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Murray N Rothbard
07-29-2013, 11:53 AM
http://wtop.com/109/3404250/Activist-Adam-Kokesh-ordered-held-without-bond-in-DC

Looks like this time they're playing hardball, too.

JK/SEA
07-29-2013, 11:57 AM
This judge is about to get his ass handed to him.

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 12:01 PM
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1227440.1356542912!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/landscape_635/article-gregory-1226.jpg

donnay
07-29-2013, 12:03 PM
A political prisoner!


ETA: EVERYONE on this forum should be outraged--right, wrong or indifferent.


First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

~ Martin Niemöller

TonySutton
07-29-2013, 12:08 PM
no victim, no crime!

green73
07-29-2013, 12:13 PM
That Drudge is using his name and red I think really says something.

http://i.imgur.com/YX9Bn5v.png

JK/SEA
07-29-2013, 12:19 PM
Judge deny's bail then says 'thankyou for your service Mr. Kokesh'

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 12:26 PM
Of course he is.

And he'll be a forgotten unperson in six months, just like all the other politicals.

Poor brave bastard.


A political prisoner!


ETA: EVERYONE on this forum should be outraged--right, wrong or indifferent.


First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out--
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me--and there was no one left to speak for me.

~ Martin Niemöller

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 12:29 PM
Mass murderers aren't held without bond. They may have an un-payable bond set, but generally speaking they aren't held "without bond".

The state considers Kokesh a threat to its existence. What an honor.

I salute you, Mr. Kokesh.

WM_in_MO
07-29-2013, 12:33 PM
No victim, no crime!

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 12:37 PM
Mass murderers aren't held without bond. They may have an un-payable bond set, but generally speaking they aren't held "without bond".

The state considers Kokesh a threat to its existence. What an honor.

I salute you, Mr. Kokesh.

Amen: +1.

Isn't this a violation of the 8th amendment?

truthsaga
07-29-2013, 12:38 PM
It's funny how for years everyone talks about doing something and when someone pushes the envelope, we find reasons for it being "too much" or a majority of us simply ignore it.

Lucille
07-29-2013, 12:39 PM
Bastard. Adam is not a danger to the community.

http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/07/29/activist-adam-kokesh-facing-charges-for-carrying-gun-in-public/


I was sitting in the court room during Adam's preliminary hearing today. The Judge was 100% in the prosecutions pocket and wouldn't allow the defense attorney to ask the officer on the stand the simplest of questions. The Federal detention facility where Adam is being held also confiscated all of his legal documents and when the defense attorney brought that up the Judge said, "Well he can pay the court for a copy of today's record."

What a joke. Judge Sullivan is a puppet.

better-dead-than-fed
07-29-2013, 12:42 PM
Mass murderers aren't held without bond. They may have an un-payable bond set, but generally speaking they aren't held "without bond".

People are held without bond:


Dangerousness is the "likelihood" a person will commit a (violent) crime in the future. ... pre-crimes.... The Supreme Court has ruled ... if you're arrested on criminal charges, you can be denied bail on the grounds that you're "dangerous".

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?412611-Dangerousness-and-Pre-Crime

The Supreme Court ruled that this does not violate the 8th Amendment (http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/eighth_amendment), since no excessive bail was offered, let alone required. http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=5741581181224640770

ETA: The judge didn't just "find" that Kokesh would likely commit a crime if released. The judge "found" that Kokesh would likely commit unlawful violence if released.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 12:45 PM
It's funny how for years everyone talks about doing something and when someone pushes the envelope, we find reasons for it being "too much" or a majority of us simply ignore it.

Effort was there. Strategy sucked.

CaptUSA
07-29-2013, 12:47 PM
It's funny how for years everyone talks about doing something and when someone pushes the envelope, we find reasons for it being "too much" or a majority of us simply ignore it.I sense his strength and power growing. Here's hoping he can use it wisely.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 01:05 PM
"No Bail" is functionally equivalent to infinite bail. Infinite bail is excessive.

green73
07-29-2013, 01:09 PM
Effort was there. Strategy sucked.

I look forward to seeing how your efforts pan out.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 01:13 PM
People are held without bail... when they are considered a flight risk. Anyone with any sense can see that Kokesh isn't a flight risk. The state considers him a threat. That is why they are holding him without bond.

donnay
07-29-2013, 01:14 PM
Amendment I

Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the government for a redress of grievances.


Amendment II

A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, shall not be infringed.


Amendment IV

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Amendment V

No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on a presentment or indictment of a grand jury, except in cases arising in the land or naval forces, or in the militia, when in actual service in time of war or public danger; nor shall any person be subject for the same offense to be twice put in jeopardy of life or limb; nor shall be compelled in any criminal case to be a witness against himself, nor be deprived of life, liberty, or property, without due process of law; nor shall private property be taken for public use, without just compensation.

Amendment VIII

Excessive bail shall not be required, nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted.


They simply ignore all the amendments--because they are above the law!

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 01:17 PM
Bastard. Adam is not a danger to the community.


The Judge was 100% in the prosecutions pocket and wouldn't allow the defense attorney to ask the officer on the stand the simplest of questions. The Federal detention facility where Adam is being held also confiscated all of his legal documents and when the defense attorney brought that up the Judge said, "Well he can pay the court for a copy of today's record."

Glad the judge is non-biased and will allow Adam, along with his attorney, the chance to defend himself. :rolleyes:

HOLLYWOOD
07-29-2013, 01:22 PM
"In a Time of Universal Deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary Act...", George Orwell 1984

"National Security-Internal Security-Security... the age old cry of the oppressor." NSA software must of kicked-out an alert on Kokesh for "PRE-CRIMES"


You are NOT FREE, until we tell you, you are FREE...
You are FREE to do, WHAT WE TELL YOU...


You see, this monstrous rigged CON game is showing cracks, and that can't happen in the created illusion of freedom in America today. Activists like Kokesh are getting too much attention, exposing too much to the public... they are close to exposing the entire game of lies by the imperial empire. The Plutocracy will not allow such exposure.

PS: The abandonment of the RULE of LAW has brought, which is, how the justice system(JUST-US) treats you, not based on what you have done, as blind justice requires, but based almost entirely on who you are. This is the definition of Washington DC Judge Sullivan's abandonment of the Rule of Law.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 01:22 PM
I look forward to seeing how your efforts pan out.

So do I.

BuddyRey
07-29-2013, 01:25 PM
#FreeAdamKokesh !!!

Origanalist
07-29-2013, 01:28 PM
"In a Time of Universal Deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary Act...", George Orwell 1984

"National Security-Internal Security-Security... the age old cry of the oppressor." NSA software must of kicked-out an alert on Kokesh for "PRE-CRIMES"


You are NOT FREE, until we tell you, you are FREE...
You are FREE to do, WHAT WE TELL YOU...


You see, this monstrous rigged CON game is showing cracks, and that can't happen in the created illusion of freedom in America today. Activists like Kokesh are getting too much attention, exposing too much to the public... they are close to exposing the entire game of lies by the imperial empire. The Plutocracy will not allow such exposure.

PS: The abandonment of the RULE of LAW has brought, which is, the justice system(JUST-US) treats you, not based on what you have done, as blind justice requires, but based almost entirely on who you are. This is the definition of Washington DC Judge Sullivan's abandonment of the Rule of Law.

