HEADS UP: Sheriff Joe Arpaio 2:30 Live Press Conference On Obama's Eligibility Thread

[Bosco Warden]

Starts in 23 minutes.


This afternoon at 2:30pm Phoenix time/ 5:30pm Eastern time July 17, 2012, the Maricopa County Sheriff's Department, a authoritative law enforcement agency, will hold a live press conference wrapping up a 11 month Investigation into Barack Obama's eligibility. The major media will be there and the information they are going to reveal has been labeled by lead investigator Mike Zullo as 'Breathtaking' pertaining to his birth and presidential eligibility. If what they have on Obama from what is circulating on pro Obama websites, it could be devastating for him, his presidency and this nation. The press conference will be live and you can watch it here at this link live streaming this afternoon.

http://www.ustream.tv/WND

http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_phoenix_metro/central_phoenix/sheriff-arpaio-holds-another-news-conference-on-president-obamas-birth-certificate

[S.Shorland]

On now

[Bosco Warden]

This is wild, it went from 6k viewers to 14k viewers in seconds.

[ghengis86]

Anything earth shattering?

[Bosco Warden]

They are making the case that regardless who made the PDF birth cert, only the Dept of Health in Hawaii has the authority to do so.

They made the case that this did not happen.

.
that is a cliff notes version.

[muzzled dogg]

i can't believe people are still occupied with this

[Bruno]

i can't believe people are still occupied with this

I can't believe people always waste their time to tell others they are wasting their time.

[RonRules]

The serial number on the birth certificate indicates that he was not born at the claimed hospital.

[Indy Vidual]

Obvious fraud is obvious.


i can't believe people are still occupied with this

I can't believe anyone thinks an original document will turn into a .pdf with layers.

[muzzled dogg]

I can't believe people always waste their time to tell others they are wasting their time.

i'm not wasting time. i've managed to put a lot of you lost souls back, transients, and wanderers back on track

[Bosco Warden]

i'm not wasting time. i've managed to put a lot of you lost souls back, transients, and wanderers back on track


I get it, giving people something they do not want is your MO..

Thanks Liberal.

[NoOneButPaul]

I can't believe people always waste their time to tell others they are wasting their time.

It bothers us because theres so much more we need to be focusing on instead...

[muzzled dogg]

liberal would be stealing from people first

[RonRules]

The Hawaii Dept of Health did not create the PDF file.

The long form birth certificate is absolutely a forged document.

[MelissaWV]

i'm not wasting time. i've managed to put a lot of you lost souls back, transients, and wanderers back on track

Department of Redundancy Department; how may we help you to help you?

[RonRules]

Sheriff Arpaio is looking for a Congressman to get Congress to investigate.

Hey, how about Ron Paul last action on the job!

[Indy Vidual]

Original docs do not turn into .pdf's with layers.

1) If the fake birth document is actually fake, then it IS truly important.
2) The fake doc is such an obvious fake, how can anyone not know by now?


It bothers us because theres so much more we need to be focusing on instead...

[RonRules]

CBS Channel 5 news-person asked Sheriff Arpaio if he would pull over Obama's motorcade and ask Obama to prove his citizenship!

Arpaio responded to get the news-person clearly identified!

[RonRules]

The Ustream video came very close to 20,000 views. I expect a few dozen YouTubes to come out of that.

[RonRules]

The comments on the ABC news story are very much against Arpaio.

http://www.abc15.com/dpp/news/region_phoenix_metro/central_phoenix/sheriff-arpaio-holds-another-news-conference-on-president-obamas-birth-certificate

I personally think that he and Det. Zullo did an excellent job considering the string of obstacles that were place in their path.

[S.Shorland]

My version said 40,000 views.It's so obviously a forgery.

[NoOneButPaul]

Original docs do not turn into .pdf's with layers.

1) If the fake birth document is actually fake, then it IS truly important.
2) The fake doc is such an obvious fake, how can anyone not know by now?

Its so obvious despite an outpouring of attention and money not 1 shred of decent evidence has crossed anyone's desk.

This story has been going forever, they've found nothing, Trump found nothing, Arpaio found nothing, the State of Arizona's Attorney concluded it was sufficient when he asked to see it. On and on and on and on it goes... more proof to more people its real yet you still you guys pound home about nothing when you could be out advancing the liberty movement or wasting your time discussing things that actually matter politically.

This is nothing, and will never be taken seriously be anyone. It hasn't yet, it never will, period. Move on... it's real, he's an American. Work on getting him out of office...

[RonRules]

My version said 40,000 views.It's so obviously a forgery.

Yes the TOTAL views was 40,000, but the max real-time individuals listening at any time was near 20,000. (Sometimes people log off and others log in)

[Bruno]

Quit trying to herd cats and move on yourselves.

/cat herding

[RonRules]

This story has been going forever, they've found nothing, Trump found nothing, Arpaio found nothing,

I can't believe you're saying that. Did you listen to the March 1 conference? Did you also see what they found about the selective service card forgery?

Just about EVERYTHING about Obama historical records, school and college records, vaccination is missing. His social security card was issued from CT, a state where he never lived!

His very own biography on the pamphlets of his publishers (that Obama most likely wrote himself as authors do clear states he was born in Kenya).

To this day Hawaii will not produce the originals, the microfilms, nothing.

Please dedicate ONE HOUR of research and if you are personally honest with yourself, you will be convinced that Obama's story is a lie.

I also can't believe I have to explain that on a "Republican" forum!

[Indy Vidual]

I will prove you wrong, since you are seriously misinformed.


Its so obvious despite an outpouring of attention and money not 1 shred of decent evidence has crossed anyone's desk....

This one takes a bit longer (Geek oriented), if you have the time to see how incorrect you are:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s9StxsFllY


This version is shorter and still proves you are seriously mistaken about lack of evidence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oHJobXm1xc

FYI: The first video includes showing the download straight from the Whitehouse site.

[kathy88]

IF he is not a citizen and IF he gets away with it, the precedent will never be recovered from. And I don't mean the citizenship issue. The shit will roll downhill faster than we can run.

[hazek]

Here's a pretty complete summary of the press conference with all the facts that were presented and 0 propaganda or opinion:
http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

[Lafayette]

If Joe wants to attempt to arrest Obama, great! If he is hurt or captured in the process, well... one less tyrannical police state enforcer on the street.

Its really a win win either way.

[RonRules]

Here's a pretty complete summary of the press conference with all the facts that were presented and 0 propaganda or opinion:
http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

Excellent article well worth taking 5 minutes to read it. Also, I'm impressed that there's already 725 comments!

Some relevant parts:

- The sheriff’s investigators have learned of a birth certificate coding system that indicates the White House document has been altered.

- An interview with the Hawaii official who allegedly signed the Obama document in 1961, Verna K.L. Lee, provided further confirmation of the coding anomalies.

- Investigators were troubled to find key information missing on the verification document Hawaii provided to Arizona’s secretary of state in May.

- Hawaii’s deputy attorney general, Jill T. Nagamine, confirm the state has a birth document on file for Obama. But she would not confirm on the record that the White House document matched what was on file with the Hawaii Department of Health.

- The sheriff’s investigators interviewed three persons of interest who have provided additional information in the case.

The codes seen on the document issued by the White House are not consistent with the information entered into the various fields, indicating the document has been altered or amended.

In the coding system, the number 9 indicates the information is not stated, meaning there should not be any information in the box in which the number is written.

However, the number 9 can be seen written in pencil next to the fields for “Usual Occupation,” “Kind of Business or Industry” and “Race of Father” on Obama’s document. Each of those fields are filled with information.

http://www.wnd.com/files/2012/07/codes.jpg

“This proves the document has been tampered with and information has been placed on it,” Zullo said.

Sheriff’s investigators tracked down the registrar who allegedly signed the White House’s birth document, U.K. Lee, who is now 95. She provided information that posed further inconsistencies with the story of Obama’s birth at the Kapiolani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital in 1961.

(She's the last living person named on that birth certificate. They also recorded her)

[RonRules]

If Joe wants to attempt to arrest Obama, great! If he is hurt or captured in the process, well... one less tyrannical police state enforcer on the street.

The Sheriff of your county has higher law enforcement power than ANY federal agency.

[Indy Vidual]

Excellent article well worth taking 5 minutes to read it...
..
http://www.wnd.com/files/2012/07/codes.jpg

“This proves the document has been tampered with and information has been placed on it,” Zullo said....

These prove it more clearly:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s9StxsFllY


This version is shorter and still proves the obvious fake:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oHJobXm1xc

[TheTexan]

These prove it more clearly:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s9StxsFllY

I'm a bit late to this party it seems. Has anyone on these forums independently verified this video, using the PDF from whitehouse.gov?

[Bruno]

I'm a bit late to this party it seems. Has anyone on these forums independently verified this video, using the PDF from whitehouse.gov?

Some hre did their own work on it the very day it came out, while the media accepted the BS and moved on. "nothing to see here, folks!"

[Indy Vidual]

Some hre did their own work on it the very day it came out, while the media accepted the BS and moved on. "nothing to see here, folks!"

Yes I just proved it, but didn't take time to make screenshots.
Wow.

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf
^^^
Open in Adobe Illustrator and turn off some layers. :eek:

[Original_Intent]

I'm a bit late to this party it seems. Has anyone on these forums independently verified this video, using the PDF from whitehouse.gov?

Canada Free Press did quite an intensive series of stories a year or more ago that were incredibly detailed...nothing that they found today is really news, but it does seem that a majority of people have been successfully herded into the "if you question the birth certificate, you are a racist redneck bastard." mindset.

Even many people on this forum and other good people on other forums have adopted the "nothing to see here, move along" attitude, when in fact, anyone that spends even an hour of research (whether intending to prove it fake or intending to prove it authentic) will come away believing that the whitehouse.gov birth certificate is authentic. It doesn;t prove Obama wasn't born in Hawaii. or that he was born in Kenya, or anything else. But anyone that will exert any effort to prove or disprove will quickly understand that what was on the whitehouse site was a forged document, and wouldn't be accepted in any court of law as proof of citizenship. And yes, I followed the steps in the video, viewed the b.c. directly on the whitehouse.gov website and all of the problems pointed out were there.

The first obvious problem is there is no legitimate reason that a simply scanned document would become a multiple layered PDF file, and further no explanation was ever given for this - anyone that brought it up was shouted down as an obvious racist.

Another was that the print did not follow the bend of the page near the binding. This is something that is hard to detect but once pointed out again is obvious and indisputable evidence that it was forged.

And there is a LOT more. And the problem for obama and defenders is that any ONE of those things is DAMNING evidence that it is a forgery. Now, Like Sheriff Joe said, they are not accusing Obama of anything. But somebody somewhere forged the document. That is something that I have known with absolute certainty for more than a year, but like most things, it's not what you know, and in truth it is not even what you can prove, it is what you can get enough people to reject the propaganda about.

[donnay]

This is what can be next if we do not care about Obama's eligibility.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPBrt-mdNmQ

[The Other Andy]

Okay, question:

Let's assume for a moment that President Obama is, in fact, not a legal US citizen.

Why claim that he is, forge these documents, run him as president, etc. etc. If he isn't a citizen, who is gaining what from this? I'm not understanding the actual motive here.

[Indy Vidual]

Okay, question:

Let's assume for a moment that President Obama is, in fact, not a legal US citizen.

Why claim that he is, forge these documents, run him as president, etc. etc. If he isn't a citizen, who is gaining what from this? I'm not understanding the actual motive here.

He is a perfect puppet, obeying his masters so they do not expose him. If he stops obeying then they can bring him down at any time.

History repeats...
The Clinton's had Whitewater, and they obeyed.
Saddam Hussein stopped obeying; He got killed.
Manuel Antonio Noriega stopped obeying, and he got removed from power.
Remember Nixon? etc. etc. etc.

[hazek]

Okay, question:

Let's assume for a moment that President Obama is, in fact, not a legal US citizen.

Why claim that he is, forge these documents, run him as president, etc. etc. If he isn't a citizen, who is gaining what from this? I'm not understanding the actual motive here.

There's a simple non conspiratorial explanation.. His parents or friends of parents weaseled themselves into getting him a birth certificate even though he wasn't actually born in Hawaii thinking he'll have a better life this way.. If he was a regular guy, no one would have ever cared and he would have lived his life as an ordinary citizen but since he just so happens to be in politics and sitting on the most important chair at that this little part of his history is getting more limelight than he can afford if he doesn't want to reveal where he was actually born.

If you listened to the press conference they discovered a legal loop hole that enables almost anybody to get a birth certificate, Obama might just be one of them who got it but shouldn't have. There's no ruse in this, no conspiracy, just a stupid rule by a gang of psychopaths and a psychopath who perhaps broke it and is now trying to hide it in order to keep his position among the psychopaths, that's all.

[RonRules]

Why claim that he is, forge these documents, run him as president, etc. etc. If he isn't a citizen, who is gaining what from this? I'm not understanding the actual motive here.

Because now you have a "blackmailable" President in the Whitehouse that will be obliged to act in accordance to the wishes of his leaders.

I would not have such things a year or two ago, but if you try to be objective about this, it makes sense.

Romney could also be a blackmailable President.

Only Ron Paul can't.

[RonRules]

My personality type: INTJ -

I'm INTJ too! It shows, so I'm told.

[rockerrockstar]

They give out only computerized birth certificates in that state from what I have found out. That may explain why it would be on a pdf and multilayered.

[Indy Vidual]

There's a simple non conspiratorial explanation....

He is a simple, "factual" explanation of the puppet concept.


Felix Frankfurter, Justice of the Supreme Court (1939-1962), said: "The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise power from behind the scenes."
February 23, 1954, Senator William Jenner warned in a speech: "Outwardly we have a Constitutional government. We have operating within our government and political system, another body representing another form of government, a bureaucratic elite which believes our Constitution is outmoded."
In a letter to an associate dated November 21, 1933, President Franklin Roosevelt wrote, "The real truth of the matter is, as you and I know, that a financial element in the large centers has owned the government ever since the days of Andrew Jackson."

[Indy Vidual]

The computerized birth certificates in that state from what I have found out. That may explain why it would be on a pdf and multilayered.

It was presented as an original document, i.e. piece of paper.
Did you even watch this video?


