Jesse Benton: I didn't mean it, was only trying to appease "hardcore Ron Paul supporter"

[ObiRandKenobi]

Benton confirms conversations with Mitch McConnell following the leak have been totally awkward...

"He wasn't angry. He wasn't upset. But I could see the hurt in his eyes."


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8rmxSupufsQ


h/t MP (http://www.mofopolitics.com/2013/08/10/jesse-benton-anti-mitch-mcconnell-remarks-were-only-to-appease-a-hardcore-ron-paul-supporter/)

[Christian Liberty]

Screw Benton. He should have owned up to telling the truth. Mitch McConnell absolutely sucks. Rand Paul is being stupid to support him as is Benton. The only difference is that Rand has a valid political excuse while Benton doesn't.

How quickly Benton forgot Mitch's votes on Iraq, the Patriot Act, exc.

Steve Deace had it right. "Ditch McConnell."

[puppetmaster]

What a tool

[fearthereaperx]

What a dufus...honestly though, what he said wasn't really that bad when put into context. I am just wondering who's this hardcore ron paul supporter that seems like he's being paid off by some opposition.

[Aratus]

even if one cautiously interpreted the holding the nose for two years to be a dig at
the obama administration, reporters are reporters, they can go back on their word...

[Keith and stuff]

Screw Benton. He should have owned up to telling the truth. Mitch McConnell absolutely sucks. Rand Paul is being stupid to support him as is Benton. The only difference is that Rand has a valid political excuse while Benton doesn't.

How quickly Benton forgot Mitch's votes on Iraq, the Patriot Act, exc.

Steve Deace had it right. "Ditch McConnell."

Thank goodness some around here knows about smart and successful politics. You should talk to Matt :) Or maybe not ;)

[enhanced_deficit]

They have patched things up.

http://i.huffpost.com/gen/1289666/original.jpg (http://www.google.com/url?sa=i&rct=j&q=mitch%20mcconnell%20benton%20nose&source=images&cd=&cad=rja&docid=DkURrGW-z4K01M&tbnid=sC2mdnGLbCIK8M:&ved=0CAUQjRw&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.huffingtonpost.com%2F2013%2F0 8%2F08%2Fmitch-mcconnell-jesse-benton_n_3728320.html&ei=aDsHUrb0G7OEygHnpYHIDw&bvm=bv.50500085,d.b2I&psig=AFQjCNF_xltid_Q7NNi3QtWitdOfTgnK4A&ust=1376292045967903)

[bolil]

The greed seems strong with this one though I'd need to shake his hand to be sure

[brandon]

Mixed feelings on this one.


But as soon as I head "Allison Lundergan Grimes" I broke out into laughter. That "what rhymes" video really has an impact on me I guess lol. Seriously though what a pretentious name.

[devil21]

Benton looks like he's been eatin' real good lately. Get on the treadmill Jesse. You're getting fat.

[LibertyEagle]

All I have to say is that Fusaro is a snake in the grass.

[muh_roads]

Interesting. So Benton is one of us after all. He's playing Trojan horse like Rand is now I suspect.

[CPUd]

Mixed feelings on this one.


But as soon as I head "Allison Lundergan Grimes" I broke out into laughter. That "what rhymes" video really has an impact on me I guess lol. Seriously though what a pretentious name.

I used to, but now all I can think of when I see her name is this:

http://i.imgur.com/2cyF8id.jpg

What has been seen cannot be unseen...

[jjdoyle]

Again, the information he said in the video he offered up freely of his own accord, not because he was even asked about what he thought of Mitch. This is his own fault, for giving out TMI and trying to appease someone that had dirt on the campaign.

[LibertyEagle]

Again, the information he said in the video he offered up freely of his own accord, not because he was even asked about what he thought of Mitch. This is his own fault, for giving out TMI and trying to appease someone that had dirt on the campaign.

Yeah, it was his fault for trusting the little worm. He should have known better and hopefully in the future he will have learned his lesson and not trust anyone in this movement.

[eduardo89]

All I have to say is that Fusaro is a snake in the grass.

I agree.

[liberalnurse]

Yeah, it was his fault for trusting the little worm. He should have known better and hopefully in the future he will have learned his lesson and not trust anyone in this movement.

Trust us? He doesn't even like us.

[PaulConventionWV]

Screw Benton. He should have owned up to telling the truth. Mitch McConnell absolutely sucks. Rand Paul is being stupid to support him as is Benton. The only difference is that Rand has a valid political excuse while Benton doesn't.

How quickly Benton forgot Mitch's votes on Iraq, the Patriot Act, exc.

Steve Deace had it right. "Ditch McConnell."

It's etc, not exc. It's short for "etcetera".

[PatriotOne]

Yeah, it was his fault for trusting the little worm. He should have known better and hopefully in the future he will have learned his lesson and not trust anyone in this movement.

Exactly what I was thinking.

Benton's trying to play chess with a bunch of ignorant checker players in the audience watching and commenting on his every move. They just don't understand. In the meantime, the professional dividers are taking advantage of the ignorant checker players to turn them into their own useful idiots to divide the liberty movement. Luckily they are still a small minority in the Liberty Movement. They are irritating though.

[LibertyEagle]

Trust us? He doesn't even like us.

Who is "us"? I've spoken to him a couple of times and he was very courteous and quite helpful.

Note: That's not to say that I agree with a variety of things that he has done.

[PatriotOne]

Trust us? He doesn't even like us.

He likes me.

[compromise]

Trust us? He doesn't even like us.

I've met him too and he's a pretty cool guy IRL. Nothing like the forum conspiracies.

[PatriotOne]

Trust us? He doesn't even like us.

You are being one of the professional dividers "useful idiots" I was speaking of. You have unwittingly become an enemy of the Liberty Movement. Just stop it.

[liberalnurse]

Not true. I've been here since the beginning and have paid close attention. I've been clear on my position where Benton is concerned. "Useful idiot" Your even more insulting then he is. "Professional divider" You just stop it.

[PatriotOne]

Not true. I've been here since the beginning and have paid close attention.

Which is why you should know better than to spread useful idiot stupidity like "Trust us? He doesn't even like us.". The professional dividers are pleased with you spreading that untrue meme.....I'm not.

[Neil Desmond]

It's etc, not exc. It's short for "etcetera".


http://images.sodahead.com/polls/002265719/4359281973_i_concur_RE_Wikileaks_s500x351_111816_5 80_answer_3_xlarge.jpeg

[presence]

only trying to appease "hardcore Ron Paul supporter"


Did I ask for a binky?

http://s2.hubimg.com/u/4105665_f260.jpg


Can someone point me to the last 5 or 6 threads where we discussed positive things Benton has done for the liberty movement? I'm sure I could come up with a few dozen WTF?'s.

[jjdoyle]

Yeah, it was his fault for trusting the little worm. He should have known better and hopefully in the future he will have learned his lesson and not trust anyone in this movement.

It's not like the guy came to Jesse and said, "Alright, tell me why you're working for Sen. McConnell now?" The guy came to Jesse with an accusation about Ron Paul 2012 bribing somebody, and giving him a check or something. Jesse tried to calm the guy down and reassure him that Jesse was on "our side", by acting like he was only working for McConnell for other reasons and he doesn't really like McConnell.

Maybe this guy is upset because he donated to Ron Paul 2012 and saw funds being misused, and Jesse didn't do anything about it? Is there more to this than what we know, and will more be coming out?

The fact Jesse Benton trusted Mitt Romney's campaign enough to help them win the nomination, should give everyone pause before calling someone a "little worm". Ron Paul 2012 had serious issues, and if this guy donated to the campaign and is seeking answers and has them, maybe that means outing those that were the problem at the campaign, I don't know what's wrong with that.

If this perhaps keeps Jesse from working with Rand moving forward, would that be a bad thing? I don't think so, from what I know of many supporters who will not donate a dime if he is associated with it, because of the way Ron Paul 2012 was run.

[Cowlesy]

Any time I needed help from Jesse Benton whether a Ron or Rand Paul campaign, he's been the fastest response-time of any of the campaign people I've talked to, spare maybe one, and extremely helpful.

To state a really unpopular opinion, I'm starting to understand why he needs to be so guarded with information. There really are tons of snakes in the grass. This Fusaro guy isn't the only one. Lots of people says stuff off the cuff and in private from time to time that's an embellishment or appeasement of people. It's like laughing at someone's dumb joke. People want you to be all buddy-buddy with them since you're an enthusiastic supporter, but with thousands of people wanting to help, the ones who are willing to bury a knife in your back always seem to find their way up the information food-chain.

You hope that private emails you send back and forth are kept private, but then some ass publishes them. You hope your phone call with someone about a sensitive issue is private, but then some ass records and publishes it. I was going to make a joke about secretly recording a private conversation and then doing the same, but then I remembered this actually happened to Jesse/McConnell already this Spring.

I feel bad for the guy. Trust no one, Jesse.

[Smitty]

Vipers latched onto the Ron Paul campaign and used Ron's popularity for their own gain.

Ron was unprepared for the surge of popularity for his message and unprepared for the corruption that it would engender in members of his campaign staff.

Rand Paul undoubtedly now knows what transpired, yet he has kept Jesse Benton around and is now politically associated with establishment Congressman Mitch McConnell.

I'm not sure what Rand's original plan was when he threw his hat into the ring, but it seems that after a measure of political success, he has decided that he wants to stay in the game and is willing to play by its corrupt rules to do so.

There's no other possible reason for him to be connected to McConnell and Benton.

[MelissaCato]

Ron Paul should just run again for POTUS in 2016 !! Then all this is just noise !!! :D

[PatriotOne]

Rand Paul undoubtedly now knows what transpired, yet he has kept Jesse Benton around and is now politically associated with establishment Congressman Mitch McConnell.

I'm not sure what Rand's original plan was when he threw his hat into the ring, but it seems that after a measure of political success, he has decided that he wants to stay in the game and is willing to play by its corrupt rules to do so.

There's no other possible reason for him to be connected to McConnell and Benton.

http://i40.tinypic.com/33xhiz4.jpg

[Smitty]

PatriotOne,..

You're uninformed. The following explains why McConnell and Benton are connected to Rand.

http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/02/02/can-ron-paul-be-tamed/

Here's an excerpt, but please read the entire article.

"At [Sen. Mitch] McConnell’s request, the National Republican Senatorial Committee sent an adviser to Kentucky to watch over Rand Paul’s general-election campaign — ‘to be the grown-up in the room,’ according to one Washington Republican who spoke on the condition of anonymity to talk candidly.

