Prove that government does not hold its own agents accountable

[Christian Liberty]

Yeah, we all know they don't, but I'm in a conversation with someone on another forum and need specific examples.

Post examples of where government has failed to hold its own agents accountable for the actions they have committed. The more blatant the better. +rep for anyone who posts a good link.

[green73]

https://news.google.com/

[better-dead-than-fed]

Yeah, we all know they don't, but I'm in a conversation with someone on another forum and need specific examples.

Post examples of where government has failed to hold its own agents accountable for the actions they have committed. The more blatant the better. +rep for anyone who posts a good link.

These examples are blatant in that the misconduct is shown by the government's own records:

Chief Federal Judge in the southern District of Arizona refuses to hold other judges accountable, despite proof that judges are routinely falsifying court records for the purpose of imprisoning people unlawfully (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1VFOSg1Xb7kL_ppGYQ97E52keBI11fyLsEtWBH5s9sPM/pub);
DOJ refuses to hold personnel accountable despite proof of an ongoing scheme to defraud the taxpayers (https://docs.google.com/document/d/1mEn8dB6jzUZjMPOAdiEjKrXcbAe6thQXr2swP6dKkmE/pub); and
DOJ agent testifies falsely in court, on record; DOJ personnel up through the Office of Inspector General refuse to hold her accountable (https://docs.google.com/document/d/19ftf3Dpi4JM5ZJ3iiAyCmPZV4S_TENZYHaCK0ouIvP4/pub).

[Christian Liberty]

Lol. I was looking for specific stories that I could post quickly, but thank you at any rate:)

(And yeah, I know I could probably just post Will Grigg's LRC page as well I'll also do that but the more the better.)

[James Madison]

2003 war in Iraq.

If you believe the official story, 9/11. A multi-billion dollar military apparatus and self-appointed policeman of the world gets outwitted, outsmarted, and outmaneuvered by 19 civilians armed with box cutters? And nobody lost their job for that colossal screwup?

[Root]

https://news.google.com/
+ rep

[better-dead-than-fed]

I was looking for specific stories that I could post quickly,

That is what I posted above, but I do not have a license to practice journalism. If you want a link to where CNN reported it, I can't give one.

[Christian Liberty]

That is what I posted above, but I do not have a license to practice journalism. If you want a link to where CNN reported it, I can't give one.

We crossposted, I was talking to green, not you. Sorry.

What you gave me was perfect:)

[VoluntaryAmerican]

http://blogs.phillymag.com/the_philly_post/2013/01/24/years-tainted-justice-police-working-victims-waiting-results/

[better-dead-than-fed]

What you gave me

If my articles can be improved, let me know and I'll edit them. I've tried to include all necessary evidence to prove the point you are trying to make, while keeping them short.

[kcchiefs6465]

By request.

A running compilation of the human victims of police abuse: a place for the Patricia Cooks, Nick Christies, Oliver Grants and Kelly Thomases.

Police Abuse (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?390933-Police-Abuse&highlight=police+abuse)

[aGameOfThrones]

The police chief that ran over a mundane gave himself a day off.

[fisharmor]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ruby_Ridge
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Move_bombing
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wounded_Knee_Massacre

If you want current events, just direct them to Will Grigg's blog.
http://freedominourtime.blogspot.com/
The problem with his blog is that you can't be a mouth-breathing, 'Murica lovin', football-watchin', chili-cheese-fries-eatin' red-blooded fuckwit and get past the first sentence of anything he writes.

ETA yeah, I haven't read the front-page entry on his site, but it deals EXACTLY with agents of the state not being held accountable.

[Christian Liberty]

OK, the poster in queston is a theonomist, and a little naive on a few issues IMO, but he's not a blatantly stupid neocon. I wouldn't even waste my time if that was the case. I actually do think there might be hope in making a libertarian out of him, or at least someone who consistently opposes government abuse.

[kcchiefs6465]

For a quick overview of general incompetence, gross negligence, and criminal conflicts of interest I'd recommend watching the video of David Silva being beaten to death, reading of the confiscation of evidence, learning of the Sheriff who concluded his officers acted appropriately grossly prematurely also being the coroner that provided a death certificate of heart failure absolving the murderers of their crime.

So many cases.

Not just restrained to the police department and related agencies.

Look at the torture programs or the importation of cocaine through Central and South America by CIA and DEA contacts. Look at the bipartisan pardoning of those responsible. Look at Fast and Furious and the gun running schemes resulting in countless deaths.

And on, and on, and on. I could write a book on the subject if I had the intention to. You will find most any instance I referred to and countless more here. A Google search with the term "ronpaulforums" added on will not disappoint.