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s9StxsFllY


This version is shorter and still proves the obvious fake:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oHJobXm1xc

[Badger Paul]

"I also can't believe I have to explain that on a "Republican" forum! "

And it was Republican governor of Hawaii who had control of those birth records circa 2007-11 when Linda Lingle was in office. Don't you think if there was anything legitimately wrong with those records the party would have used that against him? Hmmmm?

[romancito]

I can't believe you're saying that. Did you listen to the March 1 conference? Did you also see what they found about the selective service card forgery?

Just about EVERYTHING about Obama historical records, school and college records, vaccination is missing. His social security card was issued from CT, a state where he never lived!

His very own biography on the pamphlets of his publishers (that Obama most likely wrote himself as authors do clear states he was born in Kenya).

To this day Hawaii will not produce the originals, the microfilms, nothing.

Please dedicate ONE HOUR of research and if you are personally honest with yourself, you will be convinced that Obama's story is a lie.

I also can't believe I have to explain that on a "Republican" forum!

There, you got it.

[rockerrockstar]

The doubters have latched onto the idea that Adobe Illustrator — the premier program for computer graphic artists — “reveals” evidence of document manipulation in the Obama birth certificate. They note Illustrator reveals nine separate layers of the document, and claim it’s “proof” the file has been altered.
But that’s not so, says Jean-Claude Tremblay, a leading software trainer and Adobe-certified expert, who has years of experience working with and teaching Adobe Illustrator.

“You should not be so suspicious about this,” Tremblay told FoxNews.com, dismissing the allegations.
He said the layers cited by doubters are evidence of the use of common, off-the-shelf scanning software — not evidence of a forgery. “I have seen a lot of illustrator documents that come from photos and contain those kind of clippings—and it looks exactly like this,” he said.
Tremblay explained that the scanner optical character recognition (OCR) software attempts to translate characters or words in a photograph into text. He said the layers cited by the doubters shows that software at work – and nothing more.
“When you open it in Illustrator it looks like layers, but it doesn’t look like someone built it from scratch. If someone made a fake it wouldn’t look like this,” he said.“Some scanning software is trying to separate the background and the text and splitting element into layers and parts of layers.”


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/29/expert-says-obamas-birth-certificate-legit/#ixzz20wFRAiZH


Read the full article from an Expert: No Doubt Obama's Birth Certificate Is Legit

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/29/expert-says-obamas-birth-certificate-legit/#ixzz20wF0aMqg
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/29/expert-says-obamas-birth-certificate-legit/

[ShaneEnochs]

The Sheriff of your county has higher law enforcement power than ANY federal agency.

Only IN that county, though. And I believe there are even stipulations to that, such as not being allowed to arrest a congressman or senator when they're on their way to a vote.

[Danke]

i can't believe people are still occupied with this

i'm not wasting time. i've managed to put a lot of you lost souls back, transients, and wanderers back on track

Shemdogg, always there for a good laugh.

[Bruno]

"I also can't believe I have to explain that on a "Republican" forum! "

And it was Republican governor of Hawaii who had control of those birth records circa 2007-11 when Linda Lingle was in office. Don't you think if there was anything legitimately wrong with those records the party would have used that against him? Hmmmm?

And be called racists? Right!

But the argument still doesn't hold true regardless. Besides, the Democratic governor friend of Obama couldn't even find the birth cerificate, then it suddenly appeared in the same book and page and date order where any 4th grade student should have been able to find it.

[romancito]

Okay, question:

Let's assume for a moment that President Obama is, in fact, not a legal US citizen.

Why claim that he is, forge these documents, run him as president, etc. etc. If he isn't a citizen, who is gaining what from this? I'm not understanding the actual motive here.

It is simply the opposite of Ron Paul. Ron Paul wants to affirm the Constitution but others want to completely nullify it.

[rockerrockstar]

Here is another video that shows evidence that it is real

Obama Birth Certificates are real see video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB1opCUt4zk

Hawaii verifies Obama birth records to Arizona
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/hawaii-verifies-obama-birth-records-arizona/story?id=16410772#.UAYlI7Se68A

[Bruno]

Here is another video that shows evidence that it is real

Obama Birth Certificates are real see video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB1opCUt4zk

None of that is evidence and it ignores all the real issues already raised previously in this thread. It is not even the same birth certificate discussed here, and this was from three years ago.

Additionally, the newspaper articles do not prove he was born on that day, as there were numerous ways births were reported to the newspapers during that period that were not verified.

That newpaper article provides nothing as evidence, only that they sent what they feel is verification to Arizona, which is being investigated by Arpaio and only raises more questions.

The only thing that is for certain is that a large portion of Obama's past is an unverifiable mystery.
Fail. Try again.

[Danke]

Here is another video that shows evidence that it is real

Obama Birth Certificates are real see video

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bB1opCUt4zk

Hawaii verifies Obama birth records to Arizona
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/hawaii-verifies-obama-birth-records-arizona/story?id=16410772#.UAYlI7Se68A

I'd like to see his college records. We know he is a CIA stooge and globalist. So why do we care about where he was born? It is a distraction.

[rockerrockstar]

For you birthers I found this and it is pretty good for convincing people that he may have been born in Kenya.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VNEEFHk3q_4&feature=player_embedded#!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-4FqVRWgrNw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiO8BNwh4F8

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zH4GX3Otf14


Another thing to wonder is if Obama was born in Kenya would he still be considered a US Natural born citizen.


here is what one of the commenters on the last video said it makes one think. Since his mother is a citizen does it matter if he was not born in the USA?

'Natual born citizen' does NOT mean you must have two U.S. citizen parents. It does matter where you are born, it does NOT mean both your parents must be citizens.

Here is a video that claims Obama can't remember his birthday of all things.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wF_n-gn-Yo

[Muwahid]

Obvious fraud is obvious.



I can't believe anyone thinks an original document will turn into a .pdf with layers.

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO OBSESSED WITH LAYERS?!

Look at the alleged "LAYERS" they're a jumble of gibberish text, the scanning software *tries* to interpret the letters so the document can become searchable (ctrl+f) thats why SOME scanned docs can be word searched.

[rockerrockstar]

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO OBSESSED WITH LAYERS?!

Look at the alleged "LAYERS" they're a jumble of gibberish text, the scanning software *tries* to interpret the letters so the document can become searchable (ctrl+f) thats why SOME scanned docs can be word searched.

You are right look at that fox news article from an expert on Adobe Illustrator and scanning.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/29/expert-says-obamas-birth-certificate-legit/#ixzz20wFRAiZH

[Bruno]

Here is a video that claims Obama can't remember his birthday of all things.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2wF_n-gn-Yo

Irrelevant point is irrelevant.

[Danke]

I'd like to see his college records. We know he is a CIA stooge and globalist. So why do we care about where he was born? It is a distraction.

and...

[rockerrockstar]

Found this interesting article on if Obama is a Natural Born Citizen. It goes into what the law is to claim Natural Born Citizen. To sum it up if he was born in the USA he should be a Natural Born citizen. If he was born in Kenya he should not be because his mother was not in the USA for 5 years past her 16th birhday before giving birth to him. She had him at 18 years of age.

This is relevant because you need to be a Natural Born Citizen to become a president.

Here is the article
http://urbanlegends.about.com/od/barackobama/a/obama_citizen.htm

[Bruno]

This is headlined on Drudge right now.

[Indy Vidual]

WHY ARE PEOPLE SO OBSESSED WITH LAYERS?!

Look at the alleged "LAYERS" they're a jumble of gibberish text, the scanning software *tries* to interpret the letters so the document can become searchable (ctrl+f) thats why SOME scanned docs can be word searched.


You are right look at that fox news article from an expert on Adobe Illustrator and scanning.

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2011/04/29/expert-says-obamas-birth-certificate-legit/#ixzz20wFRAiZH

Nice try guys, Fox News experts, LOL?

“The only way I have been able to replicate the piecemeal nature of the birth certificate (some continuous-tone content, some bipmap content) is by combining bitmap and continuous-tone images in Adobe Illustrator,” the expert concludes.
............
In conclusion, despite repeated trials, no expert has been able to replicate the effects seen in the Obama birth certificate PDF by scanning a document, even with OCR software switched on and the resulting PDF optimized. ~Source (http://www.wnd.com/2011/08/329221/)

[Don Lapre]

Watching the mental gymnastics some people go through to try to deny the OVERWHELMING evidence that this 'president' is a complete fraud is actually one of the more pitiful things I've ever witnessed.

[Indy Vidual]

Watching the mental gymnastics some people go through to try to deny the OVERWHELMING evidence that this 'president' is a complete fraud is actually one of the more pitiful things I've ever witnessed.

+1984
Watch them try to answer this:

E-Verify 'flags' Obama's Social Security Number
System crunches prez's data, determines 'likely fraudulent'


A private investigation reveals that the Social Security Number being used by Barack Obama does not pass a check with E-Verify, the electronic system the U.S. Citizenship and Immigrations Services of the U.S. Department of Homeland Security has created to verify whether or not prospective employees have the required authorization to work legally in the United States. ~Source (http://www.wnd.com/2011/09/344461/)

[Don Lapre]

It's just (another) mix up, Indy.

Stop your racist attacks.

[TheTexan]

I consider myself a very skeptical person. As skeptical as I am of the government's stories, I'm just as skeptical of the conspiracy theories themselves. I'm not the type to go around telling other people conspiracy theories are "facts", despite the sometimes overwhelming evidence.

However, this is one of those rare cases where the facts are more than simply overwhelming. There are several things wrong with this forgery, and each individually would be enough to be 100% sure. Taking all the evidence together, I can say without a doubt, unconditionally, that the birth certificate is not a scan of an original document, but is in fact a fabrication. I would bet my life on it.

[Indy Vidual]

I consider myself a very skeptical person...

...
However, this is one of those rare cases where the facts are more than simply overwhelming. There are several things wrong with this forgery, and each individually would be enough to be 100% sure. Taking all the evidence together, I can say without a doubt, unconditionally, that the birth certificate is not a scan of an original document, but is in fact a fabrication. I would bet my life on it.

IS THAT A RACIST FLAG IN YOUR AVATAR? :p

[Dianne]

I will prove you wrong, since you are seriously misinformed.



This one takes a bit longer (Geek oriented), if you have the time to see how incorrect you are:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7s9StxsFllY


This version is shorter and still proves you are seriously mistaken about lack of evidence.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3oHJobXm1xc

FYI: The first video includes showing the download straight from the Whitehouse site.

The reason I find it important, is if it is proven Obama is not eligible to be President; maybe we can declare all the dictatorial bullshit he has done to the American people, as a nullity and void.

[Dianne]

Why we don't see too much of Michelle:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpifjvCcaGY

[S.Shorland]

Both press conferences taken together,I'd bet 50% of my net worth that the document (and the others mentioned) are forgeries.As mentioned,they aren't claiming it is Obama perpetrating a fraud but somebody is.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Reports show that, under Arpaio, the MCSO may be improperly clearing as many as 75% of cases without arrest or proper investigation. The sheriff's office has failed to properly investigate serious crimes, including the rape of a 14 year old girl by classmates, the rape of a 15 year old girl by two strangers, and the rape of a 13 year old girl by her father.

In an interview on the ABC Nightline news program, when asked to explain why 82 percent of cases were declared cleared by exception, Arpaio said "We do clear a higher percentage of that. I know that. We clear many, many cases – not 18 percent." Nightline contacted the MCSO after the interview and was told that of 7,346 crimes, only 944, or 15%, had been cleared by arrest.


In 2008, when Phoenix Mayor Phil Gordon called for a federal investigation into Arpaio's immigration enforcement tactics, Arpaio's office responded by demanding the mayor's emails and phone logs. Arpaio also had his critic Maricopa County Supervisor Don Stapley, a Republican, arrested on suspicion of failing to properly disclose business interests


Federal Judge Neil V. Wake ruled in 2008, and again in 2010, that the Maricopa County jails violated the constitutional rights of inmates in medical and other care related issues. This ruling was a result of a lawsuit brought by the ACLU, which alleged that "Arpaio routinely abused pre-trial detainees at Maricopa County Jail by feeding them moldy bread, rotten fruit and other contaminated food, housing them in cells so hot as to endanger their health, denying them care for serious medical and mental health needs and keeping them packed as tightly as sardines in holding cells for days at a time during intake."

In a ruling issued in October 2010, the U.S. Ninth Circuit Court of Appeals ordered Arpaio to follow Judge Wake's 2008 ruling, which required Arpaio to end severe overcrowding and ensure all detainees receive necessary medical and mental health care, be given uninterrupted access to all medications prescribed by correctional medical staff, be given access to exercise and to sinks, toilets, toilet paper and soap and be served food that meets or exceeds the U.S. Department of Agriculture's dietary guidelines.


As of December 2011, a federal grand jury had been investigating Arpaio's office on criminal abuse-of-power allegations since at least December 2009 and was specifically examining the investigative work of the sheriff's anti-public corruption squad.


In February 2010, Judge John Leonardo found that Arpaio "misused the power of his office to target members of the (Board of Supervisors) for criminal investigation".

In 2008, a federal grand jury began an inquiry of Arpaio for abuse of power, in connection with an FBI investigation. Arpaio is being investigated for politically motivated and "bogus" prosecutions, which a former US Attorney called "utterly unacceptable". Phoenix Mayor Phil Gordon has called Arpaio's "long list" of questionable prosecutions "a reign of terror"

As of July 2010, only Sandra Dowling has been successfully prosecuted. Indicted on 25 felony counts, Dowling eventually pled guilty to patronage for giving a summer job to her daughter, a single class-2 misdemeanor which was not among the original counts, although as part of the plea bargain she also agreed to recuse herself from the Maricopa County Regional School District. Dowling has since filed suit, alleging negligence, malicious prosecution, abuse of process and several constitutional violations


During the month of July 2010, a committee established by Arpaio, the Campaign to Re-Elect Joe Arpaio 2012, funded advertisements critical of Rick Romley, a candidate in the Republican Primary for Maricopa County Attorney and Arizona Attorney General candidate Tom Horne, despite the fact that Arpaio is not currently running for re-election (his term does not expire until the end of 2012).

An order issued on the behalf of the Maricopa Elections Department on August 24, 2010, found that one of the advertisements, a direct mailer, advocated the defeat of Romley, and was an in-kind contribution to Bill Montgomery (Romley's primary election opponent), in violation of Arizona election law. The order stated that the Campaign to Re-Elect Joe Arpaio 2012 will be fined three times the amount of money that was spent on the mailer. In September, 2010, Arpaio's campaign was fined $153,978 in this matter. Montgomery ultimately defeated Romley in the primary election, with Romley stating Arpaio's ads "hurt" his results


An analysis by the Maricopa County Office of Management and Budget, completed in April 2011, found Arpaio had misspent almost $100 million over the previous 5 years.

