Brazil Declares 'State of Emergency' for Uncontrollable Immigration Influx

[AuH20]

Revenge of the third world zombies! LOL The U.S. is not alone.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-latin-america-22149059

[JorgeStevenson]

LOL I'm actually an immigrant in Brazil right now. Legal, though. It was a huge pain in the ass, so I understand why people would immigrate here illegally.

[youngbuck]

What are the main attractions to Brazil?


LOL I'm actually an immigrant in Brazil right now. Legal, though. It was a huge pain in the ass, so I understand why people would immigrate here illegally.

[emazur]

What are the main attractions to Brazil?

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_n4rAj8vfJUc/TCOcjUYxZII/AAAAAAAAAKI/gRTiBp4cMUA/s320/061309_brazilian_ass.jpg

[sailingaway]

What are the main attractions to Brazil?

It is seen as a much better economy than its neighboring countries.

[gwax23]

Declare open immigration no visas required to work. Problem solved. All these people leave the camps to work legally everyone is happy. Next....

[RonPaulFanInGA]

What are the main attractions to Brazil?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nlBDxRdPSwg

[sailingaway]

Declare open immigration no visas required to work. Problem solved. All these people leave the camps to work legally everyone is happy. Next....

I dont know if they have a welfare state, funded schools and medicine or not, which systems could be overburdened for those paying for them, as here. I'd agree were that not the case, but for undesirables, but I do believe countries have a right to control their borders.

[JorgeStevenson]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_n4rAj8vfJUc/TCOcjUYxZII/AAAAAAAAAKI/gRTiBp4cMUA/s320/061309_brazilian_ass.jpg

That.

And career mobility, international work experience, language skills, etc. But mostly that :)

This attack is probably aimed more at the Bolivians, who are this country's equivalent of Mexicans in the US. They basically come here and work illegally in low paying jobs like housekeeping, basic manufacturing, gardening, babysitting, etc. So you guys can kind of identify with that (or not, depending on your views).

[Brian4Liberty]

Declare open immigration no visas required to work. Problem solved. All these people leave the camps to work legally everyone is happy. Next....

Sounds like a solution for the Israel/Palestine problem too. Problem solved.

[BAllen]

Sounds like a solution for the Israel/Palestine problem too. Problem solved.

LOL!
Jews don't like taking their own medicine. They like to push other countries (goyim) to enjoy dieversity.

[BlackTerrel]

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_n4rAj8vfJUc/TCOcjUYxZII/AAAAAAAAAKI/gRTiBp4cMUA/s320/061309_brazilian_ass.jpg

Can't argue with that one.

[gwax23]

LOL!
Jews don't like taking their own medicine. They like to push other countries (goyim) to enjoy dieversity.

LOL DUDE FUCK THE JEWS YEA!!!

I like how you two didnt add anything to the argument or discussion other that showing your antisemitism and general ignorance.

Only people forcing Palestinians to live in those camps are arab governments who are trying to turn them into a political tool. Despite the fact that they speak the same language have the same culture and most of them have the same religion they still arent allowed generations later to get citzenship or assimilate into society.

There where more jewish refugees from Arab/Muslim countries than Palestinian refugees yet you never hear about the jewish ones since they where absorbed into society. Despite the fact they spoke numerous different languages came from different countries and had completely different cultures.

I also like how you basically indirectly admit that israel cant be so bad since palestinians would rather live there (Immigrate) than live in other Arab countries.

Also its *diversity

[Demigod]

LOL DUDE FUCK THE JEWS YEA!!!

I like how you two didnt add anything to the argument or discussion other that showing your antisemitism and general ignorance.

Only people forcing Palestinians to live in those camps are arab governments who are trying to turn them into a political tool. Despite the fact that they speak the same language have the same culture and most of them have the same religion they still arent allowed generations later to get citzenship or assimilate into society.

There where more jewish refugees from Arab/Muslim countries than Palestinian refugees yet you never hear about the jewish ones since they where absorbed into society. Despite the fact they spoke numerous different languages came from different countries and had completely different cultures.

I also like how you basically indirectly admit that israel cant be so bad since palestinians would rather live there (Immigrate) than live in other Arab countries.

Also its *diversity

If they did let them assimilate all they would do is help Israel with the ethnic cleansing and nothing more.The fact is those people in the refugee camps hold the deeds to most of the territory of Israel and as long as they have descendants that land will always be stolen.

[Orgoonian]

LOL DUDE FUCK THE JEWS YEA!!!

I like how you two didnt add anything to the argument or discussion other that showing your antisemitism and general ignorance.

