How do you respond to "If you don't like it, leave the country"?

[mmink15]

See Subject title

[sailingaway]

why bother?

--
in clarification, I mean why bother responding? Obviously people who love their country and would never leave it would want to prevent it from going in a bad direction and would want to get it back to its roots.

I take it you are debating kindergartners?

[CPUd]

Define 'it'

[Elwar]

Working on it!

http://adventure.nationalgeographic.com/2008/09/world-travel/costa-rica.jpg
Costa Rica

[afmatt]

"Some things are worth fighting for"

[fisharmor]

Buy my ticket.

[playpianoking]

There is probably no other country that is better. While it's true that different countries do provide some sense of a free market in terms of different ideologies, the USA can evolve over time and what that person is trying to do is get you to give up rather than to follow the system to properly change it the way you want it.

You can respond that if they don't like the current system in place for proper change, you can tell them to leave the country.

[SilenceDewgooder]

born here, served here, staying here...

[mmink15]

it=America to this liberal on Facebook. He talked some smack on the good Doctor so I educated him very nicely and my posts were deleted. I sent him a little "censorship" jab via message box and here is convo:
Me: “All censorships exist to prevent anyone from challenging current conceptions and existing institutions. All progress is initiated by challenging current conceptions, and executed by supplanting existing institutions. Consequently, the first condition of progress is the removal of censorship.”
― George Bernard Shaw, Mrs. Warren's Profession

Him: Cool. Don't care!

I'm free of all speech and press. I love our president and continue to build only in the GOOD and positive things he's done that so far with our country that's in turmoil. That's how I live my life. Not constantly nitpicking every little "problem." Especially ones that werent caused by him. He's YOUR president too, but you're more than welcome to move to another country if you don't like how things are run. Good day.


Me: Reads like those Republicans, who you despise, 4 years ago. Peace.

Him: OK. Cool.

Like I said, you're welcomed to move to another country. Obama wasn't elected bc of his looks.....

[mmink15]

I shouldn't bother, but you know how us Ron Paul people get this close to convention time!

[angelatc]

Working on it!

http://adventure.nationalgeographic.com/2008/09/world-travel/costa-rica.jpg
Costa Rica

How do you respond to "Costa Rica has universal health care?"

To the op, I maintain that they're the people that should leave, since other locales already offer everything they want.

[FSP-Rebel]

The fact that he responds "OK. Cool." to your comment shows he's beyond redemption. He's part of the gutter of American intellectual laziness.

[Dr.3D]

I've had that argument thrown at me and I always respond.
"I love my country, and will stay here to attempt to correct the direction it's going. I love my country, it's the government I'm not so fond of."

[coastie]

Working on it!

http://adventure.nationalgeographic.com/2008/09/world-travel/costa-rica.jpg
Costa Rica

Hmmm, over 5000 Marines were just stationed there to give you a taste of home.

[Appalachia]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMOcyCLZHBQ

[Mahkato]

Leaving the country would force me to incur significant costs, both monetary (moving or selling possessions, selling house, quitting job, etc.) and non-monetary (leaving family and friends, leaving a desirable location, etc.). I will continue to endure the things I don't like (including taxation) until such time as *those* costs exceed my costs of moving. If the tax rate, regulatory burden, and other infringements on my liberty become too costly, I will move. Many people and companies already have moved.

[ronpaulfollower999]

Tom Woods replies to the common anti-libertarian argument that demands libertarians leave the country if they don't like the system, the rules, etc.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTqEePlZiqk&feature=plcp

[Mundane]

Well, I'd like to, but then I'd just become a victim of American foreign policy. That's what I would say.

[Natural Citizen]

See Subject title

I say we lose the like button all together and learn to love it again. Is a good start.

[Elwar]

Obama wasn't elected bc of his looks.....

He has a point there. It was his looks and his public speaking ability.

[Elwar]

How do you respond to "Costa Rica has universal health care?"

To the op, I maintain that they're the people that should leave, since other locales already offer everything they want.