Absolutely correct. Peoples eyes are starting to be opened. They cannot allow that.

Lucille
07-29-2013, 01:28 PM
Doherty: Anarcho-Activist Adam Kokesh Held Without Bond for Filming Himself Performing an Utterly Harmless "Crime"
http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/29/anarcho-activist-adam-kokesh-held-withou


Anarcho-activist Adam Kokesh was ordered held without bond on charges of loading a forbidden shotgun in D.C. (an act he filmed as deliberate political theater), reports radio station WTOP in D.C.
[...]
Kokesh next court date is scheduled for Aug. 13.

I see the reasoning---God forbid this man be free to once again commit an act of journalism/activism involving a completely harmless "crime" (loading a banned weapon in a forbidden place--a weapon perfectly legal to use in many other places in the United States with little to no harm to anyone.)

His real crime of course is his claim that he has the right to perform harmless acts the state forbids. That's very difficult for agents of the state to forgive.

Mike Riggs on the pointlessly excessive assault on Kokesh's home (http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/10/swat-team-raids-home-of-libertarian-acti) for this "crime." Me on the theater of phony consent (http://reason.com/blog/2013/07/12/adam-kokesh-in-jail-the-theater-of-the-s) in his trial.

Brian4Liberty
07-29-2013, 01:30 PM
"I consider your client to be a very dangerous man," the judge said. "This is not a political statement."

Lol. We need Orwell's double-speak translator on that statement!

satchelmcqueen
07-29-2013, 01:39 PM
can someone pont me to where they proved he loaded live ammo?

Brian4Liberty
07-29-2013, 01:40 PM
A political prisoner!


Adam Kokesh, Political Prisoner - Day 20.

LibertyEagle
07-29-2013, 01:42 PM
can someone pont me to where they proved he loaded live ammo?

Didn't he admit it? I could be wrong.

LibertyEagle
07-29-2013, 01:45 PM
"In a Time of Universal Deceit, telling the truth becomes a revolutionary Act...", George Orwell 1984

"National Security-Internal Security-Security... the age old cry of the oppressor." NSA software must of kicked-out an alert on Kokesh for "PRE-CRIMES"


You are NOT FREE, until we tell you, you are FREE...
You are FREE to do, WHAT WE TELL YOU...


You see, this monstrous rigged CON game is showing cracks, and that can't happen in the created illusion of freedom in America today. Activists like Kokesh are getting too much attention, exposing too much to the public... they are close to exposing the entire game of lies by the imperial empire. The Plutocracy will not allow such exposure.

PS: The abandonment of the RULE of LAW has brought, which is, the justice system(JUST-US) treats you, not based on what you have done, as blind justice requires, but based almost entirely on who you are. This is the definition of Washington DC Judge Sullivan's abandonment of the Rule of Law.

Unfortunately, I don't think that stunt opened anyone's eyes, but those whose eyes are already opened. Most people are likely going to view Kokesh as a dangerous person. Remember that most don't live to keep up with legislation, or what the government is up to, in general. As long as WalMart is open and QVC is operating, they are all good.

Most people are not awakened by principle. They are awakened when something happens that threatens them directly. That is why the bad guys have done so well focusing on emotion. We need to learn that.

Lucille
07-29-2013, 01:54 PM
Unfortunately, I don't think that stunt opened anyone's eyes, but those whose eyes are already opened. Most people are likely going to view Kokesh as a dangerous person. Remember that most don't live to keep up with legislation, or what the government is up to, in general. As long as WalMart is open and QVC is operating, they are all good.

Most people are not awakened by principle. They are awakened when something happens that threatens them directly. That is why the bad guys have done so well focusing on emotion. We need to learn that.

Molyneux thinks it was too early for this, and mostly because the press controls the narrative and like you said, the people aren't awake yet and will buy that he is dangrous.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tWtdLMGo5s#

30:12 - Charles asks Stefan his thoughts on the Adam Kokesh situation.

green73
07-29-2013, 01:56 PM
So do I.

http://blogs.miaminewtimes.com/crossfade/chuck_norris_approved.jpg

jkr
07-29-2013, 02:01 PM
#FreeAdamKokesh

69360
07-29-2013, 02:02 PM
Didn't he admit it? I could be wrong.

Yes, he admitted to the crime in an interview along with the fact that he is on psychiatric disability from the military and I believe medicated for it as well.

He is held without bond because it is likely that he will continue to commit more crimes given his history and mental state.

Some of you will say the law he broke was unconstitutional and I'll agree, but it's still a law. We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

better-dead-than-fed
07-29-2013, 02:05 PM
People are held without bail... when they are considered a flight risk...

... or when they are found to be a "danger", which is different from flight-risk. See my previous post (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?422652-Adam-Kokesh-ordered-held-without-bond-in-D-C&p=5148105&viewfull=1#post5148105); or look directly in 18 USC 3142(e)(1) (http://www.gpo.gov/fdsys/granule/USCODE-2011-title18/USCODE-2011-title18-partII-chap207-sec3142/content-detail.html)

John Taylor
07-29-2013, 02:05 PM
I sense his strength and power growing. Here's hoping he can use it wisely.

Mr. Kokesh is sidelining himself. His efforts are laudable morally, but do little to advance the cause of effectuating limited government tangibly.

Mr. Amash is a far better exemplar of liberty minded professionals impacting the political and legal environments in more than a transitory manner.

John Taylor
07-29-2013, 02:12 PM
Yes, he admitted to the crime in an interview along with the fact that he is on psychiatric disability from the military and I believe medicated for it as well.

He is held without bond because it is likely that he will continue to commit more crimes given his history and mental state.

Some of you will say the law he broke was unconstitutional and I'll agree, but it's still a law. We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

You are correct 69360. As a criminal defense attorney, the fact of the matter is, bond/bail is set to ensure that an individual shows up for court, that they have an incentive not to flee, and that they are disabled and deterred from the commission of further crimes. Mr. Kokesh should not be held without bail/bond in my opinion, unless his alleged crime was a violent one, or if he has demonstrated an unwillingness to show up for court, or if he has demonstrated a willingness to continue in breaking the law while out on pre-trial services. Bond/bail is not to be punitive, but neither is its amount determined reasonable based on a defendant's ability (or inability) to pay it.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 02:18 PM
Mr. Kokesh is sidelining himself. His efforts are laudable morally, but do little to advance the cause of effectuating limited government tangibly.

Mr. Amash is a far better exemplar of liberty minded professionals impacting the political and legal environments in more than a transitory manner.

Kokesh did try to run for office, but got sidelined by the New Mexico GOP. With that said, I kinda agree with you.

69360
07-29-2013, 02:19 PM
You are correct 69360. As a criminal defense attorney, the fact of the matter is, bond/bail is set to ensure that an individual shows up for court, that they have an incentive not to flee, and that they are disabled and deterred from the commission of further crimes. Mr. Kokesh should not be held without bail/bond in my opinion, unless his alleged crime was a violent one, or if he has demonstrated an unwillingness to show up for court, or if he has demonstrated a willingness to continue in breaking the law while out on pre-trial services. Bond/bail is not to be punitive, but neither is its amount determined reasonable based on a defendant's ability (or inability) to pay it.