Only people forcing Palestinians to live in those camps are arab governments who are trying to turn them into a political tool. Despite the fact that they speak the same language have the same culture and most of them have the same religion they still arent allowed generations later to get citzenship or assimilate into society.

There where more jewish refugees from Arab/Muslim countries than Palestinian refugees yet you never hear about the jewish ones since they where absorbed into society. Despite the fact they spoke numerous different languages came from different countries and had completely different cultures.

I also like how you basically indirectly admit that israel cant be so bad since palestinians would rather live there (Immigrate) than live in other Arab countries.

Also its *diversity

1.Palestinians are the Semite's in Palestine.The zionists that have stolen their land are not semitic.hxxp://current.com/community/93907305_johns-hopkins-study-confirms-european-jews-are-khazars.htm
2.The zionist's aren't "assimilating"they are committing a slow genocide on the Palestinians(Semitic people)that would rival the Holocaust™.
3.It is taught that the American Indian is the native of these lands.Lets suppose that is true.How did"diversity"work out for them?

[gwax23]

If they did let them assimilate all they would do is help Israel with the ethnic cleansing and nothing more.The fact is those people in the refugee camps hold the deeds to most of the territory of Israel and as long as they have descendants that land will always be stolen.

No they dont. Most of the land if not directly purchased prior to the establishment of the state of Israel was won in defensive wars against the Arab states. if we followed your logic most modern countries wouldnt even exist.


1.Palestinians are the Semite's in Palestine.The zionists that have stolen their land are not semitic.hxxp://current.com/community/93907305_johns-hopkins-study-confirms-european-jews-are-khazars.htm
2.The zionist's aren't "assimilating"they are committing a slow genocide on the Palestinians(Semitic people)that would rival the Holocaust™.
3.It is taught that the American Indian is the native of these lands.Lets suppose that is true.How did"diversity"work out for them?


Please provide facts and numbers for this genocide Im very interested in reading them. Besides touting age old myths about khazars and jews and other anti semitic dribble by the time you get to point three I dont even know what your talking about or what your point is.

[Demigod]

1.Palestinians are the Semite's in Palestine.The zionists that have stolen their land are not semitic.hxxp://current.com/community/93907305_johns-hopkins-study-confirms-european-jews-are-khazars.htm
2.The zionist's aren't "assimilating"they are committing a slow genocide on the Palestinians(Semitic people)that would rival the Holocaust™.
3.It is taught that the American Indian is the native of these lands.Lets suppose that is true.How did"diversity"work out for them?

It was their fault because they had a welfare state,they should have let the settlers starve :D

[Demigod]

No they dont. Most of the land if not directly purchased prior to the establishment of the state of Israel was won in defensive wars against the Arab states. if we followed your logic most modern countries wouldnt even exist.


You can not conquer private property you can only confiscate/steal it .The Palestinians have deeds from the Ottoman empire confirming that they own the land as private individuals.That is occupation and robbery.

[Orgoonian]

Please provide facts and numbers for this genocide Im very interested in reading them. Besides touting age old myths about khazars and jews and other anti semitic dribble by the time you get to point three I dont even know what your talking about or what your point is.

Do your own homework.Do you deny Palestinians are Semitic?

[gwax23]

You can not conquer private property you can only confiscate/steal it .The Palestinians have deeds from the Ottoman empire confirming that they own the land as private individuals.That is occupation and robbery.

When the arab/muslim states compensate the descendants of the 1,000,000 jews who lost there property after actually being kicked out then we can talk.

Also many jews have deeds from the Ottoman empire. The land of the major cities of israel like Tel Aviv where purchased during that time.



Do your own homework.Do you deny Palestinians are Semitic?

Where did I deny they where semitic?

I did point out your an antisemitic idiot for your remarks about jews.

Nice try though.

[Demigod]

When the arab/muslim states compensate the descendants of the 1,000,000 jews who lost there property after actually being kicked out then we can talk.



If it wasn't for the Arabs and the Ottomans there would have been no Jews after the purges in Europe.Feed a dog so it can one day bite you.

[Orgoonian]

Where did I deny they where semitic?

I did point out your an antisemitic idiot for your remarks about jews.

Nice try though.

I guess reading comprehension is not a strong point for you.
I am defending the stance of the Palestinians,the Semitic people of Palestine.Yet you call me anti-Semitic?I think you are confused about the definition of "Semite."
I never used the term "jew",i used the term zionist,and no,they are not Semitic.

[gwax23]

If it wasn't for the Arabs and the Ottomans there would have been no Jews after the purges in Europe.Feed a dog so it can one day bite you.

