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RDM
07-07-2013, 06:14 PM
Ben Swann's Truth in Media Fundraising project is floundering.

Why?

Here we are with only 18 days left, and the Kickstarter Project has not even reached $250,000 of pledges of a goal of $1,250,000. Are we that weak or are we just a bunch of "all talkers and no action"? Hence the poll question.

For a group that has complained about the unfair media and no vehicle to get the truth out, we sure are letting this opportunity slip away.

So if we don't want this Liberty Movement to look like a bowel movement, then lets get this thing funded before the deadline.

https://fbstatic-a.akamaihd.net/rsrc.php/v2/yX/r/acBKJPTD7H-.png
The MSM has ignored or falsified too many stories. It is time for the grassroots to stand up and back a true investigative reporter to bring truth to the masses. The MSM has lied about Syria, the economy, drone strikes, Edward Snowden, Michael Hastings, and the list goes on. The liberty movement will not allow the MSM to remain unchecked and unchallenged. We have the chance to take a stand and back Ben Swann's "Liberty Is Rising Truth In Media" project. http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/439668500/liberty-is-rising-truth-in-media-project-0


This event is being created, to coincide with Ben's birthday, in support of Ben Swann's "Liberty Is Rising Truth In Media" Kickstarter pledge effort. By joining this event you are stating that you will pledge to the "Liberty Is Rising Truth In Media" project on or before July 19th, 2013.
For more information about the Kickstarter event: http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/439668500/liberty-is-rising-truth-in-media-project-0http://www.ronpaulforums.com/image/gif;base64,R0lGODlhEgASAPeCALTttfLy8mHSYNTm1FfPVt3 r3CmEJ6jqqRd7FmvWa/T484Pdg93733fad/b69k7MTfPz88DbwDSLMlmgWI/hkEKTQZvGmju0OpzmnIe6hg92DQx0Cvz8/Bp8GPf398jgyCeYJj+RPv///z+4PsXjxWeoZkW3RKnaqmrVak26TITOhGOxYWGuYaDfodjm1z2 UPEvISsPdwk+pTszhzO717i6ILZzbnTGJL1+tXnCtb1W4VPn8+ YvYi/Dy8KThpHPJc+rz6R2DG2KsYhyKG+v064ncisrgysHewF+jXi6Q LUiWRzuxOs3izdP11W/Mb0uwSiqHKRF7Dy6eLWKlYNbl1nO7ch2TG+Xs5TihN3Ovcsbex cDcv226bdnn2cPxxfDx8Nrq2pfNlxSAEki2R5PLlFW6VTGSMD+ 1Pj6rPWWvZTKeMJTfk32/fbLWsjeuNnzAfPz9/DiqN0K1Qo7Xj7/fvxt+GmrOaiKFIE63TdPk02qqaWrGadnp2X7NfsDxwcr1zNT41 hmQF////wAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA CH5BAEAAIIALAAAAAASABIAAAj/AAUJHCiwAA2CCAfCsaBkA5Q6CCZoSSgQzA0hJxhobELmxRQHCA d0YAOopMmSaSqAFKjAwJs/MGP+sRHICws9AzPg8MOzpx8VgaoE8qFhgEADLQAoXdonEAkRYQ JxySKowJ0DWAPxOPAjEB0OHIBYmSNBUAQzGDAEkhFoT6AjHjzw CaRjTQezSSgEWtFjS6A2ECC4CFSGQhEEVYMsCGQkQIArXwJQCY RnwQInZQUZsJMi0AzHAfIEGtOg9JMcAjNgSWAiEBMIXQLJSUAb RVGWBtAIOBPoQ6AlAoILUFOC4AAEcQhcCHSBgHMCUkKsHDigBo gRD7LDcDMEiQKKOyxUDdggJkrEGBQTFiCSPiAAOw== (https://www.siteadvisor.com/sites/http%3A//www.kickstarter.com/projects/439668500/liberty-is-rising-truth-in-media-project-0%26h%3Dqaqgrreqh%26s%3D1/-?pip=false&premium=false&client_uid=450048563&client_ver=3.6.2.168&client_type=IEPlugin&suite=true&aff_id=662-1&locale=en_us&ui=1&os_ver=6.1.1.0)

The goal is 20,000 attending the event and pledging to the Kickstarter.
Let's show the MSM what the grassroots can create!
For more about Ben Swann:
http://BenSwann.com/


Ben Interviews President Obama
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hrerl8EwqH0


Ben Swann latest update on Syria
http://youtu.be/ZLTkMYg4zbI


Join, invite, pledge!

