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Lucille
02-08-2013, 11:06 AM
Big Tobacco-owned bastards.

FDA coming after electronic cigarettes come April
http://www.libertarianrepublican.net/2013/02/a-potential-winning-issue-for-gop-on.html


by Thomas L. Knapp

A couple of years ago, the FDA tried to outlaw electronic cigarettes under its authority to regulate medical equipment and "drug delivery systems."

A court overruled them, and said if they were going to regulate e-cigs, they would have to do so under their authority to regulate "tobacco products."

Effective in April, they intend to do just that.

Some Democratic bastions have already started treating electronic cigarettes -- which produce no smoke, "second hand" or otherwise! -- as "smoking" for purposes of public smoking bans.

From BrowardPalmBeach.com, "Ex-Smokers Organize to Keep Electronic Cigarettes on the Market, Easily Accessible":


This week, New Times reported on the electronic cigarette business, which is currently booming but faces a crossroads this April, when the Food and Drug Administration is set to release proposals on how it will regulate the industry. A Wells Fargo analyst who studies the tobacco industry told us that sales of e-cigarettes could surpass sales of traditional cigarettes in the next few years. The coming FDA rules could largely influence how the market is divided among online retailers, small brick-and-mortar shops, and/or Big Tobacco.

So far, there are few studies on the effects of inhaling e-cigarette vapor. The FDA is moving cautiously in case it proves dangerous, and some cities and states have moved to ban the sales of e-cigs entirely. But some doctors and health policy experts have said that e-cigarettes show tremendous promise as a "harm reduction" measure -- meaning that while while it's best to smoke nothing, e-cigs could probably help divert people from conventional ciggies, which definitely cause cancer, emphysema, and death.

This is an issue that plays to the same sentiments as e.g. lowering the drinking age, getting rid of seatbelt laws, etc., but in some ways it is even better, because it's pretty transparently the Democrats a) trying to preserve tax revenues from cigarette sales and b) doing a favor for Big Tobacco, even though they know that that favor will cost lives.

kathy88
02-08-2013, 11:18 AM
Why isn't it obvious to everyone else when it is SO obvious to us? What will it take?

Lucille
02-08-2013, 12:25 PM
Why isn't it obvious to everyone else when it is SO obvious to us? What will it take?

I really don't know. I actually saw one prog commenting at AmConMag say that every single regulation in existence is good, and needed. At first I thought it was a joke, but nope. They really believe that shit!

We'll know a ban is coming (and it's time to stock up) when the lapdogs all start pushing stories on the dangers of e-cigs. I've wondered why Big Tobacco hasn't gotten in on the e-cig action. Do they know a ban is coming?

Philhelm
02-08-2013, 12:40 PM
Jesus Christ. I have been using my E-cigarette almost exclusively during the last few months. I used to smoke over a pack of cigarettes a day, and now I smoke a pack of cigarettes every two weeks as I wean myself by using the E-cigarette. C.S. Lewis was right - I couldn't imagine Stalin giving two shits about this.

fr33
02-08-2013, 12:43 PM
They REALLY want to piss people off I guess.

phill4paul
02-08-2013, 12:46 PM
They REALLY want to piss people off I guess.

They don't give a shit. Much hand wringing over states and municipalities going "smokeless." To no avail. Prohibitionists like the power brought by prohibiting. It doesn't matter what it is or the compromises made.

kathy88
02-08-2013, 12:55 PM
Didn't they learn anything from prohibition of alcohol? Guess not.

Anti Federalist
02-08-2013, 02:18 PM
Didn't they learn anything from prohibition of alcohol? Guess not.

They do not care about the wake of misery they leave behind them.

More and more power is all they care about.

satchelmcqueen
02-08-2013, 03:26 PM
om fG!

opal
02-08-2013, 04:58 PM
Big tobacco did buy one of the E cig brands.. Blu according to the folks on the ECF forums.

that move on it's own pretty much said that our newfangled little buddies probably won't be banned but very heavily regulated instead.

I've already started stocking up on stuff - have not touched a regular cig since October - even though there are a couple of packs from my last carton still floating around here somewhere.

The general consensus is that the nicotine juice is most in danger since the carriers can be had anywhere.. flavors also and building a mod isn't supposed to be that hard.

Just another reason to ban the FDA

MRK
02-08-2013, 05:03 PM
Nicotine juice as you call it, is absurdly cheap. 4 or 5 years ago the equivalent of 2000 cigarettes was like $20 when ordering online. And I'm not even sure if that was toward the bottom of the price spectrum. In bulk, I'm sure it was drastically cheaper than it already was.

MRK
02-08-2013, 05:05 PM
Nicotine juice as you call it, is absurdly cheap. 4 or 5 years ago the equivalent of 2000 cigarettes was like $20 when ordering online. And I'm not even sure if that was toward the bottom of the price spectrum. In bulk, I'm sure it was drastically cheaper than it already was.

It just really shows you how far these people tax these things.

I also find it very interesting that the FDA does not regulate alcohol and tobacco (someone correct me if I'm wrong on this, but I think only ATF does). Very interesting that vaporized tobacco is getting thrown to the FDA wolves to be treated like a natural supplement (which is another industry that was thrown under the bus a couple years ago by the FDA which didn't regulate it in earnest until very recently, with things like minimum qualified personnel and minimum amounts of employees to qualify to process supplements [instant KO to small businesses])

opal
02-08-2013, 07:45 PM
it's not all tobacco.. really
I vape sweet flavors - whipped cream is actually my favorite flavor - and there are some kick ass coffee flavors - no tobacco involved.

fr33
02-08-2013, 08:03 PM
How would one go about manufacturing the liquid if a black market became lucrative? I'm no chemist. It just really sux. You can grow tobacco etc. The feds are going to drive me back to smoking. :(

hardrightedge
02-08-2013, 09:24 PM
I've been looking for a good coffee forever...CopperCreek has an excellent coffee, but it gunks up my gear. I haven't been able to find anything else like it.

