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View Full Version : Cops freak out over Holder's latest policy decision




osan
08-31-2013, 08:32 AM
You know the end of days is near when I refer to an article from the Huffington Post.

But not to worry, there is actually nothing at all to see here, so please move on before we taze you to death. And be doubly sure to ignore the bold, italicized text in red, as well as the man behind the curtain.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/08/30/police-eric-holder-marijuana-_n_3846518.html#slide=1764741

WASHINGTON -- A broad coalition of law enforcement officers who have spent the past three decades waging an increasingly militarized drug war that has failed to reduce drug use doesn't want to give up the fight. Organizations that include sheriffs, narcotics officers and big-city police chiefs slammed Attorney General Eric Holder in a joint letter (https://www.theiacp.org/portals/0/pdfs/FINALLawEnforcementGroupLetteronDOJMarijuanaPolicy .pdf)Friday, expressing "extreme disappointment" at his announcement that the Department of Justice would allow Colorado and Washington to implement state laws that legalized recreational marijuana for adults.

If there had been doubt about how meaningful Holder's move was, the fury reflected in the police response eliminates it. The role of law enforcement is traditionally understood to be limited to enforcing laws, but police organizations have become increasingly powerful political actors, and lashed out at Holder for not consulting sufficiently before adopting the new policy.

"It is unacceptable that the Department of Justice did not consult our organizations -- whose members will be directly impacted -- for meaningful input ahead of this important decision," the letter reads. "Our organizations were given notice just thirty minutes before the official announcement was made public and were not given the adequate forum ahead of time to express our concerns with the Department’s conclusion on this matter. Simply 'checking the box' by alerting law enforcement officials right before a decision is announced is not enough and certainly does not show an understanding of the value the Federal, state, local and tribal law enforcement partnerships bring to the Department of Justice and the public safety discussion."

The missive was signed by the Major County Sheriffs’ Association, the National Sheriffs’ Association, the Association of State Criminal Investigative Agencies, the International Association of Chiefs of Police, the National Narcotic Officers Associations’ Coalition, the Major Cities Chiefs Police Association and the Police Executive Research Forum. Law enforcement, the police groups said, "becomes infinitely harder for our front-line men and women given the Department’s position."

The Justice Department declined to respond.

Local law enforcement agencies rely heavily on the drug war for funding. Police departments are often able to keep a large portion of the assets they seize during drug raids, even if charges are never brought. And federal grants for drug war operations make up a sizable portion (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tag/police-militarization) of local law enforcement funding.

The letter warns that marijuana can cause suicidal thoughts, impairs driving and is a "gateway drug." The missive does not, however, address the failure of law enforcement generally to reduce drug use, even while tripling the number of people behind bars. Instead, the police warn that liberalizing pot laws will lead to an increase in crime.

"The decision will undoubtedly have grave unintended consequences, including a reversal of the declining crime rates that we as law enforcement practitioners have spent more than a decade maintaining," the officers write.

Worse, they warn, more states are likely to follow Washington and Colorado.

"The failure of the Department of Justice to challenge state policies that clearly contradict Federal law is both unacceptable and unprecedented. The failure of the Federal government to act in this matter is an open invitation to other states to legalize marijuana in defiance of federal law," they write.

tod evans
08-31-2013, 08:34 AM
I'm surprised:rolleyes:

torchbearer
08-31-2013, 08:34 AM
Told you, local police are really under the control of the federal government via federal dollars.
they are a domestic army that cannot keeps its war equipment supplied without more supply/money from D.C.
your local council has no control over these freaks anymore.

LibertyEagle
08-31-2013, 08:39 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

torchbearer
08-31-2013, 08:41 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

looks like monetary extortion, in the same vain of threatening to take away food money to schools because the school won't obey federal guidelines.

speciallyblend
08-31-2013, 08:51 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

more REEFER MADNESS from LE???? who would of thought! surprised you have fallin for the reefer madness lies with your statement shows reefer madness worked on you. Your statement reeks of reefer madness.

Thor
08-31-2013, 08:56 AM
DC finally did something right... But they had no choice unless they wanted to go to war with Colorado and Washington.

Folks, the show is about to start....

belian78
08-31-2013, 09:02 AM
more REEFER MADNESS from LE???? who would of thought! surprised you have fallin for the reefer madness lies with your statement shows reefer madness worked on you. Your statement reeks of reefer madness.
WTF you talkin bout Willis? Just because she's not posing pics of herself smokin a hooka doesn't mean that she's tryin to demonize pot. For fucks sake man, all she was pointing out was that this all could be used to placate a large portion of the base he's risking losing from starting another war. Maybe you need to take a puff and chill?

