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Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 03:50 PM
The following is a response to a member who I am having a conversation with in PMs.

I hope they don't mind me posting this, but it doesn't identify who they are, and after reading it, I'm wondering if I'm just too dark, or am I pretty close to the mark?

The person in question is asking about "hot tyranny" and how bad are things, really?

````````````````````

We're already boiled my friend.

We are 24 hours away from death camps and mass graves.

All it will take is a "terror" attack, real or manufactured (for the record, in case you didn't know, I'm a 9/11 "Truther") that kills 30,000, or 300,000 or 3 million.

The next day, tanks would roll, the "Enabling Acts" that have already been passed would get kicked into high gear and it would be lights out.

And the people will cheer and encourage it with thunderous applause.

This nation will consume itself in an orgy of death, bloodshed and fear, the likes of which mankind has not seen before.

God's retribution for the 60 million or so unborn and the millions more killed by the Empire over the last 100 years, perhaps.

And to answer your question, yes, a "hot" tyranny would let some of us survive. It lends an air of credibility: "See, we're not so bad, we allow dissent". But enough are thrown in prison or "eliminated" so as to get the rest to shut up and speak in hushed whispers, and qualify everything we say with "Not that I advocate violence".

Just like we do now.

The Soviet Union at it's Stalinist worst, did not imprison, as a percentage of population, as many as we have in prison now.

I have come 180 degrees in my thinking on this...so call me a hypocrite if you like, but I'm an older man looking back on what has been and looking forward to what's coming, and I am in complete earnest when I tell you this:

Get the fuck out. NOW! Before you are tied down with bills and family and school and work and homes and mortgages and everything else.

Make a run for it...like Ed Snowden, it doesn't matter anymore, just go, anywhere and start a life as best you can.

Maybe I'm totally wrong, but I don't think so...the situation in this country after an attack like I just mentioned will be untenable, it will be unsurvivable.

``````````````

Can you really call that living?

No wonder millions and millions are on prescription mood pills.

TheTexan
07-07-2013, 03:53 PM
The conditions are right for a hot tyranny. The only thing I'm not sure of is, when it will happen, or who will be gas-chambered. I'm thinking it will either be right wing extremists, or the mooslims. Or both. Or whatever ethnicity/ideology blows up the next building.

In any case, my plan has been to GTFO for some time now. I'm a bit behind schedule. Need to hurry up...

Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 03:55 PM
The conditions are right for a hot tyranny. The only thing I'm not sure of is, when it will happen, or who will be gas-chambered. I'm thinking it will either be right wing extremists, or the mooslims. Or both. Or whatever ethnicity/ideology blows up the next building.

Whichever one they said blew up the buildings, released the choking bio-weapon plague or set off the nuke downtown.

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 04:04 PM
I was the member he was talking too, and yeah, I don't mind you posting this: especially considering you posted your words and not mine anyway.

I'll leave (Probably reworded) part of my response open:

What on earth would be the point of leaving? What do I have to gain?

I feel like if we totally lose this country, I seriously doubt some random third world country will remain free.

Of course, my belief in Christianity may be biasing me here. I know the Great Tribulation is going to happen at some point. The Beast will be allowed to rule over the entire earth. I don't know if that beast IS America or if America will be gone by then, but I can't imagine America still being the global empire, actually going full on, open tyranny (Rather than the concealed, stealthy quasi-tyranny we have now), and being able to live free in some other country.

Besides, my family is all here. Without them, what's the point? I'm young, its true, but I'd honestly rather commit my life to fighting than to just flee.

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 04:06 PM
I should also say, while I am no means perfect, I do believe my educating of people I know about what's going on is useful. At the time where I feel this ceases to be the case, or where enough people around me "Get it", I'm willing to try something more drastic. If the government ever does something clearly evil against someone in my family, I'll be ready to fight back.

Until then, I'm willing to give education a shot.

But I don't see why leaving is a good idea.

MelissaWV
07-07-2013, 04:10 PM
Yes.

Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 04:11 PM
Well, then, God bless you brother, and maybe we'll meet in the camps or the front line.

Or maybe you can avenge me.

We'll see what is going to happen, who knows, maybe we'll turn it around, but I don't think it will be too long before things are settled one way or the other.


I was the member he was talking too, and yeah, I don't mind you posting this: especially considering you posted your words and not mine anyway.

I'll leave (Probably reworded) part of my response open:

What on earth would be the point of leaving? What do I have to gain?

I feel like if we totally lose this country, I seriously doubt some random third world country will remain free.

Of course, my belief in Christianity may be biasing me here. I know the Great Tribulation is going to happen at some point. The Beast will be allowed to rule over the entire earth. I don't know if that beast IS America or if America will be gone by then, but I can't imagine America still being the global empire, actually going full on, open tyranny (Rather than the concealed, stealthy quasi-tyranny we have now), and being able to live free in some other country.

Besides, my family is all here. Without them, what's the point? I'm young, its true, but I'd honestly rather commit my life to fighting than to just flee.

Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 04:11 PM
Yes.

OK.

:D

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 04:13 PM
Well, then, God bless you brother, and maybe we'll meet in the camps or the front line.

Or maybe you can avenge me.

We'll see what is going to happen, who knows, maybe we'll turn it around, but I don't think it will be too long before things are settled one way or the other.

I wish I had had more practice with guns than I am now.

My approach is likely to be more peaceful than violent. My goal is to get a career in education: can put my history knowledge to good use and hopefully impact my students by some knowledge about how different it used to be.

That said, if it comes down to it, I'm not afraid to physically fight. The question is, when death is by a thousand cuts, its hard to know the breaking point...

TheTexan
07-07-2013, 04:13 PM
What on earth would be the point of leaving? What do I have to gain?

The point is to go whereever your freedom is maximized. This is different for different people. It might be somewhere in the US. It might not.

Bottom line is, we could very well be waiting here in the US for this to change for the rest of our lives. So if you aren't tied down, I think it makes sense to move to somewhere you perceive as more free.

Some people can call that giving up. Yes, it is, but it's only giving up on this country. An abstract concept, that I personally have no loyalty to. Just because I change geography, doesn't mean I'll stop fighting.

TheTexan
07-07-2013, 04:16 PM
And also, this country is experiencing the biggest artificial wealth bubble in the history of mankind. When that shit pops, you don't want to be here.

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 04:20 PM
Ok,, I'm course and blunt. I make no claim of any "perfection".
But I am a believer. In God and in the Bible and in Christ. Perhaps not the best example of a Christian,, but none the less,, a believer.

These things were foretold 2000 years ago.. It has nothing to do with the US,, or the Soviets or any nations rightness or wrongness.

this is about a battle that began long before man walked the earth.
And no,, there is no place to run. It is time to choose.

RickyJ
07-07-2013, 04:22 PM
You are not grim enough! Death would be better than being a slave to these people and living in fear of them. They have already won! They don't need to kill us all to have that victory, they just need you to stay afraid of them and not tell people what is going on. As long as you don't upset their apple cart they will let you live, but what kind of life will it be?

presence
07-07-2013, 04:22 PM
And no,, there is no place to run. It is time to choose.


I choose hillbilly hermit. Let the crazies have at it.

amy31416
07-07-2013, 04:27 PM
I don't have the first clue as to what will happen or whether AF is Chicken Little or Paul Revere.

I suggest a houseboat--and a moped or motorcycle.

heavenlyboy34
07-07-2013, 04:30 PM
AF is more realistic than grim. :)

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 04:32 PM
I choose hillbilly hermit. Let the crazies have at it.

It may be possible to hide in the hills,,
It is possible to delay it as well.. but eventually (and I believe soon) there will be a One World Government.
Many have been working toward that end,, and only the resistance has held it off.

It will come,, If you fight it,,you will die.. if you resist without violence you will suffer. If you accept it and join it you will be damned.

AF is not TOO GRIM. Hard times are coming. And hard choices too.

phill4paul
07-07-2013, 04:36 PM
Sounds about right AF.

oyarde
07-07-2013, 04:49 PM
I am drinking a glass of wine , zeroing a rifle. Most people have probably never seen grim before .I have.I will not be leaving though, I have seen all the lands , I can die here .

cjm
07-07-2013, 04:50 PM
Is my outlook too grim?

If you believe this is all a done deal, then yes, I would say your outlook is too grim. To think the hot tyranny would never happen is ridiculous, and I think a certain level of grimness is appropriate given the trends over our lifetimes, but there are other possibilities and if you are not acknowledging them, then I would say your outlook is too grim (since you asked).

I read a book a while back that had a great quotation about freedom:


Freedom is nothing but the habit of choice. Now choice is remarkably wide in this life. Each day begins with the choice of tying one's left or right shoelace first, and ends with the choice of observing or ignoring the providence of God.

Milton Mayer, They Thought They Were Free: The Germans 1933-45 (http://www.alibris.com/They-thought-they-were-free-the-Germans-1933-45-Milton-Sanford-Mayer/book/6660261?matches=28&cm_sp=works*listing*title)

The outcome you described in the PM is one of many possible outcomes. The choices we (and they) make will determine which one we eventually see. I could blather on about the many outcomes but I'll just say I'm working for one that's different than the one you describe. Sounding the alarm to what's going on is an important part of avoiding a hot tyranny, but telling people to leave when this is the place that has seen the most freedom in modern history means losing resources that can help us avoid that hot tyranny. If people need to leave, they need to leave -- I'm only here because my ancestors left their homelands. But leaving isn't the only option. Get active, get involved.


What on earth would be the point of leaving? What do I have to gain?

There is plenty to be gained by leaving, but as you noted in your post (your family is here, etc), there are also costs. When I looked at the costs and benefits of various places to live, I ended up in south western Virginia and as the song goes, "in Dixie land I'll take my stand..."

RickyJ
07-07-2013, 04:50 PM
Ok,, I'm course and blunt. I make no claim of any "perfection".
But I am a believer. In God and in the Bible and in Christ. Perhaps not the best example of a Christian,, but none the less,, a believer.

