If you served as an Army Officer opine on this

[GunnyFreedom]

I don't want to bias this, so I won't give my opinion. If you served as a commissioned officer in the US Army...

What kind of man retires out as a Major?

Don't try and tell me what you think I want to hear, tell the truth according to your experience.

[Philhelm]

Define "retire." Are we talking 20 years at least? How many years as an officer? Or are we to take it at face value?
*I didn't serve as an Army officer, mind you.*

[GunnyFreedom]

20 years as an officer in the US Army, retiring out as a Major in the Army.

There is a guy trading on retiring as a Major after 20 years on active duty.

I have an opinion on that, I don't want to bias other people's opinions.

Someone who is familiar with the way the military works (since the people this guy is convincing do NOT know how the military works) your thoughts on some guy retiring out of the US Army as a Major afte 20 years on active duty as an officer.

[phill4paul]

Dunno. Major Army is O-4. Lieutenant Commander in the Navy. Someone that worked there way through the ranks, made Warrant, and progressed from there would have had a long and prosperous enlistment. Don't really understand what you are asking.

[phill4paul]

Dunno. Major Army is O-4. Lieutenant Commander in the Navy. Someone that worked there way through the ranks, made Warrant, and progressed from there would have had a long and prosperous enlistment. Don't really understand what you are asking.

Oh, 20 years as an officer? Lololol................

[ghengis86]

What kind of man retires out as a Major?


a Malfunction?

seriously, 20 years as major? What'd he do to piss away his career?

[leverguy]

20 years and only made Major? Sounds like he was passed over twice (or not recommended) and had to retire. That's still an awful long time in service for someone who only made major unless he had some enlisted or warrant time on the front end. I don't recall ever meeting a major with 20 or more years who didn't start out as a private. I was only an NCO, but I'm somewhat familiar with the officer promotion system from talking with officers over the years.

[fr33]

Forest Gump type.

(I'm not qualified to speak; not military)

[GunnyFreedom]

Oh, 20 years as an officer? Lololol................


a Malfunction?

seriously, 20 years as major? What'd he do to piss away his career?


20 years and only made Major? Sounds like he was passed over twice (or not recommended) and had to retire. That's still an awful long time in service for someone who only made major unless he had some enlisted or warrant time on the front end. I don't recall ever meeting a major with 20 or more years who didn't start out as a private. I was only an NCO, but I'm somewhat familiar with the officer promotion system from talking with officers over the years.

Y'all are definitely getting what I am asking about.

This guy is trading on his retiring out as a Major in the Army as though everybody in the world should bow down and worship him. You don't retire out after 20 as a Major unless you are a shitbag on wheels. This is the guy blatantly lying to attack me. Dude gets DESTROYED in the Vice Chair election (he only ran because he hates me) and I did very well and built many bridges.

I was content to ignore the lying jerk, but he's still attacking me.

My opinion is you don't retire out as a Major unless you are a real shitbag. I wanted people to give their own analysis without my input so the folks who have come to watch me at his direction can see it.

He has sent people to this site to spy on me by the way.

The people who support him have not served in the military. They don't understand, and it's not their fault that they don't understand.

To go into the Army as an officer, and retire out after 20 as a Major, you have to be a total bag of shit. Civilians are going to be all "oh wow, this guy was a major." Officers who make 20 who are worth a damn retire out as a Lt Col or a Col. Officers who make 20 and retire out as a Major mean their chain of command considers them worthless.

That's my opinion. I asked for other people's opinions unbiased by my input and I got it. It agrees with my assessment.

I wouldn't even be saying anything whatever except dude is still attacking me.

Retiring out after 20 as a MAJOR is not something I would be bragging about. Indeed, I'd be ashamed as hell about it.

Y'all folks reading my history here at his direction, go talk to a random Army officer yourself and ask them if I am telling the truth or spinning a line.

You don't retire out as a Major unless you are incompetent or you shtupped the General's daughter.

[Icymudpuppy]

I don't want to bias this, so I won't give my opinion. If you served as a commissioned officer in the US Army...

What kind of man retires out as a Major?

Don't try and tell me what you think I want to hear, tell the truth according to your experience.

Tons of variables here.

Many Mustangs (those who earned a commission after already serving an enlistment) often only make it to Major before they hit retirement.

Major is probably the last rank that doesn't require playing politics to achieve. After that, you really have to kiss ass to get promoted, so someone who stagnates at Major is sometimes just a fair player.

Not paying attention to your Army career paths also can cause stagnation at major. Basically, if you don't dot all your schools, and cross all your leadership positions, you may not have the right resume to move past.

In any case, there is nothing good or bad about retiring at Major.

[GunnyFreedom]

Tons of variables here.

Many Mustangs (those who earned a commission after already serving an enlistment) often only make it to Major before they hit retirement.