Arpaio used the detention fund to pay for investigations of political rivals, and activities involving his human-smuggling unit. The analysis also showed a number of inappropriate spending items, including a trip to Alaska where deputies stayed at a fishing resort, and trips to Disneyland. Separate investigations by The Arizona Republic uncovered widespread abuse of public funds and county policies by Arpaio's office, including high-ranking employees routinely charging expensive meals and stays at luxury hotels on their county credit cards.

The Republic also found that a restricted jail enhancement fund was improperly used to pay for out-of-state training, a staff party at a local amusement park, and a $456,000 bus, which was purchased by Arpaio in violation of county procurement rules.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jo0eTspzUkk

A criminal investigating a criminal. Nice

[Don Lapre]

Both press conferences taken together,I'd bet 50% of my net worth that the document (and the others mentioned) are forgeries

You should go 100%.

It's fake as hell - and anyone who's been paying attention to the sick saga over the past 4 years knows it.

The whole thing is surreal.


Barry fought tooth-and-nail for four years to keep from having to release his long form birth certificate.
Not the actions of a man who has nothing to hide, is it?

Then he finally released it on April 27th of last year.
When he did, the media mantra was, "Oh, that's it. Done deal. Nothing to see here. Move along."

You mean... nobody is going to actually inspect this document that this man fought so vigorously to keep from showing??

Wtf??

Well, people did inspect it and many multiple experts (beyond the Arpaio group) have put their reputations on the line to declare that it is absolutely a bogus document.


We don't have a single representative who simply stands up and says they think it's rightful to actually inspect this document that this man fought so hard to hide from the American people?

Why not?

No Ron Paul, Mr. Liberty?

*FAIL*

VERY disappointing.

What in fuck's name is going on here?


I've considered the reaction of the media and our representatives and have come to the conclusion that a coup has taken place.

[S.Shorland]

For a man of my age (knocking on),50% is as good as 100.It also says something that the reporters vehemently attack the messenger rather investigating the evidence.

[Don Lapre]

“We’ve been told from behind the scenes that nobody in Congress wants to touch it,” Zullo said.




It truly is the twilight zone.

[Bruno]

http://i50.tinypic.com/2rnwi9t.jpg

[libertariantexas]

I predict the "birthers" and other conspiracy theorist nuts will successfully remove Obama from office in January, 2017. At which point they will probably stage a big show, featuring Joe Arpaio and Alex Jones, touting their success..

[Bruno]

I predict the "birthers" and other conspiracy theorist nuts will successfully remove Obama from office in January, 2017. At which point they will probably stage a big show, featuring Joe Arpaio and Alex Jones, touting their success..

Ah, name calling instead of discussing actual issues addressed by this thread. A common tactic used against Ron Paul, surprised you went there.

"Ron Paul is a kook, a nutty quixotic libertarian who thinks America is to blame for 9/11, and all his followers are deluding themselves if they think he could ever become President. When Obama is relected because they didn't vote for the Republican nominee based on priciple, they will probably stage a big show and tout their success."

[S.Shorland]

Funny film about Obama's relationship with Frank Marshall Davis (possibly his real father)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fD-bsoymEyE

[RonRules]

The article on WND is now! up to 2824 comments

http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

Here's a productive comment for those of you that think we should ignore this (It's not just about the birth certificate)

Obama’s Records:
1. Occidental College records….SEALED
2. Columbia College records….SEALED
3. Columbia Thesis paper….SEALED
4. Harvard College records….SEALED
5. Selective Service Registration….SEALED (but with known fraudulent dates)
6. Uses SSN from the State of Connecticut even though was never a resident of the state….HOW? SEALED
7. Medical records….SEALED
8. Illinois State Senate schedule….SEALED
9. Illinois State Senate records….SEALED
10. Law practice client list….SEALED
11. Certified copy of original Birth Certificate….SEALED
12. Signed Embossed paper Certificate of Birth….SEALED
13. Baptism record….SEALED
14. He and Michelle Obama returned law permit to Illinois in 1993 and no longer can practice law, why? SEALED
15. Law School and ACT Test scores….SEALED
16. Why did he get “Foreign Student Grand Aid” as a student? SEALED
17. How could he travel for weeks with his beau to Pakistan in 1981. SEALED
18. On what passports did he leave US to see Grandma Obama and on which ones did he get
into Pakistan? PASSPORTS SEALED.
18. How were the tens of thousands dollars for College Years funded? SEALED
19. The adoption records of Barry Soetoro? SEALED
20. At Chicago, what did part-time Lecturer Obama write, such as a path-breaking legal article or a book on jurisprudence that
warranted a rare full tenure offer? (and has such offer ever been extended to others
of like stature? … SEALED
21. Custom Records for week of Obamas birth? MISSING
22. Why did he apply for a loan as Harrison J Bounel?

No one knows who Obama is; the Media never vetted him and his supporters have spent millions preventing any release of the above.

What little has been presented have proven to be photo shopped frauds.

And even worse: The media knows this and have been culpable accessories.

The Reporters who should be rabid supportersof Truth and Freedom of Press have surrendered their craft to an illusion.
It appears our Constitution no longer appliesto anyone in government. Obama and the Media have are blantantly lying to us.

[Dianne]

I predict the "birthers" and other conspiracy theorist nuts will successfully remove Obama from office in January, 2017. At which point they will probably stage a big show, featuring Joe Arpaio and Alex Jones, touting their success..

Wow, I too am surprised you would use the msn's name calling to intimidate people into not asking questions or speaking out.... birthers, truthers, paultards, paulbots, isolationists, tea baggers, etc.

[RonRules]

Wow, I too am surprised you would use the msn's name calling to intimidate people into not asking questions or speaking out.... birthers, truthers, paultards, paulbots, isolationists, tea baggers, etc.

Don't forget "Flippers!"

But I like that name.

[AuH20]

The article on WND is now! up to 2824 comments

http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

Here's a productive comment for those of you that think we should ignore this (It's not just about the birth certificate)

Obama’s Records:
1. Occidental College records….SEALED
2. Columbia College records….SEALED
3. Columbia Thesis paper….SEALED
4. Harvard College records….SEALED
5. Selective Service Registration….SEALED (but with known fraudulent dates)
6. Uses SSN from the State of Connecticut even though was never a resident of the state….HOW? SEALED
7. Medical records….SEALED
8. Illinois State Senate schedule….SEALED
9. Illinois State Senate records….SEALED
10. Law practice client list….SEALED
11. Certified copy of original Birth Certificate….SEALED
12. Signed Embossed paper Certificate of Birth….SEALED
13. Baptism record….SEALED
14. He and Michelle Obama returned law permit to Illinois in 1993 and no longer can practice law, why? SEALED
15. Law School and ACT Test scores….SEALED
16. Why did he get “Foreign Student Grand Aid” as a student? SEALED
17. How could he travel for weeks with his beau to Pakistan in 1981. SEALED
18. On what passports did he leave US to see Grandma Obama and on which ones did he get
into Pakistan? PASSPORTS SEALED.
18. How were the tens of thousands dollars for College Years funded? SEALED
19. The adoption records of Barry Soetoro? SEALED
20. At Chicago, what did part-time Lecturer Obama write, such as a path-breaking legal article or a book on jurisprudence that
warranted a rare full tenure offer? (and has such offer ever been extended to others
of like stature? … SEALED
21. Custom Records for week of Obamas birth? MISSING
22. Why did he apply for a loan as Harrison J Bounel?

No one knows who Obama is; the Media never vetted him and his supporters have spent millions preventing any release of the above.

What little has been presented have proven to be photo shopped frauds.

And even worse: The media knows this and have been culpable accessories.

The Reporters who should be rabid supportersof Truth and Freedom of Press have surrendered their craft to an illusion.
It appears our Constitution no longer appliesto anyone in government. Obama and the Media have are blantantly lying to us.

Pretty incriminating summary. Obama the American politician is very much a state created fairy tale.

[donnay]

I think the bottom line is; regardless of where you stand on this issue, Americans want transparency in government!!!


Prudence, indeed, will dictate that Governments long established should not be changed for light and transient causes; and accordingly all experience hath shewn, that mankind are more disposed to suffer, while evils are sufferable, than to right themselves by abolishing the forms to which they are accustomed. But when a long train of abuses and usurpations, pursuing invariably the same Object evinces a design to reduce them under absolute Despotism, it is their right, it is their duty, to throw off such Government, and to provide new Guards for their future security.-



ENOUGH IS ENOUGH!!

[RonRules]

Full recap of the press conference and revisiting all the anomalies in Obama's birth Certificate: (And some of you claim nothing was found?!!)


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yuSvFoPNLA0


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yft0kz_fbnA


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=lLrWI3vQ7Kc


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=UH4BHau2EV8


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=35rnliYemWU

[Original_Intent]

"I also can't believe I have to explain that on a "Republican" forum! "

And it was Republican governor of Hawaii who had control of those birth records circa 2007-11 when Linda Lingle was in office. Don't you think if there was anything legitimately wrong with those records the party would have used that against him? Hmmmm?

This only makes sense if you truly believe the two major parties are opposed to each other. Sure they each want more control, but not to the point of exposing each other's INSTITUTIONAL dirty laundry to us plebes.

[DerailingDaTrain]

http://oi47.tinypic.com/14qh53.jpg

[juleswin]

It bothers us because theres so much more we need to be focusing on instead...

Exactly, I sooner spend my time educating people on the dangers of Central banking than spending anytime on this issue. Its just like investigating the theft of $100 from the crime scene of a massacre. Look at the bigger picture folks

[mport1]

i can't believe people are still occupied with this

Me either. Who cares?

[Miss Annie]

Me either. Who cares?

I care. I care because the longer this is allowed to continue...... the more of a precedent is set to spit in the face of the rule of law. This is THE LAW. The laws are being broken. It is a felony to use a fraudulent SS#. It is a felony to commit forgery.
The damage that is being done to the moral of this country to allow this to continue is beyond sad. If the highest office in the country is not subject to abiding by the rule of law - why should anyone else be?
To me this is a complete mind F!#* that people would care so little about this issue. I have to show identification to get a library card for pete's sake and this is a minor issue???? What is wrong with this picture?!!?

[Bosco Warden]

Me either. Who cares?

You're a self described anarchist, why are you even here?

We are for a limited Govt, not NO Govt.

Now STFU, and remove yourself from this forum.

Please. :0)

I see from your sig youre part of the Liberty movement subversion team. Nice, at least I know where the bullshit is coming from. Thanks for that.

[AuH20]

I care. I care because the longer this is allowed to continue...... the more of a precedent is set to spit in the face of the rule of law. This is THE LAW. The laws are being broken. It is a felony to use a fraudulent SS#. It is a felony to commit forgery.
The damage that is being done to the moral of this country to allow this to continue is beyond sad. If the highest office in the country is not subject to abiding by the rule of law - why should anyone else be?
To me this is a complete mind F!#* that people would care so little about this issue. I have to show identification to get a library card for pete's sake and this is a minor issue???? What is wrong with this picture?!!?

It's pretty telling the blatant disregard for the American people when they attempt to pass such a shoddy reproduction. But maybe that was the desired goal from beginning. Utilize the controversial conspiracy industry to cloak this obvious violation of the law.

[mport1]

I care. I care because the longer this is allowed to continue...... the more of a precedent is set to spit in the face of the rule of law. This is THE LAW. The laws are being broken. It is a felony to use a fraudulent SS#. It is a felony to commit forgery.
The damage that is being done to the moral of this country to allow this to continue is beyond sad. If the highest office in the country is not subject to abiding by the rule of law - why should anyone else be?
To me this is a complete mind F!#* that people would care so little about this issue. I have to show identification to get a library card for pete's sake and this is a minor issue???? What is wrong with this picture?!!?

The government has ignored their own laws since its inception. I don't see this changing anytime soon. This has always been a nation not ruled by laws, but by men and their arbitrary dictates.


You're a self described anarchist, why are you even here?

We are for a limited Govt, not NO Govt.

Now STFU, and remove yourself from this forum.

Please. :0)

I see from your sig youre part of the Liberty movement subversion team. Nice, at least I know where the bullshit is coming from. Thanks for that.

I'm here because I've supported Ron Paul with thousands of dollars and man hours because I believe he is the best method to get people to understand the ideas of liberty.

There are quite a few anarchists on this board and elsewhere that are huge supporters of Ron Paul and have also donated a lot of time and money to the campaign...

Not sure what your comment about my signature means.

[UtahApocalypse]

The article on WND is now! up to 2824 comments

http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

Here's a productive comment for those of you that think we should ignore this (It's not just about the birth certificate)

Obama’s Records:
1. Occidental College records….SEALED
2. Columbia College records….SEALED
3. Columbia Thesis paper….SEALED
4. Harvard College records….SEALED
5. Selective Service Registration….SEALED (but with known fraudulent dates)
6. Uses SSN from the State of Connecticut even though was never a resident of the state….HOW? SEALED
7. Medical records….SEALED
8. Illinois State Senate schedule….SEALED
9. Illinois State Senate records….SEALED
10. Law practice client list….SEALED
11. Certified copy of original Birth Certificate….SEALED
12. Signed Embossed paper Certificate of Birth….SEALED
13. Baptism record….SEALED
14. He and Michelle Obama returned law permit to Illinois in 1993 and no longer can practice law, why? SEALED
15. Law School and ACT Test scores….SEALED
16. Why did he get “Foreign Student Grand Aid” as a student? SEALED
17. How could he travel for weeks with his beau to Pakistan in 1981. SEALED
18. On what passports did he leave US to see Grandma Obama and on which ones did he get
into Pakistan? PASSPORTS SEALED.
18. How were the tens of thousands dollars for College Years funded? SEALED
19. The adoption records of Barry Soetoro? SEALED
20. At Chicago, what did part-time Lecturer Obama write, such as a path-breaking legal article or a book on jurisprudence that
warranted a rare full tenure offer? (and has such offer ever been extended to others
of like stature? … SEALED
21. Custom Records for week of Obamas birth? MISSING
22. Why did he apply for a loan as Harrison J Bounel?