History isnt your strongest subject is it?

if we take your ridiculous argument at face value " If the ottomans (Who arent Arabs by the way they are Turkish) who let a few thousand jews immigrate into Palestine in the late 1800's early 1900's hadnt then today there would be no jews"

How would you explain American jews? (6.4 Million) or jews in Canda and Latin America? Or any jews in Europe or Africa or Asia that werent among the couple thousand who immigrated?

Also to your earlier point most palestinians didnt own the land they rented it out from absentee landlords from neighboring countries or major cities. So saying that the majority where "Individual property/land owners" is a fabrication. Alot of land especially in the Negev with the nomadic bedouns did not have ownership in the traditional western conception which makes your argument even weaker in that regard.

[gwax23]

I guess reading comprehension is not a strong point for you.
I am defending the stance of the Palestinians,the Semitic people of Palestine.Yet you call me anti-Semitic?I think you are confused about the definition of "Semite."
I never used the term "jew",i used the term zionist,and no,they are not Semitic.

Any definition of Antisemitism would tell you that it is a concept that is directed against jews despite the etymology of its name. You have no real argument or defense of your previous points and lies about genocide, so you are resorting to trivial technicalities.

Lets take your definition of Antisemitism to be discrimination against ANY semitic people. Jews are still semitic and you attacking jews would still make you antisemitic even by your own standards despite not attacking palestinians.

Zionists arent an ethnic group. It is a political movement. Just like you cant claim socialists are Portuguese or Albanian because Socialism is a political ideology that transcends nationality and ethnicity.

All this is irrelevant though because you still cant defend your earlier points about some supposed genocide and ethnic cleansing. Because there isnt any.

[gwax23]

double post

[Orgoonian]

Any definition of Antisemitism would tell you that it is a concept that is directed against jews despite the etymology of its name. You have no real argument or defense of your previous points and lies about genocide, so you are resorting to trivial technicalities.
I disagree.
Antisemitism is directed at Palestinians,and others from Semitic area's.In the case of the zionist usurper's,the word Semitic does not apply,since they are in fact not of Semitic origin.Taking the stance against the Palestinians,makes YOU an anti Semite.
Never once did i attack Jews,you are confusing Semitic Jews with the zionist's that have stolen Palestine,and use our weapons,money,and support to genocide those people.


All this is irrelevant though because you still cant defend your earlier points about some supposed genocide and ethnic cleansing. Because there isnt any.
Turn off your tv,and look for yourself.:rolleyes:

[gwax23]

I disagree.
Antisemitism is directed at Palestinians,and others from Semitic area's.In the case of the zionist usurper's,the word Semitic does not apply,since they are in fact not of Semitic origin.Taking the stance against the Palestinians,makes YOU an anti Semite.
Never once did i attack Jews,you are confusing Semitic Jews with the zionist's that have stolen Palestine,and use our weapons,money,and support to genocide those people.


Turn off your tv,and look for yourself.:rolleyes:

Lets say I dont have a TV so please show me this mind blowing and eye opening evidence of yours again Im really interested to see it and look over the staggering numbers.

Again your referring to Zionists like its some sort of ethnic group which is ridiculous.

You can disagree all you want. Clearly disagreeing with facts is a past time for you. Why dont you just make up everything? Like having 2+2=5 for instance. Why stop at disregarding the definition of Antisemitism??

Also please feel free to admit your wrong I wont hold it against you...promise....

[heavenlyboy34]

That.

And career mobility, international work experience, language skills, etc. But mostly that :)

This attack is probably aimed more at the Bolivians, who are this country's equivalent of Mexicans in the US. They basically come here and work illegally in low paying jobs like housekeeping, basic manufacturing, gardening, babysitting, etc. So you guys can kind of identify with that (or not, depending on your views).
Also, coffee and badass jiu-jitsu.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0ny-jE1SD0

[Orgoonian]

Lets say I dont have a TV so please show me this mind blowing and eye opening evidence of yours again Im really interested to see it and look over the staggering numbers.

Again your referring to Zionists like its some sort of ethnic group which is ridiculous.

You can disagree all you want. Clearly disagreeing with facts is a past time for you. Why dont you just make up everything? Like having 2+2=5 for instance. Why stop at disregarding the definition of Antisemitism??

Also please feel free to admit your wrong I wont hold it against you...promise....
Lol,i didn't mean to upset you.I would imagine it's hard to defend the indefensible,so you have my sympathies..You even resort to misconstruing what i said.I admit,i'm not that great at articulating my thoughts,but i think i was very clear in our exchange.
1.Palestinians are Semitic
2.The people that have stolen Palestine(zionists)are not of Semitic origin.
3.If you are for the occupation of Palestine,you are in fact"antisemitic"(see point #1)
4.All one has to do is google Palestinian genocide to see the atrocities committed against them by antisemitic people.

