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View Full Version : CNN: 'Routine check of vehicles'. The state illegally mass searching miles of vehicles




marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 05:27 PM
Anyone watching this? Live on CNN. Roadblocks along highway in Big Bear where cops are mass searching vehicles. Popping trunks, doors, opening boxes, lifting blankets, illegally searching local residents just trying to get home all for the sake of 'security'.

And they're not even searching under the vehicles, but guns are drawn just not aimed from what I have seen.

erowe1
02-12-2013, 05:30 PM
Anyone watching this? Live on CNN. Roadblocks along highway in Big Bear where cops are mass searching vehicles. Popping trunks, doors, opening boxes, lifting blankets, illegally searching local residents just trying to get home all for the sake of 'security'.

Are the people giving them permission? If so, it's not illegal. If some aren't, what's happening to them?

acptulsa
02-12-2013, 05:34 PM
Are the people giving them permission? If so, it's not illegal. If some aren't, what's happening to them?

Excuse us, ma'am, but we heard Dorner's in the neighborhood, desperate, armed to the teeth, and able to break you in half barehanded. Mind if we have a quick look?

marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 05:35 PM
Are the people giving them permission? If so, it's not illegal. If some aren't, what's happening to them?

irrelevant; the state has a roadblock preventing you from going to your house unless you pass through their checkpoint. And if you resist, how likely are you allowed to pass?

torchbearer
02-12-2013, 05:36 PM
Are the people giving them permission? If so, it's not illegal. If some aren't, what's happening to them?

are you not under duress if someone is pointing a rifle at you while asking for permission?
you may say yes, but that isn't what you'd be telling him if the rifle was in your hand instead.

erowe1
02-12-2013, 05:37 PM
And if you resist, how likely are you allowed to pass?

By "resist" you mean, not give them permission to search your vehicle. Right? That is precisely the question.

erowe1
02-12-2013, 05:37 PM
are you not under duress if someone is pointing a rifle at you while asking for permission?
you may say yes, but that isn't what you'd be telling him if the rifle was in your hand instead.

Is that what they're doing?

BSU kid
02-12-2013, 05:38 PM
I got plenty of screenshots of these illegal searches, good stuff. Cops! Protectors of the Constitution.

Keith and stuff
02-12-2013, 05:39 PM
At least they aren't currently shooting innocent people. It could be worse.

acptulsa
02-12-2013, 05:40 PM
Quick, somebody youtube this so this thread can go on for days:

http://losangeles.cbslocal.com/live-video/

marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 05:41 PM
By "resist" you mean, not give them permission to search your vehicle. Right? That is precisely the question.

The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Point being, permission or not, irrespective of whatever arbitrary case law precedent has been created, a warrant is necessary. Not that I assume some judge's warrant is a be all end all, the 4th amendment is clear. Nowhere does it say "*this amendment does not apply when an armed state agent prevents you from proceeding when you provide adequate affirmation to be searched."

torchbearer
02-12-2013, 05:41 PM
Is that what they're doing?


not there, but making the point that just because you say yes, doesn't mean its giving persmission.
especially when armed men are asking the question.

marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 05:43 PM
Is that what they're doing?

Yes, watch the live stream!! They have their guns drawn, but not aimed. So yes, if someone tells you to open your trunk with gun in hand, explain to me a duress situation.

erowe1
02-12-2013, 05:51 PM
Yes, watch the live stream!! They have their guns drawn, but not aimed. So yes, if someone tells you to open your trunk with gun in hand, explain to me a duress situation.

Good point.

Hopefully someone says no.

Jackie Moon
02-12-2013, 06:05 PM
I'd like to think that I'd deny consent to search, but I also don't think I'd enjoy being shot 46 times. I don't look like Dorner but I'm closer than a 71 year old woman.

marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 06:08 PM
You must also consider if you're just getting off work after driving through LA traffic only to come to a roadblock where they are only searching one vehicle at a time and the backup traffic is miles long, how likely is someone going to assert their rights? The mental attrition of sitting in a car stalled for who knows how long just makes you WANT to get out of the situation anyway possible. The easiest, most expedient way? Give up your rights with faux "permission".

Unless a civil rights activist is in that multi mile throng of vehicles and wants to make a point that is trivial to the state, no one will speak up.

sailingaway
02-12-2013, 06:10 PM
Wow. My sister lives up that way. I'll have to ask her about it. I agree with marketsnowball, it is like TSA on Thanksgiving. No one wants to be 'that guy' and people just want to get home if they have been waiting long enough. That road backs up plenty easily even without roadblocks.

Danke
02-12-2013, 06:11 PM
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Point being, permission or not, irrespective of whatever arbitrary case law precedent has been created, a warrant is necessary. Not that I assume some judge's warrant is a be all end all, the 4th amendment is clear. Nowhere does it say "*this amendment does not apply when an armed state agent prevents you from proceeding when you provide adequate affirmation to be searched."

I think the 4A goes out the window when you register and hand over title of the vehicle to the State.

erowe1
02-12-2013, 06:31 PM
Point being, permission or not, irrespective of whatever arbitrary case law precedent has been created, a warrant is necessary.

If the people give permission, then where's the violation?

Danke
02-12-2013, 06:34 PM
If the people give permission, then where's the violation?

They could ask what the consequences are if they do not agree to a search.

anaconda
02-12-2013, 08:03 PM
I hope everybody down there has their cell phone video recorders aimed at the cops.

kcchiefs6465
02-12-2013, 08:14 PM
I got plenty of screenshots of these illegal searches, good stuff. Cops! Protectors of the Constitution.
Pics? Of the few minutes I watched earlier they did point the rifle at the driver. One may ask whether it was intentional or not but does it really matter? At the end of the day a locked and loaded rifle is still pointed at your person.

FTR the video I saw showed the cop (National guard?) approaching the vehicle talking for a moment, then pointing his rifle into the vehicle, front then back. They then checked the trunk. Searching trucks they were a little more careful on where they were pointing the weapon. I saw quite a few times where the weapon was crossed back across an innocent driver. Guns being pointed at me, whether loaded or unloaded, intentionally or unintentionally, will piss me right tf off. I've had a few 'talks' with dumbasses who didn't know the basics of gun safety.

marketsnowball
02-12-2013, 09:59 PM
So wait, there's no issue with the cops having guns drawn on innocent people?

Ahh they gave them permission. All it takes is a simple "yes" and the 4th amendment dissolves into space. Forget the fact the 4th amendment makes no point saying "all you need is permission to mass search the citizenry". It says you need a warrant. Otherwise, cops can just search your house and say 'he said I could' then what? Your word vs. his in court? Okay. Why did we bother with a warrant for hundreds of years if it was that simple just to fabricate compliance.

marketsnowball
02-13-2013, 07:49 AM
Bump

KingNothing
02-13-2013, 07:53 AM
Excuse us, ma'am, but we heard Dorner's in the neighborhood, desperate, armed to the teeth, and able to break you in half barehanded. Mind if we have a quick look?


"Yes. Am I being detained? Ok then, I'll be on my way. Have a good day, officer!"

acptulsa
02-13-2013, 08:51 AM
One thing's certain. The day that this sort of thing is, as CNN described it, 'routine' will be the day the U.S. is no longer recognizable as the nation I was born in.

UtahApocalypse
02-13-2013, 08:58 AM
"Yes. Am I being detained? Ok then, I'll be on my way. Have a good day, officer!"

I would love to have seen what they would do