No one knows who Obama is; the Media never vetted him and his supporters have spent millions preventing any release of the above.

What little has been presented have proven to be photo shopped frauds.

And even worse: The media knows this and have been culpable accessories.

The Reporters who should be rabid supportersof Truth and Freedom of Press have surrendered their craft to an illusion.
It appears our Constitution no longer appliesto anyone in government. Obama and the Media have are blantantly lying to us.

If only Romney would answer the question about showing his tax records with this ^^^^^^

[qh4dotcom]

Ok, now that it has been determined the BC is a forgery it's about time for Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Justin Amash, The Judge and everyone else who took the oath to finally start doing their jobs of defending the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements. Because they all took the oath it's their duty to get involved in this constitutional issue...nobody who brags so much about defending the Constitution should be given a free pass on this issue...I hate to see principled men like Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Justin Amash behave like the rest of the 500+ corrupt members of Congress and participate in the coverup of Obama's crimes...what do you all think?

[AuH20]

Ok, now that it has been determined the BC is a forgery it's bout time for Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Justin Amash, The Judge and everyone else who took the oath to finally start doing their jobs of defending the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements. Because they all took the oath it's their duty to get involved in this constitutional issue...nobody who brags so much about defending the Constitution should be given a free pass on this issue...I hate to see principled men like Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Justin Amash behave like the rest of the 500+ corrupt members of Congress and participate in the coverup of Obama's crimes...what do you all think?

The main problem is that Taitz and Trump already made this investigation into the punchline of a joke, which I suspect was done intentionally.

[Bosco Warden]

It's pretty telling the blatant disregard for the American people when they attempt to pass such a shoddy reproduction. But maybe that was the desired goal from beginning. Utilize the controversial conspiracy industry to cloak this obvious violation of the law.

To simply discount this and move on is not an option, there are legitimate questions that need to be answered.

Its no more complicated then that.


The government has ignored their own laws since its inception. I don't see this changing anytime soon. This has always been a nation not ruled by laws, but by men and their arbitrary dictates.

Again, ignoring this blatant disregard for the law is not the answer. This isnt part of the RP ;liberty movement, but why we shouldnt join forces with those who want to fight this fight makes no sense to me. You have nothing to lose and everything to gain.



I'm here because I've supported Ron Paul with thousands of dollars and man hours because I believe he is the best method to get people to understand the ideas of liberty.

There are quite a few anarchists on this board and elsewhere that are huge supporters of Ron Paul and have also donated a lot of time and money to the campaign...

Not sure what your comment about my signature means.

Thanks for your contributions, while i must trust what youre saying as true, and I am not big on trust in person let alone online with people I do not know.

No offense, but its across the board. I only know by youre actions and what you chose to support by your posting actions here.

RP has always been a law abiding citizen, if in fact this is an illegal or forged document then it needs to be pursued.

Again I ask, what do you have to lose by at least supporting this by proxy here?

[qh4dotcom]

The Hawaii Dept of Health did not create the PDF file.

The long form birth certificate is absolutely a forged document.

Next time a cop pulls you over, try showing him a PDF of your driver license and tell him it is proof that you are licensed to drive....next time you come back to the US from a foreign country, show the immigration officer a PDF of your passport and tell him it's proof you can legally enter the country.

People are so stupid that they accept PDFs of birth certificates as proof Obama was born in this country.

[NewRightLibertarian]

Wow, I too am surprised you would use the msn's name calling to intimidate people into not asking questions or speaking out.... birthers, truthers, paultards, paulbots, isolationists, tea baggers, etc.

Why are you surprised? It happens here all the time



It's pretty telling the blatant disregard for the American people when they attempt to pass such a shoddy reproduction. But maybe that was the desired goal from beginning. Utilize the controversial conspiracy industry to cloak this obvious violation of the law.

They're deliberately making it obvious these days IMO because they got such a large percentage of the American population in a zombie-like daze. Look at the Bin Laden garbage too for another example. Just blatant in-your-face obvious conspiracies designed to infuriate those who haven't been robbed of any intellectual curiosity and critical thinking ability as they try to convey the message to the braindead mob

[qh4dotcom]

He is a perfect puppet, obeying his masters so they do not expose him. If he stops obeying then they can bring him down at any time.

History repeats...
The Clinton's had Whitewater, and they obeyed.
Saddam Hussein stopped obeying; He got killed.
Manuel Antonio Noriega stopped obeying, and he got removed from power.
Remember Nixon? etc. etc. etc.

You make sense but how do you explain the exceptions to the rule....Ahmadinejad hasn't been removed...Assange hasn't been killed...nobody is touching Putin.

[mport1]

Again I ask, what do you have to lose by at least supporting this by proxy here?

I just think it is a waste of time and I don't see what it will accomplish. I also don't really care about the government's laws, just natural law. So, if some government official breaks their own laws, it is definitely hypocritical, but I really just don't care that much. I think most of their laws are ridiculous to begin with.

If we are going to have an office of President, I think anybody should be able to hold the office no matter where they are born.

[Bosco Warden]

Why are you surprised? It happens here all the time



They're deliberately making it obvious these days IMO because they got such a large percentage of the American population in a zombie-like daze. Look at the Bin Laden garbage too for another example. Just blatant in-your-face obvious conspiracies designed to infuriate those who haven't been robbed of any intellectual curiosity and critical thinking ability as they try to convey the message to the braindead mob

I disagree, I think this is the perception they want to portray but then how do you explain RP and liberty movement who these same people still insist its a fringe movement yet they can't find enough anti-libertarian articles fast enough which has really stepped up over the last few months if this wasn't a issue?

This is an information war, and this is only a slanted view of what THEY want you to believe.

80% of the American people want these wars to end yet you dont hear that from the MSM, its not the illusion they want you to have.


Everyone has to fall back on "If you stand for nothing, you'll fall for anything."

Strong constitutional conviction, and understanding can't be hijacked or sub-verted. It is what it is. But they can try, and they are trying very hard.

The liberty movement does not have a huge media outlet to perpetuate our cause, but that doesn't mean the movement itself does not exist.

IMHO.

[Bosco Warden]

I just think it is a waste of time and I don't see what it will accomplish. I also don't really care about the government's laws, just natural law. So, if some government official breaks their own laws, it is definitely hypocritical, but I really just don't care that much. I think most of their laws are ridiculous to begin with.

If we are going to have an office of President, I think anybody should be able to hold the office no matter where they are born.

Interesting statement, but that is what I was getting at.

I'm not even going to ask you about illegal immigration, by your post here are dont see a need.

This is your opinion, and you are entitled to is, but I strongly disagree.

[John F Kennedy III]

National Security Threat: Obama’s Birth Certificate Proven Fraudulent


One of the biggest cover-ups in U.S. political history

Paul Joseph Watson
Infowars.com
Wednesday, July 18, 2012

Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio’s cold case posse has confirmed that President Barack Obama’s birth certificate is “definitely fraudulent,” prompting the media and political establishment to launch a frenzied spin campaign in an effort to deflect attention from the astounding new evidence uncovered by the investigation.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=yft0kz_fbnA


In addition to the deluge of previous evidence clearly proving Obama’s long form birth certificate had been tampered with, including the fact that when analyzed the document clearly shows that layered text has been added in artificially and that the scan of the document is not an original, Arpaio and his posse unearthed tantalizing new information.

The most stunning revelation is the fact that in numerous places, Obama’s birth certificate has had information added at a later date than the original.

The posse was able to obtain the original 1961 coding guide used to fill in the birth certificates at the exact time Obama’s document was filed. For example, when describing the “race of father,” the number 9 on the coding guide indicates “unknown or not stated.”

The number 9 appears on Obama’s birth certificate in section 9 entitled “race of father.” This means that the race of Obama’s father was unknown or not stated at the time the original birth certificate was filed. However, the box also contains the word “African,” which was not even used as a descriptive term at the time. The fact that the document contradicts itself in that it denotes the “race of father” as not stated but then also “African” clearly indicates that “African” was added in at a later date.


The same error can be found in box 12b, “kind of business or industry,” which is also marked with a number 9 to denote ‘not stated’ yet also contains the word “University,” again clearly suggesting the document was tampered with at a later date.

Sheriff Arpaio has now promised to elevate the issue to a higher authority within the federal government.

“Although I am having a difficult time deciding who to forward this information to given the fact that the obvious choices report directly to the president, I cannot stand by and hold on to information that threatens to weaken national security,” said Arpaio.

If you’re wondering how the media and the political establishment will respond to this latest bombshell evidence that Obama’s background is completely fraudulent, look no further than two of the individuals featured in a Fox 10 news report.

Instead of attempting to respond to the astounding facts about the fraudulent nature of the birth certificate unearthed during the investigation, critics resorted to emotional manipulation.

Former Arizona Attorney General Grant Woods labeled the issue “an absolute joke” and questioned why Arpaio would even look into the matter, before falsely claiming that most conservatives had “given up on this issue,” when in reality polls show that a majority of likely Republican voters believe that Obama was born in another country. Woods also labeled the matter “fake” and “offensive,” relying on the use of emotive words rather than challenging the facts surrounding the suspect birth certificate.

Democrat Paul Penzone, who is running against Arpaio for Maricopa County Sheriff, also displayed a jaw-dropping disregard for irony when he responded to the new evidence by stating, “I feel like it’s groundhog day, I’m hearing the same thing over and over again but you’re not going to convince me otherwise – I don’t want to hear any more.”

In other words, ‘my mind’s already made up – don’t bother me with the facts.’

“The media has demeaned this investigation at every turn as silly and wasteful,” said Lisa Allen, MCSO spokesperson. “We simply ask right now that you put your preconceived notions about this listen to the facts and if you can keep an open mind.”

However, none of the criticism of the investigation has dared to address the facts because they cannot be shot down. Instead, opponents of Sheriff Arpaio have cast aspersions about political motivations behind the investigation while others have resorted to name calling and petty jibes.

No matter what spin the media and political establishment attempt to put on this, the facts cannot be denied. President Obama’s birth certificate betrays innumerable instances clearly indicating that the document has been tampered with in an effort to manufacture the myth that Obama was born in the United States.

The manifestly logical conclusion that he was not creates an urgent national security threat and represents one of the biggest cover-ups in U.S. political history.


rest of article here:
http://www.infowars.com/national-security-threat-obamas-birth-certificate-proven-fraudulent/

[Miss Annie]

I just think it is a waste of time and I don't see what it will accomplish. I also don't really care about the government's laws, just natural law. So, if some government official breaks their own laws, it is definitely hypocritical, but I really just don't care that much. I think most of their laws are ridiculous to begin with.

If we are going to have an office of President, I think anybody should be able to hold the office no matter where they are born.

It is completely surreal to me that this situation carries so little weight with anyone in ANY position of power to do anything about it. I am 43 years old and I can remember when Monica was a HUGE deal...... and that was a moral issue. This is a criminal issue and carries no weight at all.
If I had never seen this situation play itself out - I MIGHT hold your beliefs as to it not being of any significance of the President's birthplace or heritage. But I truly believe that THIS situation is exactly what that law was trying to prevent - a takeover from the inside. That is exactly what we have now.
I could have never imagined in my lifetime such a flagrant abuse of the law or such indifference to it. When one truly sees this situation for what it is - it really makes one understand that it really doesn't matter what laws are passed, bills are signed or treaties created ......... We are nothing but screwed.

[Bosco Warden]

Miss Annie I can not thank you again as I must spread the love around apparently but these folks love to get into a PC argument and spin the intent of what is being said here.

This image really speaks to these folks. Stay strong with what you believe to be true Annie.

Sometimes being honest isnt that popular, still doesn't make it right


http://i1080.photobucket.com/albums/j338/Americasforum/320423_414206705296502_646975547_n.jpg

[CaptainAmerica]

Sheriff Asshat Paio is just trying to get re-elected after being busted for shackling a pregnant woman who was detained on the suspicion of being in the u.s. illegally.

[Bosco Warden]

Sheriff Asshat Paio is just trying to get re-elected after being busted for shackling a pregnant woman who was detained on the suspicion of being in the u.s. illegally.

Sheriff Joe is an asshat for doing the Federal Govt job that they refuse to do on border security.

Why dont you go down there and see the border violence, to date over 50k killed.

Ok got it.

I guess the whole state of AZ is a bunch of asshats then because he has been re-elected 6 times

Trolls out in force today. thanks for making it so easy CaptShitstain.

[Don Lapre]

It is completely surreal to me that this situation carries so little weight with anyone in ANY position of power to do anything about it. I am 43 years old and I can remember when Monica was a HUGE deal...... and that was a moral issue. This is a criminal issue and carries no weight at all.
If I had never seen this situation play itself out - I MIGHT hold your beliefs as to it not being of any significance of the President's birthplace or heritage. But I truly believe that THIS situation is exactly what that law was trying to prevent - a takeover from the inside. That is exactly what we have now.
I could have never imagined in my lifetime such a flagrant abuse of the law or such indifference to it. When one truly sees this situation for what it is - it really makes one understand that it really doesn't matter what laws are passed, bills are signed or treaties created ......... We are nothing but screwed.

Right on, Miss Annie.




I hate to see principled men like Ron Paul, Rand Paul, Justin Amash behave like the rest of the 500+ corrupt members of Congress and participate in the coverup of Obama's crimes...what do you all think?

Sorry to say, I view the Pauls as cowards, just like the rest who choose to ignore this.

As Mike Zullo said, it's time for the charade to end.

It's beyond disgraceful that we are 3+ years into Barry's presidency and universally, heads still remain in the sand.

[MelissaWV]

Sheriff Joe is an asshat for doing the Federal Govt job that they refuse to do on border security.

Why dont you go down there and see the border violence, to date over 50k killed.

Ok got it.

I guess the whole state of AZ is a bunch of asshats then because he has been re-elected 6 times

Trolls out in force today. thanks for making it so easy CaptShitstain.

lmao

Ignorance: it's what's for dinner.

[kcchiefs6465]

Sheriff Joe is an asshat for doing the Federal Govt job that they refuse to do on border security.

Why dont you go down there and see the border violence, to date over 50k killed.

Ok got it.

