ThinkProgress: Rand Paul Is Right On Marijuana, And That Should Scare Dems Into Action

[jct74]

I definitely think Rand has set an example for Republicans in congress to follow and changed the debate on more than a few issues as some Republicans have begun to follow his lead, but this person is making the case that Democrats should also follow Rand's lead at least on this particular issue so that Rand does not gain ownership of it and bring people over to his ideology. It is nice to see liberals worried like this as Rand scrambles up the whole political paradigm. :)


Rand Paul Is Right On Marijuana, And That Should Scare Democrats Into Action

By Ian Millhiser on Mar 24, 2013 at 11:20 am

Sen. Rand Paul (R-KY) is one of America’s most radical ideologues. He endorsed a discredited, century-old Supreme Court decision that would give employers nearly limitless power to exploit their workers. He opposes bans on employment discrimination and on whites-only lunch counters. He backs nationwide anti-union legislation that would reduce both union and non-union wages by $1,500 a year. And he backs a dangerous constitutional amendment that would have doubled unemployment and caused the economy to shrink by 17 percent. Few, if any, politicians would do more harm to more people if given the opportunity to turn their preferences into law.

Which is why Democrats need to take his effort to outflank them on drug policy very, very seriously. In an interview with Fox News’ Chris Wallace this morning, Paul laid out an uncharacteristically sensible view of how the nation should approach drugs:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?&v=8148GyHEzyA


Later in the same interview, Paul — a likely GOP presidential candidate in 2016 — is quite explicit about what he hopes to get out of staking out a sensible view on criminal justice: “someone like myself, I think, could appeal to young people, independents and moderates, because, many of them do think it is a mistake to put people in jail for marijuana use and throw away the key.”

Paul is right on both counts. Incarcerating people who commit minor drug crimes makes no sense, and his stance is a winning issue politically. In 2011, a poll found for the first time that fifty percent of the nation supports outright legalization of marijuana, compared to only 46 percent who oppose it. Among voters under 30, nearly two-thirds support legalization. Since this poll was taken, two states legalized marijuana for recreational use, and numerous others had previously legalized it for medical use. According to one poll, nearly three in four Americans believe the federal government should back off enforcement against people who comply with state marijuana laws.

So if Democrats cede this issue to the likes of Rand Paul, they will give up a powerful opportunity to engage with young voters — and potentially empower one of America’s most dangerous politicians in the process.

Of course, there is another, even more important reason why Democrats should work to liberalize America’s drug laws — Rand Paul is right that ruining people’s lives if they commit common youthful transgressions is immoral. But if Democrats cannot be moved to think sensibly on drugs because it is the right thing to do, the least they could do is think sensibly on drugs because it is in their selfish political interests to do so.

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/03/24/1767241/rand-paul-is-right-on-marijuana-and-that-should-scare-democrats-into-action/

[Christian Liberty]

Rand Paul an ideologue? He literally breathes pragmatism. This just shows how far our country is truly gone...

This shouldn't be read as a negative comment on Rand. He's smart. He's politically savvy. He's not an "Ideologue" though.

[Libertea Party]

The political threat Rand Paul represents to the Democratic machine is why MSDNC always attacks him without fail. Regardless of the merits of the argument.

More evidence that the Democratic Party is afraid of pro-liberty Republicans? (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?312548-More-evidence-that-the-Democratic-Party-is-afraid-of-pro-liberty-Republicans)

[supermario21]

Yeah, MSNBC's prime-time lineup is 3 hours of Rand bashing.

[Austrian Econ Disciple]

Lol. Anyone find it funny TP rational for legalization? Common youthful transgressions? Wow, how delectably unprincipled, vague, and consistently changing. Fools. I guess we should legalize flash mobs > property destruction, too...

[Libertea Party]

Yeah, MSNBC's prime-time lineup is 3 hours of Rand bashing.

Lawrence O'Donnell in particular I believe is threatened. He always talks about who he knows in Washington and how he was a senior Democratic staff member hack. The morning of Peter Schiff's announcement for Senate he spent an hour attacking him in an interview. He and MSNBC are the tip of the DNC's messaging effort. I really think they formally coordinate or at least share data.

