PDA

View Full Version : Plato's allegory of the cave and how it applies today




Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-21-2013, 05:58 PM
In Plato's allegory of the cave, he spoke of all the world of Greece living in a dark cave, himself included, with all of them quite content in being deceived into believing that the shadows being projected upon the walls were made up of a real substance.
He then spoke of a stranger entering from above descending to grab a hold of him to pull him up out of the cave against his nature, struggling mightily, encouraging him after exiting outside to quit sheltering his face with his hands, and then pointing his attention up towards a light in the sky.
In other words, Plato is saying here that Socrates showed him the true light. Not only that, but in all the world of Greece, Socrates and he were the only ones who saw this light clearly as he didn't mention anything about Aristotle or any other also seeing this light.
After seeing what was the true source of light, Plato then went back down into the cave to understand how the shadows the people believed weren't made up of a substance. Instead, figurines were being manipulated behind lit candles to project shadows, a false reality, upon the walls of the cave.
In order words, Plato is describing an animation. As lit candles were being utilized to fool the people into remaining in the cave and from ever bettering themselves by rising up to leave towards the true light, someone mysterious behind the scenes had to be manipulating those candles.
Aristotle was later brought to trial by these deceivers, wasn't he, as he wasn't as careful as Plato in his later reasonings?
Figure if Plato wasn't addressing any living person in the Greek world during this time when he was writing this allegory, then who? I would think he is addressing future generations. As a writer of fiction, Plato never concluded. Instead, he always had for his main idea the two dialectics developed by Socrates and himself. It must have been really lonely for him as he didn't expect anyone living during his time to understand the significance in his writings, Aristotle included. I say Aristotle didn't fully understand Plato because of the way the student never bothered to finish any of his works to form.
On another level, Plato utilized his allegory of the cave to describe how one could reduce in their reasoning the question of what is light to a formal level doing so sufficiently to understand that it comes from the sun. Indeed, he wrote on many levels. But these many levels he wrote on were intended to shield him from the backwards people of Greece, these being the same ones who Democratically sentenced Socrates to either having to leave Greece or putting himself to death by drinking poison.
Most people are still living in a cave today. They still are being deceived by the shadows that our news media are casting on the walls. They don't see the true light.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2013, 04:52 PM
Bump
When discussing The Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution, Americans should be as Socrates would have been if he were alive today by constantly reducing back to our Founding Fathers. In other words, in the United States, while The Declaration of Independence was written as a formal divorce from tyranny establishing a new order, the U.S. Constitution was written as a new marriage to a more perfect Union. To achieve this, they abolished every prior legal precedence by turning to natural law, the scientific method in use during their day, to establish self evident and unalienable truths.
Therefore, within the United States, the new order in The Declaration of Independence should take precedence over the laws established within the U.S. Constitution. This is the only way the U.S. Constitution will remain preserved.
As I've often said, the greatest of benefits are derived from the most precious of alterations. This is in contrast to the present emotional movement of hoping unto darkness and espousing change for the sake of it.

PaulConventionWV
01-23-2013, 05:41 PM
In Plato's allegory of the cave, he spoke of all the world of Greece living in a dark cave, himself included, with all of them quite content in being deceived into believing that the shadows being projected upon the walls were made up of a real substance.
He then spoke of a stranger entering from above descending to grab a hold of him to pull him up out of the cave against his nature, struggling mightily, encouraging him after exiting outside to quit sheltering his face with his hands, and then pointing his attention up towards a light in the sky.
In other words, Plato is saying here that Socrates showed him the true light. Not only that, but in all the world of Greece, Socrates and he were the only ones who saw this light clearly as he didn't mention anything about Aristotle or any other also seeing this light.
After seeing what was the true source of light, Plato then went back down into the cave to understand how the shadows the people believed weren't made up of a substance. Instead, figurines were being manipulated behind lit candles to project shadows, a false reality, upon the walls of the cave.
In order words, Plato is describing an animation. As lit candles were being utilized to fool the people into remaining in the cave and from ever bettering themselves by rising up to leave towards the true light, someone mysterious behind the scenes had to be manipulating those candles.
Aristotle was later brought to trial by these deceivers, wasn't he, as he wasn't as careful as Plato in his later reasonings?
Figure if Plato wasn't addressing any living person in the Greek world during this time when he was writing this allegory, then who? I would think he is addressing future generations. As a writer of fiction, Plato never concluded. Instead, he always had for his main idea the two dialectics developed by Socrates and himself. It must have been really lonely for him as he didn't expect anyone living during his time to understand the significance in his writings, Aristotle included. I say Aristotle didn't fully understand Plato because of the way the student never bothered to finish any of his works to form.
On another level, Plato utilized his allegory of the cave to describe how one could reduce in their reasoning the question of what is light to a formal level doing so sufficiently to understand that it comes from the sun. Indeed, he wrote on many levels. But these many levels he wrote on were intended to shield him from the backwards people of Greece, these being the same ones who Democratically sentenced Socrates to either having to leave Greece or putting himself to death by drinking poison.
Most people are still living in a cave today. They still are being deceived by the shadows that our news media are casting on the walls. They don't see the true light.

Probably one of the most intelligible posts you've ever made.

+rep

Aratus
01-23-2013, 05:57 PM
he's often metaphysical, yes...

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2013, 06:09 PM
Probably one of the most intelligible posts you've ever made.

+rep

Thanks. If you are presently attending school to learn about matters concerning the law, you are going to rarely understand me. Establishing what became a new order first within The Declaration of Independence and then advancing that order by the implementation of laws guided by the U.S. Constitution is a rationally interpreted process intended to be in the best interest of the disadvantaged; but, unfortunately, it is one that will never be accepted by lawyers as the legal business of law is, at best, an irrational endeavor. This is why, concerning the disadvantaged majority, it was the advent of the American Movement that was the major true advancement over the prior achievements of the U.S. Constitution and the Declaration of Independence and not the pathetic creation of the two-party system. While the American Movement is all about the revering of our Founding Fathers, the philosophical considerations of the new order they established for us as a natural law within The Declaration of Independence, and the legal appreciations of the laws they would later established within the U.S. Constitution to advance that order, the best the law can manage to do today is commit contempt.
The aspect which made the United States great wasn't its idiot government, but the understanding that the best the endeavor of government can be is idiotic.

Uncle Emanuel Watkins
01-23-2013, 06:27 PM
he's often metaphysical, yes...

Metaphysics literally means "Reality?" It had nothing to do with physics which was a title of one of Aristotle's works. The title, in this case, got its name because of where a student of Aristotle, the clerk charged with keeping up with the many works, filed the scroll. He filed the scroll "Reality?" next to the scroll "physics" and then called it metaphysics, meaning that its name really meant "filed before the scroll of physics." This point has caused a lot of confusion.
As the business of law is, at best, an irrational endeavor, then this means there is no such phrase as a "legal definition." This is a fallacy. Before a legal system is set up, there first has to be an order. The legal meaning comes not just from the maintained order, another fallacy, but the advancement of the order. The prior order was established by the traditions of legal precedence. To confront this traditional persecution, our Founders overturned the prior order by the use of natural law, with this being the metaphysical science in use during their time. In its place, they established a new order by the declaration of a natural law. This justified our divorce out from under the old rule by determinations of it being, instead, a tyranny.

Henry Rogue
01-23-2013, 06:57 PM
Just saw a video on this >http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?399796-A-Female-Ben-Swann/page3&highlight=female+ben+swann post 23.

Carson
01-23-2013, 07:25 PM
Here it is in clay.


The Allegory of the Cave - Plato

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LTWwY8Ok5I0