"The adviser, Trygve Olson, developed a friendship with Rand Paul, and the two realized that they could teach each other a lot — to the benefit of both candidate and party. Olson showed Paul and his campaign establishment tactics: working with the news media, fine-tuning its message. And Paul showed Olson — and by extension, McConnell — how many people were drawn to the GOP by his message of fiscal responsibility…. And at Rand Paul’s suggestion, Olson joined his father’s presidential campaign this year, basically to do what he did for Rand: help bring the Paul constituency into the Republican coalition without threatening the party. It’s probably no small coincidence that the partnership helps Rand’s burgeoning political career, too."

[FrankRep]

Does anyone know who recorded that conversation?

[PatriotOne]

PatriotOne,..

You're uninformed. The following explains why McConnell and Benton are connected to Rand.

http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/02/02/can-ron-paul-be-tamed/

Here's an excerpt, but please read the entire article.

"At [Sen. Mitch] McConnell’s request, the National Republican Senatorial Committee sent an adviser to Kentucky to watch over Rand Paul’s general-election campaign — ‘to be the grown-up in the room,’ according to one Washington Republican who spoke on the condition of anonymity to talk candidly.

"The adviser, Trygve Olson, developed a friendship with Rand Paul, and the two realized that they could teach each other a lot — to the benefit of both candidate and party. Olson showed Paul and his campaign establishment tactics: working with the news media, fine-tuning its message. And Paul showed Olson — and by extension, McConnell — how many people were drawn to the GOP by his message of fiscal responsibility…. And at Rand Paul’s suggestion, Olson joined his father’s presidential campaign this year, basically to do what he did for Rand: help bring the Paul constituency into the Republican coalition without threatening the party. It’s probably no small coincidence that the partnership helps Rand’s burgeoning political career, too."

1. First of all I take articles that use an "unnamed source" with a grain of salt.

2. What does any of that have to do with Rand and Jesse becoming corrupt? It's called networking/wanting to have influence....not becoming corrupt.

[Smitty]

This guy,..Dennis Fusaro

Good read:

http://thebullelephant.com/fusaro-ron-paul/

An excerpt: (but click on the link and read it all)

Fusaro alleges these former close allies are complicit in a bribery scheme to entice Iowa State Senator Kent Sorenson to help Ron Paul’s 2012 presidential campaign in the Iowa caucuses. Fusaro has provided contemporaneous emails and recordings of phone calls to buttress his claims. Worse, to hear Fusaro tell it, the Iowa incident is merely a symptom of a larger problem within the cadre of senior managers and consultants surrounding the Paul campaign in 2012, and who appear likely to be closely involved in the Rand Paul campaign as it gears up for 2016.

“It was ‘Invasion of the Body Snatchers’ when they took over,” Fusaro says of the Virginia crew of Mike Rothfeld, John Tate, and Dimitri Kesari, who all took senior positions with the 2012 Paul campaign. The four of these men together go back a long way in conservative politics, at least to the early 1990s when they helped energize a revival of conservatives within the Virginia Republican Party. But, he says, things had changed, singling out Rothfeld in particular. Rothfeld, according to Fusaro, is “one of the best operatives ever,” but used the Ron Paul campaign “as a means to power and money,” while casting aside moral principles in a cutthroat approach to politics.

[Smitty]

1. First of all I take articles that use an "unnamed source" with a grain of salt.

2. What does any of that have to do with Rand and Jesse becoming corrupt? It's called networking/wanting to have influence....not becoming corrupt.

The liberty movement is being "networked" out of existence.

[Deborah K]

You are being one of the professional dividers "useful idiots" I was speaking of. You have unwittingly become an enemy of the Liberty Movement. Just stop it.

Knock it off!!! Just because someone has a differing opinion than yourself does not make them an enemy. What a crock!!

[PatriotOne]

Knock it off!!! Just because someone has a differing opinion than yourself does not make them an enemy. What a crock!!

This does. Trying to remember who started that meme. Oh yeah....now I remember.

"Trust us? He doesn't even like us.".

[Deborah K]

This does. Trying to remember who started that meme. Oh yeah....now I remember.

"Trust us? He doesn't even like us.".

So now an opinion makes a person an enemy of the movement. Talk about idiocy. :rolleyes:

[thoughtomator]

OK there's one thing I can take Benton at his word for - that he's a liar.

[FrankRep]

Who the hell is Dennis Fusaro and why is he trying to destroy any chances of getting Ron Paul-like people into the government.

[FrankRep]

OK there's one thing I can take Benton at his word for - that he's a liar.
Benton is also married to one of Ron Paul's granddaughters.

[torchbearer]

Any time I needed help from Jesse Benton whether a Ron or Rand Paul campaign, he's been the fastest response-time of any of the campaign people I've talked to, spare maybe one, and extremely helpful.

To state a really unpopular opinion, I'm starting to understand why he needs to be so guarded with information. There really are tons of snakes in the grass. This Fusaro guy isn't the only one. Lots of people says stuff off the cuff and in private from time to time that's an embellishment or appeasement of people. It's like laughing at someone's dumb joke. People want you to be all buddy-buddy with them since you're an enthusiastic supporter, but with thousands of people wanting to help, the ones who are willing to bury a knife in your back always seem to find their way up the information food-chain.

You hope that private emails you send back and forth are kept private, but then some ass publishes them. You hope your phone call with someone about a sensitive issue is private, but then some ass records and publishes it. I was going to make a joke about secretly recording a private conversation and then doing the same, but then I remembered this actually happened to Jesse/McConnell already this Spring.

I feel bad for the guy. Trust no one, Jesse.

Your opinion would be different if you had been walking beside me through louisiana's presidential process.
you'd see this as karma, not poor jesse.

[PatriotOne]

So now an opinion makes a person an enemy of the movement. Talk about idiocy. :rolleyes:

An opinion that divides a movement does. Karl Rove says thanks though.

http://i42.tinypic.com/ir11qa.jpg

[klamath]

Vipers latched onto the Ron Paul campaign and used Ron's popularity for their own gain.

Ron was unprepared for the surge of popularity for his message and unprepared for the corruption that it would engender in members of his campaign staff.

Rand Paul undoubtedly now knows what transpired, yet he has kept Jesse Benton around and is now politically associated with establishment Congressman Mitch McConnell.

I'm not sure what Rand's original plan was when he threw his hat into the ring, but it seems that after a measure of political success, he has decided that he wants to stay in the game and is willing to play by its corrupt rules to do so.

There's no other possible reason for him to be connected to McConnell and Benton.The integrity and ethics of the organization reflect the integrity and ethics of the LEADER, which is RON Paul.

[Deborah K]

An opinion that divides a movement does. Karl Rove says thanks though.

http://i42.tinypic.com/ir11qa.jpg

Since when is Benton the be-all end-all to this movement?? You're putting too much importance on his involvement. Having a negative opinion about him does not make a person a 'useful idiot' or an enemy to the movement. It's nonsense.

[angelatc]

All I have to say is that Fusaro is a snake in the grass.

All I have to say is that Benton is the snake in the grass.

[Deborah K]

Benton is also married to one of Ron Paul's granddaughters.

Yeah, which speaks to his coattail-riding-opportunistic reputation.....

[FrankRep]

Yeah, which speaks to his coattail-riding-opportunistic reputation.....
Or maybe not. Benton is in the Ron Paul family now.

[thoughtomator]

Benton is also married to one of Ron Paul's granddaughters.

Clearly then, being part of the Paul family is no immunization against being a corrupt, slimy snake.

[PatriotOne]

Since when is Benton the be-all end-all to this movement?? You're putting too much importance on his involvement. Having a negative opinion about him does not make a person a 'useful idiot' or an enemy to the movement. It's nonsense.

I think it's nonsense also. It's the professional dividers putting the emphasis on Benton to divide the Liberty Movement...not me. See all the news reports about it?

[Smitty]

PatriotOne,

Karl Rove supports Rand Paul.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/karl-rove-dismisses-tea-party-backlash-we-need-fewer-christine-odonnells-and-more-rand-pauls/

We believe in markets, Rove said, but further examination “means fewer Christine O’Donnells and more Rand Pauls.”

[PatriotOne]

Yeah, which speaks to his coattail-riding-opportunistic reputation.....

I guess one could accuse you of trying to ride the coattails of the movement also.

[donnay]

What this confession by Benton says to me is he speaks out of both sides of his mouth. Really nothing new. He shouldn't be a campaign manager he should just be a politician. The Liberty movement is a movement that wants truth and transparency not more of the same dirty politics.

[PatriotOne]

PatriotOne,

Karl Rove supports Rand Paul.

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/karl-rove-dismisses-tea-party-backlash-we-need-fewer-christine-odonnells-and-more-rand-pauls/

We believe in markets, Rove said, but further examination “means fewer Christine O’Donnells and more Rand Pauls.”

No words. I'm just laughing hysterically at the thought of Rove supporting Rand.

[Deborah K]

I think it's nonsense also. It's the professional dividers putting the emphasis on Benton to divide the Liberty Movement...not me. See all the news reports about it?

Since when is Liberal Nurse is a professional divider?

We are dividing ourselves, we don't even NEED "professional dividers" - if there is such a thing. We do it by making people with differing opinions into enemies, instead of focusing on the one thing that keeps us cohesive: our desire to be free. We, in the grassroots, don't HAVE to agree on every strategy used in order to achieve success, but too many people don't realize that. Too many people believe we all need to fall in lock-step on everything. Yeah, that works. smh.

[Deborah K]

I guess one could accuse you of trying to ride the coattails of the movement also.

How so? I've never made a dime off this movement, I have no political sway, or influence. You're a fuckin idiot.

[angelatc]

I think it's nonsense also. It's the professional dividers putting the emphasis on Benton to divide the Liberty Movement...not me. See all the news reports about it?

jesse has never had good relations with the media. if his media relations skills were as savvy as the relations he had with the grassroots, it is no wonder they are coming after him with a little smug glee. as are we.

[FrankRep]

Clearly then, being part of the Paul family is no immunization against being a corrupt, slimy snake.
Jesse Benton is guilty of knowing how politics work. Sometimes you have to play the "scratch my back and i'll scratch yours."

[Smitty]

No words. I'm just laughing hysterically at the thought of Rove supporting Rand.

That's fine,...but you need to learn to laugh with your eyes open.

[angelatc]

Jesse Benton is guilty of knowing how politics work. Sometimes you have to play the "scratch my back and i'll scratch yours."

you also have to know that doing illegal things makes you vulnerable to criminal charges

[donnay]

Jesse Benton is guilty of knowing how politics work. Sometimes you have to play the "scratch my back and i'll scratch yours."


Then collectively, we are no different than those we rail about. Standing the moral ground is what we need to be leaders of men.

[FrankRep]

jesse has never had good relations with the media. if his media relations skills were as savvy as the relations he had with the grassroots, it is no wonder they are coming after him with a little smug glee. as are we.
Ron Paul didn't have good relations with the media either considering the fact the media kept ignoring him.

[Deborah K]

Ron Paul didn't have good relations with the media either considering the fact the media kept ignoring him.