In my link above you had Ed Rendell-former chairman of the Democratic Governors Association- and Howard Dean-- former chairman of the DNC throw out statistics about libertarians. They are looking at the data and are scared.

They really really don't want someone like Rand Paul to break through. If Rand Paul was a Democrat with the exact same beliefs I really believe MSNBC and liberal outlets would be less biased against him. It's the politics.

The role of MSNBC is to keep progressives inside the tent. President Obama even showed a video of Rachel Maddow praising his "accomplishments" to a Netroots conference so progressives don't go wobbly on him. How incestuous is that?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=so-Uuooz-Zo

[acptulsa]

The political threat Rand Paul represents to the Democratic machine is why MSDNC always attacks him without fail. Regardless of the merits of the argument.

I absolutely agree. We can make this backfire on them.

Simply put, we are doing what Democrats pretend is their job--look after civil liberties. And whenever any of us hear some Democratic apologist trying to trash Rand Paul, we need to call them out simply and without fail--the Democrats say they're the guardians of civil liberties, but they're doing a piss poor job, and someone is bound to step up.

Dubya put up the PATRIOT Act, the Democrats rolled over on it, and we don't roll over for the Dubyas of the world. Just that simple.

[talkingpointes]

Wow, a debate. How exciting. Let me guess -- no matter his position -he is chided and mistreated. I don't even need to watch it. That's how predictable this has come. Rand lacks a movement and a philosophy. He's a politician with group of people with another letter next to their names. No surprise. This must be his way of bring others to the table that don't want him or us there anyways. You can keep calling others stupid and then say "why don't they listen". dumb,dumb dumb,dumb dumb,dumb,dumb,dumb,dumb,

Writing in Ron Paul in 16'.

[Brett85]

Most of the comments on all of these sites basically say that Rand didn't go far enough in what he said. I guess Rand is being pragmatic in what he's saying and how he's trying to sell his position. Privately I don't think he would have a problem with a state like Colorado or Washington fully legalizing marijuana.

[supermario21]

This is why Cenk left MSNBC. I really don't like TYT, but they are more principled progressive liberals than the folks on MSNBC, and they give Rand credit where it's due. He was actually complaining about the fact that more liberals weren't with Rand during his filibuster. Meanwhile, on MSDNC, Ed Schultz was branding Rand a terrorist and O'Donnell was calling the filibuster an embarrassment.

[talkingpointes]

Most of the comments on all of these sites basically say that Rand didn't go far enough in what he said. I guess Rand is being pragmatic in what he's saying and how he's trying to sell his position. Privately I don't think he would have a problem with a state like Colorado or Washington fully legalizing marijuana.

Most of the comments come from what is his potential following. They want to see principles. Not a bunch of friendly back door deals.

[itshappening]

Maddow and Lawrence herd the sheep and Shultz is simply disgraceful.

[itshappening]

Notice now ThinkDemocrat are mentioning his every position and trying to spin it.

'Don't support Rand, check this out... he's dangerous!'

[talkingpointes]

What conservative/libertarians watch this shit network -- without Ron Paul, Schiff, Amash, or Taleb? Better yet and actually listen to what they say and care. Seems like major waste of time.

[eleganz]

thinkprogress is a pos. i'll never link or visit their material.

[surf]

I guess Rand is being pragmatic in what he's saying and how he's trying to sell his position. Privately I don't think he would have a problem with a state like Colorado or Washington fully legalizing marijuana.
he should do this publicly. it is such a case to encompass a vast pro-10th amendment stance that would not necessarily bring back aquabuddha but would just be good - and easy.

and all of our (Washington State) congressional representatives are spineless f#cks when it comes to telling Obama/Holder/Kerlikowski to [mind there own business].

[jct74]

Most of the comments on all of these sites basically say that Rand didn't go far enough in what he said. I guess Rand is being pragmatic in what he's saying and how he's trying to sell his position. Privately I don't think he would have a problem with a state like Colorado or Washington fully legalizing marijuana.

