House is in and voting now

[tangent4ronpaul]

tune in!

-t

3 votes, first is 5726 ? - congressional pay freeze

[sailingaway]

I wonder if Ron is there?

I'm interested in how he would vote. I truly don't know, after all the fuss, if the bill passing is better than or worse than doing nothing at all, given that taxes otherwise rise, and there are built in spending increases, already.

[tangent4ronpaul]

It's going to pass. Dems are holding back on voting, but it's got more than enough to pass.

This is basically bitch slapping Obama for his EO raising federal workers pay. It will stop that, but gives the military pay raises.

-t

[dillo]

Wait its this an amendment or the bill

[sailingaway]

I have little doubt it will pass, I really only care about how Ron will vote. By this point I'm confused as to what the bill does as compared to baseline. A C4L email is going around saying it raises taxes, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't raise them, it just doesn't cut them as much as they would like. Without this taxes go up more, I'm pretty sure.

[tangent4ronpaul]

I wonder if Ron is there?

I'm interested in how he would vote. I truly don't know, after all the fuss, if the bill passing is better than or worse than doing nothing at all, given that taxes otherwise rise, and there are built in spending increases, already.

Second vote is supposed to be on an amendment. If that doesn't pass, the senate bill gets a up or down vote. If it does pass, the amended senate bill gets voted on.

I don't think anyone knows what's in the amendment.

-t

[tangent4ronpaul]

Wait its this an amendment or the bill

first vote - now - overturn Obama's EO raising frderal pay
second vote - amendment
third vote - bill senate passed, possibly amended.

-t

[tsai3904]

I have little doubt it will pass, I really only care about how Ron will vote. By this point I'm confused as to what the bill does as compared to baseline. A C4L email is going around saying it raises taxes, but I'm pretty sure it doesn't raise them, it just doesn't cut them as much as they would like. Without this taxes go up more, I'm pretty sure.

Here's a good summary of the Senate passed bill. I don't think it compares it to a baseline "if nothing happens" scenario but it includes good summaries of what's in it.

http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/uploadedfiles/lb_010113_hr8.pdf

[sailingaway]

Here's a good summary of the Senate passed bill. I don't think it compares it to a baseline "if nothing happens" scenario but it includes good summaries of what's in it.

http://rsc.jordan.house.gov/uploadedfiles/lb_010113_hr8.pdf

I appreciate it.

Here is the problem I have though, with language like this:


Affirmatively Provides for Tax Increases: If this legislation is enacted, some American families and small business would face higher tax rates in 2013 on regular income and income from capital gains and dividends than they have faced in recent years, a situation conservatives have historically and universally advocated against.

those rates don't go up because of what is in the bill, they will go up if the bill DOESN'T pass, as well, as will more taxes. While the bill doesn't preserve as much of the tax cuts as we'd want, it actually cuts taxes from what would occur otherwise, which I am sure is one of the reasons CBO says it 'contributes so much to the deficit'. In other words, they view cut taxes (which happens if the bill passes) as dollar for dollar less revenues for government, hence the bill 'adding to the deficit' by not bringing in as much revenue per their analysis.

On taxes, if the bill doesn't pass, it is worse.

Note that the last bill was a million and up had higher taxes, not others, this is $450,000 and up. new bills are not going in the right direction.

I wish there were one with a baseline comparison, and the new spending compared to that, as well, is all.

[tangent4ronpaul]

first one just passes.

voting on amendment now.

whoops! - this is sounding like something about transferring land in Alaska.

-t

[itshappening]

The fiscal cliff bill is not scheduled but Boehner has told members to stick around.

They're going to do it in the dead of night, just watch!

[sailingaway]

first one just passes.

voting on amendment now.

whoops! - this is sounding like something about transferring land in Alaska.

-t

better not be those islands....

I'm sure we'll find all kinds of crap in there once it is all over.

[tangent4ronpaul]

Drywall safety act? - WTF???

-t

[sailingaway]

Drywall safety act? - WTF???

-t

I know drywall safety is an issue that concerns me daily, to the point of wanting the federal government to step in and reduce my options.

Not.

