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JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 06:31 PM
Think we could pass that legislation?

There are hundreds of thousands of people in there for victimless crimes and that's fucked up.

Get all those families together or something.

DamianTV
07-18-2013, 06:33 PM
I am a Prisoner of the US Govt because I live here, does that mean I would get GMO Free food as well?

I dont know if it would pass. Too many politicians probably have thier hands in Monsantos pockets.

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 06:36 PM
They are locked in a cage.

We are too, but legislation is still passing that sounds good socially and has fire behind it. Bring in some people on the left? It's kind of a non-partisan thing.

TaftFan
07-18-2013, 06:39 PM
I doubt they would care and they might actually dislike it.

presence
07-18-2013, 06:39 PM
Are you trollin?


Daniel 1:12


12 “Please test your servants for ten days: Give us nothing but vegetables to eat and water to drink. 13 Then compare our appearance with that of the young men who eat the royal food, and treat your servants in accordance with what you see.” 14 So he agreed to this and tested them for ten days. 15 At the end of the ten days they looked healthier and better nourished than any of the young men who ate the royal food.

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 06:40 PM
I am a Prisoner of the US Govt because I live here, does that mean I would get GMO Free food as well?


Here's the thing. It's starting to sound like if you're a good enough activist/whistelblower, they would be upgrading you to organic GMO-free food.

I'd like to amend this bill and say I'm pro-water for all US prisoners too.

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 06:43 PM
I doubt they would care and they might actually dislike it.

They would appreciate it and many people would be happy.

People would come out of there better and willing to contribute to that kind of society.

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 06:55 PM
12 “Please test your servants for ten days: Give us nothing but vegetables to eat and water to drink. 13 Then compare our appearance with that of the young men who eat the royal food, and treat your servants in accordance with what you see.” 14 So he agreed to this and tested them for ten days. 15 At the end of the ten days they looked healthier and better nourished than any of the young men who ate the royal food.

Yea, organic, gmo-free veggies and water will make you feel like a million bucks.

Warrior_of_Freedom
07-18-2013, 06:57 PM
shit if prison would give me healthy food on top of a place to stay, not lookin' so bad

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 07:00 PM
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HAPky6F3ByU

paulbot24
07-18-2013, 07:02 PM
Wouldn't it be ironic if the people locked up in prison are actually better off than "free" civilians in a SHTF scenario?

ClydeCoulter
07-18-2013, 07:28 PM
They would appreciate it and many people would be happy.

People would come out of there better and willing to contribute to that kind of society.

Yeah. We the People taking consideration of those locked up for victimless crimes. Good idea!

edit: And the resultant Karma would be good too :)

paulbot24
07-18-2013, 07:46 PM
Convicted felons are always safe to hate on. Just make sure you emphasize the word "convicted" since we are all felons.

Working Poor
07-18-2013, 07:53 PM
Josh-
it's a lovely idea but, do you really think the government wants prisoners to get healthy? They don't even want people who aren't In prison to be healthy. This bad food they are pushing on the public is so the new health care laws will make more sense because everyone is getring sick now. It will be against the law to eat real food before long.

Silly boy..

The Northbreather
07-18-2013, 08:00 PM
GMO's and pink slime = cruel and unusual punishment

Carlybee
07-18-2013, 08:05 PM
never happen...budget constraints

dannno
07-18-2013, 08:18 PM
I doubt they would care and they might actually dislike it.

Rofl, you've obviously never eaten organic food. Ever have organic grass fed beef? Anything that is pastured tastes a lot better.

donnay
07-18-2013, 08:19 PM
The Prison Industrial Complex might give in only because a healthy prisoner will produce more for the owner(s).

ClydeCoulter
07-18-2013, 08:31 PM
The Prison Industrial Complex might give in only because a healthy prisoner will produce more for the owner(s).

And it's good for the "Organic" industry. Hey, Michelle, organic! :D

donnay, are there any studies that show healthy organic food helps with brain function of criminals or something? Like, reduces tendencies of x, y, and z?

TaftFan
07-18-2013, 08:34 PM
Rofl, you've obviously never eaten organic food. Ever have organic grass fed beef? Anything that is pastured tastes a lot better.
I have in fact. Taste wise it varies to me.