Rocco
07-07-2013, 06:16 PM
What a stupid thread title.

RDM
07-07-2013, 06:17 PM
What a stupid thread title.
I'm sure it is to those that have not donated.

TaftFan
07-07-2013, 06:18 PM
I wonder if Ron Paul isn't promoting it because now we know he has his own TV venture?

RDM
07-07-2013, 06:22 PM
I wonder if Ron Paul isn't promoting it because now we know he has his own TV venture?
He really hasn't to this point and with the news of Ron's new project, that's probably why.

Bastiat's The Law
07-07-2013, 06:28 PM
You would think the anti-political approach members would be all over this effort. They're all talk.

RabbitMan
07-07-2013, 06:53 PM
I've spoken to many people about doing kick-starters. The number one thing they say to avoid is having a huge 'all-or-nothing' projects. The most frequently successful ones use kick-starter for smaller, specific projects.

As soon as I saw that he was trying to raise a million plus all at once, I knew it wouldn't make it, but I still threw in my $10. Sorry Ben!

Barrex
07-07-2013, 07:06 PM
I wonder if Ron Paul isn't promoting it because now we know he has his own TV venture?


He really hasn't to this point and with the news of Ron's new project, that's probably why.

If Ron got equipment he should/could and probably would give Ben to use it too. This would be mutually beneficial cooperation.

It is known that people on this forum are able to reach Ben Swann and Ron Paul. It is only logical that we put those two in contact and watch behind bushes what will they come up with. They could come to same conclusion let push them to make it sure.

The Free Hornet
07-07-2013, 07:08 PM
I'm sure it is to those that have not donated.

I don't recall which thread it was, but somebody was trying to drum up money for cause/politician X. Somebody else chimed in that donating to Ben Swann would be a much better use of their money.

I've heard enough of the Ben Swann project and the zealotry is wearing thin.

heavenlyboy34
07-07-2013, 07:09 PM
You would think the anti-political approach members would be all over this effort. They're all talk.
:rolleyes: You think we're made of money? :p

RDM
07-07-2013, 07:22 PM
I don't recall which thread it was, but somebody was trying to drum up money for cause/politician X. Somebody else chimed in that donating to Ben Swann would be a much better use of their money.

I've heard enough of the Ben Swann project and the zealotry is wearing thin.
Not sure who chimed in about only donating to Ben Swann. You can donate to Ben Swann for as little as $1. So if someone had another cause/politician to donate to, I don't think a dollar is going to break anyone's bank and both causes get a share of donations.

cajuncocoa
07-07-2013, 07:24 PM
I donated what I could and will try to drum up a little more before the deadline.

MelissaWV
07-07-2013, 07:25 PM
I will chime in on the "all or nothing" approach as well. The site certainly seems to talk up the goal, and goes so far as to say that all of the money is needed. There's no plan to do half as many shows if $x are raised instead. There's no talk of doing the most with what's raised.

There is, however, a strange need to scold people for not pledging to this. I have looked at it and personally do not see the value in donating. That's me, personally, and since I'm the one that is in charge of my money, that's how it's going to stay. I have to divert funds to a variety of personal expenses over the summer and fall. I can't see falling short on those goals and telling family and friends that I could not help them because I was helping someone fund their educational political programming efforts.

It would be great if it got funded, but I don't think chastising the same crowd that occasionally has to choose between food and donations in order to scrounge up $100 for the site's namesake(s) is going to be the way to fund it.

Bastiat's The Law
07-07-2013, 09:08 PM
:rolleyes: You think we're made of money? :p
If people don't want to go the political route as Ron Paul advised and reform the republican party with liberty supporters and we can't even raise 1/3 of a tiny media project, what exactly are we doing here?