Costa Rica has a balanced budget built into their Constitution.

United States' debt that I will have to help pay: $17 trillion
Costa Rica's debt: $0

[Anti Federalist]

Hmmm, over 5000 Marines were just stationed there to give you a taste of home.

Not to mention bot-flys.

Do yourself a favor.

DO NOT GOOGLE "BOT-FLY LARVA IN HUMANS".

[heavenlyboy34]

See Subject title
If you really want to engage in this debate, just point out that you have natural rights by virtue of being born-including the right to defend against state aggression.

[acptulsa]

I shouldn't bother, but you know how us Ron Paul people get this close to convention time!

This is a republic. That means you and I run this nation. Why should I leave just because you're too lazy and stubborn to do your damned job?

[mmink15]

Thanks all, my response was this
I love America, that is why I won't be leaving it. I happen to be a law abiding citizen that follows the rules and believes in fair play. Why don't the people that are trying to change the rules to benefit or slight certain groups and blindly supporting candidates that vote to reduce our freedoms leave America? You can love a country but expect more from its citizens and government can't you? Isn't that kind of what this country was founded on? Like I said, sounds like your auditioning for Fox news anchor with that Love it or Leave it line. In case you fell asleep during history, free speech and lack of censorship was a big deal when this whole country started up. It says a lot for a person's opinion when they actively repress any opposing viewpoint, and not in a good way. It just isn't healthy thinking/living. It's not a good and positive approach, it's destructive and devisive. No, our president wasn't elected on his looks, it was the promises of Change that won everyone over. And he was specific too: Ending Gitmo, troops home from Iraq within a year, end to torture/illegal detentions/cronyism of previous administration, NOT extending Bush's tax cuts for wealthy, I could go on but I doubt you've even read this far before starting to type some witty 'soundbyte you read in an article title somewhere' response. Mitt Romney is no better, but there are more than 2 parties in this country and democracy was not set up to be a horse race with citizens betting on winners. I could, probably should, have just let this all slide. But nothing offends me more than when people censor intelligent debate/discussion to suit their agenda.

[mmink15]

I used some of those lines just because it hit his hot button issues i.e. Fox, horse race, snarky soundbyte comment.

[Dr.3D]

Not to mention bot-flys.

Do yourself a favor.

DO NOT GOOGLE "BOT-FLY LARVA IN HUMANS".
Had that problem with horses and it's not pretty.

[pcosmar]

How do you respond?

usually don't.
just look at them like a cat that just coughed a hairball.

[RickyJ]

The guy has no clue. He thinks there are fair elections in this nation, that Obama has some sort of control because the elite have made him a figure head?

No, Obama is utterly powerless. If he dared tried to use his own brain and do something on his own accord that was against his handlers' dictates, he would quickly pay for it. He is smart enough to know this, even W. was smart enough to know this.

The people given a choice would have ended illegal immigration over 30 years ago. But we have no choice, the representatives do not represent us, they represent the elite bankers and they know their job is to appear to represent us, so they put on the best show they can.

[mmink15]

I love my fellow Ron Paul peeps. Haven't been as active on this forum as I'd like to be this election cycle. Still check in for the reading/news/links, but I've spent my (significantly smaller amount of) free time shilling at the local level. Heavy Ron Paul support in my area though our delegates didn't make it to convention due to so many familiar local politicians filling the slate. I hope that whatever happens over the next few weeks/months/years this will remain a welcome home to come back to and share ideas with my liberty-mind friends at RPF.

Thanks again all and feel free to keep the ideas coming. I'm sure I'll be coming home from teaching tonight to a dull retort from this guy.

[TonySutton]

Ask them if they would have said the same thing to the founding fathers.

[John F Kennedy III]

This is a republic. That means you and I run this nation. Why should I leave just because you're too lazy and stubborn to do your damned job?

/thread

[Kodaddy]

"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

[acptulsa]

"That whenever any Form of Government becomes destructive of these ends, it is the Right of the People to alter or to abolish it, and to institute new Government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to them shall seem most likely to effect their Safety and Happiness."