Rocco
07-18-2013, 08:52 PM
This is a terrible idea for economic reasons. The cost of organic is FAR higher than the cost of GMO's and we have enough money going to the prisons as is. No need to mandate some green crap to replace a type of crop which has been proven to be safe in 600+ studies.

Rocco
07-18-2013, 08:52 PM
I have eaten organic steak and I thought it tasted weird. I much prefer the good ole GMO style.


Rofl, you've obviously never eaten organic food. Ever have organic grass fed beef? Anything that is pastured tastes a lot better.

donnay
07-18-2013, 08:58 PM
And it's good for the "Organic" industry. Hey, Michelle, organic! :D

donnay, are there any studies that show healthy organic food helps with brain function of criminals or something? Like, reduces tendencies of x, y, and z?

None off the top of my head. But there is plenty of studies of healthy organic berries are excellent for boosting brain functions. Also foods high in folic acid is also good for boosting brain functions. Organic chocolate is brain food, too!

donnay
07-18-2013, 09:04 PM
This is a terrible idea for economic reasons. The cost of organic is FAR higher than the cost of GMO's and we have enough money going to the prisons as is. No need to mandate some green crap to replace a type of crop which has been proven to be safe in 600+ studies.


As the demand for non-GMO gets bigger (and it has) the price will come down. Actually it is cheaper, by and large, to produce organic foods and raise live stock on organics than it is to do the conventional methods--pesticides, herbicides and antibiotics.

Besides there is not enough independent testing of GMOs and some of the test we have seen show that GMO damages organs and cause cancerous tumor growth in rats.

TaftFan
07-18-2013, 09:09 PM
How about the prisoners grow their own food?

dannno
07-18-2013, 09:25 PM
I have eaten organic steak and I thought it tasted weird. I much prefer the good ole GMO style.

Right, because I'm sure steak has always tasted weird, grass-fed bison tasted weird for the native americans too, it's so great that Monsanto was able to reign in the flavor.

You actually don't know what the fuck you are talking about, go get some grass finished steak, there is no question it has much better beef flavor and nutritionally it is in the opposite spectrum of the crap you eat.

donnay
07-18-2013, 09:28 PM
How about the prisoners grow their own food?


Already being done in Texas. Of course there is no way of knowing if the seeds are GMO or not.

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/Sheriff-making-inmates-grow-their-own-food-117276753.html

Rocco
07-18-2013, 09:29 PM
How did I know that was coming. You're gonna attack an opinion regarding taste of food, which is among the most subjective things on this planet? Get bent.


Right, because I'm sure steak has always tasted weird, grass-fed bison tasted weird for the native americans too, it's so great that Monsanto was able to reign in the flavor.

You actually don't know what the fuck you are talking about, go get some grass finished steak, there is no question it has much better beef flavor and nutritionally it is in the opposite spectrum of the crap you eat.

Rocco
07-18-2013, 09:30 PM
The rat study is a well known fraud. They did not implement scientific controls. I didn't see the organ tissue study, but virtually every study I have seen saying GMOs are bad has been bogus.


As the demand for non-GMO gets bigger (and it has) the price will come down. Actually it is cheaper, by and large, to produce organic foods and raise live stock on organics than it is to do the conventional methods--pesticides, herbicides and antibiotics.

Besides there is not enough independent testing of GMOs and some of the test we have seen show that GMO damages organs and cause cancerous tumor growth in rats.

Natural Citizen
07-18-2013, 09:41 PM
The rat study is a well known fraud. They did not implement scientific controls. I didn't see the organ tissue study, but virtually every study I have seen saying GMOs are bad has been bogus.

Well. It's a good thing the future is open source. Monsanto can certainly view itself as the Microsoft of food but ...well....maybe some folks want to plant and eat Linux. Ever think of that? No? :)


Aside though...these particular studies you're reading/referencing....you don't think Monsanto funded them? Where are these "studies"?

donnay
07-18-2013, 09:42 PM
The rat study is a well known fraud. They did not implement scientific controls. I didn't see the organ tissue study, but virtually every study I have seen saying GMOs are bad has been bogus.

Study on pigs
http://www.organic-systems.org/journal/81/8106.pdf

A Comparison of the Effects of Three GM Corn Varieties on Mammalian Health
http://www.ijbs.com/v05p0706.htm#headingA11

French Study on rats
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-2205509/Cancer-row-GM-foods-French-study-claims-did-THIS-rats--cause-organ-damage-early-death-humans.html

DamianTV
07-18-2013, 09:48 PM
The rat study is a well known fraud. They did not implement scientific controls. I didn't see the organ tissue study, but virtually every study I have seen saying GMOs are bad has been bogus.