I believe he was released on bond or OR from his arrest in Philly last month, not sure how that case ended. I think the court is justified in it's belief he will continue to break the law given his prior actions, total lack of cooperation or participation in prior proceedings and his mental state.

At first I figured he might be cointelpro with all the crazy actions, but it seems like he just need mental health treatment now.

69360
07-29-2013, 02:20 PM
Kokesh did try to run for office, but got sidelined by the New Mexico GOP. With that said, I kinda agree with you.

He ran in a solidly blue district. He had no chance in hell in the general anyway. It was all for show.

Brian4Liberty
07-29-2013, 02:21 PM
Some of you will say the law he broke was unconstitutional and I'll agree, but it's still a law. We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

One procedure is to get the law changed. The other is to "commit" the crime, and then take the case as high up the chain as you can. Is there some other option?

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 02:23 PM
We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws ...

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRQHjJqGI4Rf0eUCRl96FcDqdKjJ9yrX 8-nC6orqqrjXmlGhZkL

But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 02:23 PM
BTW I'm already starting to read moles (paid ones too) on other political sites attempting to tie Adam Kokesh to Rand Paul (since he endorsed him long prior to this circus).

better-dead-than-fed
07-29-2013, 02:25 PM
You are correct 69360. As a criminal defense attorney, the fact of the matter is, bond/bail is set to ensure that an individual shows up for court, that they have an incentive not to flee, and that they are disabled and deterred from the commission of further crimes.

Not true. Pre-trial detention may not be used for the purpose of disabling future non-violent crimes. Detention may only be used if the court finds a likelihood of future violent crimes (or flight-risk). See Salerno.


Mr. Kokesh should not be held without bail/bond in my opinion, unless his alleged crime was a violent one, or if he has demonstrated an unwillingness to show up for court, or if he has demonstrated a willingness to continue in breaking the law while out on pre-trial services.

Not true. Pre-trial detention may not be used for the purpose of disabling future non-violent crimes.

better-dead-than-fed
07-29-2013, 02:42 PM
Some of you will say the law he broke was unconstitutional and I'll agree, but it's still a law.

You type that all you like, but that will not make it true:


a legislative act contrary to the constitution is not law

http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=9834052745083343188

What do you hope to accomplish by persistently misstating the law? Or is this some sort of mental disorder on your part? Why don't you seek psychiatric treatment for it?


We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

You have your own personal procedures, but that doesn't make them good ideas for anyone else to follow; and your point of view is based in a clear misunderstanding of the law: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?421313-Kokesh-granted-bond-Video/page3&p=5127119#post5127119

donnay
07-29-2013, 02:43 PM
I believe he was released on bond or OR from his arrest in Philly last month, not sure how that case ended. I think the court is justified in it's belief he will continue to break the law given his prior actions, total lack of cooperation or participation in prior proceedings and his mental state.

At first I figured he might be cointelpro with all the crazy actions, but it seems like he just need mental health treatment now.


It's so good to see we have forum psychiatrists on hand to help us understand Adam's problems. :rolleyes:

The British called Samuel Adams a big troublemaker, and they were right. They called him the most dangerous man in Massachusetts! If he were caught by the British he would have been hung in the town square for being a leader of men and a great revolutionary!

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 02:45 PM
Mr. Kokesh is sidelining himself. His efforts are laudable morally, but do little to advance the cause of effectuating limited government tangibly.

Mr. Amash is a far better exemplar of liberty minded professionals impacting the political and legal environments in more than a transitory manner.

Mr. Amash, et al, are attempting to sweep back the ocean with a broom.

Mr. Kokesh has turned his back on the ocean.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 02:47 PM
We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

What world are you living in?

devil21
07-29-2013, 02:57 PM
People are held without bond:



http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?412611-Dangerousness-and-Pre-Crime

The Supreme Court ruled that this does not violate the 8th Amendment (http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/eighth_amendment), since no excessive bail was offered, let alone required. http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=5741581181224640770

ETA: The judge didn't just "find" that Kokesh would likely commit a crime if released. The judge "found" that Kokesh would likely commit unlawful violence if released.

As you probably know, the Feds are also a lot more anal about bail/bond issues than local and state courts. They like "pre-release conditions" more than plain monetary bonds and if they can get away with holding someone without bail they'll do it.

Origanalist
07-29-2013, 02:57 PM
It's so good to see we have forum psychiatrists on hand to help us understand Adam's problems. :rolleyes:

The British called Samuel Adams a big troublemaker, and they were right. They called him the most dangerous man in Massachusetts! If he were caught by the British he would have been hung in the town square for being a leader of men and a great revolutionary!

Here's to the rabble-rousers....http://www.iboston.org/mcp.php?pid=samAdams&laf=hpe

twomp
07-29-2013, 03:04 PM
What world are you living in?

A world where he believes that government will fix the problems that they themselves created. A world where we are FREE. Free to do whatever the government allows us to do.

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 03:52 PM
At first I figured he might be cointelpro with all the crazy actions, but it seems like he just need mental health treatment now.

Yup, just another nut...leave him rot.

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 04:00 PM
Most people are not awakened by principle. They are awakened when something happens that threatens them directly. That is why the bad guys have done so well focusing on emotion. We need to learn that.

Yup, because most people do not want freedom.

They hate it, in fact.

We continue to ignore this key fact.

Working Poor
07-29-2013, 04:01 PM
I wish Adam all the best I wiah he was smarter than the system.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 04:02 PM
Yup, just another nut...leave him rot.

:rolleyes: Snark aside, AF, he's obv cuckoo. Who's he, thinkin' he can just load a shotgun in Washington, D.C.? Cuckoo, with a side of criminally dangerous, thankyouverymuch. Anyone who loads shotguns in WDC should be locked up... and throw away the key while yer at it, boyo.

We can all sleep safe tonight, in the quiet comfort that a vicious gun-loader ain't getting back out on the streets on some bogus bond set by a gun-nut judge. Streets are safer, I tell ya.

;)

It's like screaming at people behind bullet-proof glass sometimes...

69360
07-29-2013, 04:08 PM
You type that all you like, but that will not make it true:



http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=9834052745083343188

What do you hope to accomplish by persistently misstating the law? Or is this some sort of mental disorder on your part? Why don't you seek psychiatric treatment for it?



You have your own personal procedures, but that doesn't make them good ideas for anyone else to follow; and your point of view is based in a clear misunderstanding of the law: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?421313-Kokesh-granted-bond-Video/page3&p=5127119#post5127119

Why don't you admit that you pull the same sort of stunts Kokesh does and get yourself locked up by the feds on a regular basis as well. You know so we have a basis to judge your perspective here.


It's so good to see we have forum psychiatrists on hand to help us understand Adam's problems. :rolleyes:

The British called Samuel Adams a big troublemaker, and they were right. They called him the most dangerous man in Massachusetts! If he were caught by the British he would have been hung in the town square for being a leader of men and a great revolutionary!

I don't claim to know WHAT his problems are, but he's publicly admitted that he has them and is currently getting disability and care for them from the VA. Hopefully he gets better. He's pulled small scale publicity stunts so far, nothing that deserves mention in the same sentence as Adams.