I guess the whole state of AZ is a bunch of asshats then because he has been re-elected 6 times

Trolls out in force today. thanks for making it so easy CaptShitstain.
Joe Arpaio has no credibility left, which is why he can up and do the variety of publicity stunts he has pulled. For Christ Sake he campaigned with Rick Perry on taxpayer money. Millions of dollars are unaccounted for in the MCSO. Every other day there are abuse allegations that are mishandled and dismissed. He brags about how many people he can feed off of the same amount of money he uses to feed his dog. He ignored hundreds of child abuse cases all the while stepping up the ICE raids in Hispanic communities. He has trumped up multiple charges of child pornography for various opponents of his gestapo tactics (all of which were subsequently dropped). Oh, and let's not forget Steven Segal in a tank. Joe Arpaio is a treasonous tumor that should have been cut from America's colon long ago.

The only reason Arpaio gets re-elected is because of Sun City. They would welcome a standing army if they were told they'd be safer.

ETA: And yes, they would be, for lack of a better word, "asshats" for re-electing that tyrant of a pig.

[NewRightLibertarian]

I strongly dislike Joe Arpaio, but the enemy of your enemy is your friend. If he can bring down the Obama regime with this, more power to him

[Miss Annie]

Joe Arpaio has no credibility left, which is why he can up and do the variety of publicity stunts he has pulled. For Christ Sake he campaigned with Rick Perry on taxpayer money. Millions of dollars are unaccounted for in the MCSO. Every other day there are abuse allegations that are mishandled and dismissed. He brags about how many people he can feed off of the same amount of money he uses to feed his dog. He ignored hundreds of child abuse cases all the while stepping up the ICE raids in Hispanic communities. He has trumped up multiple charges of child pornography for various opponents of his gestapo tactics (all of which were subsequently dropped). Oh, and let's not forget Steven Segal in a tank. Joe Arpaio is a treasonous tumor that should have been cut from America's colon long ago.

The only reason Arpaio gets re-elected is because of Sun City. They would welcome a standing army if they were told they'd be safer.

ETA: And yes, they would be, for lack of a better word, "asshats" for re-electing that tyrant of a pig.

It really seems to me that it is quite irrelevant how big of an asshat Joe Arpaio is. That is not the issue at hand. Asshat's identity is not in question.

The issue is the fraudulent Birth Cert, the fake SS#, and the general lack of disclosure here.
Do we also realize how many lawsuits have been filed to keep Obama off the ballots in regards to this? The defense in each lawsuit does not just present the requested documents, or the pertinent identification. They just file for dismissal on some cheesy grounds.
Let's not forget this :

The article on WND is now! up to 2824 comments

http://www.wnd.com/2012/07/arpaio-obama-probe-finds-national-security-threat/?cat_orig=us

Here's a productive comment for those of you that think we should ignore this (It's not just about the birth certificate)

Obama’s Records:
1. Occidental College records….SEALED
2. Columbia College records….SEALED
3. Columbia Thesis paper….SEALED
4. Harvard College records….SEALED
5. Selective Service Registration….SEALED (but with known fraudulent dates)
6. Uses SSN from the State of Connecticut even though was never a resident of the state….HOW? SEALED
7. Medical records….SEALED
8. Illinois State Senate schedule….SEALED
9. Illinois State Senate records….SEALED
10. Law practice client list….SEALED
11. Certified copy of original Birth Certificate….SEALED
12. Signed Embossed paper Certificate of Birth….SEALED
13. Baptism record….SEALED
14. He and Michelle Obama returned law permit to Illinois in 1993 and no longer can practice law, why? SEALED
15. Law School and ACT Test scores….SEALED
16. Why did he get “Foreign Student Grand Aid” as a student? SEALED
17. How could he travel for weeks with his beau to Pakistan in 1981. SEALED
18. On what passports did he leave US to see Grandma Obama and on which ones did he get
into Pakistan? PASSPORTS SEALED.
18. How were the tens of thousands dollars for College Years funded? SEALED
19. The adoption records of Barry Soetoro? SEALED
20. At Chicago, what did part-time Lecturer Obama write, such as a path-breaking legal article or a book on jurisprudence that
warranted a rare full tenure offer? (and has such offer ever been extended to others
of like stature? … SEALED
21. Custom Records for week of Obamas birth? MISSING
22. Why did he apply for a loan as Harrison J Bounel?

No one knows who Obama is; the Media never vetted him and his supporters have spent millions preventing any release of the above.

What little has been presented have proven to be photo shopped frauds.

And even worse: The media knows this and have been culpable accessories.

The Reporters who should be rabid supportersof Truth and Freedom of Press have surrendered their craft to an illusion.
It appears our Constitution no longer appliesto anyone in government. Obama and the Media have are blantantly lying to us.

Or this : http://www.breitbart.com/Big-Government/2012/07/18/Top-Ten-Things-Obama-Has-Not-Released
Here is a Breitbart News top ten list of things that Obama has refused to release (a complete list would fill volumes):

10. State senate papers. In the 2008 primary, Obama criticized Hillary Clinton for not releasing papers from her eight years as First Lady--but failed to produce any papers from his eight years in Springfield. “They could have been thrown out,” he said.

9. Academic transcripts. His supposed academic brilliance was a major selling point, but Obama (by his own admission) was a mediocre student. His GPA at Occidental was a B-plus at best, and his entering class at Columbia was weak. Can he prove his merit?

8. Book proposal. Obama’s literary agent claimed he was “born in Kenya”--for sixteen years. His original book proposal exists--biographer David Maraniss refers to it--and seems to have embellished other key details of his life. Yet it has never been released.

7. Medical records. In 2000, and again (briefly) in 2008, GOP presidential candidate Sen. John McCain released thousands of pages of his medical records. Obama, who had abused drugs and continued smoking, merely provided a one-page doctor’s note.

6. Small-dollar donors. In 2008, the McCain campaign released the names of donors who had contributed less than $200, though it was not required to do so. But the Obama campaign refused, amidst accusations it had accepted illegal foreign contributions.

5. The Khalidi tape. In 2003, Obama attended a party for his good friend, the radical Palestinian academic Rashid Khalidi. The event featured incendiary anti-Israel rhetoric. The LA Times broke the story, but has refused to release the tape--and so has Obama.

4. The real White House guest list. Touting its transparency, the Obama White House released its guest logs--but kept many visits secret, and moved meetings with lobbyists off-site. It also refused to confirm the identities of visitors like Bertha Lewis of ACORN.

3. Countless FOIA requests. The Obama administration has been described as “the worst” ever in complying with Freedom of Information Act requests for documents. It has also punished whistleblowers like David Walpin, who exposed cronyism in Americorps.

2. Health reform negotiations. Candidate Obama promised that health care reform negotiations would be televised on C-SPAN. Instead, there were back-room deals woth millions with lobbyists and legislators--the details of which are only beginning to emerge.

1. Fast and Furious documents. After months of stonewalling Congress, Attorney General Eric Holder asked President Obama to use executive privilege to conceal thousands of documents related to the deadly scandal--and Obama did just that.

[Don Lapre]

Joe Arpaio has no credibility left

Start a thread about him if you want.

This one is about the bogus documents the fraud in the WH has passed off as legit.


FOCUS.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Right on, Miss Annie.





Sorry to say, I view the Pauls as cowards, just like the rest who choose to ignore this.

As Mike Zullo said, it's time for the charade to end.

It's beyond disgraceful that we are 3+ years into Barry's presidency and universally, heads still remain in the sand.

If any of this was true then people would actually care.


I strongly dislike Joe Arpaio, but the enemy of your enemy is your friend. If he can bring down the Obama regime with this, more power to him

lol

[Dianne]

Obama is out to destroy America and create a banana republic dictatorship. Even Carter suggests Obama be removed from office. This is the United Nations at work, and no one can convince me otherwise. We really know nothing about Obama, other than he is a tyrant from Kenya. Was his election just a test to see how stupid the American people are?

http://larouchepac.com/node/23160

Former President Carter Blasts Obama's Police State

Former President Jimmy Carter accurately described President Obama's police state in an op-ed in the June 24 New York Times, headlined, "A Cruel and Unusual Record." The op-ed was made more notable by the fact that Carter is criticizing his own party's president, something many Democratic members of Congress have been too intimidated to do.

Though he never mentions Obama by name, all of the police state policies that he refers to, including the indefinite detention provisions of last year's defense authorization bill, warrantless surveillance of American citizens, the killer drone policy, the continued operation of the Guantanamo prison, and so on, though begun by the G.W. Bush administration, are the policies of the Obama Administration.

"Revelations that top officials are targeting people to be assassinated abroad, including American citizens, are only the most recent, disturbing proof of how far our nation's violation of human rights has extended," writes Carter. "This development began after the terrorist attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, and has been sanctioned and escalated by bipartisan executive and legislative actions, without dissent from the general public. As a result, our country can no longer speak with moral authority on these critical issues."

It has gotten to the point that, by Carter's count, US national counterterrorism policy is in violation of at least 10 of the 30 articles of the 1948 Universal Declaration of Human Rights, including the prohibition against "cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment."

The drone policy, in particular, not only kills civilians, but has affected American foreign policy. Carter notes, "Top intelligence and military officials, as well as rights defenders in targeted areas, affirm that the great escalation in drone attacks has turned aggrieved families toward terrorist organizations, aroused civilian populations against us and permitted repressive governments to cite such actions to justify their own despotic behavior...

"At a time when popular revolutions are sweeping the globe, the United States should be strengthening, not weakening, basic rules of law and principles of justice enumerated in the Universal Declaration of Human Rights. But instead of making the world safer, America's violation of international human rights abets our enemies and alienates our friends," Carter concludes. "As concerned citizens, we must persuade Washington to reverse course and regain moral leadership according to international human rights norms that we had officially adopted as our own and cherished throughout the years."

Though he couches his argument in terms of international human rights, rather than in terms of violations of the U.S. Constitution, Carter's op-ed comes close to amounting to a bill of indictment requiring Obama's Constitutional removal from office

[Don Lapre]

If any of this was true then people would actually care.

People do care.

What planet do you live on?


Who is it that has verified the authenticity of the particular form that Barry passed out last April?


Pass me a Snickers while you work on that, champ.

[Weston White]

Why dont you go down there and see the border violence, to date over 50k killed.

However, not to date, that is since 2006.

[Miss Annie]

If any of this was true then people would actually care.



lol

Really? The bad monetary policy of the Fed is true, but how many people care? The police state is true..... how many people care?
That is not an accurate assumption.

[DerailingDaTrain]

People do care.

What planet do you live on?


Who is it that has verified the authenticity of the particular form that Barry passed out last April?


Pass me a Snickers while you work on that, champ.

A small group of people referred to as "birthers" care and nobody else does. Hell, I've seen "truthers" shy away from even talking about Obama's BC, because they don't want people thinking they actually believe he's not a citizen.

[sailingaway]

A small group of people referred to as "birthers" care and nobody else does. Hell, I've seen "truthers", shy away from even talking about Obama's BC because they don't want people thinking they are crazy.

when people are demonized for their views, they tend not to self identify, however.

[Miss Annie]

A small group of people referred to as "birthers" care and nobody else does. Hell, I've seen "truthers" shy away from even talking about Obama's BC, because they don't want people thinking they actually believe he's not a citizen.

Collectivism much? All republicans are war mongers and care about bombing Iran? All Christians like West Boro caring about bashing gays? All Ron Paul supporters are drug addicts caring about legalizing pot?

[DerailingDaTrain]

Another thing that bothers me is that the "faces" of the birther movement are always enemies of liberty such as Donald Trump or Joe Arpaio.

[pcosmar]

Another thing that bothers me is that the "faces" of the birther movement are always enemies of liberty such as Donald Trump or Joe Arpaio.

Because they are both attempting to remain relevant. and in the media eye.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Because they are both attempting to remain relevant. and in the media eye.

Does that mean we should all bow down and worship every word that comes out of their mouths simply because they don't like Obama?

[Zippyjuan]

Perhaps Sheriff Joe is trying to divert attention from his racial profiling lawsuit trial which is just starting. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/19/us-usa-arizona-sheriff-idUSBRE86I0LP20120719


The suit contends that Arpaio, who styles himself "America's toughest sheriff," and his officers violate the constitutional rights of both Hispanic citizens and legal immigrants alike in their zeal to crack down on people they believe to be illegal immigrants in the Phoenix valley.

"At trial we will prove that Sheriff Arpaio's fixation on immigration enforcement and his equating of, quote, ‘illegal' with 'Latino' has resulted in systemic civil rights violations," said Cecillia Wang, director of the Immigrants Rights Project at the American Civil Liberties Union.

The sheriff's office "has recklessly set up a dragnet for undocumented immigrants, but in the process has violated the rights of countless Latino residents of the county, U.S. citizens and immigrants alike who cannot go about their lawful business without fear of being detained and interrogated during a pretextual traffic stop," she added.

The non-jury bench trial, which will run from July 19 to August 2, focuses attention once again on Arizona, which claimed headlines last month when the U.S. Supreme Court upheld a key element of the state's crackdown on illegal immigrants requiring police to investigate those they stop and suspect of being in the country illegally.



He really isn't a supporter of freedoms and human rights. At least not for everybody.

[pcosmar]

Does that mean we should all bow down and worship every word that comes out of their mouths simply because they don't like Obama?

Who does that?
I thought this thread was just reporting on the media circus.

I think Obama is as fake as the money printed these days.. but it is still a reality like it or not.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Who does that?


Sorry to say, I view the Pauls as cowards, just like the rest who choose to ignore this.

As Mike Zullo said, it's time for the charade to end.

Sheriff Joe is a hero and Ron Paul is a coward according to Don Lapre


I strongly dislike Joe Arpaio, but the enemy of your enemy is your friend. If he can bring down the Obama regime with this, more power to him

Am I the only one who thinks that is a horrible position to have?


It really seems to me that it is quite irrelevant how big of an asshat Joe Arpaio is. That is not the issue at hand. Asshat's identity is not in question.

Let's forget everything he's ever done and join up with him


Sheriff Joe is an asshat for doing the Federal Govt job that they refuse to do on border security.

Why dont you go down there and see the border violence, to date over 50k killed.

What!?!? Sheriff Joe is a God. How dare you speak that blasphemy!

[TheTexan]

I don't expect anything to ever come of this, but I do find it as a useful indicator for just how exactly fucked we are. When the President of the United States doesn't feel obligated to put much work into a forgery of his birth certificate, and releases an obvious forgery knowing nothing will be done about it... ya... we're fucked.

