View Full Version : Let the market decide- Nov 30th and TeaParty07.com
SwordOfShannarah
11-22-2007, 12:40 AM
First off I'm sorry for getting somewhat upset in the other thread. It was weak of me to react like that. TechonoRob I shouldn't tool on you for being younger, you're about 20 times more intelligent than I'll ever be. So again, I apologize.
Back to the situation at hand..
Yesterday the letter from the campaign was forwarded to me several hundred times, each beginning with some idea of what we should do. Most all of the letters fell into two camps. One was the "lets donate now" camp and the other was the "don't change the Tea Party!" camp.
Personally I think we can do both. We can mass donate on the 30th (see http://www.RudysReadingList.com) and create another media blitz. Because TeaParty07.com is in place we can direct the traffic and attention from the RudysReadingList.com blitz into TeaParty07.com.
Some people can only afford to donate once and we'll lose them if they donate on the 30th, but the buzz we create should bring in enough Ron Paul supporters to fill the missing donors. So, after the 30th we simply pick things up and move forward with the TeaParty. That's a win/win and I would love to see that happen.
**
However- the true, best and really only way to deal with this is just to "let the market decide". For all of you who say, "We should only have the Tea Party day!". You want to force all the people who want to donate sooner to your will. That's not right. And for all of you who say, "We should all donate now!". You want to force all those who want to save and donate to the Tea Party to your will, and that's not right.
So the only real solution is the most simple. Put both sites out there and let the market decide. Maybe both days will be successful, maybe only one. That's up to the collective conscious now. I can't tell you what to do because when I do half of you get angry with me, and if I change my mind to satisfy the other side then then once again half of you get angry with me.
So there we have it, both sites are up (I'm adding graphics and banners for http://www.RudysReadingList.com shortly) and you can promote both, one or none. It's all up to you and that's the way it has been and should be.
In the end I think we have to admit.. it would be best if we could make both events hugely successful. There can be no complaints with winning twice. But again- it is what it is and will be what it will be. It's up to you now..
jamesmadison
11-22-2007, 12:44 AM
I see no reason to donate now and I would imagine the campaign still has cash on hand and will have cash on hand in a month. Especially since they have raised about 400k in the last few days.
Is there reason to suspect that the campaign will run out of cash by dec. 16th and if so what are they spending the money on?
You have to understand that people are giving their own money and most need some time to save. If you don't understand this, you don't deserve money. People are hard working and want change but they don't want to sacrafice food. Give it some time.
Nov. 30th is not even a month from Nov. 5th.
Not sure why the campaign sent out a letter.
Seems irresponsible.
mport1
11-22-2007, 12:44 AM
I really like this idea. There are just a ton of positives and negatives to each side of this thing and I think letting the market decide is a good idea. I also think getting a good but civil discussion out there will help us decide the best course of action. Truth is we don't know how things are going to turn out and there are good points to both arguments.
McDermit
11-22-2007, 12:45 AM
bleh
Skeeterbug73
11-22-2007, 12:48 AM
Nov 30 theme is to negative for me. I will donate from time to time until Dec 16 and hopefully max out then.
Ozwest
11-22-2007, 12:48 AM
Let it be... Let it be...
Shaun
11-22-2007, 12:51 AM
Good solution at this point Trevor.
Smart. It's natural law, but please guys; realise that your chance to be part of history is to push the 16th far and wide. If Trevor and team raise the 10m on the 16th, the system changes forever. PERIOD. Frank and Sean are completely and totally ****E*. And that's priceless, right?
Austin
11-22-2007, 12:52 AM
Meh.. I think a general encouragement to donate now, as well as save some extra ammunition for 16th, would have worked better.
I don't think we will raise the 10,000,000 anymore. Bummer.
Flirple
11-22-2007, 12:54 AM
I approve this message.
Meh.. I think a general encouragement to donate now, as well as save some extra ammunition for 16th, would have worked better.
I don't think we will raise the 10,000,000 anymore. Bummer.
I am pretty sure we will raise over $6 million.
mport1
11-22-2007, 12:55 AM
This should work out well. Hopefully we will raise a good chunk on the 30th, raise some money for the campaign, make some news, and then have a HUGE day on the 16th.
jamesmadison
11-22-2007, 12:55 AM
10m is possible and probable.
jamesmadison
11-22-2007, 12:57 AM
This should work out well. Hopefully we will raise a good chunk on the 30th, raise some money for the campaign, make some news, and then have a HUGE day on the 16th.
