Sen Lautenberg's new bill to "restrict" online ammo sales introduced

[devil21]

One of the biggest anti-gunners on Capitol Hill introduced legislation today to effectively ban the online sale of ammo without a gov't issued license and allow the feds to track ammo sales. I havent seen the bill itself but here's one of the first news items about it.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/white-house-gives-cool-welcome-bill-restricting-online-182934423.html



The proposal, crafted by Democratic Senator Frank Lautenberg and Democratic Representative Carolyn McCarthy, aims to restrict the ability of Americans to buy unlimited quantities of ammunition over the Internet, or by mail order, anonymously.

.....

The new legislation, dubbed the Stop Online Ammunition Sales Act, rests on four pillars, according to Lautenberg's office:

It requires anyone selling ammunition to be a licensed dealer.

It requires ammunition buyers who are not licensed dealers to present photo identification at the time of purchase, effectively banning the online or mail order purchase of ammo by regular civilians.

It requires licensed ammunition dealers to maintain records of the sale of ammunition.

It requires licensed ammunition dealers to report the sale of more than 1,000 rounds of ammunition to an unlicensed person within any five consecutive business days.

more at link


Im sure there's no new restrictions on gov't purchases though. They need that 450 million rounds of hollow point .40 as soon as possible.

[youngbuck]

Damnit, I buy most of my ammo online...

[phill4paul]

Damnit, I buy most of my ammo online...

Unfortunately, I knew that this was going to be framed as an ammo issue. Ammo and high-capacity clips are what they are targeting this time around.

[RPfan1992]

Two Capitol Hill Democrats announced legislation Monday that would effectively end online and mail-order sales of ammunition following the recent massacre in Colorado, where police say the shooter bought more than 6,000 rounds online without proving identification.

The proposal was introduced outside New York City Hall by New Jersey Sen. Frank Lautenberg and New York Rep. Carolyn McCarthy, and it marked the latest development in the gun control debate rekindled after 12 people were killed and 58 others wounded in the July 20 shooting inside an Aurora, Colo., movie theater.

Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia -- one of the high court’s most conservative justices -- also weighed in when he said on “Fox News Sunday” that the Supreme Court’s 2008 majority ruling on handguns in the District of Columbia stated the extent of limits on gun ownership “will have to be decided in future cases.”

The Stop Online Ammunition Sales Act would require buyers who are not dealers to present a photo ID at the time of purchase, “effectively banning the online or mail-order purchase of ammo by regular citizens,” according to a summary of the legislation provided to Fox News.

The three other provisions are: Only licensed dealers can sell ammunition, the licensed dealers must keep records of ammunition sales and they must report the sales of more than 1,000 rounds to an unlicensed buyer within five business days.

Lautenberg and McCarthy said they will introduce the legislation later this week.

“If someone wants to purchase deadly ammunition, they should have to come face to face with the seller,” Lautenberg said. “It's one thing to buy a pair of shoes online, but it should take more than a click of the mouse to amass thousands of rounds of ammunition.”

He also said the legislation is a “common sense” effort to flag suspicious activity and help prevent such sales to "a terrorist or the next would-be mass murderer.”

One of the most outspoken voice in favor of gun control since the Colorado shootings has been New York City Mayor Michael Bloomberg, who has continued to press President Obama and Mitt Romney to use the campaign trail to address the issue of gun violence.

“We should be having a great debate among two accomplished leaders and the people they're asking to hire them,” said Bloomberg, co-founder of Mayors Against Illegal Guns. “If the presidential candidates won't act, others will, including Senator Lautenberg and Congresswoman McCarthy.”

Lautenberg and McCarthy proposed legislation to limit large-capacity magazines after Democratic Rep. Gabrielle Giffords was shot in 2011 with a handgun that had an attachment that could carry roughly 30 rounds of ammunition.

Congress passed legislation in 1994 that included a ban on such devices but it expired in 2004. Since then, the largely-Democratic effort to reinstate the ban, which also limited the sale of so-called assault weapons, has garnered little support in Congress.