These things were foretold 2000 years ago.. It has nothing to do with the US,, or the Soviets or any nations rightness or wrongness.

this is about a battle that began long before man walked the earth.
And no,, there is no place to run. It is time to choose.

I am a Christian and I use to think this way too, not any more. We have no sure way of knowing these are the last days. Every generation thinks they are living in the last days, and so far every one of them have been wrong. Satan loves for Christians to think there is nothing they can do to stop his evil deeds when that is not true at all.

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 04:57 PM
I am a Christian and I use to think this way too, not any more. We have no sure way of knowing these are the last days. Every generation thinks they are living in the last days, and so far every one of them have been wrong. Satan loves for Christians to think there is nothing they can do to stop his evil deeds when that is not true at all.
Salt is a preservative. Why do you suppose we are supposed to be salt?

You are the salt of the earth: but if the salt has lost its savor, how shall it be salted? it is thereafter good for nothing, but to be cast out, and to be trodden under foot of men.
It is Lucifer's intention to rule the earth. A position he will attain at some point.
The only thing preventing that is the resistance to that idea.
Christ's return will be to remove him from his throne.

The League of Nations,, and the UN are attempts toward world government.. Each came about following a world war.

They say "third times the charm". :(

Cleaner44
07-07-2013, 05:02 PM
Not too grim, but I don't think running is the answer. The problem is global. One World Government... the New World Order. Tyrants are everywhere. schemers are everywhere, statists and central planners are everywhere. The highest concentration of humans that want liberty I believe are here in the U.S. and here we have the weapons to fight for freedom. Many Americans are certainly in a slumber and many are lovers of the state, but we have a history and the means to oppose tyrants. This will be the front line in the fight for human freedom and I think it is worth fighting for. I have to die sometime, so I don't mind it my life is used in the effort to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

mad cow
07-07-2013, 05:04 PM
I choose hillbilly hermit. Let the crazies have at it.

The best option.There are places in the world with one cop/1000 square miles with more oppressive laws where you would be better off.
There are places in the world with 1000 cops/square mile with less oppressive laws where you would be worse off.


Best bet is to isolate yourself from authority as best you can.I would feel safer as a hillbilly hermit it Kentucky,say,than in the Capitol of whatever country is currently considered the safest in the world.

gwax23
07-07-2013, 05:08 PM
It wont be the end of the world or some religious apocalypse.

Sure there will be a huge economic collapse, the government will get bigger and more tyrannical...but this isnt new. This has happened many times in Human history. Life goes on. Dictatorships rise and fall. So do economies.

Civil Unrest, war, poverty, it should be expected but if you think these are the end days your way off. If anything the prosperity, stability, and peace most of us have experienced in our lives is unusual. Most of human history its suffering.

If anything though you should be more positive. The chaos and collapse brings many new opportunities.

As far as running somewhere...depends where. Many places will be worse. I do suggest second citizenship and passports though. Im doing that.

cjm
07-07-2013, 05:08 PM
The best option.There are places in the world with one cop/1000 square miles with more oppressive laws where you would be better off.
There are places in the world with 1000 cops/square mile with less oppressive laws where you would be worse off.


Best bet is to isolate yourself from authority as best you can.I would feel safer as a hillbilly hermit it Kentucky,say,than in the Capitol of whatever country is currently considered the safest in the world.

This is correct. Whatever one chooses, densely populated areas are bad news in all countries.

Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 05:11 PM
Good to see all the feedback, that was one of the reasons I posted, so as not to give FF such a one sided view.

Scrapmo
07-07-2013, 05:17 PM
Im just going to copy my response to FF about this subject from another thread.







FF-
I could be wrong, but I've always wondered if this mentality was kind of a "The grass is greener" mentality. Is it ACTUALLY better anywhere else? (And I mean for the average individual, obviously a drug user would be better off in the Netherlands, while someone like Edward Snowden would clearly be better off anywhere than here). Or is there just not any such thing as real freedom anywhere?

I have no illusions of finding a libertarian utopia. The idea of "better" is subjective. We are not the most economically free country nor are we the most socially free country, we are definitely the most militiristic and imperialistic country and I expect all these things to get worse. And when this country starts to unravel we will see a police state that will rival any throughout history. I have no intention of living in a police state.

Even as bad is America is right now it is still tolerable (for lack of a better word). Its not America now, its America 10,15,20 years from now that I will abandon. I belive in that time period there will be several places that would be better than here. So I will stay and place sandbags and fight, delay, obstruct the flood until it ineveitably rises and washes freedom away from this land for good. And it will. The people in this country have made it clear that they have no desire to be free. Control is comfort. Control is easy. At some point I will lose intrest in fighting for those who will not only, not fight to remove thier own chains, but also actively pursue to enslave me as well.


FF-
We also have a constitution which means we technically have a lot of legal latitude: granted they won't actually listen to us but we can actually use the constitution to convince people the government is breaking the law and that resistance is not breaking the law.

The Vast majority of the American public has not read the constitution, nor do they care whats in it. As long as they have thier creature comforts, they will not be stired to action.


FF-
You don't really have that elsewhere.

Lots of countries have constitutions. Some of them are more free economically and less socially free. Some are more socially free and less economically free. Pick your poison.

I suggest doing some travelling while your young and uninhibited if you can. There are some other places in the world besides the USof A that are quite nice. I have some friends, and Ron Paul supporters, who moved to New Zealand sometime back. It has some things I dont like but it is overall a good alternative. And if the world is going to burn, why not watch it from the most beautiful place on the planet.

tod evans
07-07-2013, 05:20 PM
Ok,, I'm course and blunt. I make no claim of any "perfection".
But I am a believer. In God and in the Bible and in Christ. Perhaps not the best example of a Christian,, but none the less,, a believer.

These things were foretold 2000 years ago.. It has nothing to do with the US,, or the Soviets or any nations rightness or wrongness.

this is about a battle that began long before man walked the earth.
And no,, there is no place to run. It is time to choose.


I choose hillbilly hermit. Let the crazies have at it.

Not too grim, but I don't think running is the answer. The problem is global. One World Government... the New World Order. Tyrants are everywhere. schemers are everywhere, statists and central planners are everywhere. The highest concentration of humans that want liberty I believe are here in the U.S. and here we have the weapons to fight for freedom. Many Americans are certainly in a slumber and many are lovers of the state, but we have a history and the means to oppose tyrants. This will be the front line in the fight for human freedom and I think it is worth fighting for. I have to die sometime, so I don't mind it my life is used in the effort to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.


The best option.There are places in the world with one cop/1000 square miles with more oppressive laws where you would be better off.
There are places in the world with 1000 cops/square mile with less oppressive laws where you would be worse off.

Best bet is to isolate yourself from authority as best you can.I would feel safer as a hillbilly hermit it Kentucky,say,than in the Capitol of whatever country is currently considered the safest in the world.


This is correct. Whatever one chooses, densely populated areas are bad news in all countries.


I'm in this boat.

Old, set in my ways and out in the sticks.

When the SHTF the cities will be hell on earth.

Pick a part of the country where you can get along with your neighbors, you'll need each other!

Meatwasp
07-07-2013, 05:34 PM
Walk in the grave yards and you will surly waste your youth and stay grim.

oyarde
07-07-2013, 05:35 PM
The following is a response to a member who I am having a conversation with in PMs.

I hope they don't mind me posting this, but it doesn't identify who they are, and after reading it, I'm wondering if I'm just too dark, or am I pretty close to the mark?

The person in question is asking about "hot tyranny" and how bad are things, really?

````````````````````


``````````````

Can you really call that living?

No wonder millions and millions are on prescription mood pills.

I do not see it as too grim , more as focused.

limequat
07-07-2013, 05:58 PM
It's not that bad...

1) You Christians need to relax a little. Christianity requires you to be a fatalist (it's all written in the book). Don't do it. Our time here is a tiny little slice, don't waste it thinking that your fate is sealed.

2) As bad as it is now, imagine being alive in the midst of WW2. FDR caused/allowed the bombing of Pearl Harbor and indirectly the deaths of how many Americans? A new deal? I can't imagine experience that shit first hand.

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 06:21 PM
It's not that bad...

1) You Christians need to relax a little. Christianity requires you to be a fatalist (it's all written in the book). Don't do it. Our time here is a tiny little slice, don't waste it thinking that your fate is sealed.

2) As bad as it is now, imagine being alive in the midst of WW2. FDR caused/allowed the bombing of Pearl Harbor and indirectly the deaths of how many Americans? A new deal? I can't imagine experience that shit first hand.

Fatalist? You misunderstand entirely..


I will deliver this people from the power of the grave; I will redeem them from death. Where, O death, are your plagues? Where, O grave, is your destruction?

So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory. 55O death, where is your sting? O grave, where is your victory?


Oh, and I was stationed at Schofield Barracks in the Army. I went to sleep looking at the bullet holes in the wall.
I am a realist.

muh_roads
07-07-2013, 06:31 PM
There is nothing wrong with keeping up on news. The problem is that it can be information overload for people that can't separate their productivity from their private time to read about what is going on.

I have this problem myself sometimes.

If reading the grim outlook stories is getting in the way of bettering yourself to make more money for you and your family, then it is counterproductive and more harmful than good for that particular individual that has a difficult time detaching when it is needed.

69360
07-07-2013, 06:39 PM
A little grim. I've been hearing the same talk for the last 20 years. Maybe some of that would happen in the big cities. But where I live I don't have much to worry about.

Philhelm
07-07-2013, 07:47 PM
Evacuate? In our moment of triumph? I think you overestimate their chances.

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 07:53 PM
The point is to go whereever your freedom is maximized. This is different for different people. It might be somewhere in the US. It might not.

Bottom line is, we could very well be waiting here in the US for this to change for the rest of our lives. So if you aren't tied down, I think it makes sense to move to somewhere you perceive as more free.