Benton is no Ron Paul.

[FrankRep]

The collectively, we are no different than those we rail about. Standing the moral ground is what we need to be leaders of men.
I'm railing against Big Government control and the leftist, progressive politics. I know how politics work however.

[angelatc]

Ron Paul didn't have good relations with the media either considering the fact the media kept ignoring him.

in the second campaign, getting media coverage was Jesses job.

in the first run, there were lots of docmented instances of journalists getting blown off by the campaign.

[FrankRep]

Benton is no Ron Paul.
Jesse Benton knows how politics work and could have opened the door for Ron Paul-like people to get into positions of power. Dennis Fusaro exposed the "Liberty Conspiracy" so that's pretty much down the drain.

[donnay]

Ron Paul didn't have good relations with the media either considering the fact the media kept ignoring him.


If you remember by ignoring him only made people more eager to learn about him--especially in 2008. Ron Paul's record was all the people had to see to know he was a man of character and integrity--not the same old politician people would hold their nose and vote for. He was and still is a breath of fresh air.

[FrankRep]

in the second campaign, getting media coverage was Jesses job.

in the first run, there were lots of docmented instances of journalists getting blown off by the campaign.

You realize the media is controlled, right? There are powerful forces that don't want Ron Paul-like people in power.

[angelatc]

Jesse Benton knows how politics work and could have opened the door for Ron Paul-like people to get into positions of power. Dennis Fusaro exposed the "Liberty Conspiracy" so that's pretty much down the drain.

are we seriously expected to let Bentons illegal activities slide if it means winning elections

[Smitty]

You realize the media is controlled, right? There are powerful forces that don't want Ron Paul-like people in power.

,...and Jesse Benton carries water for them.

[thoughtomator]

Jesse Benton is guilty of knowing how politics work. "

I'm pretty sure you couldn't get a jury to convict him of that, after his abysmal flop (sabotage?) as RP's campaign manager, and after telling people he's holding his nose to work for his own boss.

One thing I learned REALLY quickly in politics is that shit-talking gets around, FAST.

[PatriotOne]

How so? I've never made a dime off this movement, I have no political sway, or influence. You're a fuckin idiot.

Is that your proof against Benton that he rode the political coattails of Ron? Earning a living, having political sway and influence means something negative now? I thought that's what we were shooting for in the movement.

I'm a fucking idiot? I'm just going to let that pass this time.

[Deborah K]

Jesse Benton knows how politics work and could have opened the door for Ron Paul-like people to get into positions of power. Dennis Fusaro exposed the "Liberty Conspiracy" so that's pretty much down the drain.

Frank, Benton is not our only avenue. He's not even our best choice for opening doors, I can think of others with a lot more clout, and better reputations. He'll end up another Jack Hunter if the opposition has anything to say about it.

[angelatc]

You realize the media is controlled, right? There are powerful forces that don't want Ron Paul-like people in power.

thats just a lame excuse for not doing his job. Much like teachers saying they cannot teach kids to read because the parents are at fault. Even if it is true, so what? We need someone who can change that. Jesse is not that guy.

[Deborah K]

Is that your proof against Benton that he rode the political coattails of Ron? Earning a living, having political sway and influence means something negative now? I thought that's what we were shooting for in the movement.

I'm a fucking idiot? I'm just going to let that pass this time.

You know better than that. You know what my beef is with Benton. And you were trying to insult me by accusing me of riding coattails so you can forget trying to back-pedal. If you want to tangle with me, start by being intellectually honest.

[angelatc]

Is that your proof against Benton that he rode the political coattails of Ron? Earning a living, having political sway and influence means something negative now? I thought that's what we were shooting for in the movement.

I'm a fucking idiot? I'm just going to let that pass this time.

she is right. You are being a fucking idiot.

[pcosmar]

Jesse Benton is guilty of knowing how politics work. Sometimes you have to play the "scratch my back and i'll scratch yours."

I'll put that right next to ,
"Lay down with dogs,, get up with fleas"

http://31.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lvgo8ocK9J1qdvq78o1_400.png

[angelatc]

I'll put that right next to ,
"Lay down with dogs,, get up with fleas"

I have no qualms about the check itself. My issues are with the fact that it was illegal and Benton lied about it. Although I suspect there was some weasel words in there. he might have said that the campaign did not issue a check, without mentioning that the C4L did or something equally deceptive.

[LibertyEagle]

Just wow, guys. This reminds me of shooting oneself in one's own foot.

[pcosmar]

I have no qualms about the check itself. My issues are with the fact that it was illegal and Benton lied about it. Although I suspect there was some weasel words in there. he might have said that the campaign did not issue a check, without mentioning that the C4L did or something equally deceptive.

My interest is a general dislike for Dishonesty, and back room deals and "politics as usual".

That is why I supported Ron.. A long history of honesty and integrity.

Politics as usual disgusts me.

[LibertyEagle]

Frank, Benton is not our only avenue. He's not even our best choice for opening doors, I can think of others with a lot more clout, and better reputations. He'll end up another Jack Hunter if the opposition has anything to say about it.

Who needs an opposition, Deb? We have ourselves.

[PatriotOne]

You know better than that. You know what my beef is with Benton. And you were trying to insult me by accusing me of riding coattails so you can forget trying to back-pedal. If you want to tangle with me, start by being intellectually honest.

Yes. I do know what your beef is and I also know why Benton had to distance the campaign from said beef.

[Deborah K]

I stated my opinion on all of this below. And I jumped into this stupid thread because Liberal Nurse is a friend, and I defend my friends.



Since when is Liberal Nurse is a professional divider?

We are dividing ourselves, we don't even NEED "professional dividers" - if there is such a thing. We do it by making people with differing opinions into enemies, instead of focusing on the one thing that keeps us cohesive: our desire to be free. We, in the grassroots, don't HAVE to agree on every strategy used in order to achieve success, but too many people don't realize that. Too many people believe we all need to fall in lock-step on everything. Yeah, that works. smh.

[donnay]

My interest is a general dislike for Dishonesty, and back room deals and "politics as usual".

That is why I supported Ron.. A long history of honesty and integrity.

Politics as usual disgusts me.


Well said. +rep

We do not need more of the same--that is why we are in the situation we are in currently.

[angelatc]

Just wow, guys. This reminds me of shooting oneself in one's own foot.

You think it is ok that Benton made an illegal payment, but not ok that we are condemning such behavior. is that accurate?

[Deborah K]

Yes. I do know what your beef is and I also know why Benton had to distance the campaign from said beef.

So quit the pretense then. You have your opinion about Benton, and others have theirs. No need to accuse and insult people who don't think like you.

Edit: and for record - Dr. Paul and his family didn't feel the need to distance themselves. Benton and Kokesh are enemies, and childish drama is at the root of ALL of it!

[JK/SEA]

Kent Snyder...Lew Moore....Jesse Benton......

is it just me, or does it seem the campaign mgrs. being picked are going down hill?.....wuss up with that?

[angelatc]

My interest is a general dislike for Dishonesty, and back room deals and "politics as usual".

That is why I supported Ron.. A long history of honesty and integrity.

Politics as usual disgusts me.


Paul mentioned making endorsements for the sake of political gain. Sorenson was doing the same thing. The money was to go into his PAC, after all.

[PatriotOne]

Benton and Kokesh are enemies, and childish drama is at the root of ALL of it!

You know Kokesh is an enemy now? This is a new revelation.

[FrankRep]

I'm so intrigued about how self-destructive the Ron Paul movement is.

The enemies of liberty are like a well oiled machine taking over and the Ron Paul movement is too busy attacking each other to make any great strides to take back the government.

[Deborah K]

You know Kokesh is an enemy now? This is a new revelation.

Kokesh and Benton are enemies to each other. It was at the root of why Benton wanted PaulFest to "go away". If you didn't know that, then what are you referring to when you claim you know "why Benton had to distance the campaign from said beef." Now you're starting to sound like you're full of shit.

[angelatc]

I'm so intrigued about how self-destructive the Ron Paul movement is.

The enemies of liberty are like a well oiled machine taking over and the Ron Paul movement is too busy attacking each other to make any great strides to take back the government.

So you also think it is ok to write illegal checks and then lie about it, but not to condemn it.

[thoughtomator]

I'd take one Kokesh over a million Bentons.

[Deborah K]

I'm so intrigued about how self-destructive the Ron Paul movement is.

The enemies of liberty are like a well oiled machine taking over and the Ron Paul movement is too busy attacking each other to make any great strides to take back the government.

People are going to get on each other's nerves and have it out occasionally. That's all I see going on in this thread. And I don't believe that, because some in the movement don't trust or like Benton, that somehow means the movement is doomed.

The enemies of liberty are ahead of the game in every way but one, they made the fatal and historic mistake of setting up a failed economic system that is doomed to collapse. Those of us in the movement who diligently prepare for that will have a better chance of rebuilding when it's all said and done. I think our differences will be laid to rest at some point.

[orenbus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7pdWAcK6Eh8

[JK/SEA]

I'm so intrigued about how self-destructive the Ron Paul movement is.

The enemies of liberty are like a well oiled machine taking over and the Ron Paul movement is too busy attacking each other to make any great strides to take back the government.

not sure the 'Ron Paul movement' is attacking 'each other'...i'm more inclined to believe that true Ron Paul supporters are beating off interventionist NEOCONS disguised as Ron Paul supporters. The REVOLUTION continues, and the bodies are starting to pile up...metaphorically of course.

[Matt Collins]

I have no political sway, or influence. You're doing it wrong then.... :(

[Matt Collins]

You realize the media is controlled, right? There are powerful forces that don't want Ron Paul-like people in power.Some elements of some of the media are "controlled" but it's not all monolithic, or at least not as much as it used to be. And if you know how to do it, the media can be made to serve our purposes as well.

[Matt Collins]

I have no qualms about the check itself. My issues are with the fact that it was illegal and Benton lied about it.


You think it is ok that Benton made an illegal payment, but not ok that we are condemning such behavior. is that accurate?


So you also think it is ok to write illegal checks and then lie about it, but not to condemn it.


You keep saying that it was illegal. Are you sure about that? :confused:

[PatriotOne]

Kokesh and Benton are enemies to each other. It was at the root of why Benton wanted PaulFest to "go away". If you didn't know that, then what are you referring to when you claim you know "why Benton had to distance the campaign from said beef." Now you're starting to sound like you're full of shit.

Oh. For a minute there I thought you finally figured out Kokesh was controlled opposition. Disappointed. I just read it differently than what you intended.

I know full well why the Paul campaign distanced themselves from Paulfest. I was the person pointing it out from the beginning. Remember?

Jesse wasn't wrong to do that.

[Deborah K]

You're doing it wrong then.... :(

Matt, I have NO interest in having political sway or influence. I've told you that before. NO INTEREST. It's not, and never was my objective. Any one who knows me, knows that.