Most of his comments so far about the drug war have been pretty tame and cautious, but he is at least raising the issue on numerous occasions and forcing a conversation about it which really hasn't been done much before by any prominent Democrats or Republicans in congress. I expect that he will become more bold with it over time... he has already been very outspoken/active on the hemp issue... and as far as Colorado and Washington are concerned he has said before that states should decide:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?396308-Rand-Paul-Feds-Should-Leave-State-Weed-Laws-Alone

[Slutter McGee]

This is why Dems should be scared shitless by Rand.
Against the NDAA
Liberal: Blind Squirrel
Against the Patriot Act
Liberal: Broken Clock
Against prison time for non violent offenses
Liberal: Blind Squirrel
Against Invading foreign countries non stop
Liberal: Broken Clock
Against Drones
Liberal: Blind Squirrel
States have a right to legalize gay marriage
Liberal: Broken Clock
Immigration reform
Liberal : Blind Squirrel
Conservative: With his rationale I can agree with all of that
Liberal: BUT YOU DONT UNDERSTAND....HE IS A RADICAL WHO WANTS A BALANCED BUDGET!!!!!!!!
Youth, Moderates:?????????????ok

Slutter McGee

[Brett85]

and as far as Colorado and Washington are concerned he has said before that states should decide:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?396308-Rand-Paul-Feds-Should-Leave-State-Weed-Laws-Alone

Yeah, I know. But I think it could help him even more in a state like Colorado in 2016 if he actually endorsed their law. But then again, that position would make it harder for him to win the GOP primary, which is probably what he's thinking. Unfortunately if he's forced to say that marijuana shouldn't be legalized in a GOP primary in order to win the primary, that's going to make him less electable in a state like Colorado in a general election. I wish that a majority of Republicans supported marijuana legalization so that Rand could just come right out and support full legalization.

[jct74]

Rand's marijuana comments are on front page of HuffPo right now, but they are screening all comments on the article for some reason

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/03/24/rand-paul-marijuana_n_2945307.html

[itshappening]

there's going to be thousands of comments of liberals ripping their hair out... check back in the morning

[Luciconsort]

if it scares democrats to do anything, what they'll probably do, at least in MD..... is turn it into a big overtaxed state run bureaucratic clusterfuck. just like everything else, people will be back to the black market because the weed will be cheaper sans taxes. i love that people are coming around but please don't rush these idiots into doing anything lol

[matt0611]

there's going to be thousands of comments of liberals ripping their hair out... check back in the morning

cue a thousand posts saying:

"I can't believe I agree with Rand Paul."

"Rand is such a teabagger but I agree with him on this once"

"Hell has frozen over I agree with Rand Paul"

"Rand Paul is insane but I agree with him"

etc etc ad nauseam

[FSP-Rebel]

cue a thousand posts saying:

"I can't believe I agree with Rand Paul."

"Rand is such a teabagger but I agree with him on this once"

"Hell has frozen over I agree with Rand Paul"

"Rand Paul is insane but I agree with him"

etc etc ad nauseam
They usually roll with the thoughtless and mind numbed "a broken clock is right twice a day" meme. It's their way of coping with having to agree w/ someone of the Tea Party branding w/o losing their liberal gravitas.

[jmdrake]

The strategy of the left is clear. Beat the one trick pony of Rand criticizing part of the CRA to death. The irony here is that the fastest way to get federal government out of enforcing insane drug laws is to push forward the idea that the interstate commerce clause only applies to actual interstate commerce.....a position that guts part of the CRA.

[dinosaur]

Rand is making both the Dems and the GOP play catch up now. Best defense is a good offense I guess. :)

[anaconda]

Progressives are very unsettled that a pragmatic and articulate rising star is playing with their toys without asking first.

[anaconda]

Rand is making both the Dems and the GOP play catch up now. Best defense is a good offense I guess. :)
I think you have correctly characterized Rand's approach. He's certainly no shrinking violet and he is showing great faith in The People.

[anaconda]

there's going to be thousands of comments of liberals ripping their hair out... check back in the morning

It's not an easy task that "Progressives" undertake. It is no small task to cheer the brute force of the state on some issues and plead for clemency on others. It must be devastating to them for a Constitutional Conservative to take complete custody of their issues without so much as a shot fired.

[anaconda]

Any thoughts on the article's link to an editorial on the Lochner case?

