are the proper subject matter for schools, more than, for example, pimping and hoeing. Your view is not implied by a pro-liberty philosophy.



That department doesn't revolve around people on farms in Iowa who believe that sex is "filthy garbage" and can't tell the difference between tremendously successful musicians and "wannabe street punks".



Look who's talking.

If you think for a minute that my life has been confined to a farm in Iowa, you would have another thing coming. Grow up.

[better-dead-than-fed]

If you think for a minute that my life has been confined to a farm in Iowa, you would have another thing coming. Grow up.

You strongly suggested that sex is "filthy garbage". That is Biblical of you, but not implied by a pro-liberty philosophy.

[mad cow]

Bah,who needs reading and writing and 'rithmatic.In a free market,there would be plenty parents who would want their fourth graders to be taught

Watch where your lips go, caress my tip slow
To the tempo, instrumental
Real simple when you fuckin with a pimp doe
And would be happy if the teacher would demonstrate to the child exactly where the lips go in case the fourth grader was confused by the song.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Bah,who needs reading and writing and 'rithmatic.In a free market,there would be plenty parents who would want their fourth graders to be taught

And would be happy if the teacher would demonstrate to the child exactly where the lips go in case the fourth grader was confused by the song.

Plenty of parents are prudes.

[RockEnds]

You strongly suggested that sex is "filthy garbage". That is Biblical of you, but not implied by a pro-liberty philosophy.

I'm not a church lady. Guess again.

[mad cow]

Plenty of parents are prudes.

Plenty of parents don't want their fourth grade son or daughter sucking off their teacher!!!!

What are you???

[LibertyEagle]

Yes; for example your insistence that "reading, writing, arithmetic" are the proper subject matter for schools, more than, for example, pimping and hoeing. Your view is not implied by a pro-liberty philosophy.

Are you for real? If your goal is to actually get a job, as opposed to living off the government, or otherwise stealing from fellow Americans, learning the basics is crucial. If you want your child to learn how to be a slut or a pimp, teach them on your own time. I'm sure they will look back upon your sage advice while they are passing the time in prison.

[better-dead-than-fed]

I'm not a church lady. Guess again.

You are a hip grandparent in Iowa who knows what's best for everyone?

[tod evans]

You are a hip grandparent in Iowa who knows what's best for everyone?

I know it's best that I don't frequent cities.

I also know it's best if city folk don't frequent the Ozarks.

How about we each quit paying for the others idea of "education" ?

[RockEnds]

You are a hip grandparent in Iowa who knows what's best for everyone?

Hip is not really how I would describe myself. You keep on guessing if you must, but sooner or later, you might try some line of approach that doesn't involve personal insults. They're much more effective when you have some sort of a grasp as to who you're arguing with, anyway.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Are you for real? If your goal is to actually get a job, as opposed to living off the government, or otherwise stealing from fellow Americans, learning the basics is crucial. If you want your child to learn how to be a slut or a pimp, teach them on your own time. I'm sure they will look back upon your sage advice while they are passing the time in prison.

Save it for your congregation; they might actually believe your nonsense. Gangster rapping and adult entertainment are both lawful and more lucrative than reading, writing, and arithmetic.

[better-dead-than-fed]

I also know it's best if city folk don't frequent the Ozarks.

City folks aren't about to visit places that haven't even been fully mapped. City folks like electricity and plumbing.


How about we each quit paying for the others idea of "education" ?

Absolutely.

[tod evans]

City folks aren't about to visit places that haven't even been fully mapped. City folks like electricity and plumbing.


Good!

I'll return the favor.

[better-dead-than-fed]

you might try some line of approach that doesn't involve personal insults.

Oh but feel free to call sex "filthy garbage" and musicians "punks" because when you make the insults it's okay because you think you're right.

[Anti Federalist]

Actually, parents have the absolute right to dictate what their children are taught. That is one of the many reasons why the United Nations and our federal government should get the heck out of education. We can start with abolishing the federal Department of Education. Haven't you noticed that the more the federal government involves themselves, the lower we rank in Education?

Once upon a time, parents played a huge role in what was taught in their local schools and amazingly we ranked number 1 in education.

Now, they get roughed up and arrested by off duty cops.

[Anti Federalist]

Reason to homeschool number 34,899.

[RockEnds]

Oh but feel free to call sex "filthy garbage" and musicians "punks" because when you make the insults it's okay because you think you're right.

Newsflash. Trash talking women isn't a per-requisite for good sex.

Go. back. and. read. You stated that people who do not like rap music will have children who squander their cash on gangster rap. I said that not everyone's children grow up to be a wannabe street punk. I was referring to the children of people who don't like rap music, not the rappers.

[mad cow]

Save it for your congregation; they might actually believe your nonsense. Gangster rapping and adult entertainment are both lawful and more lucrative than reading, writing, and arithmetic.

This entire thread Starting from the OP has been about what is being taught to fourth graders.

Gangster rapping and adult entertainment have nothing to do with what should be taught to fourth graders outside the twisted minds of perverts.

Now,I think all education should be a private contract between parents and who they choose to educate their children.
However,I think if you started a school teaching fourth graders gangster rap,adult entertainment,and how to watch where your lips go,caress my tip slow,you would go bankrupt.

Of course,the government can teach this crap with their gun to the taxpayers head enforced monopoly,but you would go bankrupt.

[LibertyEagle]

Save it for your congregation; they might actually believe your nonsense. Gangster rapping and adult entertainment are both lawful and more lucrative than reading, writing, and arithmetic.

If you don't learn how to add, how would you know?

[LibertyEagle]

Now, they get roughed up and arrested by off duty cops.

You mean the one person; the rest sat there like lumps of coal.

[tod evans]

You mean the one person; the rest sat there like lumps of coal.

In all fairness I saw one woman speak out and heard another....

[better-dead-than-fed]

You mean the one person; the rest sat there like lumps of coal.

Anything besides acting like a lump of coal could land you in "detention, there's really no reason they should learn it in school. People don't send their children to school to learn prison culture and develop the need to hire a defense attorney. They send them to learn to learn reading, writing, arithmetic, and etc."

As long as the lumps of coal were ranked #1 in reading, writing, and arithmetic, the purpose of education was served.


I grab his gat and bust in self-defense, my only option

Filthy, inappropriate garbage; yet interesting.

[better-dead-than-fed]

If you don't learn how to add, how would you know?

But I did learn to add.

[better-dead-than-fed]

if you started a school teaching fourth graders gangster rap... you would go bankrupt.

http://revolution88.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/tupac-shakur.jpg

[tod evans]

Picture of fake money;


http://revolution88.files.wordpress.com/2009/02/tupac-shakur.jpg

Picture of real money;

http://images-01.delcampe-static.net/img_large/auction/000/223/996/326_001.jpg

[tod evans]

Kid learning about making money in real life;

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_pLKCDmyZnlM/TLEruVt8m0I/AAAAAAAAAKU/RfnfxCn2w4I/s320/Herf_Hfr.jpg

[tod evans]

Young lady who's learned to "suck it tight" ....

http://www.riders4helmets.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/01/163381_578953162121101_1656412862_n-1.jpg

[better-dead-than-fed]

fake money

http://www.forbes.com/2008/08/15/music-media-hiphop-biz-media-cz_zog_0818cashkings.html


Tupac... pulled in... this year... about $15 million–even though he’s been dead for over 10 years.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Kid learning about making money in real life;

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_pLKCDmyZnlM/TLEruVt8m0I/AAAAAAAAAKU/RfnfxCn2w4I/s320/Herf_Hfr.jpg

Monsanto protege.

[better-dead-than-fed]

good sex

I hadn't meant to get into the difference between good sex and bad sex.


I know this may come as a shock to you, but not everyone's child grows to be a wannabe street punk.

Do you assume all "gangster rap" is about being a "punk"?

[RockEnds]

I hadn't meant to get into the difference between good sex and bad sex.



Do you assume all "gangster rap" is about being a "punk"?

Have you watched the little middle class white kids walking around, trying to be all ghetto? What would you call them exactly? Ninety-nine percent of them wouldn't survive five minutes on the street, but you're right in that there are some who buy this stuff. They think they're bad ass rebellious, and only give it up when they get tired of hanging out with people who steal their CDs. Just understand that not everyone's children go through that stage.

[moostraks]

As long as schools are dictated by the majority, you don't get to decide the purpose of schools.



Says you, but not the market.



Can't read, write, or do arithmetic if you're being beaten down by police; and the the Tupac songs I quoted don't teach how to be felons, they teach self-defense against felons.

You have an interesting perspective on who the market is and what the market has to say about things. Since property owners are taxed for this I'd say they should be the ones with a voice on the subject. Also included should be anyone who is paying a property tax through their rent payments being inflated to cover the owners costs. The government mandating this type of curriculum is not the same as a free market choice but I fathom you know that and are just attention seeking.

Schools are not being dictated by the majority but by a certain tireless minority with a horrible agenda for the future and the money and connections to implement their plan.