30th is irrelevant and stupid.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. Shannan isn't thinking logically. If you were forcing someone to donate that implies use of physical force - we're using information to try to arrive at the best outcome.
The best outcome possible is the 16th.
If the campaign runs out of cash that's their problem. Allocate funds better.
Richandler
11-22-2007, 12:59 AM
The problem with the 16th is not that we'll run out of money by then it's that there is no time to spend the money for anything helpful in the states we've been non-stop campaigning in. The campaign now has regular people to pay and regular rents too. There has to constantly be a surplus of money unless they wanted to go into debt like McCain. Being able to buy a 10 million dollar block of advertising in the beginning of december will allow us to compete with Romney. Holding back means the campaign has to remain conservative runing ads that you guys complain about. Don't critisize the campaign if you aren't willing to give them money to change now. The 16th will be to late to get commercials produced and seen. The media will no cover us until we are polling in the high teens or win one of the early states. The money bomb wore out its media coverage and reached the audience it will reach.
NewEnd
11-22-2007, 01:01 AM
Meh.. I think a general encouragement to donate now, as well as save some extra ammunition for 16th, would have worked better.
I don't think we will raise the 10,000,000 anymore. Bummer.
neither do I. I think this email cost the campagin over $2 million, that will not be recovered, now or later.
Ozwest
11-22-2007, 01:02 AM
30th is irrelevant and stupid.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. Shannan isn't thinking logically. If you were forcing someone to donate that implies use of physical force - we're using information to try to arrive at the best outcome.
The best outcome possible is the 16th.
If the campaign runs out of cash that's their problem. Allocate funds better.
It is your perogative to donate when, and if, you want to, but most are prepared to compromise, and adapt to the campaigns suggestions. Most of us are kinda pissed off too, but that's no excuse to throw a tantrum.
Shatterhand
11-22-2007, 01:03 AM
I like this idea of two money bombs. But would it be better to have a different title for the Nov. 30th website that doesn't include the name of another candidate? Something positive that relates to Ron Paul and the Freedom message? There is a nice photo of Dr. Paul up to bat/playing baseball. Maybe that could be used? Something like home run for Ron Paul?
jamesmadison
11-22-2007, 01:03 AM
neither do I. I think this email cost the campagin over $2 million, that will not be recovered, now or later.
The email didn't change anything.
Nov. 5th was purely grassroots except for one email. Dec. 16th will be grassroots as well.
Do not give the campaign credit for Nov. 5th as if they were highly involved.
Dec. 16th will go as planned.
Austin
11-22-2007, 01:03 AM
30th is irrelevant and stupid.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. Shannan isn't thinking logically. If you were forcing someone to donate that implies use of physical force - we're using information to try to arrive at the best outcome.
The best outcome possible is the 16th.
If the campaign runs out of cash that's their problem. Allocate funds better.
Eh, I wouldn't go as far as to say that... I think so long as the push for the 30th isn't overwhelmingly strong, we should be OK. I guess the biggest thing I am concerned about is the lack of unity, because without unity there will inevitably be abandonment.
With that said, I don't see the push for the 30th somehow overcoming the push for the 16th, which would point toward success for the 16th. It'd be nice for a little 1 million dollar day on the 30th, and then an 8 million dollar on the 16th.
I would have personally preferred it be a single $10mil day on the 16th, but I'm not incredibly worried at the turnout.
We must avoid conflict. If commotion is created because of this, Ron Paul will be the one being hurt in the end.
Shaun
11-22-2007, 01:05 AM
30,000 pledges will raise 10m. Take that to the bank.
Extrapolating from the Nov 5th assumes linear response to this event, it makes no allowance for the non-linear opportunistic response that the event is bound to create due to massive advance PR from the offline as well as online commnunties. In other words; unlike the last event, people are watching this one. A lot of people are watching it. We can't compare the two events. There will be a sense by Dec 16th that this could be the last big push for RP to move into the number one spot as a media celeb by stunning the media with one simple, but NEVER BEFORE asked question that they are now forced to ask..." Why is it that the number one money raiser for the GOP isn't leading in the NH or Iowa polls.." As soon as they ask this question...BOOM! That goes viral and our man is everywhere.
Remember the basic truth of US political behaviour..
" The guy who can raise the most money wins..."
DC believes this, when we do it on the 16TH, our guy goes to the front of the pack.
And then we can collectively say..
F*** YOU FRANK!