[FrankRep]

So you also think it is ok to write illegal checks and then lie about it, but not to condemn it.

I look at the bigger picture. I see a massively corrupt government that's leading the United States into total destruction and a totalitarian regime enslaving the American people. What were you saying about a check?

[Matt Collins]

Matt, I have NO interest in having political sway or influence. I've told you that before. NO INTEREST. It's not, and never was my objective. Any one who knows me, knows that.
Then what are you doing here? :confused:

[angelatc]

You keep saying that it was illegal. Are you sure about that? :confused:

I am aware that now that sorenson has been found out, he wants to change the historical interpretation of the rule. But judging by their previous decisions, the ayment was illegal.

I don't anticipate an answer, but if it wasnt, why lie about it, and why launder it through a jewelry store? Make no mistake. I work with folks who make different decisions that i would all day. Its the mealy mouthed liars that are problematic.

[angelatc]

I look at the bigger picture. I see a massively corrupt government that's leading the United States into total destruction and a totalitarian regime enslaving the American people. What were you saying about a check?

red herring.

but we are talking about corruption here. you think its ok for our side to be corrupt, then?

[Deborah K]

Oh. For a minute there I thought you finally figured out Kokesh was controlled opposition. Disappointed. I just read it differently than what you intended.

I know full well why the Paul campaign distanced themselves from Paulfest. I was the person pointing it out from the beginning. Remember?

Jesse wasn't wrong to do that.

Opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one. And since you were on the outside looking in, yours doesn't matter much - to me anyway.

[FrankRep]

How so? I've never made a dime off this movement, I have no political sway, or influence. You're a fuckin idiot.

You're doing it wrong then.... :(

Matt, I have NO interest in having political sway or influence. I've told you that before. NO INTEREST. It's not, and never was my objective. Any one who knows me, knows that.
You and the enemies of liberty both agree on something... They don't want you to have any political influence either.

[ClydeCoulter]

This forum gets all "you're destroying the movement" every time there's a disagreement on certain persons or things said by our hopefuls on certain policies.

We are not our own worst enemy, there are plenty of those out there, such that there is no need to point to your fellows. When there is disagreement, it shows that we are individuals with various life experiences and knowledge of what is going on. Are we not all seeking the truth? Are we not all desiring honesty?

You have a disagreement? Make you case, give facts, results, nuances, etc... Maybe you can educate some, maybe you can be educated.

edit: now children.... /jk

[torchbearer]

Then what are you doing here? :confused:

maybe the terms should be defined furthur.
some may only want sway over their neighbors via a campaign for liberty type grassroots lobbying, while some want sway in political parties.

[FrankRep]

red herring.

but we are talking about corruption here. you think its ok for our side to be corrupt, then?
I don't want to see the United States destroyed and the American people enslaved... The people in power are doing this right now.

[Deborah K]

Then what are you doing here? :confused:

The same thing everyone else is. Communing with like-minded people. And doing what I can to advance the cause of liberty.

[Matt Collins]

I am aware that now that sorenson has been found out, he wants to change the historical interpretation of the rule. But judging by their previous decisions, the ayment was illegal.

if it wasnt, why lie about it, and why launder it through a jewelry store? Make no mistake. I work with folks who make different decisions that i would all day. Its the mealy mouthed liars that are problematic.
Perhaps they didn't want a media storm about it during the campaign?

I dunno, but I am not totally sure the actions were illegal. I am not an attorney of course, but is it illegal for members of the legislature to be on the payroll of a Presidential campaign?

[angelatc]

I don't want to see the United States destroyed and the American people enslaved... The people in power are doing this right now.

red herring. You think its ok to allow unquestioned corruption in our ranks?

[Matt Collins]

The same thing everyone else is. Communing with like-minded people. And doing what I can to advance the cause of liberty.Advancing the cause of liberty means activism, it means getting in the fight, it means punishing politicians for taking your liberty. If you are to advance liberty you have to gain influence and political power, otherwise it doesn't work (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QCzww6EG7E).

[FrankRep]

The same thing everyone else is. Communing with like-minded people. And doing what I can to advance the cause of liberty.

Advancing the cause of liberty requires political influence.

[ClydeCoulter]

Advancing the cause of liberty means activism, it means getting in the fight, it means punishing politicians for taking your liberty. If you are to advance liberty you have to gain influence and political power, otherwise it doesn't work (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QCzww6EG7E).

As long as it is done with honesty and integrity. Otherwise, it's heading down the same rut.

[angelatc]

Advancing the cause of liberty means activism, it means getting in the fight, it means punishing politicians for taking your liberty. If you are to advance liberty you have to gain influence and political power, otherwise it doesn't work (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QCzww6EG7E).

lol it is uunfathomable to matt that anybody would use these forums for any reason other than to advance oneself politically

[compromise]

Then what are you doing here? :confused:

Trolling.

[Deborah K]

You and the enemies of liberty both agree on something... They don't want you to have any political influence either.

Frank, some people aren't equipped for political influence or sway - I'm one of them. I do what I can in my own way to advance the cause of liberty, but have no interest in being a leader or whatever. I am flawed beyond repair. But I do have skills in organizing events so that's what I do.

[Carlybee]

Advancing the cause of liberty means activism, it means getting in the fight, it means punishing politicians for taking your liberty. If you are to advance liberty you have to gain influence and political power, otherwise it doesn't work (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QCzww6EG7E).


There are a lot of people who have been on the sidelines yet donated plenty of money for this cause. One doesn't have to be actively involved, running for office, or in a leadership position to support the cause.

[ClydeCoulter]

Trolling.

"I know you are, what am I?" really?

[Deborah K]

Trolling.

Now I'm a troll?

[Deborah K]

lol it is uunfathomable to matt that anybody would use these forums for any reason other than to advance oneself politically

LOL!

[donnay]

Two words for those who sit in denial: Stockholm Syndrome.

[Carlybee]

Back to the OP...if he "didn't mean it"...that pretty much makes him a liar to start off with and just lame for trying to pass the blame to Ron Paul supporters.

[Matt Collins]

lol it is uunfathomable to matt that anybody would use these forums for any reason other than to advance oneself politicallyThe only reason to go into business is to make money. The only reason to become politically involved is to gain power. Making money isn't bad, gaining political power isn't bad. But it depends on how you make it and what you do with it as to whether or not you are doing bad things with it.


If you make a lot of money for your family or for charity, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

If you earn a lot of political power and use it to advance liberty, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

[angelatc]

As long as it is done with honesty and integrity. Otherwise, it's heading down the same rut.

Sure. This dont criticize attitude is what allowed the Reublican and Democrat corruption. We constantly berate the liberals for not holding those like sharton, Jackson, frank and even Obama accountable for their duplicity. i am not ever going to be an apologist for corruption in our own ranks.

[FrankRep]

Frank, some people aren't equipped for political influence or sway - I'm one of them. I do what I can in my own way to advance the cause of liberty, but have no interest in being a leader or whatever. I am flawed beyond repair. But I do have skills in organizing events so that's what I do.

Organizing events is a priceless skill that does advance the cause of liberty and I would consider that "political influence" or at least helping someone with political influence.

[angelatc]

The only reason to go into business is to make money. The only reason to become politically involved is to gain power. Making money isn't bad, gaining political power isn't bad. But it depends on how you make it and what you do with it as to whether or not you are doing bad things with it.


If you make a lot of money for your family or for charity, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

If you earn a lot of political power and use it to advance liberty, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

omg it just got even funnier.

[Matt Collins]

Frank, some people aren't equipped for political influence or sway - I'm one of them. I do what I can in my own way to advance the cause of liberty, but have no interest in being a leader or whatever. I am flawed beyond repair. But I do have skills in organizing events so that's what I do.no, I don't think you're flawed at all. And since you're so good at organizing events it's actually not that much different from organizing your local precinct or county, etc. I know, I do both, :) I think you could be a great activist, but I certainly understand that lots of people don't feel that they are built for it.

The unfortunate reality is that many civilians were not built to fight the British a few hundred years ago, but they didn't have a choice, because it was either that or tyranny.

[Matt Collins]

There are a lot of people who have been on the sidelines yet donated plenty of money for this cause. One doesn't have to be actively involved, running for office, or in a leadership position to support the cause.And that is very true. Activists can only do so much without funds available to spend on their work.

[Deborah K]

The only reason to go into business is to make money. The only reason to become politically involved is to gain power. Making money isn't bad, gaining political power isn't bad. But it depends on how you make it and what you do with it as to whether or not you are doing bad things with it.


If you make a lot of money for your family or for charity, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

If you earn a lot of political power and use it to advance liberty, is that a bad thing? No of course not.

And your point izzzzzzzz.......????

Edit: I see now that you added Angie's post that you were responding to her.

[Deborah K]

no, I don't think you're flawed at all. And since you're so good at organizing events it's actually not that much different from organizing your local precinct or county, etc. I know, I do both, :) I think you could be a great activist, but I certainly understand that lots of people don't feel that they are built for it.

The unfortunate reality is that many civilians were not built to fight the British a few hundred years ago, but they didn't have a choice, because it was either that or tyranny.

Matt, I appreciate what you're saying I really do, but I know my own limits, and interests.

[PatriotOne]

Opinions are like assholes, everybody's got one. And since you were on the outside looking in, yours doesn't matter much - to me anyway.

It didn't require an insider to see the problem Deb.

http://i43.tinypic.com/27yub5v.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/11m9px0.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/zkjslw.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2vlp0z5.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2yvkzvd.jpg

Adam Smoking DMT "My face got raped with the truth of the universe"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wLaQLVyJvg

[angelatc]

And your point izzzzzzzz.......????

Did you get that Deb? You could be a great activist if you just applied yourself.

[CaptUSA]

This is what happens when a person is serving two masters. Is he trying to appease the liberty movement to help the GOP establishment or is he trying to appease the establishment to help the liberty movement? Every single one of you will make up your own mind. Many of us get pissed off by even trying to engage the establishment because we want it destroyed - others see the established system as the only way to turn things around.

I don't have all the answers, but I do feel sorry for anyone who is trying to walk this line. If you really believe that the political process needs to be worked in our favor, these types of screw-ups are going to happen. Frankly, I'm surprised Rand hasn't stepped in more of these.

It's easy to label someone a traitor to the cause if they're trying a different method that seems to be reaching out to the problem. I tend to let people do what they do. If he thinks this method is working, let him pursue it. But he better be prepared for the consequences.

[thoughtomator]

It didn't require an insider to see the problem Deb.

http://i43.tinypic.com/27yub5v.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/11m9px0.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/zkjslw.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2vlp0z5.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2yvkzvd.jpg

Adam Smoking DMT "My face got raped with the truth of the universe"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wLaQLVyJvg

I don't see the problem, unless the problem is yours and it's a trained aversion to masculinity.