69360
07-29-2013, 04:10 PM
Yup, just another nut...leave him rot.

In jail no. A few months ago I would have thought that. But now I think he should be in a VA hospital or something like that until he sorts himself out.

He's messed up his future pretty badly now with multiple felonies and federal charges. Hopefully he can get his life back together.

PreDeadMan
07-29-2013, 04:35 PM
fuck the law it's just an opinion with a gun.... bad laws should be broken and those that defend them are just as bad as the king's guardsmen who enforce the tyranny.

devil21
07-29-2013, 04:38 PM
In jail no. A few months ago I would have thought that. But now I think he should be in a VA hospital or something like that until he sorts himself out.

He's messed up his future pretty badly now with multiple felonies and federal charges. Hopefully he can get his life back together.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BcLZNpRtfBo

torchbearer
07-29-2013, 04:42 PM
now?
:mad:

donnay
07-29-2013, 04:45 PM
I don't claim to know WHAT his problems are, but he's publicly admitted that he has them and is currently getting disability and care for them from the VA. Hopefully he gets better. He's pulled small scale publicity stunts so far, nothing that deserves mention in the same sentence as Adams.

Fallujah (http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/toxic-legacy-of-us-assault-on-fallujah-worse-than-hiroshima-2034065.html) was his problem.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=adzZQWkDLOQ

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 04:53 PM
In jail no. A few months ago I would have thought that. But now I think he should be in a VA hospital or something like that until he sorts himself out.

He's messed up his future pretty badly now with multiple felonies and federal charges. Hopefully he can get his life back together.

Listen to yourself, for cryin' out loud... he messed up his future!? He racked a shell, for gawd's sake.

tommyrp12
07-29-2013, 04:53 PM
.......

moostraks
07-29-2013, 04:57 PM
Listen to yourself, for cryin' out loud... he messed up his future!? He racked a shell, for gawd's sake.
But, but, he disobeyed laws and should have paid the gatekeepers their blood money before he chose to go against one of their "laws" put there to keep us "safe". Therefore Kokesh is showing his insanity by failing to comply with any and all laws put forth for us mundanes. /sarc

green73
07-29-2013, 04:58 PM
BTW I'm already starting to read moles (paid ones too) on other political sites attempting to tie Adam Kokesh to Rand Paul (since he endorsed him long prior to this circus).

OMG OMG OMG

69360
07-29-2013, 05:00 PM
Listen to yourself, for cryin' out loud... he messed up his future!? He racked a shell, for gawd's sake.

Yes, he's messed up his future. His prospects for employment are bleak with multiple felonies on his record. He's committed and admitted to a federal offense. He's looking at years in federal prison and severely reduced chances at a future upon release as a con. That's if the Feds even let him go. Any reasonable person can see that.

I mean right now he is not working and living off the tit of the same government he hates so much.

Lucille
07-29-2013, 05:01 PM
https://www.facebook.com/ADAMVSTHEMAN/posts/10151517971021260


PRELIMINARY HEARING: DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA VS ADAM KOKESH
DISTRICT OF COLUMBIA SUPERIOR COURT
JULY 29, 2013 09:00
LIZ@ADAMVSTHEMAN.COM

The courtroom this morning was dimmed for Adam Kokesh's first hearing after he was taken into Federal custody on Friday, July 26. As Adam was brought in in front of the judge in an orange prison jumpsuit and shackles, Adam's attorney, Peter Cooper, immediately asked why the Federal Marshals had confiscated Adam's notes. The judge replied that Mr. Cooper could "buy the transcripts, if he wished". The tone for this case thus set, the prosecution brought forward Detective Robert Freeman to testify regarding the affidavit that he presented to Judge Frederick Sullivan. The affidavit for this case is in addition to the sealed affidavit that allowed a coalition of federal thugs to perform a raid on Adam's Herndon residence three weeks ago.

The contents of Detective Freeman's affidavit, accepted today, were not read verbatim, but did specifically mention the YouTube video that Adam posted on the morning of July 4. The sealed affidavit from the Virginia case has not yet been opened.

The tone throughout the hearing was terse, and the prosecuting attorney repeatedly objected to each question that Adam's lawyer posed, citing 'discovery' as the reason why any question whatsoever would be absolutely invalid. It seems as if the court has at least one confidential informant that will see the stand as the case progresses. The judge's attitude went hand-in-hand with the prosecution, portraying Mr. Cooper's questions as insolent and repeatedly threatening to end the hearing early.

Adam's lawyer pressed the witness to describe the shotgun that was found in Herndon, and the witness could not name the model, but stated that it was the same shape and color as the one portrayed in the video. When asked if he knew what a green screen was, Detective Freeman noted that he "was not a video forensics analyst". Judge Sullivan stated that it was 'ridiculous to question' the authenticity of the video, because Adam had 'racked a shotgun for all the world to see'.

Mr. Cooper's questions laid bare the gaping holes in the warrant and the case to light, though it remains to be seen whether the facts will overcome the overwhelming bias that Judge Sullivan showed in the opening act of this high-profile case.

The attorneys for the day's other cases in the front row of the courtroom pulled up Adam's YouTube channel on their mobile devices and cracked jokes about Adam's guilt. Adam has been charged with carrying a firearm outside his home or office in the District of Columbia, which carries a sentence of up to 5 years.

The tension in the courtroom came to a head when the Judge shouted that he "WOULD NOT ENGAGE IN RIDICULOUSNESS" after accusing Mr. Cooper of "wasting his time" with "ridiculous questions". He scoffed at Adam's attorney. None of that mattered though as Adam was denied bond for this case. The judge said that Adam was a flight risk, and because he is outspoken political activist who was found with weapons, he is also considered dangerous to the public. The judge also noted that Adam had a previous minor marijuana charge from June 8, 2013.

Adam will remain a political prisoner without bond until his felony status hearing on August 13. The AVTM team is continually raising funds for Adam's legal and operational expenses at www.adamvstheman.com/invest. and we have raised approximately $17,000 of our goal of at least $45,000. Please donate as much as you responsibly can in order to make sure that Adam keeps his freedom. We will be releasing further updates as they develop. Thank you immensely for your support.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 05:02 PM
But, but, he disobeyed laws and should have paid the gatekeepers their blood money before he chose to go against one of their "laws" put there to keep us "safe". Therefore Kokesh is showing his insanity by failing to comply with any and all laws put forth for us mundanes. /sarc

I can't wait for the debates around here once all the thought-crime legislation is passed.

"He had it coming. Everyone knows you don't speak negatively about Big Brother, comrade... now he's an unperson."

green73
07-29-2013, 05:03 PM
Some of you will say the law he broke was unconstitutional and I'll agree, but it's still a law. We have procedures to seek redress for unconstitutional laws but he took it upon himself to break the law instead and is now suffering the consequences.

Damn that Rosa Parks.

torchbearer
07-29-2013, 05:04 PM
one confidential informant that will see the stand as the case progresses-
what is the life expectancy of snitches?

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 05:05 PM
Yes, he's messed up his future. His prospects for employment are bleak with multiple felonies on his record. He's committed and admitted to a federal offense. He's looking at years in federal prison and severely reduced chances at a future upon release as a con. That's if the Feds even let him go. Any reasonable person can see that.