Anti Federalist
02-08-2013, 09:33 PM
FDA coming after electronic cigarettes come April

After thinking about that a little bit...what, pray tell, are they NOT "coming after" or "cracking down" on?

MRK
02-08-2013, 09:42 PM
How would one go about manufacturing the liquid if a black market became lucrative? I'm no chemist. It just really sux. You can grow tobacco etc. The feds are going to drive me back to smoking. :(

The easiest way would be extracting the nicotine from the tobacco plant. As far as synthesizing the nicotine compound, I doubt this method would be cheaper as the chemical precursors and reagents would likely be very expensive relative to the cost of a tobacco leaf + the extracting compounds. However I haven't done a cost comparison, this is just comparing the costs to the costs of obtaining other naturally-occuring pharmaceuticals like caffeine, cocaine, and morphine which are able to be synthesized but because they occur naturally are far less costly to grow. So given that obtaining the nicotine from the plant is likely a better option, consider that nicotine is soluble via water from the tobacco plant, for one. The actual process of extraction would probably involve many steps of extraction to obtain 99.X+% purity, but I do not know the process although I'm sure googling would reveal much.

Caffeine for example is also soluble, but most of the extraction of caffeine from coffee is done by high pressured CO2. From there they take the caffeine and put it in your Coca Cola, Pepsi, Monster, etc. I bought a kilo of caffeine a few years back for $30. A KILO. Keep in mind a cup of strong coffee has 100mg of caffeine. So comparatively speaking that's 10,000 cups of strong coffee for $30 or 3/10ths of a cent per cup. I bioassayed the product, and it was legitimate. I haven't used any caffeine from the kilo in a long time. You have to be careful using it and store it securely because you realistically could overdose and die if you stuck your finger in the bag and tossed a bunch down your throat and ingested more than a couple grams (or even less in some cases). Also I wouldn't store it in anything less than a hidden safe if you had kids or friends/family who do. One interesting thing about caffeine anhydrous is that it is a powder in itself. There's no need to bind to another chemical and form a salt like with chloride to be in a powderlike form like most pharmaceuticals require. If they weren't salts they wouldn't be able to be pressed into pills and would just be a goopy, sticky mess.

osan
02-08-2013, 09:45 PM
The feds are going to drive me back to smoking. :(

Perhaps that's the idea?

kathy88
02-10-2013, 07:48 AM
Bump to go with American Spirit thread.

FunkBuddha
02-10-2013, 08:18 AM
The major tobacco companies are masters of Regulatory Capture (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Regulatory_capture). They were the ones lobbying the state of New York for the first FSC laws. Once they won there, they went national. My source is someone who was high up the chain at Phillip Morris who makes Marlboro.

acptulsa
02-10-2013, 08:32 AM
After thinking about that a little bit...what, pray tell, are they NOT "coming after" or "cracking down" on?

I refuse to answer on the grounds that I don't want to give the bastards ideas.

tod evans
04-04-2014, 06:45 AM
E-cigarette rule coming 'very soon,' U.S. FDA chief says

http://www.foxnews.com/health/2014/04/04/e-cigarette-rule-coming-very-soon-us-fda-chief-says/?intcmp=latestnews

The U.S. Food and Drug Administration is "pushing very hard" to release a proposed rule that would establish its authority over e-cigarettes, the head of the agency said on Thursday amid concerns the products pose a risk to children.

FDA Commissioner Margaret Hamburg told senators at a Congressional budget hearing that it has taken too long to move the rule forward and that she expects the proposal to be ready for release "very soon."

The FDA's proposal is currently being examined by the White House's Office of Management and Budget, which reviews potential regulations to assess their economic impact. OMB, which has been reviewing the proposal for roughly five months, has not said when it will be finished with its assessment.

A growing chorus of public health advocates and lawmakers are pressing for prompt release of the proposal, arguing that the delay presents risks to children who may be attracted to the sweet flavors often contained in e-cigarettes.

Senator Jeff Merkley, Democrat of Oregon, told Hamburg that the agency's delays were "disgraceful" since makers of products such as tutti-frutti flavored e-cigarettes and strawberry-flavored cigars have "an insidious strategy to addict our children to nicotine."

"Four years and four months to get the first draft over to OMB is unacceptable," he said. For OMB to sit on it for months, he added, "is unacceptable."

Hamburg said the criticisms were fair.

"I do believe that very soon I will be able to call you, and say the deeming rule is out," she said.

A law passed in 2009 gave the FDA the authority to regulate cigarettes, smokeless tobacco and roll-your-own tobacco. It also gave the agency the power to "deem" other tobacco products to be within its jurisdiction but it must first issue a rule to that effect.

E-cigarette companies believe they should be exempt from the full spectrum of regulations, saying they would stifle innovation, damage small business and hurt consumers trying to quit smoking.

Hamburg also responded to concerns about an apparent rise in the number of poisoning cases from liquid nicotine, the substance contained in e-cigarettes that, when heated, forms an inhalable vapor.