You could always do the tests yourself. And if you dont feel like it, dont worry, you already are doing a test, if you have pets.

Science on both sides lie. To know the truth and not just believe one side over the other, it is still a belief. The only way to truly KNOW is to do the tests yourself.

(no offense)

Rocco
07-18-2013, 09:49 PM
600+ published safety assessments on GMOs

http://gmopundit.blogspot.com/p/450-published-safety-assessments.html

donnay
07-18-2013, 10:00 PM
Health Risks
http://www.responsibletechnology.org/health-risks

Natural Citizen
07-18-2013, 10:12 PM
RT just ran a really good documentary on Monsanto. Covered the officials involved, the science, the legislation, health repercussion and a host of other things. Was very well done. I don't know if it's on tube ny place but I caught it on RT yeterday.

US media won't touch it with a ten foot pole though. Well...unless they can cloud the terms of controversy. Which they cannot do any longer just because the common folk are waking up and asking why. That's a great question....why....

dannno
07-18-2013, 10:14 PM
How did I know that was coming. You're gonna attack an opinion regarding taste of food, which is among the most subjective things on this planet? Get bent.

No, I'm attacking someone who eats GMO meat day in and day out, had one sampling of supposedly organic beef and thinks they know everything. Grass fed beef has better beef flavor, period. It's not subjective, there are amounts of flavor and grass fed beef has more so you're wrong. Organic may not be grass finished, but if you got 100 samplings of beef across the country organic will tend to be better than Monstanto because it will tend to be more pastured, but you can't just have one sample of beef and act like a know-it-all.

dannno
07-18-2013, 10:18 PM
600+ published safety assessments on GMOs

http://gmopundit.blogspot.com/p/450-published-safety-assessments.html

You're on Ron Paul Forums.

Why don't you know how corporatism works? Do yourself a favor and learn about it.

ClydeCoulter
07-18-2013, 10:19 PM
See, Josh is just a shit stirrer :D

JoshLowry
07-18-2013, 10:20 PM
This is a terrible idea for economic reasons. The cost of organic is FAR higher than the cost of GMO's and we have enough money going to the prisons as is. No need to mandate some green crap to replace a type of crop which has been proven to be safe in 600+ studies.

This isn't much of an economic issue, but a health related one.

People on food stamps can buy organic. (I'm not arguing for alcohol for prisoners.)

They could grow their own organic food for cheaper than anything they buy from ABC pink slime corp.

ClydeCoulter
07-18-2013, 10:23 PM
This isn't much of an economic issue, but a health related one.

People on food stamps can buy organic.

They could grow their own organic food for cheaper than anything they buy from ABC pink slime corp.

I would be all in for prisoners being allowed to grow their food, and have a choice of non-gmo (heirloom?) seeds. That may require more land, but doesn't the fed own like a big chunk of the U.S.A? Oh, and, maybe give the Indian tribes some land that they can grow good crops on out of that big chunk (for those that don't have good soil)?

edit: I can see a lot of benefit for prisoners being close to the earth in such an endeavor.

dannno
07-18-2013, 10:24 PM
This is a terrible idea for economic reasons. The cost of organic is FAR higher than the cost of GMO's and we have enough money going to the prisons as is. No need to mandate some green crap to replace a type of crop which has been proven to be safe in 600+ studies.

Do you know what cost even means? Obviously not. The cost of something is the amount of resources that go into it. The amount of resources that go into mainstream GMO crap food is actually very high, but it is subsidized by the government so they have vast economic advantage to dominate and control markets. Organic and pastured actually, potentially, is as much or less resource intensive but because it does not receive the government subsidies it does not have the advantage to dominate markets and increase economies of scale. So "cost" here is a very subjective term, speaking of things being subjective. If prisons moved to organic/grass fed and pastured animals then those industries would begin to see the benefits of economies of scale and prices would drop significantly for those of us who have educated themselves enough to know how much better it tastes and how much healthier it is. It would be an EVEN PLAYING FIELD, finally, and I guarantee you the good guys, us, will win out in that scenario.