Some people can call that giving up. Yes, it is, but it's only giving up on this country. An abstract concept, that I personally have no loyalty to. Just because I change geography, doesn't mean I'll stop fighting.

Its not that I think you're a bad person if you decide to go somewhere else. I'm just not sure it matters.

What is there to gain by leaving? I feel like if this country fully shows its colors and goes full tyrant I don't see anywhere else in the world escaping its grasp.

We are Rome.


Not too grim, but I don't think running is the answer. The problem is global. One World Government... the New World Order. Tyrants are everywhere. schemers are everywhere, statists and central planners are everywhere. The highest concentration of humans that want liberty I believe are here in the U.S. and here we have the weapons to fight for freedom. Many Americans are certainly in a slumber and many are lovers of the state, but we have a history and the means to oppose tyrants. This will be the front line in the fight for human freedom and I think it is worth fighting for. I have to die sometime, so I don't mind it my life is used in the effort to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

This is essentially how I feel.


Good to see all the feedback, that was one of the reasons I posted, so as not to give FF such a one sided view.

Thanks.

I trust the advice I'll get here more than I do anywhere else. My family is solid for spiritual advice but I am practically their source on political related stuff.

It's not that bad...

1) You Christians need to relax a little. Christianity requires you to be a fatalist (it's all written in the book). Don't do it. Our time here is a tiny little slice, don't waste it thinking that your fate is sealed.

My fate is sealed in God's eyes as he is outside time.

My fate is not sealed from my perspective as I am inside time. I still have choices to make.
2) As bad as it is now, imagine being alive in the midst of WW2. FDR caused/allowed the bombing of Pearl Harbor and indirectly the deaths of how many Americans? A new deal? I can't imagine experience that shit first hand.[/QUOTE]


Evacuate? In our moment of triumph? I think you overestimate their chances.

LOL!

Do you really think we're gonna win?

Philhelm
07-07-2013, 07:58 PM
I quoted Peter Cushing from Star Wars...

oyarde
07-07-2013, 08:05 PM
Its not that I think you're a bad person if you decide to go somewhere else. I'm just not sure it matters.

What is there to gain by leaving? I feel like if this country fully shows its colors and goes full tyrant I don't see anywhere else in the world escaping its grasp.

We are Rome.



This is essentially how I feel.



Thanks.

I trust the advice I'll get here more than I do anywhere else. My family is solid for spiritual advice but I am practically their source on political related stuff.


My fate is sealed in God's eyes as he is outside time.

My fate is not sealed from my perspective as I am inside time. I still have choices to make.
2) As bad as it is now, imagine being alive in the midst of WW2. FDR caused/allowed the bombing of Pearl Harbor and indirectly the deaths of how many Americans? A new deal? I can't imagine experience that shit first hand.



LOL!

Do you really think we're gonna win?[/QUOTE]

Yes , I think I will win :) , I may not , but I believe I will .

mad cow
07-07-2013, 08:05 PM
I quoted Peter Cushing from Star Wars...

I think Spock has a better sense of humor than some here....naming no names.

tod evans
07-07-2013, 08:07 PM
I'll take several with me if I go..:cool:

Anti Federalist
07-07-2013, 09:38 PM
Evacuate? In our moment of triumph? I think you overestimate their chances.

These aren't the droids you're looking for.

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 09:46 PM
I'll take several with me if I go..:cool:

I have had that attitude a lot. But am not really sure what I will do.

Part of me wonders if I could have Christ's love and commitment,, and accept whatever comes.

And he went a little farther, and fell on his face, and prayed, saying, O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless not as I will, but as you will.

But my nature is that of my namesake. especially if others are threatened.
I would likely be tempted to cut off a High Priest's servants ear.

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 09:51 PM
But my nature is that of my namesake. especially if others are threatened.
I would likely be tempted to cut off a High Priest's servants ear.




Well, Jesus was kind of predestined to die. I'd be curious what Sola_Fide thinks of this one, but I don't think its prohibitng all defensive violence.

amy31416
07-07-2013, 09:52 PM
Eventually, we win--I just don't know how long it takes. They're the parasites, without us, they're dead.

FindLiberty
07-07-2013, 09:53 PM
Keep the faith friends, though...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Drkh0YLF8rI

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 10:11 PM
Well, Jesus was kind of predestined to die. I'd be curious what Sola_Fide thinks of this one, but I don't think its prohibitng all defensive violence.
I know what Jesus said.

Then said Jesus unto him, Put up again your sword into its place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword.


…51And, behold, one of them which were with Jesus stretched out his hand, and drew his sword, and struck a servant of the high priest's, and smote off his ear. 52Then said Jesus to him, Put up again your sword into his place: for all they that take the sword shall perish with the sword. 53Think you that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels? …


9If any man have an ear, let him hear. 10He that leads into captivity shall go into captivity: he that kills with the sword must be killed with the sword. Here is the patience and the faith of the saints.


And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them, and judgment was given unto them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshipped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned with Christ a thousand years.

oyarde
07-07-2013, 10:17 PM
I have had that attitude a lot. But am not really sure what I will do.

Part of me wonders if I could have Christ's love and commitment,, and accept whatever comes.


But my nature is that of my namesake. especially if others are threatened.
I would likely be tempted to cut off a High Priest's servants ear.

Yeah , well , we can accept whatever comes , after we do our best :)

cjm
07-07-2013, 10:27 PM
Eventually, we win--I just don't know how long it takes. They're the parasites, without us, they're dead.

+rep. well put.

Christian Liberty
07-07-2013, 10:29 PM
I know what Jesus said.

God forgive me: I'll fight.

pcosmar
07-07-2013, 11:09 PM
God forgive me: I'll fight.

I very well may as well, as I said, I don't really know.

And forgiveness ,,He is known for. But that doesn't mean that I won't be killed. Just as He said would happen.
I may be killed not fighting as well.

won't know till that day comes.

Reason
07-07-2013, 11:22 PM
I have never heard this term "hot tyranny" before...

Yet I have read just about every SHTF book known to man...

kcchiefs6465
07-08-2013, 01:12 AM
But enough are thrown in prison or "eliminated" so as to get the rest to shut up and speak in hushed whispers, and qualify everything we say with "Not that I advocate violence".

I like that. Wiser words are hardly spoken.

kcchiefs6465
07-08-2013, 01:28 AM
Eventually, we win--I just don't know how long it takes. They're the parasites, without us, they're dead.
This is why propaganda is so dangerous.

It really will not take a majority. They fear it.. indeed they have contingencies in place. What if the people rise? I have no doubt that their power and status means enough that they'd do whatever to maintain it. A false flag, not to use an overused term which meaning has actually lost meaning, but you know what I mean. Anything to ensure they maintain their grip on the money supply as well as the subsidies. Part of the reason the "issue" of race, sexuality, religion etc. annoys me. (they make it an issue) Pit Man against man and people act surprised rights are usurped as if they're privileges. We have the numbers. Maybe not now, but eventually. God forbid people wake the fuck up and realize that.

I understand the mentality, though. Allowances and petty rule with the ability to live comfortably. Cheap lines of credit extended at minimal interest so the people live beyond their standard of comfortably. Who would want to change it? Not to mention those with families and a lot to lose. As AF wisely said, they'll condemn the system... under their breath and with clarification they'd never challenge it.

I fucking hate cages. One wonders if one is better than the other? Or perhaps people's minds are encaged in that they can't see a better way. Born as it was, they'll die with it a little worse. Plenty of BBQs and drinks and circuses and distractions to pacify them into a state of complacency. Truth be told no one is really better than. Sad day, sad to say. It would be a great thing if people realized their power. Separated and at each other's throats keeps this wickedry chugging along. I'm rather convinced no one cares. Sweet rationalizations and fairy tale gold road dreams. What a hell of a way to live.

Scrapmo
07-08-2013, 03:03 AM
This is why propaganda is so dangerous.

It really will not take a majority. They fear it.. indeed they have contingencies in place. What if the people rise? I have no doubt that their power and status means enough that they'd do whatever to maintain it. A false flag, not to use an overused term which meaning has actually lost meaning, but you know what I mean. Anything to ensure they maintain their grip on the money supply as well as the subsidies. Part of the reason the "issue" of race, sexuality, religion etc. annoys me. (they make it an issue) Pit Man against man and people act surprised rights are usurped as if they're privileges. We have the numbers. Maybe not now, but eventually. God forbid people wake the fuck up and realize that.

I understand the mentality, though. Allowances and petty rule with the ability to live comfortably. Cheap lines of credit extended at minimal interest so the people live beyond their standard of comfortably. Who would want to change it? Not to mention those with families and a lot to lose. As AF wisely said, they'll condemn the system... under their breath and with clarification they'd never challenge it.

I fucking hate cages. One wonders if one is better than the other? Or perhaps people's minds are encaged in that they can't see a better way. Born as it was, they'll die with it a little worse. Plenty of BBQs and drinks and circuses and distractions to pacify them into a state of complacency. Truth be told no one is really better than. Sad day, sad to say. It would be a great thing if people realized their power. Separated and at each other's throats keeps this wickedry chugging along. I'm rather convinced no one cares. Sweet rationalizations and fairy tale gold road dreams. What a hell of a way to live.

I want to comment on the part of the quote I bolded.

I was having a talk with my grandfather about the libertarian philosophy. He was very receptive and pretty much in agreement with everything we were talking about. He has pretty much lived his entire life by the non-aggression principle without realizing.

But one thing he did say really stuck out to me. We were discussing the welfare system, social security taxes etc. and I was trying to explain how more people would be out of poverty and not need these programs if the government step aside and let us keep more of what we earned. And he said "That all sounds great. I understand what your saying, Im just having trouble visualizing it in practice. You got to understand, I love these ideas you are telling me, but I have been living with this system for 78 years. It gets hard to see things differently after you have been conditioned to it that long." That is what we are fighting. It is natural to go with the grain. Its natural to just accept things that 95% of the population tells you is a given.

