Alex Jones - Covers Secessionist Movement & Draft Ron Paul to Restore the Republic

[libertygrl]

Listening now.... Very interesting discussion between A.J. and Vieira. This is a MUST:

Alex Jones will break down what the exploding secessionist movement really means and the federal government's plan to crush the states and sideline their rights guaranteed under the Constitution and the Tenth Amendment. Constitutional lawyer Edwin Vieira, Jr. will examine the different angles on the burgeoning movement and Alex will give you the key to true secession and how it can lead to true restoration of the Republic. We will also cover the historic farewell speech by Rep. Ron Paul on this Thursday, November 15 edition of the Alex Jones Show.

h ttp://www.infowars.com/

[Travlyr]

Listening now. It is very good. Dr. Edwin Vieira, Jr. has a plan to restore liberty.

[matt0611]

Dr. Viera is great. He really knows the Constitution.

[jmdrake]

//

[donnay]

This is a great show!!

Vieira is pointing out that Dr. Paul has not compromised his principles which is what many of us diehard supporters have been saying all along.

[libertygrl]

Whoa.. this could be BIG. Draft Dr. Paul to lead this movement?? Poor Dr. Paul. I'm wondering whether he would really want to do this. I mean, the guy probably just wants to retire and relax with his wife and grandkids.

[libertygrl]

RESTORATIONISTS! They need to set the narrative NOW before the media does and brainwashes the people into calling this a racist movement against Obama.

[Travlyr]

Whoa.. this could be BIG. Draft Dr. Paul to lead this movement?? Poor Dr. Paul. I'm wondering whether he would really want to do this. I mean, the guy probably just wants to retire and relax with his wife and grandkids.

It could be BIG. Alex Jones is fired up and I agree with Dr. Vieira. Ron Paul is the leader because of his principled integrity. The liberty movement will need plenty of principled State candidates as well. It is a great opportunity for people who understand individual liberty to step-up to the plate and get themselves elected at local levels and State levels. Forget worrying about the Feds for now.

Draft Ron Paul.

[donnay]

Whoa.. this could be BIG. Draft Dr. Paul to lead this movement?? Poor Dr. Paul. I'm wondering whether he would really want to do this. I mean, the guy probably just wants to retire and relax with his wife and grandkids.

I think Dr. Paul understands his children and grandchildren have no future if he doesn't move forward and stay active.

Dr. Paul's Farewell address was great!

[jllundqu]

Drudge linked to Infowars saying "Talk Host Calls for Second American Revolution"

They should be getting s boatload of traffic now!

Interesting.

[itshappening]

what did he say ??

[Anti Federalist]

Epic.

[jllundqu]

He's calling for a new Declaration of Independence, storming the state government offices and declaring restoration of the republic, drafting Ron Paul to lead the movement, etc.

[libertygrl]

Dr. Paul got questions about the movement today when he was on CSPAN. He was asked whether he supports the secessionist movement and if it's treasonist. I wonder if Jones and Vieira are on the same page about this as Dr. Paul because A.J. was so excited today, I thought he was going to jump out of his skin. This is just an excerpt from CSPAN:

"Well, I don't call for secession but I call for the principle of secession being recognized. The founders believed in it. There's no prohibition in the constitution against secession. They all understood they were coming together and if they're volunteering to come together, they could volunteer and leave anytime they want. They were protected in that belief with the 10th amendment. But now... you know...people say, "oh these people need to be put on a list".. a list that they are committing treason! Put in prison or thrown out of the country! You know? What about the first amendment?

The principle of secession is very important. Not so much for the purpose of seceeding, but the purpose of saying to the federal government if you mistreat us, that's what we migh consider. So, I don't think anybody is serious about that happening soon or anything else, but if you just had that principle. Nullification is the same thing. What if the states could nullify the law? Look how wonderful it would have been to solve the problem of Obama care if the states could just nullify the thing and get out of it. So, nullification and secession should always be there....

[tod evans]

Please tube it I'm to stupid to figure out how to make AJ's site go on this 'puter...

http://cdn.uberreview.com/wp-content/uploads/nat-audio-magma-tube-amplifier-1.jpg

[Travlyr]

I wish I knew how to tube stuff so tod could hear Alex on his 'puter. But I don't. Perhaps someone will.