[Bosco Warden]

Perhaps Sheriff Joe is trying to divert attention from his racial profiling lawsuit trial which is just starting. http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/07/19/us-usa-arizona-sheriff-idUSBRE86I0LP20120719



He really isn't a supporter of freedoms and human rights. At least not for everybody.

I will need to see your green card before I reply to you Scooby, I believe WE have been here before.

I am not a libertarian, I believe in borders, and National Sovereignty.

I believe in LEGAL immigration, through the proper channels, I can not, and will not support anything that is illegal.

[DerailingDaTrain]

I will need to see your green card before I reply to you Scooby, I believe WE have been here before.

I am not a libertarian, I believe in borders, and National Sovereignty.

You're not one of those white nationalists are you?

[Bosco Warden]

However, not to date, that is since 2006.

Good catch, thanks.

Its real easy to throw stones at someone who lives in a different state and actually upholds the law are an asshat.

At least these trolls make it real easy to see who is in who's camp trying to spin information.

This thread has been enlightening to say the least.

[Bosco Warden]

You're not one of those white nationalists are you?

What does that mean?

Either end the war on terror or seal up the border so we know who is in the country.

I would ask you if your a idiot, but you answered that question already.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Good catch, thanks.

Its real easy to throw stones at someone who lives in a different state and actually upholds the law are an asshat.

At least these trolls make it real easy to see who is in who's camp trying to spin information.

This thread has been enlightening to say the least.

Yup. Sheriff Joe is so great with his tent cities, unsolved rape cases, missing money, etc.

He's a swell guy I tell ya


What does that mean?

Either end the war on terror or seal up the border so we know who is in the country.

I would ask you if your a idiot, but you answered that question already.

So you want a border fence? Also, why would you insult me, when I simply asked if you consider yourself a white nationalist?

[Zippyjuan]

Plus his SWAT raids on innocent political opponents like the unarmed female school board member (I believe her title was) who had her home raided by a SWAT team at three in the morning for allegedly embezzeling money from the schools (no money was actually missing). Or using a tank and SWAT team to go after one guy who was fighting chickens (actor Steven Segal was part of that raid).

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-07-09/justice/arizona.tough.sheriff_1_arpaio-dowling-arizona-sheriff?_s=PM:CRIME

But the 77-year-old lawman is himself the subject of serious allegations of abuse of power. Arpaio's critics say he has a long history of launching bogus criminal investigations against political opponents and anyone else who gets in his way.

This year a federal grand jury started looking into the allegations.

Former Maricopa County School Superintendent Sandra Dowling says what happened to her is a case in point.

Dowling says was locked in a political battle with some members of the Maricopa County Board of Supervisors over school district funds when the sheriff's SWAT team came in the dead of night to search her home. Dowling was charged with stealing money from a school for homeless students. There were 25 felony counts in all.

"Never could I have imagined what a nightmare was waiting ahead," Dowling said.

Arpaio promised to uncover massive public corruption -- "We are looking into all avenues of this investigation," he said -- and to win a speedy conviction.

From the start Dowling maintained her innocence: "I kept saying I didn't do anything. I didn't do anything."

It took three years, but finally a judge threw out all the felony counts against Dowling. She entered a guilty plea to a single misdemeanor charge. But she said her reputation had been shattered, her career destroyed, and she owed more than $100,000 in legal fees.

"I still don't think that everybody knows I was innocent," she said.

Dowling is not alone. Arpaio has launched -- either on his own or in conjunction with the county attorney -- high-profile criminal investigations against a who's who of Maricopa County politicians and officials. The list includes the mayor of Phoenix, a former police chief, two members of the board of supervisors, Superior Court judges, and even a former state attorney general.



One way to "know who is in the country" and which Arpaio supports is to set up checkpoints and ask everybody to produce their IDs- whether or not you are even suspected of anything illegal. (and as a side note, over 40% of those in the country "illegally" entered on a legal basis- students, tourists, work visas, etc. and overstayed- the tightest border fence in the world would not stop them from entering the country). This is a major part of the lawsuit against him which just opened.

(another side note- not sure if that was deliberate or not but "your a idiot" should be spelled "you're an idiot").

[V-rod]

This is all an distraction from people investigating the government using explosives on the WTC, and a missile on the pentagon!

[Bosco Warden]

Yup. Sheriff Joe is so great with his tent cities, unsolved rape cases, missing money, etc.

He's a swell guy I tell ya

Elected 6 times by the good folks in AZ. Move there, then your opinion might mean something. Vote accordingly



So you want a border fence? Also, why would you insult me, when I simply asked if you consider yourself a white nationalist?

I do not want a border fence, just take away the free social services that illegals use they will deport themselves.

Because I know where you are going with the White Nationalists question, its the only argument you idiots have, surely my disdain for ILLEGAL activity is racially motivated.

[Bosco Warden]

Plus his SWAT raids on innocent political opponents like the unarmed female school board member (I believe her title was) who had her home raided by a SWAT team at three in the morning for allegedly embezzeling money from the schools (no money was actually missing). Or using a tank and SWAT team to go after one guy who was fighting chickens (actor Steven Segal was part of that raid).

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-07-09/justice/arizona.tough.sheriff_1_arpaio-dowling-arizona-sheriff?_s=PM:CRIME



One way to "know who is in the country" and which Arpaio supports is to set up checkpoints and ask everybody to produce their IDs- whether or not you are even suspected of anything illegal. (and as a side note, over 40% of those in the country "illegally" entered on a legal basis- students, tourists, work visas, etc. and overstayed- the tightest border fence in the world would not stop them from entering the country). This is a major part of the lawsuit against him which just opened.

(another side note- not sure if that was deliberate or not but "your a idiot" should be spelled "you're an idiot").

Thanks. You'RE and Idiot.

So now we pick and choose which MSM article isnt nonsense? See how that works Skippy?

I have seen a few posts from you Scrappy, you are not part of this liberty movement, you are trying to sway opinion with your bullshit, I've said it before, and when I see it again I will say it again.

Obvious bullshit is Obvious.

[Zippyjuan]

90% of those here illegally are not coming for the benefits but for better opportunities (mostly jobs) than where they come from. You can get rid of the benefits- fine. Just don't count on that getting rid of illegal aliens.

Those benefits are being provided by the states- education, welfare, drivers licenses. Illegal aliens are not elgible for Federal benefits like Social Security or Medicaid.

(I live in a border city in California).

[Zippyjuan]

Thanks. You'RE and Idiot.

So now we pick and choose which MSM article isnt nonsense? See how that works Skippy?

I have seen a few posts from you Scrappy, you are not part of this liberty movement, you are trying to sway opinion with your bullshit, I've said it before, and when I see it again I will say it again.

Obvious bullshit is Obvious.

Are you claiming the events did not occur?

http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-09-01/politics/30127627_1_jesus-sanchez-llovera-11-month-old-puppy-steven-seagal-lawman




An Arizona man has sued action star-turned vigilante crime fighter Steven Seagal and Maricopa County Sheriff Joe Arpaio for allegedly killing his puppy and driving a tank into his home in a massive raid earlier this year.

In March, Arpaio and officers decked out in full riot gear conducted a raid on the home of Jesus Sanchez Llovera to break up a suspected cock fighting farm, bringing along Seagal, who drove onto the scene in a tank. According to Llovera, the police carried out an "unfounded" raid that significantly damaged his home, and that they shot and killed his 11-month old puppy and around 100 roosters.


Llovera contends that his roosters are raised for show, not sport. He is seeking $100,000 in damages, as well as a written apology from Seagal.

Seagal, whom Arpaio had recently deputized to purportedly combat illegal immigration, had joined the raid as part of his reality TV show, Steven Seagal Lawman. That show is billed as, "[allowing] fans to ride shotgun with Seagal as he and his hand-selected elite team of deputies respond to crimes-in-progress."

Seagal's film crew caught the event on tape, and a local news outlet caught some of the aftermath.

"I came in on the 150 [tank] and we broke down the gate," Seagal told Phoenix's KNXV. "I deployed out on the side of the house, and guarded one side of the house, to see if anyone would run out."

Read more: http://articles.businessinsider.com/2011-09-01/politics/30127627_1_jesus-sanchez-llovera-11-month-old-puppy-steven-seagal-lawman#ixzz215qySaqb

[qh4dotcom]

Another thing that bothers me is that the "faces" of the birther movement are always enemies of liberty such as Donald Trump or Joe Arpaio.

So why do you think the friends of liberty (many of them who took the oath) aren't doing their job of defending the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements? If they were doing their job they could become the "faces" you talked about.
Kind of sad that someone like Trump who hasn't taken the oath is doing more to defend the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements than the Champion of the Constitution himself who brags so much about defending it.

[Bosco Warden]

I am not going to debate this with you scrappy, change the law, until then uphold the law.

It's no more complicated then that.

[Bosco Warden]

Are you claiming the events did not occur?

I didnt even read it, its from CNN, not a trusted name in information.


.
But I will read it just for you and then point out the bias one way or the other. I havent read it, or even seen it yet, but I know its there.

Predictable is predictable.

edit: This is politics as usual, that is why he is only under suspicion and not under arrest.

Sheriff Joe is taking on the Federal Govt, you seen how they slanders Dr. Paul, you think that is exclusive?

[Zippyjuan]

Video of the Steven Segal raid:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z1lcfKT3vJo

[DerailingDaTrain]

Elected 6 times by the good folks in AZ. Move there, then your opinion might mean something. Vote accordingly




Because I know where you are going with the White Nationalists question, its the only argument you idiots have, surely my disdain for ILLEGAL activity is racially motivated.

Idiots who don't deserve the job get elected and re-elected all the time. Where have you been living at?

Just answer the question. Yes or No


So why do you think the friends of liberty (many of them who took the oath) aren't doing their job of defending the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements? If they were doing their job they could become the "faces" you talked about.

and this brings up back to "if any of this was true then people would actually care"

[Zippyjuan]

I didnt even read it, its from CNN, not a trusted name in information.


.
But I will read it just for you and then point out the bias one way or the other. I havent read it, or even seen it yet, but I know its there.

Predictable is predictable.

edit: This is politics as usual, that is why he is only under suspicion and not under arrest.

Sheriff Joe is taking on the Federal Govt, you seen how they slanders Dr. Paul, you think that is exclusive?

The woman was subject to a SWAT raid and arrested for a crime which had not even been committed and a judge later threw out all federal charges against her. Is that a libertarian action? Would Ron Paul aprove of such actions?

[DerailingDaTrain]

The woman was subject to a SWAT raid and arrested for a crime which had not even been committed and a judge later threw out all federal charges against her. Is that a libertarian action? Would Ron Paul aprove of such actions?

He's not a libertarian (Bosco) and I'm sure that Bosco has no problem with whatever Sheriff Joe does. Neo-cons love militarized police

[Miss Annie]

I am not going to debate this with you scrappy, change the law, until then uphold the law.

It's no more complicated then that.

Exactly! You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to Bosco Warden again.

[Zippyjuan]

I didnt even read it, its from CNN, not a trusted name in information.


.
But I will read it just for you and then point out the bias one way or the other. I havent read it, or even seen it yet, but I know its there.

Predictable is predictable.

edit: This is politics as usual, that is why he is only under suspicion and not under arrest.

Sheriff Joe is taking on the Federal Govt, you seen how they slanders Dr. Paul, you think that is exclusive?

I note you have cited RT as a source in the past. Perhaps you will watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaI8a46u5mA

[Bosco Warden]

I note you have cited RT as a source in the past. Perhaps you will watch this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AaI8a46u5mA

Thom Hartman is a dyed in the wool liberal? I like RT, but clearly this guy is part of the MSM. Just happens to have a show on RT.


Thom Hartmann, progressive national and internationally syndicated talkshow host (also simulcast as TV in 40 million homes by Dish Network/Free Speech TV), and New York Times bestselling, 4-times project Censored winning author of 24 books in print in 17 languages on five continents. Leonardo DiCaprio was inspired by Thom's book "The Last Hours of Ancient Sunlight" to make the movie "The 11th Hour" (in which Thom stars), and Warner Brothers is making a movie starring DiCaprio from the book Thom co-authored with Lamar Waldron, "Legacy of Secrecy."

[Bosco Warden]

He's not a libertarian (Bosco) and I'm sure that Bosco has no problem with whatever Sheriff Joe does. Neo-cons love militarized police

This is true, orthodox Libertarians don't believe in borders, or National Sovereignty.

Neo Con I am not, but you can think whatever you wish to.

I mean you're a fucking joke, you even chose your name as DerailingDaTrain. You're here, so its no stretch to understand which train you are trying to derail.

Like I said obvious bullshit is obvious.

[Zippyjuan]

How does one go about separating "them" from "us"? You need to be able to identify the difference. You can't do that visually so you need something else. IDs. When can or should ID's be checked? At the grocery store? When you appply for a job(- that puts the burden on the employer to decide who is or is not a citizen)? When walking down the street? When you commit a crime? What about a person who's only crime is not having ID on them? Do they get arrested or deported until they can come up with some ID? Roadblocks to check everybody's IDs? Papers please.

Well let's not allow "them" to have benefits like being allowed to go to school. How about when you apply for school or a loan to go to college? Turn those people into immigration officers? Think TSA involved in every aspect of your life. This is liberty? Not to me. Should hospitals ID patients and deny treatment to those without since they can't prove they are in the country legally (this practice is illegal- they can't turn you away at the emergency room even if you have no insurance or ablity to pay- citizen or not).

And then what? Throw anybody without papers into jail- at tax payer expense? Or deport them? What if they turned out to be citizens without ID?

[Bosco Warden]

How does one go about separating "them" from "us"? You need to be able to identify the difference. You can't do that visually so you need something else. IDs. When can or should ID's be checked? At the grocery store? When you appply for a job(- that puts the burden on the employer to decide who is or is not a citizen)? When walking down the street? When you commit a crime? What about a person who's only crime is not having ID on them? Do they get arrested or deported until they can come up with some ID? Roadblocks to check everybody's IDs? Papers please.

Well let's not allow "them" to have benefits like being allowed to go to school. How about when you apply for school or a loan to go to college? Turn those people into immigration officers? Think TSA involved in every aspect of your life. This is liberty? Not to me. Should hospitals ID patients and deny treatment to those without since they can't prove they are in the country legally (this practice is illegal- they can't turn you away at the emergency room even if you have no insurance or ablity to pay- citizen or not).

And then what? Throw anybody without papers into jail- at tax payer expense? Or deport them? What if they turned out to be citizens without ID?

