PDA

View Full Version : Do Americans Love Big Brother?




Occam's Banana
06-17-2013, 03:47 PM
Why, yes. Yes, they do ...

FTA by Chet Nagle (former CIA agent): http://dailycaller.com/2013/06/13/do-americans-love-big-brother/

Now we know the sudden flood of leaks is not damaging our security. As William Binney told The Daily Caller on June 10, “Terrorists already knew all this stuff. … So, who are we keeping this from? It’s not the terrorists. We are really keeping it from the American public. Because that’s who they’re collecting data about. And that’s who they’re keeping it secret from.”

The Daily Caller asked Binney if he thought the Fourth Amendment could be restored or reformed. “Certainly it’s possible to do,” he said. “There’s a technical way to do it. But these people have all been duped by the intelligence community agencies. They throw technobabble down at the Congress and the judges. And those people have no idea what they’re talking about. All they can do is listen to the agencies and take their word for it. And they have no way of double-checking or verifying. So I look at the oversight by Congress and the courts as just a joke. In the last year, how many requests for a warrant has the FISA court rejected? Zero. It’s just a rubber stamp. In 2002 the FISA courts found out that the FBI lied on 75 affidavits for a warrant. And they didn’t do anything as a result of that. How good of an oversight is that? It’s nothing, it’s a joke.”

So is it just that Americans love Big Brother because they haven’t been told the truth in the past? If so, the latest revelations may cause a shift in public opinion.

The Washington Post’s Walter Pincus doesn’t think so. He argues (http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/surveillance-controversy-illuminated-by-history/2013/06/10/ba949844-cf8e-11e2-8845-d970ccb04497_story.html) that unlike Snowden, Americans don’t value privacy and happily wallow in global social media. They believe government is in their lives like a Facebook “friend.” Pincus recalls Yale professor Harry Rudin saying in the 1950s that Americans are unusually willing to trade civil liberties for personal security.

Maybe Professor Rudin was right.

TheTexan
06-17-2013, 04:03 PM
Just based on the people I know personally, yes, they love big brother

heavenlyboy34
06-17-2013, 04:14 PM
Who would keep us safe and comfortable without Big Brother? ;) :(

paulbot24
06-17-2013, 04:21 PM
What happens to your safety when "Big Brother" leaves and joins the military? Oh wait....

kahless
06-17-2013, 04:21 PM
The love whatever the media tells them they love.

Victor Grey
06-17-2013, 04:37 PM
"He knew in advance what O'Brien would say. That the Party did not seek power for its own ends, but only for the good of the majority. That it sought power because men in the mass were frail cowardly creatures who could not endure liberty or face the truth, and must be ruled over and systematically deceived by others who were stronger than themselves. That the choice for mankind lay between freedom and happiness, and that, for the great bulk of mankind, happiness was better. That the party was the eternal guardian of the weak, a dedicated sect doing evil that good might come, sacrificing its own happiness to that of others. The terrible thing, thought Winston, the terrible thing was that when O'Brien said this he would believe it.
You could see it in his face. O'Brien knew everything. A thousand times better than Winston he knew what the world was really like, in what degradation the mass of human beings lived and by what lies and barbarities the Party kept them there. He had understood it all, weighed it all, and it made no difference: all was justified by the ultimate purpose. What can you do, thought Winston, against the lunatic who is more intelligent than yourself, who gives your arguments a fair hearing and then simply persists in his lunacy? "
1984. Part 3 Chapter 3


We've always be at war with Syria.
We've always been in alliance with Al-Qaeda.

EBounding
06-17-2013, 05:01 PM
People don't want freedom, they want to be comfortable. If they think a faceless entity called the NSA is going to help keep them safe and not bother them, they're ok with that.

