Shock Poll: Hickenlooper: 42% Tancredo: 41%

[Warlord]

WASHINGTON — Colorado voters overwhelmingly support the death penalty and 67 percent disagree with Gov. John Hickenlooper’s recent decision to grant the convicted murderer temporary reprieve from being sentenced to die, according to a poll out this morning.

The same Quinnipiac poll shows Hickenlooper running in a close race with former Rep. Tom Tancredo, a Republican who ran against him in 2010 and has also run for president. Forty-two percent of voters said they support Hickenlooper, 41 percent support Tancredo.

The poll has a 3 percent margin of error. The surveys were conducted through land lines and cell phone interviews from June 5 – 10 among 1,065 registered Colorado voters.

http://blogs.denverpost.com/thespot/2013/06/13/poll-colorado-voters-like-the-death-penalty-hick-tancredo-run-neck-and-neck/

[Spoa]

Bump! Exciting news.

[Zarn Solen]

Tancredo is a disgusting human being.

[Red Green]

It would be awesome to see Hickenlooper get tossed along with the Senate pres and that other gun grabbing critter. CO: Guns and weed FTW!

[JCDenton0451]

Proof that Republican voters want immigration enforcement, not Amnesty.

[Warlord]

Tancredo is a disgusting human being.

He'd make a great governor.

Would be a major coup to win CO before 2016

[Red Green]

Tancredo is a disgusting human being.

He's a politician so that's almost a given. However, he's better than the scum they have now up there.

[Brett85]

This isn't surprising to me. Tancredo has a good chance to become the next Governor of Colorado because he's in favor of marijuana legalization. That's a winning issue for Republicans if they were just smart enough to realize that.

[compromise]

Tom Tancredo is an enemy of the GOP establishment and would be an excellent Governor. I'm definitely going to donate to his campaign.

[Zarn Solen]

He is a rabid racist. I can tell the difference between someone that wants to secure the borders and someone that hates people who aren't like him. He also wanted a Constitutional amendment for straight only marriage. He is more hate-driven than Rick Santorum.

[AuH20]

Tom Tancredo is an enemy of the GOP establishment and would be an excellent Governor. I'm definitely going to donate to his campaign.

I sent him donations during his last run. I'll do it again. Anyone who draws the ire of the progressive neo-borg elite as well as the Republican corporatists get money from me. You can tell alot of a man by his enemies.

[brandon]

I can't trust Tancredo after he renegged on his pot smkoing promise.
http://www.salon.com/2013/01/29/tom_tancredo_breaks_pot_smoking_promise_partner/

[compromise]

I can't trust Tancredo after he renegged on his pot smkoing promise.
http://www.salon.com/2013/01/29/tom_tancredo_breaks_pot_smoking_promise_partner/

Who cares?

If his family don't want him to smoke, then he's got to put their wishes before a publicity stunt.

[brandon]

Don't make promises you can't keep. He shook hands over the deal and gave his word.

[compromise]

Don't make promises you can't keep. He shook hands over the deal and gave his word.

It was a joke in the first place. It certainly wasn't made in seriousness. There's a video of it somewhere, he was laughing.

[supermario21]

Wow, this is big. If Hickenlooper is struggling then that means downballot Dems will get destroyed, because Hickenlooper until the gun stuff had always been considered centrist.

[Red Green]

He is a rabid racist. I can tell the difference between someone that wants to secure the borders and someone that hates people who aren't like him. He also wanted a Constitutional amendment for straight only marriage. He is more hate-driven than Rick Santorum.

Is that even possible? :confused:

[Zarn Solen]

Someone neg repped me for calling Tancredo out on his racism. I guess the neg repper didn't care, because Tancredo wasn't targeting his 'race.'

This guy not only has problems with Hispanics in the Southwest (his whole Central Americans gang members are going to get us all fear-mongering commercial), but he went to Miami to pick a fight. He even called Miami "third world."

He doesn't like any vehicle that allows Spanish speakers to connect with the rest of the country. I understand he wants people to know English, but some people are still more comfortable listening to news, debates, etc... in their native language. This allows some Hispanics to have a better understanding of US politics. It is actually a uniter and not a divider. Why take that away?

The Supreme Court Justice to had the big beef with was Sotomayor. I can't stand here, and I think her being on the bench is an insult to Hispanics. However, he accused her of being in the "Latino KKK." That is way out there.

Whenever he takes a stand on something, Hispanics are the bad guys.

This is vastly different than the Paul family. They want secure borders, but they also wanted to treat Hispanics with respect. Ron's approach was saying Hispanics were just like everyone else. Rand's approach was similar, but he addressed this point specifically to Hispanics.