On Thursday a report from the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention showed that the number of calls to poison centers involving e-cigarette liquids containing nicotine rose from one per month in September 2010 to 215 per month in February 2014. The number of calls per month involving conventional cigarettes did not show a similar increase, the report said.

"We do feel that this in an area that requires greater attention, action and concern," Hamburg said.

DamianTV
04-04-2014, 07:31 AM
Didn't they learn anything from prohibition of alcohol? Guess not.

These fuckers wouldnt learn if they were told to go play in oncoming traffic that their own obedience is what caused their own problems.

They intend to eventually try to make all forms of Tobacco completely illegal, which gives yet another prop up to the DEA to "search your home" without a warrant, because you used to smoke. They want a black market because it creates a need for them. With pot on the verge of being legalized, they realize their jobs are in jeopardy, and Tobacco is gonna be the New Pot. Even E-cigs.

NorfolkPCSolutions
04-15-2014, 10:49 AM
Well, fellow RPFers who are also vapers, keep doing what you're undoubtedly doing - explain to folks who ask what you're doing when they see you vape, vape politely (church is probably not a good place to vape), and educate, educate, educate those around you and those you love who don't vape.

Explain to anyone who will listen that this is how you have freed yourself from analog cigarettes, a legal product, which will earn you a slow and painful death: electronic cigarettes. Hell, even use the word cigarette. There is such a stigma attached to that word, such derision applied to smokers in today's society, that on some level, even the most die-hard control freak will have to concede one point, at the very least:

3 chemicals are better than hundreds of chemicals. FDA-approved Vegetable Glycerine or Propylene Glycol, FDA-approved flavoring agents, and nicotene-derived liquid in low volume, measured in milliliters, versus

• Acetanisole
• Acetic Acid
• Acetoin
• Acetophenone
• 6-Acetoxydihydrotheaspirane
• 2-Acetyl-3- Ethylpyrazine
• 2-Acetyl-5-Methylfuran
• Acetylpyrazine
• 2-Acetylpyridine
• 3-Acetylpyridine
• 2-Acetylthiazole
• Aconitic Acid
• dl-Alanine
• Alfalfa Extract
• Allspice Extract,Oleoresin, and Oil
• Allyl Hexanoate
• Allyl Ionone
• Almond Bitter Oil
• Ambergris Tincture
• Ammonia
• Ammonium Bicarbonate
• Ammonium Hydroxide
• Ammonium Phosphate Dibasic
• Ammonium Sulfide
• Amyl Alcohol
• Amyl Butyrate
• Amyl Formate
• Amyl Octanoate
• alpha-Amylcinnamaldehyde
• Amyris Oil
• trans-Anethole
• Angelica Root Extract, Oil and Seed Oil
• Anise
• Anise Star, Extract and Oils
• Anisyl Acetate
• Anisyl Alcohol
• Anisyl Formate
• Anisyl Phenylacetate
• Apple Juice Concentrate, Extract, and Skins
• Apricot Extract and Juice Concentrate
• 1-Arginine
• Asafetida Fluid Extract And Oil
• Ascorbic Acid
• 1-Asparagine Monohydrate
• 1-Aspartic Acid
• Balsam Peru and Oil
• Basil Oil
• Bay Leaf, Oil and Sweet Oil
• Beeswax White
• Beet Juice Concentrate
• Benzaldehyde
• Benzaldehyde Glyceryl Acetal
• Benzoic Acid, Benzoin
• Benzoin Resin