JK/SEA
08-31-2013, 09:02 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

you don't think thats a collectivist statement?...

stoned base?....really....lol...

pcosmar
08-31-2013, 09:15 AM
you don't think thats a collectivist statement?...

stoned base?....really....lol...

Stoned base? 20 states have at least started to legalize marijuana,, with more on the way,, This failure of policy(war on drugs) costs billions,, and the government is about to shut down again due (debt ceiling) to lack of finances,, while starting yet another war.

There are no funds to continue this madness. Police Departments nationwide need to be Cut,, Drastically..
The Tax Hogs do not want that.. it ain't about the "stoners".

Thor
08-31-2013, 09:21 AM
There are no funds to continue this madness. Police Departments nationwide need to be Cut,, Drastically..
The Tax Hogs do not want that.. it ain't about the "stoners".

It is like taking a toy away from a kid.... They scream and pitch a fit and go into tantrum mode.

I need a Bearcat! I want a Bearcat. Give me my Bearcat!!!!!

Neil Desmond
08-31-2013, 09:22 AM
Seems like all these law enforcement associations, coalitions, and forums are forgetting the 10th amendment to the Constitution:


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

tod evans
08-31-2013, 09:23 AM
It is like taking a toy away from a kid.... They scream and pitch a fit and go into tantrum mode.

I need a Bearcat! I want a Bearcat. Give me my Bearcat!!!!!

Problem is these "kids" are equipped with MP-5's and M-16's...

But..................They're cowards by nature.

Working Poor
08-31-2013, 09:27 AM
Maybe he's taking money from the war on drugs so he can start a war with Syria. I've been wondering when RPF what's going to make some kind of mention of this.

kcchiefs6465
08-31-2013, 09:32 AM
Seems like all these law enforcement associations, coalitions, and forums are forgetting the 10th amendment to the Constitution:


The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.
I doubt the founders, at least most, ever thought the government has the authority to prohibit what one puts into their body. Most probably couldn't have imagined a time where items be prohibited from consumption.

State or Federal.

The right to eat, drink, smoke, inject, or do what you wish to your body is reserved to the People, respectively. It is a natural right superseding any piece of paper or government decree. States' "rights" are a good way to get republicans to hear the argument but at the end of the day it is a flawed argument.

tod evans
08-31-2013, 09:35 AM
I doubt the founders, at least most, ever thought the government has the authority to prohibit what one puts into their body. Most probably couldn't have imagined a time where items be prohibited from consumption.

State or Federal.

The right to eat, drink, smoke, inject, or do what you wish to your body is reserved to the People, respectively. It is a natural right superseding any piece of paper or government decree. States' "rights" are a good way to get republicans to hear the argument but at the end of the day it is a flawed argument.

You forgot "grow".....

Can't you imagine the Founders opinions on federal regulations for flowers(poppies)/weed/tobacco/ephedra...

[edit] I forgot bushes (coca)

kcchiefs6465
08-31-2013, 09:42 AM
You forgot "grow".....

Can't you imagine the Founders opinions on federal regulations for flowers(poppies)/weed/tobacco/ephedra...
To think that hemp is illegal to grow in the place where the Declaration of Independence was written, and was written on, is pretty damn amazing.

I wonder what Thomas Jefferson would have had to say if hemp production was attempted to be made illegal by a State instead of Federally. No doubt he'd be just as opposed either way. And the Constitution is founded on Natural Law.


The enumeration in the Constitution, of certain rights, shall not be construed to deny or disparage others retained by the people.

States are as illegitimate in disregarding Natural Law as the federal government is.

erowe1
08-31-2013, 10:25 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

It is kind of strange. Making a 180 degree turn-around from their policy of the past 5 years, and just acting matter-of-fact about it. You have to wonder what the purpose of the announcement is and how seriously to take it.

Theocrat
08-31-2013, 10:35 AM
Told you, local police are really under the control of the federal government via federal dollars.
they are a domestic army that cannot keeps its war equipment supplied without more supply/money from D.C.
your local council has no control over these freaks anymore.

That's a good point, and it's even more of a reason why individuals should be running for local and state offices to fight against federal encroachments on their respective homes, neighborhoods, and counties.

better-dead-than-fed
08-31-2013, 11:58 AM
You forgot "grow".....

and "sell".

What would the GOP and Rand do?