[Debbie Downer]

Not bad...

I really hope he wins. He'd be one of, if not the, best governor in the country alongside Cuccinelli.

[compromise]

Someone neg repped me for calling Tancredo out on his racism. I guess the neg repper didn't care, because Tancredo wasn't targeting his 'race.'

This guy not only has problems with Hispanics in the Southwest (his whole Central Americans gang members are going to get us all fear-mongering commercial), but he went to Miami to pick a fight. He even called Miami "third world."

He doesn't like any vehicle that allows Spanish speakers to connect with the rest of the country. I understand he wants people to know English, but some people are still more comfortable listening to news, debates, etc... in their native language. This allows some Hispanics to have a better understanding of US politics. It is actually a uniter and not a divider. Why take that away?

The Supreme Court Justice to had the big beef with was Sotomayor. I can't stand here, and I think her being on the bench is an insult to Hispanics. However, he accused her of being in the "Latino KKK." That is way out there.

Whenever he takes a stand on something, Hispanics are the bad guys.

This is vastly different than the Paul family. They want secure borders, but they also wanted to treat Hispanics with respect. Ron's approach was saying Hispanics were just like everyone else. Rand's approach was similar, but he addressed this point specifically to Hispanics.

Miami is third world. That city is deteriorating fast.

I highly doubt Tancredo wants to ban private sector Spanish language media.

[AuH20]

Someone neg repped me for calling Tancredo out on his racism. I guess the neg repper didn't care, because Tancredo wasn't targeting his 'race.'

This guy not only has problems with Hispanics in the Southwest (his whole Central Americans gang members are going to get us all fear-mongering commercial), but he went to Miami to pick a fight. He even called Miami "third world."

He doesn't like any vehicle that allows Spanish speakers to connect with the rest of the country. I understand he wants people to know English, but some people are still more comfortable listening to news, debates, etc... in their native language. This allows some Hispanics to have a better understanding of US politics. It is actually a uniter and not a divider. Why take that away?

The Supreme Court Justice to had the big beef with was Sotomayor. I can't stand here, and I think her being on the bench is an insult to Hispanics. However, he accused her of being in the "Latino KKK." That is way out there.

Whenever he takes a stand on something, Hispanics are the bad guys.

This is vastly different than the Paul family. They want secure borders, but they also wanted to treat Hispanics with respect. Ron's approach was saying Hispanics were just like everyone else. Rand's approach was similar, but he addressed this point specifically to Hispanics.

What you miscategorize as "racist" is actually cultural elitism, especially when you consider the disastrous effects that multiculturalism has ushered forth in this nation. Tancredo doesn't hate hispanics (he's actually darker than some hispanics LOL), but rather the special interest groups that have forcefed us these great lies, which are intentionally designed to garner artificial guilt and sympathy for an insidious cause.

[youngbuck]

Tancredo would be exponentially better than Hickenlooper. Absolute worst case, it would be voting for the lesser of two evils, but I don't see Tancredo as quite that bad.

[thoughtomator]

Someone neg repped me for calling Tancredo out on his racism. I guess the neg repper didn't care, because Tancredo wasn't targeting his 'race.'

Someone probably neg repped you for using the most dishonest attack in modern politics, the racism dog whistle.

As Tancredo proposes no actual race-based policy whatsoever, perhaps you'd like to consider changing the language you use to something a little bit more rational and supportable and less along the lines of emotional bomb-throwing?

Could the "racism" you see in Tancredo actually be your own bias against anyone who gives an unapologetic argument in favor of US sovereignty?

[Zarn Solen]

But you can you explain why he does the things he does. That is substantial proof that he targets Hispanics, specifically.

AuH20 and anyone else, If you want to talk about it honestly and openly, I am more than willing. But by all means, some of you can keep neg speking me and insulting me. Bullying never worked on me, and it is not going to work now.

[stu2002]

GO TOM GO

[Zarn Solen]

Thoughtomator, wouldn't I be disgusted with the Pauls and many of you, if I had a problem with US sovereignty? I understand the need more enforcing US sovereignty.

[thoughtomator]

But you can you explain why he does the things he does. That is substantial proof that he targets Hispanics, specifically.

Bring your argument to the table; vague statements are not debatable arguments. What specifically does he do that you object to?

[AuH20]

But you can you explain why he does the things he does. That is substantial proof that he targets Hispanics, specifically.