If you can't read, write, or do arithmetic then you will be screwed harder by these same folks doing the beating. They won't even have to pull a gun to have you sign away everything if you are that illiterate. Furthermore it takes knowledge of more than how to rhyme (which incidentally is part of any good literature program) to be successful even as a rapper with a story to tell. A school of excellent quality would also have a fine arts program to benefit your budding entrepeneur but seems as if that has not been mentioned yet.:)

[better-dead-than-fed]

Just understand that not everyone's children go through that stage.

I do understand that, even if you don't understand how lucrative the gangster-rap industry (and porn) is.

[RockEnds]

I do understand that, even if you don't understand how lucrative the gangster-rap industry (and porn) is.

Well, you were being overly bitter in that particular post I responded to. I'm not sure how lucrative any career can be when the life expectancy is under 30. And I'm exaggerating with that figure, but not by much. Live hard, die young might be fun. I rather expected it myself. But I think lucrative is the wrong word. Hey, it's a free country. Sorta. I'll be the last person to stand in your way.

But back to the point of the post, I'm a Seger kinda gal, myself. Yet I wouldn't want this song taught in 4th grade. Would you? The genre isn't the point. The point is that the government doesn't have any business glorifying this stuff to 4th graders. Check it out. As soon as class is over, and they try this stuff, the same government will come and haul them away for it. Set up and knocked down. Ouch.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K7r-V1id038

[better-dead-than-fed]

If you can't read, write, or do arithmetic then you will be screwed....

I thought teaching children to read, without boring them to sleep with drivel about farms and Officer-Friendly, was the point of the reference to Twista?




Our children need to be taught the basics; reading, writing and arithmetic.Says you, but not the market.You have an interesting perspective on who the market is and what the market has to say about things. Since property owners are taxed for this I'd say they should be the ones with a voice on the subject. Also included should be anyone who is paying a property tax through their rent payments being inflated to cover the owners costs. The government mandating this type of curriculum is not the same as a free market choice....

Schools are not being dictated by the majority but by a certain tireless minority with a horrible agenda for the future and the money and connections to implement their plan.

My point was not about the education supplied by the pseudo-market; my point was about the skills demanded by the market.


I fathom you... are just attention seeking.

This is what happens when you try to fathom.

[tod evans]

http://www.forbes.com/2008/08/15/music-media-hiphop-biz-media-cz_zog_0818cashkings.html

Amature,

Here's forbes with a couple of known land/cattlemen;

http://www.forbes.com/2010/06/14/ted-turner-john-malone-emmerson-business-billionaires-land.html

Or we could stick with performers.... Here's a list for you....

http://www.celebritynetworth.com/articles/entertainment-articles/richest-rock-lead-singers-world/

The abject failure of this icon of rappery in the face of real musicians, especially financially, is funny, yet you hold him out as a paragon of intellect that children should emulate?

Real money doesn't flash it, real class doesn't brag and in my world real men teach their children manners and respect..

But really I'm all for ya'll paying your own way to teach your kids however you'd like.

I don't want your money to fund my kids education, please show me the same respect.

[tod evans]

Monsanto protege.

Bullshit.

Young kid at 4-H doesn't equate to a "Monsanto protege" any more than some young intercity child equates to "Criminal"...

[better-dead-than-fed]

Well, you were being overly bitter in that particular post I responded to.

The stuff that gets called "vile filth" sells well, and very much to the children of the people who call it "vile filth". I don't know how I can recognize that truth without being called bitter, etc.


I'm not sure how lucrative any career can be when the life expectancy is under 30. And I'm exaggerating with that figure, but not by much. Live hard, die young might be fun. I rather expected it myself. But I think lucrative is the wrong word. Hey, it's a free country. Sorta. I'll be the last person to stand in your way.

Entertainers getting assassinated at the age of 25 is the exception not the norm.


Yet I wouldn't want this song taught in 4th grade. Would you?

Yes.


The point is that the government doesn't have any business glorifying this stuff to 4th graders.

The government has just as little business glorifying reading, writing, and arithmetic; but you don't seem to get that?


As soon as class is over, and they try this stuff, the same government will come and haul them away for it. Set up and knocked down. Ouch.

But you can teach that too. I never suggested children should be taught about sex or self-defense without being taught about the untoward consequences. Gangster rap addresses self-defense where reading, writing, arithmetic, and Seger do not.

[RockEnds]

The stuff that gets called "vile filth" sells well, and very much to the children of the people who call it "vile filth". I don't know how I can recognize that truth without being called bitter, etc.



Entertainers getting assassinated at the age of 25 is the exception not the norm.



I am sorry to hear that. Country music, and country music that pretends to be rock, is awful.



I would should them the video, but without the sound of the country-music because it is obscene.



The government has just as little business glorifying reading, writing, and arithmetic either; but you don't seem to get that.



But you can teach that too. I never suggested children should be taught about sex or self-defense without being taught about the untoward consequences. Gangster rap addresses self-defense where reading, writing, arithmetic, and Seger do not.

So how lucrative is a career in setting up 4th graders?

[RockEnds]

The stuff that gets called "vile filth" sells well, and very much to the children of the people who call it "vile filth". I don't know how I can recognize that truth without being called bitter, etc.



Entertainers getting assassinated at the age of 25 is the exception not the norm.



I am sorry to hear that. Country music, and country music pretending to be rock, is awful.



I would show them the video, but without the sound of the country-music because it is obscene.



The government has just as little business glorifying reading, writing, and arithmetic; but you don't seem to get that?



But you can teach that too. I never suggested children should be taught about sex or self-defense without being taught about the untoward consequences. Gangster rap addresses self-defense where reading, writing, arithmetic, and Seger do not.

I tried to leave you with a song. I couldn't find it. I thought you might like that CIA song. You know, that one song? I googled it, and all I got were hits for gangster rap, a link saying that the song title was classified, and something about federal agents disseminating information that Thomas Jefferson is a terrorist. Serious. Google it.

So, I got to thinking about your point on the relationship between songs and self-defense in public education. Maybe you have a point. Imma gonna go down and make sure this gets on the common core curriculum here.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=X3_qUDwF-Ns

[moostraks]

This is heresy, as it goes beyond reading, writing, arithmetic, and horses & cows.



Can't gangster-rap without rhythm. Filthy Tupac studied ballet with its sinister gyrations.



I thought teaching children to read, without boring them to sleep with drivel about farms and Officer-Friendly, was the point of the reference to Twista?



My point was not about the education supplied by the pseudo-market; my point was about the skills demanded by the market.



This is what happens when you try to fathom.
Your point seemed to have been that rap was being taught because of its importance in the market of ideas. It is being taught because of a captive audience is being indoctrinated to behave in a certain manner. Your so called free market motivation is not the motivator for this presentation to this age group.

[Zippyjuan]

This thread makes me want to get an Uzi and some hos. Any Homies wanna chill at my crib? (can one question encourage kids to become Gangsta?)

[tod evans]

This goes here;

Sixth-Graders learn about all about Jay-Z, Big Pimpin’

http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/25/sixth-graders-learn-about-jay-z-big-pimpin/?intcmp=latestnews

Students at a Southaven, Miss. middle school were educated in the “Big Pimpin’” thug life of Jay-Z, and the school district can’t imagine why anyone would object to lessons on reading, writing and rapping.

Sixth graders at Desoto Central Middle School spent three days learning about one of the most successful hip-hop artists and entrepreneurs in the nation. They were also tested on their knowledge about Jay-Z’s “resilience.”

A parent, who had a son in the English class, reached out to me – and she’s fired up. The mad mom asked to remain anonymous over fears of repercussions. I was able to verify her claims and have agreed to provide anonymity.

“One of the songs listed on the paper that was brought home was ‘Big Pimpin’,” she told me. “Another song talked about thug life. My child was getting an education about thug life.”

She could not believe that her child was learning about a man who sings songs that degrade women and glorify the thug life.

“When he pulled out the paper in his backpack in the car, I called my husband right then,” she told me. “I was furious. We talked about it until late that night. My husband was about to blow his top.”

It’s really unfortunate that the school superintendent won’t talk to me about the assignment. I’d love to hear his side of the story.
I called the principal to get his side of the story, but he said he didn’t want to talk to me. Instead, he referred me to the superintendent’s office.

No answer.

Eventually, I was told to contact their official spokesperson.

The spokesperson told me she could not understand why Fox News was interested in a simple classroom assignment. She said she would send an official statement but declined to go on the record. I’m still waiting for the “official statement.”

The child’s parents had a similar experience. They contacted the school – hoping to get some answers. Instead, they got the brush-off.

“They made it sound like it was no big deal,” the mom told me. “They said the point of the assignment was because Jay-Z is successful.”

She said one school official even chimed in that the rapper owns a professional sports team.

“I asked him what that had to do with anything,” the parent told me. “Let’s talk about somebody that is a success that has done good things – not thug life things.”

Using the school’s logic, the mom wondered why the school doesn’t assign lessons on Hugh Hefner or Larry Flynt.

“Either way, it’s all the same,” she said.

She said the same school official told her that no matter who they assigned the kids to learn about – that person would have something negative in their past.

“We are conservative,” she said. “We are Christian. And this was brought into my house. That’s why I was so furious. It was a moral issue.”