So people do get conditioned or thier minds encaged as you say. And from what I have seen it takes a specific kind of person to look through the bullshit, stand up and say "NO". Look at the poll with the personality test. The majority of us here are INTP's and INTJ's. According to the articles I have read those are some of the rarest types and they both are characterized by an inquisitve, truth seeking nature. Is it any wonder why most of the liberty lovers here are those types? And is it any wonder why we dont see too many liberty loving folks in day to day life. I believe its because our philosophy is a truth seeking philosophy and it takes effort to process and find it. Most people do not have it in them to trudge through Rothbard, Mises, Hayek, something we find a joy to do. We love to learn, we love to seek truth. Most people generally do not. Most people want to focus on whatever is in thier imediate surroundings. As the old saying goes. "Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people."

We come off as fantastical, idealistic and dreamers. People may like what they hear, but they cant "see it". They want it, but thier minds whether by conditioning or by pure genetics cant envision a world beyond the one they already know. Sometimes I resent them for it. Mostly I try to be thankful that I still retain some cognative ability.

Of course its 4am after a 72-hour week of working nights. I could just be talking out of my ass at this point.

Mani
07-08-2013, 03:54 AM
I think it depends how bad does it get?


Or is it STAGES?

Pre-stage I: A United States with an hidden police state, to the general public eye. Bill of rights are completely gone, but no one seems to realize it. Opportunities seem to be more and more difficult to find. A militarized force, government officials, corportists, begin a new elite part of society, laws don't apply to them.
Stage I, the "ATTACK" that AF talks about which leads to the REAL HARDCORE POLICE STATE and FEMA camps.
Stage II, collapse of the world markets, and the new world order.
Stage III, the fiat currencies of the world become worthless and massive starvation, and end of the world stuff.



For me personally, I think we are already in Pre-Stage I. And now that I've traveled a bit, I feel so much MORE FREE outside the US. I may not have constitutional rights wherever I go, but I'm not sure they exist anymore anyway, so it's a useless advantage thinking the US is the best FREE country to live in because it has a constitution (IMO).

I don't have to worry about an overbearing, roided up protected class, where a simple encounter could cause my death or worse. I'm not in FEAR of Stage I or living in fear in Pre-Stage I, being outside of US, so I'm already enjoying a benefit.

Outside of the US, I don't get in lines like cattle to be groped when going to the airport, I don't have to take off my shoes or other asinine activities. I don't worry about Roided cops doing anything insane. I feel economic freedom and don't feel the local governments trying to suck the blood out of my earnings. The only shackles I feel is when I'm encountered with the restrictions of being a US CITIZEN. It happens more than once and my only real fear is the government overreach trying to reach deeper and deeper into the pockets, even of those who aren't on their soil anymore.

I'm also feeling very secure I don't have to worry about "attacks", false flags, random acts of violence, and the rounding up FEMA camps.

So I'm happy to be out of US soil for purposes of Pre-Stage I and Stage I.

Where I'm screwed is stage II and III. If the PREPPERS are correct, and it's a NEW WORLD ORDER, and markets collapse, fiat currency is worthless, and all that matters is having food, and water...Then Ya, I'm fucked. Maybe then Living in a cave or the country or in the mountains is then the better life, I'm not sure.

However, what I do know, is that for a while, during that transition period of Stage II to Stage III, money will matter for a while, or precious metals. ANd my philosophy is..I'm in the prime earning years of my life, NOW. I might as well, earn as much as possible NOW, during Pre-stage I and Stage I, so that when the shit hits the fan, I can use my financial resources to try and buy my way into gathering those precious survival resources. And I feel I can EARN and have MANY MORE financial opportunities ABROAD then in the US, so I might has well take advantage of that.

And I don't want to be the FIRST into a FEMA camp, if I can be abroad, and stay AWAY from it all during those first Stages when AMERICA is fucked over, well, I'm already better off. The longer we can hold out, the better.

I'm also trying to keep my options open. My family and I currently only have US passports, but I'm working my way towards 2-3 places of PERMANENT RESIDENCE in other countries. If USA does turn into a prison, at least I have a couple other countries that I've already been given residency status. Because I do think once shit hits the fan, some countries won't take millions of refugees. It's better to have that stuff in place now, so you can't be sent back.

Imagine if EVERY US CITIZEN has their PASSPORTS revoked (who are not part of the PROTECTED, ELITE class), imagine the shit Edward is going through. You think countries are going to accept these millions of US refugees? You don't think there will be some quotas? Hey we can accept X amount of US refugees, that's it. I'd rather have that taken care well in advance. It's important to have the options open.

I don't think there's a 100% perfect solution, but I do think resources matter. Whether they be financial resources, ammunitions, private water and food supplies (my parents have their own garden, lots of small animals roaming (rabbits, dear, birds, etc.) in their property, and own their private well, when I lived in the US, I always planned I would go back home to them if it happened).

Just do your best to gather as many resources as possible, whether you choose to go abroad or find a cabin in the country to live off the land, just do your best to gather your resources so that you have leverage or the means to survive when the time comes.

Scrapmo
07-08-2013, 04:26 AM
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Mani again."

Good post. Would you mind telling us what countries you have been to and why you chose those 2-3 countries specifically? Maybe on some advice for those looking to do the same?

Mani
07-08-2013, 05:28 AM
"You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Mani again."

Good post. Would you mind telling us what countries you have been to and why you chose those 2-3 countries specifically? Maybe on some advice for those looking to do the same?


Hong Kong. I'm 3 years in with a work Visa. 4 more years and I'm permanent, but I can do it faster, if I make a large investment into the country (like a property) I can expedite the process. I would be a permanent residence.

Already with my work visa, I have a Hong Kong Id card. I don't need a passport when I return to Hong Kong. I go through an automated immigration. I swipe my ID card, take my thumb print and I'm done with immigration within 20 seconds. (YES, the thumb print is a BIOMETRIC, bad points for HK I guess. But they do have to make sure your ID card is not stolen).

I enjoy the economic freedom here. You can open a business and a checking account fast. The laws are simple, condensed, and pro business. Small businesses are encouraged to make money. HK is an import/export hub of the world, and if your company even advertises and encourages international trade, they have money the government will throw at you. What I mean to say is they WANT you to make money. There isn't a bureaucratic mess, there aren't complicated TAX penalties for every step you make. There aren't a thousand ordinances that you may accidentally be violating. There aren't thousands of problems of being sued if someone has a hang nail while visiting your office. (My dad back in USA has is own business, and I remember after a cold winter day, he was MORE freaked out than anything about someone slipping on the public sidewalk in front of his property. He used to go EXTRA early to his place to put salt everywhere and start breaking up and shoveling ice.)

In HK they have a Government surplus, and the government is NOT out to leach every last cent from your pocket, tax advisers will actually give advice on saving money on your personal and corporate taxes.


Now many people will despise some of the things I've mentioned. Using biometrics to track you, government subsidies, any kind of tax is bad, however, what others have discussed before, is NO PLACE is perfect.

I prefer to live in a place, that pretty much LEAVES YOU ALONE. I work and have no fear that "OMG, if I do this or that, it's gonna kill me come tax season." I have no fear walking by a police officer or if the police officer is involved things will escalate out of control and I will be tortured or killed. The police or normal people (from my experience) I don't see them as a privileged class, or ROIDED up ready for a fight. My interactions have been so friendly and cordial, and none of this MIGHTY attitude. I have no fear of ambulance chasing lawyers causing trouble, I can focus on work, not these stupid ordinances and lawyer problems.

I like that they have PRIVATE health care AND public health care. They have great health care for the general public and anyone who's a resident is able to access it. At the same time there are TONS of private health care options.

I personally love going to my private doctor, and then he has his own pharmacy in his office, (LIKE ALL doctor's here have). I give him cash (no insurance involved), and I get my medicine, in the same appointment, and go home. I CANT BELIEVE I used to take THREE TRips for a similar ailment.

#1) Go to the Doctor.
#2) Drop off the prescription.
#3) Pick up the prescription.

And have a deductible and payment for both experiences, while also paying MONTHLY for health care through my job. What a fucked up backward ass system.

The private health care hospitals and facilities here are extremely efficient and customer service oriented. WHile the public facilities are also nice, and of course you have your waiting times and lines, but for free people don't mind. It's the best of both worlds.

I also love the beauty of Hong Kong. It has amazing nature, waterfalls, mountains, lush green vegetation, beaches, I can be surrounded by nature and not hear a sound of human existence, and then within a 20 minute drive be in one of the most happening and exciting cities on the planet (better than NYC Manhattan IMO). There's not many places that OFFER BOTH and within such close proximity.

I love been in the central hub of Asia. It's amazing that within 4 hours flight I can be in a dozen different countries that speak different languages, cultures, societies, different foods. It's amazing.

There are tons of other things of Hong Kong that I love, but I don't want to go on forever.

Regarding specifically about The Stage II and Stage III, I think Hong Kong could be tough. It's a densely populated city, resources could become scarce fast, a lot of things are IMPORTED, which prices could escalate out of control super quickly.

But for the time being, as I mentioned before, this place is SO BUSINESS FRIENDLY!! They WANT YOU to make money. And Asia is growing like no other place in the world, and it is DEFINITELY the place to find Financial Opportunities.

I'm just happy I'm in a place that allows me to work and doesn't bog me down with government restrictions, so I can use my prime years to earn the my potential. My goal is to avoid Stage I and to make as much money as possible before Stage II and III affects the world.

That's the plan and that's why I chose Hong Kong.

kcchiefs6465
07-08-2013, 05:49 AM
I personally love going to my private doctor, and then he has his own pharmacy in his office, (LIKE ALL doctor's here have). I give him cash (no insurance involved), and I get my medicine, in the same appointment, and go home. I CANT BELIEVE I used to take THREE TRips for a similar ailment.

