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View Full Version : U.K.: Police refuse to return stolen RV because of "human rights" of recipients living in




GregSarnowski
08-12-2013, 08:46 AM
Just when you think life in the U.K. couldn't be anymore absurd. Are we suppose to believe this family didn't know they were receiving stolen goods when they supposedly bought it from a guy in a bar for literally 1% of its true cost? And how poor can they be if they can afford to travel all over the country with it. It's one thing spending taxpayer money to give million dollar homes to illegal immigrants, which happens over there, but now apparently the poor are allowed to get away with stealing directly from people too. What a precedent! This makes me not even want to ever visit for fear that I'd get beat up and mugged and the police would take the mugger's side.

And the kicker is the victims are still paying every month for it!


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2381292/Police-wont-hand-stolen-caravan-couple-protect-human-rights-travellers-living-it.html

Police won't hand stolen caravan back to couple to protect human rights of the travellers living in it

Kathleen McLelland and Michael Curry had their caravan stolen in 2011

They were delighted when it was found by police 18 months later

But officers are unable to move a traveller family now living there

A letter sent to the couple says the police have 'no lawful powers'

A couple whose £30,000 caravan was stolen have been told a traveller family now living in it cannot be removed because it would breach their human rights.

Kathleen McClelland and her partner Michael Curry spent their life savings on the top-of-the-range camper and were devastated when it vanished from the secure site where they kept it.

When police eventually found the 26ft-long Bailey Louisiana caravan 18 months later, its owners were told a traveller couple and their two young children were living in it only ten miles from their home in Surrey.

Their initial relief turned to outrage, however, when the police said they had ‘no lawful powers’ to get it back.

They were told their only option was to begin costly civil proceedings against the family, which they say they cannot afford.

Mrs McClelland and Mr Curry had spent £10,000 improving the £20,000 caravan, including putting in a widescreen TV. They bought the vehicle on hire purchase – and still have to make monthly payments of £250 for the next two years.

Hospital ward clerk Mrs McClelland, 68, said: ‘Why should we have to pay for someone else to live in our brand new caravan? That was for our pleasure in our older years.

‘The police said that removing the family would breach their human rights and that they would have to be rehoused before it could be seized. We spent all our retirement money on that caravan because we thought it would last us a lifetime. We’re absolutely devastated. It seems as though no one cares about our human rights.

[snip]

Mr Curry said: ‘Apparently they had a receipt for it and had paid a guy £300 in a pub for it.

They had no proof apart from a handwritten note on a scrap of paper, while we had everything proving it was ours. If they wanted a caravan, why not save up for it like we did?

presence
08-12-2013, 09:11 AM
http://www.law.cornell.edu/supremecourt/text/4/170


An actual settler, without warrant, is so highly regarded,
that although the law would deem him a trespasser, on general principles,
the act prohibits any deputy surveyor from surveying any settled land, but for the owner of the settlement.

- Tench Coxe 1792




It has been said that “squatter's rights (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Squatter%27s_rights)” and “possession is 9/10ths of the law” were largely responsible for how the American west (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_west) was really won.



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law


(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law)
"conclude that even though the property was originally stolen, that if the victim or his heirs cannot be found, and if the current possessor was not the actual criminal who stole the property, then title to that property belongs properly, justly, and ethically to its current possessor."[18] (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law#cite_note-18)
(https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Possession_is_nine-tenths_of_the_law)

- Murray Rothbard










Interesting legal case. I'm not versed in UK common law enough to make a clear determination of where this will head.

Red Green
08-12-2013, 09:25 AM
Seems to me the solution is clear: steal it back. Yeah, the retired couple may not be up to the task, but hire a couple of bruisers who don't particularly like Roma taking over their country and they could probably get their RV back for a couple hundred pounds and a case of beer.

GregSarnowski
08-12-2013, 09:26 AM
Interesting legal case. I'm not versed in UK common law enough to make a clear determination of where this will head.

