Smoking (Tobacco) Test To Be Given To UK Pregnant Women

[DamianTV]

http://news.sky.com/story/1090181/smoking-test-to-be-given-to-pregnant-women


An estimated 20% of women smoke while expecting, which is believed to lead to a low birth weight for their babies and cause complications in pregnancy and labour.

In a bid to lower the numbers, the National Institute for Health and Clinical Excellence (Nice) has said women should be tested for carbon monoxide found in cigarettes during antenatal appointments, and given help to quit if levels are too high.

The proposals have been backed by midwives.

Cathy Warwick, chief executive of the Royal College of Midwives said the tests would be very helpful "in showing to women the potential damage that smoking can have on their baby".

But she warned that "any test which becomes routine must be offered along with comprehensive information and women must be able to opt out.

" ... We would like (Nice) to make clear in any advice to women that midwives should offer the test but that ultimately the final decision must lie with the woman."

But the new tests have also been met with opposition, with parenting groups saying future mothers should not be dictated to in such a way. There is also concern the tests could damage the relationship between expectant women and the professionals giving them antenatal support.

Mrs Warwick added that the NHS has too few midwives.

"The real solution here in cutting the prevalence of smoking in pregnancy is more midwives and more continuity of care from the same midwife.

"The shortage of midwives, particularly in England, means that often a midwife does not have as much time as she would want with each pregnant woman in her care and that women often see a different midwife at each visit," she said.

The new Nice guidelines, currently under consultation, are due to be published later this year.


My mother smoked while she was pregnant with me k apiou e[fohansiodf [puioaw[efhpasuf ausghfipaghipuf gy8p qrfq234t34tjupq38904yt5p83y4hhhyf;ahudf

Nothing wrong with me either!

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

my mother smoked and I have health problems I have to live with for the rest of my life.

[Christian Liberty]

Wait... so you can kill the child on purpose, but you can't circumstantially harm the child by smoking?

I think smoking during pregnancy is a case where the woman can actually validly claim bodily autonomy. The intent isn't to hurt the fetus, the intent is to smoke, and she'd likely do that anyway.

I think its quite inconsiderate to smoke while pregnant, but I'd sure as crap rather a woman do that than to deliberately kill her child through abortion.

[muh_roads]

my mother smoked and I have health problems I have to live with for the rest of my life.

What are they specifically if I may ask?

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

What are they specifically if I may ask?

who are you the IRS?

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

Wait... so you can kill the child on purpose, but you can't circumstantially harm the child by smoking?

I think smoking during pregnancy is a case where the woman can actually validly claim bodily autonomy. The intent isn't to hurt the fetus, the intent is to smoke, and she'd likely do that anyway.

I think its quite inconsiderate to smoke while pregnant, but I'd sure as crap rather a woman do that than to deliberately kill her child through abortion.
What, there's absolutely no reason to smoke a cigarette. It can only harm your health. This isn't pot we're talking about. People on RPF also advocate being able to drink while pregnant too?

[Expatriate]

Hmm. If they made it a crime to smoke/drink/do drugs while pregnant, and a woman got an abortion after being charged with such, would the charges have to be dropped?

[tod evans]

What, there's absolutely no reason to smoke a cigarette. It can only harm your health. This isn't pot we're talking about. People on RPF also advocate being able to drink while pregnant too?

I advocate the freedom to consume whatever you choose.

As far as a fetus goes both parents have the responsibility to provide, or not, a healthy womb...It's not my business, or yours, what any other couple chooses to ingest..

This idea of being able to proscribe proper behavior for others is a large part of why our country is in the mess it's in..

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

I advocate the freedom to consume whatever you choose.

As far as a fetus goes both parents have the responsibility to provide, or not, a healthy womb...It's not my business, or yours, what any other couple chooses to ingest..

This idea of being able to proscribe proper behavior for others is a large part of why our country is in the mess it's in..
I don't get the consensus here. Abortion is bad. Destroying the health of an unborn baby is OK.

[donnay]

But they are pushing toxic vaccines on pregnant women and that is A-OKAY. :rolleyes:

[DamianTV]

What, there's absolutely no reason to smoke a cigarette. It can only harm your health. This isn't pot we're talking about. People on RPF also advocate being able to drink while pregnant too?