#1) Go to the Doctor.
#2) Drop off the prescription.
#3) Pick up the prescription.

And have a deductible and payment for both experiences, while also paying MONTHLY for health care through my job. What a fucked up backward ass system.
+rep. I've been saying that for a while now.

Sounds relatively free. (as is a lot of places) A lot of what you mentioned is very appealing. Best of luck.

If you aren't a travel salesman, look into the job lol.

Scrapmo
07-08-2013, 07:13 AM
Thanks for the write up mani. Very interesting read. Hong Kong sounds very interesting. I see alot of positives. From what I understand, Hong kong enjoys alot of autonomy from the PRC.

The police issue is huge for me. I cant stand these roided up fuckers (and this is coming from a former bodybuilder) with a superiority complex just trying to start fights. I would like a country where they are, you know, not psychotic killers. Never been a fan of large cities though. Always lived out in the country. Im really looking into New Zealand.

You should have seen the look on my mother-in-laws face when I told her that america is not the most free economically or the most free socially. You would have thought I told her I had lamps mad of human skin.

Thanks for sharing mani.

shane77m
07-08-2013, 08:10 AM
Outlook too grim? perhaps. It is possible to worry ones life away.

As far as the Christianity aspect of the current events, look at amillennial eschatology. Unfortunately most people have taken the Left Behind series as the gospel truth.

WM_in_MO
07-08-2013, 08:13 AM
Outlook too grim? perhaps. It is possible to worry ones life away.

As far as the Christianity aspect of the current events, look at amillennial eschatology. Unfortunately most people have taken the Left Behind series as the gospel truth.

Thats why I'm trying to be prepared for any disaster. I don't have the space to stockpile much so I need to work on my hunting skills at this time.

pcosmar
07-08-2013, 08:32 AM
Outlook too grim? perhaps. It is possible to worry ones life away.

As far as the Christianity aspect of the current events, look at amillennial eschatology. Unfortunately most people have taken the Left Behind series as the gospel truth.

"Left Behind" was a work of total fiction. and yes, sadly, some folks believe that story.
Due mostly to the false teaching of "rapture".

Anti Federalist
07-08-2013, 08:51 AM
I have never heard this term "hot tyranny" before...

Yet I have read just about every SHTF book known to man...

It just means, "for real" rather than just the preparatory stages.

Pericles
07-08-2013, 10:39 AM
One must be willing to face reality, as unpleasant as it may be, in order to overcome it. You can never afford to lose faith that you will in the end, triumph.

Acala
07-08-2013, 10:51 AM
Too grim. Not because the threat is not real but because the idea that human beings have ever lived in anything BUT precarious conditions is an illusion. Destruction has ALWAYS been 24 hours away for EVERY human being that ever lived. From natural disaster, from the madness of crowds, from an accidental death, from disease. The sword ALWAYS hangs over the head of the living and we vastly overestimate our ability to predict when and how it will fall.

Life is transitory. You can't change that. Being angry about it only makes your time as a living being shorter and less pleasant.

Do what you can to prepare for what you think you can predict, and then be happy! Learn to accept that you CAN'T predict what is likely to take you out. That's life. If it wasn't the fucks in Washington, it would be famine, or a fire, or your stupid apprentice drops a hammer on your head, or you get an infection and it kills you. You WILL die no matter how prepared you are, how angry you get, or how many tyrants you put against the wall.

And remember, if you allow the contemplation of your enemy's evil to rob you of one moment of happiness in life, you have handed them the one victory they could never achieve without your cooperation.

So cheer up! Your a dead man no matter what you do.

Czolgosz
07-08-2013, 10:55 AM
*Guesstimations*


Grim? Probably.

Likely you've dealt w/ the system at least once, and passionately hate it.

Agitated because you know the solution to slavery, yet even here, they'll remain slaves due to the danger in freeing themselves. And this keeps you from ultimately being free.

mczerone
07-08-2013, 11:26 AM
The question isn't whether one should stay or flee.

The question is how do we prepare for the inevitable. You might stay, or you might flee. That's not important. What's important is what you're doing once you're there.

No matter where you live you need to do a few things:

(1) Protect yourself and work with your family to protect them according to the probability of different devastations.

(2) Cultivate social relations to ensure a harmonious future with your neighbors and trade partners.

(3) Create and support alternative institutions. As the state fails, people will still need security, schools, money, courts, roads, insurance, and every other valuable service that the state has usurped. If they are left without these services, true chaos will result. So start formulating how to get things done without the state NOW, before it's too late.

So whether you stay or go should depend on where you think you'll have the best chance of getting these things done - and that answer will be different for everyone.

Living life during an emergency shouldn't require any change in your rules of action - the emergency is merely the test showing whether your rules of action are worth following the rest of the time.

Philhelm
07-08-2013, 11:29 AM
It just means, "for real" rather than just the preparatory stages.

Like kinetic vs. potential energy. Perhaps kinetic tyranny would be the "proper" term.

Philhelm
07-08-2013, 11:29 AM
Double Postration

WM_in_MO
07-08-2013, 12:00 PM
I'd say tend to yourself first, then your neighborhood, then your larger community. I wouldn't tend farther than i could round trip in a day.

Refer to Maslow's hierarchy of needs:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/6/60/Maslow's_Hierarchy_of_Needs.svg/450px-Maslow's_Hierarchy_of_Needs.svg.png

Start at the bottom with your own self/family and extended family. Help them understand your philosophy. Help them understand your morality. Help them LIVE those. Help them in planning and preparation. Form militias first in your house then in your neighborhood. Call them what you want. Neighborhood watch, neighborhood security, whatever. Make sure they all understand the non-aggression principle otherwise you're likely to make the news. I would train them to make reports not to the police but to each other. Save the "authorities" as a last resort or for after-the-fact. This really depends on what kind of people you have in your police force. I believe I am fortunate here because we don't (yet) have the assault vehicle and military police here in St Louis and surrounding areas. We also have a population which is largely on board with self-sufficiency and outdoor skills.

I imagine when SHTF it won't be as bad here in my area. I'd go so far as to say life will hardly change in the first few days. I worry about what will happen in the weeks months etc that come after. Once it sets in that this isn't temporary.

Ron Paul did well (WON) in my county. I'd imagine we'd have the most to fear from the neighbors in eastern counties.

Christian Liberty
07-08-2013, 08:47 PM
Outlook too grim? perhaps. It is possible to worry ones life away.

As far as the Christianity aspect of the current events, look at amillennial eschatology. Unfortunately most people have taken the Left Behind series as the gospel truth.

I'm not amillennial, but I'm not dispensationalist either. I don't believe in the rapture, I believe I'll be stuck on this rock unless somehow warp drive is invented in my lifetime. Otherwise, I'm here till I physically die.


"Left Behind" was a work of total fiction. and yes, sadly, some folks believe that story.
Due mostly to the false teaching of "rapture".

Yep, I reject the rapture.

Michigan11
07-08-2013, 09:41 PM
Well I would say perspective is owned by each individual, dealing with reality, which is very grim indeed. I would say it's not good to focus so much on negativity or that will become you, I learn this lesson daily.

But we are now in some very devestating times, that are catching many in the nets. We may soon witness the destruction of many people that we know because they can't survive, and that is going to change many peoples hearts, I hope for the better.

heavenlyboy34
07-08-2013, 10:29 PM
Hong Kong. I'm 3 years in with a work Visa. 4 more years and I'm permanent, but I can do it faster, if I make a large investment into the country (like a property) I can expedite the process. I would be a permanent residence.

Already with my work visa, I have a Hong Kong Id card. I don't need a passport when I return to Hong Kong. I go through an automated immigration. I swipe my ID card, take my thumb print and I'm done with immigration within 20 seconds. (YES, the thumb print is a BIOMETRIC, bad points for HK I guess. But they do have to make sure your ID card is not stolen).

I enjoy the economic freedom here. You can open a business and a checking account fast. The laws are simple, condensed, and pro business. Small businesses are encouraged to make money. HK is an import/export hub of the world, and if your company even advertises and encourages international trade, they have money the government will throw at you. What I mean to say is they WANT you to make money. There isn't a bureaucratic mess, there aren't complicated TAX penalties for every step you make. There aren't a thousand ordinances that you may accidentally be violating. There aren't thousands of problems of being sued if someone has a hang nail while visiting your office. (My dad back in USA has is own business, and I remember after a cold winter day, he was MORE freaked out than anything about someone slipping on the public sidewalk in front of his property. He used to go EXTRA early to his place to put salt everywhere and start breaking up and shoveling ice.)

In HK they have a Government surplus, and the government is NOT out to leach every last cent from your pocket, tax advisers will actually give advice on saving money on your personal and corporate taxes.


Now many people will despise some of the things I've mentioned. Using biometrics to track you, government subsidies, any kind of tax is bad, however, what others have discussed before, is NO PLACE is perfect.

I prefer to live in a place, that pretty much LEAVES YOU ALONE. I work and have no fear that "OMG, if I do this or that, it's gonna kill me come tax season." I have no fear walking by a police officer or if the police officer is involved things will escalate out of control and I will be tortured or killed. The police or normal people (from my experience) I don't see them as a privileged class, or ROIDED up ready for a fight. My interactions have been so friendly and cordial, and none of this MIGHTY attitude. I have no fear of ambulance chasing lawyers causing trouble, I can focus on work, not these stupid ordinances and lawyer problems.

I like that they have PRIVATE health care AND public health care. They have great health care for the general public and anyone who's a resident is able to access it. At the same time there are TONS of private health care options.

I personally love going to my private doctor, and then he has his own pharmacy in his office, (LIKE ALL doctor's here have). I give him cash (no insurance involved), and I get my medicine, in the same appointment, and go home. I CANT BELIEVE I used to take THREE TRips for a similar ailment.