I mean right now he is not working and living off the tit of the same government he hates so much.

THERE ALREADY IS NO FUTURE.

green73
07-29-2013, 05:06 PM
Yes, he's messed up his future. His prospects for employment are bleak with multiple felonies on his record. He's committed and admitted to a federal offense. He's looking at years in federal prison and severely reduced chances at a future upon release as a con. That's if the Feds even let him go. Any reasonable person can see that.

I mean right now he is not working and living off the tit of the same government he hates so much.

You are such a sad, sad member of this place.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 05:06 PM
Damn that Rosa Parks.

She had it coming.

Now - the rest of you - sit down, shut up, and do as you're told.

69360
07-29-2013, 05:07 PM
Damn that Rosa Parks.

I'm sure she knew the penalty for her actions. What she did was far less serious than multiple federal offenses. Kokesh has really screwed up his life here.

69360
07-29-2013, 05:08 PM
You are such a sad, sad member of this place.

I'm actually really satisfied with my life thanks.

green73
07-29-2013, 05:09 PM
I'm actually really satisfied with my life thanks.

Sure. So are both the George Bushes.

green73
07-29-2013, 05:11 PM
I'm sure she knew the penalty for her actions. What she did was far less serious than multiple federal offenses. Kokesh has really screwed up his life here.

He did it for us all, ya ingrate.

69360
07-29-2013, 05:12 PM
He did it for us all, ya ingrate.

I do not believe that is true.

green73
07-29-2013, 05:14 PM
I do not believe that is true.

Yes, of course, you being a bullshit monger.

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 05:19 PM
People can reasonably dispute the utility of Kokesh's actions, but the suggestion that he had it coming, or that he somehow screwed up his life is disingenuous, at best. Your Rosa Parks analogy, green, is spot on.

fr33
07-29-2013, 05:33 PM
Nobody to blame but the jackboots who arrested him and are charging him with "crimes".

And it sounds like they are getting scared...

JK/SEA
07-29-2013, 05:44 PM
Adam Kokesh donation receipt.

Item Description Qty Taxable Unit Price Item Total
AVTM3TEMP TEMPORARY ORDER/DONATION FORM 1 N US $100.00 US $100.00

DID AND DONE.

Donation dedicated to 69360.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 05:57 PM
Molyneux thinks it was too early for this, and mostly because the press controls the narrative and like you said, the people aren't awake yet and will buy that he is dangrous.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_tWtdLMGo5s#

30:12 - Charles asks Stefan his thoughts on the Adam Kokesh situation.

That's because Stefan is our enemy and should be treated accordingly.He opposes

He opposes Ron Paul, he opposes civil disobedience, he gets up in front of a pro-liberty audience and tells them not to vote for people like Ron Paul, exc.

At the best, he's an absolute, total idiot.




I believe he was released on bond or OR from his arrest in Philly last month, not sure how that case ended. I think the court is justified in it's belief he will continue to break the law given his prior actions, total lack of cooperation or participation in prior proceedings and his mental state.

At first I figured he might be cointelpro with all the crazy actions, but it seems like he just need mental health treatment now.

:rolleyes:

You're a shill for the establishment too. I recommend you leave.

-1.


He ran in a solidly blue district. He had no chance in hell in the general anyway. It was all for show.

And let me guess, you wouldn't have given him your vote?


http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRQHjJqGI4Rf0eUCRl96FcDqdKjJ9yrX 8-nC6orqqrjXmlGhZkL

But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such government, and to provide new guards for their future security.

Amen brother! +1.

BTW I'm already starting to read moles (paid ones too) on other political sites attempting to tie Adam Kokesh to Rand Paul (since he endorsed him long prior to this circus).

Rand Paul is trying to win in the political process, so distancing him from Kokesh is probably wise.


Mr. Amash, et al, are attempting to sweep back the ocean with a broom.

Mr. Kokesh has turned his back on the ocean.

I don't exactly see either strategy working, but at the same time, not trying is just letting your enemies win. Which is a bad idea.

Yup, because most people do not want freedom.

They hate it, in fact.

We continue to ignore this key fact.

True.

:rolleyes: Snark aside, AF, he's obv cuckoo. Who's he, thinkin' he can just load a shotgun in Washington, D.C.? Cuckoo, with a side of criminally dangerous, thankyouverymuch. Anyone who loads shotguns in WDC should be locked up... and throw away the key while yer at it, boyo.

We can all sleep safe tonight, in the quiet comfort that a vicious gun-loader ain't getting back out on the streets on some bogus bond set by a gun-nut judge. Streets are safer, I tell ya.

;)

It's like screaming at people behind bullet-proof glass sometimes...

It does indeed feel like screaming at people behind bullet proof glass...

The worst is when people seriously try to tell me Mitt Romney was the "Lesser of two evils" and that I'm even delusional for not thinking so. Its ridiculous.

In jail no. A few months ago I would have thought that. But now I think he should be in a VA hospital or something like that until he sorts himself out.

He's messed up his future pretty badly now with multiple felonies and federal charges. Hopefully he can get his life back together.

No he doesn't. He's a hero of the liberty movement with the guts to commit civil disobedience. Not a "criminal." Shut up and stop defending our enemies. I'll likely be back to neg rep this one later.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 06:02 PM
Bryan, can we force him to change his username to 666?

Either way, that's what I'm going to refer to him to from now on.

This is the idiot that neg repped me for "Not showing adequate respect" to the military. Yet he shows this kind of disrespect to liberty activist Adam Kokesh. Its ridiculous.

I guess if you murder people for Uncle Sam, you deserve respect, but if you dare go against him, you don't...

This thread is very illuminating when it comes to who the real friends of liberty are. 666 is not, and neither is Failineux...

A Son of Liberty
07-29-2013, 06:21 PM
That's because Stefan is our enemy and should be treated accordingly.He opposes

He opposes Ron Paul, he opposes civil disobedience, he gets up in front of a pro-liberty audience and tells them not to vote for people like Ron Paul, exc.

At the best, he's an absolute, total idiot.

There are plenty of things one could say about Molyneux, but that he is an enemy of the liberty movement is not one. He is opposed to the state, and is fairly eloquent in defense of his views.


I don't exactly see either strategy working, but at the same time, not trying is just letting your enemies win. Which is a bad idea.

Neither strategy will work, but turning your back on it is less futile, and is empowering.


The worst is when people seriously try to tell me Mitt Romney was the "Lesser of two evils" and that I'm even delusional for not thinking so. Its ridiculous.

Yet, in many ways it is the same argument you use above.

TheTexan
07-29-2013, 06:47 PM
One procedure is to get the law changed. The other is to "commit" the crime, and then take the case as high up the chain as you can. Is there some other option?

When constitutional law is ignored and discarded, as it is today, there does exist another option for redress, but its generally considered more of a duty, than an option

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 06:48 PM
In jail no. A few months ago I would have thought that. But now I think he should be in a VA hospital or something like that until he sorts himself out.

He's messed up his future pretty badly now with multiple felonies and federal charges. Hopefully he can get his life back together.

