Obama requests 30 Tractor Trailers full of $100 Bills for Sandy Damage

[presence]

http://www.newsday.com/news/nation/obama-proposes-60b-for-sandy-relief-1.4305538


WASHINGTON -- The White House on Friday proposed $60.4 billion in federal disaster aid for damage to the Northeast from superstorm Sandy, an amount welcomed by New York (http://www.newsday.com/topics//New_York_%28state%29)'s top lawmakers as "good news."

http://demonocracy.info/infographics/usa/us_debt/images/usd-1_trillion_dollars-1,000,000,000,000_USD-v2.jpg

[BAllen]

Unlimited supply of money.
Reminds me of what Greenspan said when asked if we would default on our loans: There is no danger of that, because we can always print up more money.

[angelatc]

Meh - helicopters ftw!

New York is home to some of the richest people in the world. But the people in Alabama need to bail them out. Of course.

[QuickZ06]

Unlimited supply of money.
Reminds me of what Greenspan said when asked if we would default on our loans: There is no danger of that, because we can always print up more money.

SCARY!!!!!!

[libertygrl]

Meh - helicopters ftw!

New York is home to some of the richest people in the world. But the people in Alabama need to bail them out. Of course.

As a "Sandy" survivor and a limited government proponent, I have been going back and forth in my mind about this. I'm seriously questioning my position lately when it comes to the issue of national emergencies after what I have personally experienced and have see first hand.

It's easy for people to sit and judge others when they haven't gone through a similar situation - and I'm including myself before this tragic event took place. I live in a working class neighborhood and contrary to some people, we are NOT all rich New Yorkers. Far from it.

Compared to some of my neighbors, my family at least had a home to go back to. We were displaced for 2 weeks. We had some damage with our oil burner and electrical wiring system and other things that we could not afford paying for repairs at this time. Someone suggested contacting FEMA. It's hard to stick to your principles when you've just gone through a traumatic experience and going through a tough economic time as well. We got a little money back which was a big help to pay for some of the damages.

It's been amazing to see the level of volunteers from around the country who have come here to help out. I can't say enough about the Red Cross which came by with their food trucks daily to serve the communities. I mean, what are people supposed to do??? I'm asking this in all sincerity. Are we supposed to wait for charities to donate money? We were able to get repairs taken care of because of the immediate grant we received (and some from home owner's insurance). But I have to be honest. FEMA did get it to us pretty quickly. And I can't believe I'm giving props to FEMA! Believe me. Especially since I'm one of those people who are into researching conspiracy theories! The one night I stayed in my home without heat/electric was tough enough. But then to have a curfew and seeing military vehicles around and hearing helicopters flying overhead at night was pretty freaky.

Here's some pictutes of the devestation. Is one state able to pay for all its own damages and restoration to barriers and infrastructure??? I don't know. That's why I'm asking you guys:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wkji4T_hidw

[evilfunnystuff]

Meh - helicopters ftw!

http://makeagif.com/media/3-17-2012/LBnYPf.gif

[presence]

Is one state able to pay for all its own damages and restoration to barriers and infrastructure??? I don't know. That's why I'm asking you guys:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wkji4T_hidw

I'm assuming you're on LBI because that's the video you posted.

LBI is a "migrating barrier island". Stop and think about the larger implications of that statement for a second.

IMHO it should be left to nature... or to those insurance companies which are willing to offer risk policies, or to those individuals who are willing and able to build disposable structures for short term gain. FEMA, .fed .gov etal should not be rebuilding unaffordable unsustainable infrastructure that is going to be washed away again in the next storm, be it next year, 5 years from now, or 50. And they certainly shouldn't be pumping sand from the bottom of the ocean to try to keep a migrating island in place. Unaffordable, unsustainable infrastructure is what the bank bailouts were.

Let me coin a phrase "the FEMA coastal living bubble"

Sea level is rising. Storms are becoming more intense. The Ross ice shelf is about to crack off.

