Is this another GOP stunt?...MASS Delegates...

[Tiso0770]

A Message to the Massachusetts GOP


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-cVQfvK2VI4

[CPUd]

Sorta reminds me of when a fighter pilot gets shot down over enemy territory and captured. Then their captors release a video statement from them.

the Josh Tolley vid is the counterpoint
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?383420-Josh-Tolley-great-vid-on-compromise-Romney-and-future-strategy

[ATXRevolutionary]

Le sigh. Going along to get along. I'm disappointed in these delegates. The whole reason the lawsuit exists is because the GOP and Romney have cheated every step of the way. Nominating Romney is the will of the voters!? You mean the voters that just listen to who the MSM tells them to vote for and would never take the time to actually fight for anything? Yeah, that's a pledge worth honoring...

If the large percentage of Romney supporters cared so much then they should of stood up for their beliefs and became delegates!

These Ron Paul loving delegates are forgetting we have a Republic, not a Democracy. A Republic that allows the irate, tireless minority to make real change... Not to just honor the will of the average American sheepie!

[Natural Citizen]

Instant tea....not at all like the home brewed stuff that tastes so sweet. I had mentioned this phenomenon in one of my first posts here. Those friends from within or something to that extent. Interestingly enough, it was moved somewhere else. Haven't seen hide nor hair or read the thread since.

[romancito]

Delegate one, "I'm going to war." Delegate two, "I'm going to Iran to fight Iranians." Delegate three, "I'm going to Syria first and then to Iran." Delegate four, "I'm going to Syria, Iran and then to China."

Delegate one, "I'm want Obamneycare to my company." Delegate two, "I want to pay higher health insurance with Obamneycare." Delegate three, "I want Obamneycare for my abortions." Delegate four, "Obamneycare will make America the great but I will go to Mexico for my treatment."

Delegate one, "I want a bigger Navy." Delegate two, "I want a bigger army." Delegate three, "I want Guantanamo to grow larger." Delegate four, "Waterboarding should be legal."

Delegate one, "I want to surrender my guns." Delegate two, "Everyone should surrender their guns." Delegate three, "Police should search everyone they see." Delegate four, "We should check first at the police station before going on any trip out of town."

Delegate one, "I would like my job to be outsourced." Delegate two, "I would like to have an offshore account." Delegate three, "I want my social security to be confiscated." Delegate four, "I want my Chinese imports to triple in cost."

[cajuncocoa]

Remember what I said yesterday about co-opting, hijacking, and infiltrating (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?383392-Importance-of-getting-involved-in-your-local-GOP&p=4539185#post4539185)? *ahem*

[romancito]

Delegate one, "I want more federal programs mandates for my state." Delegate two, "I want a Romneycare mandate for my state." Delegate three, "I want my county and city to be flooded with incentives, stimulus dollars, and federal programs for jobs." Delegate four, "I want my city, county and state to raise taxes everywhere they have a tax structure in place to pay for Romney's mandates."

[Dublin4Paul]

This video made me puke. What a disgrace.

[enjerth]

The delegate, the bottom of the political pyramid, carries the most weight and the most responsibility.

You are elected from among your peers because they are either ignorant, or they trust you.

Wield your power.

[Natural Citizen]

Remember what I said yesterday about co-opting, hijacking, and infiltrating (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?383392-Importance-of-getting-involved-in-your-local-GOP&p=4539185#post4539185)? *ahem*

Perhaps it should be expected that a flood of "occupy" this and that news is in our future as well. Who knows....

[jcannon98188]

You see these guy's faces? Memorize them, and make sure they go down in history as traitors. They soldout.

[Cinderella]

Are you people serious? Lol

They are trying to convince the MaGOP that they were going to follow their state laws! That there was NO just cause to disqualify them. They risk having a felony on their record and thousands of dollars in fines if they do not follow state laws. Don't you all know Mass has some of the strictest binding laws in the country? But why should any of you care? It's not your life or future. Keep giving them great advice such as not signing the original GOP affidavit by the deadline, which is what got them illegally bounced.

Yes remember these people, because they will be filing a lawsuit at the STATE level that would require the GOP to follow their own rules and recertify these delegates. I hear they are also in the process of filing appeals to the RNC.

Yes remember the faces of these "traitors" who continue to fight for their rights and the will of over 2000 voters in Massachusetts who elected them to represent the state.

[cheapseats]

How is not possible to readily verify whether this is "legit"? NOT to concede that some Republicans get to tell other Republicans what to do, rather, to remark (with incredulity) on Ron Paul's seeming INACCESSIBILITY to his most "enthusiastic" supporters.

And what of the Liberty Moovement in Massachusetts? I think my memory is not playing tricks on me in recollecting that the board has MEMBERS from Massachusetts.