liberty2897
07-18-2013, 11:23 PM
They might have GMO-free food, but it is getting hard to get good dope in there. They cut alcohol and smoking to a minimum. I think those of you suggesting that jail might be better than the outside are crazy. Maybe it used to be good in there, but not any more.

danno is featured in part of this documentary : )

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GJFLg7hchZw

jbauer
07-19-2013, 06:06 AM
Gmo the global warming of the liberty movement

jbauer
07-19-2013, 06:11 AM
Do you know what cost even means? Obviously not. The cost of something is the amount of resources that go into it. The amount of resources that go into mainstream GMO crap food is actually very high, but it is subsidized by the government so they have vast economic advantage to dominate and control markets. Organic and pastured actually, potentially, is as much or less resource intensive but because it does not receive the government subsidies it does not have the advantage to dominate markets and increase economies of scale. So "cost" here is a very subjective term, speaking of things being subjective. If prisons moved to organic/grass fed and pastured animals then those industries would begin to see the benefits of economies of scale and prices would drop significantly for those of us who have educated themselves enough to know how much better it tastes and how much healthier it is. It would be an EVEN PLAYING FIELD, finally, and I guarantee you the good guys, us, will win out in that scenario.

Wow you need to get out more. There's not enough acreage in the world to do 100% organic. It's also significantly more resource intensive. Organic is nearly entirely marketing and you guys have bought it hook line and sinker.

amy31416
07-19-2013, 06:26 AM
I think it'd be awesome if the inmates could have a plot of land to grow their own food on, and seeds available in the commissary. A lot of prisons probably don't have that kind of outdoor space though.

donnay
07-19-2013, 07:06 AM
Wow you need to get out more. There's not enough acreage in the world to do 100% organic. It's also significantly more resource intensive. Organic is nearly entirely marketing and you guys have bought it hook line and sinker.

LOL! Ever heard of Biointensive Farming (http://www.growbiointensive.org/)? Conventional Farming have stripped our lands of minerals because of all the pesticides and herbicides they have used for years. Our soils need to be replenished in order for us to get the proper nutritional values back.

GMO is entirely marketing and indoctrinating people to think GMO's will feed and save the world. It's kind of like how they marketed Aspartame as "Natural" made from sugar--which anyone that researches it will fine it is genetically modified fecal matter from E.coli. Mmm Yum! <s>

.

presence
07-19-2013, 07:09 AM
Wow you need to get out more. There's not enough acreage in the world to do 100% organic. It's also significantly more resource intensive. Organic is nearly entirely marketing and you guys have bought it hook line and sinker.


As someone that grows a good portion of the food I eat I can say that statement is full of manure.

belian78
07-19-2013, 09:38 AM
As someone that grows a good portion of the food I eat I can say that statement is full of manure.
Yeah I have a 10x20 garden on the side of my house, and I'm going to be supplying my relatives with corn/beans/onions/potatoes/okra because I'm going to have more than I'll need. I'm going to have to say there's plenty enough room for organic too.

jbauer
07-19-2013, 10:04 AM
As someone that grows a good portion of the food I eat I can say that statement is full of manure.

So should you discount the fact that we grow most of my own?...except seafood. I grew up on a farm. I still live on one. You guys are out of your mind if you think you can grow enough food on this planet to feed its 7 Billion people. The only reason Amerkians think we can is because "we" haven't been hungry since the great depression.

I'll use non-traditional methods when they're appropriate. I'll use GMO when its appropriate. I grow a lot of heritage seed. The quantity of "natural" but still quite harmful chemicals used to grow "organic" food is ridiculous. Those of you who are to blind to see the forest for the trees but have no problem paying several times it worth because you think its more healthy are welcome to do so.

jbauer
07-19-2013, 10:08 AM
Yeah I have a 10x20 garden on the side of my house, and I'm going to be supplying my relatives with corn/beans/onions/potatoes/okra because I'm going to have more than I'll need. I'm going to have to say there's plenty enough room for organic too.

How many in your family? You'll have extra when its in season and none when its not. You're also not figuring in crop failure. It takes loads of veggies to feed a family for the entire year. We've been canning and freezing for years. It takes 1/2 an acre to put a good dent into what we need for a family of 4 and more to feed the animals.