It was interesting that Alex had Dr. Edwin Vieira, Jr. on first and then Lew Rockwell. Dr. Vieira is likely the foremost constitutional scholar of our time, and he actively promotes using the constitution as a tool to take our liberty back. And then Lew Rockwell comes on saying that he didn't sign the constitution and referred to the ideas of Spooner as being the future. Lew gave lip service to the Declaration of Independence as our founding document which is what Abraham Lincoln defended as a basis for his morality against slavery. LOL... It'll be interesting to see if Dr. Paul continues to take the lead. I expect he will... and I certainly hope so. Things are getting exciting in the liberty movement and when Ron Paul is finished in Washington D.C. I expect fireworks!

[donnay]

Please tube it I'm to stupid to figure out how to make AJ's site go on this 'puter...

http://cdn.uberreview.com/wp-content/uploads/nat-audio-magma-tube-amplifier-1.jpg



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EFd5r3H3Bn4

[libertygrl]

If this is indeed a new movement forming (in principle and not in actuality), I think people need to be VERY cautious it doesn't go the way of the Ron Paul Tea Party. Case in point - the other night I saw Hannity interviewing a guy from TX who was a secessionist activist. Seems very fishy to me. You don't hear about the Tea Parties anymore... The GOP lost BIG time and many Conservative voters are getting fed up with the party. The Ron Paul Tea Party got very close to uniting both Liberals & Conservatives against the system, until Faux News with Beck, Hannity, and then the emergence of Palin, steered it toward the Republican establishment thus allowing the left/right paradigm to continue, (as well as support for the same foreign policy).

If Romney had won, there would be no talk of secession. The GOP establishment needs a new movement to jump onto to keep people loyal to their party. Is it me, or are some similar signs emerging? Also, the movement should take over the narrative by creating more "softer" sounding descriptions like Vieira suggested - Reformationists instead of Secessionists.

You know the game - they choose certain words to put together to make it appear more palatable to the public like "The Patriot Act" or "Smart Weapon." Because I guarentee you, the liberal side of the media is going to jump all over this and come up with something new to replace the word "tea-baggers."

By the way - here's a post about the Hannity show:

Sean Hannity fanned the flames of insurrection last night on his show. His guest was Texas Nationalist Movement president Daniel Miller, who Hannity treated seriously like a sane person in an otherworldly discussion of whether red states should secede. Says Miller:

“The fact of the matter is, that there cannot be a union between those who esteem the principles of Karl Marx over the principles of Thomas Jefferson. Here in Texas, we esteem those principles of Thomas Jefferson — that all political power’s inherent in the people. What we have seen given on Tuesday was that a majority of the people in the United States, and the states in which they reside, esteem the principles of Karl Marx over those principles.”

http://w ww.nashvillescene.com/pitw/archives/2012/11/14/behind-rebel-lines-dispatches-from-the-secessionist-movement


See? Just like they did with the Tea Party, the controlled media is already getting involved to make this out to be a Republican vs. Democrat thing when in actuality, the whole system is corrupt. Will the people fall for it again?? Any thoughts?

[dinosaur]

He's calling for a new Declaration of Independence, storming the state government offices and declaring restoration of the republic, drafting Ron Paul to lead the movement, etc.

So AJ is basically calling for war and wants RP to be our general?

[mac_hine]

Epic.


Let's play out this fantasy, AF........

Say this secession movement got some legs, Texas was able to withdraw itself from the union and Ron Paul was drafted as president of the Republic of Texas. Would you leave the "Free State" of NH and hightail it over there?

I would definitely consider doing so.

[tod evans]

Good God Alex is obnoxious!

But I like what he's saying....

[libertygrl]

So AJ is basically calling for war and wants RP to be our general?