[Christian Liberty]

Thanks to all of you. ESPECIALLY for William Grigg's blog. Read the first article and I already feel like I want to light a flag on fire...

+rep to all of you.

[better-dead-than-fed]

... He was wrongly convicted not once, but twice.... He spent 18 years at the Louisiana State Penitentiary, 14 of them on death row.... When his attorneys finally found the evidence that cleared him -- evidence his prosecutors had known about for years -- he was weeks away from execution.

... in the end, there was no accountability....

... "Mistakes can happen. But if you don't do anything to stop them from happening again, you can't keep calling them mistakes."...

--> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?423070-quot-There-have-to-be-some-kind-of-consequences-quot

[kcchiefs6465]

Literally, everything they do there is no accountability.

At most [and usually not] there is a façade of accountability and a half-assed apology some half-century later.

Tuskegee, forced sterilizations, unknowing human experimentation.

Some 50-100 years later they'll say, "My bad. Sorry I injected your eyeball with syphilis and withheld the cure. Your brain only consumed itself." Only someone propagandized or naïve cannot see this. You want proof? look at the impeachment numbers or trials for war crimes. Indiscriminate munitions poisoning everything, birth defect rates higher than Hiroshima. All on a criminal fluke of supposed WMDs and Iraqi 9/11 involvement. Hundreds of thousands dead, billions swindled from the people on food alone. And these cocksuckers joke about it. Or joke about droning children. There isn't even an aura of accountability. They laugh their asses off at the notion.

Here's some proof.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f_tFKa2_YBQ


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52JVljZW_cw

[Christian Liberty]

Those men make Ted Bundy look like a saint...

[better-dead-than-fed]

... for at least two decades no [FBI] agent has been disciplined for any instance of deliberately shooting someone....

--> http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?418601-The-F-B-I-Deemed-Agents-Faultless-in-150-Shootings

This thread could get very long.

[better-dead-than-fed]

The last time government employees were held accountable was 1776.

[kcchiefs6465]

And another point I'd like to make with regards to the videos I posted, these are no doubt known about in the Arab world. That our president so candidly jokes about their horror and tragedy no doubt incites many to hate us.

So not only are they grossly incompetent, never accountable, and sickeningly candid about death and misery, they are making us less safe in the process. And trust and believe if one of the Arabs attacks us the people will be up in arms again ready to be pointed to Iran or Somalia or some other country they've had their eye on for a while now. More wealth wasted through illegal transfers and political contracts, more children sent abroad fighting an enemy that either doesn't exist or perhaps one who was incited into attacking us, and countless more civilians being killed overseas. Not to mention the irradiation of the planet. These assholes keep on their arrogant, ignorant ways and they're liable to sterilize humanity.

[Cleaner44]

Madoff Chasers Dug for Years, to No Avail
Regulators Probed at Least 8 Times Over 16 Years; Congress Starts Review of SEC Today
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB123111743915052731.html?mod=googlenews_wsj

How many SEC agents were held accountable?


Eight SEC employees disciplined over failures in Madoff fraud case; none are fired
http://articles.washingtonpost.com/2011-11-11/business/35284161_1_madoff-matter-sec-employees-madoff-fraud-case

Do I win?

[jkr]

waco

[better-dead-than-fed]

waco


The last time government employees were held accountable was 1776 April 19, 1995...

[enhanced_deficit]

Yeah, we all know they don't, but I'm in a conversation with someone on another forum and need specific examples.

Post examples of where government has failed to hold its own agents accountable for the actions they have committed. The more blatant the better. +rep for anyone who posts a good link.


Many examples.
Recently controvercial Obama had called for immediate release of "our diplomat" who was accused of murdering some people tailing him in a poor brown country.
Next day State dept admitted that he was actually a CIA contractor. His release was purchased with some money and he was never tried for murder.

Plant has killed American citizens and their teenager children without trying them in a court of law, planted agent has not been held accountable so far.

Need more examples?

[kpitcher]

The Ruby Ridge Sniper wiki page has an interesting tidbit :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lon_Horiuchi


In 1997, Boundary County, Idaho Prosecutor Denise Woodbury, with the help of special prosecutor Stephen Yagman, charged Horiuchi in state court with involuntary manslaughter over his killing of Vicki Weaver. The U.S. Attorney filed a notice of removal of the case to federal court, which automatically took effect under the statute for removal jurisdiction[11] where the case was dismissed by U.S. District Judge Edward Lodge on May 14, 1998, who cited the supremacy clause of the Constitution which grants immunity to federal officers acting in the scope of their employment

There you have it - the rule that says if you're a federal officer just doing your job you can't get in trouble, even if you're really bad at your job.