---Thomas Jefferson, in the Declaration of Independence

[jkr]

CAPITOL CONTROLS!
you are not permitted to "leave" in any permanent sense
they will not let you leave with "their money" & assets that YOU worked for
they will come for your money that you earn elsewhere
they will come for you if they dont get "their money" and throw you in a cage...or WORSE

we are ALL $laves!
you cant check out any time you like, and you can never leave
and that is the law

stfu!

[heavenlyboy34]

This is a republic. That means you and I run this nation. Why should I leave just because you're too lazy and stubborn to do your damned job?
Actually, in republican theory, representatives "run the nation"-supposedly representing the wishes of the electorate (not so much in practice, of course).

[KingRobbStark]

Best response:

NO, U LEAVE!

[heavenlyboy34]

---Thomas Jefferson, in the Declaration of Independence
My favorite part of that document. :)

[evilfunnystuff]

then why don't you just git out?

Cuz fuck you thats why!

Anyone who resorts to that is never gonna be swayed.

[idiom]

What if the person says it to you and you are living in 1930's Germany?

[awake]

'If you don't like it, leave it', will in actuality be ' get out if you can'.

[truelies]

I simply remind them that they can neither silence me nor make me leave my Country..........and that ANY attempt to do so would be a very bad mistake.

[heavenlyboy34]

Not to mention bot-flys.

Do yourself a favor.

DO NOT GOOGLE "BOT-FLY LARVA IN HUMANS".
Wait...you still use google? :eek: Damn, I thought you didn't like being spied on.
Google’s Broken Promise: The End of “Don’t Be Evil”
(http://gizmodo.com/5878987/its-official-google-is-evil-now)
In a privacy policy shift (http://www.google.com/policies/), Google announced today that it will begin tracking users universally across all its services—Gmail, Search, YouTube and more—and sharing data on user activity across all of them. So much for the Google we signed up for.
The change was announced in a blog post today (http://googleblog.blogspot.com/2012/01/updating-our-privacy-policies-and-terms.html), and will go into effect March 1. After that, if you are signed into your Google Account to use any service at all, the company can use that information on other services as well. As Google puts it:
Our new Privacy Policy makes clear that, if you're signed in, we may combine information you've provided from one service with information from other services. In short, we'll treat you as a single user across all our products, which will mean a simpler, more intuitive Google experience.

(much more at linky)

[idiom]

Or, did Dietrich Bonhoeffer or Albert Einstein make the better choice?

Should one be leaving America now, going Galt as it were, to preserve what they can in order to return after the collapse, or possibly to join the fight to liberate America in the future?

As impressive as America's blade of grass fortress is, the government repeatedly steps over peoples lines in the sands and all that happens is people draw a new line.

[John F Kennedy III]

What if the person says it to you and you are living in 1930's Germany?

Yes I am.

[Philhelm]

The response depends on the person asking the question.

Possible response:

"I'd rather expel the vile traitors that ruined the homeland of our dear Founding Fathers, blessed be thy names."

To a neocon: "Um, I'm a veteran...didn't I earn my keep? Also, aren't you supposed to suck my dick or let me sleep with your wife? You do support the troops, don't you? DON'T YOU?"

"I would leave, but the progressive, statist scum have spread their filth across the entire globe. The final battlefield shall be here. Are you willing to die for your cause?"

[awake]

Reading up on Greece will give you a good primer of what we are in for... 25%+ unemployment, seniors who have their pensions and retirements wiped out thanks to the government promise of "retirement". Left to walk the streets with children who can't afford to take them in...suicide rate quadrupled... All of this damn mess is thanks to the mistaken belief that government can do anything, when in reality it can do nothing but rob you of everything.

They are calling for a dictator in Greece to stop the austerity, they have one already, the bankers who are liquidating them. Who will save the from the bankers????