Major is probably the last rank that doesn't require playing politics to achieve. After that, you really have to kiss ass to get promoted, so someone who stagnates at Major is sometimes just a fair player.

Not paying attention to your Army career paths also can cause stagnation at major. Basically, if you don't dot all your schools, and cross all your leadership positions, you may not have the right resume to move past.

In any case, there is nothing good or bad about retiring at Major.

Not a Mustang. Mustangs are a different story. They are 8-10 years in before they even make 2nd LT. I, for one, have never heard of some guy who entered as a LT retiring out after 20 as a Major unless they were a total bag of shyt, and the Marines promote way slower than the Army.

This is why I was looking for Army officers to opine specifically. It's possible that the Army is different from the Marines, Navy, and Air Force.

[bolil]

Tons of variables here.

Many Mustangs (those who earned a commission after already serving an enlistment) often only make it to Major before they hit retirement.

Major is probably the last rank that doesn't require playing politics to achieve. After that, you really have to kiss ass to get promoted, so someone who stagnates at Major is sometimes just a fair player.

Not paying attention to your Army career paths also can cause stagnation at major. Basically, if you don't dot all your schools, and cross all your leadership positions, you may not have the right resume to move past.

In any case, there is nothing good or bad about retiring at Major.

From a wannabe's perspective: I've never understood why a college degree somehow makes an officer. My recruiter, bless his soul, ran me through it but it still seems to me like officers are forged best from the enlisted.

Robert E. Lee was a major up until the 1861 IIRC.

[phill4paul]

Not a Mustang. Mustangs are a different story. They are 8-10 years in before they even make 2nd LT. I, for one, have never heard of some guy who entered as a LT retiring out after 20 as a Major unless they were a total bag of shyt, and the Marines promote way slower than the Army.

This is why I was looking for Army officers to opine specifically. It's possible that the Army is different from the Marines, Navy, and Air Force.

Every branch IS different. In major ways. But hey..IcymudCappyJack is the senior Army occifer on these boards so far as I know. Best to direct your questions to him as I slowly back out. H/T/ Cappy Jack............

[GunnyFreedom]

From a wannabe's perspective: I've never understood why a college degree somehow makes an officer. My recruiter, bless his soul, ran me through it but it still seems to me like officers are forged best from the enlisted.

Robert E. Lee was a major up until the 1861 IIRC.

I agree that the modern standard is nonsense. It should be about skills quality and integrity and not about who can play the system long enough to buy a bachelor's degree. The curent system is so broken that total scumbags become officers, while real golden leaders are stuck in the enlisted ranks. It wan't like this until the 1960's when the progressives started writing policy.

[bolil]

I agree that the modern standard is nonsense. It should be about skills quality and integrity and not about who can play the system long enough to buy a bachelor's degree. The curent system is so broken that total scumbags become officers, while real golden leaders are stuck in the enlisted ranks. It wan't like this until the 1960's when the progressives started writing policy.

Can you imagine what would happen to the donkeys if the studs made it into the pen?

[phill4paul]

real golden leaders are stuck in the enlisted ranks.

Perhaps that is for the best. My dad was an E-9. I'm sure he wasn't being original when he quoted Milton "“Better to reign in hell than serve in heaven.” Why the hell would anyone give up that? I dunno. I sure as hell wouldn't have.

[bolil]

Perhaps that is for the best. My dad was an E-9. I'm sure he wasn't being original when he quoted Milton "“Better to reign in hell than serve in heaven.” Why the hell would anyone give up that? I dunno. I sure as hell wouldn't have.

Meh, I suppose if it were former sergeants as generals there would be a lot less, if any, of the nonsense bandied about today. Sergeants that have asked men to do and or die and kill, not fucking west point ideologues that rubber stamp their orders and rely on the sergeants to follow through anyways.

I am forum sliding and do not mean to.

[phill4paul]

Meh, I suppose if it were former sergeants as generals there would be a lot less, if any, of the nonsense bandied about today. Sergeants that have asked men to do and or die and kill, not fucking west point ideologues that rubber stamp their orders and rely on the sergeants to follow through anyways.

I am forum sliding and do not mean to.

Possibly. But, you see, those sergeants can't become generals. Generals are borne of wealth and connection. The best an enlisted could hope to achieve would be an 0-4. Most 0-4s, if they are worth a salt, actually listen to their senior enlisted.

[QuickZ06]

He could have had some issues, was a drinker got a few too many DUI's. The wars are fucking these guys and gals up.

[bolil]

Never mind, welcome home to the returning. I am sorry.

[tod evans]

I'm not qualified to opine Gunny, lowly enlisted scum that I once was....

[Warlord]

How do you get to become a General Gunny? Seriously?