We advocate personal responsibility.

Our Govt makes laws against absolutely everything under the sun and identify specific things specifically, then turn it into a profit making scheme. You are not allowed to step on legos with bare feet due to risk of personal injury. You are not allowed to stab yourself in the eyeball with a zipper. Etc etc etc.

When there are less laws, people have to think about the consequenses of their actions for themselves and make their own conclusions. Should smoking while pregnant be made illegal? Fuck no. Why? Because less laws promotes more personal responsibility. Yeah there will be idiots that want to give themselves popcicle enemas, but there will always be those idiots.

When the freedom that we are given is the freedom from responsibility, we stop thinking for ourselves in general, and thats when the real idiots come out to play.

[paulbot24]

/\/\/\ What he said.:D

[Anti Federalist]

What, there's absolutely no reason to smoke a cigarette. It can only harm your health. This isn't pot we're talking about. People on RPF also advocate being able to drink while pregnant too?

Not me!

ZERO TOLERANCE!

I think that all pregnant women must report to a government certified maternity center immediately upon the start of any pregnancy, and be sequestered there until the child is born.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

I advocate the freedom to consume whatever you choose.

As far as a fetus goes both parents have the responsibility to provide, or not, a healthy womb...It's not my business, or yours, what any other couple chooses to ingest..

This idea of being able to proscribe proper behavior for others is a large part of why our country is in the mess it's in..

So then you are pro-choice. Having an abortion is the parent making the decision to kill the fetus. No different than drinking so much you have a miscarriage.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

We advocate personal responsibility.

Our Govt makes laws against absolutely everything under the sun and identify specific things specifically, then turn it into a profit making scheme. You are not allowed to step on legos with bare feet due to risk of personal injury. You are not allowed to stab yourself in the eyeball with a zipper. Etc etc etc.

When there are less laws, people have to think about the consequenses of their actions for themselves and make their own conclusions. Should smoking while pregnant be made illegal? Fuck no. Why? Because less laws promotes more personal responsibility. Yeah there will be idiots that want to give themselves popcicle enemas, but there will always be those idiots.

When the freedom that we are given is the freedom from responsibility, we stop thinking for ourselves in general, and thats when the real idiots come out to play.

Fair enough but aborting the fetus is also a decision by the parents, and a lot of people here would like a law that disallows this. People need to seriously make up their minds if it's okay to kill a fetus or not, and if not, then why is it okay to destroy its health.

[donnay]

So then you are pro-choice. Having an abortion is the parent making the decision to kill the fetus. No different than drinking so much you have a miscarriage.


Are you prepared to regulate stupidity? Because that is what you are advocating. Government should not be in the business of minding other people's business--period.

[Anti Federalist]

Are you prepared to regulate stupidity? Because that is what you are advocating. Government should not be in the business of minding other people's business--period.

One is too many!

ZERO TOLERANCE IN ALL THINGS!

[Philhelm]

who are you the IRS?

If he were the IRS he wouldn't need to ask, apparently.

[Carson]

When I first read this I thought it meant they were going to do more testing with Mom's smoking.

Now I feel just sick about the testing but maybe even more so that my mind has gone to the point to comprehend the statement as it is written. Why do I even let such crap in?

[John F Kennedy III]

Wait... so you can kill the child on purpose, but you can't circumstantially harm the child by smoking?

I think smoking during pregnancy is a case where the woman can actually validly claim bodily autonomy. The intent isn't to hurt the fetus, the intent is to smoke, and she'd likely do that anyway.

I think its quite inconsiderate to smoke while pregnant, but I'd sure as crap rather a woman do that than to deliberately kill her child through abortion.

I agree.

[Carson]

Why would anyone want to be tested anyway? You would think they would already know!?

[DamianTV]

Fair enough but aborting the fetus is also a decision by the parents, and a lot of people here would like a law that disallows this. People need to seriously make up their minds if it's okay to kill a fetus or not, and if not, then why is it okay to destroy its health.

/agreed

A lot of people on both sides make statements that self contradict. Abortion is ok but smoking and / or drinking should be completely illlegal. Flip side: Abortion is not ok but smoking and / or drinking while preggers is just fine.