[Wesker1982]

I respond to this here (http://wesker1982.wordpress.com/2012/04/16/taxation-is-theft/)

[emazur]

If you don't like the Constitution (the Supreme Law of the Land), it's YOU who should leave.

[bunklocoempire]

"How do you respond to "If you don't like it, leave the country"?

With the questions:

Why would you be content walking around with your undergarments filled with poo?

What is so attractive and nostalgic about your soiled clothes that you wouldn't want to have them clean again?

Why would you insist others to join you in that behavior?

If others would rather have clean clothes, then why should they be gone from your presence?

What is your fascination with failure?

And then with the statement:

You are perfectly free to go on living in your soiled undergarments, but it doesn't have to affect me.

Invite others to use yourself and the products of your labor -there are no end to the folks who would help you out with that.

Stay in a cage if you think you have too much freedom or burn some of your money if you think it's worth too much.

Your behavior doesn't have to affect me.

[LinuxJedi]

Well, this type of thing is childish baiting. However, I think somebody did tell the manufacturing jobs to leave the country, so kudos to you Mr. Leave the Country If You Don't Like It, you torched the industrial sector. Which one is next? Yes, there are other reasons for manufacturing jobs leaving... but the point is that if the attitude is "get out if you don't like something" there won't be much of an economy left, will there?

What is the overall effect to the US if scientists, engineers, innovators and other ground-shakers are told "get out" by the ignorant masses?

Anyways, I have already come to my own conclusion to leave North America... and attempt to fund candidates / initiatives from abroad.

[phill4paul]

I tell them I am phill4paul of the state of North Carolina and that if North Carolina decided to leave the Union of so called 'America' I would well, and joyously, oblige.

[Natural Citizen]

Or, did Dietrich Bonhoeffer or Albert Einstein make the better choice?

Should one be leaving America now, going Galt as it were, to preserve what they can in order to return after the collapse, or possibly to join the fight to liberate America in the future?

As impressive as America's blade of grass fortress is, the government repeatedly steps over peoples lines in the sands and all that happens is people draw a new line.

I don't know why this is the first thing that popped into my head when I read your posting. But it was. Scwewy, ain't it?

Dr. Michio Kaku Says America Has A Secret Super Weapon (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e7D3_eGaO5k&feature=related) - Galtish at the very least.

[TheTexan]

"Okay"

[mmink15]

Thanks all, my response was this
I love America, that is why I won't be leaving it. I happen to be a law abiding citizen that follows the rules and believes in fair play. Why don't the people that are trying to change the rules to benefit or slight certain groups and blindly supporting candidates that vote to reduce our freedoms leave America? You can love a country but expect more from its citizens and government can't you? Isn't that kind of what this country was founded on? Like I said, sounds like your auditioning for Fox news anchor with that Love it or Leave it line. In case you fell asleep during history, free speech and lack of censorship was a big deal when this whole country started up. It says a lot for a person's opinion when they actively repress any opposing viewpoint, and not in a good way. It just isn't healthy thinking/living. It's not a good and positive approach, it's destructive and devisive. No, our president wasn't elected on his looks, it was the promises of Change that won everyone over. And he was specific too: Ending Gitmo, troops home from Iraq within a year, end to torture/illegal detentions/cronyism of previous administration, NOT extending Bush's tax cuts for wealthy, I could go on but I doubt you've even read this far before starting to type some witty 'soundbyte you read in an article title somewhere' response. Mitt Romney is no better, but there are more than 2 parties in this country and democracy was not set up to be a horse race with citizens betting on winners. I could, probably should, have just let this all slide. But nothing offends me more than when people censor intelligent debate/discussion to suit their agenda.

His response: Great. I know all of this. And I'll still post whatever I feel necessary, and either ignore or delete your comments if I don't approve or care to see them on my page.

[mmink15]

I'm letting it sit a bit, no rationalizing with this guy. It is frustrating as all get out and it makes me want to scream, but I'm reminding myself that arguing with a fool only proves there are two.

[emazur]

If you don't like the Constitution (the Supreme Law of the Land), it's YOU who should leave.