AuH20 and anyone else, If you want to talk about it honestly and openly, I am more than willing. But by all means, some of you can keep neg speking me and insulting me. Bullying never worked on me, and it is not going to work now.

I would never neg rep someone I disagree with. Now regarding Hispanics, yes he attacks their political power base, but he doesn't believe that Americans are racially superior to Hispanics. Don't conflate the two.

[Zarn Solen]

I am sorry, I should have separated that part into a different paragraph. It was not meant for you or anyone willing to discuss.

Thoughtomater, I have few in the 18th post (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?417781-Shock-Poll-Hickenlooper-42-Tancredo-41&p=5073596&viewfull=1#post5073596). To be honest, I don't remember some of the stuff, since it was a while back. He always had that fixation with Hispanics, and I think it is harmful to many people and not just Hispanics.

[Keith and stuff]

But you can you explain why he does the things he does. That is substantial proof that he targets Hispanics, specifically.

AuH20 and anyone else, If you want to talk about it honestly and openly, I am more than willing. But by all means, some of you can keep neg speking me and insulting me. Bullying never worked on me, and it is not going to work now.
Even if you are going to claim race is real, you should still admit that most Hispanics are White. If you beleive in races, they are the same race anyway. Therefore, the term you are looking for isn't racist. Maybe you should call him a culturalist or something more accurate.

[Zarn Solen]

Even if you are going to claim race is real, you should still admit that most Hispanics are White. If you beleive in races, they are the same race anyway. Therefore, the term you are looking for isn't racist. Maybe you should call him a culturalist or something more accurate.

I could understand that argument. In fact, I would say humans are one race. However, that does not mean Tancredo sees it that way.

[AuH20]

I am sorry, I should have separated that part into a different paragraph. It was not meant for you or anyone willing to discuss.

Thoughtomater, I have few in the 18th post (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?417781-Shock-Poll-Hickenlooper-42-Tancredo-41&p=5073596&viewfull=1#post5073596). To be honest, I don't remember some of the stuff, since it was a while back. He always had that fixation with Hispanics, and I think it is harmful to many people and not just Hispanics.

Tancredo has a controversial and un-politically correct form of expression, but unfortunately most of his rhetoric is fact based. I'm an objectivist, so this delivery doesn't really bother me, while it will irk others.

[RonPaulMall]

This guy not only has problems with Hispanics in the Southwest (his whole Central Americans gang members are going to get us all fear-mongering commercial), but he went to Miami to pick a fight. He even called Miami "third world."

I live in Miami and can assure you this place IS a third world country. I live on the beach, which is bearable, but if I drive to the mainland, 9/10 it is to get to the airport. The mainland is an utter hell hole. And when I have children, I'll have to move because Miami is no place any sane person would raise their kid and that is 100% due to immigration (and not all of it Hispanic- Haitian immigration is a huge problem down here too). Saying you don't want Colorado to turn in to Mexico is not "racist". If the people of Colorado wanted to live in Mexico, they'd move there. "Racism" is an argument people use when they want to stop using their brains.

[Zarn Solen]

If he was as critical of others as he was of people who happen to be Hispanic than I could see that. However, that is not the case. His rhetoric is definitely aimed to define things based on 'racial' (which yes on reality is more like cultural) lines.

I noticed someone mentioned multiculturalism. The United States is not one culture. It never even has been. Maryland used to be English Catholic, and the rest of the original colonies were divided up between Western denominations and cultures (even Swedish). I do not believe we have to learn other people's cultures (like multi-cultualism wants), but I do think people should be able to practice the cultures of their ancestors (or anyone's ancestors), if they wish. If people wanted to listen to the radio in Polish, I don't see a problem with it (given they run their own station). This is really getting into a different topic, though. Maybe it belongs in another thread somewhere.

I know I have a problem with a massive amount of parenthesis. I'm seeing a doctor, a shrink, and priest about it.

[Zarn Solen]

I live in Miami and can assure you this place IS a third world country. I live on the beach, which is bearable, but if I drive to the mainland, 9/10 it is to get to the airport. The mainland is an utter hell hole. And when I have children, I'll have to move because Miami is no place any sane person would raise their kid and that is 100% due to immigration (and not all of it Hispanic- Haitian immigration is a huge problem down here too). Saying you don't want Colorado to turn in to Mexico is not "racist". If the people of Colorado wanted to live in Mexico, they'd move there. "Racism" is an argument people use when they want to stop using their brains.

I thought it was weird that he singled out Miami. Why not Philly, Cleveland, or Detroit? The guy that usually talks about Hispanics singled out Miami. I never once said Miami was a great place.