[Demigod]

History isnt your strongest subject is it?

if we take your ridiculous argument at face value " If the ottomans (Who arent Arabs by the way they are Turkish) who let a few thousand jews immigrate into Palestine in the late 1800's early 1900's hadnt then today there would be no jews"

How would you explain American jews? (6.4 Million) or jews in Canda and Latin America? Or any jews in Europe or Africa or Asia that werent among the couple thousand who immigrated?

Also to your earlier point most palestinians didnt own the land they rented it out from absentee landlords from neighboring countries or major cities. So saying that the majority where "Individual property/land owners" is a fabrication. Alot of land especially in the Negev with the nomadic bedouns did not have ownership in the traditional western conception which makes your argument even weaker in that regard.

Yes because when I write the Arabs and the Ottomans I meant that the Turks were Arabs :cool:.A couple of thousand may have come in the region of Palestine from western Europe but tens of thousands of Jews fleeing from Spain,England and the rest of western Europe settled in the Balkans and Carigrad which were then/are under Ottoman rule and it was not the 1800 to 1900 but more from the late 1500 until the Ottoman empire was dissolved.And the Jews had far more rights in that Empire than the Christians ever did.

.

[robert68]

..

[gwax23]

Yes because when I write the Arabs and the Ottomans I meant that the Turks were Arabs :cool:.A couple of thousand may have come in the region of Palestine from western Europe but tens of thousands of Jews fleeing from Spain,England and the rest of western Europe settled in the Balkans and Carigrad which were then/are under Ottoman rule and it was not the 1800 to 1900 but more from the late 1500 until the Ottoman empire was dissolved.And the Jews had far more rights in that Empire than the Christians ever did.

.

Ill give you that but you still exaggerated saying no jews would be around if not for the ottomans which is simply not true cause the majority of jews did not live in Ottoman lands. Further this still doesnt refute any of the points Ive been making regarding the conflict.



Lol,i didn't mean to upset you.I would imagine it's hard to defend the indefensible,so you have my sympathies..You even resort to misconstruing what i said.I admit,i'm not that great at articulating my thoughts,but i think i was very clear in our exchange.
1.Palestinians are Semitic
2.The people that have stolen Palestine(zionists)are not of Semitic origin.
3.If you are for the occupation of Palestine,you are in fact"antisemitic"(see point #1)
4.All one has to do is google Palestinian genocide to see the atrocities committed against them by antisemitic people.

So after repeated attempts for you to show this evidence of genocide you still refuse to do so. Im going to go out on a limb here and say you dont have evidence of genocide because there isnt and everything youve been saying is complete bullshit.

That and the fact you need to buy yourself a dictionary to look up what Antisemitic means and what an ethnic group is.

You conceded jews are semitic even though prior you said they are khazars. So Is a Jewish Zionist not semitic?

[jmdrake]

Also, coffee and badass jiu-jitsu.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V0ny-jE1SD0

BJJ isn't the only martial art from Brazil. Capoeira is gaining respect even in MMA.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMkmFuLpoCM

and for martial arts eye candy. ;)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vM2Qn3AYm4

[heavenlyboy34]

BJJ isn't the only martial art from Brazil. Capoeira is gaining respect even in MMA.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DMkmFuLpoCM

and for martial arts eye candy. ;)


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4vM2Qn3AYm4
You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to jmdrake again. :(
Thanks for sharing! ~hugs~ I've never heard of that art before. I like that it emphasizes kicks. I didn't notice any grappling techniques-which would make it more useful in sport combat....I'll look into it and see what it's like. :) Special thanks for the MA eye candy. :D ;)

ETA: I see the only training facilities in that style in my are way out in Scottsdale. :( That would be a really useful thing to learn for sparring purposes. My training thus far hasn't emphasized kicks much :( ...I have very long legs and could have fun with that stuff. :D

[jmdrake]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to jmdrake again. :(
Thanks for sharing! I've never heard of that art before. I like that it emphasizes kicks. I didn't notice any grappling techniques-which would make it more useful in sport combat....I'll look into it and see what it's like. :) Special thanks for the MA eye candy. :D ;)

You're welcome on both counts! :) Capoeira was developed by Brazilian slaves as a way to resist their masters. It mostly uses kicks because they had to be able to fight with their hands shackled. It was also disguised to look like a dance. There is a guard pass in BJJ that comes straight from Capoeira (in fact I think it's called the Capoeira guard pass) and "stand up in base" for getting back on your feet in BJJ looks a lot like the Capoeira negativa. As for street versus sport, well old Capoeira mestres used to sometimes fight with straight razors held between their toes!