If anybody thinks that we are going to find our way out of this nightmare without serious risk to life, limb and "future", they are wrong.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 06:54 PM
There are plenty of things one could say about Molyneux, but that he is an enemy of the liberty movement is not one. He is opposed to the state, and is fairly eloquent in defense of his views.



I don't believe him. Controlled op., IMO.


Neither strategy will work, but turning your back on it is less futile, and is empowering.


How is it any less futile?

Yet, in many ways it is the same argument you use above.

In what way? I'm pretty sure you too supported Dr. Paul and did not support Mitt Romney.

I'm not an anarchist anyways, I'm a minarchist (As my sig says) but even if I were a full-blooded ancap, there's still a difference between a lesser good and a lesser evil.

If anybody thinks that we are going to find our way out of this nightmare without serious risk to life, limb and "future", they are wrong.

Unfortunately, I don't think the bolded portion actually belongs.

69360
07-29-2013, 07:33 PM
And let me guess, you wouldn't have given him your vote?

Back then before he went totally off the reservation? If I lived in his district then I think I would have. I wasn't a fan of his style, but mostly agreed with him on issues. He had zero chance of winning a blue district anyway. The way he behaves now, no absolutely not.

69360
07-29-2013, 07:41 PM
If anybody thinks that we are going to find our way out of this nightmare without serious risk to life, limb and "future", they are wrong.

I'm not so worried yet, I have things that concern me, but all I really want is to be left alone. Where I am now is fine nobody bothers me and won't for the foreseeable future. I moved to where I am for that reason. If I can no longer live my life the way I want to I'll reevaluate it then. I'm proactive, rather than complain I will take action to remove myself from bad situations.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 07:48 PM
You are such a sad, sad member of this place.


Sure. So are both the George Bushes.

Indeed.


People can reasonably dispute the utility of Kokesh's actions, but the suggestion that he had it coming, or that he somehow screwed up his life is disingenuous, at best. Your Rosa Parks analogy, green, is spot on.

Indeed.

Back then before he went totally off the reservation? If I lived in his district then I think I would have. I wasn't a fan of his style, but mostly agreed with him on issues. He had zero chance of winning a blue district anyway. The way he behaves now, no absolutely not.

You're a statist mole...

AuH20
07-29-2013, 07:50 PM
I'm not so worried yet, I have things that concern me, but all I really want is to be left alone. Where I am now is fine nobody bothers me and won't for the foreseeable future. I moved to where I am for that reason. If I can no longer live my life the way I want to I'll reevaluate it then. I'm proactive, rather than complain I will take action to remove myself from bad situations.

You can't be that optimistic?

69360
07-29-2013, 07:54 PM
You're a statist mole...

Hey if calling people names floats your boat, then great. I probably agree with you and Kokesh 90% on issues. I just totally disagree with his methods. It makes us look very bad and you are wrong if you think he hasn't badly damaged his future.

I hope he gets the help he needs. I thought he was cointel or a grandstanding jackass, but I was wrong, it's pretty obvious now he's just a guy fighting his demons in a very public way.

69360
07-29-2013, 07:56 PM
You can't be that optimistic?

I live in Maine in the woods, things are fine here. Take it anyway you like, but I'm hundreds of miles from a major city and in the whitest state in the country with vast natural resources and an almost unguarded border to get out if shtf. So yeah, I'm not so worried, yet. It could change.

JK/SEA
07-29-2013, 07:58 PM
Hey if calling people names floats your boat, then great. I probably agree with you and Kokesh 90% on issues. I just totally disagree with his methods. It makes us look very bad and you are wrong if you think he hasn't badly damaged his future.

I hope he gets the help he needs. I thought he was cointel or a grandstanding jackass, but I was wrong, it's pretty obvious now he's just a guy fighting his demons in a very public way.

well if you go with Adam 90% of the time, perhaps you could tone down your negative comments about him and find topics that really matter to you...like Weiner.

69360
07-29-2013, 08:00 PM
well if you go with Adam 90% of the time, perhaps you could tone down your negative comments about him and find topics that really matter to you...like Weiner.

Agreeing on issues is one thing and taking actions that I think damage causes I believe in are another. I think what he does harms chances of things I want happening. I still believe in the process, it's damaged but not a total loss yet.

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 08:02 PM
I'm not so worried yet, I have things that concern me, but all I really want is to be left alone. Where I am now is fine nobody bothers me and won't for the foreseeable future.

You need to work on the "foreseeable" future by being a little more worried, now.


"All I really wanted was to to be left alone."

Three a day. If you don't support others in their attempt to draw a line in their sand how long until the line reaches yours? Three a day.

JK/SEA
07-29-2013, 08:02 PM
Agreeing on issues is one thing and taking actions that I think damage causes I believe in are another. I think what he does harms chances of things I want happening. I still believe in the process, it's damaged but not a total loss yet.


one word.....Weiner.

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 08:06 PM
I hope he gets the help he needs.

I hope you do too. Like a SWAT raid on the wrong address. Your address.

69360
07-29-2013, 08:08 PM
You need to work on the "foreseeable" future by being a little more worried, now.



Three a day. If you don't support others in their attempt to draw a line in their sand how long until the line reaches yours? Three a day.


I live in Maine in the woods, things are fine here. Take it anyway you like, but I'm hundreds of miles from a major city and in the whitest state in the country with vast natural resources and an almost unguarded border to get out if shtf. So yeah, I'm not so worried, yet. It could change.

Pretty much same answer

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 08:11 PM
It would be one thing if 666 didn't agree with Kokesh's strategy, but he's actually defending the LEOs and the government.

He's our enemy.

Origanalist
07-29-2013, 08:15 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=WbrjRKB586s

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 08:23 PM
I'm not so worried yet, I have things that concern me, but all I really want is to be left alone. Where I am now is fine nobody bothers me and won't for the foreseeable future. I moved to where I am for that reason. If I can no longer live my life the way I want to I'll reevaluate it then. I'm proactive, rather than complain I will take action to remove myself from bad situations.

Brother, I understand...I'm off by myself up to the hills of New Hampshire. I could, and would love to do nothing more than retreat and live my life comfortably up in the hills of God's Country. I pray for the day.

But I must be "proactive" myself, in my own way.

I have to worry, I have no choice but to do everything I can am brave enough to undertake, and to support, as much as I possibly can, those that are brave enough to risk it all, in any attempt to bring hurt to The System.

I have to worry about what kind of world I am leaving to my children.

I do not want them to live in a prison planet, as I'm sure you don't want yours to.

So I support Adam, even if he may be a little off kilter.

I support Rand, even though he has pissed me off by playing the "political game" closer to the breast than I care for.

I support Alex Jones, even if some find him to be offensive.

I support Glenn Greenwald, even though he may very well be a socialist.

See what I'm getting at?

69360
07-29-2013, 08:24 PM
It would be one thing if 666 didn't agree with Kokesh's strategy, but he's actually defending the LEOs and the government.

He's our enemy.

If we don't respect the rule of law, our society will break down into anarchy. The goes for government officials AND us as citizens. Nobody is above the law and can take the law into their own hands. If you don't agree with a law, work to change it. If that doesn't work remove yourself from the area with tge law you don't like. I don't see the citizens of DC protesting lack of open carry ever. So I have to assume they agree with that law. I would never live there since I don't.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 08:26 PM
If we don't respect the rule of law, our society will break down into anarchy. The goes for government officials AND us as citizens. Nobody is above the law and can take the law into their own hands.