The little boy’s father was so livid that the school brushed off his wife he decided to write a letter to the school district:

“The page sent home was an eye-opener and I refuse to have my son subjected to today’s version on what should be accepted as okay and normal without knowing the facts,” the dad wrote.

“The facts are this page represented this thug in a positive way and calls him successful. Success to me doesn’t mean demeaning women, glorifying drugs and violence and flaunting money. Success should be about living decent and having respect for themselves and others.”

And to put an exclamation point on his reasoning, the dad included the lyrics to a Jay-Z song. I’d love to share some of those lyrics with you – but I’ve got standards. Let’s just say, Jay-Z has an affinity for the F-word and the B-word.

Heather Fox is not surprised to learn about the three-day Jay-Z lecture at the middle school. She runs a Facebook page called “Desoto County Reform” – an online gathering place for parents concerned about the school district.

“Hopefully we can address the issues that most people are afraid to address out loud,” she told me. “The school district is not happy about our website.”

“We know there are students at the high school who’ve had to read explicit books,” she said. “And now we know about the Jay-Z class.”

Fox said the sixth grade assignment was not age appropriate.

“A lot of the kids don’t know anything about the things that surround Jay-Z – it’s something that a lot of parents are concerned about,” Fox said. “Why make them exposed to it at such an early age?”

It’s really unfortunate that the school superintendent won’t talk to me about the assignment. I’d love to hear his side of the story. But the school district’s silence makes me a bit suspicious.

If there’s nothing wrong with the assignment, what’s there to hide? Why brush off a concerned parent who has a valid concern about what her child is learning?

The mom told me the school made a “bad, bad choice” – and now she and her husband are about to make a choice.

“It really makes me want to either send him to a private school or homes school,” she said.

[RockEnds]

This thread makes me want to get an Uzi and some hos. Any Homies wanna chill at my crib? (can one question encourage kids to become Gangsta?)

It's an old trick. Hey, look at me. I'm cool. And the police. Let's hang. I'll teach you all I know, then send you to jail where I'll teach you not to be so damned gullible.

[better-dead-than-fed]

Our children need to be taught the basics; reading, writing and arithmetic.Says you, but not the market....... my point was about the skills demanded by the market.Your point seemed to have been....
My point in that post was not about rap; my point was about "reading, writing, and arithmetic": three words which were dictated above by LibertyEagle, but not by any free market.

[better-dead-than-fed]

taught about the untoward consequencesSo how lucrative is a career in setting up 4th graders?

Huh? Why don't you address that to an overprotective parent, because their children are the ones who end up in L.A. as adults, performing in gangster-rap videos, and other kinds of videos.

[RockEnds]

Huh? Why don't you address that to an overprotective parent, because their children are the ones who end up in L.A. as adults, performing in gangster-rap videos, and other kinds of videos.

You seem to be in the know.

http://benswann.com/the-most-dangerous-domestic-spying-program-is-common-core/


Even the Department of Education, though, admits that privacy is a concern, and that that some of the data gathered may be “of a sensitive nature.” The information collected will be more than sensitive; much of it will also be completely unrelated to education. Data collected will not only include grades, test scores, name, date of birth and social security number, it will also include parents’ political affiliations, individual or familial mental or psychological problems, beliefs, religious practices and income.

In addition, all activities, as well as those deemed demeaning, self-incriminating or anti-social, will be stored in students’ school records. In other words, not only will permanently stored data reflect criminal activities, it will also reflect bullying or anything perceived as abnormal.

[The Bavarian]

So when will Pimpology be introduced in our schools?

I'm waiting.

[RockEnds]

So when will Pimpology be introduced in our schools?

I'm waiting.

Well, first they have to decide at which grade level they wish to begin profiling potential pimps. It's never too early to start. Prolly pre-school. Then they have to decide the best method to attract the most prospective pimps. Once that's accomplished, they'll need to design the curriculum, construct a teacher's record book that will collect the relevant info, and put a plan into place to brush off public criticism. Finally, they'll need to decide at what point in the child's development they'll intervene and process him into the system. And, of course, what kind of carrots they can dangle in front of him to keep him blind and compliant enough to stay in the system for the entirety of his life, all the while thinking he's big and bad.

[dannno]

better-dead-than-fed has a good point here.

I would add:

-Art imitates life and I would want to teach a child about the life around them.

-Rap is modern day poetry. If you disagree, you are probably racist.

-What you think is 'promoting' a lifestyle is not. 95%+ of the suburban kids and young adults I knew very much enjoyed gangster rap and yet they never participated in a drive by, gang banging, pimping or hoing... all they did is listen to it, dance to it and dress like it in some instances.

[dannno]

You can use it as a tool to teach your kids about freedom.

Why do all of the gangsters seem to control the drug trade and prostitution? Because those activities are illegal, so criminals take them over and the whole situation creates a lot of violence, destruction and despair in its wake.

[RockEnds]

You can use it as a tool to teach your kids about freedom.

Why do all of the gangsters seem to control the drug trade and prostitution? Because those activities are illegal, so criminals take them over and the whole situation creates a lot of violence, destruction and despair in its wake.

They don't, dannno. And common core is not about freedom. It's about profiling.

[dannno]

They don't, dannno. And common core is not about freedom. It's about profiling.

I'm not defending Common Core, I'm defending teaching young children about gangster rap, or music in general.

I would rather they know the history behind gangster rap and why they sing about what they sing about and how their culture became that way before they actually start listening to it when they get older and may get confused about what they are hearing.

[better-dead-than-fed]

So how lucrative is a career in setting up 4th graders?

p.s. also why don't you address that to parents who set their children up to be adult "lumps of coal" (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?428581-Common-Core-teaching-thug-life&p=5240649&viewfull=1#post5240649)?


If acting out the lyrics will land a kid in juvenile detention, there's really no reason they should learn it in school. People don't send their children to school to learn prison culture and develop the need to hire a defense attorney.

So should they eliminate all references to Thomas Jefferson too?

[better-dead-than-fed]

she’s fired up.http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/25/sixth-graders-learn-about-jay-z-big-pimpin/?intcmp=latestnews

A cultural conservative became hot-headed? This is unprecedented.


“Another song talked about thug life. My child was getting an education about thug life.”

How does she feel about references to thug Thomas Jefferson, who shot a bunch of police?


songs that degrade women

Has she seen what the Bible says about women? Gangster rap has nothing on the Bible, when it comes to degrading women.


"My husband was about to blow his top."

A cultural conservative became hot-headed? This is unprecedented.


"We are Christian."

Will wonders never cease?


"I was so furious."

A furious Christian? This is unprecedented.


father was so livid

A livid Christian? This is unprecedented.

[RockEnds]

A cultural conservative became hot-headed? This is unprecedented.



How does she feel about references to thug Thomas Jefferson, who shot a bunch of police?



Has she seen what the Bible says about women? Gangster rap has nothing on the Bible, when it comes to degrading women.



A cultural conservative became hot-headed? This is unprecedented.



Will wonders never cease?



A furious Christian? This is unprecedented.



A livid Christian? This is unprecedented.

I'm just curious. Killed the cat, I know. But, why Jefferson? Why not George Washington or Daniel Boone? Do you think we like Jefferson the best, or is there some other reason you've chosen him?

http://www.judicialwatch.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/08/2161-docs.pdf

[better-dead-than-fed]

Why not George Washington or Daniel Boone?

I know little about Washington and Boone. I use Jefferson as an example because he gangster-rapped the Declaration of Independence.


Do you think we like Jefferson the best

From your posts about thugs and street punks, I figured you see Jefferson as garbage?

[tod evans]

-Art imitates life and I would want to teach a child about the life around them.

-Rap is modern day poetry. If you disagree, you are probably racist.



Well I suppose I'm a culturally deficient racist then...

"Rap" doesn't imitate life in any of my varied circles nor does it emulate "art" by any stretch of my imagination..

I'll grant that there's a segment of todays younger crowd that appreciates it just like some folks appreciated disco...I wasn't one of those folks either.

You'll just have to hang that racist moniker around my neck.:o

Or...........Maybe we could agree that not everybody views the world the same way..

You could live in suburbia and carry on as you like, I could live out here in the sticks and carry on as I like...

I don't feel the need to ascribe negative traits or monikers to your choices, in fact I'd be extremely happy to completely leave you alone.

It's this idea government is trying to cram down our collective throats that "we" need to be homogenous that's causing problems...

America is a diverse country, how about instead of forcing acceptance of differing cultures, celebrating the uniqueness of our own?

That's the point I tried to make earlier in the thread.....City folks have no desire to have Vo-Ag taught in their classrooms and I don't want to force them to.

I don't feel the need to belittle suburbanites for their ways, it's who they are and that's okay with me.

But, when suburbanites start trying to push their culture and mannerisms down my throat I have a problem with that.

[RockEnds]

I know little about Washington and Boone. I use Jefferson as an example because he gangster-rapped the Declaration of Independence.



From your posts about thugs and street punks, I figured you see Jefferson as garbage?

Gotcha. Yeah, I keep flunking my retraining.