[Orgoonian]

So after repeated attempts for you to show this evidence of genocide you still refuse to do so. Im going to go out on a limb here and say you dont have evidence of genocide because there isnt and everything youve been saying is complete bullshit.
Then prove me wrong.I'm not going to fill page after page of video,and documentation proving what you already know but either wont admit,or just too lazy to look up yourself.You say i am full of feces?Then prove it.I've been doing it to you:D


That and the fact you need to buy yourself a dictionary to look up what Antisemitic means and what an ethnic group is.
What bothers you the most?The fact that i am correct,or that i show how you,and others like you, will use buzzwords like "anti-Semite" to provoke a Pavlovian response in the reader,and shut down the debate before the truth comes out?If i were you,i would get used to it.The anti-Semite card is played out.


You conceded jews are semitic even though prior you said they are khazars. So Is a Jewish Zionist not semitic?
Again you try to obfuscate.I understand,i really do.
Not all Jews are Semitic lol.

So what have we learned here today?
1.Palestinians are a Semitic people,therefore when you used the term anti-Semite against me,you opened yourself up to be educated.
2.The people that are occupying Palestine(zionists)are not of Semitic origin.You have not disputed this fact,nor should you.They do indeed call themselves "Jews",but that does not make them Semitic.
3.Google,and buying a dictionary helps when confronted on web forums by paid shills whose sole purpose is to mitigate the horror's of israeli war crimes.

[gwax23]

This is hopeless.

If someone is going to come out and claim genocide and not provide even the slightest amount of evidence to support such an outrageous claim and when asked to do so declines, is the one admitting guilt. For you to say Im admitting guilt for asking YOU to provide evidence of your assertions is ridiculous and only further proves my point that your full of 'feces'

Thats what bothers me.

No ones asking you for a 20 page report but you havent provided any evidence of genocide AT ALL. Nothing zip. Instead youve gone on for pages about technicalities and word meanings in order to cover up your 'feces'

I never denied Palestinians where semitic. You keep rehashing this yet I never brought this up you did. Ive been responding solely to your points regarding jews which you cover up by claiming your not talking about jews "Only the zionists." if anything is a 'buzzword" its your use of zionists as everything from a political ideology (which it actually is) to an ethnic group (Which it is not fyi). You can add zionist to the list of words you dont understand the meaning of, a list which includes Antisemitism.

Your the one trying to shut down any open discussion because when I call you out for what you really are an antisemite (Antisemite in the accepted definition of the word not your definition) you hide behind the "Im only against zionists" card.

So what truth are you even talking about? You come up with these assertions dont back them up and then claim its the truth?

Then you go on to claim im some how antisemitic for suggesting you are is just another one of your many crazy assertions youve made in this thread.

Anyway let me try to actually teach you something.

1- Jews have been living in ''Palestine" continuously longer than any other group of people. Theyve been there before Islam before Christianity and they have maintained that presence continuously to the present day.
2- Jews including jews who profess the ideology of Zionism are a semitic peoples. Any claims that they are somehow descended from a Turkic tribe known as the Khazars whose royalty converted to judaism in the 800's 900's AD has been refuted numerous times by historians and geneticists and is only currently professed as fact by Antizionists and antisemites who are attempting to attack Israels claim to existence.


Please study on this, facts are a good thing to remember.

[FrankRep]

This thread got disappointing real fast.

[Brian4Liberty]

I like how you two didnt add anything to the argument or discussion other that showing your antisemitism and general ignorance.

Only people forcing Palestinians to live in those camps are arab governments who are trying to turn them into a political tool.

You added "open borders yippee" to the conversation. That's really adding to the conversation. :rolleyes: And resorting to lame accusations right from the start? You already lost that one. Tell us more about these open borders and open immigration between Israel and the Palestinian territories.

[gwax23]

You added "open borders yippee" to the conversation. That's really adding to the conversation. :rolleyes: And resorting to lame accusations right from the start? You already lost that one. Tell us more about these open borders and open immigration between Israel and the Palestinian territories.

How is it not adding to a discussion about Immigration?? The solution held by most libertarians in this case would be open immigration and thats exactly what I said in my first post. I would love to hear your anti immigration counter arguments to this.

You bringing up Israel and Palestine is what got the whole thread derailed so Im glad you admitted to that and further admitting to not adding anything to the discussion.