• Benzophenone
• Benzyl Alcohol
• Benzyl Benzoate
• Benzyl Butyrate
• Benzyl Cinnamate
• Benzyl Propionate
• Benzyl Salicylate
• Bergamot Oil
• Bisabolene
• Black Currant Buds Absolute
• Borneol
• Bornyl Acetate
• Buchu Leaf Oil
• 1,3-Butanediol
• 2,3-Butanedione
• 1-Butanol
• 2-Butanone
• 4(2-Butenylidene)-3,5,5-Trimethyl-2-Cyclohexen-1-One
• Butter, Butter Esters, and Butter Oil
• Butyl Acetate
• Butyl Butyrate
• Butyl Butyryl Lactate
• Butyl Isovalerate
• Butyl Phenylacetate
• Butyl Undecylenate
• 3-Butylidenephthalide
• Butyric Acid]
• Cadinene
• Caffeine
• Calcium Carbonate
• Camphene
• Cananga Oil
• Capsicum Oleoresin
• Caramel Color
• Caraway Oil
• Carbon Dioxide
• Cardamom Oleoresin, Extract, Seed Oil, and Powder
• Carob Bean and Extract
• beta-Carotene
• Carrot Oil
• Carvacrol
• 4-Carvomenthenol
• 1-Carvone
• beta-Caryophyllene
• beta-Caryophyllene Oxide
• Cascarilla Oil and Bark Extract
• Cassia Bark Oil
• Cassie Absolute and Oil
• Castoreum Extract, Tincture and Absolute
• Cedar Leaf Oil
• Cedarwood Oil Terpenes and Virginiana
• Cedrol
• Celery Seed Extract, Solid, Oil, And Oleoresin
• Cellulose Fiber
• Chamomile Flower Oil And Extract
• Chicory Extract
• Chocolate
• Cinnamaldehyde
• Cinnamic Acid
• Cinnamon Leaf Oil, Bark Oil, and Extract
• Cinnamyl Acetate
• Cinnamyl Alcohol
• Cinnamyl Cinnamate
• Cinnamyl Isovalerate
• Cinnamyl Propionate
• Citral
• Citric Acid
• Citronella Oil
• dl-Citronellol
• Citronellyl Butyrate
• itronellyl Isobutyrate
• Civet Absolute
• Clary Oil
• Clover Tops, Red Solid Extract
• Cocoa
• Cocoa Shells, Extract, Distillate And Powder
• Coconut Oil
• Coffee
• Cognac White and Green Oil
• Copaiba Oil
• Coriander Extract and Oil
• Corn Oil
• Corn Silk
• Costus Root Oil
• Cubeb Oil
• Cuminaldehyde
• para-Cymene
• 1-Cysteine Dandelion Root Solid Extract
• Davana Oil
• 2-trans, 4-trans-Decadienal
• delta-Decalactone
• gamma-Decalactone
• Decanal
• Decanoic Acid
• 1-Decanol
• 2-Decenal
• Dehydromenthofurolactone
• Diethyl Malonate
• Diethyl Sebacate
• 2,3-Diethylpyrazine
• Dihydro Anethole
• 5,7-Dihydro-2-Methylthieno(3,4-D) Pyrimidine
• Dill Seed Oil and Extract
• meta-Dimethoxybenzene
• para-Dimethoxybenzene
• 2,6-Dimethoxyphenol
• Dimethyl Succinate
• 3,4-Dimethyl-1,2 Cyclopentanedione
• 3,5- Dimethyl-1,2-Cyclopentanedione
• 3,7-Dimethyl-1,3,6-Octatriene
• 4,5-Dimethyl-3-Hydroxy-2,5-
Dihydrofuran-2-One
• 6,10-Dimethyl-5,9-Undecadien-
2-One
• 3,7-Dimethyl-6-Octenoic Acid
• 2,4 Dimethylacetophenone
• alpha,para-Dimethylbenzyl Alcohol
• alpha,alpha-Dimethylphenethyl Acetate
• alpha,alpha Dimethylphenethyl Butyrate
• 2,3-Dimethylpyrazine
• 2,5-Dimethylpyrazine
• 2,6-Dimethylpyrazine
• Dimethyltetrahydrobenzofuranone
• delta-Dodecalactone
• gamma-Dodecalactone
• para-Ethoxybenzaldehyde
• Ethyl 10-Undecenoate
• Ethyl 2-Methylbutyrate
• Ethyl Acetate
• Ethyl Acetoacetate
• Ethyl Alcohol
• Ethyl Benzoate
• Ethyl Butyrate
• Ethyl Cinnamate
• Ethyl Decanoate
• Ethyl Fenchol
• Ethyl Furoate
• Ethyl Heptanoate
• Ethyl Hexanoate
• Ethyl Isovalerate
• Ethyl Lactate
• Ethyl Laurate
• Ethyl Levulinate
• Ethyl Maltol
• Ethyl Methyl Phenylglycidate
• Ethyl Myristate
• Ethyl Nonanoate
• Ethyl Octadecanoate
• Ethyl Octanoate