LOL. I don't think so... but I'll have to listen to him again. He gets so excitable. :p If he's talking in principle about secession like Dr. Paul did on CSPAN maybe Dr. Paul would listen to what he has to say. If not, then he shouldn't get his hopes up too high about Dr. Paul charging in on his white horse to save us. LOL

[donnay]

If this is indeed a new movement forming (in principle and not in actuality), I think people need to be VERY cautious it doesn't go the way of the Ron Paul Tea Party. Case in point - the other night I saw Hannity interviewing a guy from TX who was a secessionist activist. Seems very fishy to me. You don't hear about the Tea Parties anymore... The GOP lost BIG time and many Conservative voters are getting fed up with the party. The Ron Paul Tea Party got very close to uniting both Liberals & Conservatives against the system, until Faux News with Beck, Hannity, and then the emergence of Palin, steered it toward the Republican establishment thus allowing the left/right paradigm to continue, (as well as support for the same foreign policy).

If Romney had won, there would be no talk of secession. The GOP establishment needs a new movement to jump onto to keep people loyal to their party. Is it me, or are some similar signs emerging? Also, the movement should take over the narrative by creating more "softer" sounding descriptions like Vieira suggested - Reformationists instead of Secessionists.

You know the game - they choose certain words to put together to make it appear more palatable to the public like "The Patriot Act" or "Smart Weapon." Because I guarentee you, the liberal side of the media is going to jump all over this and come up with something new to replace the word "tea-baggers." Any thoughts??


Join the 10th Amendment Center--get together with like-minded people who want unbridled liberty. Civil disobedience! Tell the Fed to go to hell.

[mac_hine]

"This will be the most important broadcast in my 17 years on air." ~AJ

Is it just me or has he said this no less than 17 times in the past?

It is captivating radio though.

[libertygrl]

Join the 10th Amendment Center--get together with like-minded people who want unbridled liberty. Civil disobedience! Tell the Fed to go to hell.

Here's their video:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61U6vnBLJzU&feature=plcp

[Jordan]

We have some political firepower now; let's not overextend our growing presence within the GOP, which is only starting to hear us out, by aligning with someone who has virtually no credibility (Alex Jones.)

[donnay]

We have some political firepower now; let's not overextend our growing presence within the GOP, which is only starting to hear us out, by aligning with someone who has virtually no credibility (Alex Jones.)

:rolleyes:

“In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.” ~ Mark Twain

[libertygrl]

Here is the website of the TX nationalist movement started by Daniel Miller who has been a guest on Hannity and Glen Beck. I'd be curious to know more about this guy's background. For all we know, he could be a neo-con or shill for the GOP. Just wondering if he's a legit grassroots guy. Be careful of all these groups that will pop up now, just like the many Republican backed Tea Parties did.

Here's a brief bio:

Over the years, as a result of daily immersion by his parents, Daniel stayed politically active and aware.

Since 1992, he has worked as a field volunteer for many Republican candidates and in 1996 was elected as Chairman of the Gregg County Constitutional Committee. This was a citizen-led initiative to draft a new Constitution for Texas.

He also worked as the Public Relations Director for CAP-IT, an organization founded in Longview to force regulation of sexually oriented businesses.

Miller is currently the President of the Texas Nationalist Movement which is the largest and oldest organization promoting the interests of freedom, liberty and independence in Texas.

While President of TNM he has testified in front of the State Affairs Committee in the Texas House of Representatives on HCR 50 (State Sovereignty Resolution) and worked to build public pressure in support of Texas sovereignty.

As a frequent speaker at meetings, events and rallies for TEA Party and other liberty-oriented organizations and causes, he has been featured on every major news network and in most major newspapers in the Texas, the United States and around the world. He has also been a guest on the Glenn Beck Program, BBC News, RT-TV and many other news outlets. In all of these, he has been an outspoken advocate for Texas.

He recently stepped down as the host of the long-running radio show, Texas Perspective, a talk radio and commentary program focused on examining current events from a Texas point-of-view. Texas Perspective began its run as an internet-only broadcast before moving to AM 1300 KSET in Beaumont.

In 2011, Miller authored, Line In The Sand, about Texas Nationalism and the current political, cultural and economic situation in Texas and the United States which is in its fourth printing.

h ttp://www.texasnationalist.com/

[libertygrl]

What others are saying about secession:

The reason for these movements may lie not in disillusionment with the federal government, but with the re-election of President Barack Obama. Many of the secessionist movements are based in the ideas espoused in the Declaration of Independence, as well as the 10th Amendment. The former speaks to the dissolution of any government the people believe to be unjust, while the latter is the basis for the concept of states' rights.