[AuH20]

If he was as critical of others as he was of people who happen to be Hispanic than I could see that. However, that is not the case. His rhetoric is definitely aimed to define things based on 'racial' (which yes on reality is more like cultural) lines.

I noticed someone mentioned multiculturalism. The United States is not one culture. It never even has been. Maryland used to be English Catholic, and the rest of the original colonies were divided up between Western denominations and cultures (even Swedish). I do not believe we have to learn other people's cultures (like multi-cultualism wants), but I do think people should be able to practice the cultures of their ancestors (or anyone's ancestors), if they wish. If people wanted to listen to the radio in Polish, I don't see a problem with it (given they run their own station). This is really getting into a different topic, though. Maybe it belongs in another thread somewhere.
I know I have a problem with a massive amount of parenthesis. I'm seeing a doctor, a shrink, and priest about it.

I don't think anyone here is advocating for Americans to abandon their sub-cultures or ethnic identities, but rather abandon this ridiculous notion that that one of these sub-cultures can be on the same dominant level with the conglomerate blueprint known as Western Civilization. This transnational progressivism that has entrenched itself here from Europe and Latin American is directly opposed to the unique property and individual right based system that Western Civ has sparked.

[Debbie Downer]

Even if you are going to claim race is real, you should still admit that most Hispanics are White. If you beleive in races, they are the same race anyway. Therefore, the term you are looking for isn't racist. Maybe you should call him a culturalist or something more accurate.

Most Hispanics are not white. Most are mestizo which although they do have some white blood, they are not white, they are mostly native american. White Hispanics are a minority, both in Latin America and in the United States.

This is a Mestizo Hispanic (some random lower-class Mexican):

http://www.humanbiologicaldiversity.com/Photos/Mexican%20Mestizo.jpg

This is a White Hispanic (Mexican singer Belinda):

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-c-Y0AW7oaS4/UC-Z4JQ6v9I/AAAAAAAAV3Y/n2lnF5QP-PI/s1600/Belinda+2.jpg

[Zarn Solen]

Right, but that was my problem with Tancredo. He didn't want a presidential debate translated in Spanish for a TV audience. If anything, using Spanish could be a key to reaching out to Hispanics*, which are by the way, Westerners.

*Meaning not targeting their votes but reaching out to them as American citizens.

[Zarn Solen]

Mestizo is a poor term to use, and they have 'white blood.'

[Debbie Downer]

Mestizo is a poor term to use, and they have 'white blood.'

Mestizo isn't a 'poor term,' it's the term used by them and anyone knows anything about different types of Hispanics/Latin Americans. It's not a derogatory term, if that's what you think.

Yeah, they might have some white blood, but they vast majority of Mestizos are as white as Obama.

[Debbie Downer]

Right, but that was my problem with Tancredo. He didn't want a presidential debate translated in Spanish for a TV audience. If anything, using Spanish could be a key to reaching out to Hispanics*, which are by the way, Westerners.

*Meaning not targeting their votes but reaching out to them as American citizens.

Westerners? Come here to Mexico and tell me the majority of the population is "western." You have no fucking clue what you are talking about.

[Zarn Solen]

Mestizo isn't a 'poor term,' it's the term used by them and anyone knows anything about different types of Hispanics/Latin Americans. It's not a derogatory term, if that's what you think.

Yeah, they might have some white blood, but they vast majority of Mestizos are as white as Obama.

It's a misleading term. You are right, but because Obama is actually very white.

They certainly are Westerners. There have strong religious and political ties to Europe.

[Debbie Downer]

It's a misleading term. You are right, but because Obama is actually very white.

They certainly are Westerners. There have strong religious and political ties to Europe.

Hahahaha. Man you really need to come here to Latin America.

And no, Mestizo is not misleading. Simply saying "Hispanic" as a race is extremely misleading because there are many different racial/ethnic groups that make up Hispanics. There are Mestizos, Whites, Blacks, Amerindian, and even Asian Hispanics.

The majority of illegal aliens in the US are Mestizo Hispanics, not Whites.

Oh and Obama is black, he's not white despite having a white mother.

[Zarn Solen]

People do not lose their white, because it is mixed with something else. I do not know how many times I have to type it in different ways.

[Keith and stuff]

Most Hispanics are not white. Most are mestizo which although they do have some white blood, they are not white, they are mostly native american. White Hispanics are a minority, both in Latin America and in the United States.

The vast majority of Hispanics in the US are White. That's how the government classifies them, anyway. Mestizo Hispanic is obviously not a racial classification in the US but perhaps it is a good cultural classification? Plenty of Hispanics do classify themselves as more than 1 race. What is it, 5%? Maybe 10%?