• Ethyl Oleate
• Ethyl Palmitate
• Ethyl Phenylacetate
• Ethyl Propionate
• Ethyl Salicylate
• Ethyl trans-2-Butenoate
• Ethyl Valerate
• Ethyl Vanillin
• 2-Ethyl (or Methyl)-(3,5 and 6)-Methoxypyrazine
• 2-Ethyl-1-Hexanol, 3-Ethyl -2 -
Hydroxy-2-Cyclopenten-1-One
• 2-Ethyl-3, (5 or 6)-Dimethylpyrazine
• 5-Ethyl-3-Hydroxy-4-Methyl-2 (5H)-Furanone
• 2-Ethyl-3-Methylpyrazine
• 4-Ethylbenzaldehyde
• 4-Ethylguaiacol
• para-Ethylphenol
• 3-Ethylpyridine
• Eucalyptol
• Farnesol
• D-Fenchone
• Fennel Sweet Oil
• Fenugreek, Extract, Resin, and Absolute
• Fig Juice Concentrate
• Food Starch Modified
• Furfuryl Mercaptan
• 4-(2-Furyl)-3-Buten-2-One
• Galbanum Oil
• Genet Absolute
• Gentian Root Extract
• Geraniol
• Geranium Rose Oil
• Geranyl Acetate
• Geranyl Butyrate
• Geranyl Formate
• Geranyl Isovalerate
• Geranyl Phenylacetate
• Ginger Oil and Oleoresin
• 1-Glutamic Acid
• 1-Glutamine
• Glycerol
• Glycyrrhizin Ammoniated
• Grape Juice Concentrate
• Guaiac Wood Oil
• Guaiacol
• Guar Gum
• 2,4-Heptadienal
• gamma-Heptalactone
• Heptanoic Acid
• 2-Heptanone
• 3-Hepten-2-One
• 2-Hepten-4-One
• 4-Heptenal
• trans -2-Heptenal
• Heptyl Acetate
• omega-6-Hexadecenlactone
• gamma-Hexalactone
• Hexanal
• Hexanoic Acid
• 2-Hexen-1-Ol
• 3-Hexen-1-Ol
• cis-3-Hexen-1-Yl Acetate
• 2-Hexenal
• 3-Hexenoic Acid
• trans-2-Hexenoic Acid
• cis-3-Hexenyl Formate
• Hexyl 2-Methylbutyrate
• Hexyl Acetate
• Hexyl Alcohol
• Hexyl Phenylacetate
• 1-Histidine
• Honey
• Hops Oil
• Hydrolyzed Milk Solids
• Hydrolyzed Plant Proteins
• 5-Hydroxy-2,4-Decadienoic Acid delta-Lactone
• 4-Hydroxy-2,5-Dimethyl-3(2H)-Furanone
• 2-Hydroxy-3,5,5-Trimethyl-2-Cyclohexen-1-One
• 4-Hydroxy -3-Pentenoic Acid Lactone
• 2-Hydroxy-4-Methylbenzaldehyde
• 4-Hydroxybutanoic Acid Lactone
• Hydroxycitronellal
• 6-Hydroxydihydrotheaspirane
• 4-(para-Hydroxyphenyl)-2-Butanone
• Hyssop Oil
• Immortelle Absolute and Extract
• alpha-Ionone
• beta-Ionone
• alpha-Irone
• Isoamyl Acetate
• Isoamyl Benzoate
• Isoamyl Butyrate
• Isoamyl Cinnamate
• Isoamyl Formate, IsoamylHexanoate
• Isoamyl Isovalerate
• Isoamyl Octanoate
• Isoamyl Phenylacetate
• Isobornyl Acetate
• Isobutyl Acetate
• Isobutyl Alcohol
• Isobutyl Cinnamate
• Isobutyl Phenylacetate
• Isobutyl Salicylate
• 2-Isobutyl-3-Methoxypyrazine
• alpha-Isobutylphenethyl Alcohol
• Isobutyraldehyde
• Isobutyric Acid
• d,l-Isoleucine
• alpha-Isomethylionone
• 2-Isopropylphenol
• Isovaleric Acid
• Jasmine Absolute, Concrete and Oil
• Kola Nut Extract
• Labdanum Absolute and Oleoresin
• Lactic Acid
• Lauric Acid
• Lauric Aldehyde
• Lavandin Oil
• Lavender Oil
• Lemon Oil and Extract
• Lemongrass Oil
• 1-Leucine
• Levulinic Acid
• Licorice Root, Fluid, Extract
and Powder
• Lime Oil
• Linalool
• Linalool Oxide
• Linalyl Acetate
• Linden Flowers
• Lovage Oil And Extract
• 1-Lysine]
• Mace Powder, Extract and Oil
• Magnesium Carbonate
• Malic Acid
• Malt and Malt Extract
• Maltodextrin
• Maltol
• Maltyl Isobutyrate
• Mandarin Oil
• Maple Syrup and Concentrate
• Mate Leaf, Absolute and Oil
• para-Mentha-8-Thiol-3-One
• Menthol
• Menthone
• Menthyl Acetate
• dl-Methionine
• Methoprene
• 2-Methoxy-4-Methylphenol
• 2-Methoxy-4-Vinylphenol
• para-Methoxybenzaldehyde
• 1-(para-Methoxyphenyl)-1-Penten-3-One
• 4-(para-Methoxyphenyl)-2-Butanone
• 1-(para-Methoxyphenyl)-2-Propanone
• Methoxypyrazine
• Methyl 2-Furoate
• Methyl 2-Octynoate
• Methyl 2-Pyrrolyl Ketone
• Methyl Anisate
• Methyl Anthranilate
• Methyl Benzoate
• Methyl Cinnamate
• Methyl Dihydrojasmonate
• Methyl Ester of Rosin, Partially Hydrogenated
• Methyl Isovalerate
• Methyl Linoleate (48%)
• Methyl Linolenate (52%) Mixture
• Methyl Naphthyl Ketone
• Methyl Nicotinate
• Methyl Phenylacetate
• Methyl Salicylate
• Methyl Sulfide
• 3-Methyl-1-Cyclopentadecanone
• 4-Methyl-1-Phenyl-2-Pentanone
• 5-Methyl-2-Phenyl-2-Hexenal
• 5-Methyl-2-Thiophene-carboxaldehyde
• 6-Methyl-3,-5-Heptadien-2-One
• 2-Methyl-3-(para-Isopropylphenyl) Propionaldehyde
• 5-Methyl-3-Hexen-2-One
• 1-Methyl-3Methoxy-4-Isopropylbenzene
• 4-Methyl-3-Pentene-2-One
• 2-Methyl-4-Phenylbutyraldehyde
• 6-Methyl-5-Hepten-2-One
• 4-Methyl-5-Thiazoleethanol
• 4-Methyl-5-Vinylthiazole
• Methyl-alpha-Ionone
• Methyl-trans-2-Butenoic Acid
• 4-Methylacetophenone
• para-Methylanisole
• alpha-Methylbenzyl Acetate
• alpha-Methylbenzyl Alcohol
• 2-Methylbutyraldehyde
• 3-Methylbutyraldehyde
• 2-Methylbutyric Acid
• alpha-Methylcinnamaldehyde
• Methylcyclopentenolone
• 2-Methylheptanoic Acid
• 2-Methylhexanoic Acid
• 3-Methylpentanoic Acid
• 4-Methylpentanoic Acid
• 2-Methylpyrazine
• 5-Methylquinoxaline
• 2-Methyltetrahydrofuran-3-One
• (Methylthio)Methylpyrazine (Mixture Of Isomers)