Me? Im pro choice. But more importantly, I can be the type of person that both sides agree with. And its really quite easy to do. Your baby? Not my business. Thus, no disagreeing with people on either side because I leave them alone, which for the most part is exactly what people want, and what our Glorious Leaders absolutely refuse to do. Some people (not singling anyone out) however will insist that I leave them alone, but will turn right the fuck back around and try to impose their choices on me. One of the reasons Im not singling anyone out on this is because I know damn well that I am not going to agree with everyone on everything. Me and another person might have the same point of view on abortion, but be the exact opposite on some other subject. But at some point, we will probably disagree on a non abortion subject, like smoking, or privacy, or guns, or dogs, or Chocolate vs Vanilla.

For the most part, this community does fairly well to allow each other to make their own choices for themselves. Some topics, we do great, some, like abortion, not so much. The only ones that I really have any modicum of difficulty with is when they claim what I can do with my own body is subject to their determination, or the determination of any majority.

One of the foundations of freedom is to be free to make a decision for ones self. Flip side, as there always is, is the freedom to bear the consequenses of ones decisions. And that is usually where our freedoms start to metastocise into the Cancer we call Government. People want the freedom to make all these choices, but dont want to bear the burden of their actions. People start to claim that others should not have a right to do as the please with their own bodies (not just abortion but things like tatoos or drugs while not pregnant or piercings or riding a bicycle without a helmet) so somebody has to determine what people are "allowed" to do. We end up having "permissions", not Rights, granted to us by the authority of the Government. And Govt sees this as a cash cow. Say tatoos were suddenly made illegal. Govt would be all over that shit fining everyone with a tatoo because they make more and more money from fines, and if imprisoned for harm against ones self, that just supports the Prison Industrial Complex.

Govt is really only giving us what the majority is asking for. Please take away all our freedoms so we dont have to deal with the consequences of our free will. The Illusion of Choice is used extensively to try to passify the rest. As is Censorship. Cant get mad about something you dont know about. Oh you like Ron Paul? We'll just have to make sure that Ron Paul is ommitted from any of your Search Results so you dont think he has any chance to get into office. Oh you hate Ron Paul? Then we'll be more than happy to tell you all his dirty secrets, but since he doesnt have any, we'll just tell you that so and so called him a nut. All to reinforce the idea that Ron Paul is not a True Statesman.

The real job of Govt is to prevent us from taking away our rights from each other. Unfortunately, this must also include all the foolish things we can do with our Rights as well. We have Free Speech so that we can discuss problems and conclude a logical solution. Yet, people use their Free Speech to boast about things like "I baned Betty". We have Gun Rights to protect ourselves from the abuses of a Tyrannical Govt, not so that we can shoot ourselves in the foot. We have the Right to tell Soldiers to get the fuck out of your house. We have the Right to Privacy to prevent the abuses of Govt and other organizations by using every shred of information about you against you. Like Pepsi? You are now an ENEMY of Coca Cola Co. We have the Right to a Speedy Trial so that we must be recognized as being Innocent until found Guilty in a court of law.

Yet, somehow, many of us find a way to take each and every one of our Enumerated Rights and find a way to fuck it up. There are valid reasons we continue to say "Dont talk to Cops. EVER." Why? Because we have the Right to Remain Silent, and many of us knowingly just throw that right out the window. Cops are coercive and manipulative and very threatening, and we fall for their bluffs. We have the Right to Resist Unlawful Arrests. Lets see any Cop anywhere actually respect that Right. Good luck. But just because there are a few that fall victim to their own stupidity does not mean we should take away the Rights of the rest to make the same mistake. Boy drowns in pool. The knee jerk reaction would end up making Water Illegal, not just swimming or diving.

Most of our Rights are derived from the idea that WE OWN OURSELVES. Concepts like both Socialism and Democracy are completely incompatible with a person being Soverign. (Soverign = Your Own King) They perpetuate a lie where everyone tries to live at the expense of everyone else while no one is able to do anything for themselves. Democracy fails because the Rights of the Minority will be repealed by the claimed Rights of the Majority. We do not live in a Democracy despite what our Elected (I use the term "Elected" loosely) Officials continue to tell us by way of MSM. We live in a Constitutional Republic. The word Democracy does not appear in the Bill of Rights or Declaration of Independence. So what is a Republic? It is a combination of two Latin words. Res means Thing. Publica is pretty easy to figure out: Public. The Public Thing. Which is The Law. Governments are derived from Men. Governments are given Permission by the People which define how the Government itself is allowed to operate. My Rights do not exist because a Government acknowledges that they exist. Government exists by MY hand and they are expressly denied permission to deprive or disparage the People of their Rights. Governments are charged with the obligation of protecting the Rights of the people by upholding the LAW which is derived from MEN. Governments are at the Bottom of the Food Chain, not the other way around.