#1) Go to the Doctor.
#2) Drop off the prescription.
#3) Pick up the prescription.

And have a deductible and payment for both experiences, while also paying MONTHLY for health care through my job. What a fucked up backward ass system.

The private health care hospitals and facilities here are extremely efficient and customer service oriented. WHile the public facilities are also nice, and of course you have your waiting times and lines, but for free people don't mind. It's the best of both worlds.

I also love the beauty of Hong Kong. It has amazing nature, waterfalls, mountains, lush green vegetation, beaches, I can be surrounded by nature and not hear a sound of human existence, and then within a 20 minute drive be in one of the most happening and exciting cities on the planet (better than NYC Manhattan IMO). There's not many places that OFFER BOTH and within such close proximity.

I love been in the central hub of Asia. It's amazing that within 4 hours flight I can be in a dozen different countries that speak different languages, cultures, societies, different foods. It's amazing.

There are tons of other things of Hong Kong that I love, but I don't want to go on forever.

Regarding specifically about The Stage II and Stage III, I think Hong Kong could be tough. It's a densely populated city, resources could become scarce fast, a lot of things are IMPORTED, which prices could escalate out of control super quickly.

But for the time being, as I mentioned before, this place is SO BUSINESS FRIENDLY!! They WANT YOU to make money. And Asia is growing like no other place in the world, and it is DEFINITELY the place to find Financial Opportunities.

I'm just happy I'm in a place that allows me to work and doesn't bog me down with government restrictions, so I can use my prime years to earn the my potential. My goal is to avoid Stage I and to make as much money as possible before Stage II and III affects the world.

That's the plan and that's why I chose Hong Kong.
What do you think of Marc Faber's predictions WRT Asia and the West?

Mani
07-08-2013, 11:23 PM
What do you think of Marc Faber's predictions WRT Asia and the West?


I've seen a lot of predictions but not sure by whom. Which one is that?

enhanced_deficit
07-08-2013, 11:45 PM
The following is a response to a member who I am having a conversation with in PMs.

I hope they don't mind me posting this, but it doesn't identify who they are, and after reading it, I'm wondering if I'm just too dark, or am I pretty close to the mark?

The person in question is asking about "hot tyranny" and how bad are things, really?

````````````````````


``````````````

Can you really call that living?

No wonder millions and millions are on prescription mood pills.


It is certianly not far fetched and has realistic basis but seems bit exaggerated towards the grim side.
Considering what has been unfolding lately, hard to call any view too cynical these days.

susano
07-08-2013, 11:46 PM
Yes, what are Marc Faber's predictions? I would guess that the far east if the new west.

Nobexliberty
07-08-2013, 11:49 PM
Thats why I'm trying to be prepared for any disaster. I don't have the space to stockpile much so I need to work on my hunting skills at this time.
Do you really think the rest of the world is going to watch as millions of acres of fine farmland is up for grabs. It would be like the scramble for Africa but with a bigger "profit". The monarchs of european countries will restore order before half of Americans are dead.

heavenlyboy34
07-08-2013, 11:50 PM
I've seen a lot of predictions but not sure by whom. Which one is that?
Broadly speaking, he has predicted the Western economies slipping deeper into recession-maybe depression-and Asian economies taking off (especially China's economy) the last few years.
He's author of the Gloom, Boom, and Doom Report.
http://gloomboomdoom.com/public/pSTD.cfm?pageSPS_ID=6000

heavenlyboy34
07-08-2013, 11:52 PM
Do you really think the rest of the world is going to watch as millions of acres of fine farmland is up for grabs. It would be like the scramble for Africa but with a bigger "profit". The monarchs of european countries will restore order before half of Americans are dead.
Monarchs? Aren't the Europeans addicted to "democracy" and welfarism nowadays? (especially the Eurozone)

Nobexliberty
07-08-2013, 11:56 PM
Monarchs? Aren't the Europeans addicted to "democracy" and welfarism nowadays? (especially the Eurozone) Some nations still has popular royal families. They should be able to instill law and order and unite their nation instead of splitting up like the US is likely going to do.

kcchiefs6465
07-09-2013, 12:00 AM
...
You remind me of someone else.

I can't remember the exact thread.

Only person I've seen to advocate a monarchy. (we discussed it) And you aren't 13.

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 12:02 AM
Some nations still has popular royal families. They should be able to instill law and order and unite their nation instead of splitting up like the US is likely going to do.
Yeah, I know there are various royal families on the continent, especially Eastern Europe. I was under the impression that they were mostly token positions now, though. I haven't studied modern European history too deeply. :toady:

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 12:04 AM
You remind me of someone else.

I can't remember the exact thread.

Only person I've seen to advocate a monarchy. (we discussed it) And you aren't 13.
I've advocated monarchy several times, and still would if the topic came up again. (I argue for it as a lesser evil, though)

kcchiefs6465
07-09-2013, 12:10 AM
I've advocated monarchy several times, and still would if the topic came up again. (I argue for it as a lesser evil, though)
Same style - Everything. Not simply him advocating for a monarchy but his points and reasoning. I typed a few posts responding to it.

I think we are thinking of the same thread? Not sure how to find it.

I'm stating for fact he is not 13 years old and that a monarchy isn't freedom.

Other posts have gone over it in detail.

Nobexliberty
07-09-2013, 12:14 AM
Yeah, I know there are various royal families on the continent, especially Eastern Europe. I was under the impression that they were mostly token positions now, though. I haven't studied modern European history too deeply. :toady: People in royal families are raised from birth on how to lead a nation and how to be popular. They are popular and represent the will of the people better then corrupt politicans. They also act as Head of State and in some nations they can even dismiss parlaments I think.

Cutlerzzz
07-09-2013, 12:21 AM
On the bright side: The younger generation is against the War on Terror, the War on Drugs, Patriot Act, Abortion, the bailouts, racism, is more supportive of opt outs of Social Security, and wants to end government discrimination in marriage. Ron Paul has an extremely passionate group of young supporters (which is relatively large compared to young Neocons), many younger Democrats are looking for more honest anti-war type rather than Obama. The population has been becoming more pro gun for decades, barring the Sandy Hook blip. The main stream media is dying as more and more people use the Internet to find actual facts and alternate opinions.

From the looks of it the Republican Party will likely end up becoming moderately Libertarian, while the Democratic Party will become more anti war.

susano
07-09-2013, 12:42 AM
People in royal families are raised from birth on how to lead a nation and how to be popular. They are popular and represent the will of the people better then corrupt politicans. They also act as Head of State and in some nations they can even dismiss parlaments I think.


So, what's your deal, really? I'm interested. Are you you actually a Swede, in Sweden?

Mani
07-09-2013, 12:48 AM
Broadly speaking, he has predicted the Western economies slipping deeper into recession-maybe depression-and Asian economies taking off (especially China's economy) the last few years.
He's author of the Gloom, Boom, and Doom Report.
http://gloomboomdoom.com/public/pSTD.cfm?pageSPS_ID=6000

China will be a power player, but not exactly sure how they will transition, because they are not the low cost factory anymore.

A lot of those factories left and moved to Vietnam, India, Indonesia. I have a friend in the garment business and she said China is definitely not the low cost place for that anymore. However, they still have a big infrastructure and build to scale, let's see where they go.

China is also a big consumer, so they are becoming an attractive in terms of marketing into. China has money, and so does a lot of Asia. I read yesterday Macau is not only beating Vegas, but outdoing ALL the casino's in the US COMBINED. Vegas would have to increase it's gambling business by SIX TIMES to be even with Macau. It was something absurd, like every American would need to start gambling to makeup for the difference between Vegas and Macau.

It seems like parts of Asia are going through that Industrial Revolution period we had, but it's hyper fast with the internet and new technologies. I've seen better efficiencies and technologies in Asia then back home in USA, and that dropped my jaw when I realized USA really wasn't #1 like I always thought.



It's a difficult thing to predict how things will all play out.

You can never count out the US, they have the biggest army, and if things go bad, US could just start invading places and in order to capture RESOURCES. Land, water, oil, etc. Who's going to stop them?

But as a middle class people, what will happen to us still in the US? FEMA camps? Hunger Games poverty if you are not part of the privileged class? Police State.

If it goes that far, again USA would be a shit place to be in.

But if the ENTIRE WORLD GOES MAD MAX BEYOND THUNDERDOME, then maybe a cabin in the mountains isn't such a bad idea regardless if it's USA or wherever. I'm happy my parents have their own land, garden, and water supply. If things go really really bad, they can barbed wire, fence up the area and protect themselves from the wayward bandits. Thankfully they are 30-45 minutes from a big city, so they should be pretty much left alone. The garden is just a hobby, not meant for sustenance, and I'm sure a lot of people have gardens that are just hobbies, not for their sole living. But if the apocalypses happens, it's too late to START a garden.

My only concern about people relying on gardens, fishing, hunting, wildlife....is if the US starts to make it ILLEGAL to grow your own food, it doesn't pass FDA requirements or all your EXTRA FOOD is ILLEGAL, as it must be SHARED in a time of need, you are allowed an ALLOWANCE. My parents have a few apple trees and get hundreds of apples come season, will the FDA confiscate and fine my parents if things go bad? Will they throw BLEACH on it? Will they have drones flying that far from the city to inspect people's homes and blow up gardens? But maybe that's the transitional period between ultimate tyranny and then survival anarchy.



It's anyone's guess. Just do your best to strengthen your resources as much as possible. Stay positive and use your positive energy to achieve what you can in life, just be ready and prepared if something does happen.

susano
07-09-2013, 01:27 AM
Hong Kong

http://popupcity.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Hong-Kong-Outside.jpg

http://photomichaelwolf.com/hong-kong/


Mani, do you live in one of these boxes? I couldn't.

I have a friend who traveled in Asia (Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, and Hong Kong). She hated Hong Kong because of it's vertical, concrete jungle. Singapore she said was like a mind controlled Stepford reality, and she loved the other places.