• 3-Methylthiopropionaldehyde
• Methyl 3-Methylthiopropionate
• 2-Methylvaleric Acid
• Mimosa Absolute and Extract
• Molasses Extract and Tincture
• Mountain Maple Solid Extract
• Mullein Flowers
• Myristaldehyde
• Myristic Acid
• Myrrh Oil
• beta-Napthyl Ethyl Ether
• Nerol
• Neroli Bigarde Oil
• Nerolidol
• Nona-2-trans,6-cis-Dienal
• 2,6-Nonadien-1-Ol
• gamma-Nonalactone
• Nonanal
• Nonanoic Acid
• Nonanone
• trans-2-Nonen-1-Ol
• 2-Nonenal
• Nonyl Acetate
• Nutmeg Powder and Oil
• Oak Chips Extract and Oil
• Oak Moss Absolute
• 9,12-Octadecadienoic Acid (48%)
And 9,12,15-Octadecatrienoic Acid (52%)
• delta-Octalactone
• gamma-Octalactone
• Octanal
• Octanoic Acid
• 1-Octanol
• 2-Octanone
• 3-Octen-2-One
• 1-Octen-3-Ol
• 1-Octen-3-Yl Acetate
• 2-Octenal
• Octyl Isobutyrate
• Oleic Acid
• Olibanum Oil
• Opoponax Oil And Gum
• Orange Blossoms Water, Absolute, and Leaf Absolute
• Orange Oil and Extract
• Origanum Oil
• Orris Concrete Oil and Root
Extract
• Palmarosa Oil
• Palmitic Acid
• Parsley Seed Oil
• Patchouli Oil
• omega-Pentadecalactone
• 2,3-Pentanedione
• 2-Pentanone
• 4-Pentenoic Acid
• 2-Pentylpyridine
• Pepper Oil, Black And White
• Peppermint Oil
• Peruvian (Bois De Rose) Oil
• Petitgrain Absolute, Mandarin Oil and Terpeneless Oil
• alpha-Phellandrene
• 2-Phenenthyl Acetate
• Phenenthyl Alcohol
• Phenethyl Butyrate
• Phenethyl Cinnamate
• Phenethyl Isobutyrate
• Phenethyl Isovalerate
• Phenethyl Phenylacetate
• Phenethyl Salicylate
• 1-Phenyl-1-Propanol
• 3-Phenyl-1-Propanol
• 2-Phenyl-2-Butenal
• 4-Phenyl-3-Buten-2-Ol
• 4-Phenyl-3-Buten-2-One
• Phenylacetaldehyde
• Phenylacetic Acid
• 1-Phenylalanine
• 3-Phenylpropionaldehyde
• 3-Phenylpropionic Acid
• 3-Phenylpropyl Acetate
• 3-Phenylpropyl Cinnamate
• 2-(3-Phenylpropyl)Tetrahydrofuran
• Phosphoric Acid
• Pimenta Leaf Oil
• Pine Needle Oil, Pine Oil, Scotch
• Pineapple Juice Concentrate
• alpha-Pinene, beta-Pinene
• D-Piperitone
• Piperonal
• Pipsissewa Leaf Extract
• Plum Juice
• Potassium Sorbate
• 1-Proline
• Propenylguaethol
• Propionic Acid
• Propyl Acetate
• Propyl para-Hydroxybenzoate
• Propylene Glycol
• 3-Propylidenephthalide
• Prune Juice and Concentrate
• Pyridine
• Pyroligneous Acid And Extract
• Pyrrole
• Pyruvic Acid
• Raisin Juice Concentrate
• Rhodinol
• Rose Absolute and Oil
• Rosemary Oil
• Rum
• Rum Ether
• Rye Extract
• Sage, Sage Oil, and Sage
Oleoresin
• Salicylaldehyde
• Sandalwood Oil, Yellow
• Sclareolide
• Skatole
• Smoke Flavor
• Snakeroot Oil
• Sodium Acetate
• Sodium Benzoate
• Sodium Bicarbonate
• Sodium Carbonate
• Sodium Chloride
• Sodium Citrate
• Sodium Hydroxide
• Solanone
• Spearmint Oil
• Styrax Extract, Gum and Oil
• Sucrose Octaacetate
• Sugar Alcohols
• Sugars
• Tagetes Oil
• Tannic Acid
• Tartaric Acid
• Tea Leaf and Absolute
• alpha-Terpineol
• Terpinolene
• Terpinyl Acetate
• 5,6,7,8-Tetrahydroquinoxaline
• 1,5,5,9-Tetramethyl-13-Oxatricyclo(8.3.0.0(4,9))Tridecane
• 2,3,4,5, and 3,4,5,6-
Tetramethylethyl-Cyclohexanone
• 2,3,5,6-Tetramethylpyrazine
• Thiamine Hydrochloride
• Thiazole
• 1-Threonine
• Thyme Oil, White and Red
• Thymol
• Tobacco Extracts
• Tochopherols (mixed)
• Tolu Balsam Gum and Extract
• Tolualdehydes
• para-Tolyl 3-Methylbutyrate
• para-Tolyl Acetaldehyde
• para-Tolyl Acetate
• para-Tolyl Isobutyrate
• para-Tolyl Phenylacetate
• Triacetin
• 2-Tridecanone
• 2-Tridecenal
• Triethyl Citrate
• 3,5,5-Trimethyl -1-Hexanol
• para,alpha,alpha-Trimethylbenzyl Alcohol
• 4-(2,6,6-Trimethylcyclohex-1-
Enyl)But-2-En-4-One
• 2,6,6-Trimethylcyclohex-2-
Ene-1,4-Dione
• 2,6,6-Trimethylcyclohexa-1,
3-Dienyl Methan
• 4-(2,6,6-Trimethylcyclohexa-1,
3-Dienyl)But-2-En-4-One
• 2,2,6-Trimethylcyclohexanone
• 2,3,5-Trimethylpyrazine
• 1-Tyrosine
• delta-Undercalactone
• gamma-Undecalactone
• Undecanal
• 2-Undecanone, 1
• 0-Undecenal
• Urea
• Valencene
• Valeraldehyde
• Valerian Root Extract, Oil
and Powder
• Valeric Acid
• gamma-Valerolactone
• Valine
• Vanilla Extract And Oleoresin
• Vanillin
• Veratraldehyde
• Vetiver Oil
• Vinegar
• Violet Leaf Absolute
• Walnut Hull Extract
• Water
• Wheat Extract And Flour
• Wild Cherry Bark Extract
• Wine and Wine Sherry
• Xanthan Gum
• 3,4-Xylenol
• Yeast