American
11-22-2007, 01:07 AM
Then donate on the 30th, but those who are almost maxed and those who just dont have the money and donate this will dilute the teaparty fund raiser. But hey you go right ahead and attempt to so so day or one big day.
RP still has 40% of the money he has raised already, what is the fucking rush.
mport1
11-22-2007, 01:10 AM
I wish the campaign would just take out some loans if they want to use the funds now to advertise. They are pretty much guaranteed to get paid back later. This would solve all of our problems.
Karrl
11-22-2007, 01:11 AM
a physical force is necessarily physical....and then there is what one can do with their will (fulness), which is not physical. I might harangue someone into doing something which they really wouldnt have done otherwise....without ever having touched them!!
Bomb away on Nov 30th!! and Dec 16th!!
SwordOfShannarah
11-22-2007, 01:14 AM
I like this idea of two money bombs. But would it be better to have a different title for the Nov. 30th website that doesn't include the name of another candidate? Something positive that relates to Ron Paul and the Freedom message? There is a nice photo of Dr. Paul up to bat/playing baseball. Maybe that could be used? Something like home run for Ron Paul?
If you want to throw some themes out there that's cool.. but it may pay to wait until RudysReadingList.com has some graphics (not that I want Yoshi to work twice! Thanks Yoshi!) to see the idea in a better light.
I chose this because it is one of Ron Paul's campaign positions, it is an attack against the "front runner" and because of all the objections to Ron Paul held within the current republican base the stance on the war is the strongest. If we can change their minds about the war on terror I think Ron Paul will win.
davidhperry
11-22-2007, 01:16 AM
This is a great idea - thanks again for working so hard to pull this stuff together.
Menthol Patch
11-22-2007, 01:17 AM
I see no reason to donate now and I would imagine the campaign still has cash on hand and will have cash on hand in a month. Especially since they have raised about 400k in the last few days.
Is there reason to suspect that the campaign will run out of cash by dec. 16th and if so what are they spending the money on?
You have to understand that people are giving their own money and most need some time to save. If you don't understand this, you don't deserve money. People are hard working and want change but they don't want to sacrafice food. Give it some time.
Nov. 30th is not even a month from Nov. 5th.
Not sure why the campaign sent out a letter.
Seems irresponsible.
The fact of the matter is that Ron Paul needs more money ASAP if he is to win in the early primary states.
Ozwest
11-22-2007, 01:20 AM
It would be a big call to ignore HQ's request for a quick cash injection. It is too risky to second guess them at this crucial time... Sure, I believe it will effect the final outcome of total monies contributed and the amount of publicity Ron Paul may have received, but if we don't get with the program, and the boards are alight with bickering , people will go right off donating... HQ gets the benefit of the doubt one more time... One more time... Suck it up for Liberty.
I did not buy many of the points made in the campaign email.
They're going to get $10M on Dec. 16, and LIKE IT. :D
That said, I did my duty and sent em $100 in response to the email. But I'm going to send quite a bit more on the 16th.
Shatterhand
11-22-2007, 01:25 AM
If you want to throw some themes out there that's cool.. but it may pay to wait until RudysReadingList.com has some graphics (not that I want Yoshi to work twice! Thanks Yoshi!) to see the idea in a better light.
I chose this because it is one of Ron Paul's campaign positions, it is an attack against the "front runner" and because of all the objections to Ron Paul held within the current republican base the stance on the war is the strongest. If we can change their minds about the war on terror I think Ron Paul will win.
Yeah, good point. I look forward to seeing the graphics. Thanks for all your hard work.
Delaware
11-22-2007, 01:27 AM
Both, there is enough people and enough time to donate at least a few million each day.
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 01:30 AM
Letting the market decide makes no sense. Market economics only work when you are competing for something. Are we suppose to be competing with each other? How does that help us break records?
If we keep spreading this too thin, it's going to fall apart
Austin
11-22-2007, 01:30 AM
If you want to throw some themes out there that's cool.. but it may pay to wait until RudysReadingList.com has some graphics (not that I want Yoshi to work twice! Thanks Yoshi!) to see the idea in a better light.
I chose this because it is one of Ron Paul's campaign positions, it is an attack against the "front runner" and because of all the objections to Ron Paul held within the current republican base the stance on the war is the strongest. If we can change their minds about the war on terror I think Ron Paul will win.
When you look at from this perspective, it makes me almost want to donate on the 30th. :p
I can support the 30th if it exposes more people to the truth about the war on terror. However, I still do not think the 30th should be pushed all that hard, with the exception of the few days prior to the date.