Washington is a really interesting historical figure. You should read up. One of my ancestors was with him, in the rank and file, of course, as he fled the Battle of Brooklyn. My ancestor's whole family had to move from Long Island to Connecticut during the conflict. The British held Long Island, of course. Militarily, he was an interesting figure, but Washington's greatest accomplishments may have been the voluntary relinquishment of power. It's quite a concept when you think about it. The war was over, and he said, "I'm done. I'm going home." (I'm paraphrasing.) It was a pivotal point in history. It's one of the things that made this nation different from others. I don't think they teach that point in school anymore.

Hey, here's another genre with a song that doesn't belong in a 4th grade classroom:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nPDixDqAUh0

Toward the end it gets rather graphic. Don't listen to it if you don't want to hear the details of a sexual encounter. Nine-year-olds certainly should not. It's adult content. They'd prolly get in trouble for just having it in the backpack or writing the lyrics on their book cover.

[moostraks]

Fifty Shades of the Common Core: how much porn is too much for high schoolers?

Read more: http://dailycaller.com/2013/09/12/fifty-shades-of-the-common-core-how-much-porn-is-too-much-for-high-schoolers/#ixzz2g0kO9Ui0

[moostraks]

(WARNING: Graphic) Common Core Approved Child Pornography
Read more at http://politichicks.tv/column/warning-graphic-common-core-approved-child-pornography/#bQpVwB9kEbi7v168.99


The book, Toni Morrison’s 1970 novel, “The Bluest Eye,” is among Common Core’s exemplar texts for 11th graders...

the author of the book, Morrison, says that she wanted the reader to feel as though they are a “co-conspirator” with the rapist. She took pains to make sure she never portrayed the actions as wrong in order to show how everyone has their own problems. She even goes as far as to describe the pedophilia, rape and incest “friendly,” “innocent,” and “tender.” It’s no wonder that this book is in the top 10 list of most contested books in the country...

[CPUd]

Well I suppose I'm a culturally deficient racist then...

"Rap" doesn't imitate life in any of my varied circles nor does it emulate "art" by any stretch of my imagination..

I'll grant that there's a segment of todays younger crowd that appreciates it just like some folks appreciated disco...I wasn't one of those folks either.

You'll just have to hang that racist moniker around my neck.:o

Or...........Maybe we could agree that not everybody views the world the same way..

You could live in suburbia and carry on as you like, I could live out here in the sticks and carry on as I like...

I don't feel the need to ascribe negative traits or monikers to your choices, in fact I'd be extremely happy to completely leave you alone.

It's this idea government is trying to cram down our collective throats that "we" need to be homogenous that's causing problems...

America is a diverse country, how about instead of forcing acceptance of differing cultures, celebrating the uniqueness of our own?

That's the point I tried to make earlier in the thread.....City folks have no desire to have Vo-Ag taught in their classrooms and I don't want to force them to.

I don't feel the need to belittle suburbanites for their ways, it's who they are and that's okay with me.

But, when suburbanites start trying to push their culture and mannerisms down my throat I have a problem with that.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=34u_3Z9_LUw

[dannno]

Well I suppose I'm a culturally deficient racist then...

"Rap" doesn't imitate life in any of my varied circles nor does it emulate "art" by any stretch of my imagination..

I'll grant that there's a segment of todays younger crowd that appreciates it just like some folks appreciated disco...I wasn't one of those folks either.

You'll just have to hang that racist moniker around my neck.:o

Or...........Maybe we could agree that not everybody views the world the same way..

You could live in suburbia and carry on as you like, I could live out here in the sticks and carry on as I like...

I don't feel the need to ascribe negative traits or monikers to your choices, in fact I'd be extremely happy to completely leave you alone.

It's this idea government is trying to cram down our collective throats that "we" need to be homogenous that's causing problems...

America is a diverse country, how about instead of forcing acceptance of differing cultures, celebrating the uniqueness of our own?

That's the point I tried to make earlier in the thread.....City folks have no desire to have Vo-Ag taught in their classrooms and I don't want to force them to.

I don't feel the need to belittle suburbanites for their ways, it's who they are and that's okay with me.

But, when suburbanites start trying to push their culture and mannerisms down my throat I have a problem with that.

Holy hell dude, you just discredited yourself when you compared rap to disco. Disco was around for like 3 or 4 years before it died, hip hop has been around since around the time disco started, and there were some variations even before disco, but I'd put it at a solid 30+ years.

It may not imitate life in your circles, but who cares? I daydream all the time about living out in the woods on a huge property, I hate the city, but humanity is beautiful and humanity can be ugly, but the portrayal of both the positive and the negative is just a shared experience which is what life is all about.

You may not be a big fan of Molyneux, but one thing he is right about and why more Christians should be promoting him is because he believes that humans need to strive to be more empathetic. He employs strategies on self improvement and raising children with the end goal of making more people more empathetic. Honestly, I can't think of anybody who represents empathy more than Jesus, which is a little ironic that so many Christians here hate him (though I'm sure there are plenty who are fans as well). But the point is, the ghetto is a place that is generally surrounded by negativity but the beauty of humanity glows through hip hop in ways that other music does not.

Not to mention, hip hop is not one person or one voice. There are thousands of people and thousands of voices - they are all telling stories and waxing intellectual. Some of it is really outstanding.

I'm guessing that as soon as you hear anything that sounds like hip hop your brain shuts down and has already decided you don't like it. That's no way to live, imo.

I'm also curious what "culture" is being pushed on you when you listen to hip hop? I can listen to country music without line dancing or even putting on boots. In fact, I don't think I've ever worn cowboy boots, but I can still listen to country music, right?

[Ender]

I don't care what music you like. Whatever floats your boat. The issue is that "pimps and hoes" are not exactly suitable curriculum for young children. :rolleyes: Our kids are graduating without knowing how to read, write and do arithmetic. I hardly think it is old school to believe that our children should focus on the basics instead of gangster rap.

Didn't all people have a heart attack when Catcher in the Rye was required reading? ;)

The real issue is that forced public schooling does not work and should be dissolved; it is simply a place to turn out compliant factory workers.

This stuff is just a distraction. Everyone will run around with their hands in the air and when it is tamed or taken out, then they will be satisfied with horrible public schools once more.

[Ender]

Holy hell dude, you just discredited yourself when you compared rap to disco. Disco was around for like 3 or 4 years before it died, hip hop has been around since around the time disco started, and there were some variations even before disco, but I'd put it at a solid 30+ years.

It may not imitate life in your circles, but who cares? I daydream all the time about living out in the woods on a huge property, I hate the city, but humanity is beautiful and humanity can be ugly, but the portrayal of both the positive and the negative is just a shared experience which is what life is all about.

You may not be a big fan of Molyneux, but one thing he is right about and why more Christians should be promoting him is because he believes that humans need to strive to be more empathetic. He employs strategies on self improvement and raising children with the end goal of making more people more empathetic. Honestly, I can't think of anybody who represents empathy more than Jesus, which is a little ironic that so many Christians here hate him (though I'm sure there are plenty who are fans as well). But the point is, the ghetto is a place that is generally surrounded by negativity but the beauty of humanity glows through hip hop in ways that other music does not.

Not to mention, hip hop is not one person or one voice. There are thousands of people and thousands of voices - they are all telling stories and waxing intellectual. Some of it is really outstanding.

I'm guessing that as soon as you hear anything that sounds like hip hop your brain shuts down and has already decided you don't like it. That's no way to live, imo.

I'm also curious what "culture" is being pushed on you when you listen to hip hop? I can listen to country music without line dancing or even putting on boots. In fact, I don't think I've ever worn cowboy boots, but I can still listen to country music, right?

My grandmother tells stories of when she was young, Swing was called evil. My dad says that some conservatives still say that Rock is a communist plot. ;)

[CPUd]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZltNR-Mkj-g

You can mix that with Blondie - Rapture

[LibertyEagle]

Didn't all people have a heart attack when Catcher in the Rye was required reading? ;)

The real issue is that forced public schooling does not work and should be dissolved; it is simply a place to turn out compliant factory workers.

This stuff is just a distraction. Everyone will run around with their hands in the air and when it is tamed or taken out, then they will be satisfied with horrible public schools once more.

I don't think you have been keeping up with the plethora of UN-generated education programs. School-to-work, Outcome-based education, No child left Behind, Goals 2000 and now, Common Core.

This stuff is being heaped on us for a reason and it has been working. Americans have been dumbed down. All that is left is completely unraveling our society.

I agree with you wholeheartedly about public schools and this is one of the reasons.

[Ender]

I don't think you have been keeping up with the plethora of UN-generated education programs. School-to-work, Outcome-based education, No child left Behind, Goals 2000 and now, Common Core.

This stuff is being heaped on us for a reason and it has been working. Americans have been dumbed down. All that is left is completely unraveling our society.

I agree with you wholeheartedly about public schools and this is one of the reasons.

Of course I have kept up- I am deeply involved with private education and freedom in learning.

"Stuff" has been heaped on the public for generations- people get mad, then get used to it, then think it's normal. Almost all history taught is false- math is antiquated, as is English. Yet we extol these, as taught in the public system, because we now think that they are truth.

The answer is to get rid of public ed- especially forced learning. This is NOT learning but simply what I call the regurgitation system. Take it in, burp it out for a test, forget it.

