Do no evil Google embraces evil

[itshappening]

PYONGYANG, North Korea (AP) - The Google chairman wants a first-hand look at North Korea's economy and social media in his private visit Monday to the communist nation, his delegation said, despite misgivings in Washington over the timing of the trip.

Eric Schmidt, executive chairman of one of the world's biggest Internet companies, is the highest-profile U.S. executive to visit North Korea - a country with notoriously restrictive online policies - since young leader Kim Jong Un took power a year ago. His visit has drawn criticism from the U.S. State Department because it comes only weeks after a controversial North Korean rocket launch; it has also prompted speculation about what the businessman hopes to accomplish.

Schmidt arrived on a commercial Air China flight with former New Mexico Gov. Bill Richardson, who has traveled more than a half-dozen times to North Korea over the past 20 years.

Richardson, speaking ahead of the flight from Beijing, called the trip a private, humanitarian mission.

"This is not a Google trip, but I'm sure he's interested in some of the economic issues there, the social media aspect. So this is why we are teamed up on this," Richardson said without elaborating on what he meant by the "social media aspect."

"We'll meet with North Korean political leaders. We'll meet with North Korean economic leaders, military. We'll visit some universities. We don't control the visit. They will let us know what the schedule is when we get there," he said.

U.S. officials have criticized the four-day trip. North Korea on Dec. 12 fired a satellite into space using a long-range rocket. Washington condemned the launch, which it considers a test of ballistic missile technology, as a violation of U.N. Security Council resolutions barring Pyongyang from developing its nuclear and missile programs. The Security Council is deliberating whether to take further action.

"We don't think the timing of the visit is helpful, and they are well aware of our views," State Department spokeswoman Victoria Nuland told reporters last week.

The trip was planned well before North Korea announced its plans to send a satellite into space, two people with knowledge of the delegation's plans told The Associated Press. AP first reported the group's plans last Thursday.

Schmidt, a staunch proponent of Internet connectivity and openness, is expected to make a donation during the visit, while Richardson will try to discuss the detainment of a U.S. citizen jailed in Pyongyang, members of the delegation told AP.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/google-executive-chairman-arrives-in-north-korea-85823.html#ixzz2HIR7ogMH

[Cleaner44]

Why does visiting North Korea equal embracing evil?

[itshappening]

North Korea is a state that has 200,000 political prisoners in gulags, is anti-capitalist and bellicose .

Therefore they're evil and no American executive should be visiting these idiots to "study" their failed economy and ideology.

[Cleaner44]

North Korea is a state that has 200,000 political prisoners in gulags, is anti-capitalist and bellicose .

Therefore they're evil and no American executive should be visiting these idiots to "study" their failed economy and ideology.

There is no doubt that the people in the government of NK are evil. There also is no doubt that the people in the US government are evil. Our government causes millions of deaths across the globe and attempts to run the world like a giant puppet show. Should we also label visitor to the US as embracing evil?

[itshappening]

There is no doubt that the people in the government of NK are evil. There also is no doubt that the people in the US government are evil. Our government causes millions of deaths across the globe and attempts to run the world like a giant puppet show. Should we also label visitor to the US as embracing evil?

The US might have some evil politicians but it doesn't have gulags, political prisoners and an anti-capitalist economy where citizens are starving. That's a whole different level of evil that should not be embraced by American executives unless they're secretly fascinated with Communism which I suspect Mr. Schmidt might be.

[compromise]

North Korea is a state that has 200,000 political prisoners in gulags, is anti-capitalist and bellicose .

Therefore they're evil and no American executive should be visiting these idiots to "study" their failed economy and ideology.
He can do what he wants. I'm sure he won't come back preaching Juche (although he'll still be backing a different form of socialism).

If anything, we also need some politicians to visit North Korea and other countries like Iran. We talked to the Soviet Union, so why shouldn't we talk to them?

[itshappening]

He can do what he wants. I'm sure he won't come back preaching Juche (although he'll still be backing a different form of socialism).

If anything, we also need some politicians to visit North Korea and other countries like Iran. We talked to the Soviet Union, so why shouldn't we talk to them?

you can meet with these leaders in neutral countries rather than go there and legitimize the regime providing what will be a photo opportunity and PR coup. To the average starving North Korean it will look like their new leader is being embraced by big shot American's and is therefore wise and will fix their problems.

[specsaregood]

you can meet with these leaders in neutral countries rather than go there and legitimize the regime providing what will be a photo opportunity and PR coup. To the average starving North Korean it will look like their new leader is being embraced by big shot American's and is therefore wise and will fix their problems.

How do you know the real state of the "average north korean" without visiting? Trust in the western media to tell you the truth? lol Maybe the average NK likes his country and its leadership.