It appears unlikely that either the House or Senate will take up the new legislation, considering the GOP-controlled House would probably not support such a measure, and Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid has already said there is no time for that debate in his chamber during the final months of the session.

Even so, Lautenberg and McCarthy argue there was an appetite for such change even before the shootings, pointing to Google no longer selling ammunition and firearms through its shopping channels.

Romney has said he does not believe America needs new gun laws, while Obama has said he supports gun ownership but suggested revisiting legislation on background checks and assault weapons, which prompted the response from Reid.

White House Deputy Press Secretary Josh Earnest said Monday he didn’t know whether the president has seen the new legislation but the administration would track it and similar proposals in Congress.

Earnest also repeated Obama’s belief in the Second Amendment but said the president thinks the country must take “robust steps within law” to address gun issues.

Lautenberg and McCarthy were joined Monday by Dan Gross, president of the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence.

"We as a nation know we are better than this,” Gross said. “We are better than 32 gun murders every day.”

This will not stop gun violence in my opinion.

[GuerrillaXXI]

Even forgetting about the unconstitutionality of it, such a law would be completely ineffective at preventing violence, and it would destroy a number of businesses. I think this is far too outrageous to pass.

Even so, I'm really beginning to get sick of this shit from the anti-gun obsessives. :mad:

[LibertyEagle]

This will not stop gun violence in my opinion.

Of course it won't. But, that is not their intent.

[phill4paul]

Ammo and high capacity mags have been an underlying target for awhile. The winds are not blowing in the direction gun control but the margin is closer for restriction.

[devil21]

Damnit, I buy most of my ammo online...

Walmart appreciates the Senator working to put small businesses out of business. MidwayUSA, while not a small business, is not amused either.

off topic:
Your avatar is creepy considering where you're from.

[Anti Federalist]

Gawd, Lousenberg's still alive?

I swear, I was fighting anti gun legislation from him in NJ over thirty years ago and he was ancient then.

What are these creeps' secret?

Fetal grindings?

FFS...

[devil21]

There's a movie about a "secret" lab that grows humans for the sole purpose of harvesting their fresh organs when the old elites of government and corporations need new ones. Can't think of the name but it's got that Scarlett Johannson (sp?) chick and maybe Ewen McGregor in it. Wouldn't surprise me if it were loosely based on a real program.

[shane77m]

Just placed an order for some bulk ammo today. Better buy it while you can.

[pauljmccain]

^^^ "The Island"

I almost always buy more than 1000 at a time. The ex-Soviet 7.62 comes 1120 to the crate. Not like this will ever pass though.

[GuerrillaXXI]

What's particularly diabolical about this law is the fact that many people can't get the ammo they need in the quantities they shoot without buying over the Internet. Not everyone is lucky enough to live next to Fred's Ammo Warehouse.

I'm beginning to think this whole anti-freedom agenda is going to come to a head in our lifetimes. The Founders would have already been shooting by now. Today's freedom-lovers have been very patient and have always sought to work around these draconian gun restrictions in a peaceful and dignified manner, retaining our necessary deterrent against tyranny without crossing the line into violence. But politicians and their enforcement goons are pushing us into a corner, and our options are running out.

[GunnyFreedom]

Proposal for State Nullification:


If both the buyer and the seller of online ammunition transactions are located within the boundaries of the State of North Carolina, then Federal law restricting the sale of ammunition online shall not apply, notwithstanding the location of any ISP Network or Administrative Headquarters, or any associated equipment.

The State of North Carolina shall not cooperate with any Federal activities relating to the restriction of online ammunition sales both originating and terminating within the borders of the State of North Carolina.

The State of North Carolina shall interpose itself on behalf of the People of North Carolina. Any Federal agent or law enforcement official attempting to serve any Federal warrant against the online sales of ammunition that have never at any point crossed outside of the State of North Carolina, shall be guilty of a Class H Felony.

[John F Kennedy III]

Of course it won't. But, that is not their intent.

Right. Their intent is to increase violence.