But my bigger point is that there is only 1 human race.

Maybe Zarn Solen come start saying that Tacredo is against Mestizo Hispanics or something? That would be more accurate and less inflammatory than saying he is racist. My main point is that Zarn was wrong and being inflammatory. I'm not surprised that someone neg repped him.

Sorry for getting so off topic.

[Debbie Downer]

The vast majority of Hispanics in the US are White. That's how the government classifies them, anyway. Mestizo Hispanic is obviously not a racial classification in the US but perhaps it is a good cultural classification? Plenty of Hispanics do classify themselves as more than 1 race. What is it, 5%? Maybe 10%?

But my bigger point is that there is only 1 human race.

Maybe Zarn Solen come start saying that Tacredo is against Mestizo Hispanics or something? That would be more accurate and less inflammatory than saying he is racist.

Yes, that is true that the US government doesn't consider "Hispanic" as a race and classifies them as either White or Black. That doesn't mean the majority are actually white.

[Debbie Downer]

People do not lose their white, because it is mixed with something else. I do not know how many times I have to type it in different ways.

Actually, yes, they do. Obama isn't white.

[Zarn Solen]

The vast majority of Hispanics in the US are White. That's how the government classifies them, anyway. Mestizo Hispanic is obviously not a racial classification in the US but perhaps it is a good cultural classification? Plenty of Hispanics do classify themselves as more than 1 race. What is it, 5%? Maybe 10%?

But my bigger point is that there is only 1 human race.

Maybe Zarn Solen come start saying that Tacredo is against Mestizo Hispanics or something? That would be more accurate and less inflammatory than saying he is racist. My main point is that Zarn was wrong and being inflammatory. I'm not surprised that someone neg repped him.

Sorry for getting so off topic.

However, the term racist does not mean that I think humans are divided into different races. It is a word used to describe someone's dissatisfaction with someone's skin pigment, culture, etc...

Like I said, it does not matter if people neg spek me. I simply would not do the same to others. I find it too disrespectful to do to others.

[Debbie Downer]

However, the term racist does not mean that I think humans are divided into different races. It is a word used to describe someone's dissatisfaction with someone's skin pigment, culture, etc...


No, racism is the belief that one race - whites - should rule all others.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FgQny9JSjl0

[Zarn Solen]

Okay, so we are going to end discussion with the agreement that Chris Mathews is a tool.

[compromise]

I thought it was weird that he singled out Miami. Why not Philly, Cleveland, or Detroit? The guy that usually talks about Hispanics singled out Miami. I never once said Miami was a great place.

Miami has a tropical climate, which combined with the Latin-Caribbean culture, makes it more like a third world country (in the Americas, I'm aware there are cold third world countries on other continents) than some of these other places.

Also, I believe he was in Miami at the time he made his remarks, so he was probably just describing what he was seeing all around him.

[ReasonableThinker]

He is a rabid racist. I can tell the difference between someone that wants to secure the borders and someone that hates people who aren't like him. He also wanted a Constitutional amendment for straight only marriage. He is more hate-driven than Rick Santorum.

Libtard alert. Glad we have more libtards on the forum now..

[ReasonableThinker]

I could understand that argument. In fact, I would say humans are one race. However, that does not mean Tancredo sees it that way.



You're just revealing your ignorance in anthropology then. There are 5 races of Man, one second libtards like you twist race into a social construct then they proclaim "THERES ONE HOOMAN RACE!!" Wait, I thought it was a social construct?

[AuH20]

Libtard alert. Glad we have more libtards on the forum now..

I don't think he's a libtard. Probably hyper-sensitive in that he falls for the emotional ruse that has typified the illegal immigration debate. The fact is that hispanics aren't bad people but you cannot let them run roughshod over this nation with the Marxist virus that they have acquired from their native countries. End of discussion. If you want to be an American individual and forge a new life here, then we'll help you. If you want to recreate a new vision of your former homeland under the guise of social justice, you can go suck on the end of a tailpipe.

[NationalAnarchist]

Someone neg repped me for calling Tancredo out on his racism. I guess the neg repper didn't care, because Tancredo wasn't targeting his 'race.'

This guy not only has problems with Hispanics in the Southwest (his whole Central Americans gang members are going to get us all fear-mongering commercial), but he went to Miami to pick a fight. He even called Miami "third world."

He doesn't like any vehicle that allows Spanish speakers to connect with the rest of the country. I understand he wants people to know English, but some people are still more comfortable listening to news, debates, etc... in their native language. This allows some Hispanics to have a better understanding of US politics. It is actually a uniter and not a divider. Why take that away?