Austin
11-22-2007, 01:31 AM
Letting the market decide makes no sense. Market economics only work when you are competing for something. Are we suppose to be competing with each other? How does that help us break records?
If we keep spreading this too thin, it's going to fall apart
Kind of sounds like we are adopting the policy that the good doctor is opposing. :p
Ivanelterrible
11-22-2007, 01:32 AM
Encourage people to donate more regularly, and save up for a big 16th. The point really isnt so much the money as it is the media, in my opinion, and the media will only really focus on us if we have a huge 16th.
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 01:35 AM
Kind of sounds like we are adopting the policy that the good doctor is opposing. :p
It's tantamount to saying that each country should go to war with each other to weed out the weak instead of just combining forces.
devil21
11-22-2007, 01:36 AM
I can't see how RP's campaign would be near broke by now. That makes NO sense. With all due respect (and I mean that honestly), I don't see how diverting momentum to another "random" day makes any sense after publicizing it (in the USA TODAY FOR F*&KS SAKE! All hail llepard!). In the end, it all counts on the FEC website but I dont get the point of all this since there is no way Ron Paul's campaign would be broke now.
Ozwest
11-22-2007, 01:40 AM
Letting the market decide makes no sense. Market economics only work when you are competing for something. Are we suppose to be competing with each other? How does that help us break records?
If we keep spreading this too thin, it's going to fall apart
The whole point, is that no one is competing, each person is free to donate the "sweat off their brow" in whatever manner they please.
Flirple
11-22-2007, 01:40 AM
I like this idea of two money bombs. But would it be better to have a different title for the Nov. 30th website that doesn't include the name of another candidate? Something positive that relates to Ron Paul and the Freedom message? There is a nice photo of Dr. Paul up to bat/playing baseball. Maybe that could be used? Something like home run for Ron Paul?
I hear you but I like the idea of shinning more light on the philosophical differences between Ron and Rudy. I think Ron's challenge to Rudy never received the attention it deserved because at the time Ron was still a nobody to the media. This will be a chance to put this reading assignment back on the map and really contrast the differences between the 2 candidates.
And earlier someone mentioned that they felt like Trevor wasn't thinking logically. Regardless if you agree with this approach or not, I think he has more than proved that he not only listens to the many conflicting points of view but also proceeds thoughtfully. But at the same time, he is demonstrating leadership. And in the end he is right, the market knows best and will decide.
TheEvilDetector
11-22-2007, 01:40 AM
30th is irrelevant and stupid.
No one is forcing anyone to do anything. Shannan isn't thinking logically. If you were forcing someone to donate that implies use of physical force - we're using information to try to arrive at the best outcome.
The best outcome possible is the 16th.
If the campaign runs out of cash that's their problem. Allocate funds better.
That's a bit harsh don't you think, considering that part of the reason why cash flow is so slow is due to folks saving up for the money bomb.
McDermit
11-22-2007, 01:41 AM
*sigh*
The 30th sucks. And so does Bydlak.
TheEvilDetector
11-22-2007, 01:42 AM
30,000 pledges will raise 10m. Take that to the bank.
Extrapolating from the Nov 5th assumes linear response to this event, it makes no allowance for the non-linear opportunistic response that the event is bound to create due to massive advance PR from the offline as well as online commnunties. In other words; unlike the last event, people are watching this one. A lot of people are watching it. We can't compare the two events. There will be a sense by Dec 16th that this could be the last big push for RP to move into the number one spot as a media celeb by stunning the media with one simple, but NEVER BEFORE asked question that they are now forced to ask..." Why is it that the number one money raiser for the GOP isn't leading in the NH or Iowa polls.." As soon as they ask this question...BOOM! That goes viral and our man is everywhere.
Remember the basic truth of US political behaviour..
" The guy who can raise the most money wins..."
DC believes this, when we do it on the 16TH, our guy goes to the front of the pack.
And then we can collectively say..
F*** YOU FRANK!
30,000 will raise 7 mil roughly I think.
I am basing this on 18,000 bringin in 4.2mil on 5th Nov.
SwordOfShannarah
11-22-2007, 01:46 AM
Letting the market decide makes no sense. Market economics only work when you are competing for something. Are we suppose to be competing with each other? How does that help us break records?