I feel strongly about many things, few more than family, liberty, and electronic cigarettes. Vaping is saving my life, saving me money, and by allowing me to indulge indoors, giving me more time with my family. It makes my job easier and more comfortable.

Sounds like the kind of thing that needs to be fucking banned, or taxed into oblivion.

Suzanimal
08-08-2016, 02:39 PM
FDA begins enforcing e-cig rule

The Obama administration is now regulating electronic cigarettes.


The Food and Drug Administration's (FDA) already regulates traditional cigarettes, but the so-called deeming rule, which went into effect Monday, allows the agency to also control e-cigarettes, cigars, and hookahs.
This comes after the FDA proposed the deeming rule in 2014 and finalized it in May.

The rule prohibits stores from selling e-cigarettes in vending machines and to anyone under the age of 18.

Manufacturers will also face stricter e-cigarette labeling rules. They will be required to list health warnings on the packages and will not be allowed to market them as “light” or “mild.”

http://thehill.com/regulation/healthcare/290757-fda-begins-enforcing-e-cig-rule

Zippyjuan
08-08-2016, 05:04 PM
anyone under the age of 18.


California recently raised the smoking age to 21.

Suzanimal
08-08-2016, 05:08 PM
California recently raised the smoking age to 21.

Still 18 in GA.

ChristianAnarchist
08-08-2016, 05:50 PM
Hell I'm still waiting for them to legalize MJ here so I can open a Willie's Reserve franchise in this area and get rich...

Lucille
08-09-2016, 09:19 AM
Seething hatred. The FDA is doing this to hand the vaping market to Big Tobacco and it never ceases to amaze me how those evil clowns can destroy so many businesses with the stroke of a pen.

CONgress is worthless.

https://www.vapes.com/blogs/news/two-new-congressmen-endorse-cole-bishop-amendment-to-fda-e-cig-regulations


The Cole-Bishop amendment to the 2017 Agricultural Appropriations bill would change the grandfather date specifically for deemed products from February 15, 2007 to the effective date of the Deeming Regulation (i.e., most likely sometime in 2016). If this amendment becomes law, any nicotine-containing e-vapor products on the market as of the effective date of the final rule would be grandfathered and, although such products would still have to comply with the rest of the Tobacco Control Act, could avoid the lengthy and expensive PMTA process. Grandfathered products could also serve as predicate products for future SE Reports for new products intended to be marketed after the new grandfather date.

In addition to changing the grandfather date for deemed products, the amendment also includes language that will:


Require FDA to begin rulemaking to establish a product standard for e-vapor product batteries within 1 year of the effective date of the Deeming Regulation, and publish a final product standard for e-vapor product batteries within 2 years of the effective date of the Deeming Regulation.
Cause an e-vapor product to be considered misbranded under the FDCA if it is advertised in a newspaper, magazine, periodical, or any other publication other than an adult publication (i.e., a publication with 15% or less of its readership from readers younger than 18 years of age, and read by fewer than 2 million persons under 18 years of age).
Require retailers to sell e-vapor products in direct face-to-face exchanges without the use of any electronic or mechanical devices, such as a vending machine. This provision contains an exemption for mail-order sales (i.e., internet), and allows the use of vending machines or self-service displays if the machine or display is located in a facility where the retailer can ensure no persons under the age of 18 would be permitted to enter (i.e., adult-only facilities).
Require publication, within 1 year of the effective date of the Deeming Regulation, a regulation that would require e-vapor products to be labeled with the phrases "Keep Out of Reach of Children," and "Underage Sale Prohibited," as well as feature an accurate statement of the nicotine content of the product.
Requires retailers (e.g., vape shops) to register their establishment with FDA unless such retailer has already registered under any state or federal law.



What Next?

While it is certainly good news for the e-vapor industry, the Cole-Bishop amendment still has a long way to go before it becomes law. Both the House and the Senate will eventually have to vote on and pass the Agricultural Appropriations bill (with the amendment), which must ultimately be signed by the President. In addition, it is not yet clear when the bill will advance through Congress and make its way to the President, as recent budget bills have been passed in the final days of the previous fiscal year. It is very possible, if not probable, that the Deeming Regulation will be published before the Agricultural Appropriations bill becomes law, likely leading to additional showdowns between anti-tobacco and vaping advocates over the public health and economic impact of FDA's rule, and the need to change the grandfather date for deemed products.