FSP-Rebel
08-31-2013, 01:18 PM
Cry me a river, bitches. And, that's coming from someone who generally is supportive of police. With that said, their input is not needed in this situation and they should just do their freaking jobs and leave it at that. In some people, I suppose cannabis does impair driving but it should be reckless driving in general that is the main culprit on the roads. Then they go off and really show their retardary by saying cannabis makes people suicidal.:rolleyes: really?

FSP-Rebel
08-31-2013, 01:22 PM
and "sell".

What would the GOP and Rand do here?

Rand would probably not say shit as he's already expended plenty of political capital forcing the president's hand on Syria. If one thinks that Rand is going to say growing and selling cannabis is wonderful then don't hold their breath for too long.

better-dead-than-fed
08-31-2013, 01:33 PM
If one thinks that Rand is going to say growing and selling cannabis is wonderful then don't hold their breath for too long.

I would not expect him to say it is a wonderful thing; but does he want to fine/imprison people for selling/buying drugs, and tax people to fund the operation? I am trying to understand this "movement"'s position.

kcchiefs6465
08-31-2013, 01:40 PM
Rand would probably not say shit as he's already expended plenty of political capital forcing the president's hand on Syria. If one thinks that Rand is going to say growing and selling cannabis is wonderful then don't hold their breath for too long.
He doesn't have to say anything about the merits of growing marijuana, or about selling, or ingesting drugs.

Simply acknowledging that Man is born with Natural Rights inherent to their being would be fine.

I understand he takes the states' rights argument to make it kosher for republicans but I like to believe he understands that this issue is greater than that. It is an issue of whether or not you truly own your body and destiny, or whether you are subservient to government whims and decrees.

The government usurping illegitimate authority on this issue grants bad precedent. What next? Large sodas? Check. Salt? Check. Trans fats? Check. Raw milk? Check. It would be just as absurd [and illegitimate] for the government to ban one from eating vegetables as it is for them to ban growing what you wish, and ingesting what you wish. The bastardized commerce clause aside, you also have the right to offer your services to anyone who is willing to [trade] pay for them.

There is a way to present this that is not damaging. That is, the government doesn't own you, what you do, and who you do it with. You are a person who was born with the ability to think for themselves. Who could not understand that?

speciallyblend
09-01-2013, 12:41 AM
WTF you talkin bout Willis? Just because she's not posing pics of herself smokin a hooka doesn't mean that she's tryin to demonize pot. For fucks sake man, all she was pointing out was that this all could be used to placate a large portion of the base he's risking losing from starting another war. Maybe you need to take a puff and chill?


simply put her statement implies reefer madness mindset just in the way she implies, just by using the words stoned base. that stoned base changed the colorado constitution 2 times, love to hear about how le's base changed the state constitution in her state 2 times;) her statement itself is reefer madness. What are you smoking willis to let her stoned base comment slide it is BS!! Her unstoned base seems useless.

speciallyblend
09-01-2013, 12:45 AM
you don't think thats a collectivist statement?...

stoned base?....really....lol...

either belian is choosing to ignore what le actually said ,but i would like belian to reply to your statement. Which is basically what i was saying and since jk/sea understood exactly what i was saying. I have to ask why belian does not?

speciallyblend
09-01-2013, 12:54 AM
Rand would probably not say shit as he's already expended plenty of political capital forcing the president's hand on Syria. If one thinks that Rand is going to say growing and selling cannabis is wonderful then don't hold their breath for too long.

i hear ya and understand, but now rand will have to talk more then just about mandatory min and he will have to be pro marijuana and say it if he wants to win colorado. He will have to expose the dems on this or the gop will lose the vote in colorado based on gop perception of being pro-drug war. Since obama and the dnc are jumping on the ending mandatory min bandwagon. He will have to epose the failed drug war and favor common sense and stop calling marijuana dangerous which it is not. If he cannot expose truth about marijuana. Then the majority "stoner base" will hand the gop a loss in colorado just based on perception if he does not counter romney bs from last election the gop will lose the majority voter base he needs towin colorado. If he thinks fence sitting will win him colorado. Then he will lose colorado before it begins. wanna bet? I will, i have worked with this voter base now for almost 15 years, If Rand Paul does not counter the bs romney arguments in colorado by romney in 2012. Then the gop will lose colorado and the election BET ON IT! ignore the warnings and the gop will lose colorado before the election begins like they did in 2008/2012!
.
Rand better find some new talking points on the failed drug war and legal marijuana personal and medical very soon. I want to be a delegate but have no interest in being one yet from rands pandering.