I would support open borders between the two countries. Actually between one country and a non country. There was relatively open borders between the two up until the intifadas. A huge percentage of Palestinians worked in israel and the palestinian economy depended on that. With the outbreaks of the Intifadas and Israel leaving the Gaza Strip these economic exchanges and openness slowly ended to everyones detriment. I see no problem with border restrictions between two hostile entities and the intifadas were a state of hostility.

So exactly what point where you trying to make with your snarky remark?

I think we both know if borders where opened up again it would be Palestinians moving into Israel and not the other way around, which is surprising considering most peoples accusations of Israels evilness would lead one to believe Israel would be the last place Palestinians would be headed in an open borders scenario. So once again you alluding to this only further discredited your views and views held by similar minded people about the "evilness" of Israel.

[Brian4Liberty]

I would support open borders between the two countries.

Oh really? Did you change your mind? It seems that in the past you have said that you don't agree with the Palestinian right of return, and that Palestine should not be united with Israel. How would open borders and open immigration be any different from that?


I think we both know if borders where opened up again it would be Palestinians moving into Israel and not the other way around, which is surprising considering most peoples accusations of Israels evilness would lead one to believe Israel would be the last place Palestinians would be headed in an open borders scenario.

There would probably be people moving both directions if there was truly freedom and peace.

[gwax23]

Open Borders does not mean both states would merge into one. I think you need to read up on definitions of Open borders and look at places like Europe for instance.

I still hold that neither country or soon to be country should be merged. Ive always stressed that a Yugoslvia type one state solution would only lead to more violence and bloodshed. The only one state solution I would accept is all of the Palestinian territories being incorporated into Israel similar to East jerusalem and the Golan heights. This solution or the basic two states two peoples solution which I also I support. There is also the 3 state solution with Israel Jordan and Egypt extending sovereignty to parts of the territories. None of these contradicts with a policy of open borders.

Please provide evidence where I stated differently In the past....

[Brian4Liberty]

Open Borders does not mean both states would merge into one. I think you need to read up on definitions of Open borders and look at places like Europe for instance.

I still hold that neither country or soon to be country should be merged. Ive always stressed that a Yugoslvia type one state solution would only lead to more violence and bloodshed. The only one state solution I would accept is all of the Palestinian territories being incorporated into Israel similar to East jerusalem and the Golan heights. This solution or the basic two states two peoples solution which I also I support. There is also the 3 state solution with Israel Jordan and Egypt extending sovereignty to parts of the territories. None of these contradicts with a policy of open borders.

Please provide evidence where I stated differently In the past....

How is incorporating Gaza and the West Bank into Israel different from "merging" them?

[jmdrake]

Can we get back to talking about Brazil? You know, jui-jitsu, capoeira, and sexy women? Hey, I just noticed that jui-jitsu has the word "jew" in it! :eek:

[BAllen]

Can we get back to talking about Brazil? You know, jui-jitsu, capoeira, and sexy women? Hey, I just noticed that jui-jitsu has the word "jew" in it! :eek:

ANTI-SEMITE!!!

[robert68]

Since no one is posting any more Brazilian butt pics, I’ll address some of the hasbara that’s been posted.

The over 500,000 Jews from "Arab" countries who “emigrated” to “Israel”, did so over many decades at the wishes and significant provocation (falsflag ops etc..) of “Israel”, after 1947, when most of the Palestinians (750,000) had already been driven out of Palestine.

Naeim Giladi, a Jewish Iraqi, has written extensively about this. Here's just a few passages from an article he wrote:


THE JEWS OF IRAQ (http://www.inminds.co.uk/jews-of-iraq.html)
by Naeim Giladi

I write this article for the same reason I wrote my book:
to tell the American people, and especially American Jews, that Jews from Islamic lands did not emigrate willingly to Israel; that, to force them to leave, Jews killed Jews; and that, to buy time to confiscate ever more Arab lands, Jews on numerous occasions rejected genuine peace initiatives from their Arab neighbors. I write about what the first prime minister of Israel called "cruel Zionism." I write about it because I was part of it.


In our previous Link, Israeli historian Ilan Pappe looked at the hundreds of thousands of indigenous Palestinians whose lives were uprooted to make room for foreigners who would come to populate confiscated land. Most were Ashkenazi Jews from Eastern Europe. But over half a million other Jews came from Islamic lands. Zionist propagandists claim that Israel "rescued" these Jews from their anti-Jewish, Muslim neighbors. One of those "rescued" Jews-Naeim Giladi-knows otherwise.
...