[tangent4ronpaul]

I know drywall safety is an issue that concerns me daily, to the point of wanting the federal government to step in and reduce my options.

Not.

The issue is that chinese drywall contains toxic materials.

about the "cliff":

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-34222_162-57561526-10391739/boehner-offers-gop-two-cliff-choices/

As House Republicans try to get past an impasse on the "fiscal cliff", House Speaker John Boehner, R-Ohio presented his members with two options: to amend the bill with new spending cuts or to just vote on the Senate bill as-is.

After meeting with the Republican conference and listening to members' concerns, Boehner cooked up the plan. According to a GOP leadership aide, the first option would be create an amendment to the Senate bill that would add a package of spending cuts. If the House GOP leadership can find 218 votes to support this amendment, they will bring it up for a vote and send an amended bill back to the Senate.

The Speaker and the leader both cautioned members about the risk in such a strategy. They told them there is no guarantee the Senate, which is adjourned until Noon tomorrow, would act on the amended bill. If the House cannot get a commitment of 217 votes for the amendment tonight, GOP leaders will bring up the Senate-passed measure for an up-or-down vote in the House. House Democrats insist there are enough Democratic votes to pass the Senate version of the bill.

Meantime, a Senate Democratic leadership aide told CBS News, "we will absolutely not take up the House bill if they change the bipartisan agreement reached in the Senate."

-t

[tangent4ronpaul]

dup

[cajuncocoa]

Drywall safety act? - WTF???

-tI just checked in and saw this post...that "drywall safety" thing probably has something to do with a problem we had in NOLA after Katrina.

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20091227/ARTICLE/912271039

[sailingaway]

I just checked in and saw this post...that "drywall safety" thing probably has something to do with a problem we had in NOLA after Katrina.

http://www.heraldtribune.com/article/20091227/ARTICLE/912271039

actually, the Chinese dry wall is a real issue because many entire housing developments were built with it, and tearing them all apart is..... unlikely to happen.

[tangent4ronpaul]

from tweets C-SPAN just read:

looks like repubs don't have 218 votes to pass amendment for additional spending cuts.

They plan to vote late on Senate passed bill. Probably around 2am.

-t

[oyarde]

from tweets C-SPAN just read:

looks like repubs don't have 218 votes to pass amendment for additional spending cuts.

They plan to vote late on Senate passed bill. Probably around 2am.

-t That is what I would expect......

[sailingaway]

That is what I would expect......

But in that case, could better be expected later? Given that taxes go up automatically if nothing passes?

Also, are these increases already in the automatic spending increases or are they new, apart from the continuing the unemployment extension (which I know is new.)

[oyarde]

But in that case, could better be expected later? Given that taxes go up automatically if nothing passes?

Also, are these increases already in the automatic spending increases or are they new, apart from the continuing the unemployment extension (which I know is new.) It is indeed a double edged Claymore or broadsword, I figured you can not get 218 votes to cut spending, and yes the tax increases need stopped . Remember going forward though , that you will also not get votes to cut spending, even if you did in the House, not in the Senate ,eventually leading to demise .

[angelatc]

Spending is control. They can't possibly give it up.

[Brett85]

Does anyone have a roll call vote for this? I want to see whether Ron is there today or not.

[tangent4ronpaul]

House to return in about 15 minutes with a vote on a rule change in about an hour (9:30pm EST), if that passes, there should be a string of votes, including on the Senate bill.

-t

[tsai3904]

Does anyone have a roll call vote for this? I want to see whether Ron is there today or not.

They haven't posted roll call votes online yet.

[sailingaway]

AP is reporting the GOP has dropped opposition to the bill, presumably that means leadership is no longer trying for changes.

[itshappening]

Yes I knew that would happen.

He's going to hold an up and down vote on it, a free vote for his members but Boehner knows he can find 30 GOP votes to pass it with Democrat votes.

He's doing what he's told without regard to the speakership.

Establishment always finds a way to win even if it means Boehner puts himself in jeopardy because he wants it passed for his masters.

[Pauls' Revere]

Live link:

http://www.c-span.org/Live-Video/C-SPAN/

[itshappening]

I estimate up to 100 GOPers will vote with 180 Democrats and it will pass easily.