Men have divided the Law into two sub categories: Criminal (including Felony and Misdemeanor) and Civil. For a Violation of the Law to occur, there MUST be a Victim. Criminal Law exists to prosecute people who commit crimes against the Public on things we all agree are crimes. Vandalism. Theft. Robbery. Murder. These are offenses we universally agree on. And we have Civil Court. Borrowing your Lawn Mower and breaking it while I am using it is not considered a Criminal Offense. Again however, we find that there is both a Plaintiff and a Defendant. There exists a VICTIM. Civil Court has been completely comprimised by Inflation. The minimum damage that can be claimed in Civil Court is $20. Twenty Bucks. Today, that wont even pay your cell phone bill, but when that clause was written, $20 bucks had some value to it. Since then, our dollar has lost 98% of its value. The quantity of money has increased, but the value of each dollar has decreased. Inflation has caused Civil Courts to have to deal with more and more and more ever increasing things that people can sue each other over. Okay, my little boy broke your little boys toy he got with his Happy Meal. A worthless toy. It wont be long until the value of that toy (remember inflation) will be well over $20 bucks and we will see children suing each other and each others parents over shit like a broken pencil. A broken pencil should not even be considered worthy of a Courts attention. But this again is derived from Property Rights. We unintentionally damaged each others Property. Civil Court. I forcibly took your Property. Criminal Court. Someone harms someone else. Again, based on Property Rights that every person owns themselves.

If we fail to acknowledge that we own ourselves and can NOT own each other, then we have truly lost sight of what it means to be an American. If we do acknowledge that every person owns themselves, we must also acknowledge that what they do with their lives is beyond anyone elses measure of control. I do not own you so I can not force you to either smoke or not smoke, use drugs or not use drugs, get vaccinated or not get vaccinated. If I were to try to claim such things, it would be to violate your Property Rights of Self Ownership.

Then we come back around to Abortion / Pregnant Smokers. We must admit that we do not own the Pregnant Womans Body. She owns herself. If she does NOT own herself, then we do NOT own ourselves, and become the Property of some other entity. We have no more Right to tell the Pregnant Woman that she can not smoke than we do to require her to smoke while she is not pregnant. We must also recognize that the Pregnant Smoking Womans body is also NOT the property of the Fetus living inside of her. The fetus has no legal claim to the womans body what so ever. And since the pregnant womans body is not our property, there is not a damn thing we can do about it, regardless of how much it pisses us off or danger it poses to her unborn child. That is the Consequence of Freedom.

I'd personally prefer the consequenses of having too much freedom as opposed to too little of it. We must all learn to take responsibility for our own actions once again.

[tod evans]

So then you are pro-choice. Having an abortion is the parent making the decision to kill the fetus. No different than drinking so much you have a miscarriage.

Once again since you seem to have failed to grasp the concept..

It's not my business, or yours, and certainly not the governments, if a couple makes bad or unhealthy choices regarding their fetus.

This does not advocate abortion nor does it condemn it and leaps of supposition serve no sane purpose.

It's completely up to you and your wife how you choose to behave while she's pregnant, it's not my place to monitor your behavior and it's not governments.

Smoking tobacco or consuming alcohol or even God forbid:rolleyes:, doing drugs, is a personal choice that is none of your business, so butt the fuck out!

If somehow you're able to twist in your own mind, personal responsibility into pro-abortion, then there's something going on up there I can't follow.

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

Smoking tobacco or consuming alcohol or even God forbid:rolleyes:, doing drugs, is a personal choice that is none of your business, so butt the fuck out!

If somehow you're able to twist in your own mind, personal responsibility into pro-abortion, then there's something going on up there I can't follow.