This is NOT close to real education, so why support any of it?

[LibertyEagle]

Of course I have kept up- I am deeply involved with private education and freedom in learning.

"Stuff" has been heaped on the public for generations- people get mad, then get used to it, then think it's normal. Almost all history taught is false- math is antiquated, as is English. Yet we extol these, as taught in the public system, because we now think that they are truth.

The answer is to get rid of public ed- especially forced learning. This is NOT learning but simply what I call the regurgitation system. Take it in, burp it out for a test, forget it.

This is NOT close to real education, so why support any of it?

I cannot believe you are arguing that being able to read, write or do arithmetic is antiquated.

[RockEnds]

Of course I have kept up- I am deeply involved with private education and freedom in learning.

"Stuff" has been heaped on the public for generations- people get mad, then get used to it, then think it's normal. Almost all history taught is false- math is antiquated, as is English. Yet we extol these, as taught in the public system, because we now think that they are truth.

The answer is to get rid of public ed- especially forced learning. This is NOT learning but simply what I call the regurgitation system. Take it in, burp it out for a test, forget it.

This is NOT close to real education, so why support any of it?

Common Core is past the pale as is teaching cocksucking to 9-year-olds. There's a line, and people instinctively understand where it is drawn. The goal of common core is to do exactly what has been done on this thread, to redefine moral authority. The new morality is to intimidate and demean people who have common morality. Orwell would be so proud! And while they're doing this, they're tagging anyone who objects for religious reasons as a potential terrorist--just like our forefathers who were also terrorists.

This is not yesterday's game. This is Common Core.

[Ender]

I cannot believe you are arguing that being able to read, write or do arithmetic is antiquated.

Learn to READ.

I said the methods in which they are taught in public school are ANTIQUATED.

And, it is interesting that that is all you got out of what I posted- speaks volumes for public ed. :(

[Ender]

Common Core is past the pale as is teaching cocksucking to 9-year-olds. There's a line, and people instinctively understand where it is drawn. The goal of common core is to do exactly what has been done on this thread, to redefine moral authority. The new morality is to intimidate and demean people who have common morality. Orwell would be so proud! And while they're doing this, they're tagging anyone who does this for religious reasons as a potential terrorist--just like our forefathers who were also terrorists.

This is not yesterday's game. This is Common Core.

So, maybe now people will actually take some action instead of thinking that public schools "educate'.

[moostraks]

I cannot believe you are arguing that being able to read, write or do arithmetic is antiquated.
Many say handwriting is considered unnecessary. Just wait for when they start signing contracts with an x again. This is why we homeschool. My children will not learn according to the latest fad in education.

[LibertyEagle]

Learn to READ.

I said the methods in which they are taught in public school are ANTIQUATED.

And, it is interesting that that is all you got out of what I posted- speaks volumes for public ed. :(

You should take some of your own medicine. I told you at the outset that I didn't support public schools.

[Ender]

You should take some of your own medicine. I told you at the outset that I didn't support public schools.

Then tell me what I said- instead of defending public education.

[Ender]

Many say handwriting is considered unnecessary. Just wait for when they start signing contracts with an x again. This is why we homeschool. My children will not learn according to the latest fad in education.

Handwriting is very necessary- helps connect the brain.

[LibertyEagle]

So, maybe now people will actually take some action instead of thinking that public schools "educate'.

Question. Can you walk and chew gum at the same time?

Public schools aren't going to be ended overnight, as much as I would prefer that they were. So, in my opinion, it is crucial that we fight these UN programs, while doing our best to encourage homeschooling and private schooling.

[Ender]

Question. Can you walk and chew gum at the same time?

Public schools aren't going to be ended overnight, as much as I would prefer that they were. So, in my opinion, it is crucial that we fight these UN programs, while doing our best to encourage homeschooling and private schooling.

And you will fail, because like most Americans you will fight a small battle but lose the war.

[RockEnds]

So, maybe now people will actually take some action instead of thinking that public schools "educate'.

Maybe. I really love our home school assistance program. The teacher is my cousin. I like the way she thinks. ;) But I'm considering going it alone because of common core. I have a couple other family members who are recently retired teachers, and they're pretty shocked at the program. Maybe more people will wake up. I don't know. I don't feel it's something that should be quietly accepted, though.

[Ender]

Maybe. I really love our home school assistance program. The teacher is my cousin. I like the way she thinks. ;) But I'm considering going it alone because of common core. I have a couple other family members who are recently retired teachers, and they're pretty shocked at the program. Maybe more people will wake up. I don't know. I don't feel it's something that should be quietly accepted, though.

Go for it. Teach your children their interests; let them become good in one thing. And then watch as they blossom into eternal learners. It is amazing.

[RockEnds]

Go for it. Teach your children their interests; let them become good in one thing. And then watch as they blossom into eternal learners. It is amazing.

I do that now. It's just nice to have the resources and social interaction provided through the homeschool assistance program. But Iowa recently changed the law. Beginning this year, all I am required to do is report that we homeschool. And I could move across the line to Missouri where I don't even have to report that. Todd's making the Ozarks sound pretty good. :)

[LibertyEagle]

Go for it. Teach your children their interests; let them become good in one thing. And then watch as they blossom into eternal learners. It is amazing.

I think that's a great idea, Ender. But, I think fighting the other is important too. If just 2 women can throw out one of these programs in a state, it's not like it's not possible to do all over.

[tod evans]

Holy hell dude, you just discredited yourself when you compared rap to disco. Disco was around for like 3 or 4 years before it died, hip hop has been around since around the time disco started, and there were some variations even before disco, but I'd put it at a solid 30+ years.

Discredited myself with whom?

I didn't claim to like or pay attention to either, in fact I specifically stated that I didn't care for disco or rap...


It may not imitate life in your circles, but who cares?

Why I do of course, that's why I brought it up.


I daydream all the time about living out in the woods on a huge property, I hate the city, but humanity is beautiful and humanity can be ugly, but the portrayal of both the positive and the negative is just a shared experience which is what life is all about.

Good for you it's a good thing to have aspirations.

Please try to understand that most folks who live out in the country hate the city too and for that reason we are very skeptical about city folk bringing their bad habits with them if they try and move to the country..We have our own troubles out here in the sticks and I for one would really appreciate it if you kept your troubles in the city.
You're of course welcome to come and enjoy country life just don't expect country folks to adapt to city behavior.


You may not be a big fan of Molyneux, but one thing he is right about and why more Christians should be promoting him is because he believes that humans need to strive to be more empathetic. He employs strategies on self improvement and raising children with the end goal of making more people more empathetic. Honestly, I can't think of anybody who represents empathy more than Jesus, which is a little ironic that so many Christians here hate him (though I'm sure there are plenty who are fans as well). But the point is, the ghetto is a place that is generally surrounded by negativity but the beauty of humanity glows through hip hop in ways that other music does not.

It's not my place to speak for other Christians and I certainly am not the person to tell them what they should do.
I have listened to Mr.Molyneux since I first heard of him on this board and like most folks he has some ideas I agree with and others I don't.
One in particular I happen to disagree with him on is child rearing, he's free to raise his child however he wants but I'll not tolerate him or anyone else trying to tell me how to raise mine.


Not to mention, hip hop is not one person or one voice. There are thousands of people and thousands of voices - they are all telling stories and waxing intellectual. Some of it is really outstanding.

Okay, I'm sure you believe that.

Understand that I do not want my child subjected to your version of "telling stories and waxing intellectual", there is a cultural barrier that I will not forego.


I'm guessing that as soon as you hear anything that sounds like hip hop your brain shuts down and has already decided you don't like it. That's no way to live, imo.

It may be "no way for you to live" it works just fine for me.

I'm not interested in indoctrinating your children with my ideas of proper storytelling or my ideas of intellectual discussion suitable for their class room.

Why is it that you find it necessary to push yours on mine?


I'm also curious what "culture" is being pushed on you when you listen to hip hop? I can listen to country music without line dancing or even putting on boots. In fact, I don't think I've ever worn cowboy boots, but I can still listen to country music, right?

You may listen to whatever you like, you may let your child listen to whatever you find appropriate. You and your kid may wear whatever footwear you like.

Why do you want to tell me what you think is appropriate for my child?

[tod evans]

The answer is to get rid of public ed- especially forced learning. This is NOT learning but simply what I call the regurgitation system. Take it in, burp it out for a test, forget it.

This is NOT close to real education, so why support any of it?

I do not advocate for any type of centralized school system.

In fact my choice would be to have community based curriculums paid for locally, taught with local people that were free and clear of all federal influence.

Everything government gets involved in it fucks up, everything!

[dannno]

You're of course welcome to come and enjoy country life just don't expect country folks to adapt to city behavior.

What does listening to rap have to do with city behavior? I said before that 95% of my friends listen to an enjoy hip hop, yet none of them participate in anything remotely similar to what is often discussed in the songs with regard to urban violence and such. I could live in Alaska and listen to hula music or I could live in the tropics and listen to some dude yodling up in the mountains - I can empathize and share their experiences in a different way than actually participating or adopting those practices. In fact, by doing all of this exploring, people of different cultures can begin to better understand each other and this can resolve future conflict.