I'm sorry for your loss. I'll never tell an individual not to take a handout when they need it and can get it; if you don't take it someone else will. In the same breath I'll never ask my government to give it to you either.


That said... I'm an electrician, plumber, and structural carpenter; free advice if you need it.

[libertygrl]

I'm assuming you're on LBI because that's the video you posted.

LBI is a "migrating barrier island". Stop and think about the larger implications of that statement for a second.

IMHO it should be left to nature... or to those insurance companies which are willing to offer risk policies, or to those individuals who are willing and able to build disposable structures for short term gain. FEMA, .fed .gov etal should not be rebuilding unaffordable unsustainable infrastructure that is going to be washed away again in the next storm, be it next year, 5 years from now, or 50. And they certainly shouldn't be pumping sand from the bottom of the ocean to try to keep a migrating island in place. Unaffordable, unsustainable infrastructure is what the bank bailouts were.

Let me coin a phrase "the FEMA coastal living bubble"

Sea level is rising. Storms are becoming more intense. The Ross ice shelf is about to crack off.

I'm sorry for your loss. I'll never tell an individual not to take a handout when they need it and can get it; if you don't take it someone else will. In the same breath I'll never ask my government to give it to you either.


That said... I'm an electrician, plumber, and structural carpenter; free advice if you need it.

Thank you presence. I do not live on LBI but I do live along the shore. I apologize if the video was misleading. I only chose it for the pictures and the song! So it was a poor choice I guess. I didn't know exactly what a migrating barrier island was until I looked it up:

A barrier island is a long, thin, sandy stretch of land, oriented parallel to the mainland coast that protects the coast from the full force of powerful storm waves. Between the barrier island and the mainland is a calm, protected water body such as a lagoon or bay. Barrier islands are dynamic systems, constantly on the move, migrating under the influence of changing sea levels, storms, waves, tides, and longshore currents. h ttp://www.enotes.com/barrier-islands-reference/barrier-islands

So if I understood you correctly, it's because of this fact that it is a high risk area to live and therefore should not be allowed any government grants. I can understand that. But what about the other people who live elsewhere and are in desparate need of assistance? Just posing a question. Thanks again for your response.

[Victor Grey]

Well opinions on the organization of Fema aside.

60 billion dollars, is enough to fund fema for 10, years.

That is a lot, of darned money for disaster relief. A lot.
Show me differently

Clinton had a bill, that was like, 8 billion or something once.
That was for around 30 states?


IMO this is a tragedy itself. You just don't spend 60 billion on disaster relief. That's wasteful. That's taking advantage of a tragedy to put in pork.

That's a lot of money. I'm repeating myself; I'm dumbfounded by that number.

[alucard13mmfmj]

Where would these tractor trailers full of money be located ? =p.................................

[Victor Grey]

I'm reading now that the total damage done by Sandy, amounts itself to about 60 billion.

The purpose of disaster relief isn't to just buy back everything 100%. It's to get people water, food, power and housing. Couple other things maybe; clear the roads and such. Let them move back in. Get the services going. BASIC things. Then, the places are supposed to rebuild themselves.

Aside philosophy, the idea's basically the same as if you didn't assist. Ultimately they do the work on that.


Obama, wants to give New York and New Jersey that sum amount in total back, except in the hands of government.

That's stupid. It won't work, you can't go back to Kansas again. Not fully in every way. Government isn't smart enough to allocate that money, to a way that will be very useful to the place like normal people acting as individuals would be. You show me a miracle and I'll be convinced that the majority isn't wasted on useless pursuits.

I was dazed by this notion, and now I'm mad.

Man we have a socialistic president. Just, the arrogance. Growing the government isn't going to help that area out much at all. It'll just waste.

I'm depressed and angry.

[tod evans]

I can't help but think that folks in Washington are so out of touch with reality they couldn't find their ass with both hands..

If every property owner was given 100% of the appraised value for their property it wouldn't equate to $60B

[BAllen]

I can't help but think that folks in Washington are so out of touch with reality they couldn't find their ass with both hands..