As many of the secession petitions are from states whose electors were on the losing side of the presidential election, it may be fair to assume this could be little more than a case of sour grapes on the part of political extremists. It can also be fair to assume that, in some cases, this could be a matter of citizens being disgusted with what they see as overreaches by the feds, and that this is their way of slapping the hand of Uncle Sam as if to say "back off, buster!"

The best way to address this movement may simply be to let them have their say, then let them go away.

h ttp://www.examiner.com/article/despite-resurgence-secession-movement-shoud-not-be-taken-seriously


Elizabeth Dias of Time Magazine says the secession petitions really amount to nothing more than "comic relief," and she reminds us that many liberals upset with the re-election of George W. Bush in 2004 threatened to move to Canada. (Reportedly there are some conservatives now pondering this move. However, very, very few people from the left or right follow through.) But Dias says it's not all fun and games, though:

There is a seamy aspect to the surge in petitions as well. Little concrete information is known about most of the signatories. Their names have not been verified, and anyone can sign as many petitions as they like. Southern nationalists have rallied around the idea, and many may consider it a last-ditch effort to preserve the notion of white supremacy in the U.S. rather than a post-election joke. "The election results were really great for our cause," says Michael Cushman, 36, an advocate of secession and founder of the Southern Nationalist Network. "I think it was better that Obama won because it has revived a lot interest in secession in the South because he is very unpopular here."

People wishing for secession should realize their states would be stepping into a logistical nightmare if they broke from the union, according to a report from NBC 17 in North Carolina. No. 1, secession from the union has been ruled to be illegal by the Supreme Court. If a state somehow gets around that, there are host of other problems it would confront:

"It would be chaos," William Peace University political science professor David McLennan said of the prospect. "It would potentially disrupt business, legal contracts, transportation, et cetera." McLennan added, "You have a host of problems, from the structure of government -- North Carolina has no army, navy, air force or marines, for example. It would need a currency and start establishing legal treaties with other countries and, presumably, the United States." Should the state secede, McLennan says North Carolina would be stripped of its military bases and federal aid -- such as money from the Federal Emergency Management Agency, which could serve as a bargaining tool for the federal government. "The U.S. would decommission [military bases]. They cannot have bases in foreign countries, generally, unless invited in or in times of war," McLennan explained.

... But the military isn't the only big industry that would leave North Carolina. "Most banks in Charlotte would leave; most researchers in RTP would leave. Companies would close," University of North Carolina professor Joseph Glatthaar said. "With horribly depleted resources, North Carolina would have to defend its borders and police the population. Property values would collapse. Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid would disappear, so elderly and poor would all have to leave North Carolina. In fact, anyone in their 50s would probably feel as though they should move soon. And that is just the beginning." ..

h ttp://www.cleveland.com/nation/index.ssf/2012/11/secession_petitions_serious_mo.html


Excerpts from a Huffington Post article:

I hate to disappoint the 675,000 whiny diaper babies calling for secession in the wake of the election but, sorry, no matter how hard they stomp their feet and pout and fling their feces at the electoral map, demands for secession might as well be demands for goblins and unicorns. They're equally as realistic.

Secession from the United States will never happen.

Ever.

Not only is it illegal, but it's technically an act of treason as defined by the Constitution, and it was ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court in Texas v. White. Furthermore, the secessionists aren't merely condemning the Obama administration, secession is by definition a categorical rejection of the United States and its Constitution, say nothing of the beloved Pledge of Allegiance, which specifically includes the word "indivisible" right after the word "God." I thought these things were sacrosanct to conservatives.

The impossible reality of a successful confederacy would be further exacerbated by the secession precedent. States would end up splitting into smaller and smaller pieces with parts of states seceded from other parts -- subdividing and subdividing until the confederacy vaporized or was reunified into a more traditional federalist system.

Again, this isn't speculative. This is tested reality. The Confederate States of America ended up with a strong central government because it quickly learned that it couldn't fight a war and manage its economy without one. Years earlier, the disastrous Articles of Confederation were dismantled and replaced with the U.S. Constitution with a strong central government and a powerful chief executive as its centerpiece.