I am guessing you have very little or no empathy for people who are born and grow up in urban areas. Do you realize you could have just as easily been born in inner-city Los Angeles? Are people who live in the country 'better' than people who live in the city, or were they born there and they are a product of being raised in that environment?

Does listening to rap increase the amount of people who move to the inner city and become gangsters? I really don't think so..

[tod evans]

I am guessing you have very little or no empathy for people who are born and grow up in urban areas. Do you realize you could have just as easily been born in inner-city Los Angeles? Are people who live in the country 'better' than people who live in the city, or were they born there and they are a product of being raised in that environment?



Your assumptions regarding my upbringing are wrong..

I was born in a city, a large one as a matter of fact, my father moved our family to the country just as I hit puberty..

I was stationed at NRMCGLAKES and as a young man bounced back and forth between city money and country tranquility before I realized I belong in the sticks.

No group of people are "better" than any other, what a ridiculous question..

As for empathy for city folks..........I have empathy for people who live where they don't want to, that works for folks who are in the country and want to be citified as well as vice-versa..

Frankly I could care less about what music you listen to, where I take issue is when you or anyone else tries to teach my child that language and behavior such as has been depicted in this thread is normal or acceptable in a public setting such as a school.

Were you to bring a child raised in the manners described to the local park to play with the other kids he/she would undoubtedly be frog-marched to you by an irate parent. If you found his/her behavior acceptable and told the irate parent as much there's a good chance you'd be put in your place...

Why would you, or anyone, want to subject a child to that?

There are cultural differences between city folks and country folks, one's not "better" than the other but who in their right mind tries to push their ideas of acceptability/morality on a group who disagrees?

There's a big difference between an adult doing something and that adult teaching another persons child the same thing.

I would no more teach your child how to gut a deer against your wishes than I would permit you to expose my child to the ideas that have been depicted in this thread...

[RockEnds]

Well, look what just came in the mail.

My child recently visited an allergist. I just received this:


Preventative Medicine
Immunizations:
Influenza - Have you had a flu shot since the most recent September 1? No Parent Refuses

Parent laughed out loud at the suggestion, actually. But there were a series of questions that included school performance. I've raised kids for the past 29 years. This is the first I've ever received something like this in the mail after a doctor visit.

Welcome to the brave, new world. Let the games begin.

http://www.dataqualitycampaign.org/your-states-progress/10-state-actions?action=one

[better-dead-than-fed]

where I take issue is when you or anyone else tries to teach my child that language and behavior such as has been depicted in this thread is normal or acceptable in a public setting such as a school.

Were you to bring a child raised in the manners described to the local park to play with the other kids he/she would undoubtedly be frog-marched to you by an irate parent. If you found his/her behavior acceptable and told the irate parent as much there's a good chance you'd be put in your place...

I appreciate the lengths you are going to respect people's individuality in this thread's context; but if you are right about what's "normal" and "acceptable" behavior, I would like to see you frog-march a child in a park in Compton.

[better-dead-than-fed]

There's a line, and people instinctively understand where it is drawn.... The new morality is to intimidate and demean people who have common morality.

Apparently you misjudged what's "common" and "instinctive"? Cultural conservatives wrote the book on intimidating and demeaning dissenters; now that cultural conservatism is growing less common, tyranny of the majority isn't looking so good for cultural conservatives anymore.


our forefathers who were also terrorists.

Interesting.

[tod evans]

I appreciate the lengths you are going to respect people's individuality in this thread's context; but if you are right about what's "normal" and "acceptable" behavior, I would like to see you frog-march a child in a park in Compton.

My child won't be in a park in Compton..(wherever that is?)

And it's not me you'd need to worry about if your child misbehaves out here in the sticks, it's the mothers who'll call your bluff.

[Natural Citizen]

And it's not me you'd need to worry about if your child misbehaves out here in the sticks, it's the mothers who'll call your bluff.

Heh. Funny thing about life in the sticks. Few get to appreciate this.

[RockEnds]

Interesting.

Yes, it is interesting that the feds have taken that position. Did you read the link back a few posts from the military training? Here's an article on the subject:

http://radio.foxnews.com/toddstarnes/top-stories/pentagon-labels-founding-fathers-conservatives-as-extremists.html

But reading the manual is more enlightening.

Of course, it's not really new. YouTubes of federal agents promoting this line of thought is not new.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZgmYzbyhtM

You certainly seem to shine to the idea.

[Peace&Freedom]

Apparently you misjudged what's "common" and "instinctive"? Cultural conservatives wrote the book on intimidating and demeaning dissenters; now that cultural conservatism is growing less common, tyranny of the majority isn't looking so good for cultural conservatives anymore.


I reject the wholesale idea that that cultural conservatives "wrote the book on intimidating and demeaning dissenters," or that it was premised on tyranny or majoritarianism. You don't have to agree with the majprity on something to at least be respectful towards the large fragment of the population who holds to it. I am not a Muslim, but respect one fourth of the world's population that is. The consistent approach of the left, by contrast, has been to disrespect and marginalize any expression of the cultural right. E.g., when's the last time you saw an evangelical presented as a positive major character on prime time TV?

It is the cultural left who has been distinctive in being dismissive towards historic moral views held by most Americans, most non-Americans, and by most people through history. They have instead been intent on imposing their views on everybody else through law and government policy, to an extent not reproduced by the right, and irrespective as to whether they are the numerical majority or not. At the very least, in the ongoing current cultural war, we are supposed to not notice the authoritarian impulses of the cultural left, only those of the right.

[RockEnds]

Apparently you misjudged what's "common" and "instinctive"? Cultural conservatives wrote the book on intimidating and demeaning dissenters; now that cultural conservatism is growing less common, tyranny of the majority isn't looking so good for cultural conservatives anymore.


So you want to fight tyranny with...tyranny?

[LibertyEagle]

From Lew Rockwell on Facebook. He was talking about Ron's new book on homeschooling, but I thought it would be relevant to this thread.


"I have started reading Ron Paul's new book on the School Revolution and am really enjoying it. Anyone who is not in a position to homeschool children should not be put off buying and reading this book. You will love it no matter your age or interest in homeschooling. It is clear, concise, and full of interesting anecdotes about Dr. Paul’s own experiences growing up in the educational system of the day.

What I like so much thus far is what is missing in many libertarian and pro-liberty arguments: a solid treatment of the importance of personal responsibility as a key component of the struggle for personal liberty. Any self-ordering society must in fact be a moral society, where passions and preferences are tempered by a keen eye on consequence and the non-aggression principle.

The state seeks to program children to be obedient drones and it resents and outlaws challenges. But, as Dr. Paul points out early in the book, “there can be no revolution without a revolution in education.” It is the fundamental issue of our time."

[dannno]

From Lew Rockwell on Facebook. He was talking about Ron's new book on homeschooling, but I thought it would be relevant to this thread.

Do you believe that the point of hip hop is to convince everybody to be immoral?

[LibertyEagle]

Do you believe that the point of hip hop is to convince everybody to be immoral?

Do you think songs like Po-Pimp are teaching morality? That is one of the songs they are covering in this government indoctrination program.

[better-dead-than-fed]

our forefathers who were also terrorists.Interesting.Yes, it is interesting that the feds have taken that position... YouTubes of federal agents promoting this line of thought is not new.

Do you disagree? When the Founders shot police, do you deny they were living the thug life?


You certainly seem to shine to the idea.

The idea that mass shootings against government employees is terrorism? I hadn't realized that was a controversial proposition. Please explain how it is not terrorism?

[better-dead-than-fed]

Do you think songs like Po-Pimp are teaching morality?

Do you think this is teaching any violation of the non-aggression principle:



Cause he's a pimp, he gotta be, full of that
M-O, N-E, but why?
Cause nigga be sportin nice cars and fancy clothes
Fresh jewels Girbaud flexin one five oh (chop chop)
Chop up that paper hoe, chop up that paper hoe
Watch where your lips go, caress my tip slow
To the tempo, instrumental
Real simple when you fuckin with a pimp doe....

Me and Do or Die dig drinkin love potion
The word that was never said
Twisted be givin women d*ck in the bed, until they sick in the head
And if I ever leave whoever dead
They ain't trickin the Feds or spittin game but it's chicken and bread
Kickin them legs in the air like a playa do
Then belittle in a day or two
After words I'ma slay a crew
Now that's some pimp type shit that B-Low and AK'll do
Wearing gray and blue



But if the head the bonk c'mon suck a nigga dick

[better-dead-than-fed]

I reject the wholesale idea that that cultural conservatives "wrote the book on intimidating and demeaning dissenters," or that it was premised on tyranny or majoritarianism. You don't have to agree with the majority on something to at least be respectful towards the large fragment of the population who holds to it. I am not a Muslim, but respect one fourth of the world's population that is. The consistent approach of the left, by contrast, has been to disrespect and marginalize any expression of the cultural right. E.g., when's the last time you saw an evangelical presented as a positive major character on prime time TV?