Carlybee
07-07-2013, 09:08 PM
I had planned to donate before the deadline due to other pressing expenses I have at the moment. Frankly I do not appreciate comments like the title of this thread nor the guilt trips that people keep throwing out there as if it's the members of LF sole duty to fund a kickstarter of over a million dollars. Surely you realize the movement has been splintered and a lot of people have left this site compared to how many were here when Ron Paul was still in the race. It is not the cash cow it once was. So I will donate what I can when I can but I would highly think about changing your approach because it makes me want to say kma. And if you guys thought you were going to raise over a million dollars off an internet forum without bringing in some large donors then I hope you were not Ben's advisers on this. All you are going to do with threads like this trying to blame US for not meeting a lofty goal, then all you are going to do is alienate people even more. This is an extremely immature approach to raising funds.

Mr.NoSmile
07-07-2013, 09:12 PM
I love how a simple kick-starter not reaching its goal characterizes a group of people as weak or just a bunch of "all talkers and no action," as you put it. If you want to try and raise the entire fund yourself and have that satisfaction, then by all means, but don't stand on a soapbox and criticize a movement, and individuals who each have their own lives to live and finances to take care of outside of this forum and certainly besides a kick-starter, just because a quota isn't reached. This isn't the end all be all to anything and everyone here knows that.

truthsaga
07-07-2013, 10:20 PM
All I know, is everyday I am here it is to be here for my people (no, not just Polish, German, Irish people, all people). I donated money to get people to CPAC, Iowa Caucuses, money bombs, and other events. All I know this is a return on investment that will make ground work here in California easier and more productive by having an Emmy award journalist doing stories on topics of substance. A politicians speech can only go so far.. we need more guys like Ben out there.

How quick are we to forget all the positive fair coverage he put out during Ron Paul's election; what was going on in Maine, the RNC, and other related stories. We contacted him and he stood with us.

Just like anyone else in this Liberty Camp from '07 to now, I am down for my brothers and sisters here and you best believe I am giving my time and resources to help Ben Swann.

"bigotry is the disease of ignorance, of morbid minds; enthusiasm of the free and buoyant. education & free discussion are the antidotes of both."

"our liberty depends on the freedom of the press, and that cannot be limited without being lost."

RDM
07-07-2013, 10:47 PM
I had planned to donate before the deadline due to other pressing expenses I have at the moment. Frankly I do not appreciate comments like the title of this thread nor the guilt trips that people keep throwing out there as if it's the members of LF sole duty to fund a kickstarter of over a million dollars. Surely you realize the movement has been splintered and a lot of people have left this site compared to how many were here when Ron Paul was still in the race. It is not the cash cow it once was. So I will donate what I can when I can but I would highly think about changing your approach because it makes me want to say kma. And if you guys thought you were going to raise over a million dollars off an internet forum without bringing in some large donors then I hope you were not Ben's advisers on this. All you are going to do with threads like this trying to blame US for not meeting a lofty goal, then all you are going to do is alienate people even more. This is an extremely immature approach to raising funds.
I have noticed. I've also noticed many of those people that are no longer here on this forum used to sabotage many Ron Paul promotions and efforts by other forum members. I'm sure they feel their job is done here and no longer frequent the place.

Carlybee
07-07-2013, 11:56 PM
I have noticed. I've also noticed many of those people that are no longer here on this forum used to sabotage many Ron Paul promotions and efforts by other forum members. I'm sure they feel their job is done here and no longer frequent the place.

So that gives you the right to try and insult and guilt people by calling them weak and referring to what's left of the movement as a bowel movement? Way to win friends and influence people.

RDM
07-08-2013, 12:03 AM
So that gives you the right to try and insult and guilt people by calling them weak and referring to what's left of the movement as a bowel movement? Way to win friends and influence people.

Nobody ever said "truth" was pretty or palatable.

Carlybee
07-08-2013, 12:04 AM
Nobody ever said "truth" was pretty or palatable.


You have a lot to learn about marketing.

The Bavarian
07-08-2013, 12:08 AM
1.2 million? Ouch... Well, my bank account is pretty low right now but I'll drum something up before the deadline.

RDM
07-08-2013, 12:12 AM
You have a lot to learn about marketing.
Considering what we put up with during 2011-2012 with media bias and outright lies, I shouldn't need any marketing skills. It should be as easy as selling bananas to a monkey.

nobody's_hero
07-08-2013, 12:27 AM
I think most of this movement has gone into their SHTF shelters.

But even on my survival prepping allowance I threw $200 towards this, if for no other reason than so Ben Swann can make Public Service Announcements before the collapse telling my idiotic fellow Americans to stay the hell away from my compound. :)

Of course, they never listened before.