What do they do right now at legitimate border crossings?

Keep throwing these softballs, I got all day.

[qh4dotcom]

I note you have cited RT as a source in the past. Perhaps you will watch this video:


Russia Today: Arizona has ridiculous immigration legislation, attacks AZ secretary of state, says the state of Arizona is the most misguided in the nation, invites their viewers to put their tin foil hats on, says the GOP wants to have the votes of the crazies and the racists and says anyone who wants to have a closer look at Obama's birth certificate can go to the White House website.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eVazNiMFsDI

[Zippyjuan]

What do they do right now at legitimate border crossings?

Keep throwing these softballs, I got all day.


As I pointed out earlier, about 45% of those in the country illegally entered it on a legal basis- student visas, travel or work permits, etc and overstayed. An iron tight border will not keep them out. How would you suggest we respond to those already in the country? And do so without infringing on liberties of those here legally? Should we expand TSA types to the streets of our cities- to the schools and businesses to check IDs?

[Bosco Warden]

As I pointed out earlier, about 45% of those in the country illegally entered it on a legal basis- student visas, travel or work permits, etc and overstayed. An iron tight border will not keep them out. How would you suggest we respond to those already in the country? And do so without infringing on liberties of those here legally? Should we expand TSA types to the streets of our cities- to the schools and businesses to check IDs?

Sheriff Joe is doing a good job, which is why he is re-elected, and the subject of the OP.


Until there is an end to the war on terror, then we have to know who is in the country and who is not.

What do you suggest, all things considered. you fail to keep this in context to the border issue, and the drug cartel violence and the terrorist threat.

You can't have everything here, so stop trying. Its not a perfect system but enforcing the law as its written is a good start.

[Zippyjuan]

George Bush got re-elected too. So did Clinton.

Can you elaborate on the terrorist threat? The terrorists identified in this country (and they have been few- including the ones involved with 9/11) were not here illegally. And the drug cartel violence has pretty much stayed in Mexico so that is not an excuse to increase our police state here as well.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Sheriff Joe is doing a good job, which is why he is re-elected, and the subject of the OP.


Until there is an end to the war on terror, then we have to know who is in the country and who is not.



#1: He gets re-elected because voters continue to fall for his drug warrior rhetoric.

#2: So because the war on terror still exists, should we just get behind the Patriot Act? After all, the government needs to know what we're up to and so if you don't have anything to hide....

[Bosco Warden]

George Bush got re-elected too. So did Clinton.

Can you elaborate on the terrorist threat? The terrorists identified in this country (and they have been few- including the ones involved with 9/11) were not here illegally. And the drug cartel violence has pretty much stayed in Mexico so that is not an excuse to increase our police state here as well.

the law is the law you dont have to like it, no one is even asking you to like it. Change the law, then you will have an argument.


#1: He gets re-elected because voters continue to fall for his drug warrior rhetoric.

#2: So because the war on terror still exists, should we just get behind the Patriot Act? After all, the government needs to know what we're up to and so if you don't have anything to hide....

Same answer, its not perfect but its the law, change it then that changes everything.

You can disobey the law but then there are consequences, ones which I think everyone here is aware of.

Keep spinning liberal, but obvious bullshit is still obvious bullshit.

[DerailingDaTrain]

This is true, orthodox Libertarians don't believe in borders, or National Sovereignty.

Neo Con I am not, but you can think whatever you wish to.

I mean you're a fucking joke, you even chose your name as DerailingDaTrain. You're here, so its no stretch to understand which train you are trying to derail.

Like I said obvious bullshit is obvious.

It was this one...and it worked.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MOFB-2yJzCY

So what? I chose a stupid name when I signed up. When I search for your name in Google all I get are the posts you have made here and someone named Bosco Warden being arrested in Bengal for sodomy.




I mean you're a fucking joke

Internet tough guy who can't defend his positions so you use random insults. Nice

[NIU Students for Liberty]

the law is the law you dont have to like it, no one is even asking you to like it. Change the law, then you will have an argument.



Same answer, its not perfect but its the law, change it then that changes everything.

You can disobey the law but then there are consequences, ones which I think everyone here is aware of.

Keep spinning liberal, but obvious bullshit is still obvious bullshit.

So by your logic, it was acceptable for slavery to exist in the United States for approximately 200 years because no one had changed the laws. Instead, slaves had to face the consequences if they chose to flee their masters or white people should've been arrested for disobeying the Fugitive Slave Act.

And I'm not a liberal, I'm an anarcho-capitalist. But continue to spin your love of statism because I am certainly entertained.

[Bosco Warden]

So by your logic, it was acceptable for slavery to exist in the United States for approximately 200 years because no one had changed the laws. Instead, slaves had to face the consequences if they chose to flee their masters or white people should've been arrested for disobeying the Fugitive Slave Act.

And I'm not a liberal, I'm an anarcho-capitalist. But continue to spin your love of statism because I am certainly entertained.

Like I said its not a perfect system but its the best we have, we at one time were a nation of laws. period.

you can call yourself whatever it is you think you are but you are posting very liberal ideas with all these strawman arguments you being forward.

I'm glad you are entertained, I'm here all week. make a donation at the door.

[Don Lapre]

It's an enormously pitiful spectacle to see people (on a Liberty Forum, no less) divert toward the 'bad guy' Sheriff instead of concentrating on the overwhelming evidence that the man who has our nuclear codes and commands the most powerful army in the world is a completely illegal FRAUD.

Seriously, what in fuck's name is wrong with you people?


Amazing.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Like I said its not a perfect system but its the best we have, we at one time were a nation of laws. period.

A nation of laws that endorsed slavery and segregation, forced removal of property, the income tax, prohibition, censorship, etc. Do you support the state arresting those who participate in civil disobedience against laws that infringe upon their right to privacy and choice (so long as these individuals are not aggressive towards another person's life and/or property)?

[AuH20]

It's an enormously pitiful spectacle to see people (on a Liberty Forum, no less) divert toward the 'bad guy' Sheriff instead of concentrating on the overwhelming evidence that the man who has our nuclear codes and commands the most powerful army in the world is a completely illegal FRAUD.

Seriously, what in fuck's name is wrong with you people?


Amazing.
Arpaio is a lowly sheriff to boot as opposed to the commander in chief of the armed forces. Last I checked Arpaio doesn't possess the ability to make you or I disappear with the full backing of the world's most lethal fighting force, but the hyperbole aimed at Arpaio is certainly amusing.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

It's an enormously pitiful spectacle to see people (on a Liberty Forum, no less) divert toward the 'bad guy' Sheriff instead of concentrating on the overwhelming evidence that the man who has our nuclear codes and commands the most powerful army in the world is a completely illegal FRAUD.

Seriously, what in fuck's name is wrong with you people?

Amazing.


We choose to focus on the provable wrongs that Obama has committed instead of Arpaio's "pitiful spectacle".

[Don Lapre]

You choose to ignore the overwhelming evidence that is right in front of your face, NIU.

[Revolution9]

We choose to focus on the provable wrongs that Obama has committed instead of Arpaio's "pitiful spectacle".

Are you what we can expect from the college/university liberty movement??..Because if it is we are effed hard.

Rev9

[Zippyjuan]

The fact that Obama was born in Hawaii should not be the issue it is either.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Arpaio is a lowly sheriff to boot as opposed to the commander in chief of the armed forces.

Tell that to the people that Arpaio and his thugs have roughed up all in the name of "justice". It astounds me that supposed supporters of liberty are actually defending this guy.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Are you what we can expect from the college/university liberty movement??..Because if it is we are effed hard.

Rev9

If you expect us to defend thugs like Arpaio or campaign for mediocre GOP politicians, then yes, you're effed.

[erowe1]

You choose to ignore the overwhelming evidence that is right in front of your face, NIU.
Overwhelming evidence of what?

[AuH20]

Tell that to the people that Arpaio and his thugs have roughed up all in the name of "justice". It astounds me that supposed supporters of liberty are actually defending this guy.

Arpaio's crime is owning a badge. I forgot for a second.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Arpaio's crime is owning a badge. I forgot for a second.

Give me a break. You make it sound as if he's a hero. I bet you also forgot about his impressive war on drugs track record:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBQu1spxxFA

[AuH20]

Give me a break. You make it sound as if he's a hero. I bet you also forgot about his impressive war on drugs track record:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBQu1spxxFA

I'm not saying he's a hero, but the feds and a certain powerful lobbying group have been hellbent in fabricating charges against his department for more than a decade.

[Bosco Warden]

Tell that to the people that Arpaio and his thugs have roughed up all in the name of "justice". It astounds me that supposed supporters of liberty are actually defending this guy.

Focus here Scooby, this is about Obama's birth cert, quit changing the subject.

Also where this is all going as far as border security is the loss of our National Sovereignty, with UN oversight.

Weakening our border to the south is just part of what is to come.

I am now sure what you are thinking but try to keep it in context with what this Global Govt is headed.

[Bosco Warden]

Give me a break. You make it sound as if he's a hero. I bet you also forgot about his impressive war on drugs track record:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OBQu1spxxFA

He is doing his job, which is keeping the citizens of AZ safe from drug violence, which is ultimately what asking for ID stems from, you give ma a break.

[Bosco Warden]

If you expect us to defend thugs like Arpaio or campaign for mediocre GOP politicians, then yes, you're effed.

No, I expect you to mind your own business liberal, no one needs, or wants your help.

Thugs like Arpaio is doing the job of the Federal Govt, because we have a rogue Govt, who has already sold the country now is trying to harmonize what has been promised.

If you got a problem with that then your in the wrong camp buddy.

Fear monger much?

[Zippyjuan]

No, I expect you to mind your own business liberal, no one needs, or wants your help.

Thugs like Arpaio is doing the job of the Federal Govt, because we have a rogue Govt, who has already sold the country now is trying to harmonize what has been promised.

If you got a problem with that then your in the wrong camp buddy.

Fear monger much?

Arpaio does. That's how he keeps getting re-elected.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

I'm not saying he's a hero, but the feds and a certain powerful lobbying group have been hellbent in fabricating charges against his department for more than a decade.

Sounds awfully familiar...

But excuse me while I go shed a tear for Arpaio.

[AuH20]

Arpaio does. That's how he keeps getting re-elected.

Given that his county is a maelstrom of drug violence as well as a center for drug mule motivated border crossings, I don't think he has to convince many. They just have to stick their head out the window of their car or home. Maricopa County is a warzone. You could banish Arpaio & his lawless department to another dimension & the same problems would arise again. That's liberty for you. Beheadings, rapes, drug related assassinations, forced servitude as a drug mule.....

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Focus here Scooby, this is about Obama's birth cert, quit changing the subject.

Also where this is all going as far as border security is the loss of our National Sovereignty, with UN oversight.

Weakening our border to the south is just part of what is to come.

I am now sure what you are thinking but try to keep it in context with what this Global Govt is headed.

I (and others) already explained why this appears to be nothing but political theater on Arpaio's end when all it does is focus the public's attention away from legitimate issues that affect all of us such as Obama's economic/foreign policy mess.

Since I believe in the NAP, spending public resources to defend an arbitrary border (which counts as infringing on private property btw) is a violation of individual liberties.

[NIU Students for Liberty]

Given that his county is a maelstrom of drug violence as well as a center for drug mule motivated border crossings, I don't think he has to convince many. They just have to stick their head out the window of their car or home. Maricopa County is a warzone. You could banish Arpaio & his lawless department to another dimension & the same problems would arise again. That's liberty for you. Beheadings, rapes, drug related assassinations, forced servitude as a drug mule.....

Except he wants to heighten drug prohibition, the bane of the problems you point to.

[AuH20]

No, I expect you to mind your own business liberal, no one needs, or wants your help.

Thugs like Arpaio is doing the job of the Federal Govt, because we have a rogue Govt, who has already sold the country now is trying to harmonize what has been promised.

If you got a problem with that then your in the wrong camp buddy.

Fear monger much?

I really think you should stop calling him names. I know the other guy riled you up with the neocon accusations and white nationalist nonsense. But everyone here is generally on the same team. You need to remember that.

[Zippyjuan]

Given that his county is a maelstrom of drug violence as well as a center for drug mule motivated border crossings, I don't think he has to convince many. They just have to stick their head out the window of their car or home. Maricopa County is a warzone. You could banish Arpaio & his lawless department to another dimension & the same problems would arise again. That's liberty for you. Beheadings, rapes, drug related assassinations, forced servitude as a drug mule.....
Beheadings? How many? Jan Brewer claimed some but none could be found or substantiated.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/09/AR2010070902342.html

Jan Brewer has lost her head.

The Arizona governor, seemingly determined to repel every last tourist dollar from her pariah state, has sounded a new alarm about border violence. "Our law enforcement agencies have found bodies in the desert either buried or just lying out there that have been beheaded," she announced on local television.

Ay, caramba! Those dark-skinned foreigners are now severing the heads of fair-haired Americans? Maybe they're also scalping them or shrinking them or putting them on a spike.

But those in fear of losing parts north of the neckline can relax. There's not a follicle of evidence to support Brewer's claim.

The Arizona Guardian Web site checked with medical examiners in Arizona's border counties, and the coroners said they had never seen an immigration-related beheading. I called and e-mailed Brewer's press office requesting documentation of decapitation; no reply.

Brewer's mindlessness about headlessness is just one of the immigration falsehoods being spread by Arizona politicians. Border violence on the rise? Phoenix becoming the world's No. 2 kidnapping capital? Illegal immigrants responsible for most police killings? The majority of those crossing the border are drug mules? All wrong.



More at link.

OK more.

Two months ago, the Arizona Republic published an exhaustive report that found that, according to statistics from the FBI and Arizona police agencies, crime in Arizona border towns has been "essentially flat for the past decade." For example, "In 2000, there were 23 rapes, robberies and murders in Nogales, Ariz. Last year, despite nearly a decade of population growth, there were 19 such crimes." The Pima County sheriff reported that "the border has never been more secure."



Next, there's Brewer's claim that "the majority" of people immigrating illegally "are coming here and they're bringing drugs, and they're doing drop houses and they're extorting people and they're terrorizing the families. That is the truth." No, it isn't. The Border Patrol's Tucson Sector has apprehended more than 170,000 undocumented immigrants since Oct. 1, but only about 1,100 drug prosecutions have been filed in Arizona in that time.