130 conservatives will vote against it but they will get a free pass to do it (he's not going to kick them all off committee's etc)

This should ensure that at least 20 staunch rebels are going to be suitably outraged with Boehner, might be higher, and may want him removed from the speakership come Thursday. Boehner is probably hoping they do nothing and have little time to organize in order to depose him.

[sailingaway]

Roll Call ‏@rollcall
House Rules just approved closed rule to bring Senate-passed #fiscalcliff deal to floor. Floor vote on rule expected around 9:30 pm

[oyarde]

So , basically looks as though Reid got everything he wanted .....

[JJ2]

This is insane. Now that the CBO says this bill (which Obama said is needed to REDUCE the deficit) will ADD 3.9 TRILLION dollars to the deficit over the next decade, how can ANY so-called "conservative" vote for this, or even allow it to be voted through? Doesn't it take just ONE Congressperson to stop the bill from being rushed through at this point? Why doesn't somebody (even a retiring member, perhaps) stop this monstrosity? Why doesn't Ron Paul stop it? What a great way to go out! Let the 113th Congress do something about the taxes, but stop this spending nonsense!

[sailingaway]

The CBO is saying preventing part of the tax cuts from expiring 'increases the deficit'.

[tsai3904]

Ron didn't vote on the three bills earlier so it looks like he's not there today.

[sparebulb]

So , basically looks as though Reid got everything he wanted .....

Well, maybe he did, but the R's showed that they aren't just going to roll over and take a bad deal.................until, of course, they did.

I'm sure that Limp Windbag, Shammity, and Beck will all console the GOP faithful with the gallant tales of Boner's and McConnell's bravery and leadership.

[JJ2]

The CBO is saying preventing part of the tax cuts from expiring 'increases the deficit'.

OK, I looked at the details a little more. Still, the CBO says it ADDS $330 billion in spending over the next decade, instead of cutting spending!

[sailingaway]

Ron didn't vote on the three bills earlier so it looks like he's not there today.

hm

[oyarde]

Yeah , I saw the third of a trillion too.

[oyarde]

That is the Dem math for you, they give you a couple ham bones, buy some T bone steaks.

[oyarde]

That may be enough to cut our credit rating again ???

[oyarde]

Tax increase money could just pay for more interest ??

[Brett85]

This is insane. Now that the CBO says this bill (which Obama said is needed to REDUCE the deficit) will ADD 3.9 TRILLION dollars to the deficit over the next decade, how can ANY so-called "conservative" vote for this, or even allow it to be voted through? Doesn't it take just ONE Congressperson to stop the bill from being rushed through at this point? Why doesn't somebody (even a retiring member, perhaps) stop this monstrosity? Why doesn't Ron Paul stop it? What a great way to go out! Let the 113th Congress do something about the taxes, but stop this spending nonsense!

The CBO says that cutting taxes adds 3.9 trillion to the deficit, which is simply untrue. Cutting taxes generally brings in more revenue to the government, not less. NOBODY should ever believe anything the CBO says. It's necessary to pass this bill in order to cut tax rates on 99% of the American people. I imagine Ron will vote for it if he's actually there.

[Brett85]

Ron didn't vote on the three bills earlier so it looks like he's not there today.

How do you know he didn't vote on the earlier bills? The last time I looked the roll call votes weren't up.

[sailingaway]

The CBO says that cutting taxes adds 3.9 trillion to the deficit, which is simply untrue. Cutting taxes generally brings in more revenue to the government, not less. NOBODY should ever believe anything the CBO says. It's necessary to pass this bill in order to cut tax rates on 99% of the American people. I imagine Ron will vote for it if he's actually there.

If he's NOT there on the last vote of his last session, I'd kind of wonder why. As in maybe if it wasn't going to impact the outcome, he wouldn't want to undermine allies. I am a bit confused as to what the bill does vis a vis the benchline if no bill is passed, at this point, to be honest.