[compromise]

you can meet with these leaders in neutral countries rather than go there and legitimize the regime providing what will be a photo opportunity and PR coup. To the average starving North Korean it will look like their new leader is being embraced by big shot American's and is therefore wise and will fix their problems.
Many US presidents visited the USSR and the PRC.

[MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2]

The US might have some evil politicians but it doesn't have gulags, political prisoners and an anti-capitalist economy where citizens are starving. That's a whole different level of evil that should not be embraced by American executives unless they're secretly fascinated with Communism which I suspect Mr. Schmidt might be.


I'd say he's more fascinated with surveillance for starters. Anyway, there's no reason for Schmit and a governor to be sharing trips. If nothing else, I dislike it as a sign of more government-business orgies.

[compromise]

I'd say he's more fascinated with surveillance for starters. Anyway, there's no reason for Schmit and a governor to be sharing trips. If nothing else, I dislike it as a sign of more government-business orgies.

Isn't he a former Governor? The current Governor of New Mexico is Susana Martinez.

[itshappening]

How do you know the real state of the "average north korean" without visiting? Trust in the western media to tell you the truth? lol Maybe the average NK likes his country and its leadership.

You can read from "defectors" what life is like there. it's awful and they're brainwashed into loving their leaders. Big shot American executives smiling and meeting them just legitimizes the all knowing leader and military who run things there.

[specsaregood]

You can read from "defectors" what life is like there. it's awful and they're brainwashed into loving their leaders.

Sounds like the US. Who are we to judge? we have more people in prison than them.

[jcannon98188]

Your right. We should probably just drop some sanctions on them, and then eventually attack them when politically convienient to do so. Maybe their long range nuke delivery system will jump in sophistication suddenly, prompting the immediate need for military intervention.

[KingNothing]

North Korea is a state that has 200,000 political prisoners in gulags, is anti-capitalist and bellicose .

Therefore they're evil and no American executive should be visiting these idiots to "study" their failed economy and ideology.

You don't think that Google is motivated by a desire to democratize NK and information in that absurd, depressing, country? I don't see this as "embracing evil" in any way shape or form.

[KingNothing]

Sounds like the US. Who are we to judge? we have more people in prison than them.

As a percent of the population is that true? I absolutely cannot believe that it is. They have the sort of tyranny that now only exists in fiction.

[specsaregood]

As a percent of the population is that true? I absolutely cannot believe that it is. They have the sort of tyranny that now only exists in fiction.

Once you start having to argue about the specifics of which is worse based on "percent of the population", you've already lost and my point is reinforced.

[itshappening]

The difference being you're not in prison for expressing dissent against the Obama regime.

In North Korea you'd be in a gulag eating a slice of bread a day if you're lucky.

[compromise]

The difference being you're not in prison for expressing dissent against the Obama regime.

In North Korea you'd be in a gulag eating a slice of bread a day if you're lucky.

I agree NK and other countries like it are terrible and I'm thankful I don't live there. But you aren't really drawing a distinction between a US government delegation visiting North Korea and US presidential trips to the USSR and the PRC.

[specsaregood]

The difference being you're not in prison for expressing dissent against the Obama regime.
In North Korea you'd be in a gulag eating a slice of bread a day if you're lucky.

I don't see much difference in putting somebody in prison for political dissent and putting somebody in prison for possessing a nontoxic plant product. Let those countries without gulags cast the first stone....

[KingNothing]

Once you start having to argue about the specifics of which is worse based on "percent of the population", you've already lost and my point is reinforced.

Well, I mean, we also have more people die every year than North Korea. Scale matters. You can't just say we have more of something. Of course we do. We've got over 300 million people living in our country.

[specsaregood]

Well, I mean, we also have more people die every year than North Korea. Scale matters. You can't just say we have more of something. Of course we do. We've got over 300 million people living in our country.

Here you go.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

North korea is not on the list, but guess which country tops the list?

[itshappening]

I don't see much difference in putting somebody in prison for political dissent and putting somebody in prison for possessing a nontoxic plant product. Let those countries without gulags cast the first stone....

There is a huge difference to a country locking up people for a few years based on misguided drug laws and a country locking up people for life along with their families in miserable gulags for expressing dissent.

One is evil and the other isn't.

[specsaregood]

There is a huge difference to a country locking up people for a few years based on misguided drug laws and a country locking up people for life along with their families in miserable gulags for expressing dissent.

One is evil and the other isn't.

That's funny right there.

[itshappening]

Why is it funny? The US is not evil and neither is its misguided drugs policy. Real evil and tyranny is being sentenced to life in a gulag with your parents for possibly, maybe, expressing dissent or have been assessed as untrustworthy by a state official which goes on in North Korea. It's political terror there.