The claim that illegal immigrants are behind most killings of law-enforcement personnel is also bunk. Arizona state Sen. Sylvia Allen claimed that "in the last few years 80 percent of our law enforcement that have been killed or wounded have been by an illegal." A Phoenix police spokesman told the Arizona Republic's E.J. Montini that the real figure for such killings is less than 25 percent, and that there are no statistics on the wounding of officers.

So what is this "terrible border security crisis" that Brewer says has only "gotten worse"? She complained recently to Fox News's Greta Van Susteren about the Obama administration's handling of the border: "They haven't did [sic] their job."

[Don Lapre]

Overwhelming evidence of what?

lol

Are you brain dead?

Document forgery.


Try gettin' yourself up to speed.

[AuH20]

Beheadings? How many? Jan Brewer claimed some but none could be found or substantiated.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/09/AR2010070902342.html


More at link.

The Washington Post's assertion isn't entirely accurate:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1362540/Mexican-drugs-cartel-behead-man-Arizona-apartment-stealing.html


The 38-year-old has stolen 400lbs of marijuana and some meth from a cartel while claiming they had been seized by the Border Patrol, according to a police report.

The cartel found out he had actually stolen the drugs and hired men to kidnap and kill him in Nogales, Mexico.

But Cota-Monroy was able to talk his way out of being killed by saying he would pay back the money and use his house as collateral.

The house did not belong to him and he fled to Phoenix, where the cartel sent assassins to befriend and kill him. His body was found on October 10.

Detective David Ramer said: 'It was a very gruesome scene. Anytime you see a headless body stabbed multiple times, obviously that's gruesome.

'And this is a message being sent - not only are they going to kill you but they're going to dismember your body, and "if you cross us, this is what happens".'

Police said the cartel Cota-Monroy stole from is known as the PEI-Estatales/El Chapo drug trafficking organisation and that he had been known to traffic drugs for his sister's lover, known as 'El Jefe'

[Zippyjuan]

I am sorry and stand corrected. There was one. Thank you for the information. The post made it sound like this is a regular thing though. A maelstrom of beheadings and rapes and drug mules.

Maybe Arpaio should be looking into those rapes and sex crimes.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/10/us/sheriff-joe-arpaio-criticized-over-handling-of-sex-crimes-cases.html

Sheriff Arpaio, the top law enforcement official in sprawling Maricopa County, is perhaps best known for his hard-nosed treatment of prisoners and his aggressive raids aimed at illegal immigrants. But it is his department’s approach to more than 400 sex-crimes cases that has Sheriff Arpaio in trouble.

His deputies failed to investigate or conducted only the sketchiest of inquiries into hundreds of sex crimes between 2005 and 2007, investigations by Arizona law enforcement agencies have shown. Many of those cases involved molested children.

[qh4dotcom]

It's an enormously pitiful spectacle to see people (on a Liberty Forum, no less) divert toward the 'bad guy' Sheriff instead of concentrating on the overwhelming evidence that the man who has our nuclear codes and commands the most powerful army in the world is a completely illegal FRAUD.

Seriously, what in fuck's name is wrong with you people?


Amazing.

I agree with you....and you know what? There are a bunch of "principled Ron Paul supporters" on this forum who made a big deal out of Rand Paul endorsing Romney, the last thing these "principled folks" were going to do was give Rand a free pass for endorsing Romney...but somehow these "principled Ron Paul supporters" were happy to give the Pauls a free pass on covering up for Obama's crimes. Like endorsing Romney is worse than participating in the coverup of one of the greatest scams in American history. Go figure. All 535 members of Congress are participating in the coverup of Obama's crimes...not one of them is doing their job of defending the Constitution's natural born citizen requirements....sadly, not even the champion of the Constitution who does the most bragging about defending the Constitution and who doesn't even take his own advice.

"We should know the truth and we should follow the rule, we should follow the law, we should follow what the Constitution says about who is qualified to be President. So, I am very open-minded about looking at all of that."
- Ron Paul
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CoQ3kO9xzcs#t=1m30s

[Don Lapre]

Right on, q4.

[Revolution9]

If you expect us to defend thugs like Arpaio or campaign for mediocre GOP politicians, then yes, you're effed.

I don't give an eff what he has done. What I am speaking to is the willful ignorance and blinkered idiocy in railing on the sheriff when he ain't the one in the spotlight for the biggest fraud in history. He simply did what law enforcement does. look onto suspicious activity that breaks the law. Yes. We are effed with headspaces like yours. I can only hope you mature out of your knee jerk and gain some practical pragmatism. The rest of your hogwash about endporsing GOP-ers ain't possibly directed at me or yer just pulling shit from your lower fundament.

Rev9

[Revolution9]

I (and others) already explained why this appears to be nothing but political theater on Arpaio's end when all it does is focus the public's attention away from legitimate issues that affect all of us such as Obama's economic/foreign policy mess.

Oh the strategist in you has severe failings. Ya see..if he gets legally jacked for his fraudulent shenanigans then all his policies are moot. Fraud ab initio. ObamaCare is out the window. Nothing he has signed has any force of law. You ain't as bright with your ideological claptrap as you think you are. Yer position submits a free pass to the long legged mack daddy.

Rev9

[Revolution9]

The fact that Obama was born in Hawaii should not be the issue it is either.

No..It shouldn't. The issue here is his father being Frank Marshall Davis..the black royalty of amurikan communism. This exposed exposes the whole shooting match. The Kenya gambit is a "look over there and waste time" bit of hoodwinkery.

Rev9

[Revolution9]

I am sorry and stand corrected. There was one. Thank you for the information. The post made it sound like this is a regular thing though. A maelstrom of beheadings and rapes and drug mules.

Maybe Arpaio should be looking into those rapes and sex crimes.
http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/10/us/sheriff-joe-arpaio-criticized-over-handling-of-sex-crimes-cases.html

Just across the border there are mass graves of mutilated bodies being uncovered with great regularity. The borders are intentionally porous allowing the psychopaths ingress and egress as they see fit.. Yet here you are with your shilling BS again trying to paint a rosy picture. you are so full of it.

Rev9

[erowe1]

lol

Are you brain dead?

Document forgery.


Try gettin' yourself up to speed.

In post #163 you said something about overwhelming evidence that president Obama is an illegal fraud (whatever that's supposed to mean). Now it's just document forgery.

[AuH20]

Just across the border there are mass graves of mutilated bodies being uncovered with great regularity. The borders are intentionally porous allowing the psychopaths ingress and egress as they see fit.. Yet here you are with your shilling BS again trying to paint a rosy picture. you are so full of it.

Rev9

Largely because Maricopa County is smack dab in the middle of a highly contested battle for drug cartel supremacy.

[kcchiefs6465]

I'm not saying he's a hero, but the feds and a certain powerful lobbying group have been hellbent in fabricating charges against his department for more than a decade.
More than a decade of which who was in charge? (Of the MCSO)

You are quite a case.. I believe I called you on your Ron Paul comments (in a Justin Amash thread, I believe?) in which I still haven't a response.

That being said I am unamazed you would chime two cents in in stating,
Arpaio's crime is owning a badge. I forgot for a second.

Yes, that is it. It isn't his mismanagement of the investigation of hundreds of child sex abuse cases. (Allowing the statute of limitations to run out as well as never investigating a good percentage of them) It isn't about inmates being subjected to 100+ heat in the desert in tents. It isn't about the publicity stunts he has pulled denying 'well known' inmates water and putting them in a sweat box. It isn't about tanks rolling down private property. (Killing dogs and roosters they were supposedly there to rescue) It isn't about the mayor, different councilmen, etc. being arrested on embezzlement and/or child pornography charges only to have the case dismissed after their careers ruined. It isn't about the ICE/SB1070 raids conducted making average citizens feel weary and carry their 'papers.' It isn't about the fact that he is proud of aforementioned facts. Hell, it isn't even about pink boxers. My entire disdain relies souly on his badge.

I honestly think what upsets me the most is supposed Liberty minded people support this gestapo tumor. I've lived in M.C. I know the fear average law abiding citizens face because of this tyrannical asshole. I know who elects him run after run. It's a damn shame. And frankly, supposed Libertarians supporting him is a damn shame. //end rant

[kcchiefs6465]

Given that his county is a maelstrom of drug violence as well as a center for drug mule motivated border crossings, I don't think he has to convince many. They just have to stick their head out the window of their car or home. Maricopa County is a warzone. You could banish Arpaio & his lawless department to another dimension & the same problems would arise again. That's liberty for you. Beheadings, rapes, drug related assassinations, forced servitude as a drug mule.....
Do you live in Maricopa County?

[AuH20]

More than a decade of which who was in charge? (Of the MCSO)

You are quite a case.. I believe I called you on your Ron Paul comments (in a Justin Amash thread, I believe?) in which I still haven't a response.

That being said I am unamazed you would chime two cents in in stating

Point me to the thread. Was it a salem witch trial at Amash's expense?? I can't answer everything but I'd love to revisit the thread.


Yes, that is it. It isn't his mismanagement of the investigation of hundreds of child sex abuse cases. (Allowing the statute of limitations to run out as well as never investigating a good percentage of them) It isn't about inmates being subjected to 100+ heat in the desert in tents. It isn't about the publicity stunts he has pulled denying 'well known' inmates water and putting them in a sweat box. It isn't about tanks rolling down private property. (Killing dogs and roosters they were supposedly there to rescue) It isn't about the mayor, different councilmen, etc. being arrested on embezzlement and/or child pornography charges only to have the case dismissed after their careers ruined. It isn't about the ICE/SB1070 raids conducted making average citizens feel weary and carry their 'papers.' It isn't about the fact that he is proud of aforementioned facts. Hell, it isn't even about pink boxers. My entire disdain relies souly on his badge.

I honestly think what upsets me the most is supposed Liberty minded people support this gestapo tumor. I've lived in M.C. I know the fear average law abiding citizens face because of this tyrannical asshole. I know who elects him run after run. It's a damn shame. And frankly, supposed Libertarians supporting him is a damn shame. //end rant

First off, of the 432 cases half of them were thrown out for having no legitimacy to them. Secondly, you're dealing with a transient population of illegal immigrants who were reporting a large majority of these crimes. Utilizing valuable assets and resources to track down Jorge Espinoza when he's halfway to Massachusetts or Oaxaca doesn't strike me as logical nor efficient.

Secondly, I could care less what happens to those violators who don't follow Arizona or federal law in the Sheriff's county. There is a long lost remnant called personal responsibility as well as it's brother named situational awareness. These two valuable skills have served human beings well over the last six thousand years. Many of Joe's oppressed prisoners didn't magically end in Sheriff's Joe tents because they discarded a empty candy wrapper at the local street corner. Some of the nonsense peddled in this forum about Sheriff Joe and his badge wielding gestapo rounding up innocent, law abiding pillars of society is comical at best. It's 2012 in the age of mini-cameras and compact smart phones, yet we have no incendiary videos detailing firsthand these numerous alleged abuses by the Maricopa County Sheriff's department .

[Don Lapre]

In post #163 you said something about overwhelming evidence that president Obama is an illegal fraud (whatever that's supposed to mean). Now it's just document forgery.

Just?

If Barry passed off a forged BC, that is illegal and it makes him a fraud, does it not?


Unreal.

[Revolution9]

In post #163 you said something about overwhelming evidence that president Obama is an illegal fraud (whatever that's supposed to mean). Now it's just document forgery.

Try that forged document stuff at the local drivers license bureau and you will understand what fraud is and how the mundane get treated when attempting what the resident of the blight house and demander in thief does with impunity. The worst part is a fraud is creating and signing laws that have no power of law. But the force is still there to jackboot ya. Just like the commies planned. Make the entire US government illegitimate and it is only one step to power over their vast treasures while the people weave and bob and fight amongst themselves over ideologues.

Rev9

[AuH20]

Try that forged document stuff at the local drivers license bureau and you will understand what fraud is and how the mundane get treated when attempting what the resident of the blight house and demander in thief does with impunity. The worst part is a fraud is creating and signing laws that have no power of law. But the force is still there to jackboot ya. Just like the commies planned. Make the entire US government illegitimate and it is only one step to power over their vast treasures while the people weave and bob and fight amongst themselves over ideologues.

Rev9

Or a forged pistol license. We wouldn't see you until 2020. ROFL

[kcchiefs6465]

Point me to the thread. Was it a salem witch trial at Amash's expense?? I can't answer everything but I'd love to revisit the thread.
I've been looking for it.. for a while actually. I believe it's in this thread.. (Something along the lines of Ron Paul not being a good messenger for liberty).. http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?378220-Amash-considers-resigning-from-Congress-after-feeling-heat-from-a-vote&highlight=amash+kcchiefs6465 If you find the post I am talking about feel free to leave a response in the original thread.

Without this thread being derailed further I invite those with any articles relating to Joe Arpaio to stop by:
(I'll Edit)
By all means.. carry on with the topic of the thread.

[AuH20]

Not saying Arpaio is a saint because he certainly isn't one, but look at all the ex-La Raza officials at prominent levels within the Obama Administration. Coincidence, with the heat coming down on Sheriff Joe exponentially worse than years past? And this isn't to say that the crooked Bush Administration wasn't on Joe's case for exposing their lack of action in regard to the illegal alien migration. After all, the drug trade and the illegal labor phenomenon has always had daunting dollar signs attached to such activities:

http://standwitharizona.com/blog/2012/02/22/la-raza-president-calls-joe-arpaio-americas-worst-sheriff-demands-resignation/


La Raza is coming after Joe, and they are joined at the hip with the Obama Administration at the highest levels. Cecila Munoz, NCLR’s former chief lobbyist, is now Obama’s Domestic Policy Adviser. Hilda Solis, the Labor Secretary, is a former NLCR member who demands “civil rights” for illegal aliens in the workplace. And Thomas Perez, the Department of Justice Civil Rights Division chief – is a former President of CASA de Maryland, the Soros and government-funded La Raza offshoot in Maryland that fights for the “rights” of illegal aliens and against immigration laws like SB1070. Perez also came to Phoenix just one month earlier, to accuse Sheriff Joe of “racial profiling” and has threatened to file suit.


Hmmm. I wonder if any high level KKK officials will be looking for employment within a Romney administration. Or is that just a democrat thing?? The NCLR is basically a cleaned up Hispanic version of the KKK that rubs elbows with the most powerful members of Congress.

[qh4dotcom]

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