[JJ2]

The CBO says that cutting taxes adds 3.9 trillion to the deficit, which is simply untrue. Cutting taxes generally brings in more revenue to the government, not less. NOBODY should ever believe anything the CBO says. It's necessary to pass this bill in order to cut tax rates on 99% of the American people. I imagine Ron will vote for it if he's actually there.

There are no tax cuts in the bill, only tax hikes. Keeping the rates the same for some people will not result in more revenue.

Not only are there tax increases, there are also spending increases (CBO says $330 billion in spending increases over the next decade).

There is no good reason to not force this to go to the 113th Congress, IMO.

[Brett85]

There are no tax cuts in the bill, only tax hikes. Keeping the rates the same for some people will not result in more revenue.

Not only are there tax increases, there are also spending increases (CBO says $330 billion in spending increases over the next decade).

There is no good reason to not force this to go to the 113th Congress, IMO.

There are no tax increases since all of the tax increases occurred last night when all of the Bush tax cuts expired. Right now, the current tax rates are the same as they were before the Bush tax cuts were passed. This bill simply cuts the tax rates back to where they were for 99% of Americans.

[Pauls' Revere]

futures are up 250.
http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/stocks/futures/

Gimme Shelter:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJDnJ0vXUgw

[oyarde]

futures are up 250.
http://www.bloomberg.com/markets/stocks/futures/ I saw that, that Nasdaq looks incredibly inflated.

[JJ2]

There are no tax increases since all of the tax increases occurred last night when all of the Bush tax cuts expired. Right now, the current tax rates are the same as they were before the Bush tax cuts were passed. This bill simply cuts the tax rates back to where they were for 99% of Americans.

Semantics. "Cutting" them back to where they have been for a decade is not going to bring in more revenue. Just like Obama was lying in 2010 when he said the "tax cuts" (keeping rates the same) would spur the economy.

[sailingaway]

There are no tax increases since all of the tax increases occurred last night when all of the Bush tax cuts expired. Right now, the current tax rates are the same as they were before the Bush tax cuts were passed. This bill simply cuts the tax rates back to where they were for 99% of Americans.

This. That is what bothered me about that C4L email someone posted on another site. It said it raised taxes, instead of clarifying that it prevented taxes from automatically raising, but only prevented it on some. That error is throughout most write ups I've seen, as if the bill itself raises taxes.

People are saying taxes go up on 70% but I think they are talking about the expiration of the payroll tax holiday, again, an expiration that occurs automatically if it is not prevented.

[Pauls' Revere]

Not a single NAY vote yet.

[Brett85]

I would think that Ron would go back to Washington DC to vote on a bill as important as this, but we'll see. I hope he shows up.

[Pauls' Revere]

One NAY vote. Who was it?

[Brett85]

Not a single NAY vote yet.

They're just voting on the rule, not the actual Senate bill. It's just a procedural vote.

[Pauls' Revere]

They're just voting on the rule, not the actual Senate bill. It's just a procedural vote.

Thanks fro the clarification.

[sailingaway]

I would think that Ron would go back to Washington DC to vote on a bill as important as this, but we'll see. I hope he shows up.

I'm feel pretty sure he would, unless there were a reason he wasn't doing it, on purpose. That is why I was wondering when tsai said he didn't seem to be there.

Maybe we'll find out tomorrow he had to be somewhere.

[sailingaway]

CSPAN ‏@cspan
U.S. House: Final Passage Vote on #FiscalCliff Bill at approximately 10:45pm ET - LIVE on C-SPAN http://cs.pn/Z86YEz

[oyarde]

So 10:45 Eastern?

[sailingaway]

So 10:45 Eastern?

Yeah.

[sailingaway]

@jamiedupree
Rep Ron Paul R-TX has missed every vote so far on New Year's Eve and New Year's in the US House

Odd.

[SpreadOfLiberty]

@jamiedupree
Rep Ron Paul R-TX has missed every vote so far on New Year's Eve and New Year's in the US House

Odd.http://ronpaulswag.com/media/catalog/product/10/image/9df78eab33525d08d6e5fb8d27136e95/r/3/r3volution-glass.jpg

(i'm joking of course)

[itshappening]

its passed with Dem votes as I predicted!