It is the cultural left who has been distinctive in being dismissive towards historic moral views held by most Americans, most non-Americans, and by most people through history. They have instead been intent on imposing their views on everybody else through law and government policy, to an extent not reproduced by the right, and irrespective as to whether they are the numerical majority or not. At the very least, in the ongoing current cultural war, we are supposed to not notice the authoritarian impulses of the cultural left, only those of the right.


imprisoning people for alcohol;
imprisoning people for drugs;
imprisoning people for sodomy;
imprisoning people for pimping;
imprisoning people for hoeing;
imprisoning people for "obscene" speech; and
vilifying women for sexual promiscuity.

Evangelicals don't get portrayed nicely by the liberal media, but at least they don't get imprisoned.

[tod evans]

imprisoning people for alcohol;
imprisoning people for drugs;
imprisoning people for sodomy;
imprisoning people for pimping;
imprisoning people for hoeing;
imprisoning people for "obscene" speech; and
vilifying women for sexual promiscuity.

Evangelicals don't get portrayed nicely by the liberal media, but at least they don't get imprisoned.

The Christians I know do not want people imprisoned for non-violent crimes, do you know of a specific group that does?

[Zippyjuan]

Do you think songs like Po-Pimp are teaching morality? That is one of the songs they are covering in this government indoctrination program.

Does listening to "immoral" music make you behave immorally? Elvis was once considered an immoral influence on youth. So were the Beatles. In his day, Mozart was considered immoral as well. Were they part of a government "indoctrination program"?

If a test asks a question about Communist Russia or China are they promoting communism among youth? (this entire thread comes from one question in one class which refered to a Rap artist- I am impressed the discussion of it has lasted this long).

Now if there was an entire course about it and promoting it as something to be emulated that would be a different story- but that is certainly not the case here.

[better-dead-than-fed]

The Christians I know do not want people imprisoned for non-violent crimes, do you know of a specific group that does?

Yes, the group that created those laws in the first place. I realize there are enlightened Christians who'd rather not imprison people over non-violent "crimes". The enlightened ones are the norm among Ron Paul supporters and RPF members, but unfortunately the exception among the general population.

[tod evans]

Yes, the group that created those laws in the first place. I realize there are enlightened Christians who'd rather not imprison people over non-violent "crimes". The enlightened ones are the norm among Ron Paul supporters and RPF members, but unfortunately the exception among the general population.

Isn't that akin to saying Ron Paul supporting rappers are different than the mainstream?

[better-dead-than-fed]

this entire thread comes from one question in one class which refered to a Rap artist- I am impressed the discussion of it has lasted this long

Would there have been similar outcry if the lesson had referred to a country-music song about hard-drinking, gambling, womanizing, and run-ins with the law?

http://llamabutchers.mu.nu/archives/putin-thug-life-tupac-tatoo.gif

[better-dead-than-fed]

Isn't that akin to saying Ron Paul supporting rappers are different than the mainstream?

I don't understand your question.

[Zippyjuan]

Excellent point. Country music criminals are seen as rebels, outlaws- cool people fighting oppression. Rap criminals are seen as criminals against society. Both engaging in the same sorts of behavior.

[tod evans]

Excellent point. Country music criminals are seen as rebels, outlaws- cool people fighting oppression. Rap criminals are seen as criminals against society. Both engaging in the same sorts of behavior.

I've missed the country music songs promoting criminal behavior in bastardized English that this federal program is pushing.

Do you have an example?

[better-dead-than-fed]

I've missed the country music songs promoting criminal behavior in bastardized English that this federal program is pushing.

Do you have an example?

Declaration of Independence?

[Zippyjuan]

I've missed the country music songs promoting criminal behavior in bastardized English that this federal program is pushing.

Do you have an example?

No I don't because I haven't examined the entire ciriculum.
How much are they pushing evil hip hop music? According to the OP, one question on one worksheet in an entire school year. That is pushing it?

[tod evans]

I can't edit/type as fast as you Zippy..

I haven't examined the curriculum either, I have read some of the "lyrics" posted in this thread and I haven't once used the term "evil"..

What I have said is if you want to teach your kid rap in school then have at it, my kid won't be studying or mimicking rap while living under my roof.

There are differing demographics in the US, mine doesn't fit where you live, obviously, and rap doesn't fit out here.

That's not a problem for me, I don't want to push my agenda on your child.

[Zippyjuan]

I don't listen to rap or coutry music. I just don't see the claim that the education system is somehow promoting hip hop culture via a single question on one paper in an entire school year. I don't get what the fuss is about. The uproar is actually in the end promoting it even more than the course is.


In the second worksheet students had to find the common theme "twist" from words like "tornado," the 50's dance move and a rapper named "twista." The worksheet also references his song "Po-Pimp."

It doesn't list any lyrics but just mentions the title of the song. Here is what all of the fuss is about- different uses of the word "Twister":

http://global.fncstatic.com/static/managed/img/Opinion/660-fourth-grade-lesson.jpg
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/19/fourth-graders-taught-about-pimps-and-mobstaz-in-louisiana/

[tod evans]

I don't listen to rap or coutry music. I just don't see the claim that the education system is somehow promoting hip hop culture via a single question on one paper in an entire school year. I don't get what the fuss is about. The uproar is actually in the end promoting it even more than the course is.

Way I read the article the "single question" was predicated by "studying" the song/rhyme rap.

I don't listen to rap or country either..

[better-dead-than-fed]

I've missed the country music songs promoting criminal behavior in bastardized English that this federal program is pushing.

Do you have an example?

From: http://commoncore.org/maps/documents/Art_in_the_Maps.pdf

Oil painting promoting a "midnight ride" calling for people to shoot police:

http://edu.warhol.org/Images/gwood.jpg

Painting promoting thug-lifers led by George Washington on their way to shoot police:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/9/95/Washington_Crossing_the_Delaware_by_Emanuel_Leutze %2C_MMA-NYC%2C_1851.jpg/640px-Washington_Crossing_the_Delaware_by_Emanuel_Leutze %2C_MMA-NYC%2C_1851.jpg

Shakespeare play promoting murder and political assassinations:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hamlet

Michelangelo's pornography:

(warning: explicit content) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Michelangelos_David.jpg

Promotion of stealing and smoking a pipe all night long:


London Bridge is falling down,
Falling down, falling down.
London Bridge is falling down,
My fair lady....

Silver and gold will be stolen away,
Stolen away, stolen away,
Silver and gold will be stolen away,
My fair lady....

Give him a pipe to smoke all night,
Smoke all night, smoke all night,
Give him a pipe to smoke all night,
My fair lady.

Promotion of getting "handy" with the girls:


Yankee Doodle went to town
A-riding on a pony,
Stuck a feather in his cap
And called it macaroni'.

Yankee Doodle keep it up,
Yankee Doodle dandy,
Mind the music and the step,
And with the girls be handy.

[Zippyjuan]

Way I read the article the "single question" was predicated by "studying" the song/rhyme rap.

I don't listen to rap or country either..

I can understand that. It was portrayed in that way by some of the reactions to it. I posted a picture of the actual worksheet above so people can see what it is really about.

[LibertyEagle]

Zippy, there are a number of threads about Common Core on this site. I recommend you read them. This UN-education program is absolutely horrid.

[tod evans]

Let me repeat myself..

If you want to teach your kids that intercity behavior, language and mannerisms are proper behavior then do so.

Don't try and teach my kid that shit, I won't have it.

Your quotes/links portray some of my childs ancestors, I don't have a problem portraying them as such, if you don't want to teach your child about my ancestors that's fine with me, don't do it...

If you want to teach your children about my ancestors then do it..

Right now my 9 y/o and I are going over our genealogy in the 15th century and there were plenty of scurrilous individuals who left their mark...

I don't want to teach your child my families genealogy or cultural practices, don't try to teach my child yours.

[Zippyjuan]

Maybe Chubby Checker should have been left off the "uses of the word Twist" as well (actually his name isn't mentioned but it does describe how to do the "Twist"- let's rotate those hips now!). He played that darn Rock and Roll music. Like the worksheet says,

"sometimes people dance to meet boyfriends or girlfriends" (which to me was more odd for fourth graders than the next part).

Here is the entire "questionable" part:


Carl Terrell Mitchel, better known by his stage name "Twista", was born in 1972. Ninteen years later, his album "Running off at Da Mouth" debued. In 1977, after appearing on Do or Die's hit "Po Pimp", Twista was signed to Atlantic Records. Under that label he released "Adrenaline Rush" and formed the group Speedknot Mobstarz in 1998. His 2000 album "Kamikazi" went to number one in the Billboard Top 200 album chart.

Is that teaching "intercity behavior, language, and mannerisms" and promoting it as "proper behavior"?

[better-dead-than-fed]

Let me repeat myself..

If you want to teach your kids that intercity behavior, language and mannerisms are proper behavior then do so.

Don't try and teach my kid that shit, I won't have it.

Your quotes/links portray some of my childs ancestors, I don't have a problem portraying them as such, if you don't want to teach your child about my ancestors that's fine with me, don't do it...

If you want to teach your children about my ancestors then do it..

Right now my 9 y/o and I are going over our genealogy in the 15th century and there were plenty of scurrilous individuals who left their mark...

I don't want to teach your child my families genealogy or cultural practices, don't try to teach my child yours.