If Rand wants to throw away my 9 years of activism and gop delegate work in the gop . He can be my guest and do it.

Don't hold your breath if you think rand will win colorado with his pandering to the right for the drug war and trying to ride the fence on personal and medical marijuana. The voters in colorado will not buy his pandering on these huge issues for the huge majority voter block over generations now built in colorado. They are like ron paulers they are not buying the gop est talking points.

The gun issue might save him in colorado over his drug war pandering but i doubt it.

58% nationally support legal marijuana personal and medical and a solid majority voter base in colorado support it. take what i say for granted and you ignore a solid voter base that shows up unlike the anti marijuana/video gamers who must "smoke pot" and stay home now;) anti-stoners are the new reefer madness stoners:) they don't vote and are too busy eating cheetos to vote;) WE VOTE!!

Scrapmo
09-01-2013, 03:45 AM
I get the same reaction from my 5-year old niece if I take her toys away. Alot of pouting and gentle sobbing.

Guess these good ol' boys will have to get their kicks some other way now.

GregSarnowski
09-01-2013, 04:00 AM
I'm wondering about the timing of Holder's announcement. Is it to placate his stoned base while Obama proceeds to bomb Syria?

Realistically they had no choice in the matter Maybe the feds actually think the pages and pages of regulations CO legislatures drafted up will work.

I read an article the other day about some politician in Colorado complaining how everyone is just buying tax-free "medical marijuana" instead, because it's so easy to get the cards and no doubt the taxes are onerous. I had to laugh..there goes their dreams of getting rich off cannabis smokers.

Working Poor
09-01-2013, 06:24 AM
For those you who are wondering what Rand thinks about this here is an opinion piece he wrote that covers this subject:

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/aug/30/paul-extending-the-reach-of-kings-dream/

Origanalist
09-01-2013, 06:28 AM
DC finally did something right... But they had no choice unless they wanted to go to war with Colorado and Washington.

Folks, the show is about to start....

I wish.

otherone
09-01-2013, 06:49 AM
"It is unacceptable that the Department of Justice did not consult our organizations -- whose members will be directly impacted --"

http://cdn.c.photoshelter.com/img-get/I0000.A_boQzjAhI/s/900/900/Pigs-Berkshires-LB0706-8431.jpg

thoughtomator
09-01-2013, 06:53 AM
If you see Eric Holder do something lawful, your antennae ought to go up in red alert status. Something's up.

tod evans
09-01-2013, 06:56 AM
Local law enforcement agencies rely heavily on the drug war for funding. Police departments are often able to keep a large portion of the assets they seize during drug raids, even if charges are never brought. And federal grants for drug war operations make up a sizable portion (http://www.huffingtonpost.com/tag/police-militarization) of local law enforcement funding.



This appears to be the primary thrust of osans post..

And to me a far more relevant topic than who said what or which senator might take what position..

There is an armed gang out there and if you live in Co. or Wa., or any number of states with pro-weed laws, these guys are gunning for you with the stated purpose of lining their own pockets...

evilfunnystuff
09-01-2013, 07:15 AM
There is an armed gang out there and if you live in Co. or Wa., or any number of states with pro-weed laws, these guys are gunning for you with the stated purpose of lining their own pockets...

Same as it ever was, except the freedom side is starting to dominate the public debate.

I remember when these guys would just say "Hey, we are just doin our job, just go change the laws.", significant progress has been made.

While I'm happy about holders statement, I do have to wonder what his other hand is doing.

Pericles
09-01-2013, 10:19 AM
It is kind of strange. Making a 180 degree turn-around from their policy of the past 5 years, and just acting matter-of-fact about it. You have to wonder what the purpose of the announcement is and how seriously to take it.

Change of focus, but not the amount of resources or tactics, which are well established.

Instead of drugs, we are now going to get (choose one or more) (A) guns (B) anti-government tea party terrorists (C) pedophiles (D) other off the streets.

osan
09-01-2013, 11:16 AM
For those you who are wondering what Rand thinks about this here is an opinion piece he wrote that covers this subject:

http://m.washingtontimes.com/news/2013/aug/30/paul-extending-the-reach-of-kings-dream/

Cannot say I much cared for this article. I do not like it that Rand Paul panders so transparently - it disgusts me and shows how very unlike his father he really is. He may be significantly better than most others of the ilk but he does not yet rise to my standard. This smooching of the long deceased butt of Michael King sickens me largely because people do not know the truth about him and do not want to. But nobody twisted Rand Paul's arm, to my knowledge, and therefore this episode of revoltingly obsequious writing gives me particular pause to stick my head in the toilet and begin the dry heaves.