It apparently won't be heard unless the victims sue them in civil court, which they can't afford to do.

I don't really think homesteading laws in the frontier days and people spending their life's savings on an RV just to have it stolen out from under them with no legal recourse are really comparable issues.

The Rothbard quote doesn't apply. The victims are known, and they want their property back, in fact due to the monthly payments they are continually being hurt by this incident.

69360
08-12-2013, 09:47 AM
Seems to me the solution is clear: steal it back. Yeah, the retired couple may not be up to the task, but hire a couple of bruisers who don't particularly like Roma taking over their country and they could probably get their RV back for a couple hundred pounds and a case of beer.

Not Roma, Irish travelers. But yeah, that is what they should do.

asurfaholic
08-12-2013, 10:01 AM
I say go with Red Green's idea...

angelatc
08-12-2013, 10:24 AM
I like the "Steal it back" idea, but the police won't tell them where it is.

mad cow
08-12-2013, 10:28 AM
Fookin' Pikies!

presence
08-12-2013, 10:34 AM
Seems to me the solution is clear: steal it back. Yeah, the retired couple may not be up to the task, but hire a couple of bruisers who don't particularly like Roma taking over their country and they could probably get their RV back for a couple hundred pounds and a case of beer.

I had a creaton steal my wife's bicycle at one point. I saw him on it when I was driving by; he pulled into a gas station / convenience store and went inside. I looked at the bike and it had house paint in the distinctive color of my home splattered on it where we had spilled a can the previous year. It was mine. I waited until he came out, I told him "Nice bike, I appreciate you giving it to me." I picked it up and put it in the back of my truck with my left hand, flared my nostrils, got back in my rig and drove away. Someone stole it from my shed, again, a few weeks later. I never saw the initial thief or the bike after that. I let it go, I'd rather look back and say I bribed the devil, than called the cops.

Occam's Banana
08-12-2013, 10:36 AM
A letter sent to the couple says the police have 'no lawful powers'

Seems to me the solution is clear: steal it back.

Anyone care to bet that if the original owners did "steal it back" the police would not suddenly discover that they actually do have "lawful powers" after all?

Nah, didn't think so ...

TruckinMike
08-12-2013, 10:39 AM
Let me guess--> the victims were lover of individualism and abhorred the concept of collective rights. Right? Hardly... I'm guessing that they are now reaping what they sowed.:cool:

GregSarnowski
08-12-2013, 10:47 AM
Let me guess--> the victims were lover of individualism and abhorred the concept of collective rights. Right? Hardly... I'm guessing that they are now reaping what they sowed.:cool:

Wow what a stupid assumption based on nothing. Would it be "cool" if the government dropped a drone on your head? After all you live in America therefore you must support the military!

TruckinMike
08-12-2013, 12:55 PM
Wow what a stupid assumption based on nothing. Would it be "cool" if the government dropped a drone on your head? After all you live in America therefore you must support the military!

Do you care to make a wager on the issue? I'll bet $20 that they are in fact supporters of collective theft(at the barrel of a gun) and redistribution so commonly found in the UK.

I will bet you another $20 that if you walk up to the average TV watching person in America that they would in fact whole heartily support the US military's action around the world --- including the bombing of brown people with drones(and with full acceptance of the current collateral damage statistics).

and I will also bet you $500 that the average Sean Hannity listener is in full agreement with the above as well. ( but that's too easy, no one would take that bet!:))

Loser pays to the new Ron Paul Channel.

Red Green
08-12-2013, 01:01 PM
Anyone care to bet that if the original owners did "steal it back" the police would not suddenly discover that they actually do have "lawful powers" after all?

Nah, didn't think so ...

Yeah, the fact is that the poor Irish Travelers didn't really have anything worth confiscating but the elderly owners of the RV do, so yeah the pigs would become keenly interested in pursuing them for theft of their own property.