The Supreme Court Justice to had the big beef with was Sotomayor. I can't stand here, and I think her being on the bench is an insult to Hispanics. However, he accused her of being in the "Latino KKK." That is way out there.

Whenever he takes a stand on something, Hispanics are the bad guys.

This is vastly different than the Paul family. They want secure borders, but they also wanted to treat Hispanics with respect. Ron's approach was saying Hispanics were just like everyone else. Rand's approach was similar, but he addressed this point specifically to Hispanics.

Sotamayor was in the La Raza group which is a racist hispanic group.

[Brett85]

He also wanted a Constitutional amendment for straight only marriage. He is more hate-driven than Rick Santorum.

So what? No law or amendment defining marriage as between a man and a woman causes any gay person to get thrown in prison for having their own private marriage ceremony. On the other hand, marijuana users are actually getting kidnapped and thrown in a cage for using marijuana, and Tancredo is one of the rare politicians who actually wants to end that.

[thoughtomator]

Tancredo objects to the creation and spread of a separate and different nation inside the United States. There are good reasons to do this, historically a Balkanized nation ends up at war with itself.

[supermario21]

I think the whole gist of these developments is that Colorado is still firmly a swing state. Rand is going to need Colorado in 4 years if he wins the nomination so I'd like to see a Republican revolution in the state.

[AuH20]

Tancredo objects to the creation and spread of a separate and different nation inside the United States. There are good reasons to do this, historically a Balkanized nation ends up at war with itself.

People are so handicapped by infantile, emotional pleas that they have no idea what is transpiring.

I think a simple parable would explain the greater problem and threat:

A trio of guests are invited to live in a man's home as a humanitarian gesture of brotherhood. After a few weeks in their new surroundings, these three are feeling comfortable & start to rearrange the furniture and portraits in home. Encouraged by the homeowner's relative indifference to these small changes, soon the guests feel confident enough to change the cable television plan as well as signing off for a new extension of the home at the owner's expense. Feeling abit lonely, these guests call up their friends from the other side of town to live in the newly expanded home. Taken back by these changes, the homeowner demands that his new guests are to leave immediately and is assailed as a RACIST by the reluctant group!!!

[Zarn Solen]

You're just revealing your ignorance in anthropology then. There are 5 races of Man, one second libtards like you twist race into a social construct then they proclaim "THERES ONE HOOMAN RACE!!" Wait, I thought it was a social construct?

You have no idea what I stated. By the way, I am a libertarian that used to be a social conservative and interventionist.

[Zarn Solen]

I think the whole gist of these developments is that Colorado is still firmly a swing state. Rand is going to need Colorado in 4 years if he wins the nomination so I'd like to see a Republican revolution in the state.

In what why is a different nation forming within the United States, unless you isolate certain cultures as much as possible?

[Debbie Downer]

Tancredo objects to the creation and spread of a separate and different nation inside the United States. There are good reasons to do this, historically a Balkanized nation ends up at war with itself.

Which makes sense and I fully support. If you move to the US, become an American. That doesn't mean you have to lose all your culture, but look at how the Irish, Italians, Swedes, Greeks, etc assimilated. That's what should be demanded of all new immigrants.

[Zarn Solen]

Which makes sense and I fully support. If you move to the US, become an American. That doesn't mean you have to lose all your culture, but look at how the Irish, Italians, Swedes, Greeks, etc assimilated. That's what should be demanded of all new immigrants.

They had their own groups.

You guys really go out of your way to support a neocon, or is bombing people left and right okay now, too?

[Debbie Downer]

They had their own groups.

I know, but they have assimilated. You don't find 2nd generation Italian immigrants who don't speak English. They became Americans.

[AuH20]

I know, but they have assimilated. You don't find 2nd generation Italian immigrants who don't speak English. They became Americans.

Why do we baby hispanics in this country with the lingual aids and the rest of the crutch nonsense that the other ethnic groups never had? It's like they are a protected species and any criticism is immediately translated as racially motivated attacks. I'm so sick of the cultural marxism. People need to stand up and say enough is enough. Johnny can no longer wear diapers in high school. LOL

[EricMuck]

just logged in for the first time in forever to give support to Zarn. There is a disgusting trend of racism in conservative politics for the past 50 years or so. It wasn't that long ago that there was many different languages spoken in the United States of America. That is plural.