There is physically not enough land on this planet to feed everyone if you cut the yields in 1/2 or more to make everyone feel better about what they eat.

donnay
07-19-2013, 11:10 AM
How many in your family? You'll have extra when its in season and none when its not.

That's why it is wise to eat seasonally. It's economically sustainable and much more healthier.

dannno
07-19-2013, 12:13 PM
The quantity of "natural" but still quite harmful chemicals used to grow "organic" food is ridiculous. Those of you who are to blind to see the forest for the trees but have no problem paying several times it worth because you think its more healthy are welcome to do so.

This logical fallacy here is referred to appealing to authority, you tend to do it a lot. Just because it is USDA certified organic doesn't mean much. You could also, potentially, use very limited amounts of non-organic substances on your farm and still retain healthy soil, runoff and grow good healthy fruits and vegetables that cannot be certified organic. You could have a certified organic farm next door run by big agribusiness that grows shitty food and use harsh chemicals. That is why I shop at farmer's markets. Big agrifarms just pump a bunch of chemicals into the soil until it is depleted of all the natural minerals and healthy soil bacteria and over time the quality and nutrients suffer tremendously.. but you could go to a mainstream grocery store and buy food from a farm that just started pumping chemicals into brand new broken soil and it happens to be healthy and good and nutritious, but it is not sustainable so why support it?

We aren't talking about labels here, we are talking about philosophical approaches to farming techniques.

dannno
07-19-2013, 12:16 PM
There is physically not enough land on this planet to feed everyone if you cut the yields in 1/2 or more to make everyone feel better about what they eat.

What is this ridiculous nonsense about growing half the yield?

jbauer
07-19-2013, 01:53 PM
This logical fallacy here is referred to appealing to authority, you tend to do it a lot. Just because it is USDA certified organic doesn't mean much. You could also, potentially, use very limited amounts of non-organic substances on your farm and still retain healthy soil, runoff and grow good healthy fruits and vegetables that cannot be certified organic. You could have a certified organic farm next door run by big agribusiness that grows shitty food and use harsh chemicals. That is why I shop at farmer's markets. Big agrifarms just pump a bunch of chemicals into the soil until it is depleted of all the natural minerals and healthy soil bacteria and over time the quality and nutrients suffer tremendously.. but you could go to a mainstream grocery store and buy food from a farm that just started pumping chemicals into brand new broken soil and it happens to be healthy and good and nutritious, but it is not sustainable so why support it?

We aren't talking about labels here, we are talking about philosophical approaches to farming techniques.

You're welcome to feel however you want. But do you honestly think that farmers who derive their income from property that's in most cases been in their families for generations are destroying their land all to get some sort of short term monetary gain??

Gmo = manbearpig

QuickZ06
07-19-2013, 02:14 PM
There's not enough acreage in the world to do 100% organic.

Skyscraper Greenhouses!

JoshLowry
07-19-2013, 02:30 PM
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-11-01-3438466893_x.htm?csp=34

"It's nice to be out in the elements," said Knowles, 42, stirring dark, rich compost that will amend the soil at the small farm where he and fellow inmates of the Cedar Creek Corrections Center grew 8,000 pounds of organic vegetables this year.

Natural Citizen
07-19-2013, 03:24 PM
http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2008-11-01-3438466893_x.htm?csp=34

"It's nice to be out in the elements," said Knowles, 42, stirring dark, rich compost that will amend the soil at the small farm where he and fellow inmates of the Cedar Creek Corrections Center grew 8,000 pounds of organic vegetables this year.


There is just a whole host of things that people could consider here. Where to begin in the political wild, I don't know....

The fact that the prison industry is moving into general infrastructure is a big deal. That's not to mention the fact that biotech companies are as well enacting legislation themselves via representation so is a conflict of interest of sorts. Just don't know where to begin with this. Immigrants seem to be great lil landscapers too so....yeah. I think the prison industry is working rather hard to influence policy on immigration to maybe get them into the business end of imprisonment. Big old tall glass of water here aside from benefits to health and natural infrastructure.

mad cow
07-19-2013, 04:24 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nhtPuePkU5Y

You gotta suffer if you want to sing the blues and I love the blues and America needs more blues singers...so yeah,I'm for it.What could go wrong?

Nobexliberty
07-19-2013, 04:28 PM
Make them work for their food by farming different crops to fullfill their nutrional needs. If they are in alaska make them fish for food if the weather is to cruel for agriculture.