[Brian4Liberty]

you also have to know that doing illegal things makes you vulnerable to criminal charges

For some reason this makes me think of one of AF's quotes. What was it exactly? Something like "three felonies a day"? The way the laws are written now, there's no way to always comply. Ignorance of a myriad of complex and contradictory laws is no excuse.

Unless you are a high level member of the Obama Bureaucracy. Then you are immune to all laws.

[PatriotOne]

I don't see the problem, unless the problem is yours and it's a trained aversion to masculinity.

LOL. Looking like a mentally ill person is the new masculine look now? Times are a changing.

[Deborah K]

It didn't require an insider to see the problem Deb.



PO, you're never going to 'get' Adam, I'll never get him either. He pisses me off at times. But I could post just as many tubes that show him verbally trouncing people in authority, who have no clue what liberty even is. And he is an advocate of civil disobedience, even risking his own health and liberty to unmask the hypocrisy and utter dismissal of our rights.

You may have no use for him, but you don't get to choose who fights for freedom, and who doesn't. I know you think he is controlled opposition, but I don't because I knew Adam before anyone else in this movement did. I brought him to the forefront by allowing him to speak at Revolution March when no one knew who he was. So blame me! And include me in on your conspiracy theories regarding Adam now. :rolleyes:

But consider this: Many of the founders had serious problems with each other - Thomas Paine was a pariah at one point. Jefferson and Adams, once very close, became enemies. Jefferson and Hamilton were archenemies. It's all human nature in the end, and those who recognize this can rise above it.

[thoughtomator]

LOL. Looking like a mentally ill person is the new masculine look now? Times are a changing.

A mentally healthy society celebrates manhood. A mentally crippled society fears it.

The fact that you equate masculine expression with mental illness is quite damning proof that you have been thoroughly mentally emasculated.

I think you're jealous that he has the self-confidence to be manly and honest.

[Brian4Liberty]

It seems to me that Benton is in a no-win situation. Some supporters want him to work the system, some don't.

When we donate money to the campaign, we want it to be spent our way. But the reality is, once we give the money, it is spent however the campaign wants to spend it. We really can't expect to have any say in the matter (other than to cease donating).

Personally, I would never want a campaign to waste money, or to use it to pay "bribes", no matter how it is spun, whether it is considered legal or illegal (or probably somewhere in between). But the idea of what is a "bribe" is difficult. Hiring a person to do actual work for a campaign, is that a "bribe"? Maybe it is if that person does nothing other than give an endorsement, or they are not capable of actually working. Is the person being paid to be a "lobbyist"? Lobbyists get paid a lot of money, but what do they do? Try to convince others? How do you know when anybody is doing something that is actually productive when you hire them?

Working with others and engaging in some quid pro quo, especially in areas where interests intersect, seems to be an honest way to work in politics. Paying someone money to do nothing or little sounds more like a bribe.

One thing is for sure, most of the media will do anything to smear Ron or Rand. A personality conflict, difference of opinion, or even blatantly, obviously illegal or immoral activity is meaningless in the Hillary camp. The media would refuse to listen to it. On the other hand, if it's in any way related to Ron, they will seek it out, encourage it, and if they have to, create the controversy themselves. It's hard trying to be the honest, moral faction, in a dishonest and amoral world.

[ObiRandKenobi]

Benton looks like he's been eatin' real good lately. Get on the treadmill Jesse. You're getting fat.

that was mean but i still lol'd.

[Anti Federalist]

What's going on here?

Oh...this again.

Carry on.

[liberalnurse]

Which is why you should know better than to spread useful idiot stupidity like "Trust us? He doesn't even like us.". The professional dividers are pleased with you spreading that untrue meme.....I'm not.

You seem to equate not keeping my mouth shut about my thoughts towards Benton with not supporting Rand or this movement. Again, not true and you should know better. And frankly I could care less if your pleased with me or not. I'm pleased with myself and what my role has been, in advancing liberty and this movement, and will continue to be so with or without your blessing.

[PatriotOne]

I brought him to the forefront by allowing him to speak at Revolution March when no one knew who he was. So blame me! And include me in on your conspiracy theories regarding Adam now. :rolleyes:



And that's why you can't be objective in understanding why the Paul Campaign had to distance itself from Paulfest. If you think people who do things like smoke DMT and post it on youtube is someone a Presidential campaign wants to be associated with then you are either batshit crazy or blind as a bat. Either way there is a bat involved because I know you are not stupid.

[pcosmar]

.


If you make a lot of money for your family or for charity, is that a bad thing?
Depends on how you do it.




.If you earn a lot of political power and use it to advance liberty, is that a bad thing?.

Again it depends? Do the ends justify the means?

I see lining of pockets, and political positions. and I have not noticed a lot of liberty being advanced by these folks.

NORML has done some despite opposition from the GOP.
The ACLU has done some,, and some I don't agree with.. Despite both parties.

The RNC and DNC,,, nope.

[Deborah K]

And that's why you can't be objective in understanding why the Paul Campaign had to distance itself from Paulfest. If you think people who do things like smoke DMT and post it on youtube is someone a Presidential campaign wants to be associated with then you are either batshit crazy or blind as a bat. Either way there is a bat involved because I know you are not stupid.

Again I say to you - Benton hates Kokesh, and Kokesh hates Benton. That is why Benton was actively trying to dissuade speakers, and launched a full-scale (behind the scenes) assault on us. (Don't bother asking for proof, because I am unwilling to throw people under the bus on this). The vitriol didn't end there. Benton also can't stand Franchi, or Woods, and vice versa - both of whom attended PaulFest. Which is why he referred to us as a "bad people" and a "fringe element". And it is also why Benton had flyers circulating with Kokesh's pic on them at Ron's event. This was childish drama at its worst. Dr. Paul did not feel the same way Benton did about it. He was willing to do a video for us to play at our event but we couldn't pull it off in a timely way - Kathy88 is witness to a voicemail I got from Ron about it. Ron's family bought around 25 tickets to the event - so please - stop talking like you know what's up - cuz you don't.

[thoughtomator]

And that's why you can't be objective in understanding why the Paul Campaign had to distance itself from Paulfest. If you think people who do things like smoke DMT and post it on youtube is someone a Presidential campaign wants to be associated with then you are either batshit crazy or blind as a bat. Either way there is a bat involved because I know you are not stupid.

Shit, Obama's best buddy is one of the few genuine, actual domestic American terrorists. Kokesh isn't half as openly radical as most of Obama's staff is.

What you fear is the media. It's a healthy fear but not one that should lead you to cut off your own balls to prevent them from being kicked.

[PatriotOne]

You seem to equate not keeping my mouth shut about my thoughts towards Benton with not supporting Rand or this movement. Again, not true and you should know better. .

No. I do believe your intentions are good.


And frankly I could care less if your pleased with me or not.

I'm sure. Karl is pleased with you though.

[FrankRep]

Again I say to you - Benton hates Kokesh, and Kokesh hates Benton. That is why Benton was actively trying to dissuade speakers, and launched a full-scale (behind the scenes) assault on us.

Who is "us"? Kokesh is a loose cannon and the Ron Paul campaign should have distanced themselves from Kokesh from the beginning.

[Deborah K]

Who is "us"?

"Us" = organizers of the event.


Kokesh is a loose cannon and the Ron Paul campaign should have distanced themselves from Kokesh from the beginning.

But he, (Ron) didn't. He, (Ron) endorsed his (Adam's) campaign. Granted Kokesh went off the rails. But tying his 'sins' to Ron or Rand, simply because he's a defender of freedom is just stupid to me.

[Matt Collins]

Granted Kokesh went off the rails. But tying his 'sins' to Ron or Rand, simply because he's a defender of freedom is just stupid to me.Unfortunately being rational is not a requirement in politics and the media. The opposition will use anything against you they can, fair, rational, or otherwise.

[PatriotOne]

Again I say to you - Benton hates Kokesh, and Kokesh hates Benton. That is why Benton was actively trying to dissuade speakers, and launched a full-scale (behind the scenes) assault on us. (Don't bother asking for proof, because I am unwilling to throw people under the bus on this). The vitriol didn't end there. Benton also can't stand Franchi, or Woods, and vice versa - both of whom attended PaulFest. Which is why he referred to us as a "bad people" and a "fringe element". And it is also why Benton had flyers circulating with Kokesh's pic on them at Ron's event. This was childish drama at its worst. Dr. Paul did not feel the same way Benton did about it. He was willing to do a video for us to play at our event but we couldn't pull it off in a timely way - Kathy88 is witness to a voicemail I got from Ron about it. Ron's family bought around 25 tickets to the event - so please - stop talking like you know what's up - cuz you don't.

Of course Benton doesn't like Kokesh or him being associated with the Paul family. It's absolutely ridiculous that you don't see or refuse to see the problem with it Deb. Thank god I have to go now because I can't have this asinine conversation anymore without my head exploding.



http://i43.tinypic.com/27yub5v.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/11m9px0.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/zkjslw.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2vlp0z5.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2yvkzvd.jpg

Adam Smoking DMT "My face got raped with the truth of the universe"


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8wLaQLVyJvg

[JK/SEA]

Unfortunately being rational is not a requirement in politics and the media. The opposition will use anything against you they can, fair, rational, or otherwise.

...and use screen names like 'Patriot one'...

[FrankRep]

But he, (Ron) didn't. He, (Ron) endorsed his (Adam's) campaign. Granted Kokesh went off the rails. But tying his 'sins' to Ron or Rand, simply because he's a defender of freedom is just stupid to me.

I'm glad Jesse Benton rejected Kokesh. Kokesh should have been rejected as soon as he teamed up with Code Pink.

[JK/SEA]

//

[kathy88]

Everything Deb has said in this ridiculous thread is absolutely true.

[Deborah K]

Unfortunately being rational is not a requirement in politics and the media. The opposition will use anything against you they can, fair, rational, or otherwise.

Well Matt, so far, I haven't seen too many stories about Adam's recent arrest associating Rand or Ron to him. The only association I'm aware of is the article written recently and published in Ron's online journal (which escapes my memory at the moment) and where the author defends Kokesh. There's a thread on it in here somewhere. Anyone?

[Deborah K]

Of course Benton doesn't like Kokesh or him being associated with the Paul family. It's absolutely ridiculous that you don't see or refuse to see the problem with it Deb. Thank god I have to go now because I can't have this asinine conversation anymore without my head exploding.


Of course you can't, because you're incapable of co-existing with anyone who disagrees with you about anything. Are you like this in the real world? And re-posting unseemly vids and pics of Adam over and over only makes you come off like an annoying gnat.

Edit: and btw, Ron apparently doesn't share your opinion, given what I told you about his involvement with us. But then again, he's a sort of 'live and let live' kind of guy. Unlike many here.