Feelgood
07-08-2013, 12:32 AM
Too many bombs!

Money bombs. Pledge bombs. etc etc etc

Sorry, but I stated this before when Ron was running and we couldn't meet his money bomb goals. It is simply "fill in the blank" bomb fatigue. People are tapped out. Broke. Busted. Depleted. Exhausted. Bankrupt. Impoverished. Sucked dry. Drained. Eviscerated. Sapped. Barren. Destitute. Played out. Ruined.

I could keep on all night. Not sure if you got the memo about the current Obama economy? It isn't good. Even though I am sure there are plenty here who would love to donate more, they simply can not. 1.25 million is no joke, and honestly is a bit over the top. I'm not sure Ron could pull off getting that money bomb/kickstarter whatever at this stage of the game. For a lot, I am sure their apathy has, rightfully, returned.

Be it as it may, unless some wealthy millionaire type steps up, I don't see this happening.

Lastly, I will leave off that I personally find this thread a bit offensive.

Carlybee
07-08-2013, 12:33 AM
Considering what we put up with during 2011-2012 with media bias and outright lies, I shouldn't need any marketing skills. It should be as easy as selling bananas to a monkey.

Apparently there are more bananas than monkeys. He has only a bit over 25K likes on the project's Facebook page. Someone should be working that around the clock to quadruple that. Have any potential big money donors been approached? You can be as insulting as you want to members here, but realistically you cannot nickel and dime your way to over a million dollars without large donations. This was way too ambitious a kickstarter to depend mostly on forum members. (I sincerely hope that wasn't the plan). People are basically being asked to provide seed money for a business start up. If you want to raise the money needed you are going to have to do a heck of a lot more than depend on little ol us and coming in here and trying to insult/guilt people into donating is just messed up. I have seen 3 kickstarters this year..2 failed to meet their goal and one barely made it's goal and they were all under 50k.

And I agree with Feelgood..people are bombed out. I get solicitations for money daily in my email from Rand Paul for RandPac and Ron Paul on behalf of C4L, and about 3 other people with C4L. Not to mention the Mises Institute and any other number of people/organizations who happen to have my email address.

Sola_Fide
07-08-2013, 12:41 AM
The liberty movement will always resemble a bowel movement because freedom attracts people who want to use their freedom in sometimes moral, theological, and philosophically base ways.

The invalid arguments, fallacies, and immoral trash I read sometimes on this website makes me want to flush the metaphorical toilet.

Bman
07-08-2013, 01:33 AM
Yes. It never lived up to the hype and many have gone home. Anyone trying to make a buck off this group may find some cash but they're going to have a hard time bringing in millions. The die hard base is too small and in it's own ways deeply divided.

pacelli
07-08-2013, 05:34 AM
This possibility of donor saturation was discussed in 2007, 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2012, and 2013. And the donations have tapered off over time, as predicted. Hell, Ron Paul himself predicted the economic collapse that we're experiencing right now. Its a shame that Ben wasn't around in 07 when blimps were being kept in the air by this forum at a cost of approximately $200k a month.

Bastiat's The Law
07-08-2013, 07:36 AM
I'm not sure I buy into the whole donations tapering off argument. Ron raised over 40 million dollars.

liveandletlive
07-08-2013, 07:48 AM
This is a worthwhile endeavor. Liberty is about educating people. More so than the pipe dream of getting Ron Paul or candidate X elected. We need to support more things like this. Ben Swan is a stand up guy

CaptUSA
07-08-2013, 07:49 AM
Considering what we put up with during 2011-2012 with media bias and outright lies, I shouldn't need any marketing skills. It should be as easy as selling bananas to a monkey.You see, that's my trepidation with this project. I am much more willing to put my money in the hands of people who have a way of selling bananas to elephants and donkeys. Sure, it'll make us feel good to have someone preaching to this choir, but in a practical sense, I'm more interested in growing the congregation. But that's just me. I wish Ben all the luck in the world!