The law is very selective if you haven't noticed of late. I'm a rule of law guy and what we have today is by no means Rule of Law.

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 08:27 PM
Pretty much same answer

Not so worried yet? Give it time. It's coming.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 08:27 PM
Brother, I understand...I'm off by myself up to the hills of New Hampshire.

But I have to be "proactive" myself.

I have to worry, I have no choice but to do everything I can am brave enough to undertake, and to support, as much as I possibly can, those that are brave enough to risk it all, in any attempt to bring hurt to The System.

I have to worry about what kind of world I am leaving to my children.

I do not want them to live in a prison planet, as I'm sure you don't want your to.

So I support Adam, even if he may be a little off kilter.

I support Rand, even though he has pissed me off by playing the "political game" closer to the breast than I care for.

I support Alex Jones, even if some find him to be offensive.

I support Glenn Greenwald, even though he may very well be a socialist.

See what I'm getting at?

+1.


If we don't respect the rule of law, our society will break down into anarchy. The goes for government officials AND us as citizens. Nobody is above the law and can take the law into their own hands.

Our society is already broken, and our government is a gang of thugs. You haven't been paying attention, have you?

Or you're just comfortable because its always someone else who suffers, rather than you.

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 08:29 PM
I live in Maine in the woods, things are fine here. Take it anyway you like, but I'm hundreds of miles from a major city and in the whitest state in the country with vast natural resources and an almost unguarded border to get out if shtf. So yeah, I'm not so worried, yet. It could change.

LOL - Yah, until the FedCoats decide tomorrow morning to move 10,000 Somalian refugees right next door.

Like they did in Lewiston.

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 08:32 PM
If we don't respect the rule of law, our society will break down into anarchy. The goes for government officials AND us as citizens. Nobody is above the law and can take the law into their own hands. If you don't agree with a law, work to change it. If that doesn't work remove yourself from the area with tge law you don't like. I don't see the citizens of DC protesting lack of open carry ever. So I have to assume they agree with that law. I would never live there since I don't.

That is anarchy, and why I have yet to go "full an-cap".

The people mob up and enforce the edicts they desire through a local warlord.

To hell with the rights of any minority voices.

Mob rule.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 08:37 PM
That is anarchy, and why I have yet to go "full an-cap".

The people mob up and enforce the edicts they desire through a local warlord.

To hell with the rights of any minority voices.

Mob rule.

Yeah, that's one reason I'm a minarchist myself.

KEEF
07-29-2013, 08:42 PM
Brother, I understand...I'm off by myself up to the hills of New Hampshire. I could, and would love to do nothing more than retreat and live my life comfortably up in the hills of God's Country. I pray for the day.

But I must be "proactive" myself, in my own way.

I have to worry, I have no choice but to do everything I can am brave enough to undertake, and to support, as much as I possibly can, those that are brave enough to risk it all, in any attempt to bring hurt to The System.

I have to worry about what kind of world I am leaving to my children.

I do not want them to live in a prison planet, as I'm sure you don't want yours to.

So I support Adam, even if he may be a little off kilter.

I support Rand, even though he has pissed me off by playing the "political game" closer to the breast than I care for.

I support Alex Jones, even if some find him to be offensive.

I support Glenn Greenwald, even though he may very well be a socialist.

See what I'm getting at?
Spot on AF +rep

Edit:
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Anti Federalist again.

Could someone hook the brother up for me.

Thanks

Origanalist
07-29-2013, 08:46 PM
Spot on AF +rep

Edit:

Could someone hook the brother up for me.

Thanks

Got it.

Anti Federalist
07-29-2013, 08:51 PM
Yeah, that's one reason I'm a minarchist myself.

I hope it doesn't devolve into yet another argument over the issue.

In my heart I hope that someday humanity can progress to the point where "government" is as abhorrent an idea as say, ritual human sacrifice is today.

Then we can truly live with "no rulers".

Right now though, I'd take backing away from the brink of destruction.

I keep repeating myself, but it needs to be said...we, meaning "we, the people" are just 24 hours away from full blown, fire up the cremation ovens, open the GULAGS, tanks in the street, martial law, "hot" tyranny.

All it will take is a real or manufactured "terror" attack that kills ten times the amount of people that 9/11 did.

KEEF
07-29-2013, 08:53 PM
Got it.
Thanks

69360
07-29-2013, 08:53 PM
LOL - Yah, until the FedCoats decide tomorrow morning to move 10,000 Somalian refugees right next door.

Like they did in Lewiston.

They actually weren't settled in Maine by the fed. They left the places the feds sent them on their own because they got stuck in the ghetto and weren't safe. It's about half that, there are about 5000 now. Those people aren't much trouble. The biggest complaint about them was too many came at once and welfare couldn't support them all. Generally their community is pretty good about keeping everyone in line and they have not turned Lewiston into a slum.

I have a protected nature preserve on 3 sides of my property. Nobody will ever build there.

phill4paul
07-29-2013, 08:58 PM
I have a protected nature preserve on 3 sides of my property. Nobody will ever build there.

Who owns that property? Lol. This get's better and better. Your perceived "safe" situation. Lord it on. Lord it on.

Christian Liberty
07-29-2013, 09:00 PM
I hope it doesn't devolve into yet another argument over the issue.

In my heart I hope that someday humanity can progress to the point where "government" is as abhorrent an idea as say, ritual human sacrifice is today.

Then we can truly live with "no rulers".

Right now though, I'd take backing away from the brink of destruction.

I keep repeating myself, but it needs to be said...we, meaning "we, the people" are just 24 hours away from full blown, fire up the cremation ovens, open the GULAGS, tanks in the street, martial law, "hot" tyranny.

All it will take is a real or manufactured "terror" attack that kills ten times the amount of people that 9/11 did.

I'm not sure its going to happen quite the way you think it will happen, but it will happen/

We're being boiled ailive. I'm just hoping and praying it takes a long time for America to cook entirely.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 09:00 PM
They actually weren't settled in Maine by the fed. They left the places the feds sent them on their own because they got stuck in the ghetto and weren't safe. It's about half that, there are about 5000 now. Those people aren't much trouble. The biggest complaint about them was too many came at once and welfare couldn't support them all. Generally their community is pretty good about keeping everyone in line and they have not turned Lewiston into a slum.

I have a protected nature preserve on 3 sides of my property. Nobody will ever build there.

They'll simply evict you and "Agenda 21" your property.

Dianne
07-29-2013, 09:19 PM
Indefinite detention .... Obama/Holder afraid Kokesh gonna get into their cocaine stash?

mad cow
07-29-2013, 09:20 PM
I'm not so worried yet, I have things that concern me, but all I really want is to be left alone. Where I am now is fine nobody bothers me and won't for the foreseeable future. I moved to where I am for that reason. If I can no longer live my life the way I want to I'll reevaluate it then. I'm proactive, rather than complain I will take action to remove myself from bad situations.

All I ever wanted was to be left alone.

But the government won't do that,will they?
I am trying to find some balance between supporting liberty and prepping for disaster with my limited funds.