If we keep spreading this too thin, it's going to fall apart
Well perhaps then this is a matter of semantics. Maybe I should have said, "Let free will decide". In the end if you decide for everyone what is right you still have the problem of how to force everyone to do the same thing. It won't work, the best you can do is present your arguments for one side of the issue and hope they make so much sense they spread like wildfire.
30,000 pledges will raise 10m. Take that to the bank.
Extrapolating from the Nov 5th assumes linear response to this event, it makes no allowance for the non-linear opportunistic response that the event is bound to create due to massive advance PR from the offline as well as online commnunties. In other words; unlike the last event, people are watching this one. A lot of people are watching it. We can't compare the two events. There will be a sense by Dec 16th that this could be the last big push for RP to move into the number one spot as a media celeb by stunning the media with one simple, but NEVER BEFORE asked question that they are now forced to ask..." Why is it that the number one money raiser for the GOP isn't leading in the NH or Iowa polls.." As soon as they ask this question...BOOM! That goes viral and our man is everywhere.
Remember the basic truth of US political behaviour..
" The guy who can raise the most money wins..."
DC believes this, when we do it on the 16TH, our guy goes to the front of the pack.
And then we can collectively say..
F*** YOU FRANK!
Well said!
On Nov 5th, most people were just sitting back and watching to see what would happen. When the money started pouring in, few had prepared for it and just went with the buzz, perhaps sending out a few emails, calling some friends etc.
This time there are many many more people out there promoting the event and thinking of ways to leverage the buzz that it generates. I expect there will be stories in many media, including the mainstream talking up Dec 16th as one to watch for campaign raising history as $10 million estimates flood in.
That kind of buzz in advance would guarantee over $10 mill. We must flood digg, youtube, media email boxes and anything else we can think of in couple of days before Dec 16th. As we know, more and more Old Media has become the reporter of the internet. If we draw their attention to the buzz we can get them to co-promote it.
ronpaulyourmom
11-22-2007, 01:50 AM
The whole idea of the 16th is to raise a shit-ton of money, so much that people who had written us off see the headline, become intrigued and ask themselves...
"How could so many people donate to this guy, what makes them believe so deeply or why is there a disconnect with what I've heard about this guy being a longshot not worth consideration?"
And then they start to think that they owe it to us to at least humor the man with a second-look.
Ozwest
11-22-2007, 01:50 AM
Well said!
On Nov 5th, most people were just sitting back and watching to see what would happen. When the money started pouring in, few had prepared for it and just went with the buzz, perhaps sending out a few emails, calling some friends etc.
This time there are many many more people out there promoting the event and thinking of ways to leverage the buzz that it generates. I expect there will be stories in many media, including the mainstream talking up Dec 16th as one to watch for campaign raising history as $10 million estimates flood in.
That kind of buzz in advance would guarantee over $10 mill. We must flood digg, youtube, media email boxes and anything else we can think of in couple of days before Dec 16th. As we know, more and more Old Media has become the reporter of the internet. If we draw their attention to the buzz we can get them to co-promote it.
Good post.
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 01:55 AM
I hear you but I like the idea of shinning more light on the philosophical differences between Ron and Rudy. I think Ron's challenge to Rudy never received the attention it deserved because at the time Ron was still a nobody to the media. This will be a chance to put this reading assignment back on the map and really contrast the differences between the 2 candidates.
And earlier someone mentioned that they felt like Trevor wasn't thinking logically. Regardless if you agree with this approach or not, I think he has more than proved that he not only listens to the many conflicting points of view but also proceeds thoughtfully. But at the same time, he is demonstrating leadership. And in the end he is right, the market knows best and will decide.
He's completely wrong though, were in competition with other candidates, not each other. We beat them by coming together and getting competitive, not by separating and doing own thing.
jrich4rpaul
11-22-2007, 01:57 AM
Option 3) Blitzing other campaign's money bombs!
The Tea Party certainly cannot be forgotten. It was going to be huge up until that damn email, we cant just give up on it. But yes, they need money now as well, so do what ya'll want.
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 01:59 AM
I can't believe the campaign would sabotage the grassroots...what the fuck were they thinking?
McDermit
11-22-2007, 02:00 AM
Well, I hope "the market" decides to boycott the 30th, because this nonsense is only further hurting the 16th campaign.
We WEREN'T competing with each other, but now thanks to Bydlak's incompetence and lack of forsight and Trevor's decision to run with another site, we are.
There should absolutely not be any concentrated donation day aside from the 16th. Any other day will detract from the effort. If you want to donate today, do it. If you want to donate on the 28th, great! But don't go trying to do another money bomb. Just donate on your own.