[AuH20]

I can't wait to see which of the 80 odd republicans voted yea.

[oyarde]

its passed with Dem votes as I predicted! What are the totals ?

[supermario21]

Paul Ryan: Medicare Part D, TARP, and now THIS. Something like 257-167.

[Inkblots]

Paul Ryan: Medicare Part D, TARP, and now THIS. Something like 257-167.

The gold standard in fiscal conservatism, ladies and gentlemen. Why, he's the best and brightest the GOP has to offer!

[itshappening]

Ryan might have voted against it, you dont know yet.

[itshappening]

170 odd Dems and 85 Republicans voted yea

[supermario21]

Dana Bash
✔
@DanaBashCNN
Wow. Senate potential 2016ers voted no. But paul ryan just voted yes on fiscal cliff package

[Brett85]

I imagine Ron voted for it as well if he was actually there.

[Confederate]

Passed the house

[Inkblots]

And so the can is successfully kicked down the road... for another two months. Each time our dear leaders in Washington come together to "solve" our problems, the resolution lasts for less time, and the problems have grown yet worse when they expire.

Remember, kids and kiddies: anything that can't go on, stops.

[JJ2]

"Five Senate Republicans also rejected the measure, including tea party favorites Rand Paul (Ky.), Mike Lee (Utah) and Marco Rubio (Fla.), a potential contender for the 2016 Republican presidential nomination." (http://www.washingtonpost.com/business/economy/house-members-meet-to-review-senate-passed-cliff-deal/2013/01/01/6e4373cc-5435-11e2-bf3e-76c0a789346f_print.html)

Rubio is a potential contender, but not Paul. :rolleyes:

[AuH20]

the only good thing about this bill that I can see is that they somehow tricked Biden into upping the estate tax threshold from 3 million to 5 million.

[JJ2]

Vast majority of Republicans voted against the bill, but Ryan votes for it? :rolleyes:

[oyarde]

So summary is tax rates stay the same under 400k, 620 billion in tax hikes,estate tax to 40 % 15 billion in cuts & 330 billion added to the debt over 10????

[easycougar]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/01/fiscal-cliff-deal-also-doles-out-millions-for-hollywood-railroads-rum-producers/


$430 million for Hollywood through “special expensing rules” to encourage TV and film production in the United States. Producers can expense up to $15 million of costs for their projects.

WTF!!!!

[oyarde]

Does not sound like a good deal ....

[sailingaway]

I imagine Ron voted for it as well if he was actually there.

big if, though, given he didn't vote in other votes. I know they took his keys a while ago.

I was looking forward to his vote, though. I tend to agree he would vote for it, on just the extension of tax cut side, but don't know everything in it, such as specifics on new spending.

[Brett85]

the only good thing about this bill that I can see is that they somehow tricked Biden into upping the estate tax threshold from 3 million to 5 million.

No, it was upped from 1 million to 5 million, and the rate went from 55% to 40%.

[Inkblots]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/01/fiscal-cliff-deal-also-doles-out-millions-for-hollywood-railroads-rum-producers/

WTF!!!!

The wonderful thing about being 16 million million dollars in debt is that a mere 430 million dollars thrown down the drain doesn't sound like that much - just a bit of chump change, so why not spend it?

[JK/SEA]

2% FICA increase for everyone?

[AuH20]

No, it was upped from 1 million to 5 million, and the rate went from 55% to 40%.

That was a huge win anyway you look at it.

[supermario21]

2% FICA increase for everyone?

Yes, FICA/payroll was not part of any deal.

[Brett85]

big if, though, given he didn't vote in other votes. I know they took his keys a while ago.

I was looking forward to his vote, though. I tend to agree he would vote for it, on just the extension of tax cut side, but don't know everything in it, such as specifics on new spending.

I noticed there were 7 Republicans "not voting" in the procedural vote, and 5 Republicans "not voting" on the main bill. So it's possible that Ron voted on it.

[sailingaway]

I noticed there were 7 Republicans "not voting" in the procedural vote, and 5 Republicans "not voting" on the main bill. So it's possible that Ron voted on it.