[FrankRep]

Well Matt, so far, I haven't seen too many stories about Adam's recent arrest associating Rand or Ron to him. The only association I'm aware of is the article written recently and published in Ron's online journal (which escapes my memory at the moment) and where the author defends Kokesh. There's a thread on it in here somewhere. Anyone?
Whenever the media would like to make a hit piece on Ron Paul, they could always point to Ron Paul's poor judgement of character by bringing in Kokesh.

[Deborah K]

I'm glad Jesse Benton rejected Kokesh. Kokesh should have been rejected as soon as he teamed up with Code Pink.

So then, by your logic, I should be rejected for supporting Kokesh?

[Deborah K]

Whenever the media would like to make a hit piece on Ron Paul, they could always point to Ron Paul's poor judgement of character by bringing in Kokesh.

And who's fault is that?

Look, the media is so far into the gov't at this point, they could make shit up if they wanted and get away with it. It doesn't justify ostracizing someone in the movement. You are wanting to do to Kokesh, what others are wanting to do to Benton. It's all ridiculous.

[Matt Collins]

So then, by your logic, I should be rejected for supporting Kokesh?
You're not running for office at present.

[Matt Collins]

Well Matt, so far, I haven't seen too many stories about Adam's recent arrest associating Rand or Ron to him. That's because they went through great pains to disassociate themselves from Kokesh.

[cajuncocoa]

“This stuff can bring down the Ron Paul movement,” Fusaro says, before taking pains to describe the difference between grassroots supporters of Ron Paul, and what he describes as “Ron Paul, Inc.,” basically a cottage industry of self-interested professionals with more interest in personal gain than in advancement of the movement. “Like Mike Rothfield [sic] has said, he [Ron Paul] can run his own campaign, while we run ours,” meaning essentially that “Ron Paul, Inc.” ran a campaign in parallel to the candidate himself, but without the candidate’s adherence to principle. Source: http://www.economicpolicyjournal.com/2013/08/ron-paul-vs-ron-paul-inc.html

The evidence is strong in this thread.

[JK/SEA]

i sent Kokesh one hundred bucks last week and dedicated the contribution to Patriot One and Matt Collins and FrankRep.

you're welcome.

[Deborah K]

That's because they went through great pains to disassociate themselves from Kokesh.

You just willfully ignored the second half of my response.

[Deborah K]

You're not running for office at present.

And neither is Kokesh. So what's your point?

[JK/SEA]

Merchant: ADAM VS THE MAN, LLC


Item Description Qty Taxable Unit Price Item Total
AVTM3TEMP TEMPORARY ORDER/DONATION FORM 1 N US $100.00 US $100.00

[Original_Intent]

http://images.sodahead.com/polls/002265719/4359281973_i_concur_RE_Wikileaks_s500x351_111816_5 80_answer_3_xlarge.jpeg

For some reason as I read this I imagined I heard "I concur" in Sean Connery's voice...:toady:

[cajuncocoa]

I don't always agree with Patriot One (in fact, this is the first time) but when I do, it's not the way PO meant it. There ARE professional dividers within this liberty movement, but it's not those PO thinks it is.

Here's a clue: if you think Sarah Palin is serious about liberty but Adam Kokesh is not, you may need to re-think why you're really here.

[Carlybee]

Trolling.

Really? You who have been here less than a year are going to accuse a long time member of trolling? Piss off.

[Deborah K]

I don't always agree with Patriot One (in fact, this is the first time) but when I do, it's not the way PO meant it. There ARE professional dividers within this liberty movement, but it's not those PO thinks it is.

Here's a clue: if you think Sarah Palin is serious about liberty but Adam Kokesh is not, you may need to re-think why you're really here.

When you say "professional" that is equated to pay, in my pea brain. Is that what you mean?

[thoughtomator]

Really? You who have been here less than a year are going to accuse a long time member of trolling? Piss off.

From my experience here, long time members can easily troll with the best of them. I'd be disappointed if they couldn't.

Hang on a sec and let me whip this rep bar out of my pants and swing it around a little.

[cajuncocoa]

When you say "professional" that is equated to pay, in my pea brain. Is that what you mean?
I'm just using the term PO used...but to learn there are some getting paid to destroy Ron's r3volution would not be a surprise to me at all. Can't prove it, but I highly suspect it.

[Deborah K]

From my experience here, long time members can easily troll with the best of them. I'd be disappointed if they couldn't.

Hang on a sec and let me whip this rep bar out of my pants and swing it around a little.

Well I can assure you, I'm not trolling. I jumped in this thread to defend my friend, and it went from there. Not trying to troll.

[FrankRep]

I'm just using the term PO used...but to learn there are some getting paid to destroy Ron's r3volution would not be a surprise to me at all. Can't prove it, but I highly suspect it.
Nothing is politics happens by accident and the Ron Paul movement looks to be self-destructing.

[orenbus]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I3B3WzTMFZk

[JK/SEA]

Nothing is politics happens by accident and the Ron Paul movement looks to be self-destructing.

bullshit.

[New York For Paul]

Nothing is politics happens by accident and the Ron Paul movement looks to be self-destructing.

The Ron Paul Movement might be getting stronger by getting rid of certain people. Many large donors and activists were driven away from the campaign. So much lost talent has been squandered. At this point Jesse Benton would probably be more harm than good to Rand Paul.

[Carlybee]

Nothing is politics happens by accident and the Ron Paul movement looks to be self-destructing.


Wishful thinking?

[Deborah K]

Nothing is politics happens by accident and the Ron Paul movement looks to be self-destructing.


I disagree, I think the movement has made great inroads.

[MelissaCato]

Ron Paul should just run again for POTUS in 2016 !! Then all this is just noise !!! :cool:

[scrosnoe]

It matters how we treat one another as we go -- what we say and what we do! Actions have consequences...

Hopefully the movement is learning from past mistakes.

[FrankRep]

The Ron Paul Movement might be getting stronger by getting rid of certain people. Many large donors and activists were driven away from the campaign. So much lost talent has been squandered. At this point Jesse Benton would probably be more harm than good to Rand Paul.
He is now obviously.


Top Iowa Evangelical: Rand Paul Can’t Hire Ron Paul’s Aides for 2016 If Campaign Guilty of Giving Check for Endorsement
http://www.nationalreview.com/corner/355453/top-iowa-evangelical-rand-paul-cant-hire-ron-pauls-aides-2016-if-campaign-guilty



Top Iowa evangelical Bob Vander Plaats declined to comment on the emerging scandal that Iowa state senator appears to have accepted a check to switch his endorsement from Michele Bachmann to Ron Paul, saying he wanted to let the process take his course.

But he did warn that if Iowa state senator Kent Sorenson is found to have given a check, Rand Paul needs to make sure he doesn’t have any staff who were involved if he runs in 2016.

“People in Iowa and people in America will see Rand as his own man,” Vander Plaats comments, “unless there’s some odd connections with staff and whatever that are working for both, and then it becomes an entangled mess that you don’t want to be in.”

[Smitty]

The only reason to go into business is to make money. The only reason to become politically involved is to gain power.




Altruism is very rare in American politics, that's true.

But Dr Paul has proven that it isn't totally extinct.

If your purpose in being a political activist is to make money and gain power, you'd be much better served by abandoning the liberty movement and sell whatever you can of yourself to the neocons.

Give Mitch and Jesse a call.

They can put you on the path.

First stop, Israel.

[JK/SEA]

It matters how we treat one another as we go -- what we say and what we do! Actions have consequences...

Hopefully the movement is learning from past mistakes.

who is we?

[cajuncocoa]

Altruism is very rare in American politics, that's true.

But Dr Paul has proven that it isn't totally extinct.

If your purpose in being a political activist is to make money and gain power, you'd be much better served by abandoning the liberty movement and sell whatever you can of yourself to the neocons.

Give Mitch and Jesse a call.

They can put you on the path.

First stop, Israel.

I owe you another rep.

[FrankRep]

who is we?

I find it amusing that libertarian-types rail against "collectivism" and turn around and use terms like "we, " "us," and "the movement."

[Feeding the Abscess]

in the second campaign, getting media coverage was Jesses job.

in the first run, there were lots of docmented instances of journalists getting blown off by the campaign.

Jesse was the liason to the media in the first campaign as well.

[Matt Collins]

If your purpose in being a political activist is to make money and gain power, you'd be much better served by abandoning the liberty movement and sell whatever you can of yourself to the neocons.
Why would I do that? It makes no sense. I want the liberty movement to have more power, not less.

[JK/SEA]

I find it amusing that libertarian-types rail against "collectivism" and turn around and use terms like "we, " "us," and "the movement."

you think Scrosnoe is a libertarian?....

[parocks]

You are being one of the professional dividers "useful idiots" I was speaking of. You have unwittingly become an enemy of the Liberty Movement. Just stop it.

Right on. There is very little useful benefit from attacking our own people.

It's very common. If I was a RINO, and I was worried about Ron Paul or Rand Paul, I'd try to spread the idea that the people working for Ron and Rand are awful.

And there has been a lot of that.

[JK/SEA]

Why would I do that? It makes no sense. I want the liberty movement to have more power, not less.

did Lew Moore help out in that regard?

[Smitty]

Power is cheap in American politics.

It's no secret on how to obtain it.

You simply do what the powers that be tell you to do.

Providing liberty to the masses is much more complicated than garnering power,...and requires a large dose of self sacrifice.

So far, I haven't seen Rand express any willingness to make that sacrifice.

He won't even sacrifice Jesse Benton.

That's a huge red flag.

It's more than a bit surprising to me that more can't see it.

[Deborah K]

Well Matt, so far, I haven't seen too many stories about Adam's recent arrest associating Rand or Ron to him. The only association I'm aware of is the article written recently and published in Ron's online journal (which escapes my memory at the moment) and where the author defends Kokesh. There's a thread on it in here somewhere. Anyone?

I found the article that makes my point which Matt has chosen to willfully ignore:

http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2013/july/18/adam-kokesh-and-the-drugs-and-guns-prosecution-trap.aspx


Podcast host Adam Kokesh appears to have joined the long list of victims of the US government's drugs and guns prosecution trap. After a US Park Police raid on his Virginia residence last week, media reported Monday that Kokesh was charged with possession of a Schedule I or II drug under the federal Controlled Substances Act while in possession of a gun. After his arrest, a judge ruled that Kokesh is prohibited from owning or possessing a firearm through the end of his prosecution.

In the drugs and guns prosecution trap, when a defendant merely possesses a gun while allegedly in violation of the Controlled Substances Act, the government seeks to impose additional penalties for the gun possession. These penalties may be imposed even if the defendant did not use a gun in any violent activity or even in any activity related to drugs.