Right now,my balance is swinging more toward guns&ammo,precious metals and prepper supplies.If I could,I would buy me a cabin way back in the woods and move there.

But we shouldn't fault others for where their balance falls at the moment,some favor politics,some favor activism.We are all on the same side and we are all in this together.


"We must hang together, gentlemen...else, we shall most assuredly hang separately."

-- Benjamin Franklin

69360
07-29-2013, 09:37 PM
Who owns that property? Lol. This get's better and better. Your perceived "safe" situation. Lord it on. Lord it on.


They'll simply evict you and "Agenda 21" your property.

Private foundation. Well funded own many tracts of land in Maine to preserve from development and allow public access. Great people. Apparently the people I bought the place from were slobs. I cleaned up all the trash the previous owners threw in the woods, they were grateful.

AuH20
07-29-2013, 09:39 PM
Private foundation. Well funded own many tracts of land in Maine to preserve from development and allow public access. Great people. Apparently the people I bought the place from were slobs. I cleaned up all the trash the previous owners threw in the woods, they were grateful.

So you're stating that you a buffer zone of some type?

Cleaner44
07-29-2013, 09:43 PM
Mass murderers aren't held without bond. They may have an un-payable bond set, but generally speaking they aren't held "without bond".

The state considers Kokesh a threat to its existence. What an honor.

I salute you, Mr. Kokesh.

I also salute Adam for having the courage to risk his freedom to make a point that could be historic.

69360
07-29-2013, 09:52 PM
So you're stating that you a buffer zone of some type?

I guess you could say that. It's a nature preserve. Hiking trails etc. It's nice to have all around me. They aren't hippie tree huggers either you can hunt on their land in season and fish in the river.

better-dead-than-fed
07-30-2013, 02:42 PM
Yes, he's messed up his future. His prospects for employment are bleak with multiple felonies on his record. He's committed and admitted to a federal offense. He's looking at years in federal prison and severely reduced chances at a future upon release as a con. That's if the Feds even let him go. Any reasonable person can see that.

Any reasonable person can see that your perception is grossly distorted. Who here, besides maybe you, would deny someone a job because he had exercised his constitutional right to bear arms?


If we don't respect the rule of law, our society will break down into anarchy. The goes for government officials AND us as citizens. Nobody is above the law and can take the law into their own hands. If you don't agree with a law, work to change it. If that doesn't work remove yourself from the area with the law you don't like.

And when people believe they are above the law, and they pass unconstitutional legislative acts, we should submit or run away (while petitioning for redress), and if we don't submit or run away, we should to be imprisoned. Is this not your point?


Would it be harmful for people in any manner to lobby in favor of open-carry? Couldn't this upset Democrats, causing harmful backlash?

Also, would it be harmful to support the Second Amendment, as is?


During the 1788 ratification debates, ... It was understood across the political spectrum that the right helped to secure the ideal of a citizen militia, which might be necessary to oppose an oppressive military force if the constitutional order broke down.

http://scholar.google.com/scholar_case?case=2739870581644084946

Is this Amendment "stupid shit" that could attract unwanted attention from Democrats? Would it be better to support a toned-down Amendment that merely protects our right to keep/bear arms inside our homes?


his methods. ... makes us look very bad

When you write "us" here, it appears you are referring to the people who submit or run away. It's obvious that you're just a guy fighting his demons in a very public way. Why don't you get the psychiatric treatment you need?

AuH20
07-30-2013, 02:50 PM
Originally Posted by 69360
Yes, he's messed up his future. His prospects for employment are bleak with multiple felonies on his record. He's committed and admitted to a federal offense. He's looking at years in federal prison and severely reduced chances at a future upon release as a con. That's if the Feds even let him go. Any reasonable person can see that.

He was already screwed, once he got the 70% PTSD classification. Once you get labeled with that type of mental classification, your job opportunities are severely limited.

mad cow
07-30-2013, 03:18 PM
He was already screwed, once he got the 70% PTSD classification. Once you get labeled with that type of mental classification, your job opportunities are severely limited.

Legally,your job opportunities are non-existent.


Medical evidence is signs, symptoms and laboratory findings and is required to document the claim. Symptoms, such as pain, are considered but must be reasonably expected to come from a medically determinable impairment which the claimant is diagnosed to have. The decision is based on a sequential evaluation of medical evidence. The sequence for adults is:
1. Is the claimant performing a substantial gainful activity? If yes, deny. If no, continue to next sequence.
2. Is the claimant's impairment severe? If no, deny. If yes, continue to next sequence.
3. Does the impairment meet or equal the severity of impairments in the Listing of Impairments?[8] If yes, allow the claim. If no, continue to next sequence.
4. Is the claimant able to perform past work? If yes, deny. If no continue to next sequence.
5. Is the claimant able to perform any work in the economy? If yes, deny. If no allow the claim.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SSDI

noneedtoaggress
07-30-2013, 04:17 PM
It makes us look very bad and you are wrong if you think he hasn't badly damaged his future.

Adam Kokesh's actions represent Adam Kokesh. His actions are his own, as are yours. He's aware of what he's doing and his future is his own to shape. Some individuals may choose to identify with him on varying levels. You've already made it clear that you don't want to be associated with Kokesh, and made it apparent that you feel threatened by the mere prospect to the point that you've chosen to take action and relentlessly attack him with even the most flimsiest of evidence or reasoning to back yourself up.

There's one person who makes you look bad and it's not the person you're compulsively striving to make look bad.

torchbearer
07-30-2013, 04:19 PM
There's one person who makes you look bad and it's not the person you're compulsively striving to make look bad.

69360 post actually say more about himself, than they do about a man he barely knows.

presence
07-30-2013, 05:21 PM
Brother, I understand...I'm off by myself up to the hills of New Hampshire. I could, and would love to do nothing more than retreat and live my life comfortably up in the hills of God's Country. I pray for the day.

But I must be "proactive" myself, in my own way.

I have to worry, I have no choice but to do everything I can am brave enough to undertake, and to support, as much as I possibly can, those that are brave enough to risk it all, in any attempt to bring hurt to The System.

I have to worry about what kind of world I am leaving to my children.

I do not want them to live in a prison planet, as I'm sure you don't want yours to.

So I support Adam, even if he may be a little off kilter.

I support Rand, even though he has pissed me off by playing the "political game" closer to the breast than I care for.

I support Alex Jones, even if some find him to be offensive.

I support Glenn Greenwald, even though he may very well be a socialist.

See what I'm getting at?


Liberty Coalition Mission

WM_in_MO
07-30-2013, 05:33 PM
Liberty Coalition Mission


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ej1DGHG38bg

Ron paul made friends. So should we.

Lucille
08-04-2013, 02:32 PM
That's because Stefan is our enemy and should be treated accordingly.He opposes

He opposes Ron Paul, he opposes civil disobedience, he gets up in front of a pro-liberty audience and tells them not to vote for people like Ron Paul, exc.

At the best, he's an absolute, total idiot.

Adam (https://twitter.com/adamkokesh/status/363450702212767745) sure doesn't think so.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3Gh7QheCyZw

bolil
08-04-2013, 02:36 PM
Forum sliding, yay!