Carlybee
07-08-2013, 08:14 AM
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?417364-PLEDGE-BOMB-for-Ben-Swann-s-quot-Liberty-Is-Rising-quot-Truth-in-Media-project&p=5115092&viewfull=1#post5115092

This ^

Bastiat's The Law
07-08-2013, 08:15 AM
This is a worthwhile endeavor. Liberty is about educating people. More so than the pipe dream of getting Ron Paul or candidate X elected. We need to support more things like this. Ben Swan is a stand up guy
I advocate doing both. They're not mutually exclusive endeavors. Having a liberty orientated network would do wonders for our potential candidates in the future, so they really compliment each other.

Barrex
07-08-2013, 08:16 AM
I mentioned before that 1.2 millions is too much...

Where there is a will there is a way.

If Ron got equipment he should/could and probably would give Ben to use it too. This would be mutually beneficial cooperation.

It is known that people on this forum are able to reach Ben Swann and Ron Paul. It is only logical that we put those two in contact and watch behind bushes what will they come up with. They could come to same conclusion let push them to make it sure.

There are people on this forum who got skills needed to make this project (web designers, software developers, artists, people who make youtube videos with graphic thingies.....) who could do a lot of work for Ben and reduce costs significantly.


No use from bickering.


What else can be done to make this happen?

PaulConventionWV
07-08-2013, 08:52 AM
Oh, RDM, when did you get so funny? What a funny title! It's just so funny, I can't get over it...

PaulConventionWV
07-08-2013, 08:57 AM
I will chime in on the "all or nothing" approach as well. The site certainly seems to talk up the goal, and goes so far as to say that all of the money is needed. There's no plan to do half as many shows if $x are raised instead. There's no talk of doing the most with what's raised.

There is, however, a strange need to scold people for not pledging to this. I have looked at it and personally do not see the value in donating. That's me, personally, and since I'm the one that is in charge of my money, that's how it's going to stay. I have to divert funds to a variety of personal expenses over the summer and fall. I can't see falling short on those goals and telling family and friends that I could not help them because I was helping someone fund their educational political programming efforts.

It would be great if it got funded, but I don't think chastising the same crowd that occasionally has to choose between food and donations in order to scrounge up $100 for the site's namesake(s) is going to be the way to fund it.

Melissa, maybe you missed the fact that ALL Kickstarter campaigns are all-or-nothing. The goal MUST be met or the project won't get funded at all. That's just the nature of Kickstarter, it's not Benn's fault. He can't do anything if he raises half the money because if that happens, he won't get any money!

RDM
07-08-2013, 05:04 PM
Oh, RDM, when did you get so funny? What a funny title! It's just so funny, I can't get over it...
I'm like a blind squirrel sometimes.

MelissaWV
07-08-2013, 05:24 PM
Melissa, maybe you missed the fact that ALL Kickstarter campaigns are all-or-nothing. The goal MUST be met or the project won't get funded at all. That's just the nature of Kickstarter, it's not Benn's fault. He can't do anything if he raises half the money because if that happens, he won't get any money!

Yes, and he chose Kickstarter. Maybe you missed that!

It's ridiculous to put that high a goal to something like this, and depend largely on grassroots to fund it. There are candidates that need funding for far less money, and can use every penny. There are people in a variety of personal situations that have cropped up of late. There are a number of folks scratching their way past the finish lines of their chosen educational paths. It'd be a wise idea to hit up a few larger donors rather than those who are only going to spare a bit here or there. Even if I tossed $5,000 at this, it would echo on its way in.

NoOneButPaul
07-08-2013, 06:45 PM
Swann made the mistake of doing this is an off-election year... had he waited for the midterms there'd be more activity.

ladyjade3
07-08-2013, 07:31 PM
I'm not surprised there is donor fatigue and people are bombed out. I think Kickstarter is worth a shot and I hope we get a last minute surge for him, but honestly, aren't we all sick to death of the charity model for liberty? We need to build something based on profitability and advertising. You know, how the rest of the world funds their media. Someone work that out please.

cajuncocoa
07-08-2013, 07:36 PM
I'm not surprised there is donor fatigue and people are bombed out. I think Kickstarter is worth a shot and I hope we get a last minute surge for him, but honestly, aren't we all sick to death of the charity model for liberty? We need to build something based on profitability and advertising. You know, how the rest of the world funds their media. Someone work that out please.

The problem I see with that is, the news organizations become dependent on those sources for their money allowing the donors to dictate what can and cannot be brought to light. (Exactly why we already have the media we do).

kcchiefs6465
07-09-2013, 01:32 AM
Truth be told, to those thinking political activism is the key, never going to happen.