There's no stopping the 16th. Other ideas will bring money in here and there, but the 16th is the BOMB - that's just how it's going to happen. We can worry about the email hurting that momentum, but come the 16th, we're all going to be glued to our screens.
What's hurting now is sort of a dead news cycle. Not many appearances on TV, no debates... we're in a dead spot.
Mark37snj
11-22-2007, 02:10 AM
In the past 2 days we raised 372,919.07! Thats pretty good. No need to uproot December 16th with a competitor. We need the 16th to be BIG. That will buy us more free press than any other competing fund raiser will deliver after its spent and that free press will be before the first primary. At the most I say we do another "Lets Beat *Establishment Politician* Money Bomb Today" Day, But leave the 16th alone. Besides, did anyone consider that the campaign is just challenging us? We are Ron Paul Patriots, we were born to be challenged!!! We just got a little sluggish and the campaign gave us a little tune up. VROOOMMMMMM ;)
SwordOfShannarah
11-22-2007, 02:12 AM
Well, I hope "the market" decides to boycott the 30th, because this nonsense is only further hurting the 16th campaign.
We WEREN'T competing with each other, but now thanks to Bydlak's incompetence and lack of forsight and Trevor's decision to run with another site, we are.
There should absolutely not be any concentrated donation day aside from the 16th. Any other day will detract from the effort. If you want to donate today, do it. If you want to donate on the 28th, great! But don't go trying to do another money bomb. Just donate on your own.
Woah partner! I didn't decide to run with the other site. I state clearly that I received hundreds of emails expressing a desire to donate earlier. I am only allowing them to do what they want to do in a group fashion. This is not my decision. I have no right to tell people they can't join together and try to create an earlier money bomb day if they want to. They have asked that I create this site for them and because I want to keep their trust I have done so. That's all there is to it.
SwordOfShannarah
11-22-2007, 02:13 AM
He's completely wrong though, were in competition with other candidates, not each other. We beat them by coming together and getting competitive, not by separating and doing own thing.
Please stop twisting words and pinning this on me. I've explained it very clearly and most here get it. See above post for explanation.
TheEvilDetector
11-22-2007, 02:37 AM
Please stop twisting words and pinning this on me. I've explained it very clearly and most here get it. See above post for explanation.
Trevor, I think you have settled for a very sensible position in this matter
(btw thanks for removing the link on the teaparty site relating to the campaign email).
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 02:41 AM
Please stop twisting words and pinning this on me. I've explained it very clearly and most here get it. See above post for explanation.
Your words weren't twisted, you just seem to think it's better for us to compete against each other instead of against the neo-cons. It's becoming Paul camp A, versus Paul camp B, versus Huckabee camp, versus romney camp, versus rudy camp, etc.
I don't see how pitting us against each other in a mini-market when we have the main market to compete in still.
Answer this: How can they be short on funds already when they weren't expecting anything near what they are getting on regular days...let alone what happened on the 5th??? I think they are getting greedy and sloppy
Flirple
11-22-2007, 02:46 AM
He's completely wrong though, were in competition with other candidates, not each other. We beat them by coming together and getting competitive, not by separating and doing own thing.
I don't think we are disagreeing all that much. Of course we are all working toward the same goal just like a backup quarterback is on the same team as the starter and they both want the team to win. But internal competition is a sign of a healthy movement.
I for one am not taking my eye off promoting the 16th. It is THE day. I am just viewing the 30th as being a similar compliment to the 5th as the Nov. 11th was. That is, a complimentary day that people were free to take or leave. We all still understood that Nov. 5th was going to be the dominant day that got our attention. But the 11th raised a few hundred thousand dollars more.
Bydlok's letter/Huckabee's money sparkler competition raised a few hundred thousand dollars and we are on track to make this one of the better fund raising weeks (excluding the week of the 5th and the 11th of course). Throw in a healthy yet not overwhelming day on the 30th and we are in very good shape while we will still have another 2 weeks before the 16th.
Maybe we should just set a modest goal for the 30th. Maybe something in the $200,000-$500,000 range?
hawkeyenick
11-22-2007, 02:51 AM
Truthfully, there has to be a compromise if the division of supporters is to ever stop.
Maybe just promote competition money bomb days along the way (acknowleding that they are not the main event at the same time), while still pimping the 16th. We all know it's going to be smaller now with our eyes off of the ball, but it can still turn out nice.