While drugs continue to harm our society...
This is but a mere example of the sort of ignorant tripe he spews. He may be innocently using terms in the commonly flawed manner, but IMO he should be more aware of the power of language and be more keen on its proper use. He presumes to be an example to the rest of the nation, so let him be a proper one beginning with taking the time to write properly.


aspects of the federal war on drugs continue to unfairly target the black community.

Boo-hiss. What a steaming pile of meaningless bullshit of a statement. If such aspects exist, list them - let us see him support his assertion with facts if they are true. As written, the statement stands appearing as a naked attempt to gain the support of black voters via the usual language of "it's not your fault - I understand and I will do everything I can to make sure you are never called to account for your actions and are given all manner of free stuff".


There is no excuse for drug abuse

The implied presupposition here being that it requires one. Rand Paul squeaks and squawks about a lot of meaningless shit, but I do not read too much by him stressing liberty.
I want to see less drug use. I also want to see equal justice. I want to see fewer nonviolent criminals incarcerated.

No talk of wanting to see human freedom brought to its fullest bloom, which would necessitate tolerating the possible blossoming of rampant drug abuse.

So noted.


Martin Luther King Jr. had a dream

Actually, it appears he may not have. The speech in question, as I recall, was written by a little cockroach named Levin or Levine, a self-proclaimed communist. He was the "brains" behind the Michael King phenomenon.



, and we’ve unquestionably made great strides toward equality. However, we still have injustices that must be addressed.

Once again the statement is made in the context of his fawning over the great Michael King and not in the interests of universal freedom.

Feh - you can keep this cupcake; it is so very stale. I remain willing to be persuaded, but thus far see no basis.

surf
09-01-2013, 11:37 AM
take this for what it's worth, but cops here in Stonerville (aka Seattle, Washington - home of the Huskies and Sounders) appear to be quite pleased to not have to enforce marijuana prohibition here....

it's 4:20 somewhere :cool:

devil21
09-01-2013, 03:14 PM
Awwww....cop's oldest method to search vehicles and houses goes up in smoke with the legalization of cannabis.

COP: "I smell weed."
DRIVER: "So?"
COP: "Have a nice day."
----------
COP: "I see weed in plain sight on your coffee table."
HOMEOWNER: "So?"
COP: "Have a nice day."

The old "I see/smell weed" thing has led to so many searches that otherwise wouldn't have been done. Also gotta retrain all the drug dogs since smelling weed isn't a "hit" anymore in legal states. I know their funding has a lot to do with their motivations against legalization but the upheaval to their ingrained procedures (status quo operations) is probably just as big a concern. They have to relearn policing.

Anti Federalist
09-01-2013, 04:44 PM
Standing army or oppression.

Can't be more clear.

Mani
09-01-2013, 07:07 PM
Same as it ever was, except the freedom side is starting to dominate the public debate.

I remember when these guys would just say "Hey, we are just doin our job, just go change the laws.", significant progress has been made.

While I'm happy about holders statement, I do have to wonder what his other hand is doing.

Exactly....they used to say.....aww shucks mundane.....Im just doing my job...I don't make the laws...


So why are you crying now that the law is changed???


Because the #1 way to fuck with people...

This mundane is giving me attitude.....hey...I smell marijuana in your car....cavity search time bitches!!!

better-dead-than-fed
09-02-2013, 04:19 PM
Rand would probably not say shit as he's already expended plenty of political capital forcing the president's hand on Syria. If one thinks that Rand is going to say growing and selling cannabis is wonderful then don't hold their breath for too long.

What about an investigation into why the administration is keeping marijuana on Schedule 1 despite the scientific evidence? Couldn't he support such an investigation without posting photos of bongs, saying pot is wonderful, or "advocating everyone... smoking pot" (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?425584-Hypocrisy-on-Sanctions-from-RPF/page2&p=5199165#post5199165)?

osan
09-02-2013, 05:52 PM
What about an investigation into why the administration is keeping marijuana on Schedule 1 despite the scientific evidence? Couldn't he support such an investigation without posting photos of bongs, saying pot is wonderful, or "advocating everyone... smoking pot" (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?425584-Hypocrisy-on-Sanctions-from-RPF/page2&p=5199165#post5199165)?

Well put - we don't need no steenkeeng false dichotomies.