The new breed of American General's are terrible and have not earned their medals. We once engaged a battalion of Petraeus and chased them out of a large town south west of Helmand with nothing but AK47's, a few RPG's and sheer heart. Petraeus has not been seen since. Total pussy and we claim victory over this so called world's best military.

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

Y'all are definitely getting what I am asking about.

This guy is trading on his retiring out as a Major in the Army as though everybody in the world should bow down and worship him. You don't retire out after 20 as a Major unless you are a shitbag on wheels. This is the guy blatantly lying to attack me. Dude gets DESTROYED in the Vice Chair election (he only ran because he hates me) and I did very well and built many bridges.

I was content to ignore the lying jerk, but he's still attacking me.

My opinion is you don't retire out as a Major unless you are a real shitbag. I wanted people to give their own analysis without my input so the folks who have come to watch me at his direction can see it.

He has sent people to this site to spy on me by the way.

The people who support him have not served in the military. They don't understand, and it's not their fault that they don't understand.

To go into the Army as an officer, and retire out after 20 as a Major, you have to be a total bag of shit. Civilians are going to be all "oh wow, this guy was a major." Officers who make 20 who are worth a damn retire out as a Lt Col or a Col. Officers who make 20 and retire out as a Major mean their chain of command considers them worthless.

That's my opinion. I asked for other people's opinions unbiased by my input and I got it. It agrees with my assessment.

I wouldn't even be saying anything whatever except dude is still attacking me.

Retiring out after 20 as a MAJOR is not something I would be bragging about. Indeed, I'd be ashamed as hell about it.

Y'all folks reading my history here at his direction, go talk to a random Army officer yourself and ask them if I am telling the truth or spinning a line.

You don't retire out as a Major unless you are incompetent or you shtupped the General's daughter.

Depends...The officer corps at least in the sea-faring branches is a lot of ass-kissing, and not necessarily do the best and brightest make advancements. This is why I never saw the 'honor' or what have you in the Office Corps. The enlisted were always more meritocracy-oriented. If you meet a E-7 or E-8 enlisted USCG / USN you're pretty sure they are worth their salt. If you meet an O-5 or O-6 you never know...some are good, some aren't. Too much politics in the Officer Corps for my liking.

[Todd]

Tons of variables here.

Many Mustangs (those who earned a commission after already serving an enlistment) often only make it to Major before they hit retirement.

Major is probably the last rank that doesn't require playing politics to achieve. After that, you really have to kiss ass to get promoted, so someone who stagnates at Major is sometimes just a fair player.

Not paying attention to your Army career paths also can cause stagnation at major. Basically, if you don't dot all your schools, and cross all your leadership positions, you may not have the right resume to move past.

In any case, there is nothing good or bad about retiring at Major.

That was my first thought. (Was he enlisted first?)

And Major is the highest you can acheive if you are just getting by.

[Working Poor]

I am on your site Glenn do some math see the physics, geometry, algebra, and,trigonometry (sp?)of this then you can find the solution to this problem you see.

[loveshiscountry]

I don't want to bias this, so I won't give my opinion. If you served as a commissioned officer in the US Army...

What kind of man retires out as a Major?

Don't try and tell me what you think I want to hear, tell the truth according to your experience.My father just about qualified. Almost 20 years as an officer. Roughly 25 years all told. Entered WW2 as an enlisted man then said if anything breaks out again, he'd rather be the a$$hole giving the orders than the one taking orders from the a$$hole so he went into officers training.
After 25 years total and serving in WW2, Korea, and Vietnam one incident was the final straw that led to retiring. In late 1965, thinking the war might end soon, two American "factions" were set to fight each other over a land grab. He had to send some people behind the lines to stop it. "It was time to get out".

[XTreat]

One of three things, either you were prior service enlisted, you were a great officer that bucked the system, or you were you were a crappy officer that did poorly.

[Anti Federalist]

Depends...The officer corps at least in the sea-faring branches is a lot of ass-kissing, and not necessarily do the best and brightest make advancements. This is why I never saw the 'honor' or what have you in the Office Corps. The enlisted were always more meritocracy-oriented. If you meet a E-7 or E-8 enlisted USCG / USN you're pretty sure they are worth their salt. If you meet an O-5 or O-6 you never know...some are good, some aren't. Too much politics in the Officer Corps for my liking.

Hey, I know this...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TpJ_IAUs8nI

[Brown Sapper]

FWIW I've always heard the two hardest jumps in the Officer pay grade is from Captain to Major and Colonel to 1-Star. It also depends on his duty. Combat arms officers and Battalioin XOs usually get promoted faster than the rest. He was probably a XO of a Quartermaster Battalion or something like that. BTW currently a Staff Sergeant.

[Carlybee]

My uncle was enlisted and retired as a Lt.Col.