Mani
07-09-2013, 01:54 AM
Hong Kong

http://popupcity.net/wp-content/uploads/2010/02/Hong-Kong-Outside.jpg

http://photomichaelwolf.com/hong-kong/


Mani, do you live in one of these boxes? I couldn't.

I have a friend who traveled in Asia (Indonesia, Malaysia, Singapore, Thailand, and Hong Kong). She hated Hong Kong because of it's vertical, concrete jungle. Singapore she said was like a mind controlled Stepford reality, and she loved the other places.

Nope.

This is my area:

http://www.12hk.com/pics/reservoir1.jpg


http://www.hongkonghustle.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/06/hong-kong-best-hikes-hiking-hk-trail-walk.jpg


And I'm about literally 15-20 minutes from this:

http://howzit-hongkong.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/hong_kong_travel_guide111.jpg

The city that never sleeps.

Typical Saturday Night:

http://guidepal.blob.core.windows.net/article-mainimages/aphoto71549.jpg

Typical Sunday Afternoon Hike:

http://carfield.com.hk/gallery/Day+Trip/Dragon%27s+Back+%E9%BE%8D%E8%84%8A/DSC01479.jpg


I wouldn't be able to live in the vertical shoe boxes. I love coming home to the country atmosphere but being close to the city and the action. Even in South Florida, I preferred to live in the Suburbs on a fairly quiet lake, but only 30-40 minutes from South Beach and Fort Lauderdale beach and the lively atmosphere.

I'm not surprised to hear about your friend. I met a friend who said they have visited HK 10 times and he HATES HK! He said I've been going there for work for 10 years and I HATE every trip, I cannot STAND IT!

He had no idea how much greenery and beauty HK had. His last trip, I showed him around for 2 days and he left saying, WOW, HK is amazing, I love this place!

susano
07-09-2013, 02:57 AM
Mani, those photos look beautiful but where is the housing and the towns/villages?

Scrapmo
07-09-2013, 04:04 AM
That scenery is gorgeous mani. I hate you.
On a related note. It sounds like your a business person. I'm guessing it would be harder to go over there and get set up if one was say a healthcare worker and not in business?

Mani
07-09-2013, 06:25 AM
Mani, those photos look beautiful but where is the housing and the towns/villages?

South side of the island. Stanley, tai tam, repulse bay. Its where all the expats live..not all, but a good portion. There are other pockets of beautiful areas that i havent been to yet and also full of expats.

I have a friend whos a cathay pilot, every weekend he shows me all these pics of amazing waterfalls and nature hikes, etc. there is a lot to be explored.

Mani
07-09-2013, 06:27 AM
That scenery is gorgeous mani. I hate you.
On a related note. It sounds like your a business person. I'm guessing it would be harder to go over there and get set up if one was say a healthcare worker and not in business?


Yes i dont kniw much about that. Im in business and most of the expats i know are in finance and banking or airlines or business dealing with China.

PSYOP
07-09-2013, 06:43 AM
So many fearmongerers in this thread...

better-dead-than-fed
07-09-2013, 07:29 AM
I like Tim McVeigh.

Dary
07-09-2013, 08:05 AM
These aren't the droids you're looking for.
These aren't the droids I'm looking for.

Wait...

What???

presence
07-09-2013, 09:42 AM
God forgive me: I'll fight.

http://krishna.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Arjuna-Lamets-about-Killing-Family-Members-on-the-Battlefield-of-Kuruksettra-620x350.jpg

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 09:53 AM
This.

Stand and deliver.

This shit is global. Global governance is the goal.

There is NO WHERE to hide. NO WHERE.

Running will only weaken the resistance. GARUNTEED.


Not too grim, but I don't think running is the answer. The problem is global. One World Government... the New World Order. Tyrants are everywhere. schemers are everywhere, statists and central planners are everywhere. The highest concentration of humans that want liberty I believe are here in the U.S. and here we have the weapons to fight for freedom. Many Americans are certainly in a slumber and many are lovers of the state, but we have a history and the means to oppose tyrants. This will be the front line in the fight for human freedom and I think it is worth fighting for. I have to die sometime, so I don't mind it my life is used in the effort to support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic.

AuH20
07-09-2013, 10:04 AM
On the bright side: The younger generation is against the War on Terror, the War on Drugs, Patriot Act, Abortion, the bailouts, racism, is more supportive of opt outs of Social Security, and wants to end government discrimination in marriage. Ron Paul has an extremely passionate group of young supporters (which is relatively large compared to young Neocons), many younger Democrats are looking for more honest anti-war type rather than Obama. The population has been becoming more pro gun for decades, barring the Sandy Hook blip. The main stream media is dying as more and more people use the Internet to find actual facts and alternate opinions.

From the looks of it the Republican Party will likely end up becoming moderately Libertarian, while the Democratic Party will become more anti war.

In many ways, the younger generation is more deluded than the boomer generation. The only thing that can save us is collapse. Raw, unfiltered reality can be the only stimulant for freedom in that it will dissolve many of the lies and false conclusions many have been indoctrinated with. This awakening period will likely entail famine, violence and disease.

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 10:57 AM
The Millenials are not deluded. "We" are enraged and lost.

Many seek escape - willingly and knowingly (Think; Brave New World). The Millenials have their emotional frequency set to rage and despair. More than any other living generation, the Millenials understand just how different this world will be 50 years from now. We are PARALYSED.

We are stuck because the Boomers have ALL of the power, ALL of the wealth and ALL of the effective (non-violent) means of change and have proven REPEATEDLY to be UNWILLING to do so because it means a direct haircut on their own lifestyle. This unwillingness to face reality is eating the prosperity and opportunity of their own children (have you seen youth unemployement all over the Wester world?).

These are generalizations, but they are accurate. There are always exceptions.

The Boomers don't have much time left to change their direction.

The Millenials all over the world are already snapping.


In many ways, the younger generation is more deluded than the boomer generation. The only thing that can save us is collapse. Raw, unfiltered reality can be the only stimulant for freedom in that it will dissolve many of the lies and false conclusions many have been indoctrinated with. This awakening period will likely entail famine, violence and disease.

Christian Liberty
07-09-2013, 11:04 AM
Due mostly to the false teaching of "rapture".[/QUOTE]


The Millenials are not deluded. "We" are enraged and lost.

Many seek escape - willingly and knowingly (Think; Brave New World). The Millenials have their emotional frequency set to rage and despair. More than any other living generation, the Millenials understand just how different this world will be 50 years from now. We are PARALYSED.

We are stuck because the Boomers have ALL of the power, ALL of the wealth and ALL of the effective (non-violent) means of change and have proven REPEATEDLY to be UNWILLING to do so because it means a direct haircut on their own lifestyle (at the expense of their children).

These are generalizations, but they are accurate. There are always exceptions.

The Boomers don't have much time left to change their direction.

The Millenials all over the world are already snapping.



I'm not sure what a "millennial" is but if you're thinking of my generation:

This is indeed how I feel, however, only a few people who I shared public school with actually agreed with me on politics. Most are relatively anti-war but totally buy state involvement in our domestic lives, and few understood how serious the lies about terrorism were.


http://krishna.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Arjuna-Lamets-about-Killing-Family-Members-on-the-Battlefield-of-Kuruksettra-620x350.jpg
What?

You remind me of someone else.

I can't remember the exact thread.

Only person I've seen to advocate a monarchy. (we discussed it) And you aren't 13.

Hans Hoppe certainly wasn't 13 either...

AuH20
07-09-2013, 11:04 AM
The Millenials are not deluded. "We" are enraged and lost.

Many seek escape - willingly and knowingly (Think; Brave New World). The Millenials have their emotional frequency set to rage and despair. More than any other living generation, the Millenials understand just how different this world will be 50 years from now. We are PARALYSED.

We are stuck because the Boomers have ALL of the power, ALL of the wealth and ALL of the effective (non-violent) means of change and have proven REPEATEDLY to be UNWILLING to do so because it means a direct haircut on their own lifestyle (at the expense of their children).

These are generalizations, but they are accurate. There are always exceptions.

The Boomers don't have much time left to change their direction.

The Millenials all over the world are already snapping.



Personally, I wouldn't want to live in a world run by the millenials and I'm a generation Xer. They are morally hollow as the boomers and 10x as ignorant, due to being directly detached from their human heritage. When you are cut off from the ties that bind, you feel alone and distressed as you described. What we're seeing transpire is not new. Tyranny is the norm on this planet as opposed to an anomaly.

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 11:09 AM
Brave. New. World.

Going as planned.



Personally, I wouldn't want to live in a world run by the millenials and I'm a generation Xer. They are morally hollow as the boomers and 10x as ignorant, due to being directly detached from their human heritage. When you are cut off from the ties that bind, you feel alone and distressed as you described. What we're seeing transpire is not new. Tyranny is the norm on this planet as opposed to an anomaly.

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 11:14 AM
Also,

Every generation is as bad/good as the last - just different.

At the end of the day it is the 10% that change fate. Both the good and bad.

The rest are natures excess who will be used/steered/led one way or another.


Personally, I wouldn't want to live in a world run by the millenials and I'm a generation Xer. They are morally hollow as the boomers and 10x as ignorant, due to being directly detached from their human heritage. When you are cut off from the ties that bind, you feel alone and distressed as you described. What we're seeing transpire is not new. Tyranny is the norm on this planet as opposed to an anomaly.

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 11:15 AM
Personally, I wouldn't want to live in a world run by the millenials and I'm a generation Xer. They are morally hollow as the boomers and 10x as ignorant, due to being directly detached from their human heritage. When you are cut off from the ties that bind, you feel alone and distressed as you described. What we're seeing transpire is not new. Tyranny is the norm on this planet as opposed to an anomaly.
Meh, not all are. I'm technically a millenial, depending on how you define it (b. 12/1981) and I don't have those qualities/traits.