[Zarn Solen]

Why do we baby hispanics in this country with the lingual aids and the rest of the crutch nonsense that the other ethnic groups never had? It's like they are a protected species and any criticism is immediately translated as racially motivated attacks. I'm so sick of the cultural marxism. People need to stand up and say enough is enough. Johnny can no longer wear diapers in high school. LOL

I wouldn't say that is racist in of itself. I have no problem with people believing otherwise, but Tancredo goes out of his way to target Hispanics.

[AuH20]

just logged in for the first time in forever to give support to Zarn. There is a disgusting trend of racism in conservative politics for the past 50 years or so. It wasn't that long ago that there was many different languages spoken in the United States of America. That is plural.

There is nothing wrong with multiple modes of communication. But riddle me this. On the local level, one non-english party and an english speaking party want to engage in commerce with each other. How does this successfully occur without a common medium of communication? And this type of lingual compatability stretches across all types of societal interation and fields.

[EricMuck]

PEOPLE CAN SPEAK WHATEVER LANGUAGE THEY SO CHOOSE. THIS IS A FREE COUNTRY DAMNIT.

[AuH20]

PEOPLE CAN SPEAK WHATEVER LANGUAGE THEY SO CHOOSE. THIS IS A FREE COUNTRY DAMNIT.

Exactly. No one cares what language humans utilize for communication purposes, but versatility is imperative. Are you familiar with the Tower of Babel story?

[Zarn Solen]

There is nothing wrong with multiple modes of communication. But riddle me this. On the local level, one non-english party and an english speaking party want to engage in commerce with each other. How does this successfully occur without a common medium of communication? And this type of lingual compatability stretches across all types of societal interation and fields.

Tancredo's problem was not that Spanish people would not learn English for direct communication (in the case in which I am referring). His problem was there was a successful way to translate English responses into Spanish for a TV audience that has an easier time hearing political questions and answers in Spanish. It did not mean they did not understand English. It means Spanish was easier and more comfortable for them. That is the reason why people will speak another language at home. BTW, Ron Paul was a willing participator in said debate.

I do have to give you credit though for at least discussing this maturely. That type of response is not exactly all the rage on the internet.

[AuH20]

Tancredo's problem was not that Spanish people would not learn English for direct communication (in the case in which I am referring). His problem was there was a successful way to translate English responses into Spanish for a TV audience that has an easier time hearing political questions and answers in Spanish. It did not mean they did not understand English. It means Spanish was easier and more comfortable for them. That is the reason why people will speak another language at home. BTW, Ron Paul was a willing participator in said debate.

Tancredo is not an advocate for babying or placating certain ethnic groups in this country. He does hold any ill will towards the spanish language.

[RonPaulMall]

I thought it was weird that he singled out Miami. Why not Philly, Cleveland, or Detroit? The guy that usually talks about Hispanics singled out Miami. I never once said Miami was a great place.

Massive immigration from Mexico is the threat that Colorado faces. Mexicans are Hispanic. Tancredo talks about Hispanic immigration because it is the issue which is relevant to the state he comes from. Miami is a city that has turned in to a hell hole because of massive immigration from largely Hispanic countries. Philly, Cleveland, and Detroit are all hell holes, but not for that reason. He singled out Miami because it was relevant (or at least the closest thing to relevant that exists on the East Coast), not because he "hates Hispanics" or whatever it is you are talking about.

[Zarn Solen]

How is that babying? It is simply more effective communication.

[AuH20]

How is that babying? It is simply more effective communication.

Yes and no.

[Zarn Solen]

Massive immigration from Mexico is the threat that Colorado faces. Mexicans are Hispanic. Tancredo talks about Hispanic immigration because it is the issue which is relevant to the state he comes from. Miami is a city that has turned in to a hell hole because of massive immigration from largely Hispanic countries. Philly, Cleveland, and Detroit are all hell holes, but not for that reason. He singled out Miami because it was relevant, not because he "hates Hispanics" or whatever it is you are talking about.

Most legal immigrants are Mexicans. Those are the ones I'm talking about. What about them being Mexican/ Spanish speaking/ Hispanic is a problem?

[Debbie Downer]

Why do we baby hispanics in this country with the lingual aids and the rest of the crutch nonsense that the other ethnic groups never had? It's like they are a protected species and any criticism is immediately translated as racially motivated attacks. I'm so sick of the cultural marxism. People need to stand up and say enough is enough. Johnny can no longer wear diapers in high school. LOL

I'm a Hispanic and I hate Hispanics who can't even learn English yet think they have a birthright to live in the US.