The drugs and guns prosecution trap can be used to pressure a defendant to plead guilty in return for a reduced penalty instead of exercising his right to a trial. As explained by Eric Stern, counsel to former Montana Governor Brian Schweitzer, the top US government prosecutor in Montana used gun possession charges "pervasively" as part of a strategy to intimidate Montanans who possessed marijuana in compliance with state medical marijuana laws into pleading guilty in plea-bargains.

Feel free to read on at the link.


That's because they went through great pains to disassociate themselves from Kokesh.


So much for distancing themselves from Kokesh.

[Anti Federalist]

For some reason as I read this I imagined I heard "I concur" in Sean Connery's voice...:toady:

In Capt. Marko Ramius' voice in Hunt for Red October.

[cajuncocoa]

So much for distancing themselves from Kokesh.

I doubt that Ron would want to distance himself from Adam. Ron Paul, Inc (i.e., those self-interested professionals with more interest in personal gain than in advancement of the movement).....well, that's a different story.

[Smitty]

Jesse's boss comes in at #4.

http://chasvoice.blogspot.com/2012/03/aipac-campaign-contributions-to-us.html

[JK/SEA]

Jesse's boss comes in at #4.

http://chasvoice.blogspot.com/2012/03/aipac-campaign-contributions-to-us.html


You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Smitty again.

[PatriotOne]

I found the article that makes my point which Matt has chosen to willfully ignore:

http://www.ronpaulinstitute.org/archives/featured-articles/2013/july/18/adam-kokesh-and-the-drugs-and-guns-prosecution-trap.aspx



Feel free to read on at the link.




So much for distancing themselves from Kokesh.

And it's things like that that make me appreciate Benton all the more. I hope for Benton to be mean as a two-headed rattlesnake to protect our pol...be it Rand or Ron....even if it's from themselves. I don't want Benton to be a nice guy who feels he has to stroke everyone's ego or be their friends. He's playing a game that has land mines, bear traps, snakes in the grass, snipers in the tree's, enemies on the outside and inside, cointel pro and useful idiots. I hope he squashes anyone who threatens Rand like a bug. We are at war...Rand needs a General not a summer camp leader singing kumbaya around the camp fire.

Kokesh self destructed but I would of preferred he ended up on the bottom of Benton's shoe like the cockroach he was/is.

[Carlybee]

And it's things like that that make me appreciate Benton all the more. I hope for Benton to be mean as a two-headed rattlesnake to protect our pol...be it Rand or Ron....even if it's from themselves. I don't want Benton to be a nice guy who feels he has to stroke everyone's ego or be their friends. He's playing a game that has land mines, bear traps, snakes in the grass, snipers in the tree's, enemies on the outside and inside, cointel pro and useful idiots. I hope he squashes anyone who threatens Rand like a bug. We are at war...Rand needs a General not a summer camp leader singing kumbaya around the camp fire.

Kokesh self destructed but I would of preferred he ended up on the bottom of Benton's shoe like the cockroach he was/is.

LMAO. Seriously? Obviously Benton has a long way to go before he knows how to dodge landmines. He can't even dodge his own big mouth.

[cjm]

Who the hell is Dennis Fusaro and why is he trying to destroy any chances of getting Ron Paul-like people into the government.

I met Dennis face to face a couple of times. We traded some emails and spoke on the phone a few times too. We were working on the same project at the time. Although we did not work together directly, he was very helpful with a sub-project I was working on. From what I saw, he gave a lot more to the overall project than he got out of it. I don't know him well, but I think I know him well enough to say that he is an asset to the liberty movement.


All I have to say is that Fusaro is a snake in the grass.

It might seem that way on the surface. Who records conversations except machiavellian puppet masters, right? But is there a case where an honorable person might record a conversation? Have any of you had dealings with someone that mischaracterized what you said on the phone? I have. I haven't gone to the level of recording conversations, but sometimes I wish I had when I know that the other party is making claims that are not true about my statements.

I'm not in a position to defend Fusaro's recording or publishing of those phone calls. I don't know enough about the Fusaro-Benton history. But even if this turns out to be a bad move, I would characterize it as a mistake on Fusaro's part and not say the man himself is a snake. Until I know more, Dennis is ok in my book.

I also share his concerns about "Ron Paul, Inc."

[PatriotOne]

LMAO. Seriously? Obviously Benton has a long way to go before he knows how to dodge landmines. He can't even dodge his own big mouth.

Hopefully he learned not to trust anyone.

[Feeding the Abscess]

Perhaps they didn't want a media storm about it during the campaign?

I dunno, but I am not totally sure the actions were illegal. I am not an attorney of course, but is it illegal for members of the legislature to be on the payroll of a Presidential campaign?

http://theiowarepublican.com/2013/fbi-investigating-bachmann-campaign-including-alleged-sorenson-payments/


Former Bachmann chief of staff Andy Parrish swore in an affidavit that Sorenson was being paid by C&M Strategies for his work on the Bachmann presidential campaign, in an effort to help Sorenson skirt Iowa Senate ethics rules.

http://theiowarepublican.com/2013/the-payoff-details-revealed-on-sorensons-deal-with-ron-paul/


Sorenson is currently under investigation for violating an Iowa Senate ethics rule that forbids Iowa state senators from being compensated by a presidential campaign.

[liberty2897]

And it's things like that that make me appreciate Benton all the more. I hope for Benton to be mean as a two-headed rattlesnake to protect our pol...be it Rand or Ron....even if it's from themselves. I don't want Benton to be a nice guy who feels he has to stroke everyone's ego or be their friends. He's playing a game that has land mines, bear traps, snakes in the grass, snipers in the tree's, enemies on the outside and inside, cointel pro and useful idiots. I hope he squashes anyone who threatens Rand like a bug. We are at war...Rand needs a General not a summer camp leader singing kumbaya around the camp fire.

Kokesh self destructed but I would of preferred he ended up on the bottom of Benton's shoe like the cockroach he was/is.

I know what you mean. It doesn't matter if he has to take money from MIC, give campaign donation money for bribes, kill innocent people. All that matters is that he fights for liberty, ending corruption in politics, and the end of fascism! /s

[A Son of Liberty]

God bless ya, Deb, et al.

On all other points, this thread is a fucking disgrace.

You can have your "liberty movement".

[JK/SEA]

God bless ya, Deb, et al.

On all other points, this thread is a fucking disgrace.

You can have your "liberty movement".

is there another one out there?

[Carlybee]

I hope for Benton to be mean as a two-headed rattlesnake to protect our pol...be it Rand or Ron....even if it's from themselves. .


Nannyism 101

[A Son of Liberty]

is there another one out there?

I'm not toeing the bullshit line that the likes of Collins and PO are advocating. I'm not Kokesh, but I'm more Kokesh than Benton by miles, and if that means I'm frog-marched out of this "movement" by the likes of them, they can kiss my ass.

This bullshit brow-beating of everyone who'd rather choose another foxhole to fight out of has gotten old. And quite frankly, anyone who thinks ANY liberty is going to be gained by playing ball with the PIGS in Washington DC are so utterly deluded that we may have less in common than I once thought.

And in my astute, well-formed and historically-based opinion, Rand Paul is going to "play ball" himself right into a corner out of which the absolute best, pie-in-the-sky, rainbows and lollipops out come anyone could hope for is 4 years somewhat akin to Reagan. Some folks around here might consider that a victory, but then they would apparently have NO IDEA where exactly we are on the road to tyranny.

So to hell with it. Now please, do accuse me of being a "divider". SMFH.

[Deborah K]

And it's things like that that make me appreciate Benton all the more. I hope for Benton to be mean as a two-headed rattlesnake to protect our pol...be it Rand or Ron....even if it's from themselves. I don't want Benton to be a nice guy who feels he has to stroke everyone's ego or be their friends. He's playing a game that has land mines, bear traps, snakes in the grass, snipers in the tree's, enemies on the outside and inside, cointel pro and useful idiots. I hope he squashes anyone who threatens Rand like a bug. We are at war...Rand needs a General not a summer camp leader singing kumbaya around the camp fire.

Kokesh self destructed but I would of preferred he ended up on the bottom of Benton's shoe like the cockroach he was/is.

And it's "things like this" that make me wanna re-post my last sentence in #58. UN - believable.

[cajuncocoa]

God bless ya, Deb, et al.

On all other points, this thread is a fucking disgrace.

You can have your "liberty movement".This thread certainly has exposed those who are co-opting the liberty movement for personal gain (aka "Ron Paul, Inc.")

[JK/SEA]

I'm not toeing the bullshit line that the likes of Collins and PO are advocating. I'm not Kokesh, but I'm more Kokesh than Benton by miles, and if that means I'm frog-marched out of this "movement" by the likes of them, they can kiss my ass.

This bullshit brow-beating of everyone who'd rather choose another foxhole to fight out of has gotten old. And quite frankly, anyone who thinks ANY liberty is going to be gained by playing ball with the PIGS in Washington DC are so utterly deluded that we may have less in common than I once thought.

And in my astute, well-formed and historically-based opinion, Rand Paul is going to "play ball" himself right into a corner out of which the absolute best, pie-in-the-sky, rainbows and lollipops out come anyone could hope for is 4 years somewhat akin to Reagan. Some folks around here might consider that a victory, but then they would apparently have NO IDEA where exactly we are on the road to tyranny.

So to hell with it. Now please, do accuse me of being a "divider". SMFH.

nope, no accusations from this corner.

[New York For Paul]

I met Dennis a few times. He travels around the country and was in New Hampshire in 2008. On the one hand he is a very tough guy, who will really fight over principles. Most tenacious. He scares elected officials and is a top gun lobbyist who can really give it to liberal candidates. I have not made a judgement, but I would not want to be in big fight with him, as Jesse Benton has found out.





I met Dennis face to face a couple of times. We traded some emails and spoke on the phone a few times too. We were working on the same project at the time. Although we did not work together directly, he was very helpful with a sub-project I was working on. From what I saw, he gave a lot more to the overall project than he got out of it. I don't know him well, but I think I know him well enough to say that he is an asset to the liberty movement.


It might seem that way on the surface. Who records conversations except machiavellian puppet masters, right? But is there a case where an honorable person might record a conversation? Have any of you had dealings with someone that mischaracterized what you said on the phone? I have. I haven't gone to the level of recording conversations, but sometimes I wish I had when I know that the other party is making claims that are not true about my statements.

I'm not in a position to defend Fusaro's recording or publishing of those phone calls. I don't know enough about the Fusaro-Benton history. But even if this turns out to be a bad move, I would characterize it as a mistake on Fusaro's part and not say the man himself is a snake. Until I know more, Dennis is ok in my book.

I also share his concerns about "Ron Paul, Inc."

[LibertyEagle]

And it's "things like this" that make me wanna re-post my last sentence in #58. UN - believable.

Deb, I actually totally agree with the first paragraph of what she wrote.