Then I will wait and see. Thanks.

[tangent4ronpaul]

They sure are slamming a ton of stuff by fast and a lot of it is police state stuff... :(

-t

[supermario21]

Somebody save this for an ad in 4 years....


Rebecca Berg@rebeccagberg
Paul Ryan on why he voted for the deal: “When you like something, you vote for it. …I wasn’t afraid.” Said it reflects conservative values.

[JK/SEA]

Yes, FICA/payroll was not part of any deal.


shhhhh....don't tell anyone...

[Brett85]

That was a huge win anyway you look at it.

I agree. That's the main reason why I support this bill and feel that it's a much better deal than it could've been.

[supermario21]

I agree. That's the main reason why I support this bill and feel that it's a much better deal than it could've been.

I disagree about what my vote would have been, but the silver lining is that we didn't surrender any future leverage. We have the debt ceiling to force major cuts/reform.

[tangent4ronpaul]

Looks like Hezbolla is being declared a terrorist organization. But they are asking for a recorded vote on this one. nope - recorded vote request is lifted.

I've never seen the house approve so much legislation this fast - like 2 a minute!

-t

[JK/SEA]

Looks like Hezbolla is being declared a terrorist organization. But they are asking for a recorded vote on this one. nope - recorded vote request is lifted.

I've never seen the house approve so much legislation this fast - like 2 a minute!

-t

just resolutions...not new law.

[AuH20]

Steny Hoyer is crying for Sandy Relief.

[sailingaway]

https://twitter.com/iMcNulty82/status/286324277098209280

check out the last tweet

[JK/SEA]

https://twitter.com/iMcNulty82/status/286324277098209280

check out the last tweet

geez..thanks Ian..
fur nuthin'

[supermario21]

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2012/roll659.xml

Roll call, futures Sens. Scott and Flake vote no.

[oyarde]

2% FICA increase for everyone? Yes , I think so , 2% cut for those paying in,1.7 % increase for those recieving, best I can tell , that would be the slate for this year....

[Brett85]

Ron wasn't there to vote on the bill.

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2012/roll659.xml

[Rudeman]

I think its great that Rubio and Ryan split on the vote, both are the media's "conservative" darlings and now the media (Fox News, Hannity etc.) can't claim that one position was better than the other without throwing one of them under the bus for their vote.

[TheTexan]

I haven't been following this too closely, did the thieves take any of my money (hint: I'm not > 400k)

[Pauls' Revere]

So, how much time does this buy the country?

[sailingaway]

http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2012/roll659.xml

[sailingaway]

So, how much time does this buy the country?

two months.

[oyarde]

So, how much time does this buy the country? None , I think , small business owners just got tax increases, no hiring , debt going up , I figure 5 1/3 trillion over the next 4 yrs give or take 3/4 trillion, health care bill destruction intact...... food prices rising, should equal zero growth...

[supermario21]

I'll say this, these pathetic displays by the establishment are only going to help us. Erick Erickson lashes out at the establishment tonight...

http://www.redstate.com/2013/01/01/the-mcconnell-tax-hike/

[Pauls' Revere]

I haven't been following this too closely, did the thieves take any of my money (hint: I'm not > 400k)

Last I heard the payroll tax was going up. but not sure.

[oyarde]

I haven't been following this too closely, did the thieves take any of my money (hint: I'm not > 400k) Best I can figure, your 2 % tax increase on Social Security started today if it was a pd Holiday .

[sailingaway]

Last I heard the payroll tax was going up. but not sure.

Yeah, the holiday for that cut expired.

[Pauls' Revere]

two months.

So, we'll be back at this in two months with another bill? FFS! :mad:

[sailingaway]

Last I heard the payroll tax was going up. but not sure.

Yeah, the holiday for that cut expired.

[sailingaway]

So, we'll be back at this in two months with another bill? FFS! :mad:

that's when the 'headroom' for the debt ceiling ends.

[SpreadOfLiberty]

Lamar Smith voted yes.

[Pauls' Revere]

that's when the 'headroom' for the debt ceiling ends.

and we all know whats going to happen with that.

[oyarde]

Like I said, none.

