Press release for Zogby Poll

[BrianH]

When I learned Jones Productions was Alex Jones' firm I thought the media would never touch this. Even google ban him. Heck even this forum buried the thread in a side forum!

So what to do? This is a huge story. It only cost $4500 for the poll. We could run it again without Alex Jones's name associated with it. We could try to promote reviews on the blogs which don't link to Alex Jones. Like: http://truthseeds.org/2007/11/19/ron-paul-wins-latest-zogby-poll/ But I doubt the MSM would buy that.

We need to get on this and fast. Supporters here are willing to chipin for a rerun of this poll. Alex has shown the way - but we need someone else who the media will not trash to run with this. Ideas?

[rpliving]

Where is the zogby link? Thats why people are ignoring it.

[Ridiculous]

A blind poll will never hold any water.

[BrianH]

Where is the zogby link? Thats why people are ignoring it.

According to Prison Planet they wanted more money to do a press release. Sounds weird, but the story said that Jones Productions was looking to do this and maybe do another poll with another company next week. I wrote to Alex Jones Radio to offer assistance but have not heard back. This needs to happen without Alex Jones IMO before the media will touch it.

[cliche]

I sure hope the media ignores this. The poll questions are ridiculous and was funded by somebody with an agenda.

Time and money are better spent getting Ron Paul higher in the "acceptable" polls. This is junk news.

[pcosmar]

I sure hope the media ignores this. The poll questions are ridiculous and was funded by somebody with an agenda.

Time and money are better spent getting Ron Paul higher in the "acceptable" polls. This is junk news.

What a bright flash of complete ignorance.

[BrianH]

A blind poll will never hold any water.

I agree - but this was "semi blind" when you read the "bios" of the candidates there was no doubt who they were referring to. What it told me was that people know so little about Ron Paul, they may not have even recognised his bio, or if they did they liked it.

Kucinich supporters did something similar in July - he got something like 80% and the campaign was going nuts about it - an "issues only" poll which turned out Kucinich was number one by a huge margin. Even my answers favored him as there was no questions that would support Ron Paul's platform. So that was a biased poll.

But this one I think is much better. They make hardly any attempt to conceal who the candidates are and it is very simple.

[freelance]

A blind poll will never hold any water.

This particular blind poll hints at two things:

It's the message, but without name recognition, it doesn't matter. It hints that connecting the message to the man is the challenge.

It's interesting that so many want proof from double-blind studies whenever we talk about alternative health while people dismiss blind polling out of hand.

Does ANYONE realize that campaigns commission internal polls all the time. Consider this for what it is--an internal poll.

For those who feel that this poll is flawed, no one is stopping you from commissioning your own poll. I'm sure that Mr. Zogby would take your money.

[Adamsa]

I think if 50% of America knew Ron Paul and his positions well, he'd get the nomination.

[Hope]

It needs to be ignored. The only useful thing about it is that it tells us there are a lot of people who would get on board with RP if they knew who he was -- but we already know that.

It's hypocrtical and intensely lame to say, "Ron Paul getting 2% isn't accurate" and then insisting that everyone should pay attention when Alex Jones buys a poll where Ron does well. You can't have your cake and eat it too. We certainly shouldn't spend money that could be going to the campaign on Zogby.

[AlexMerced]

yeah, if were to pay them polling, it should be a poll of substance

[BrianH]

yeah, if were to pay them polling, it should be a poll of substance

So how to improve it? A bigger poll?

I believe someone who is an expert at this needs to advise. I see the situation we are in maybe without precedent. Last GOP presidential primary was to get Bush in a second time-- people left the GOP in droves. in my precinct TEN people showed up to vote in the primary - the lowest on record ever. So now lots of folks in Iowa are registered as no party or democrats. And they are the MAJORITY of the Ron Paul supporters in our area.

This is why there is a huge disconnect between the straw polls, the online polls and the telephone polls. There is a massive opportunity for a smart pollster to figure out how to do it differently and get a result more respresentative of the massive grassroots support for Ron Paul.

It's no use saying "we know that -forget this idea". TONS of people DO NOT KNOW this and this poll was one way to address that problem.

[KingTheoden]

I'm surprised to see people bashing AJ for this poll. Yes, it is a blind issues poll (however the questions make it obvious who the candidates are) and no, the questions were not slanted to support Ron Paul. Romney's bio was pretty over the top silly.

The media will often use blind polls or other polling techniques to push people into answering a certain way. It is also a fact that the polls that put Ron Paul at 2% use methods to discount Ron Paul supporters. Perhaps the most agregious one is the inflater/deflater value that a polling agency assigns a candidate. They can and do say 'well, historically x group does not vote so we will diminish their results by multiplying by .35.'