People have their own paths and they should take them. But, if we are to have success politically, it's going to be a tough road, and I just hope no one professing to be a part of this movement is going to work against that success, whether unknowingly or intentionally. Obviously, I'm not talking about you here. You have a heart of gold.

[cajuncocoa]

Deb, I actually totally agree with the first paragraph of what she wrote.

People have their own paths and they should take them. But, if we are to have success politically, it's going to be a tough road, and I just hope no one professing to be a part of this movement is going to work against that success, whether unknowingly or intentionally. Obviously, I'm not talking about you here. You have a heart of gold.
If the success has been built on a foundation of educating the American voters, there's not a damned thing anyone could do to tear it down; in fact it will continue to grow beyond our wildest dreams.

If it's built on a house of cards, there's no telling how things will turn out.

That said, and despite what you may believe about me, I will always be working for the advancement of true liberty.

[angelatc]

Kokesh self destructed but I would of preferred he ended up on the bottom of Benton's shoe like the cockroach he was/is.

Cockroachs scurry when the sunlight shines, which is what Benton is doing right now. He can only wish he was half the man Adam is.

[NewRightLibertarian]

Cockroachs scurry when the sunlight shines, which is what Benton is doing right now. He can only wish he was half the man Adam is.

Great point- When Adam was serving his country, Benton was shoving cupcakes down his throat. Now Benton's buffoonery shows itself again and people are still rushing to his defense. How many times does this blob have to show himself to be a disgrace to the liberty movement before people finally admit it? Are so many people around here really just mindless worshipers of power? The people who are making this about Fusaro's intentions rather than Benton's incompetence are pathetic as well. It really exposes people when you see them here using the same tricks that the political class and media scum use to conflate the issue.

[PatriotOne]

Cockroachs scurry when the sunlight shines, which is what Benton is doing right now. He can only wish he was half the man Adam is.

Pretty sure Benton wouldn't even wish to be a fingernail on Adam's pinky since all of the dumbass is looking at doing hard time in prison right now for what was surely nothing more than political theater with an unloaded shotgun and no trigger to rile up the useful idiots.

[JK/SEA]

Pretty sure Benton wouldn't even wish to be a fingernail on Adam's pinky since all of the dumbass is looking at doing hard time in prison right now for what was surely nothing more than political theater with an unloaded shotgun and no trigger to rile up the useful idiots.

keep talking asshole. I'm ready to send Adam more money BECAUSE of you.

[cajuncocoa]

Pretty sure Benton wouldn't even wish to be a fingernail on Adam's pinky since all of the dumbass is looking at doing hard time in prison right now for what was surely nothing more than political theater with an unloaded shotgun and no trigger to rile up the useful idiots.
I guess you have to resort to insults when that's the best argument you can offer.

Consider that many great people throughout history spent time in prison for causes they believed in, and those are the people who really fought against tyranny; few political figures can say that.

[FrankRep]

Time to let this thread die now.

This is not productive.

[JK/SEA]

Time to let this thread die now.

This is not productive.

yeah, thanks for your input.

[Carlybee]

Time to let this thread die now.

This is not productive.

Aka...the apologists are outnumbered.

[LibertyEagle]

First they took out Jack Hunter from Rand's campaign.

Next it appears that they have done massive damage to not only the relationship that Rand had with McConnell, but has also done massive damage to the entire structure that it took over 6 years to build in Iowa. To top it off, its looking like it has also stripped from Rand the possibility of having anyone in his presidential campaign that had been in Ron's. This has massive repercussions. Do you realize what this means? It would mean that he wouldn't have anyone around him that he both trusted and that also knew much of anything at all about campaigns. And the majority of that was done by someone who purports to be part of the liberty movement ... Dennis Fusaro.

He taped phone calls. How on earth anyone around here could agree with that is beyond me. He was trying to do damage and he has succeeded. Using the term, snake in the grass, is being kind.

The establishment is very happy indeed about all this and sadly, so are some on this website.

[PatriotOne]

keep talking asshole. I'm ready to send Adam more money BECAUSE of you.

Go for it. Not like you were going to do anything useful with it anyways. Adam wants ALL of your pot $.

[PatriotOne]

I guess you have to resort to insults when that's the best argument you can offer.

Consider that many great people throughout history spent time in prison for causes they believed in, and those are the people who really fought against tyranny; few political figures can say that.

And Adam isn't one of them.

[FrankRep]

Aka...the apologists are outnumbered.
AKA: Attacking each other isn't fixing the problems of the country.

[cajuncocoa]

And Adam isn't one of them.

Did he turn you down for a date or something?

[cajuncocoa]

Time to let this thread die now.

This is not productive.


Aka...the apologists are outnumbered.

LOL...sounds like it! :D

[JK/SEA]

Go for it. Not like you were going to do anything useful with it anyways. Adam wants ALL of your pot $.

spoken like a true marxist.

[LibertyEagle]

It might seem that way on the surface. Who records conversations except machiavellian puppet masters, right? But is there a case where an honorable person might record a conversation? Have any of you had dealings with someone that mischaracterized what you said on the phone? I have. I haven't gone to the level of recording conversations, but sometimes I wish I had when I know that the other party is making claims that are not true about my statements.

I'm not in a position to defend Fusaro's recording or publishing of those phone calls. I don't know enough about the Fusaro-Benton history. But even if this turns out to be a bad move, I would characterize it as a mistake on Fusaro's part and not say the man himself is a snake. Until I know more, Dennis is ok in my book.



He wouldn't have released it as he did, if he was trying to do good.


I also share his concerns about "Ron Paul, Inc."

It is something to keep abreast of, for sure. As long as we realize that it is not just the people working for Ron Paul directly that are being paid from this movement. Also add to it people like Rudowski and his crowd from We Are Change, Alex Jones, Thomas Woods, Adam Kokesh and countless others.

Ron chose the people who work for him. He obviously trusts them. The post up above when someone mentioned that the campaign would do their thing and Ron Paul would do his, is being completely overblown in my opinion. Clearly, they had different jobs. Ron went on interviews, did debates, etc., that the campaign scheduled and then, they did clean up on aisle 9, or tried to, when Ron didn't exactly come across like he intended. Their job was to try their best to market Ron Paul.

[LibertyEagle]

spoken like a true marxist.

WHAT???

[JK/SEA]

AKA: Attacking each other isn't fixing the problems of the country.

attacking provacateurs is....well....somewhat a gray area in here.

[PatriotOne]

Aka...the apologists are outnumbered.

Yeah but it's like Plants vs. Zombies. I've gotten past 4000 levels of zombies :D.

[PatriotOne]

Did he turn you down for a date or something?

So junior high.

[PatriotOne]

WHAT???

I second that. What??? He should stick to his usual argument of FUCK YOU! At least that makes some moronic sense.

[Lucille]

Go for it. Not like you were going to do anything useful with it anyways. Adam wants ALL of your pot $.

WTF is with the pot crack? Are you one of those social Marxist drug warriors or something? He'll be using it to pay a lawyer.

Benton pocketed (http://www.opensecrets.org/news/2013/02/ron-paul-network-was-lucrative-for-jesse-benton.html) more of my money than I care to think about. What a waste.

[FrankRep]

Take a break from fighting to read BenSwann.com's newest article:


BenSwann.com
Aug. 11, 2013


“Yes, Common Core is a federal takeover of education!”
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?423969-BenSwann-com-quot-Yes-Common-Core-is-a-Federal-Takeover-of-Education!-quot

[angelatc]

First they took out Jack Hunter from Rand's campaign.

Next it appears that they have done massive damage to not only the relationship that Rand had with McConnell, but has also done massive damage to the entire structure that it took over 6 years to build in Iowa. To top it off, its looking like it has also stripped from Rand the possibility of having anyone in his presidential campaign that had been in Ron's. This has massive repercussions. Do you realize what this means? It would mean that he wouldn't have anyone around him that he both trusted and that also knew much of anything at all about campaigns. And the majority of that was done by someone who purports to be part of the liberty movement ... Dennis Fusaro.

He taped phone calls. How on earth anyone around here could agree with that is beyond me. He was trying to do damage and he has succeeded. Using the term, snake in the grass, is being kind.

The establishment is very happy indeed about all this and sadly, so are some on this website.

benton brings this on himself.

[PatriotOne]

WTF is with the pot crack? Are you one of those social Marxist drug warriors or something? He'll be using it to pay a lawyer.


Not at all. I just don't find pot particularly useful either.

[Smitty]

It's been a while since I spent any time here, but I recall the abrupt shut down of the campaign and the questions it caused.

For me,..everything is much easier to understand when it's broken down to the elements.

A: McConnell will *never* be an advocate of the liberty movement,...ain't gonna happen. He's owned by interests which run contrary to personal liberties. Rand couldn't alter that even if he wanted to.

B: Jesse Benton works for McConnell.

I'm not sure what type of reasoning gymnastics must be applied at this point in order to believe that Jesse Benton is an asset to the liberty movement,..but I'm quite sure that I'm incapable of them.

,...and that's a good thing.

*ahem*,.."wake up",...remember?

[cajuncocoa]

So junior high.

Yes, your arguments certainly have been. I just thought there might be a reason Adam pushes your buttons so hard.

[angelatc]

Pretty sure Benton wouldn't even wish to be a fingernail on Adam's pinky since all of the dumbass is looking at doing hard time in prison right now for what was surely nothing more than political theater with an unloaded shotgun and no trigger to rile up the useful idiots.

like i said, adam is twice the man benton will ever be. Adam wasnt laundering camaign money. He was out in broad daylight, on public property exercising his rights while Benton was hanging out in the shadows with the grifters.

[angelatc]

Not at all. I just don't find pot particularly useful either.

So you dont care about the second amendment, and overturning prohibition isnt on your agenda either. Good to know!

[LibertyEagle]

It's been a while since I spent any time here, but I recall the abrupt shut down of the campaign and the questions it caused.

For me,..everything is much easier to understand when it's broken down to the elements.

A: McConnell will *never* be an advocate of the liberty movement,...ain't gonna happen. He's owned by interests which run contrary to personal liberties. Rand couldn't alter that even if he wanted to.

B: Jesse Benton works for McConnell.

I'm not sure what type of reasoning gymnastics must be applied at this point in order to believe that Jesse Benton is an asset to the liberty movement,..but I'm quite sure that I'm incapable of them.

,...and that's a good thing.

*ahem*,.."wake up",...remember?

Please think beyond a sign wave.

No one here thinks McConnell is a part of the liberty movement; HOWEVER, having the minority or majority leader of the Senate backing you if you run for President certainly isn't harmful to your success. Nor is it harmful to bringing in the donations you are going to need in order to have a chance in hell of getting nominated.

Rand is playing chess and too many here are playing checkers.

[Carlybee]

Shhhhhhh.....must....squash....dissent.