About 125,000 Jews left Iraq for Israel in the late 1940s and into 1952, most because they had been lied to and put into a panic by what I came to learn were Zionist bombs...


http://www.inminds.co.uk/jews-of-iraq.html

[gwax23]

I love how you blatantly deflate the numbers. 800,000 - 1,000,000 left Arab/Muslim lands.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_exodus_from_Arab_and_Muslim_countries

Maybe you can read up on these refugees who have no agency in the UN specially dedicated to them, who dont receive ny support funding or compensation for there losses and are never talked about anywhere.

The majority fled from the string of pogroms, riots, attacks and general antisemitism of that time. Many where outright deported from the country and all property seized.

So whatever you found on the internet about some flook arguing otherwise it doesnt support any of your bullshit points.

My Grandfather fled Iraq to Mandatory Palestine after losing most of his family int he Farhud program that happened...wait for....in 1941.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Farhud

[robert68]

From your link:
600,000 Jews from Arab and Muslim countries had reached Israel by 1972.

“586,269” is the number used in one of the supporting sources. at your link. The “over 500,000” I used is quite accurate.

Also from your link:
it did not become significant until the 1948 Arab-Israeli War. From the onset of the 1948 Arab–Israeli War until the early 1970s...

That’s essentially the same as my “over many decades… after 1947”.

Regarding the killings of 1941, Iraq was under British military occupation in those days. They made the unpopular Nuri as-Said prime minister, so the blame lies with them and him; and if you were a non-interventionist, you would be blaming them.

Also, from the article I linked to:


Britain's pro-Zionist attitude in Palestine, however, triggered a growing anti-Zionist backlash in Iraq, as it did in all Arab countries. Writing at the end of 1934, Sir Francis Humphreys, Britain's Ambassador in Baghdad, noted that, while before WW I Iraqi Jews had enjoyed a more favorable position than any other minority in the country, since then "Zionism has sown dissension between Jews and Arabs, and a bitterness has grown up between the two peoples which did not previously exist.[3]

From Jewishvirtuallibrary: (http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/talking/jew_refugees.html)


In 1945, roughly 1 million Jews lived peacefully in the various Arab states of the Middle East, many of them in communities that had existed for thousands of years.

It was western state intervention and the Zionism it backed, that broke the relationship between Jews and other Arabs in Arab/Muslim countries.

[gwax23]

From your link:

“586,269” is the number used in one of the supporting sources. at your link. The “over 500,000” I used is quite accurate.

Also from your link:

That’s essentially the same as my “over many decades… after 1947”.

Regarding the killings of 1941, Iraq was under British military occupation in those days. They made the unpopular Nuri as-Said prime minister, so the blame lies with them and him; and if you were a non-interventionist, you would be blaming them.

Also, from the article I linked to:


From Jewishvirtuallibrary: (http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/talking/jew_refugees.html)



It was western state intervention and the Zionism it backed, that broke the relationship between Jews and other Arabs in Arab/Muslim countries.

Your ignoring jews who didnt go to Israel. What they dont count as refugees? Only counting jews who where forced out prior to 1972 AND who went to israel is purposefully deflating and misrepresenting the true statistics. Hence the 800k-1M figure being a more accurate representation of the true situation.

Blaming the British for a mob killing and murdering jews is ridiculous and calling Britain pro zionist is also a misrepresentation. British views and positions changed frequently but where in no way shape or form pro zionist, not since Balfour. They blocked immigration and waged a war against Zionist groups in mandatory palestine. They didnt want a Jewish satte there because it would hurt there economic and political interests in the Arab world.

It was a purely antisemitic pogrom. No excuses.

And while jews in the Arab worlds had better conditions than Jews in Europe, thats not saying much. Thats a pretty low bar to compare to. They where still 2nd Class citizens and subjugated to various forms of Discrimination taxes and persecution which only increased rapidly after 1948 despite the fact that many of them where not zionists.

[SashaA]

gwax23,

I appreciate your posts and I do agree that no Arab whether they are Muslim or Christian deserves to live in the Land of Israel. Unfortunately, I came across an article by Murray Rothbard, and he has the most atrocious lies about the Israel-Arab conflict in which Jews are obviously the most victimized.

The article is War Guilt in the Middle East.