Lucille
08-09-2016, 09:25 AM
http://sfata.org/what-is-the-grandfather-date-of-the-tobacco-control-act-and-how-will-it-impact-the-vapor-industry/


Although the FDA has promoted its proposed deeming rule as a reasonable regulation to protect children, the agency’s proposal would ban the sale of most nicotine vapor products on the market because the Tobacco Control Act established February 15, 2007 as the “grandfather date,” which is the date for any tobacco product regulated by Chapter IX (including newly deemed products) to be sold on the U.S. market, and avoids having companies submit (and FDA approve) a PreMarket Tobacco Application (PMTA). Virtually no vapor products were on the market at that time, so the time-consuming and expensive PMTA is the only legal pathway for all other vapor products”. This is why moving the “grandfather date” is so important. Complicating the issue, the FDA has also claimed, “We do not believe that we have the authority to alter or amend this grandfather date.”

In the originally introduced Tobacco Control Act legislation in 2004 (negotiated and agreed to by Phillip Morris, the Center for Tobacco Free Kids’ Matt Myers and then Glaxo Smith Klein lobbyist Mitch Zeller), the grandfather date was set at June 30, 2003. When the legislation was reintroduced in 2005, the grandfather date was then changed to February 15, 2005, and later to February 15, 2007 when it was reintroduced in 2007, which remained when the legislation was reintroduced, again, in 2009; probably in an attempt to ban several recently introduced smokeless tobacco products by Reynolds.

Just one e-cigarette product has been found that was on the market prior to the Tobacco Control Act’s 2007 grandfather date — a first generation e-cigar manufactured by NJOY.

But the manufacturers of an estimated 100,000+ different nicotine vapor products now on the market (including all nicotine containing e-liquids) would be required to submit a PMTA for each SKU (stock keeping unit). The FDA would have to approve the PMTA in order for the product to remain legal to market 24 months after issuance of its final rule. The FDA’s deeming regulation basically redefines all nicotine vapor products introduced since 2007 as new tobacco products, thus requiring FDA approval of a PMTA to keep these so-called “new” tobacco products legal to market to adults.
[...]
One estimate in FDA’s proposed deeming regulation probably closest to reality is the agency’s estimate that 25 PMTAs would be submitted annually for different e-cigarette products. Those PMTAs would likely to be submitted for cig-alike products by Altria, Reynolds, Imperial, BAT, PMI, JTI and perhaps NJOY. But even if FDA approved all PMTAs submitted for e-cigarettes prior to the FDA’s e-cigarette ban 24 months following final rule issuance, the agency has estimated the deeming regulation would ban >98.5% of the agency’s grossly underestimated 1,675 different e-cigarette products on the U.S. market. So the FDA has essentially acknowledged that the deeming regulation would ban nearly all e-cigarette products now on the market, and creates a new e-cigarette cartel controlled by several large manufacturers.

Suzanimal
08-09-2016, 09:25 AM
Require retailers to sell e-vapor products in direct face-to-face exchanges without the use of any electronic or mechanical devices, such as a vending machine. This provision contains an exemption for mail-order sales (i.e., internet), and allows the use of vending machines or self-service displays if the machine or display is located in a facility where the retailer can ensure no persons under the age of 18 would be permitted to enter (i.e., adult-only facilities).


Require publication, within 1 year of the effective date of the Deeming Regulation, a regulation that would require e-vapor products to be labeled with the phrases "Keep Out of Reach of Children," and "Underage Sale Prohibited," as well as feature an accurate statement of the nicotine content of the product.

Yeah, that'll keep teens from using them.:rolleyes:

Lucille
08-09-2016, 05:11 PM
Fascists.

The FDA's New Rules for E-Cigarettes Are Already Hurting Vape Shops
New regs took affect on Monday and could be too costly for small companies to compete with Big Tobacco.
https://reason.com/blog/2016/08/09/the-fdas-new-rules-for-e-cigarettes-are


There's no tobacco in electronic cigarettes. That's a fact.

But don't bring facts to the Food and Drug Administration, which on Monday officially began regulating e-cigarettes (and the businesses that make and sell them) under the provisions of the Tobacco Control Act, the 2009 giving the FDA regulatory power over tobacco products—and apparently things that sort of look and act like tobacco products too.

The consequences are already being felt at places like The Electric Cigarette Lounge in Sacramento, California, which shut its doors for good this week. The store's owner told local TV station KCRA that the FDA's rules snuffed out his business.

Andrew Osborne, the owner of Vapor Trail Electronics in Buffalo, New York, told News 4 that he expects the entire e-cigarette industry to collapse under the new federal rules.

"This is going to wipe out the e-cigarette business and leave Big Tobacco running the industry," said Chris Voudris, who owns four retail shops called Vapor Haus in Ohio, told the Dayton Daily News on Monday. "The cost of regulations will be too costly for small companies to compete."
[...]
Many e-cigarettes contain nicotine extracted from tobacco, but considering them the equivalent of cigarettes is an affront to common sense and medical science. There's no combustion, no smoke and no tar in e-cigarettes, along with fewer cancer-causing chemicals. . One study from the United Kingdom found that e-cigarettes are 95 percent safer than their combustible cousins. Driving e-cigarettes out of the marketplace, as the FDA's new rules are almost certain to do, will make it harder for nicotine-addicted smokers to kick the habit by taking up a safer alternatives.

Despite all those arguments, perhaps the best example of the absurdity of the FDA's decision to classify e-cigarettes as tobacco products is the simple fact that vaping doesn't involve tobacco. In fact, some e-cigarette makers offer "tobacco free" nicotine that is synthesized in a lab or produced from other types of plants, like tomatoes and green peppers.

In the eyes of the federal government, though, it's all tobacco—even when it's not.