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/03/07/1684111/rand-paul-all-laws-protecting-workers-are-constitutionally-suspect/

[matt0611]

They usually roll with the thoughtless and mind numbed "a broken clock is right twice a day" meme. It's their way of coping with having to agree w/ someone of the Tea Party branding w/o losing their liberal gravitas.

Oh yeah, I forgot about that one.

[whoisjohngalt]

Lol. Anyone find it funny TP rational for legalization? Common youthful transgressions? Wow, how delectably unprincipled, vague, and consistently changing. Fools. I guess we should legalize flash mobs > property destruction, too...

Your confusing his framing with his rationale. His rationale wouldn't be as appealing to the voters he is trying to attract as the utilitarian argument. If the majority of voters understood our rationale for legalization than the conversation would be about all drugs. Instead they support marijuana reform only because they understand the utilitarian argument but not yet the moral one. This is the Rand Paul method.

[twomp]

The great thing about this is just like Ron Paul, people in the next few years who google "marijuana decriminalization" will end up running into articles about Rand Paul and Ron Paul. I know of a couple people who became a part of the rEVOLution from just this. They see a politician they agree with and look more into him and they see just how far down the rabbit hole goes...

[jllundqu]

Rand Paul an ideologue? He literally breathes pragmatism. This just shows how far our country is truly gone...

This shouldn't be read as a negative comment on Rand. He's smart. He's politically savvy. He's not an "Ideologue" though.

Maybe they meant Paul the Elder?

[spladle]

Any thoughts on the article's link to an editorial on the Lochner case?

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/03/07/1684111/rand-paul-all-laws-protecting-workers-are-constitutionally-suspect/

"lol"

[jtstellar]

god i hate liberals.. they can't accomplish anything but always complain about other people doing what they think is right.. so useless it's dramatic.. s#@$ or get off the pot, jeez

[surf]

if it scares democrats to do anything, what they'll probably do, at least in MD..... is turn it into a big overtaxed state run bureaucratic clusterfuck. just like everything else, people will be back to the black market because the weed will be cheaper sans taxes. i love that people are coming around but please don't rush these idiots into doing anything lolI hear you.

in essence this was the dilemma of libertarians/RP folks in Washington- allow the gov't to set prices too high (there is already a good "black market" w/prices and quality that Coloradoans would probably envy) and inevitably screw things up in exchange for not prosecuting users.

but the estimates of tax revenue using consumption of about a pound of state-sold weed per user per year can not really be seen as a good thing (or a realistic figure)... this sells.

the liquor control board that was partially put out of the liquor retailing business by an initiative a few years ago will now oversea the formation of this pot market. lobbyists will write the rules and regulations and those of us that are hoping for a freer market will cross our fingers and hope we don't find $400/ounce for rag-weed when the stores are scheduled to be able to sell this December.

[HigherVision]

I don't know, I know a lot of people get excited about stuff like this but at the end of the day I think all the so-called progressives really care about is keeping the welfare and regulatory state going. I doubt they really care about civil liberties. That's more a throwback to classical liberalism to make it look like they aren't for complete totalitarianism. I don't think we have any 'allies on the left', they're all snakes who can't be trusted. Go back to how Cenk treated Peter Schiff on his show a few years back. I've seen him demonize Rand by deliberately taking his words out of context on his show before as well.

[HigherVision]

cue a thousand posts saying:

"I can't believe I agree with Rand Paul."

"Rand is such a teabagger but I agree with him on this once"

"Hell has frozen over I agree with Rand Paul"

"Rand Paul is insane but I agree with him"

etc etc ad nauseam

And then they'll all pat themselves on the back about how hip and how 'progressive' they all are. I'm sorry I hate these people, I hate progressives. Even more than the neocons. After 5 years of Obama I'm sick of them.

[whoisjohngalt]

Rand Paul an ideologue? He literally breathes pragmatism. This just shows how far our country is truly gone...

This shouldn't be read as a negative comment on Rand. He's smart. He's politically savvy. He's not an "Ideologue" though.

He literally breathes air. I think you mean figuratively.

It's ok you must have been watching old Perry debate highlights. "Al Qaeda will move into Iraq, literally at the speed of light!"