Rand Paul won't be elected.

No one else will give a fuck aside from what their tv says.

Forgive me for speaking frankly about it.

RDM
07-09-2013, 06:30 AM
Truth be told, to those thinking political activism is the key, never going to happen.

Rand Paul won't be elected.

No one else will give a fuck aside from what their tv says.

Forgive me for speaking frankly about it.
Sadly, I'm beginning to accept that outcome.

jtap
07-09-2013, 07:19 AM
I think Ben was really hoping that he could get 125,000 Liberty loving individuals to donate $10 bucks (not that much to complain about or budget for) and use the power of volume. Up against such a huge deficit and such low numbers of people donating it seems a daunting task, because it is.

The disappointing thing to me and I assume to him is the small number of people getting involved. Considering the amount of people in this country you wouldn't think it would be that hard. So, the question is: is it a problem of marketing and spreading the word or lack of people that care?

Carlybee
07-09-2013, 07:41 AM
Truth be told, to those thinking political activism is the key, never going to happen.

Rand Paul won't be elected.

No one else will give a fuck aside from what their tv says.

Forgive me for speaking frankly about it.

Yes and the GOP cheating during the nomination process will have nothing to do with it...the silencing delegates or stomping on people or locking them out. Instead the grass roots will get blamed that they didn't do enough. That's how that's going to play out.

ClydeCoulter
07-09-2013, 08:57 AM
Yes and the GOP cheating during the nomination process will have nothing to do with it...the silencing delegates or stomping on people or locking them out. Instead the grass roots will get blamed that they didn't do enough. That's how that's going to play out.

Can't rep you again, right now. Someone cover me?

AuH2O
07-09-2013, 09:30 AM
The reason is, simply, that this Ben Swann thing -- and Ben Swann himself -- are not widely known or marketed. As a casual observer of these liberty boards, I only knew a little bit about him. I know even less about the project, and less still about why I ought to donate to it.

The idea that it could easily raise $2.5 million dollars -- and the shock that it hasn't -- is indicative of a not-so-accurate awareness of the project has a whole ... probably as a result of spending too much time in a liberty movement echo chamber.

cajuncocoa
07-09-2013, 10:00 AM
Can't rep you again, right now. Someone cover me?

Got it.

FSP-Rebel
07-09-2013, 10:00 AM
Yes and the GOP cheating during the nomination process will have nothing to do with it...the silencing delegates or stomping on people or locking them out. Instead the grass roots will get blamed that they didn't do enough. That's how that's going to play out.
You can't expect to do a delegate strategy at the last minute during a presidential primary w/ an insurgent candidate that has been dragged through the mud in every way imaginable and not encounter the types of pullback that we witnessed. Rand is clearly running a real primary campaign and not focusing so much on supporters being delegates as the rules haven't been changed back despite the efforts of the additionally elected people we got on the RNC. I can understand the defeatist sentiments from those in areas w/ not-so-active liberty groups and thus the feeling of despair rises to the top yet it's on you to get the ball rolling on something and get others to join your team. I care not how libertarian someone is if they are inactive and useless. Heck, I'd even qualify LP activism at this point for the uppity folks that can't play well with conservatives, just do something.

Regarding this Swann situation, the man clearly was aiming too high out of the gate and shouldn't have relied upon his FB likes or those that said they'd be attending this kickstarter as usually only 10-25% of people actually end up following through on a verbal commitment. I agree that this mission is important and it will be a shame if it doesn't pan out but it's not like he can't reassess the situation and/or find himself employed at the Blaze or another local tv station, he and his fam won't starve I'm sure. Frankly, what surprised me in this whole thing is that Ron is hanging him out to dry so far. Ben went over and beyond to broadcast the convention irregularities as well as topics that no one else would yet not much in return. If a person is a champion to your cause you never leave them hanging especially if you want more of what they have to offer. I was gonna stay out of this thread altogether but since the usuals have turned it into something against Rand, I had to chime in.