Rothbard claims that
"While the British were still in Palestine, the Zionist paramilitary forces began to crush the Palestinian Arab armed forces in a series of civil war clashes. But, more fatefully, on April 9, 1948, the fanatical Zionist-Revisionist terrorists grouped in the organization Irgun Zvai Leumi massacred a hundred women and children in the Arab village of Deir Yassin. By the advent of Israel’s independence on May 15 the Palestinian Arabs, demoralized, were fleeing in panic from their homes and from the threat of massacre. The neighboring Arab states then sent in their troops. Historians are wont to describe the ensuing war as an invasion of Israel by the Arab states, heroically rebuffed by Israel, but since all of the fighting took place on Arab territory, this interpretation is clearly incorrect. What happened, in fact, is that Israel managed to seize large chunks of territory assigned to the Palestinian Arabs by the partition agreement, including the Arab areas of Western Galilee, Arab west-central Palestine as "corridor" to Jerusalem, and the Arab cities of Jaffa and Beersheba. The bulk of Jerusalem – the New City – was also seized by Israel and the UN internationalization plan discarded. The Arab armies were hampered by their own inefficiency and disunity and by a series of UN-imposed truces broken only long enough for Israel to occupy more Arab territory."

Rothbard again lies and says:
"The UN agreement had provided (a) that Jerusalem be internationalized under UN rule, and (b) that there be an economic union between the new Jewish and Arab Palestine states. These were the basic conditions under which the UN approved partition. Both were promptly and brusquely disregarded by Israel – thus launching an escalating series of aggressions against the Arabs of the Middle East.

Can you please refute these lies by the self-hating Jew, Rothbard? I would really appreciate it.

[gwax23]

gwax23,

I appreciate your posts and I do agree that no Arab whether they are Muslim or Christian deserves to live in the Land of Israel. Unfortunately, I came across an article by Murray Rothbard, and he has the most atrocious lies about the Israel-Arab conflict in which Jews are obviously the most victimized.

The article is War Guilt in the Middle East.




Rothbard claims that
Rothbard again lies and says:[/FONT][/COLOR]

Can you please refute these lies by the self-hating Jew, Rothbard? I would really appreciate it.

I like Rothbard on a lot of things but here as you mentioned I believe he was wrong.

There was a three way civil war going on between the jews Arabs and British in the area. Bad things happened on all sides, that is the face of war. Blaming solely the jews for any negative outcomes shows his bias.

The Deir Yassin incident which he mentions was tragic and the Israeli Government/Jewish agency apologized for it despite this apology being disregarded by the Jordanians. Rothbard claiming this single incident discredits Jewish self determination is ridiculous since far worse incidents were perpetrated by the Arab side which he fails to mention. Such as the Hebron massacres, the Hadassah medical convoy massacre, the Kfar Etzion massacre (more jews died in this than in Deir Yassin), Safed Porgrom, the Tiberias Massacre are among a few.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hadassah_medical_convoy_massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Hebron_massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kfar_Etzion_massacre
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1929_Safed_pogrom
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1938_Tiberias_massacre

Many of these happened before the civil war and attacked some of the oldest jewish communities in the world many of which where not even Zionist. Yet Rothbard doesnt mention any of this. Further unlike Deir Yassin no arab institution or organization or government apologized for them, quite the opposite the openly and actively encouraged further violence against the Jews in their home countries and beyond.

Further this doesnt include any Massacres committed against jews Outside of Palestine in the neighboring Arab countries which triggered the mass flight of jewish refugees that I mentioned earlier. Refugees who alone outnumbered the Palestinian refugees yet rarely receive mention and have no official support from the UN unlike the Palestinians who have an agency directed specifically to helping them.


He downplays the invasion of Jewish populated territory, territory that was going to be awarded to the new found state as per the UN partition plan. The Arabs invaded this territory and LOST. The land the nascent state of Israel won defending itself it won justly. The fact that different standards are applied to Israel in this case show the hypocrisy.

He also claims that the UN brokered truces hurt the Arabs when in fact it prevented them from being further overrun by the Jewish forces.The Israelis had the initiative and could of pushed onto Jerusalem and the west bank and beyond had it not been for the Truces. So him saying the brokered cease fires only hurt the arabs is another fallacy.

Lastly he trys to claim that israel broke the UN provisions since it did not adhere to the economic portions of it and the internationalization of Jerusalem but this is the biggest lie of all.

First the jews ACCEPTED the UN partition plan in its entirety. The arabs rejected it and launched their invasion. Claiming israel should be bound to have an economic union with countries that didnt recognize it and wanted to destroy it after the war is absurd. He also fails to mention that the Arabs ignored ALL provisions of the partition and continued to Occupy land that was supposed to go for a Palestinian state including occupying the vast majority of Jerusalem. So another lie on his part. Egypt and Jordan occupied supposed Palestinian land for 2 decades and the world said nothing. Neither sought the establishment of a Palestinian state during that time.

He was very biased on this issue and not a credible source regarding the conflict in anyway.