So if you're one of the now hundreds of thousands of signatories to these ridiculous petitions, think about the reality of what you've endorsed. You signed a petition to disconnect yourself from the United States of America and, perhaps, to wage war against it. If you're on Social Security -- gone. If you're on Medicare -- gone. If your children attend public or charter schools -- gone. If you work for a defense contractor or another corporation that relies on government contracts -- gone. Hell, if you rely on the internet to do business -- gone. And in the worst case scenario, you should be prepared to wage war against the most powerful military in the history of mankind, augmented by the military might of other allied nations.

And if you're inclined to storm off like a drama-queen reality show contestant -- if you're inclined to "Go Galt" as so many conservatives threatened to do four years ago -- then run off into the forest and live off the grid for while until you calm down from your post-election hysteria. While you're there, wise up.

h ttp://www.huffingtonpost.com/bob-cesca/secession-obama-2012_b_2138541.html?utm_hp_ref=barack-obama

[Anti Federalist]

Actually, that's a bad ass analog tube type amplifier.

NAT is top of the line.

I'd love to own one.


Please tube it I'm to stupid to figure out how to make AJ's site go on this 'puter...

http://cdn.uberreview.com/wp-content/uploads/nat-audio-magma-tube-amplifier-1.jpg

[tod evans]

Actually, that's a bad ass analog tube type amplifier.

NAT is top of the line.

I'd love to own one.

North of $20K, yeah me too!

[Anti Federalist]

Not only is it illegal, but it's technically an act of treason as defined by the Constitution, and it was ruled unconstitutional by the Supreme Court in Texas v. White. Furthermore, the secessionists aren't merely condemning the Obama administration, secession is by definition a categorical rejection of the United States and its Constitution, say nothing of the beloved Pledge of Allegiance, which specifically includes the word "indivisible" right after the word "God." I thought these things were sacrosanct to conservatives.

LOL at asking "permission" to leave from the tyranny you are departing from.

Might as well ask an abusive spouse if you may please leave.

[tod evans]

... But the military isn't the only big industry that would leave North Carolina. "Most banks in Charlotte would leave; most researchers in RTP would leave. Companies would close," University of North Carolina professor Joseph Glatthaar said. "With horribly depleted resources, North Carolina would have to defend its borders and police the population. Property values would collapse. Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid would disappear, so elderly and poor would all have to leave North Carolina. In fact, anyone in their 50s would probably feel as though they should move soon. And that is just the beginning." .[/B].



Sounds like manna from heaven to me and I'm over 50....

[Anti Federalist]

Hell, if you rely on the internet to do business -- gone.

LOL - Burkina Faso, "the Disputed Zone" and Somalia has internet service.


And in the worst case scenario, you should be prepared to wage war against the most powerful military in the history of mankind, augmented by the military might of other allied nations.

At least this author is honest about it.

Just like an abusive spouse, they'll kill you before just letting walk out the door in peace.

The mask is now off.

[NewRightLibertarian]

At least this author is honest about it.

Just like an abusive spouse, they'll kill you before just letting walk out the door in peace.

The mask is now off.

It's the same as it was in 1861. Our big advantage is the globalized world. If we can get enough people from enough states to get in on it, we could pull it off. Alex Jones actually did a good job describing it today from the hour of his show I heard. We wouldn't be seceeding to form a new government. We'd just be seceeding from the Federal terrorists to restore the Constitution. We should frame it in these terms.

[Anti Federalist]

But the commenters are right about one thing, it's all talk in a bag, just wind in sails.

Butthurt democrats said the same thing in 2000.

And gloating republicans called them whiny infants.

Blarg blarg blarg, while Rome burns...

[anaconda]

If this is indeed a new movement forming (in principle and not in actuality), I think people need to be VERY cautious it doesn't go the way of the Ron Paul Tea Party. Case in point - the other night I saw Hannity interviewing a guy from TX who was a secessionist activist. Seems very fishy to me. You don't hear about the Tea Parties anymore... The GOP lost BIG time and many Conservative voters are getting fed up with the party. The Ron Paul Tea Party got very close to uniting both Liberals & Conservatives against the system, until Faux News with Beck, Hannity, and then the emergence of Palin, steered it toward the Republican establishment thus allowing the left/right paradigm to continue, (as well as support for the same foreign policy).