Anarchists seem to have gotten pissy about this - I've gotten a neg rep. Well for all you knee jerkers who love dishin' out the red, you should know that I also support anarchists' right to secede or purchase land from the government to be used for a stateless society.

[heavenlyboy34]

Anarchists seem to have gotten pissy about this - I've gotten a neg rep. Well for all you knee jerkers who love dishin' out the red, you should know that I also support anarchists' right to secede or purchase land from the government to be used for a stateless society.
The Force is with you. :cool:

[LibertyEagle]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nTqEePlZiqk&feature=plcp

His ancestors did.

[LibertyEagle]

If you don't like the Constitution (the Supreme Law of the Land), it's YOU who should leave.

+1

[TheTexan]

+1

Do you support our right to secede and/or buy land from the government?

[Dianne]

My response is, I am leaving it... I'm 60 years old... I've fought and marched for civil rights, marched to end wars .. I don't want another dollar of my hard earned paychecks... killing anyone... anywhere !!!!!!

I've worked since I was 14 years old, you do the math... I've paid into this system three fold, and I hate the system and refuse to pay into it any longer. Not another dime of my earnings will go to killing innocent victims, or to rape and foreclose on American victims, who also worked their entire lives to have their homes stolen and sold to some illegal immigrant... free citizenship if you buy this home that has already been sold 35 times on the stock exchange and no one knows who the hell owns it anymore.

The USA is so corrupt, and so mafia driven... I am proud to say I am leaving it. What a disgusting piece of shit this country has become; and you can thank the idiot who said if you don't like it, why don't you leave it? LMAO that attitude is what destroyed this country. He is the problem, not you.

[UWDude]

I respond as such:

"WRONG! This si my country! And this country has a thing called freedoms and rights, and if you don't want them, than go to China or North Korea, and live in your perfect police state there!"

[Dianne]

One other thing... Obama, Pelosi, Reid and the other mafia chieftains know we who remain sain, wish to leave this hell hole; once referred to as a republic; now known as a dictatorship .... so they have placed what is called an "exit tax"

Anyone know more information about that? When you leave the USSA, you have to pay an exit tax, fess up to the IRS about anything you might or might not owe; then you are still required to pay US income tax while you live abroad.

[malkusm]

Respond with "Well ideally, I should just be able to leave the state. The states were supposed to be very different from one another, not homogenous and under central control."

[JSaindon]

I'm letting it sit a bit, no rationalizing with this guy. It is frustrating as all get out and it makes me want to scream, but I'm reminding myself that arguing with a fool only proves there are two.

Sounds ignorant and smug, the worst combo. I hope they are under 30 or all hope is lost on this one. Socialist for life. If he knows Obama didn't deliver on 90% or more of his platform in '08, it boggles my mind why he would still support him.

[MJU1983]

See Subject title

Why should I leave? It's a childish argument.

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y205/MJU1983/318628_237653536290282_423819946_n.jpg

[QuickZ06]

Where liberty dwells, there is my country.

[heavenlyboy34]

If you don't like the Constitution (the Supreme Law of the Land), it's YOU who should leave.
As Mises would argue, if you don't like the Constitution, you should micro-secede.

[low preference guy]

the law says that someone who doesn't like the way things are can stay. so you're the one who disagrees with the law and you should leave.

[donnay]

I would submit to him, "And leave and go where? When the control grid is finally in place (it's almost there), there will be no where to run. We will all be slaves on the global plantation. The U.S. government has been hijacked, we need to bring these criminals to justice. We have the legal documents to do it! No where else in the world does. The founders knew where the real power lies, it lies within each and everyone of us. Now, if you do not want to partake in taking back what is rightfully ours, move the hell out of our way!"

[idiom]

I would submit to him, "And leave and go where? When the control grid is finally in place (it's almost there), there will be no where to run. We will all be slaves on the global plantation. The U.S. government has been hijacked, we need to bring these criminals to justice. We have the legal documents to do it! No where else in the world does. The founders knew where the real power lies, it lies within each and everyone of us. Now, if you do not want to partake in taking back what is rightfully ours, move the hell out of our way!"