[Brett85]

I wonder whether someone will at least ask Ron how he would've voted on this had he been on the house floor.

[dillo]

how does the estate tax work with regards to a family business? Can you just sell the business before death for 1$ to your son to avoid the tax?

[AuH20]

how does the estate tax work with regards to a family business? Can you just sell the business before death for 1$ to your son to avoid the tax?

First $5 million dollars of the estate worth is exempted. Upward of that plateau is 40%.

[itshappening]

Anyone under 400k will be paying 2% more tax this year, plus Obamacare is something you have to worry about as businesses figure how to implement it

[Brian4Liberty]

I think its great that Rubio and Ryan split on the vote, both are the media's "conservative" darlings and now the media (Fox News, Hannity etc.) can't claim that one position was better than the other without throwing one of them under the bus for their vote.

Ryan voted yes on TARP. His sellout on the budget is nothing new. Anyone who thinks he is a fiscal conservative is delusional.

(And Rubio's vote was a fake. He would have voted yes in a heartbeat, if he thought it wouldn't come back to haunt him.)

[AuH20]

Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson just gave their thumbs down on this bill, as far as spending reduction goes.

[sailingaway]

I wonder whether someone will at least ask Ron how he would've voted on this had he been on the house floor.

I wonder how he would have voted. But since C4L sent out an email about calling your reps to vote against it and Rand voted against it, I don't know if he'll want to discuss it, if you would have voted yes. But I do wonder how he would have voted had he been there.

[sailingaway]

Ryan voted yes on TARP. His sellout on the budget is nothing new. Anyone who thinks he is a fiscal conservative is delusional.

(And Rubio's vote was a fake. He would have voted yes in a heartbeat, if he thought it wouldn't come back to haunt him.)

I think they are playing both options. You want a moderate? Ryan. You want a 'tea party conservative'? Rubio. (*cough*)

[oyarde]

Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson just gave their thumbs down on this bill, as far as spending reduction goes. So do I .

[tangent4ronpaul]

I wonder how he would have voted. But since C4L sent out an email about calling your reps to vote against it and Rand voted against it, I don't know if he'll want to discuss it, if you would have voted yes. But I do wonder how he would have voted had he been there.

I think you just answered your own question.

Remember who is the head of C4L

-t

[sailingaway]

I think you just answered your own question.

Remember who is the head of C4L

-t

Not sure it works that way, but that is actually why I am most interested to find out. If he WOULD have voted no, though, he'll say so when asked.

[oyarde]

Anyone under 400k will be paying 2% more tax this year, plus Obamacare is something you have to worry about as businesses figure how to implement it

Pretty much, and the guy who owns the place you work just got a tax increase , see how that works out for ya with Obamacare.Oh yeah, and groceries are going to cost more due to the drought, corn , etc

[jkob]

hopefully this means the end of Boehner.

Seems like Cantor is positioning himself to replace him tho

[AuH20]

hopefully this means the end of Boehner.

Seems like Cantor is positioning himself to replace him tho

And Obama supposedly detests Cantor. I'm not a fan of Cantor, but I guess it's a minor upgrade.

[sailingaway]

hopefully this means the end of Boehner.

Seems like Cantor is positioning himself to replace him tho

Yeah, he suddenly was first ever time against Boehner on this as if he's different.

Cantor's no better.

[bolil]

I cannot seem to find a full text of this budget/resolution/what ever anywhere.

[sailingaway]

I cannot seem to find a full text of this budget/resolution/what ever anywhere.

Yeah, good luck with that.

[ord33]

I cannot seem to find a full text of this budget/resolution/what ever anywhere.

Here you go: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/fiscal-cliff-bill-full-text-85644.html

[Rudeman]

Ryan voted yes on TARP. His sellout on the budget is nothing new. Anyone who thinks he is a fiscal conservative is delusional.

(And Rubio's vote was a fake. He would have voted yes in a heartbeat, if he thought it wouldn't come back to haunt him.)

Oh I know this but most Republicans don't. How many times were we (Ron Paul supporters) told that Ryan was this great fiscal conservative and how we should support Romney because of him? The more Ryan exposes himself for what he is the better.