No argument from me about that. If gangster rap has weakened the demand for the government program that's shoving your ancestors' debauchery down the throats of inner-city students, that weakening of demand is progress I think everyone here can appreciate.



Fathers of this country never cared for me
They kept my ancestors shackled up in slavery
And Uncle Sam never did a damn thing for me
Except lie about the facts in my history
So now I'm sitting hear mad cause I'm unemployed
But the government's glad cause they enjoy it
When my people are down so they can screw us around
Time to change the government now. Panther power.

Maybe they will put his face on the national dollar bill.

[RockEnds]

I don't listen to rap or coutry music. I just don't see the claim that the education system is somehow promoting hip hop culture via a single question on one paper in an entire school year. I don't get what the fuss is about. The uproar is actually in the end promoting it even more than the course is.



It doesn't list any lyrics but just mentions the title of the song. Here is what all of the fuss is about- different uses of the word "Twister":

http://global.fncstatic.com/static/managed/img/Opinion/660-fourth-grade-lesson.jpg
http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/09/19/fourth-graders-taught-about-pimps-and-mobstaz-in-louisiana/


I was also under the impression that the song was being played and promoted. That's a train wreck of a lesson, but at least they're not actually teaching oral sex to 9-year-olds. I know they're trying to integrate subjects with Common Core, but what is the point of this lesson other than possibly promoting ADD? How quickly can a student jump from one bit of trivia to the next without any substance being presented? I'm not sure this lesson isn't actually more destructive than just teaching the song.

I think I would entitle this, "How to Change the Subject from Science to Shaking yer Butt for the Opposite Sex in Two Minutes or Less."




Back to the conversation, Down with Morality! Everyone knows moral nihilism is a superior philosophy! Wait, wat?

[better-dead-than-fed]

Down with Morality! Everyone knows moral nihilism is a superior philosophy! Wait, wat?

Who said anything about amorality or nihilism? Are you referring to my observation that you misjudged what's "common" and "instinctive"?



There's a line, and people instinctively understand where it is drawn.... The new morality is to intimidate and demean people who have common morality.Apparently you misjudged what's "common" and "instinctive"?

Or my list of offenses committed by some cultural conservatives?



imprisoning people for alcohol;
imprisoning people for drugs;
imprisoning people for sodomy;
imprisoning people for pimping;
imprisoning people for hoeing;
imprisoning people for "obscene" speech; and
vilifying women for sexual promiscuity.

[Peace&Freedom]

imprisoning people for alcohol;
imprisoning people for drugs;
imprisoning people for sodomy;
imprisoning people for pimping;
imprisoning people for hoeing;
imprisoning people for "obscene" speech; and
vilifying women for sexual promiscuity.

Evangelicals don't get portrayed nicely by the liberal media, but at least they don't get imprisoned.

Oh yes they do. Ask the families who have been SWAT teamed over guns they own, homeschooling, the pastors worldwide who have been jailed for teaching the biblical doctrine against homosexuality, etc, or litigated/blacklisted over alleged 'hate speech' for doing so, etc. Drop the other shoe, the list of things cultural conservatives get imprisoned, sued, bankrupted, etc for is longer than the list above. The cultural left choose to use the courts, government policies and regulations to impose their schema on everybody else, compared to the more open approach of direct legislation or referendum used by the right, but that doesn't mean they are any less coercive. Since the liberal regs and case law vastly exceeds the number of laws, I'd say the left is more coercive.

And there is a legitimate disagreement (between secular and theistic libertarians) as to whether sexual immorality is non-violent/consensual. God is personally victimized by sin regardless of whether the human parties involved view their behavior that way, so calling the acts 'consentual' defacto imposes a structural atheism into the law. Whether you agree with such a approach to the law or not, that does not make the current state of affairs more libertarian or pro-liberty. By most every measure, we were vastly freer circa the late 1700's (when cultural conservatism was the clear bias of the law) than we are now.

[better-dead-than-fed]

families who have been SWAT teamed over guns they own

This affects thug-lifers too, not just cultural conservatives.


homeschooling, the pastors worldwide who have been jailed for teaching the biblical doctrine against homosexuality, etc,

I encountered none during my five years in jail in southern Arizona and Massachusetts, and 95% were there for drugs. The stats would vary jurisdictionally, but nationally I think roughly 50% imprisoned are for drugs. Anyway, I do appreciate your point that evangelicals are not immune.


there is a legitimate disagreement (between secular and theistic libertarians) as to whether sexual immorality is non-violent/consensual. God is personally victimized by sin regardless of whether the human parties involved view their behavior that way, so calling the acts 'consentual' defacto imposes a structural atheism into the law.

"Theistic libertarianism", as you describe it, would give the God individual a political tyranny over other individuals. He alone would be free to dictate a list of arbitrarily prohibited beliefs and acts. If that's a "legitimate" conception of "libertarianism", then a scheme where I was tyrannical dictator might be "legitimate" similarly. If I tried to impose such a scheme, I would expect problems from those opposed to tyranny.

[Ender]

Oh yes they do. Ask the families who have been SWAT teamed over guns they own, homeschooling, the pastors worldwide who have been jailed for teaching the biblical doctrine against homosexuality, etc, or litigated/blacklisted over alleged 'hate speech' for doing so, etc. Drop the other shoe, the list of things cultural conservatives get imprisoned, sued, bankrupted, etc for is longer than the list above. The cultural left choose to use the courts, government policies and regulations to impose their schema on everybody else, compared to the more open approach of direct legislation or referendum used by the right, but that doesn't mean they are any less coercive. Since the liberal regs and case law vastly exceeds the number of laws, I'd say the left is more coercive.

And there is a legitimate disagreement (between secular and theistic libertarians) as to whether sexual immorality is non-violent/consensual. God is personally victimized by sin regardless of whether the human parties involved view their behavior that way, so calling the acts 'consentual' defacto imposes a structural atheism into the law. Whether you agree with such a approach to the law or not, that does not make the current state of affairs more libertarian or pro-liberty. By most every measure, we were vastly freer circa the late 1700's (when cultural conservatism was the clear bias of the law) than we are now.

God is NOT personally victimized by sin. That's baloney.

We are here with agency and free will to discover things ourselves and come to our own conclusions. We are no more free under tyrannical religious conservatism as we are under tyrannical atheistic liberalism.

[helmuth_hubener]

I agree, this Common Core crap has got to go.... I agree also. Consumers of education should be free to consume whatever education they choose, regardless of whether others agree with them or not. Agreed?

[Ender]

I agree also. Consumers of education should be free to consume whatever education they choose, regardless of whether others agree with them or not. Agreed?


Yep.

[Natural Citizen]

I agree also. Consumers of education should be free to consume whatever education they choose, regardless of whether others agree with them or not. Agreed?

How the hell do you "consume" education? What kind of reframe is this?

Consumers of education....unbelievable.

[helmuth_hubener]

How the hell do you "consume" education? What kind of reframe is this?

Consumers of education....unbelievable. Thank you for asking! I do not understand your anger, but I can understand your confusion. I consume education in the same way that I consume electricity and entertainment. I don't eat them, true! You see, consuming does not always mean "eating". In economics, it means paying money to get something, even if that something is effervescent. So you see, I can not only be a consumer of enchiladas, but also of encryption services.

[Natural Citizen]

Thank you for asking! I do not understand your anger, but I can understand your confusion. I consume education in the same way that I consume electricity and entertainment. I don't eat them, true! You see, consuming does not always mean "eating". In economics, it means paying money to get something, even if that something is effervescent. So you see, I can not only be a consumer of enchiladas, but also of encryption services.

Anger? Oh, please.

I have to stop messing with you. Weird fellow, this helmuth.

[better-dead-than-fed]

I do not understand your anger, but I can understand your confusion.

I don't understand it either. It's like a whirlwind of confused anger.


BDTF...I don't know if you know it but you seem to be the shining example of useful idiot for the very people who have been delegated to apply this infrastructure. Take it from someone who has sat in the same room with them many, many times. See, you're down on the bottom end of the totem pole trying to place others who may not understand the issue in scope into a position of useful idiot with things that are only relative to the distance of your own sight/perception/immediate goals in all of this. I promise you that you are so far out of your league that it's laughable. But by all means...keep it up.

[Natural Citizen]

I don't understand it either. It's like a whirlwind of confused anger.

Hm. You again, huh? I thought that you were banned.

What you quoted came from a completely different subject of discussion in an entirely different thread. What does it have to do with this at all?

Bye...again. Although I am curious what purpose you serve around here. It's interesting. :cool:

[helmuth_hubener]

Anger? Oh, please.

I have to stop messing with you. Weird fellow, this helmuth. Did I answer your question, though? Do you now understand how I can be said to be a "consumer" of movies?

[jonhowe]

I don't think it is absurd. I have my opinion about what's appropriate, and you have yours. I can live with your backwards opinion, but you have no place dictating the curriculum of any school except one you might manage yourself. Your opinion is tolerated but your dictatorship is unwelcome.

You do realize that YOU are, in fact, the one who is unwelcome, right?

[better-dead-than-fed]

You do realize that YOU are, in fact, the one who is unwelcome, right?

why?