Whatever you think of Jones, he dropped a wad of cash on this poll. It is one thing to say we should be cautious and reserved about this poll - that is how I am. But to just say it is worth nothing because it is a bio poll or because Jones paid for it is absurd.

[Duckman]

Whatever you think of Jones, he dropped a wad of cash on this poll. It is one thing to say we should be cautious and reserved about this poll - that is how I am. But to just say it is worth nothing because it is a bio poll or because Jones paid for it is absurd.

I think this poll has merit if true but it seems fishy to me that Alex Jones paid for it and there is no link on Zogby to substantiate the claims. I think if Alex can't get Zogby to post the results on their website to substantiate these poll results then frankly Alex Jones wasted his money to have this poll conducted.

I think we need to realize that we have to stay open minded and level headed, and not blindly accept good news from a biased source without independent confirmation. Otherwise, we may all look dumb later.

[AlexMerced]

I don't doubt the Polls results, but the implications I don't think are important, what we need is awareness

[BrianH]

I don't doubt the Polls results, but the implications I don't think are important, what we need is awareness

So??? what are you suggesting? I started this thread to look at action we could do to address this serious problem of the polling. That is why the media keep saying over and over again Ron has no chance, if they bother reporting at all.

[Naraku]

If I commissioned a poll I'd put their names in it, but also include a list of positions for each name and have each issue listed by which issues were identified in previous polls as the most important.

[Ninja Homer]

I think this poll has merit if true but it seems fishy to me that Alex Jones paid for it and there is no link on Zogby to substantiate the claims. I think if Alex can't get Zogby to post the results on their website to substantiate these poll results then frankly Alex Jones wasted his money to have this poll conducted.

I think we need to realize that we have to stay open minded and level headed, and not blindly accept good news from a biased source without independent confirmation. Otherwise, we may all look dumb later.

Zogby wants additional money for them to post the poll on their site. Alex Jones said he's going to do it.

This poll is definitely newsworthy to BM (Big Media), but not until it's posted on Zogby's site.

[pcosmar]

You want another poll?
Put your money where your mouth is.
This poll was commissioned, as are ALL polls.
Put up or shut up.

[KingTheoden]

I think this poll has merit if true but it seems fishy to me that Alex Jones paid for it and there is no link on Zogby to substantiate the claims. I think if Alex can't get Zogby to post the results on their website to substantiate these poll results then frankly Alex Jones wasted his money to have this poll conducted.

I think we need to realize that we have to stay open minded and level headed, and not blindly accept good news from a biased source without independent confirmation. Otherwise, we may all look dumb later.

He says he has a director form Zogby coming on to discuss the poll today. He also stated that Zoby will come out with an official release this week.

[Pharoah]

Official Zogby press release paints Ghouliani as the winner. :rolleyes:
Checkout the methodology page to learn that 1009 people were polled - but that's not what the press release says.

http://www.zogby.com/methodology/readmeth.dbm?ID=1235

[Revolution9]

So??? what are you suggesting? I started this thread to look at action we could do to address this serious problem of the polling. That is why the media keep saying over and over again Ron has no chance, if they bother reporting at all.

I am with ya Brian.. These other people just seem like a bunch of busybody naysayers who jus don't like AJ, no matter what he does. Pathetically childish in my opinion. They don't like this poll because it is not "scientific" but will bend their knee and bow their head to the other fixed polls as though they are the gods honest truth.. And then go turn on Glen Beck who is not even in the same league of journalism as AJ and drool all over his words as they take 150% notice of all he says.

Randy

[MEGAMERICAN]

It needs to be ignored. The only useful thing about it is that it tells us there are a lot of people who would get on board with RP if they knew who he was -- but we already know that.

It's hypocrtical and intensely lame to say, "Ron Paul getting 2% isn't accurate" and then insisting that everyone should pay attention when Alex Jones buys a poll where Ron does well. You can't have your cake and eat it too. We certainly shouldn't spend money that could be going to the campaign on Zogby.

Alex Jones has already maxed out the amount he can give to Ron Paul. Yes, he funded the poll, but that doesn't mean he had complete control over everything. If you read the actual questions you'll see that it is about as fair as can be for all 4 candidates. The bios were chosen by Zogby and Jones only changed a few words so it wouldn't call any candidate a "great leader" or any other weasel words.

This poll should NOT be ignored. Look at Zogby's actual press release.
http://www.zogby.com/news/ReadNews.dbm?ID=1391
They focus on a small subgroup of people that they knew were hardcore GOP people. The headline is about Giuliani winning a small subgroup. They only mention Ron Paul at the end in a small paragraph. That was the only demographic where Ron Paul got last place and one of the few that he lost.

Paul won every religious demographic, every minority, NASCAR fans, etc. He wasn't far behind in the name recognition questions either.