So you would have no problem if your neighbor was giving their 2 year old [insert drug of choice here]? What difference does it make if the baby is in or out of the womb when it comes to drug use?

Then you are pro-choice? What's the point of protecting the fetus from being aborted if poisoning it to the point of possibly crippling it for life/killing it with consumables is free game?

Is freedom at the expense of others justified? A lot of RPFers who smoke seem to be annoyed when it comes to any rule against smoking. 2nd hand smoke is just as bad as 1st hand smoke. Unless you're rolling your own cigarettes with just tobacco in them, you're destroying everyone around you's health. Cig. companies put all kinds of foul shit in their cigarettes and you should not be free to ruin the health of others. When you can freely smoke in a public space you are making it inaccessible to people who wish to use the public space without threat to their health.

[Smart3]

Women who can't give up smoking shouldn't bear children. I support this measure for that reason and also because it saves taxpayer money in the long run.

[tod evans]

Re-read the first two sentences of the post you quoted...

It's none of my business, it's none of yours and it's certainly not governments.

If you dislike tobacco smoke so much then buy a big enough piece of property to keep yourself free from it..

Me, I dislike cities and nosy people, so I bought a piece of property far enough out not to have to deal with 'em..

Until some self righteous SOB decides he needs to try and legislate other folks behavior...

GTFO of my business!

[Kilrain]

What, there's absolutely no reason to smoke a cigarette. It can only harm your health. This isn't pot we're talking about. People on RPF also advocate being able to drink while pregnant too?

Of course there are "reasons" to smoke.

1. It tastes good.
2. It's an excellent stress reliever.

To name a couple. And on a personal note, there's a good chance that I would be dead or have serious health issues if I hadn't started smoking.

It's not all black and white, people are different.

[John F Kennedy III]

Women who can't give up smoking shouldn't bear children. I support this measure for that reason and also because it saves taxpayer money in the long run.

I'm glad someone has a sense of humor.

[RonPaulFanInGA]

What happened to a woman's right to choose? If she wants to smoke during pregnancy, who is anyone else to complain? It's her body, after all. Any birth defects would be preferable to being killed by being aborted.

[Smart3]

Of course there are "reasons" to smoke.

1. It tastes good.
2. It's an excellent stress reliever.

To name a couple. And on a personal note, there's a good chance that I would be dead or have serious health issues if I hadn't started smoking.

It's not all black and white, people are different.

So does semen, which is, as we know something she's accepted in the past.

[Anti Federalist]

I'm glad someone has a sense of humor.

Umm...I'm pretty sure he was serious.

Now, me, on the other hand, I am kidding.

[Anti Federalist]

you should not be free to ruin the health of others

I am a committed vegan.

Animal products are very bad and destructive to my health.

You have no right to have a barbeque and pollute my air with your foul, cruel and harmful animal by-products.

[Kilrain]

So does semen, which is, as we know something she's accepted in the past.

Stay classy.

[AGRP]

The only answer is to arrest and lock all pregnant females behind bars until they give birth.

[Smart3]

The only answer is to arrest and lock all pregnant females behind bars until they give birth.

You joke, but that could totally happen one day.

[Anti Federalist]

The only answer is to arrest and lock all pregnant females behind bars until they give birth.

Now you're talking.

Zero Tolerance!

[DamianTV]

The only answer is to arrest and lock all pregnant females behind bars until they give birth.

Probably closer to the truth than we realize.

All joking aside, look at countries like India and China with extremely high population densities. China has its one child per family thing. People in India have abortions if they find out the child is female due to doweries paid by the females parents in a marriage.

Since this country has pretty much outlawed everything anyway, we can pretty damn well guarantee it wont be long until BOTH Tobacco and Pregnancy are made Unlawful.

When Pregnancies are Outlawed, only Outlaws will have Pregnancies.

[Anti Federalist]

When Pregnancies are Outlawed, only Outlaws will have Pregnancies.

You joke...it will be within 20 years you start to see serious restrictions on pregancy, when, where and with whom it is permitted.

It will be mandatory that any newborns be assigned to the system at birth or even before birth, with biometric and/or genetic markers being assigned in utero.

"Blanks" or "unscannables" will not be permitted, and hunted down for arrest or extermination.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkPGlVqqEP0