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Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 12:36 PM
Yah, you know what, I know some of you are tired of hearing about this, I read some of the crabbing about it in other threads.

But, for fuck's sake, this ain't paranoia, this ain't "cop bashing", these are not "isolated incidents" done by a few "bad apples".

This is systemic and is getting worse and it will only be a matter of time before it is people, in fact, in many cases it is people.

Standing army of oppression.




Family wants answers after officer allegedly guns down family pet

Posted: Sep 10, 2012 2:05 PM EDT Updated: Sep 10, 2012 2:12 PM EDT

By Kristin Moore, WNEM TV5 Reporter
By Tom Plahutnik, Web Editor/Produce

http://www.wnem.com/story/19503465/family-wants-answers-after-officer-guns-down-family-pet

http://wnem.images.worldnow.com/images/19503465_BG1.jpg

A local family is still shocked after what happened to their beloved pet. They say their dog was shot and killed at the hands of a police officer.

The shooting happened Saturday in St. Louis, Mich., in Gratiot County.

Lori Walmsley, a neighbor of the family who lost their pet, says she saw the incident.

Walmsley says she was outside playing with her own dog when her neighbor's golden retriever, Scout, ran over into her yard. She says she called the dog over to play, which Scout did, and then Scout ran back over back into his own yard. That's when Walmsley says a police officer showed up.

Walmsley said the officer asked if the was dog hers. She said "no," but told the officer Scout wasn't dangerous. She says the officer tried to catch the dog, who apparently didn't want to be caught. The dog tried to run away and when cornered by the officer, let out a little growl. Walmsley says she couldn't believe what happened next.

"I heard 'pop pop pop pop pop,' and I thought, 'what is going on,' and I [saw] the St. Louis Police Department standing over my dog," said Scout's owner.

"He just started shooting him, he just kept shooting him in the head," said Walmsley. "I said, 'What are you doing? He's just a puppy!'"

The dog was taken to the vet were it later died.

The witness says the officer wasn't provoked and she doesn't feel his reaction was warranted. Scout's owners were inside their house during the incident.

TV5 has tried several times to talk to the officer involved, or someone from the St. Louis Police department. We'll have much more on the story tonight on TV5 News at 6 p.m. when we take The Tough Questions to the police department.

ZENemy
09-10-2012, 12:39 PM
Yah, you know what, I know some of you are tired of hearing about this, I read some of the crabbing about it in other threads.

But, for fuck's sake, this ain't paranoia, this ain't "cop bashing", these are not "isolated incidents" done by a few "bad apples".

This is systemic and is getting worse and it will only be a matter of time before it is people, in fact, in many cases it is people.

Standing army of oppression.


I could not say it better so Ill just quote you. :D

AGRP
09-10-2012, 12:40 PM
The written story is deceiving. Heres what he said in the video:

"The cop came out. Opened up my gate. The dog came out. He [the cop] cornered him right over here and the dog growled at him so he shot him..."

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 12:43 PM
Video @ link.

Linky no worky

Dr.3D
09-10-2012, 12:44 PM
I don't want to see another bloody shot dog. Damnitall

cajuncocoa
09-10-2012, 12:45 PM
I'm glad you bring these abuses to our attention...but it's so heart-breaking to read this kind of thing. :(

Brian4Liberty
09-10-2012, 12:52 PM
Uh, the owner said that the dog was 8 years old. Not that it matters, other than the thread title being wrong.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 12:52 PM
The written story is deceiving. Heres what he said in the video:

"The cop came out. Opened up my gate. The dog came out. He [the cop] cornered him right over here and the dog growled at him so he shot him..."

Jesus H. Christ.

...*sigh*...

Thanks for posting that.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 12:53 PM
Uh, the owner said that the dog was 8 years old. Not that it matters, other than the thread title being wrong.

Thanks for that.

I was going by what the neighbor and witness said:


He's just a puppy

pcosmar
09-10-2012, 12:53 PM
Linky no worky

Worked for me..
Still does not make any sense.

Are they trying to provoke people into responding?
It seems deliberate.

pcosmar
09-10-2012, 12:55 PM
Thanks for that.

I was going by what the neighbor and witness said:

Cassie is going on 4yrs.. she is still a puppy. (wants to be a lap dog)

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 12:57 PM
Worked for me..
Still does not make any sense.

Are they trying to provoke people into responding?
It seems deliberate.

I know it's deliberate.

Poking us into a response in order to "crack down" like never before seems as good an explanation as any.

HigherVision
09-10-2012, 01:04 PM
There seem to be two groups of Ron Paul supporters. One group is people like myself who believe in the non-aggression axiom fully and only support the Constitution for pragmatic reasons: to reduce the power of government so hopefully that someday we can eliminate it completely and have all services provided by government provided by the market. And then there people who believe in Constitutional government philosophically. Those who believe that government does have some right to coerce against people and forcefully provide some services like police because the market would be incapable of providing these services. What the latter group doesn't understand is that when a service provider has no competition there are much less limits to what they're able to get away with. So as depressing as these stories of police abuse are, if people are reacting to them by saying something like "How could they do this!? Don't they know they're our public servants?! That they work for us?!!" still don't really get it. They don't work for us. If someone works for you you usually have the ability to fire them. When's the last time you fired a cop? To the contrary, we literally work for the government. The money we pay in taxes to government is mandatory, it doesn't matter if we like the service or not. If a business operated like this or attempted to we'd be outraged. And yet we tolerate it and even appreciate the same behavior from government, because we are indoctrinated with propaganda about government from the time that we're children. So it's hard for people to see what it really is.

For those who say that anarcho-capitalism wouldn't work, I ask you is this dog getting shot to death an example of government working? Because if so maybe a system that doesn't work would be better.

cajuncocoa
09-10-2012, 01:09 PM
Worked for me..
Still does not make any sense.

Are they trying to provoke people into responding?
It seems deliberate.Yes, it does. Why does it seem they are targeting dogs lately?

HigherVision
09-10-2012, 01:10 PM
I know it's deliberate.

Poking us into a response in order to "crack down" like never before seems as good an explanation as any.

That's what Alex Jones would say but really it's just cops being cops.

pcosmar
09-10-2012, 01:11 PM
. And then there people who believe in Constitutional government philosophically. Those who believe that government does have some right to coerce against people and forcefully provide some services like police because the market would be incapable of providing these services. .

Where do you get the idea that the constitution gives the government any rights?
Or that it even authorizes police?

It is the failure to abide by the constitution that has created this.
The very concept of police should not exist in a free society.
http://www.constitution.org/lrev/roots/cops.htm

cajuncocoa
09-10-2012, 01:12 PM
That's what Alex Jones would say but really it's just cops being cops.Can we please not turn this into another Alex Jones food fight?

Root
09-10-2012, 01:17 PM
AF, Please continue to inform us on the "war on dogs". It's disgusting that this is happening all over the country and nobody really "sees" it.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 03:05 PM
That's what Alex Jones would say but really it's just cops being cops.

That, in all honesty, is worse.

I'd rather think that it was the deliberate actions of a plan than just a million armed psychopaths running around.

Dr.3D
09-10-2012, 03:08 PM
I'll bet it's just some illiterate cops who have mistaken the "war on drugs" with "war on dogs."

tod evans
09-10-2012, 03:59 PM
Get a rope! :mad:

truelies
09-10-2012, 04:04 PM
.................................................. ..........
The witness says the officer wasn't provoked and she doesn't feel his reaction was warranted. Scout's owners were inside their house during the incident.

TV5 has tried several times to talk to the officer involved, or someone from the St. Louis Police department. We'll have much more on the story tonight on TV5 News at 6 p.m. when we take The Tough Questions to the police department.

Dear Lord Strike this vile agent (and all that he holds dear) of a satanic State with with the most painful, terrifying, humiliating and lingering of vexations as a mere foretaste of his Final and Just Judgement before Your Throne, Amen.

Philhelm
09-10-2012, 05:41 PM
I asked my wife (I got married a month ago :eek:) what she would do if a cop shot her dog. She said that she would end up in jail. When I asked why, she said that it would be because she had killed a cop.

She doesn't understand liberty, but I did manage to get her to vote for Ron Paul in the primary. Better than nothing!

P.S. Fuck the police!

EBounding
09-10-2012, 05:55 PM
Stories like this scare me. We always keep our dog on a leash, even in our own yard, but this is something I hate thinking about. He's all bark and cowers the closer you get to him. Ugh, it makes me sick....

bunklocoempire
09-10-2012, 06:44 PM
The written story is deceiving. Heres what he said in the video:

"The cop came out. Opened up my gate. The dog came out. He [the cop] cornered him right over here and the dog growled at him so he shot him..."

That quote sums a lot of things up on so many levels.

"The cop came out" He sure did.

jclay2
09-10-2012, 08:05 PM
So the cop opened a gate, cornered the dog, and then proceeded with an execution. What defense on earth will they use to state this is not murder?

So AF, have these stories in your opinion become more frequent, or is it people just waking up to the police violence. I swear I have been following your police threads for some 3 years now and it seems like this is happening way more often. I really do hope we are just waking up to whats already out there. Very disturbing to see this brutality INCREASE on the most kind and gentle creatures in the planet.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 08:22 PM
So the cop opened a gate, cornered the dog, and then proceeded with an execution. What defense on earth will they use to state this is not murder?

So AF, have these stories in your opinion become more frequent, or is it people just waking up to the police violence. I swear I have been following your police threads for some 3 years now and it seems like this is happening way more often. I really do hope we are just waking up to whats already out there. Very disturbing to see this brutality INCREASE on the most kind and gentle creatures in the planet.

IMO?

These incidents are becoming more widespread.

Trouble is, there is no real way to quantify any of this, not even when cops shoot people, there is no national tracking or compiling of these incidents, even though Congress mandated it, several years ago. (For people of course, the dog killings are only tabulated by humble servants such as myself.)

The only people tracking police misconduct is CATO, that took over David Packwood's awesome Injustice Everywhere site, when he was no longer able to keep it going.

http://www.policemisconduct.net/

This story is front page right now, at PM btw. I posted this story when it was only an hour old, so I want to hope that the editor over there is reading here and picking some of these stories up.

The problem, as I see it, boils down to three words:

Circular Force Continuum.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 08:35 PM
Okay, what is Circular Force Continuum?

I'm pulling some old posts of mine that explained it, but search the term "circular force continuum", it's worth it to read some of our fellow RPF members that were in LE comment on it as well.



When asked why this happening more and more:

One, is a nationwide shift in police policies that have moved responses from a vertically integrated "force continuum" to a circular one. I can't speak for all states and locales, but in my little NH town this was done at the behest of the feds through the Fed Fusion center. The real world ramifications of this are that, without any intervening action, a cop may move directly to lethal force, pretty much regardless of what force may have been used against him. All he needs to do is cite "officer safety".

Two, is a solidification of the "bunker mentality", the idea that cops are "at war" (I've posted that comment from police chiefs before) and that equates to a street attitude that roughly fleshes out to "There are only three types of people in the world, cops, cops families and scumbags".

Three, is an insurance, compensation and legal incentive to blow somebody away or taser them. Believe it or not, it costs less to the department to gun down a mundane than it does to physically wrestle them down and restrain them if they are belligerent or uncooperative if there are any injuries to either party. This was also made clear right in my little town and was corroborated by people in other towns and states that do the same thing I do, which is to say, make a PITA of myself to the local cops at police commission meetings and so on.



Another way of answering the same question:

Because there has been a change in training, coming from both above (the Feds), sideways (the towns' lawyers and insurance) and below (the union leadership).

Everything now revolves around "officer safety".

The force continuum is no longer vertical, it is circular, meaning a cop on the scene can use whatever force comes to mind as being the most effective to ensure "officer safety", neutralizing hostiles at the scene (that's us, Mundanes, citizens) and maintaining control.

Shooting the dog is perceived as the safest route for the cop, it's also the cheapest route for the town, even if a Mundane successfully sues, it's cheaper than dealing with disability and medical care for a cop that gets bit.

And that's why calling one of these people into your home is a mistake you may never recover from.

Any dealing with a LEO must be handled with deadly seriousness.

fisharmor
09-10-2012, 08:45 PM
I asked my wife (I got married a month ago :eek:) what she would do if a cop shot her dog. She said that she would end up in jail. When I asked why, she said that it would be because she had killed a cop.

Phil, you gotta talk to your wife.
They're not doing this because they like killing dogs.
They're doing this because they want to be killing people.

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 08:50 PM
Phil, you gotta talk to your wife.
They're not doing this because they like killing dogs.
They're doing this because they want to be killing people.

Yes, this, exactly.

If we roll over for this, well, what's to stop them from shooting people just as indiscriminately.

Officer Safety you know.

fisharmor
09-10-2012, 09:07 PM
Yes, this, exactly.

If we roll over for this, well, what's to stop them from shooting people just as indiscriminately.

Officer Safety you know.

Well, that's not exactly where I was going.
If you stand up to a cop who just went Barney Badass on your dog, you just created the excuse for him to do it to you.

I'm not saying roll over for this - I'm saying that standing up to the cop who has a weapon drawn and is obviously aroused by killing is not going to do any good for anyone.

They're killing dogs as proxies. They want to kill you. If you give them an excuse, they will.

Even if the cop is going full-bore psychopath, naked as a jaybird, eating his own shit, and trying to slash you up with a straight razor, ON FILM, you're still going to lose every single asset of yours keeping yourself out of prison after you defend yourself.

If he just got done engaging in an act which is not only blessed but actively encouraged by the department as an act of self-defense on the part of the pig (i.e., shooting your pet), then what the fuck makes you think you're going to get away with taking out your frustration on him?

Is a dog worth dying? Even if you take him out, is it going to be worth going to prison for the rest of your days, knowing that your wife and children also no longer have two pennies to rub together?

The stakes are already pretty fucking staggering, and stacked way the fuck against you.

daviddee
09-10-2012, 09:16 PM
A few issues:

1. The psychopath was trespassing
3. The psychopath was armed
3. The psychopath provoked a fight with a family friend
4. The psychopath shot the family friend

It appears the only thing missing is an invocation of the Castle Doctrine and the 2nd Amendment.

This is yet another example of why all homes should have cameras installed. This entire story would be considerably different if the tragedy was videotaped. Watching psychopaths in action tend to have a negative effect on the lies they spin.

Murder has been memorialized at: http://www.dogmurderers.com/2012/09/11/cop-tresspassing-provokes-dog-shoots-6-times-video/

sailingaway
09-10-2012, 09:17 PM
I've owned Goldens. I tried to think back to if I had EVER seen one growl. I couldn't remember so I went to google images to jog my memory of what a growling golden retriever looks like. there is a SINGLE picture of a dog fight, apparently it is the closest to 'growling golden retriever' ever caught on camera: http://www.google.com/search?q=golden+retriever&hl=en&safe=off&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ei=YqxOUIiiOMaYygHa7oCYBg&ved=0CAoQ_AUoAQ&biw=1280&bih=929#hl=en&safe=off&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=growling+golden+retriever&oq=growling+golden+retriever&gs_l=img.3..0i24.34161.36708.0.37093.11.10.1.0.0.1 .152.901.7j3.10.0...0.0...1c.1.Xz4Q3aD6zeM&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=6e0e51b0ca104203&biw=1280&bih=929

Anti Federalist
09-10-2012, 09:23 PM
Valid points.

But, we're all gonna die sometime.


Well, that's not exactly where I was going.
If you stand up to a cop who just went Barney Badass on your dog, you just created the excuse for him to do it to you.

I'm not saying roll over for this - I'm saying that standing up to the cop who has a weapon drawn and is obviously aroused by killing is not going to do any good for anyone.

They're killing dogs as proxies. They want to kill you. If you give them an excuse, they will.

Even if the cop is going full-bore psychopath, naked as a jaybird, eating his own shit, and trying to slash you up with a straight razor, ON FILM, you're still going to lose every single asset of yours keeping yourself out of prison after you defend yourself.

If he just got done engaging in an act which is not only blessed but actively encouraged by the department as an act of self-defense on the part of the pig (i.e., shooting your pet), then what the fuck makes you think you're going to get away with taking out your frustration on him?

Is a dog worth dying? Even if you take him out, is it going to be worth going to prison for the rest of your days, knowing that your wife and children also no longer have two pennies to rub together?

The stakes are already pretty fucking staggering, and stacked way the fuck against you.

daviddee
09-10-2012, 09:30 PM
Even if the cop is going full-bore psychopath, naked as a jaybird, eating his own shit, and trying to slash you up with a straight razor, ON FILM, you're still going to lose every single asset of yours keeping yourself out of prison after you defend yourself.



Without journeying to much off topic, for now, what you have written should be the road map of all patriots.

By having assets in the USA your rights are severely limited. You will consume your entire life's work defending yourself in a court system owned by your accuser. Don't play their game.

Professor8000
09-11-2012, 12:41 AM
Well, that's not exactly where I was going.
If you stand up to a cop who just went Barney Badass on your dog, you just created the excuse for him to do it to you.

I'm not saying roll over for this - I'm saying that standing up to the cop who has a weapon drawn and is obviously aroused by killing is not going to do any good for anyone.

They're killing dogs as proxies. They want to kill you. If you give them an excuse, they will.

Even if the cop is going full-bore psychopath, naked as a jaybird, eating his own shit, and trying to slash you up with a straight razor, ON FILM, you're still going to lose every single asset of yours keeping yourself out of prison after you defend yourself.

If he just got done engaging in an act which is not only blessed but actively encouraged by the department as an act of self-defense on the part of the pig (i.e., shooting your pet), then what the fuck makes you think you're going to get away with taking out your frustration on him?

Is a dog worth dying? Even if you take him out, is it going to be worth going to prison for the rest of your days, knowing that your wife and children also no longer have two pennies to rub together?

The stakes are already pretty fucking staggering, and stacked way the fuck against you.

I would say that if invoking your sacred right to property and self government means basically declaring war on a corrupt police department and Law Enforcement System, then it's high time to expel the trespassers by any means necessary. Non-Aggressively of course.

IronPatriot
09-11-2012, 01:43 AM
I'm glad that stories like this are posted here, as I share them at every opportunity.

Lindsey
09-11-2012, 02:00 AM
My dog is super social, she is incredibly friendly and will run towards anyone who comes by in hopes that they will give her a bit of attention. I am thinking I need to put up a sign at the end of the driveway, something basically saying, "Dog is friendly, please don't shoot." Because heaven-forbid police had any reason to come up my driveway, she'd immediately be flying out to greet them.

mczerone
09-11-2012, 07:30 AM
What shocks me about this story is that St. Louis, Michigan is a tiny town of maybe a couple thousand. This isn't even a suburb, it's a grain elevator and a gas station.

If the police are out of control there, they are out of control everywhere.

tod evans
09-11-2012, 07:40 AM
What shocks me about this story is that St. Louis, Michigan is a tiny town of maybe a couple thousand. This isn't even a suburb, it's a grain elevator and a gas station.

If the police are out of control there, they are out of control everywhere.

It's a safe bet that their heroic actions fighting the "war on drugs" has secured some type of federal grant that will enrich every cop on the force.......

Keeping kids safe..

Spikender
09-11-2012, 08:50 AM
Damn.

Thanks for sharing, AF. I really should start keeping a file of these reports for future use. I think I'll start right now.

kathy88
09-11-2012, 09:29 AM
Here's an update.

http://www.wnem.com/story/19503465/family-wants-answers-after-officer-guns-down-family-pet

Chief says killing was "absolutely justified." Neighbors are putting up signs in their yards.

EBounding
09-11-2012, 05:46 PM
People in the area are preparing to protest. The city is saying the protesters need a permit.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream

OBEY CITIZEN

Dr.3D
09-11-2012, 06:14 PM
People in the area are preparing to protest. The city is saying the protesters need a permit.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream

OBEY CITIZEN
Of course, they have to collect a fee for that as well. Can't have any unpaid for protests.

Anti Federalist
09-11-2012, 06:15 PM
There is so much wrong in both those statements I don't even know where to begin.

"Why did we shoot your dog? Fuck you. That's why. And if you try to make even the mildest of fuss about it, we'll arrest all of you uppity Mundanes." - Officer Friendly.


Here's an update.

http://www.wnem.com/story/19503465/family-wants-answers-after-officer-guns-down-family-pet

Chief says killing was "absolutely justified." Neighbors are putting up signs in their yards.


People in the area are preparing to protest. The city is saying the protesters need a permit.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream

OBEY CITIZEN

Anti Federalist
09-11-2012, 06:16 PM
Of course, they have to collect a fee for that as well. Can't have any unpaid for protests.

There will be no fee, because there will be no permit.

Can't have the Mundanes getting uppity.

The right of the people to peacebly assemble...

Dr.3D
09-11-2012, 06:17 PM
There will be no fee, because there will be no permit.

Can't have the Mundanes getting uppity.

The right of the people to peacebly assemble...
Well, if they won't let people peacebly assemble, I supposed they will do so unpeacebly.

tod evans
09-11-2012, 06:18 PM
New and revised eddition;

http://www.twowheelforum.com/images/smilies/hang.gif Get a rope! :mad:

Dr.3D
09-11-2012, 06:19 PM
New and revised eddition;

http://www.twowheelforum.com/images/smilies/hang.gif Get a rope! :mad:
Well, might want to start with pitchforks and torches first.

Anti Federalist
09-11-2012, 06:25 PM
Well, if they won't let people peacebly assemble, I supposed they will do so unpeacebly.

I hope so.

Might be a real wake up call for the people of this small Michigan town.

Maybe we'll read about them in the coming months, how they all voted to dissolve the local police force and fire every damn cop there.

EBounding
09-11-2012, 07:10 PM
Send this link to Drudge in the tips box: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2201866/He-just-kept-shooting-head-Family-demands-answers-officer-shoots-beloved-pet-golden-retriever-SEVEN-TIMES-head.html

Origanalist
09-11-2012, 07:35 PM
People in the area are preparing to protest. The city is saying the protesters need a permit.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream

OBEY CITIZEN

Down the rabbit hole with you Alice!

Dr.3D
09-11-2012, 07:46 PM
There will be no fee, because there will be no permit.

Can't have the Mundanes getting uppity.

The right of the people to peacebly assemble...
Wait a minute.... don't they collect the fee and then have you wait for the permit? If they don't grant the permit, they keep the fee anyway.

presence
09-11-2012, 07:57 PM
...for fuck's sake, this ain't paranoia, this ain't "cop bashing", these are not "isolated incidents" done by a few "bad apples".

This is systemic and is getting worse and it will only be a matter of time before it is people, in fact, in many cases it is people.


I just watched the PBS doc "Secrets of the Dead" on Auschwitz where the two prisoners escape to tell the Hungarian Jews not to board the trains.

The Jews didn't listen.



Don't call the cops.


presence

Anti Federalist
09-11-2012, 11:23 PM
I just watched the PBS doc "Secrets of the Dead" on Auschwitz where the two prisoners escape to tell the Hungarian Jews not to board the trains.

The Jews didn't listen.



Don't call the cops.


presence

I would love to find a clip of that.

tod evans
09-12-2012, 01:40 AM
Well, might want to start with pitchforks and torches first.


Shooting family pets in order to trespass unquestioned takes a person with some type of mental deficiency..

I fear that if "pitch-forks and torches" were brandished, heck even a boy-scout knife, the citizen would receive the same treatment as the family pet.

As concerned citizens there are only two choices;
1) Let them continue on their rampage killing pets and those who resist.
2) Don't.

All the grumbling, all the outrage hasn't even slowed the number of reported incidences....In fact more government agencies are suiting up in their killing uniforms....Fish-n-wildlife now has black suited attack squads for Pete's sake..

There's something seriously wrong with our society when we actually believe that these folks are protecting our freedom.

EBounding
09-12-2012, 07:50 AM
Can you imagine if it was just some guy who did this and not a cop?

Dog runs past a driver's car. The driver gets out and starts chasing after it. The dog runs into its yard and the guy calls the dog from the OPEN gate. The dog starts running towards him and the guy starts to kick the dog back. The guy then pulls out his pistol and blasts the dog 7 times in the yard right next to the house.

Here's the police report:

http://ftpcontent.worldnow.com/wnem/WNEM/Police%20Report%20Dog%20Shooting.pdf

VoluntaryAmerican
09-12-2012, 09:17 AM
Bad reporting. Where is the officers name?

mczerone
09-12-2012, 11:53 AM
Bad reporting. Where is the officers name?

They won't print that. If it was a street kid who murdered a neighbor's dog, there would be wanted posters everywhere, and the newsmedia would be asking people to turn him in, giving his exact description, distinguishing features, and what he had for breakfast.

But it's a cop, and the media will protect them from any "undue" scrutiny from the public.

Anyway, from the facebook (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream) page it appears to be someone named Matt Van Hall.

According to the city website, he's not even a patrol officer, he's a "Code Enforcer" and "Rental inspector"


Matt Van Hall
Code Enforcement/Rental Inspections Officer
Phone: (989) 681-4621
Fax: (989) 681-3842
Email: mvanhall@stlouismi.com
Office Hours: Tuesday and Wednesday 8:00 a.m. - 5:00 p.m.

Anti Federalist
09-12-2012, 12:10 PM
They won't print that. If it was a street kid who murdered a neighbor's dog, there would be wanted posters everywhere, and the newsmedia would be asking people to turn him in, giving his exact description, distinguishing features, and what he had for breakfast.

But it's a cop, and the media will protect them from any "undue" scrutiny from the public.

Anyway, from the facebook (https://www.facebook.com/pages/Justice-for-Scout-and-his-Family/416171498439981?ref=stream) page it appears to be someone named Matt Van Hall.

According to the city website, he's not even a patrol officer, he's a "Code Enforcer" and "Rental inspector"

Holy sweet Jesus, this guy was just a Code Cop?

Fuck me...

Dr.3D
09-12-2012, 12:12 PM
Holy sweet Jesus, this guy was just a Code Cop?

Fuck me...
Sounds like he shouldn't have had anything but a pen or pencil. I wonder if he could have killed that dog with either one of those things.

Anti Federalist
09-13-2012, 09:47 PM
bump because I feel like it

mczerone
09-13-2012, 09:58 PM
Some updates: they've had multi-day vigils and protests, and still no word from the county prosecutor about charges, from the police department about the officer's status, or from the city govt about any restitution for the victims.

At least there haven't been any arrests for protesting w/o permits.

Henry Rogue
09-13-2012, 10:54 PM
You know I don't remember a big news conference announcing A War on Dogs. I guess those creeps don't announce everything.

Anti Federalist
09-16-2012, 11:50 PM
Cop blows away dog 'for no good reason'

World Net Daily reads RPF maybe?

http://www.wnd.com/2012/09/cop-blows-away-dog-for-no-good-reason/

Philhelm
09-17-2012, 03:17 PM
I hope so.

Might be a real wake up call for the people of this small Michigan town.

Maybe we'll read about them in the coming months, how they all voted to dissolve the local police force and fire every damn cop there.

I'd literally cream my jeans.

tod evans
09-17-2012, 03:31 PM
http://archives.forum-politique.org/2011/i15.photobucket.com/albums/a356/Lilaznchynkboi2010/SmileysGoBad/guillotine01.gif

Anti Federalist
09-17-2012, 05:25 PM
http://archives.forum-politique.org/2011/i15.photobucket.com/albums/a356/Lilaznchynkboi2010/SmileysGoBad/guillotine01.gif

LOL

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?388963-Will-the-Liberty-Movement-go-the-way-of-the-French-Revolution

Anti Federalist
09-22-2012, 01:48 AM
St. Louis officer will not be charged in dog shooting

http://www.themorningsun.com/article/20120921/NEWS01/120929955/st-louis-officer-will-not-be-charged-in-dog-shooting

The St. Louis police officer who shot and killed a golden retriever two weeks ago will not be charged following the conclusion of the Michigan State Police investigation.

According to a press release issued by Gratiot County Prosecuting Attorney Keith Kushion, the investigation into Officer Matt Vanhall had been turned over to the state police to avoid a conflict of interest had the incident been investigated by the St. Louis Police Department. “I do not find any legal basis to charge Officer Vanhall with a crime,” Kushion said in the statement.

Vanhall shot the dog, Scout, in its own back yard Sept. 9 as he was investigating an incident in which a loose dog ran in front of his vehicle. He said the dog came at him.

The dog belonged to the Brain Goetzinger family, who requested that criminal charges be authorized against Vanhall. Michigan State Police incident reports, the Alma Department of Public Safety incident report and the report filed by Vanhall were all reviewed by Kushion.

Kushion also viewed the scene of the shooting and spoke with the State Police detective who investigated the incident as well as the Alma Department of Public Safety officer who took witness statements on the date of the incident.

Kushion said he reviewed Michigan law on shooting an animal, including Section 19 of the dog law of 1919.

“Simply put, if Officer Vanhall was being attacked by Scout, Officer Vanhall would have been within his rights to kill the attacking dog. If he was not being attacked, he would not have this right. Officer Vanhall claims he was under attack by Scout.”

The release said that there were two direct eyewitnesses to the incident. One eyewitness told investigatiors that Scout was shot without provocation, but on the day of the shooting, the witness told Alma police that she did not observe the shooting. Four days later, the release states, she provided an entirely different account in a statement to the Michigan State Police.

“This new account is not supported by the physical evidence located at the scene by the State Police, namely, the location of the bullet casings in the Goetzinger’s yard,” the release states.

“A second eyewitness gave a different version of the events and this version tends to support Officer Vanhall’s version and is also supported by the physical evidence,” the release states.

Kushion’s statement concludes with “Accordingly, while you or I may disagree with the manner in which Officer Vanhall dealt with the situation at hand, it appears that the shooting of Scout was within the legal options available to him. I do not find any legal basis to charge Officer Vanhall with a crime. The propriety of selecting the option he did is a matter of review by his department, not the criminal justice system or my office. I offer my heartfelt condolences to the Goetzinger family for the loss of their pet, Scout.”

sailingaway
09-22-2012, 02:16 AM
It's a Golden. Of course it 'came at him'. People have tennis balls.

EBounding
09-25-2012, 05:00 PM
OK, so I can waltz onto my neighbor's property, call their dog over from an open gate and then shoot it several times when it comes running towards me. Do I have that right? Or am I just missing a badge?

Dr.3D
09-25-2012, 05:03 PM
OK, so I can waltz onto my neighbor's property, call their dog over from an open gate and then shoot it several times when it comes running towards me. Do I have that right? Or am I just missing a badge?
No you don't have the right any more than the cop does. The cop should be in serious trouble for doing what he did.

Yeah... you are just missing the badge.

Anti Federalist
10-25-2012, 10:39 PM
The police chief is unhappy with CATO's "Police Misconduct" site for daring to post this story.


Wow is all I can say. Your general statement to all says you publish strong cases supported by third-party witnesses or other compelling evidence. You need to get the incident report/investigation from the independent agency, (Michigan State Police) that I by the way requested be done less then 12 hours after the incident. All you have is the words of a so called witness that changed her story several times and only said, the vicious things she said after the TV camera was in her face. I could and at some time will tell this whole story, but in the meantime I will stand by the officer making the right decision under the circumstances and the Investigation done by the Michigan State Police and the decision of our county Prosecutor. I now have zero respect for anything you put in print when I have first hand knowledge that you do absolutely no investigation before you print your vicious hate toward public servants.

Why can't you now, chief?

http://www.policemisconduct.net/police-chief-sounds-off/

heavenlyboy34
10-25-2012, 10:48 PM
St. Louis officer will not be charged in dog shooting

http://www.themorningsun.com/article/20120921/NEWS01/120929955/st-louis-officer-will-not-be-charged-in-dog-shooting

The St. Louis police officer who shot and killed a golden retriever two weeks ago will not be charged following the conclusion of the Michigan State Police investigation.

According to a press release issued by Gratiot County Prosecuting Attorney Keith Kushion, the investigation into Officer Matt Vanhall had been turned over to the state police to avoid a conflict of interest had the incident been investigated by the St. Louis Police Department. “I do not find any legal basis to charge Officer Vanhall with a crime,” Kushion said in the statement.

Vanhall shot the dog, Scout, in its own back yard Sept. 9 as he was investigating an incident in which a loose dog ran in front of his vehicle. He said the dog came at him.

The dog belonged to the Brain Goetzinger family, who requested that criminal charges be authorized against Vanhall. Michigan State Police incident reports, the Alma Department of Public Safety incident report and the report filed by Vanhall were all reviewed by Kushion.

Kushion also viewed the scene of the shooting and spoke with the State Police detective who investigated the incident as well as the Alma Department of Public Safety officer who took witness statements on the date of the incident.

Kushion said he reviewed Michigan law on shooting an animal, including Section 19 of the dog law of 1919.

“Simply put, if Officer Vanhall was being attacked by Scout, Officer Vanhall would have been within his rights to kill the attacking dog. If he was not being attacked, he would not have this right. Officer Vanhall claims he was under attack by Scout.”

The release said that there were two direct eyewitnesses to the incident. One eyewitness told investigatiors that Scout was shot without provocation, but on the day of the shooting, the witness told Alma police that she did not observe the shooting. Four days later, the release states, she provided an entirely different account in a statement to the Michigan State Police.

“This new account is not supported by the physical evidence located at the scene by the State Police, namely, the location of the bullet casings in the Goetzinger’s yard,” the release states.

“A second eyewitness gave a different version of the events and this version tends to support Officer Vanhall’s version and is also supported by the physical evidence,” the release states.

Kushion’s statement concludes with “Accordingly, while you or I may disagree with the manner in which Officer Vanhall dealt with the situation at hand, it appears that the shooting of Scout was within the legal options available to him. I do not find any legal basis to charge Officer Vanhall with a crime. The propriety of selecting the option he did is a matter of review by his department, not the criminal justice system or my office. I offer my heartfelt condolences to the Goetzinger family for the loss of their pet, Scout.” Fuck the rope. Draw and quarter the killer cop. :mad:

heavenlyboy34
10-25-2012, 10:52 PM
Srsly, townsfolk need to start demanding third party psychological and drug testing for all cops. Clearly the "profession" draws way too many psychopaths and sociopaths. /end ramble

EBounding
10-26-2012, 06:11 AM
The police chief is unhappy with CATO's "Police Misconduct" site for daring to post this story.



Why can't you now, chief?

http://www.policemisconduct.net/police-chief-sounds-off/

This police chief is so dumb. He's been arguing with people all over social media over the past month and now he's whining to Cato for simply posting the story? It's clear the department lacks any sort of judgement or common sense.

roho76
10-26-2012, 06:48 AM
That, in all honesty, is worse.

I'd rather think that it was the deliberate actions of a plan than just a million armed psychopaths running around.

Only a million? Pfftt....

Philhelm
10-26-2012, 08:14 AM
This police chief is so dumb. He's been arguing with people all over social media over the past month and now he's whining to Cato for simply posting the story? It's clear the department lacks any sort of judgement or common sense.

That's what happens when police forces disqualify people for having too high of an IQ.

DeMintConservative
10-26-2012, 08:54 AM
Is it me or cop kills dog stories have been all over the place lately?

Perhaps they need to start sending some documentary on Ruby Ridge and how it all started to police departments, people forget quickly.

EBounding
11-15-2012, 02:37 PM
The family put this sign on their lawn shortly after their dog was killed:
1656

The city commanded them to take it down. They took it down. The next day, they get a ticket and a court summons. (https://www.facebook.com/permalink.php?story_fbid=439982669392197&id=416171498439981)

tod evans
11-15-2012, 02:41 PM
There Vill be no subversive signage in FEMA district 7