[AFPVet]

I knew one captain in the Air Force who pissed off some higher ups and would never be able to make major so he retired as a captain. I do know that in the Air Force, they want you to start a graduate degree program as soon as you become a major—the Air Force really pushes education. I don't know if this is the case in the Army or not... if that was the case, it could be that he/she didn't want to pursue a master's degree program in order to continue to progress through the ranks.

The transition from captain to major is the hardest though since you're going from company to field grade.

[jllundqu]

Well if one served, hypothetically of course, as a Military Liaison Officer in China, first as a CPT then promoted to MAJ, then his CO told him there are no promotions available for MLOs. Meaning one CANNOT promote to LTC in this branch at this location. This hypothetical MAJ might choose to stay in his position and retire rather than attempt to switch branches mid-late career...

Make sense?

[mrsat_98]

How do you get to become a General Gunny? Seriously?

Currently I suspect you might have to suck start the kenyan.

[Pericles]

Not a Mustang. Mustangs are a different story. They are 8-10 years in before they even make 2nd LT. I, for one, have never heard of some guy who entered as a LT retiring out after 20 as a Major unless they were a total bag of shyt, and the Marines promote way slower than the Army.

This is why I was looking for Army officers to opine specifically. It's possible that the Army is different from the Marines, Navy, and Air Force.

That takes care of the primary reason an Army officer would retire as a major. The only other valid reason is service during a major drawdown (post WWII and Vietnam). The promotion accordion expands and contracts more in the Army than the other services. In 2005 to 2009, just over 3 years active duty was the promotion time to CPT. During a slow period (1987 to 1997), times expand and promotion rates drop. I made CPT with date of rank 1 APR 89 (number 43 on my promotion list) and was a 1LT for 2 years 11 months - had I stayed in, I would have a more than 8 years as a CPT before the first look at active duty promotion to major. Even then, the 20 year active duty mark should have been LTC with one or two years service at that rank.

I'd guess this guy got passed over twice for LTC, after the results of the second passover came out, he had 18 years active service, so was grandfathered in for 20 year retirement - as a rule, if you make it to 18 years inthe Army without being forced out, they will keep you for the last two years.

[oyarde]

That takes care of the primary reason an Army officer would retire as a major. The only other valid reason is service during a major drawdown (post WWII and Vietnam). The promotion accordion expands and contracts more in the Army than the other services. In 2005 to 2009, just over 4 years active duty was the promotion time to CPT. During a slow period (1987 to 1997) times expand and promotion rates drop. I made CPT with date of rank 1 APR 89 (number 43 on my promotion list) and was a 1LT for 2 years 11 months - had I stayed in, I would have a more than 8 years as a CPT before the first look at active duty promotion to major. Even then, the 20 year active duty mark should have been LTC with one or two years service at that rank.

I'd guess this guy got passed over twice for LTC, after the results of the second passover came out, he d 18 years active service, so was grandfathered in for 20 year retirement - as a rule, if you make it to 18 years inthe Army without being forced out, they will keep you for the last two years.

What about Chaplains ? I do not recall ever seeing one above Capt. I think they have one General over all of them ? Medical guys ? I remember maybe one dentist over Capt, he was a Major and I am guessing he would have been close to retirement.

[oyarde]

I don't want to bias this, so I won't give my opinion. If you served as a commissioned officer in the US Army...

What kind of man retires out as a Major?

Don't try and tell me what you think I want to hear, tell the truth according to your experience.

Do you know what he worked at ? Not Combat Arms ?

[fesoferbex]

Given that the fellow started as an officer, it has been my experience that most officers would make LtCol by retirement given average performance and average opportunities. I have seen lots of full-birds retire. And Enlisted to Officer usually were hard chargers that would make Col by the time they got out...so

It's no impossible, just, odd.

[Pericles]

What about Chaplains ? I do not recall ever seeing one above Capt. I think they have one General over all of them ? Medical guys ? I remember maybe one dentist over Capt, he was a Major and I am guessing he would have been close to retirement.

Special Branch (Chaplain, JAG, Medical) is different, they spend almost no time as LTs, are CPTs almost forever, then retire as LTCs and COLs. At a JAG branch, the lawyers are CPTs, the lead defense and lead prosecutor are MAJs, and the head counsel, and military judges are LTCs and COLs. Others work similar. Different promotion lists from Army competitive category as well.

[oyarde]

Special Branch (Chaplain, JAG, Medical) is different, they spend almost no time as LTs, are CPTs almost forever, then retire as LTCs and COLs. At a JAG branch, the lawyers are CPTs, the lead defense and lead prosecutor are MAJs, and the head counsel, and military judges are LTCs and COLs. Others work similar. Different promotion lists from Army competitive category as well.

Thanks , kind of what I figured , never thought about it until Gunny asked.I was never around Remfs much :)