[KingNothing]

Here you go.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_countries_by_incarceration_rate

North korea is not on the list, but guess which country tops the list?

You're really doing a wonderful job at beating the hell out of this strawman. Our criminal justice system stinks. I acknowledge that. Our drug laws are horrific and inhumane.

Do you have any idea what life is like in North Korea, though? It's hard tyranny and exponentially worse than anything any American will ever have to endure.

"It is estimated that between 150,000 and 200,000 political prisoners are detained in concentration camps, where they perform slave labour and risk summary beatings, torture and execution." Yuck to that.

[specsaregood]

Do you have any idea what life is like in North Korea, though? It's hard tyranny and exponentially worse than anything any American will ever have to endure.

how would I know? I've never been there -- isn't that what this thread is about going over and visiting NK? Perhaps the average NK likes their tyranny, the average american certainly embraces their own flavor of it. #1 per capita prison population in the world, the US. Yes, we should certainly be the ones doing the judging.

[KingNothing]

how would I know? I've never been there -- isn't that what this thread is about going over and visiting NK? Perhaps the average NK likes their tyranny, the average american certainly embraces their own flavor of it. #1 per capita prison population in the world, the US. Yes, we should certainly be the ones doing the judging.

You're very good at this.

[kcchiefs6465]

The US might have some evil politicians but it doesn't have gulags, political prisoners and an anti-capitalist economy where citizens are starving.
Lol. Yes, yes, and yes.

ETA: I know what you meant. Look in the mirror a little closer and you will see what I mean.

[itshappening]

North Korean's like their tyranny, police state and living off $7/week if they're lucky.

As I said it's an evil system perpetuated by men who want to stay in power. For American executives to visit and provide legitimacy and cover for that regime is wrong.

[compromise]

North Korean's like their tyranny, police state and living off $7/week if they're lucky.

As I said it's an evil system perpetuated by men who want to stay in power. For American executives to visit and provide legitimacy and cover for that regime is wrong.

I like how you are avoiding my posts and responding to the other guy instead. Ron Paul says we should talk to our enemies, regardless of how they treat their own citizens, just as we did with totalitarian communist powers during the Cold War. That involved many visits to these totalitarian communist powers. Do you really believe Nixon visiting Mao or Reagan visiting Gorbachev legitimized their totalitarian regimes?

[jclay2]

You can read from "defectors" what life is like there. it's awful and they're brainwashed into loving their leaders. Big shot American executives smiling and meeting them just legitimizes the all knowing leader and military who run things there.

Completely agree with you man. +rep. Honestly, the fact that it is the google ceo really makes me think this is bad news.

[jcannon98188]

I like how you are avoiding my posts and responding to the other guy instead. Ron Paul says we should talk to our enemies, regardless of how they treat their own citizens, just as we did with totalitarian communist powers during the Cold War. That involved many visits to these totalitarian communist powers. Do you really believe Nixon visiting Mao or Reagan visiting Gorbachev legitimized their totalitarian regimes?
But that is Ron Paul, and Paul was wrong. After all, the way forward is to use our Military and Sanctions to bully countries to fall in line
[/iWishThisWaySarcasmButItRepresentsTheViewOfManyOnT hisForum]

[itshappening]

I like how you are avoiding my posts and responding to the other guy instead. Ron Paul says we should talk to our enemies, regardless of how they treat their own citizens, just as we did with totalitarian communist powers during the Cold War. That involved many visits to these totalitarian communist powers. Do you really believe Nixon visiting Mao or Reagan visiting Gorbachev legitimized their totalitarian regimes?

I think talking to them is fine but not touring their countries. Nixon was a crook, i'm not going to answer for his behavior

[compromise]

I think talking to them is fine but not touring their countries. Nixon was a crook, i'm not going to answer for his behavior
Nixon being a crook is irrelevant. There was nothing wrong with his visit to China. If anything, his visit to China was a good thing. Agreeing to tour their countries makes them a lot more willing to talk to you about other things.

[itshappening]

Nixon being a crook is irrelevant. There was nothing wrong with his visit to China. If anything, his visit to China was a good thing. Agreeing to tour their countries makes them a lot more willing to talk to you about other things.

Why talk with criminals? At least in the case of Gorbachov he was working to dismantle the crazy system but the North Koreans show no sign of doing that, they want to be in power forever and keep their citizens impoverished. That is evil.

[MoneyWhereMyMouthIs2]

Isn't he a former Governor? The current Governor of New Mexico is Susana Martinez.


Sure. So what's his current role and interest?

[emazur]

from 3 days ago:
North Korea Enlists German Help to Prepare Economic Opening (http://www.spiegel.de/international/world/german-paper-reports-north-korea-preparing-economic-opening-a-875844.html)