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 11:16 AM
Also,

Every generation is as bad/good as the last - just different.

At the end of the day it is the 10% that change fate. Both the good and bad.

The rest are natures excess who will be used/steered/led one way or another.
This^^

AuH20
07-09-2013, 11:18 AM
Also,

Every generation is as bad/good as the last - just different.
At the end of the day it is the 10% that change fate. Both the good and bad.
The rest are natures excess who will be used/steered/led one way or another.

But it's gotten progressively worse. Baby boomers, Generation X and now the ultra narcissistic Millenials. I don't think this trend can continue. We're due for a Greatest Generation to reverse course. I really think the generation post-Millenial could be our saviors given the anticipated environment.

AuH20
07-09-2013, 11:19 AM
Meh, not all are. I'm technically a millenial, depending on how you define it (b. 12/1981) and I don't have those qualities/traits.

I was speaking generally of Millenials. I apologize for the inclusion. :)

JK/SEA
07-09-2013, 11:36 AM
Outlook to grim?....

actually, i think you're too cheery.

torchbearer
07-09-2013, 11:44 AM
I'd say you are way to optimistic.

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 11:57 AM
I was speaking generally of Millenials. I apologize for the inclusion. :)
k, thanks. :) ~hugs~

Cutlerzzz
07-09-2013, 02:27 PM
In many ways, the younger generation is more deluded than the boomer generation. The only thing that can save us is collapse. Raw, unfiltered reality can be the only stimulant for freedom in that it will dissolve many of the lies and false conclusions many have been indoctrinated with. This awakening period will likely entail famine, violence and disease.

How is it (or any gen) worse than the boomers?

tod evans
07-09-2013, 02:40 PM
How is it (or any gen) worse than the boomers?

As a "boomer" I'm comfortable saying that fixing the mess this country is in socially and economically is going to take all living generations working toward the same goal.

This blaming somebody else makes a person feel good but does nothing to fix the problem...

I see this kind of like construction when each trade blames the preceding one for problems and come time to button up the job the problem is still there because nobody actually fixed it.

Ron Paul gave all generations hope, an actual plan that could have put us as a country on the road to recovery, but voters of all ages shunned his ideas...In my circle of "boomers" I only know of two couples who refused to even entertain his platform and they're both California democrats.....Every other boomer I know backed the good Dr....

Scrapmo
07-09-2013, 02:51 PM
I repeated the general sentiment of this thread to a neo-con I know. She told me "your to pessimistic, you got to have some hope, the government does some good here and around the world, blah blah blah (or should I say bah bah bah).

I looked her square in the eye and said, "If you want to believe in fairy tales go watch fox news. Go study history and realize that when it becomes necessary to maintain its power, your government will line you up by a trench and put a bullet in your head"

mad cow
07-09-2013, 03:16 PM
The Millenials are not deluded. "We" are enraged and lost.

Many seek escape - willingly and knowingly (Think; Brave New World). The Millenials have their emotional frequency set to rage and despair. More than any other living generation, the Millenials understand just how different this world will be 50 years from now. We are PARALYSED.

We are stuck because the Boomers have ALL of the power, ALL of the wealth and ALL of the effective (non-violent) means of change and have proven REPEATEDLY to be UNWILLING to do so because it means a direct haircut on their own lifestyle. This unwillingness to face reality is eating the prosperity and opportunity of their own children (have you seen youth unemployement all over the Wester world?).

These are generalizations, but they are accurate. There are always exceptions.

The Boomers don't have much time left to change their direction.

The Millenials all over the world are already snapping.



The more things change....
A song by some Boomers.


Well a young man
He ain't got nothin' in the world these days
I said a young man
Ain't got nothin' in the world these days

In the old days
When a young man was a strong man
All the people stepped back
When a young man walked by

You know nowadays
Well it's the old man's
Got all the money
And a young man
Ain't got nothin' in the world these days

You know nowadays, if you're the young man
You ain't got nothin' in the world these days


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9g30nwCpyaA

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 03:40 PM
As a "boomer" I'm comfortable saying that fixing the mess this country is in socially and economically is going to take all living generations working toward the same goal.
This blaming somebody else makes a person feel good but does nothing to fix the problem...

I see this kind of like construction when each trade blames the preceding one for problems and come time to button up the job the problem is still there because nobody actually fixed it.

Ron Paul gave all generations hope, an actual plan that could have put us as a country on the road to recovery, but voters of all ages shunned his ideas...In my circle of "boomers" I only know of two couples who refused to even entertain his platform and they're both California democrats.....Every other boomer I know backed the good Dr....

Got that right. But as my above post outlines, it's the Boomers who hold ALL of the top end cards.

Y'all have the Jacks, Queens, Kings and Aces.

I know there are a lot of RPer's here doing their best who are Boomers - but it's going to take a lot more of the Boomers to get anything truly done.

Acala
07-09-2013, 03:53 PM
Got that right. But as my above post outlines, it's the Boomers who hold ALL of the top end cards.



All the Boomers have is debt. We inherited Social Security and Medicare, paid those taxes all our lives, and we won't get a penny out of it. Those of us who also paid into a pension will see inflation turn that to ashes before we get any benefit from it. And any IRA or 401k money will be yanked as well. Our houses have no equity. I repeat, Boomers have nothing but debt.

I'm not saying that it isn't their fault or that they didn't enjoy the unsustainable party or that they didn't help make things worse for the next generation. Just saying that if you think the Boomers have all the wealth, you are mistaken. And that will become clear in the next twenty years.

So who DOES have all the wealth? The same people who always do - the crony-capitalists and oligarch political insiders.

Seraphim
07-09-2013, 03:59 PM
NUMBERS.

Expertise. Trades.

The brunt of the skilled and important workforce are BOOMERS.

That is leverage to the Nth degree. Get creative man!

:-)

All the Boomers have is debt. We inherited Social Security and Medicare, paid those taxes all our lives, and we won't get a penny out of it. Those of us who also paid into a pension will see inflation turn that to ashes before we get any benefit from it. And any IRA or 401k money will be yanked as well. Our houses have no equity. I repeat, Boomers have nothing but debt.

I'm not saying that it isn't their fault or that they didn't enjoy the unsustainable party or that they didn't help make things worse for the next generation. Just saying that if you think the Boomers have all the wealth, you are mistaken. And that will become clear in the next twenty years.

So who DOES have all the wealth? The same people who always do - the crony-capitalists and oligarch political insiders.

green73
07-09-2013, 04:09 PM
I don't have the first clue as to what will happen or whether AF is Chicken Little or Paul Revere.

I suggest a houseboat--and a moped or motorcycle.

Let's do it.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_8x-sY-At8sU/TPmxyJOpg7I/AAAAAAAAAJw/1dBFuyQCBrc/s640/scooter.jpg

tod evans
07-09-2013, 04:09 PM
NUMBERS.

Expertise. Trades.

The brunt of the skilled and important workforce are BOOMERS.

That is leverage to the Nth degree. Get creative man!

:-)

The only way the trades will be relevant again is when this house of cards comes crashing down.

How it crashes will determine what trades are important.

It's "our" responsibility as boomers to pass on what knowledge we remember, it's the younger generations responsibility to learn it.

My son is learning, I have taught many others over the years too...But I'm only a carpenter..:o

green73
07-09-2013, 04:13 PM
I am drinking a glass of wine , zeroing a rifle. Most people have probably never seen grim before .I have.I will not be leaving though, I have seen all the lands , I can die here .

I would like to have you at my side, kemo sahbee

green73
07-09-2013, 04:22 PM
Eventually, we win--I just don't know how long it takes. They're the parasites, without us, they're dead.

We Don’t Know How Close to Victory We Are


History shows that people usually don’t know when we are about to win. We are lousy at knowing whether we have a chance at victory.

When people struggling for liberty and justice face seemingly overwhelming power and impossible odds, they can suddenly breakthrough and win when things seem most hopeless and they least expect victory.

http://www.washingtonsblog.com/2008/07/we-dont-know-how-close-to-victory-we-are.html

Carlybee
07-09-2013, 04:22 PM
The death of the work ethic is what's choking the younger generation and that probably is the fault of us boomers. We didn't want our kids to have to struggle and do without so we helped create an entitlement society. I have worked hard since I was very young...my son hasn't had to work as hard because I've helped him but now its hard to make it out there alone. To say we boomers have all the power is a misnomer..maybe the ones who have been able to create wealth but that is certainly not the majority. I speak to young adults I work with and tell them I worked 3 jobs when I was in my 20s..they are horrified at the thought and complain all the time about their one job.

shane77m
07-09-2013, 04:41 PM
The death of the work ethic is what's choking the younger generation and that probably is the fault of us boomers. We didn't want our kids to have to struggle and do without so we helped create an entitlement society. I have worked hard since I was very young...my son hasn't had to work as hard because I've helped him but now its hard to make it out there alone. To say we boomers have all the power is a misnomer..maybe the ones who have been able to create wealth but that is certainly not the majority. I speak to young adults I work with and tell them I worked 3 jobs when I was in my 20s..they are horrified at the thought and complain all the time about their one job.


Death of the work ethic?

http://youtu.be/DtonKfWw2JY

mad cow
07-09-2013, 04:49 PM
Death of the work ethic?

http://youtu.be/DtonKfWw2JY

Free Noodles!

torchbearer
07-09-2013, 04:53 PM
kemo sahbee

quien no sabe

heavenlyboy34
07-09-2013, 05:33 PM
[QUOTE=shane77m;5117108]Death of the work ethic?
lolz@hippy. :D

Carlybee
07-09-2013, 05:57 PM
Death of the work ethic?

http://youtu.be/DtonKfWw2JY



The Noodle Revolution?

green73
07-09-2013, 06:04 PM
quien no sabe

Who knows?

KingNothing
07-09-2013, 06:04 PM
"Silly" is the word I would use, but grim can work.