Super tuesday is much more important than Iowa, and it's in February. Iowa is not going to be won, I'm guaranteeing it. I live in Iowa, and the support just isn't here yet.
AdoubleR
11-22-2007, 04:59 AM
Best answer to this question I've heard!
LibertyEagle
11-22-2007, 05:18 AM
I like this idea of two money bombs. But would it be better to have a different title for the Nov. 30th website that doesn't include the name of another candidate? Something positive that relates to Ron Paul and the Freedom message? There is a nice photo of Dr. Paul up to bat/playing baseball. Maybe that could be used? Something like home run for Ron Paul?
+1, if you guys really think adding yet another bomb is a good idea.
Personally, I do not. If you add another one, it takes focus off the one on the 16th. That is, if you want that one to be really big and I know everyone does. Big events like this cause people to contribute that may not do it otherwise and those who were already planning to, contribute more than they had planned, because they get caught up in the excitement. You know it's true.
RonPaulGetsIt
11-22-2007, 05:21 AM
We have only scratched the surface in getting donors out of the tens of millions out there who would love Dr. Pauls message but don't know it exists yet.
The simple truth is the earlier the money gets to the campaign, the more advertising they can do, and the sooner we can have these people on board. Plus the free advertising the fundraising itself provides.
We have to stop thinking there is a finate amount of funds available to tap here. This is the argument made by those who only want the teaparty and nothing else. I'm telling you everyone could max out on the 30th and we could and will still break all records on Dec 16th with new donors. It is almost a month away. To win this election we need millions upon millions to know there is another way, a better way - not just the 18,000 signed up at the teaparty.
Donate all you can now - or Nov 30th - and think of it like you are a founding father in the birth of this revolution. If it means you can't partcipate in the teaparty because you are broke or maxed out, you can still sit back and enjoy the fun knowing you we a part of it because you set the groundwork sending in your money early.
jaj1701
11-22-2007, 05:21 AM
+1
No other canidate mentioned would be my preference as well.
disciple
11-22-2007, 05:28 AM
I am going to contribute some on november 30th and double the amount for the tea party.
That settles it for me.
Cyclone
11-22-2007, 05:58 AM
If anyone splits their donations up and donates on both days you destroy what the 16th will do for us. Nothing for the 30th. All for the 16th. Do not let the best marketing tool in history get derailed by a bunch of whining children at the Ron Paul campaign.
Do you remember when they needed to have 8 million by the end of November? Well, we are up to 9 million right now. So either they lied then or are lying now.
A million bucks donated on Nov.30 gets no publicity, and buys almost no airtime. But, that million added to whatever we can get on Dec 16 makes us headlines, airtime, news articles, discussions over the water cooler, I can't even begin to tell you.
If we bring in 9 million on the 16th but it could have been ten because of the 30th, we hurt the campaign. If we bring in 3.4 million on the 16th we look like chumps if it could have been another 4.4 but for the 30th.
Another 4.4 million dollar day will get talked about. But if it somehow drops under that, then the story will be, well, I guess Ron Paul's steam engine is slowing down. If that happens and it could have been avoided because of the 30th, then we are stupid, stupid, stupid.
If you have any amount of money left in your bank account that you can give to Ron Paul and you are not maxed out, then give it all to him on the 16th. I am not even buying anymore supplies until then. We have to dump the motherload on the 16th!
If some of you folks here have 200 that you can donate, then it must be on the 16th, if you have 1000, then it must be on the 16th.
Can you imagine what will happen in the world if we get 20 million dollars that day? We can, but only if we all give everything left that we have to give on the 16th. To heck with one hundred, we need one thousand from everyone! That is if you have it.
Diluting the 16th makes no sense, does not help the campaign at all, and don't listen to their whining about needing the money now. They have a million dollars MORE than they said they needed. Let them worry about it. Let them have some fund raisers. Let them put up a way for American abroad to donate on the website like Obama has and our supporters have been BEGGING for for months. Yes, we have people who have money, who are overseas, and have been begging the campaign for a way to donate online. So far, the campaign is too busy to get to it. Well, maybe if we all hold off they will get unbusy.
We begged them to tell Myspace folks about the Nov.5 day because it would be easy for them to, they refused. Dozens of us spent hundreds of hours doing what they could have done with one click.
Let them update their myspace page like we keep asking them to.
We need to do what we do best - run this campaign the way it needs to be run. If it weren't for us, Ron Paul would not have a sign up in this country! He would be nowhere.