[Xhin]

I'm beginning to think this whole anti-freedom agenda is going to come to a head in our lifetimes.

But what will we call it? I like "American Spring" myself.

[GunnyFreedom]

Imagine calling your Sheriff to defend you against ATF coming after the online ammo you bought from within your own state. :D

[devil21]

Proposal for State Nullification:

10th amendment at work

I would support that bill. Every state needs to introduce something like it. That's why these more local races are so important!

[GunnyFreedom]

I'm getting a picture here.


Section 1: "If any employee, agent, or service member of the Federal Government, or Department of Defense Chain of Command (to include the National Guard upon any orders from out of State) attempts to serve warrants defined as unauthorized in Section 1.1 or in Section 1.2 of this bill, they shall be guilty of a class I felony once per every offense.

Section 1.1: "Principle Definitions of Unauthorized Warrants
.

A) Any law that violates the writ of Habeas Corpus except in war or insurrection is unconstitutional, and any warrants pursuant to the suspension of Habeas Corpus are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina, except that the State of North Carolina declare by 2/3 of the General Assembly present that a condition of war or insurrection concurrently exists in North Carolina. (US Constitution Article 1)

B) Any law that supposes the government ownership of persons is a violation of the 13th Amendment to the US Constitution prohibiting slavery, and any warrants pursuant to the control over free persons are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (Amendments to the US Constitution)

C) Any law that imposes a tax must arise out of the US House and not the US Senate, all warrants pursuant to tax bills arising from the US Senate are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (US Constitution Article 1)

D) The power to force citizens to purchase a product is not delegated to the Federal Government within the US Constitution, and all warrants pursuant to Federally enforced product purchases are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (10th Amendment)


Section 1.1.1: "Section 1.1 may be amended at any time upon a majority vote of the House and the Senate. The removal of any provision from Section 1.1 shall require a 2/3 vote of the General Assembly present.

Section 1.2: "Firewall Definitions for Unauthorized Warrants:
.

A) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §123.4(a) [NDAA] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §123.4(a) [NDAA] and levy the charge of a Class H felony against all personnel executing the unauthorized warrant.

B) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §456.7(c) [PPACA] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall not interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §456.7(c) [PPACA], except in the direct defense of citizens in the process of being infringed.

C) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §891.0(g) [PATRIOT Act] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall not interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §891.0(g) [PATRIOT Act], except in the direct defense of citizens in the process of being infringed."
.

Section 1.2.1: "Section 1.2 may be amended at any time upon a majority vote of the House and the Senate. The removal of any provision from Section 1.2 shall require a 2/3 vote of the General Assembly present.

Section 2: "State Legislative Interpositional Duties

Section 3: "State Attorney General Duties in the Resolution of State and Federal Conflicts

Section 4: "State Judicial Duties to Interpret Nullification Law as Supreme in North Carolina except for those Federal Laws directly pursuant to Article 6 of the US Constitution.

Section 5: "State Executive Duties in the Defense of Citizens Under Infringement

Section 6: "Description of Powers Retained to the People

Section 7: "Description of Powers Retained to the State

Section 8: Effective Date

[GunnyFreedom]

Refined one step:

