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aGameOfThrones
07-27-2013, 03:39 PM
A gunman killed the husband-and-wife managers of a Hialeah apartment complex, then terrorized the building for hours, killing four other people before a SWAT team took him down in a hail of bullets on Saturday.

The violence started about 6:30 p.m. Friday, when building managers Italo and Camira Pisciotti went to speak with a fourth-floor tenant who lived with his mother, according to police and witnesses. The tenant, Pedro Alberto Vargas, 42, fired about 15 to 20 shots at the Pisciottis, killing them. Italo was 78, Camira was 68.

“I saw my mother’s dead body,” said Shamira Pisciotti, who lives in a unit at the building her parents managed. “She died the moment she was shot, but it looks like my dad was still alive after he was shot.”

The Pisciottis, who were from Colombia, had managed the building for 20 years and were a month away from celebrating their 30th wedding anniversary. They were babysitting their 9-year-old granddaughter when the shootings happened.

Mariano Arias, 46, who lives on the building’s second floor, said he heard Vargas’ 83-year-old mother, Esperanza Patterson, scream to the Pisciottis, “Get my son out of the apartment!” A moment later, Arias heard gunshots. “I hit the ground,” he said.

From a balcony, Vargas then opened fire at fire-rescue workers who arrived at the scene. One of his bullets struck a man who was walking with his son into a building across 46th Street, killing him. The man was identified by Hialeah police as Carlos Javier Gavilanes.“From up there, he was able to shoot at people across the street, catching this one man who was just walking into his apartment,” Hialeah Police Sgt. Eddie Rodriguez said.

Vargas then moved inside, to a third-floor unit. Arias said the unit’s door lock was shot out, and its three tenants — a man, woman and teenage daughter — were killed. The 17-year-old girl had been hiding in a bathroom, he said.

Vargas then went upstairs, where he took two hostages in a fifth-floor unit and put his gun to their heads. When talks with police negotiators fell through about 2 a.m. Saturday, SWAT officers stormed the building, shooting Vargas dead.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/07/27/3525365/seven-dead-after-standoff-shootings.html#storylink=cpy

youngbuck
07-27-2013, 04:03 PM
And nobody was armed to protect themselves and swiftly eliminate this psychopath. When seconds count, police are minutes away. May the victims RIP.

MelissaWV
07-27-2013, 05:33 PM
And nobody was armed to protect themselves and swiftly eliminate this psychopath. When seconds count, police are minutes away. May the victims RIP.

I actually don't think that would have stopped the initial murders. The managers/landlords went to talk to the guy like normal people and were shot without much warning, from the story already out there. I also don't think that a guy randomly walking down the street would have known via psychic waves or something to turn around and pre-emptively kill the guy getting read to shoot down at him from a balcony.

The only ones I could see as having benefited from a gun to defend themselves would be the three folks whose apartment he barged into, and particularly the girl who hid (she would have had a tactical advantage at that point).

Anti Federalist
07-27-2013, 05:37 PM
then terrorized the building for hours, killing four other people before a SWAT team took him down in a hail of bullets on Saturday.

Those goddamn tanks are slow.

Thank God all the officers were OK though.

Anti Federalist
07-27-2013, 05:39 PM
I actually don't think that would have stopped the initial murders. The managers/landlords went to talk to the guy like normal people and were shot without much warning, from the story already out there. I also don't think that a guy randomly walking down the street would have known via psychic waves or something to turn around and pre-emptively kill the guy getting read to shoot down at him from a balcony.

The only ones I could see as having benefited from a gun to defend themselves would be the three folks whose apartment he barged into, and particularly the girl who hid (she would have had a tactical advantage at that point).

True.

In an ambush situation, there is little that can be done if somebody completely gets the drop on you.

Not to mention this couple was elderly.

Sure would have helped the others though.

In this case, when seconds counted, cops were only hours away.

mad cow
07-27-2013, 05:41 PM
The only ones I could see as having benefited from a gun to defend themselves would be the three folks whose apartment he barged into, and particularly the girl who hid (she would have had a tactical advantage at that point).

And they would have benefited enormously.The 20+ gunshots would have given them plenty of warning to arm up and be prepared.
Arm up and be prepared,people.

HOLLYWOOD
07-27-2013, 06:02 PM
And nobody was armed to protect themselves and swiftly eliminate this psychopath. When seconds count, police are minutes away. May the victims RIP.2nd amendment baby!

Well, let's look at some justifications...

#5 reason to tell; Dianne Feinstein, Schumer, Levin, Boxer, et al gun grabbers... to go fuck themselves...
#4 reason, Militarized Law Enforcement has killed 8 times as many Americans in history, than all terrorism combined...
#3 reason, Fascist, criminal corrupt, racketeering, conspiring, fraudulent, crime families of Washington DC will protect themselves at the people's expense...
#2 reason, government views the people as the enemy, spying on them, more rights violation laws; records stealing, arrests, charges, confiscations, rubbers-stamping warrants, jails, imprisoning, (only need the people for campaign donations, propaganda dialectic, and election day)

Numera Uno:
2005 SCOTUS Ruling: 'Police Not Constitutionally Bound to Protect Citizens'

Ender
07-27-2013, 06:05 PM
I actually don't think that would have stopped the initial murders. The managers/landlords went to talk to the guy like normal people and were shot without much warning, from the story already out there. I also don't think that a guy randomly walking down the street would have known via psychic waves or something to turn around and pre-emptively kill the guy getting read to shoot down at him from a balcony.

The only ones I could see as having benefited from a gun to defend themselves would be the three folks whose apartment he barged into, and particularly the girl who hid (she would have had a tactical advantage at that point).

You are thinking in US terms- think Swiss; if everyone is known to pack heat, then murders are much rarer. THIS direction is where we need to go as armed civilians.

MelissaWV
07-27-2013, 06:09 PM
You are thinking in US terms- think Swiss; if everyone is known to pack heat, then murders are much rarer. THIS direction is where we need to go as armed civilians.

I'm pretty sure someone who's going to shoot some old folks just for talking to him is still going to do so whether he thinks they are armed or not; he has the advantage and unless you think those elderly folks are some kind of quickdraw experts, they would still wind up dead in this situation. Likewise, the guy walking down the street.

Now, would he barge into an unknown person's home if there was a good chance they were armed and had been alerted by the recent gunfire that something was amiss and they needed to take defensive positions and be ready? THAT part is the only part I see changing here.

Carson
07-28-2013, 12:24 AM
You may not need a gun in a day, or need one in a month, but when you do need one you need one mighty darn quick.