[RonPaulMall]

Most legal immigrants are Mexicans. Those are the ones I'm talking about. What about them being Mexican/ Spanish speaking/ Hispanic is a problem?

Have you ever been to Mexico? Have you ever been to New Mexico? Now compare those places to Colorado. Do you really think the people of Colorado want their state to turn in to New Mexico? Well, if every immigrant from Mexico that wanted to move to Colorado were allowed to do so, that is exactly what would happen. Nobody is saying it is a "problem" being a Mexican in and of itself. The "problem" is immigration of Mexicans to a specific place in a specific context. Colorado is a beautiful state with a high quality of life. If the immigration patterns are not altered in some way, it will in a relatively shot time become an unlivable hell hole. Many people in Colorado, understandably, don't want to see that happen.

[Zarn Solen]

I'm a Hispanic and I hate Hispanics who can't even learn English yet think they have a birthright to live in the US.

But he is including those willing to learn English but are still more comfortable with Spanish. It's great you can grasp other languages, but some people struggle. Yes, I also realize there are people who do not care and even try to learn English. I don't like those ones, either.

[Zarn Solen]

Have you ever been to Mexico? Have you ever been to New Mexico? Now compare those places to Colorado. Do you really think the people of Colorado want their state to turn in to New Mexico? Well, if every immigrant from Mexico that wanted to move to Colorado were allowed to do so, that is exactly what would happen. Nobody is saying it is a "problem" being a Mexican in and of itself. The "problem" is immigration of Mexicans to a specific place in a specific context.

They had political cartoons about that type of thing concerning the mass immigration of Southern and Eastern Europeans. It turns out, mass immigration is not a problem, if you know how to handle it.

[AuH20]

They had political cartoons about that type of thing concerning the mass immigration of Southern and Eastern Europeans. It turns out, mass immigration is not a problem, if you know how to handle it.

That was a very long time ago. Migrations were in the hundred thousands as opposed to the millions. It's a completely different world with modern transport eliminating vast distances and with the addictive welfare state that has emerged. The melting pot has been smashed to pieces.

[Zarn Solen]

That was a very long time ago. Migrations were in the hundred thousands as opposed to the millions. It's a completely different world with modern transport eliminating vast distances and with the addictive welfare state that has emerged. The melting pot has been smashed to pieces.

Wouldn't extending the line of communication help with that?

[RonPaulMall]

But he is including those willing to learn English but are still more comfortable with Spanish. It's great you can grasp other languages, but some people struggle. Yes, I also realize there are people who do not care and even try to learn English. I don't like those ones, either.

But for everyone else, what is the difference? What do Coloradans care whether their new Mexican ghettos are populated by people speaking Spanish out of choice or out of ignorance? As a candidate for citizenship, isn't a person who is simply too stupid to learn the language an even more absurd choice than a person who can but chooses not to? How far down the rabbit hole of insanity are we going here?

[AuH20]

But for everyone else, what is the difference? What do Coloradans care whether their new Mexican ghettos are populated by people speaking Spanish out of choice or out of ignorance? As a candidate for citizenship, isn't a person who is simply too stupid to learn the language an even more absurd choice than a person who can but chooses not to? How far down the rabbit hole of insanity are we going here?

The real travesty is those of Mexican origin who are ILLITERATE in Spanish. This is a disturbing trend.

[RonPaulMall]

They had political cartoons about that type of thing concerning the mass immigration of Southern and Eastern Europeans. It turns out, mass immigration is not a problem, if you know how to handle it.

Actually, all that demonstrates is that mass immigration of Southern and Eastern Europeans, in an entirely different time and in a completely different context, aren't a problem. We've had plenty of time to gauge the effect of mass immigration from Mexico in places like Southern California, New Mexico, and parts of Arizona and Texas. The results are not pretty.

[AuH20]

Wouldn't extending the line of communication help with that?

A cultural renaissance would help in that regard, and all parties involved would retain their cultural identity. No one wants to transform our new immigrants into mindless, vapid "new age" consumers, but they need to be introduced into the ideals that defined this nation.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

Hickenlooper has been nuts. The gun issue, the death penalty, coddling illegal aliens...he's begging to be beaten.

No surprise this poll shows Coloradans like the death penalty.

[Zarn Solen]

A cultural renaissance would help in that regard, and all parties involved would retain their cultural identity. No one wants to transform our new immigrants into mindless, vapid "new age" consumers, but they need to be introduced into the ideals that defined this nation.

But you cannot introduce them, if you don't try. It makes no sense.

As for Tancredo, he was not even being asked to try. Others were trying to reach out with a translated debate, and he got his panties in a bunch.