Carlybee
07-09-2013, 10:16 AM
You can't expect to do a delegate strategy at the last minute during a presidential primary w/ an insurgent candidate that has been dragged through the mud in every way imaginable and not encounter the types of pullback that we witnessed. Rand is clearly running a real primary campaign and not focusing so much on supporters being delegates as the rules haven't been changed back despite the efforts of the additionally elected people we got on the RNC. I can understand the defeatist sentiments from those in areas w/ not-so-active liberty groups and thus the feeling of despair rises to the top yet it's on you to get the ball rolling on something and get others to join your team. I care not how libertarian someone is if they are inactive and useless. Heck, I'd even qualify LP activism at this point for the uppity folks that can't play well with conservatives, just do something.

Regarding this Swann situation, the man clearly was aiming too high out of the gate and shouldn't have relied upon his FB likes or those that said they'd be attending this kickstarter as usually only 10-25% of people actually end up following through on a verbal commitment. I agree that this mission is important and it will be a shame if it doesn't pan out but it's not like he can't reassess the situation and/or find himself employed at the Blaze or another local tv station, he and his fam won't starve I'm sure. Frankly, what surprised me in this whole thing is that Ron is hanging him out to dry so far. Ben went over and beyond to broadcast the convention irregularities as well as topics that no one else would yet not much in return. If a person is a champion to your cause you never leave them hanging especially if you want more of what they have to offer. I was gonna stay out of this thread altogether but since the usuals have turned it into something against Rand, I had to chime in.

Correct me if I'm wrong but Ron started his own media project before Ben did..I am sure his resources are tied up with that.

FSP-Rebel
07-09-2013, 10:29 AM
Correct me if I'm wrong but Ron started his own media project before Ben did..I am sure his resources are tied up with that.
I was under the assumption that he and Ron had met on more than just a few occasions and that this is why Ben felt he could stretch his wings so far like he's doing now. In regards to Ron, I thought he was doing his podcast thing and some internet tv related thing so yeah. The only thing I can think of in Ron's defense is that he let Ben have his way with raising money that would otherwise go to his endeavor. Seems to me that if the community including Ron wants to see a liberty related tv thing popping off, we'd want a super intelligent, charismatic and lady's man kinda guy who is fairly young enough to build a huge brand going forward. It is what it is and we'll just have to set our sights on something else and move along if the chips fall out of place.

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 10:31 AM
To those of you who voted YES, remember, you just called yourselves pieces of shit.

Carlybee
07-09-2013, 10:57 AM
Ben just posted on FB there would be a big announcement this week regarding the kickstarter.

truthsaga
07-09-2013, 11:22 AM
Personally, I prefer a journalist with Liberty in their hearts and mind - rather than those with blood on their hands for blatantly lying to the people..

Barrex
07-10-2013, 08:04 AM
Swann made the mistake of doing this is an off-election year... had he waited for the midterms there'd be more activity.
And when similar project was asking for money during election year people said during election year people are forucsed on political donation soo....

To those of you who voted YES, remember, you just called yourselves pieces of shit.

He he... I thought it is funny that is why I voted YES ;)



People have unreasonable expectations and wrong picture of situation and then get disappointed...

Uriah
07-10-2013, 03:12 PM
I don't know if the liberty movement has but I have them on a regular basis.

azxd
07-16-2013, 02:25 PM
LOL
The whole thing is a sick joke.

You're seriously fooling yourself, if you think you can effect real change.

jtap
07-16-2013, 02:40 PM
Ben just posted on FB there would be a big announcement this week regarding the kickstarter.

I am assuming this announcement was that he would do a fraction of the episodes if the people who have pledged would move their pledge donations to paypal from amazon so that he got the money since the kickstarter won't get funded.

I'm surprised that no one is talking about that here.

bolil
07-17-2013, 05:11 PM
The liberty movement, or whatever it is, has not become shit... but it may have become exhausted. Enthusiasm, especially the shared brand seen in groups, has peaks and valleys. Give it some time, and the 'movement' or whatever (that is to say people who value liberty above almost everything else) will be back with a vengeance. Ron Paul retiring was not a grave blow, but it removed a common thread.

Peace&Freedom
07-18-2013, 06:32 AM
The liberty movement is simply taking a break, and perhaps de-coupling itself from being (or becoming) simply a personality cult around Ron Paul. There was a movement before Paul's GOP campaigns caused it to make a quantum leap in terms of further growing as a national grassroots network, and the movement will continue after the time of the Pauls as well.