If Romney had won, there would be no talk of secession. The GOP establishment needs a new movement to jump onto to keep people loyal to their party. Is it me, or are some similar signs emerging? Also, the movement should take over the narrative by creating more "softer" sounding descriptions like Vieira suggested - Reformationists instead of Secessionists.

You know the game - they choose certain words to put together to make it appear more palatable to the public like "The Patriot Act" or "Smart Weapon." Because I guarentee you, the liberal side of the media is going to jump all over this and come up with something new to replace the word "tea-baggers."

By the way - here's a post about the Hannity show:

Sean Hannity fanned the flames of insurrection last night on his show. His guest was Texas Nationalist Movement president Daniel Miller, who Hannity treated seriously like a sane person in an otherworldly discussion of whether red states should secede. Says Miller:

“The fact of the matter is, that there cannot be a union between those who esteem the principles of Karl Marx over the principles of Thomas Jefferson. Here in Texas, we esteem those principles of Thomas Jefferson — that all political power’s inherent in the people. What we have seen given on Tuesday was that a majority of the people in the United States, and the states in which they reside, esteem the principles of Karl Marx over those principles.”

http://w ww.nashvillescene.com/pitw/archives/2012/11/14/behind-rebel-lines-dispatches-from-the-secessionist-movement


See? Just like they did with the Tea Party, the controlled media is already getting involved to make this out to be a Republican vs. Democrat thing when in actuality, the whole system is corrupt. Will the people fall for it again?? Any thoughts?


Everything you've said is correct and germane. The PTB are really skilled at co opting insurrections. They do it at home and abroad. And what's really frightening is that the masses generally believe the narratives from the media and the politicians regarding their interventions.

Also, I worry about tyrannies controlling the individual states.

[donnay]

Actually, that's a bad ass analog tube type amplifier.

NAT is top of the line.

I'd love to own one.

Looks like a sewing machine with a light bulb. :D

[Shane Harris]

Texas seems too nationalist and "patriotic" to abandon the Union.

[anaconda]

Isn't A.J. off track when he speculates that the "states" can meet and sort this out? Aren't they also corrupt in their leadership due to decades of federal intervention?

[Anti Federalist]

Looks like a sewing machine with a light bulb. :D

Face...meet Palm.

Palm...Face.

[Anti Federalist]

Texas seems too nationalist and "patriotic" to abandon the Union.

Pretty much.

TX was a democrat stronghold when I was a kid.

[Shane Harris]

How about individual secession? Can I personally secede? Pretty please with freedom on top

[AuH20]

Texas seems too nationalist and "patriotic" to abandon the Union.

Not if they are continually abused.

[Peace&Freedom]

The respectful treatment Hannity gave the movement is more worrisome than the derision heaped upon it by the left side of the paradigm. Just like with the early Tea Party, the establishment supplies its one-two punch---the left accuses it of racism to scare away Democrats attracted to it, then the neo-cons move in to steer it from the inside, towards a get-the-Democrats campaign in the next round of elections. It represents the co-opt side of the establishment paradigm, perhaps wanting to get control of secession right out of the gate. Welcome to the Glenn Beck 2.0 attempt to steer an alternative movement.

[Jordan]

:rolleyes:

“In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.” ~ Mark Twain

If every time we get close to becoming mainstream we just retreat deeper to political extremism we'll never get anything accomplished.

[jllundqu]

:rolleyes:

“In the beginning of a change the patriot is a scarce man, and brave, and hated and scorned. When his cause succeeds, the timid join him, for then it costs nothing to be a patriot.” ~ Mark Twain

And how!

[libertygrl]

The respectful treatment Hannity gave the movement is more worrisome than the derision heaped upon it by the left side of the paradigm. Just like with the early Tea Party, the establishment supplies its one-two punch---the left accuses it of racism to scare away Democrats attracted to it, then the neo-cons move in to steer it from the inside, towards a get-the-Democrats campaign in the next round of elections. It represents the co-opt side of the establishment paradigm, perhaps wanting to get control of secession right out of the gate. Welcome to the Glenn Beck 2.0 attempt to steer an alternative movement.

Exactly.. that's exactly how I see it. After awhile their methods become so transparant. We'll, at least to SOME of us. But how do people in the liberty movemenr steer this away from what happened last time?