If every property owner was given 100% of the appraised value for their property it wouldn't equate to $60B

If they didn't prop up the housing market, it would be worth much less than that.

[Cleaner44]

It does NOT take 60+ BILLION to get people food, clothing and shelter while they wait for their insurance companies to fulfil their policy obligations.

[libertygrl]

Is this $60 billion figure coming from Obama or NY/NJ? If it's from the states, don't they each have to provide an assessment of their damages and quantify how they've come to a particular dollar amount for the aid are seeking?

[libertygrl]

So how much does the potential 2016 presidential race figure into this with the possibilty of both Cuomo and Christie running??

Here are some excerpts of articles I found on why they are seeking the amount they are asking for:

State leaders are asking for more than $32 billion in repair costs and another $9 billion in funds to help mitigate and prevent damages from future disaster. In total, Northeast governors are asking Congress to approve an $80 billion appropriation bill to help storm victims.

"The devastation caused by Hurricane Sandy is of unprecedented proportions, ranking among the worst natural disasters in our nation's history in terms of loss of life, property damage, and economic impact," Cuomo said in a released statement. "Working together, we will rebuild stronger and better than ever before, so New York is better prepared and has the infrastructure in place to handle future major weather incidents."

http://w ww.usnews.com/news/articles/2012/12/03/andrew-cuomo-on-capitol-hill-stumping-for-hurricane-sandy-aid


“I know that’s a lot of money," he said in Albany. “I understand the fiscal situation. But that is the need, and we’re looking to meet the need.”

Administration officials would not say which specific requests were being excluded, but other officials monitoring the situation identified several that the White House seemed cool to New York, for instance, sought reimbursement for business owners who lost money while they were closed, as well as for privately held utilities like Consolidated Edison.

Another proposal that may not make the cut was fully reimbursing homeowners for the costs they incur returning damaged and destroyed homes to the condition they were in before the storm.

Supporters of the disaster-relief request are proposing that the money would not have to be offset, or paid for through spending cuts elsewhere. The administration is unlikely to propose a way to pay for the aid and Senator Harry Reid of Nevada, the Democratic majority leader, said he did not believe it should require savings elsewhere. But the House speaker, John A. Boehner of Ohio, is reserving judgment. If the aid is not offset, it would be financed through federal debt.


Mr. Obama’s pending request would leave the states with difficult choices to make. Mr. Cuomo has said he needs $33 billion to repair the New York City subway system, hospitals, homes and other facilities damaged by the storm, and an additional $9 billion to upgrade infrastructure to protect against future storms, for a total of $42 billion. Mr. Christie has said that New Jersey needs $29.5 billion to repair schools, roads, bridges, businesses, homes and other facilities, and $7.4 billion to prevent damage from future storms, a total of $36.9 billion. Gov. Dannel P. Malloy of Connecticut has asked for $3.2 billion, the bulk of it to bury power lines, upgrade transmission systems, build sewage-treatment plants and pay for other projects to guard against future storms.

http://w ww.nytimes.com/2012/12/06/nyregion/obama-to-ask-congress-for-50-billion-in-storm-aid.html

[Brian4Liberty]

Compared to some of my neighbors, my family at least had a home to go back to. We were displaced for 2 weeks. We had some damage with our oil burner and electrical wiring system and other things that we could not afford paying for repairs at this time. Someone suggested contacting FEMA. It's hard to stick to your principles when you've just gone through a traumatic experience and going through a tough economic time as well. We got a little money back which was a big help to pay for some of the damages.

It's been amazing to see the level of volunteers from around the country who have come here to help out. I can't say enough about the Red Cross which came by with their food trucks daily to serve the communities. I mean, what are people supposed to do??? I'm asking this in all sincerity. Are we supposed to wait for charities to donate money? We were able to get repairs taken care of because of the immediate grant we received (and some from home owner's insurance). But I have to be honest. FEMA did get it to us pretty quickly.