[oyarde]

I cannot seem to find a full text of this budget/resolution/what ever anywhere. I cannot as well.

[Pauls' Revere]

Takes breaks for oil and gas.
No reduction in deficit or debt.
No mention of taxing for offshore corps,
Senior managers and hedge fund execs keep a tax break.
etc...

The "sequester" or the deep cuts in federal spending is essentially postponed until Feburary.

http://news.yahoo.com/fiscal-cliff-deal-looks-u-businesses-taxes-043058870--finance.html

[Carson]

Over on fark there was a joke when twitter came out that went something like what can you say with only 150 characters, or what ever it was. Anyway, it went something like,

"I'm going into the bathroom".

"Poop is coming out".


A Fark headline for one of the threads on this topic is;

Obama says fiscal cliff deal is "emerging." OK HOPE IS COMING OUT (www.fark.com/comments/7511420/Obama-says-fiscal-cliff-deal-is-emerging-OK-HOPE-IS-COMING-OUT )

[tangent4ronpaul]

The market has voted on the fiscal cliff:

Dollar, yen drop sharply on fiscal-cliff deal
The dollar and Japanese yen fall sharply as the euro rallies after the House of Representatives passes a bill to undo much of the fiscal cliff threatening the U.S. economy.
http://stream.marketwatch.com/story/markets/SS-4-4/SS-4-18128/

European Stocks Rise, Dollar Drops on U.S. Budget Bill
http://www.businessweek.com/news/2013-01-01/australian-stocks-rise-as-yen-weakens-on-u-dot-s-dot-budget-bill

-t

[JJ2]

Takes breaks for oil and gas.
No reduction in deficit or debt.
No mention of taxing for offshore corps,
Senior managers and hedge fund execs keep a tax break.
etc...

The "sequester" or the deep cuts in federal spending is essentially postponed until Feburary.

http://news.yahoo.com/fiscal-cliff-deal-looks-u-businesses-taxes-043058870--finance.html

"deep cuts in federal spending"? You mean the slowdown in the rate of spending increases?

[jj-]

I would think that Ron would go back to Washington DC to vote on a bill as important as this, but we'll see. I hope he shows up.

I hope he doesn't. Anything would be more productive. Spending time with his family, reading an economics book, even sleeping.

Also, this is during the new year holiday. Congress shouldn't even be in session. Congress should get together once or twice a year, and definitely not during holidays. It's an insult to ask Ron Paul to waste his time, especially considering that his vote wouldn't change the outcome.

[Cap]

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/01/fiscal-cliff-deal-also-doles-out-millions-for-hollywood-railroads-rum-producers/



WTF!!!!"Bread and Circuses"

[sailingaway]

"deep cuts in federal spending"? You mean the slowdown in the rate of spending increases?

that would be it, yes.

[sailingaway]

I hope he doesn't. Anything would be more productive. Spending time with his family, reading an economics book, even sleeping.

Also, this is during the new year holiday. Congress shouldn't even be in session. Congress should get together once or twice a year, and definitely not during holidays. It's an insult to ask Ron Paul to waste his time, especially considering that his vote wouldn't change the outcome.
I was disappointed last night that he wasn't there, with all the sturm und drang coming from people on the hill and watching it -- he can always be counted on as the cool voice of reason.

But when I thought about it, even if he would have voted FOR continuing the tax cuts as much as they could get, he'd probably have had to vote against the spending increases which weren't constitutional. And no vote is more like a vote against than for. And last night was nonsense, with high drama, essentially.

[Brett85]

I was disappointed last night that he wasn't there, with all the sturm und drang coming from people on the hill and watching it -- he can always be counted on as the cool voice of reason.

But when I thought about it, even if he would have voted FOR continuing the tax cuts as much as they could get, he'd probably have had to vote against the spending increases which weren't constitutional. And no vote is more like a vote against than for. And last night was nonsense, with high drama, essentially.

No, that isn't true. The last time around, an extension of unemployment benefits were added to the bill that extended the Bush tax cuts for everyone temporarily, and Ron voted in favor of that.