And it still has some flaws to overcome---its too-often expressed hostility towards religious conservatives who could be its biggest voting bloc, its similar estrangement of 9-11 truth, and the distraction with the "reform the GOP" effort that is siphoning off much of the energy of the movement (trying to cast out Satan from within Satan's house).

Anti Federalist
07-18-2013, 08:10 AM
You would think the anti-political approach members would be all over this effort. They're all talk.

Bite me.

I donated $200.

You?

Anti Federalist
07-18-2013, 08:11 AM
The liberty movement, or whatever it is, has not become shit... but it may have become exhausted. Enthusiasm, especially the shared brand seen in groups, has peaks and valleys. Give it some time, and the 'movement' or whatever (that is to say people who value liberty above almost everything else) will be back with a vengeance. Ron Paul retiring was not a grave blow, but it removed a common thread.

A common thread that some people insist on breaking.

matt0611
07-18-2013, 10:05 AM
I donated. I think its a worthwhile cause. Ben Swann is pretty great. Hopefully this gets funded.

Bastiat's The Law
07-18-2013, 10:29 AM
Bite me.

I donated $200.

You?

I find it a self-aggrandizing to publicly announce donations, so I choose to keep that private.

Bastiat's The Law
07-18-2013, 10:33 AM
I think the liberty movement is just turning the page, some faster than others. Things will begin to heat up again, especially when we realize how much muscle we can flex when we put our minds to do so.

Occam's Banana
07-18-2013, 12:05 PM
And [the liberty movement] still has some flaws to overcome [such as] the distraction with the "reform the GOP" effort that is siphoning off much of the energy of the movement (trying to cast out Satan from within Satan's house).

I am not persuaded that this is true (the "siphoning off" part - not the "trying to cast out Satan" bit, which is separate issue altogether).

It's very analogous to a critique you'll often encounter in open source circles. The argument is that there are "too many" Linux distros or "too many" command shells or "too many" variants of this, that or the other open source project - and that the existence of so many separate & distinct projects devoted to the same general purpose "siphons off" support and development from the "better" or "more worthy" projects. One of the problems with this criticism (apart from its question-begging & inherently subjective assumptions regarding what projects are to be considered as "better" or "more worthy") is that it presumes without evidence that the efforts that go into, say, creating yet another command shell program would have gone into improving and advancing an already-well-established command shell (such as `bash`). But this is an extremely dubious premise. The very fact that new command-shell projects are started (despite the fact that command shells such as `bash` already exist) indicates (by the demonstrated preferences of the participants) that the premise is false.

As it is applied to the "reform the GOP" project in the liberty movement, this "siphoning off" criticism presumes (again, without evidence) that the resources of those who prefer the "reform the GOP" strategy would have gone into supporting some other particular project(s) (were they to eschew the "reform the GOP" approach). But - as is the case for open source projects - this simply does not follow.

This alleged "siphoning off" phenomenon is NOT a "flaw" in the liberty movement - any more than it is in the open source movement. In fact, if anything, it is one of the greatest strengths of the liberty movement (and the open source movement). It is an inherent & inescapable feature of spontaneous order & decentralized organization. And as frustrating as it might be (especially for those who have preferences for "projects" other than those that seem to get the most attention & support), it truly *is* a feature - not a "bug" ...

Occam's Banana
07-18-2013, 12:18 PM
You would think the anti-political approach members would be all over this effort. They're all talk.


I donated $200.


I find it a self-aggrandizing to publicly announce donations, so I choose to keep that private.

So let me get this straight. You pompously & self-righteously accuse "non-political" people of being "all talk."

But when "non-political" people (AF, in this case) show you that you are wrong, you accuse them of "self-aggrandizement."

WTF kind of mealy-mouthed "damned if you do, damned if you don't" bullshit is that? SMGDH ...

jtap
07-18-2013, 01:22 PM
I find it a self-aggrandizing to publicly announce donations, so I choose to keep that private.

I didn't feel super comfortable announcing my donation but the thread to keep track of how much was donated by rpf people got me to break my rule.

Anti Federalist
07-18-2013, 08:24 PM
I find it a self-aggrandizing to publicly announce donations, so I choose to keep that private.

Soooo...let me see if I have this straight:

If you donate to cause xyz, you find it is self-aggrandizing to post what you have donated. And that's cool.

But if other people, who think differently about things, do the same thing, then they are all a bunch of no-good cheapskate blowhards.

Got it.