Sorry to hear that your home was damaged. Hopefully your possessions in the house survived? Really a bummer for those who lost their homes.

So in your situation, you had a couple of urgent problems that needed to be fixed (heating and electric). Red Cross sounds like they did a good job of delivering food and water. Did insurance cover the repair costs? Was the insurance company slow in paying? If there wasn't any or sufficient insurance coverage, did you have any emergency (rainy day) funds? Was the FEMA money a loan?

How do you differentiate this situation from a person whose heater goes out or wiring goes bad any other day?

[Brian4Liberty]

I can't help but think that folks in Washington are so out of touch with reality they couldn't find their ass with both hands..

If every property owner was given 100% of the appraised value for their property it wouldn't equate to $60B

No doubt the subway repairs will be expensive. It would be interesting to know the value of all homes destroyed though.

[tod evans]

Subway below sea level...........Ummm?

[presence]

Is this $60 billion figure coming from Obama or NY/NJ? If it's from the states, don't they each have to provide an assessment of their damages and quantify how they've come to a particular dollar amount for the aid are seeking?

I believe the states requested 80 obama is requesting "only" 60 on their behalf. I don't have a cite for you... but I'm pretty sure thats what I read recently

eta

I see you actually quoted that 80 figure in your next post.

[VIDEODROME]

As a "Sandy" survivor and a limited government proponent, I have been going back and forth in my mind about this. I'm seriously questioning my position lately when it comes to the issue of national emergencies after what I have personally experienced and have see first hand.

Completely fair question and I think you have a point. I think I've even heard Nick Gillespie say he isn't necessarily against a safety net. He said the real problem is Entitlements.

I also consider the role of government and even the General Welfare clause.

I mean if Government's most basic role is for our common security, is this only for defense against foreign enemies? Or could this apply to natural disasters? I mean a big enough disaster does affect other parts of the nation as corporate headquarters may be in the path of destruction or supply chains are disrupted.

I don't think Government should actually rebuild houses or businesses. Presence has a point though, I think it's true that Government doing a complete bailout and paying to rebuild is a Moral Hazard. However, I think it would be reasonable to act as a partner to help companies and people. Maybe offer shelter, food, and help relocating to relatives. It would help to not have people living in homes with stagnant water and mold.

[libertygrl]

Completely fair question and I think you have a point. I think I've even heard Nick Gillespie say he isn't necessarily against a safety net. He said the real problem is Entitlements.

I also consider the role of government and even the General Welfare clause.

I mean if Government's most basic role is for our common security, is this only for defense against foreign enemies? Or could this apply to natural disasters? I mean a big enough disaster does affect other parts of the nation as corporate headquarters may be in the path of destruction or supply chains are disrupted.

I don't think Government should actually rebuild houses or businesses. Presence has a point though, I think it's true that Government doing a complete bailout and paying to rebuild is a Moral Hazard. However, I think it would be reasonable to act as a partner to help companies and people. Maybe offer shelter, food, and help relocating to relatives. It would help to not have people living in homes with stagnant water and mold.

Yeah, this was tough. I was just discussing this with a neighbor (who happens to be a senior AND a Ron Paul supporter) He said because this was a catastrophic storm, he didn't have a problem accepting federal aid. This storm caused tremendous damage and destruction that usually happens once in 100 years. However, he was one of the lucky ones. He wonders if had lost his home, where would he go? How would he survive living on a fixed income? In that case, he would have needed much more in federal aid. So I guess I'd be in the Nick Gillespe camp. Sometimes we tend to see things only in black and white and that's not always the case.

[gerryb1]

Imagine if the fedgov didn't steal 20-50% of everyone's incomes, how much they would be able to afford to prepare themselves? And how much generous charity would be freely given?

We wouldn't be starving people by mis-directing resources to rebuild an island whose natural purpose is to be destroyed.

[libertygrl]

Imagine if the fedgov didn't steal 20-50% of everyone's incomes, how much they would be able to afford to prepare themselves? And how much generous charity would be freely given?



That's an excellent point.