I consider that one must inquire of oneself what does one hope to achieve by staying?

I picked a country to move to and moved to it. There are a lot of options, from low government nations to regions with very little government at all. Some are hellish like Somalia, but some are bright and friendly like the Solomon Islands.

The world is a big place and the US government really doesn't care about most of it.

[Swarmed]

Ask them why you have to leave. Why shouldn't they leave instead?

[donnay]

I consider that one must inquire of oneself what does one hope to achieve by staying?

I picked a country to move to and moved to it. There are a lot of options, from low government nations to regions with very little government at all. Some are hellish like Somalia, but some are bright and friendly like the Solomon Islands.

The world is a big place and the US government really doesn't care about most of it.

Because we have the legal documents to right the wrongs. The people have the power, not the hijacked government. And they know it, and that is why this police state is tighten ever so quickly around us.

[oyarde]

See Subject title How would I respond ? It is my Country, made great at one time by strict observance to the US Constitution and defenders of it , like me , eroding , badly , for, about 100 years . Leave ? , no I will not , I was born here , my blood & sweat , permeate the earth on the few acres I own of my family farm , worked by my Father and his Father before him . Leave , LOL , i WILL never Surrender . In many, many battles , I never have . It is what it is. That would be my response . I may die , but, my teachings and instructions will not .

[cavalier973]

My family has been here since before the War for Independence; if you count my mother's side, we've been here since before Columbus. So, I have an idea: why don't you leave my country, you lousy illegal immigrant?

[oyarde]

I tell them I am phill4paul of the state of North Carolina and that if North Carolina decided to leave the Union of so called 'America' I would well, and joyously, oblige. Yeah , I would vote to secede as well...

[Romulus]

I say I will not leave, the ones who are committing fraud will leave, and like it!

[pcosmar]

.

The world is a big place and the US government really doesn't care about most of it.

You mistakenly believe it is about the "US" government.

The agenda is a One World Government,, with a One World Dictator..

the present "US govt" is a tool,, The UN is a facilitator.

Have you found a Non-UN country?

[Original_Intent]

If you don't like the Constitution (the Supreme Law of the Land), it's YOU who should leave.

That's my choice. I'd also say, if you want to change the constitution, give it your best shot at amending it. Pretending that anything that you don;t like in the Constitution just doesn't exist isn't a moral option, and if you think otherwise you are guilty of treason and should either leave the country or be tried for the crime.

[PaulConventionWV]

See Subject title

I would rather like to leave the country. I think I will some day. Thanks for the advice, old guard Republicans!

[Acala]

How about this:

"Why don't YOU leave the country. The liberty-lovers were here first."

[DGambler]

"What, you don't like the first amendment? Perhaps you are the one that should leave."

[phill4paul]

In the words of Washington GOP Senate Candidate Todd Akin... "Go F--k Yourself..."

[PaulConventionWV]

Not to mention bot-flys.

Do yourself a favor.

DO NOT GOOGLE "BOT-FLY LARVA IN HUMANS".

That's like telling me not to think about a pink elephant.

[PaulConventionWV]

Do you support our right to secede and/or buy land from the government?

I would honestly like to see a group of people try to form a stateless society.

[heavenlyboy34]

"What, you don't like the first amendment? Perhaps you are the one that should leave."
Careful with that one. The answer would be: what, you don't like the 16th amendment or the FED? You should leave. ;)

[Shane Harris]

Ask them the same thing about any issue they want to change. Don't like abortion? Leave! Don't like capitalism? Leave! Don't like taxes? Leave! Don't Like Obama? Leave! Don't like Bush? Leave! Don't like war? Leave! Don't like gays? Leave! etc. It really means nothing.

[jonhowe]

As someone mentioned earlier, leaving just makes it easier for the government to justify blowing you up.

Also, what a freaking loser. He only focuses on the good things? Is that what he said about BUSH?