Section 1: "If any employee, agent, or service member of the Federal Government, or Department of Defense Chain of Command (to include the National Guard upon any orders from out of State) attempts to serve warrants defined as unauthorized in Section 1.1 or in Section 1.2 of this bill, they shall be guilty of a class I felony once per every offense.
.
Section 1.1: "Principle Definitions of Unauthorized Warrants
.
A) Any law that violates the writ of Habeas Corpus except in war or insurrection is unconstitutional, and any warrants pursuant to the suspension of Habeas Corpus are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina, except that the State of North Carolina declare by 2/3 of the General Assembly present that a condition of war or insurrection concurrently exists in North Carolina. (US Constitution Article 1)
.
B) Any law that supposes the government ownership of persons is a violation of the 13th Amendment to the US Constitution prohibiting slavery, and any warrants pursuant to the control over free persons are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (Amendments to the US Constitution)
.
C) Any law that imposes a tax must arise out of the US House and not the US Senate, all warrants pursuant to tax bills arising from the US Senate are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (US Constitution Article 1)
.
D) The power to force citizens to purchase a product is not delegated to the Federal Government within the US Constitution, and all warrants pursuant to Federally enforced product purchases are unauthorized warrants in the State of North Carolina. (10th Amendment)
.
Section 1.1.1: "Section 1.1 may be amended at any time upon a majority vote of the House and the Senate. The removal of any provision from Section 1.1 shall require a 2/3 vote of the General Assembly present.
.
Section 1.2: "Firewall Definitions for Unauthorized Warrants:
.
A) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §123.4(a) [NDAA] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §123.4(a) [NDAA] and levy the charge of a Class H felony against all personnel executing the unauthorized warrant.
.
B) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §456.7(c) [PPACA] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall not interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §456.7(c) [PPACA], except in the direct defense of citizens in the process of being infringed.
.
C) Any and all Federal warrants pursuant to US Code §891.0(g) [PATRIOT Act] are not authorized in the State of North Carolina. The State shall not interpose itself against unauthorized executions pursuant to US Code §891.0(g) [PATRIOT Act], except in the direct defense of citizens in the process of being infringed."
.
Section 1.2.1: "Section 1.2 may be amended at any time upon a majority vote of the House and the Senate. The removal of any provision from Section 1.2 shall require a 2/3 vote of the General Assembly present.
.
Section 2: "State Legislative Interpositional Duties
.
A) The State of North Carolina has a duty to interpose itself on behalf of citizens being investigated, served warrants on, and prosecuted for the violation of any laws found by the State of North Carolina to be in violation of Article 6 of the US Constitution and Articles 9 and 10 of the Bill of Rights.
.
Section 3: "State Attorney General Duties in the Resolution of State and Federal Conflicts
.
A) The Attorney General of the State of North Carolina shall act as (and may delegate the duties of) defense council to the accused when the accused is held in contempt of any laws for which the execution of warrants would be unauthorised in the State of North Carolina.
.
Section 4: "State Judicial Duties to Interpret Nullification Law as Supreme in North Carolina except for those Federal Laws directly pursuant to Article 6 of the US Constitution.
.
A) All Federal laws that have been properly nullified in this chapter shall be constructed by the Courts as though repealed in fact, provided that all direct and ancillary activities of the defendant in each case at law were retained within the State of North Carolina.
.
Section 5: "State Executive Duties in the Defense of Citizens Under Infringement
.
A) The Governor of the State of North Carolina shall execute (and may delegate) the duty to protect, defend, and advocate for all citizens involved in any Federal enforcement action arising from law the warrants for which would be unauthorized according to Section 1 of this bill.
.
Section 6: "Description of Powers Retained to the People
.
A) Because no list of protected rights can be exhaustive, the following list applies solely for illustrative purposes of the kinds of rights retained to the people in North Carolina, as well as those rights enumerated.
.

1. Freedom of self defense and defense of others.
2. Ownership over our own bodies.
3. The safe use and disposal of personal and real property.

.
Section 7: "Description of Powers Retained to the State
.
A) Because no list of protected rights can be exhaustive, the following list applies solely for illustrative purposes of the kinds of rights retained to the State of North Carolina, as well as those rights enumerated.
.

1. Food safety and farm management regulation.
2. Control over public education.
3. Food and Drug policy and regulation.
4. Intrastate firearms regulation
.
Section 8: "Effective Date. This bill is effective upon adoption.

[oyarde]

I just got free shipping yesterday on a mail order of a case of 12 ga 3 inch steel , hex shaped #1's , 1 3/8 oz shot , the hex shape allows more shot stacked in the hull and throws a pattern , about eight inches wider , so , my #1 , about 140 pellets ( pellets .16 inch , or about 4 mm )in a 38 inch circle . Sweet . Called Winchester Blind Side .

[madengr]

^^^ "The Island"


Which was a copy of The Clonus Horror (even has the creepy politician).
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0078062/