We have some smart marketing folks on this site and we all saw what happened last time.
We will not get coverage for a 4 million dollar day and a ten million dollar day two weeks later. The media will get bored. It will only cover the first smaller one. They are going to get tired of reporting money bombs. So do we want them to cover a whimper or a shout from the top of a mountain?
Please, I beg you, do not split up your donations. We need it all on the 16th as we hit primary season. They are trying for money to get some coverage in ONE state. If we get the money on the 16th to be huge we will get coverage in 50 states! I can find one in 20 who has heard of Ron Paul in my state because it is not a focus state. Before the Nov. 5 thing I couldn't find one in 100. We need coverage in ALL states. If Iowa sees how much money Ron Paul brings in on the 16th don't you think that will be a little better advertising than some lame ad?
BOSTON TEA PARTY! LET'S HAVE ANOTHER REVOLUTION!
disciple
11-22-2007, 06:07 AM
You can always contribute on the 30th without diminishing your contributions for the tea party for those who can afford to.
In this way, both goals are met and everyone is happy.
GHoeberX
11-22-2007, 07:21 AM
I approve this message.
But does Chuck Norris approve it as well? :D
On-topic: let the market decide is perfectly fine with me. But then I hope you (Trevor) won't use the TeaParty07 mailinglist for this purpose either.
Drknows
11-22-2007, 07:32 AM
if we're going to make the 30th happen, lets make it happen BIG. no sense in letting the chips fall where they may.
EDIT just seen a poll in another thread looks like the "market" has already decided the 16th.
Thomas Paine
11-22-2007, 07:48 AM
Let's hit get that meter on the Ron Paul website up to $10M by end of November and "double down" on Tea Party day. I don't see why we can't raise $10M on Tea Party day. I plan on donating a $100 plus on Tea Party day and I haven't indicated my donative intent until now and I suspect that I am not the only one.
BrianH
11-22-2007, 08:03 AM
I'm for the Nov 30th- on the heals of the Florida debate. The end of year projection at http://www.ronpaulgraphs.com/full_quarter.html is between 12-17 million.
And the Dec 16th projection looks set to be double Nov 5th http://www.ronpaulgraphs.com/teaparty_vs_nov5_members.html.
So that would bring the year end to well over $20 million IMO. But that's 3 days from the Iowa Primary. There's huge amounts of promotion needed. There's massive apathy in the GOP faithful in Iowa according to this report in the Washington Post yesterday:
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/11/20/AR2007112002302.html
Excerpt:
"How many of you are disgusted with politics?" asks Bob Vander Plaats, another Huckabee man and a lunch regular.
All hands shoot up.
"We don't attend political meetings to find out what's going on in the community," bemoaned Gordon Greene, a county supervisor. "It's extremely disturbing that people don't even take enough interest in their local government . . . "
"Part of the disheartening feeling I have is not just the lack of the ideal candidate, but the optimistic views of the other side, the Democrats' view of their prospects," added Gene Johnson, a Wells employee.
They pledge to vote in the general election even if they skip the caucuses and are resigned to the fact that they may have to vote for -- in their words -- "the lesser of two evils."
All we need to convert the massive numbers of independants, democrats and apathetic republicans in Iowa to win this. And we can according to this Zogby poll:
http://truthseeds.org/2007/11/19/ron-paul-wins-latest-zogby-poll/
But we need more pubicity in Iowa and more pubicity around the national campaign.
Keep promoting promoting promoting. I'm going out to post slim jims to billboards...
.
I think the fact that everyone has risen up and answered the challenge
to donate as you can,
while just putting a few dollars away a week, a couple less drinks,
to save enough for Dec 16th, for The Party of Tea,
is just great!
.
What could be more perfect than replenishing the till
as the campaign approved by Ron Paul gets the bill?
.
Maybe that's "what more" we can do.
Spend less save more, donate a bit as it comes in the door.
.
Liberty
11-22-2007, 08:27 AM
Truthfully, there has to be a compromise if the division of supporters is to ever stop.
Maybe just promote competition money bomb days along the way (acknowleding that they are not the main event at the same time), while still pimping the 16th. We all know it's going to be smaller now with our eyes off of the ball, but it can still turn out nice.
Super tuesday is much more important than Iowa, and it's in February. Iowa is not going to be won, I'm guaranteeing it. I live in Iowa, and the support just isn't here yet.
Ron Paul supporters from other states are paying for various means of advertising in Iowa and working their as*es off trying to improve Ron's numbers there.
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