Occam's Banana
06-17-2013, 05:02 PM
From the Pincus commentary referenced in the OP article cite (emphasis mine): http://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/surveillance-controversy-illuminated-by-history/2013/06/10/ba949844-cf8e-11e2-8845-d970ccb04497_story.html


On March 15, 2012, Wired magazine published a long article by James Bamford, who has written books about the NSA. Bamford described the agency’s new $2 billion Utah Data Center and its ability to “intercept, decipher, analyze, and store vast swaths of the world’s communications as they zap down from satellites and zip through the underground and undersea cables of international, foreign, and domestic networks.”

He wrote that when the center is fully running at the end of this year, “stored in near-bottomless databases will be all forms of communication, including the complete contents of private emails, cell phone calls, and Google searches, as well as all sorts of personal data trails — parking receipts, travel itineraries, bookstore purchases, and other digital ‘pocket litter.’ ”

Was there any follow-up in the mainstream media to Bamford’s disclosure, or anything close to the concerns voiced on Capitol Hill this past week? No.

That’s because the American public at large is more accepting of the government’s involvement in their lives — along with Facebook, Google, Amazon, Apple — than is Edward Snowden, the 29-year-old who leaked the highly classified NSA documents. He appears to believe the public is unaware, and, as he told the Guardian, knowing “what’s happening, you [meaning the public] should decide whether we should be doing this.”

I believe the public has decided. I have never forgotten one thought in a lecture I heard at Yale University back in the early 1950s when Sen. Joseph R. McCarthy (R-Wis.) was carrying on his anti-communist witch hunt. Professor Harry R. Rudin declared that the two peoples most willing to trade civil liberties for personal security were the Germans and the Americans. Sixty-plus years later, I think the reaction to 9/11 that we still see proves again that Rudin was right.

heavenlyboy34
06-17-2013, 05:03 PM
"He knew in advance what O'Brien would say. That the Party did not seek power for its own ends, but only for the good of the majority. That it sought power because men in the mass were frail cowardly creatures who could not endure liberty or face the truth, and must be ruled over and systematically deceived by others who were stronger than themselves. That the choice for mankind lay between freedom and happiness, and that, for the great bulk of mankind, happiness was better. That the party was the eternal guardian of the weak, a dedicated sect doing evil that good might come, sacrificing its own happiness to that of others. The terrible thing, thought Winston, the terrible thing was that when O'Brien said this he would believe it.
You could see it in his face. O'Brien knew everything. A thousand times better than Winston he knew what the world was really like, in what degradation the mass of human beings lived and by what lies and barbarities the Party kept them there. He had understood it all, weighed it all, and it made no difference: all was justified by the ultimate purpose. What can you do, thought Winston, against the lunatic who is more intelligent than yourself, who gives your arguments a fair hearing and then simply persists in his lunacy? "
1984. Part 3 Chapter 3


We've always be at war with Syria.
We've always been in alliance with Al-Qaeda.
:D Well done. Love that book. Now you should quote the juicy parts from the torture scene.

DamianTV
06-17-2013, 05:41 PM
People don't want freedom, they want to be comfortable. If they think a faceless entity called the NSA is going to help keep them safe and not bother them, they're ok with that.

THIS

Most people are okay with a Govt that takes away from others so they can get by without making any effort. They are so lazy they dont even want to go through the act of theft themselves, and would rather other peoples prosperity is stolen for them by someone else. Being free requires effort and responsibility. And I think too many people just want freedom from responsibility, thus, openly welcome Big Brother.

Just they wait until Big Brother turns its focus on them.

CaptUSA
06-17-2013, 05:48 PM
Here's a deal for you...

I will promise you I will keep you safe from lightning strikes and tornados. Just give me a billion dollar budget and your civil liberties. Bingo! You are now safe.

Oh yeah, some may get through, but just look at all the ones I stopped! I'm great! You should love me! I am the one keeping you safe! If you haven't been killed by a tornado or lightning strike, it's because of me! Your welcome!


(of course, terrorism is a smaller threat than tornados and lightning, and the budget is a hell of a lot more than a billion dollars, and the government's efforts actually cause more terrorism, but then you didn't want to hear that part.)