I'M SORRY that I have nothing "positive" to contribute. That does NOT mean I should bow out of the conversation, unless y'all want a CIRCLE JERK.

Private property! Private property! Kinda. Ask the Owners whether they jump thru any hoops against their will.

SEPARATELY, Ron Paul trailing BADLY in the popular vote means YOU DON'T HAVE THE NUMBERS to "take over" as an exclusionary our-way-or-the-highway subset.

If NOBP turns out to be Someone Other Than Ron Paul...which certainly SEEMS to be a Done Deal, but we'll know FOR SURE very soon...the fight goes forward on more than one flank. Liberty Republicans...isn't that what y'all are calling yourselves? If I was in the GOP TAKEOVER MOOVEMENT...which I am not, and will not become...I would strongly suggest, in my own inimitable fashion, trying to reclaim the Tea Party is a better bet than trying to hold onto truly libertarian-leaning Republicans-for-Ron-Paul's sake. Fuhgeddabout enticing disillusioned Democrats, it ain't happening.

Very bad when I have to scroll up to rediscover what thread I'm in, sorry.

IT SHOULD BE EZPZ TO VERIFY WHETHER "INSTRUCTIONS" TO YOU ARE FROM FRIEND OR FOE...especially for people who call other people Unthinking.

Here's the rub. Not all Liberty folk have identical friends and foes.

[enjerth]

...who continue to fight for their rights...

Umm, is saying "I'm against any legal action to unbind delegates" fighting for anyone's rights?

When the WILL of the mob reigns supreme, the world will end. Which do you think is more important? The right to choose another path, or the right of the people's voice to be heard?

This is kind of like a first amendment right, that the people's may voice their opinion. It should also be the first amendment right of any delegate to choose another path, after having been duly elected as a representative of the people to conduct the affairs of the people for which they are too busy to research and engage in on their own.

You're arguing for rules that try to reshape a representative democracy into direct democracy. That's when the republic is gone.

[Cinderella]

My argument is that if delegates truly want to be unbound by their state party, they must engage themselves in the process. Get involved in the rules committees and rewrite the rules for future caucuses! You go nowhere by breaking laws, acquiring felonies, and accumulating thousands of dollars in fines and legal fees. This is the heart of the message! Get involved! We can't change things if people refuse to get involved in the process. Start your own RTC, run for school committee, state committee, state rep, or selectman/woman!! The point is you need to get involved if you want things to change.

[enjerth]

On the contrary. We get everywhere if we break the laws.

There are laws that were made for honor, our crown of justice, and there are laws that were created for destruction, which must be destroyed for the sake of justice.

The way to have such laws undone is for the right-standing citizen to throw themselves upon the law, and have their day in court if it comes to that, and be decided on by a jury of their own peers!

Anything less than that, to permit destructive laws to hold you hostage, is cowardice and will leave a worse array of tyrants for our children to live under.

The Republic was created by the delegation, and it is our last tool to restore the Republic peacefully.

The delegation is the last bastion of the Republic.

Let my delegates go! :cool:

[ClydeCoulter]

On the contrary. We get everywhere if we break the laws.

There are laws that were made for honor, our crown of justice, and there are laws that were created for destruction, which must be destroyed for the sake of justice.

The way to have such laws undone is for the right-standing citizen to throw themselves upon the law, and have their day in court if it comes to that, and be decided on by a jury of their own peers!

Anything less than that, to permit destructive laws to hold you hostage, is cowardice and will leave a worse array of tyrants for our children to live under.

The Republic was created by the delegation, and it is our last tool to restore the Republic peacefully.

The delegation is the last bastion of the Republic.

Let my delegates go! :cool:

And I look forward (unfortunately) to having to defend that (bolded statement) in the near future. I see too many people saying, "Why not just take the primary results and be done with it". BECAUSE OUR COUNTRY IS NOT A DEMOCRACY (mob rule).

[jmag]

So if Romney doesn't win at first ballot will they vote for him again to not cause trouble? Sounds like it.

[Cinderella]

So if Romney doesn't win at first ballot will they vote for him again to not cause trouble? Sounds like it.

Mass delegates are only required to vote for Romney on the first ballot ONLY. Seriously people? Before making baseless assumptions you should check their state laws and GOP rules.

[kathy88]

I've been avoiding watching that. I should have continued. I feel sick now. Thanks Massachusetts "Liberty" Caucus.

[wetroof]

this is a good. I am really supportive of this. They are trying to go to Tampa. I support that a hundred percent. I don't care what they have to say in this one vid about being against legal action to unbind the delegates.

For all we know at the convention they were go back on there pledge to vote Mitt. Or they might not, depending on the rules. still its more RP strength on the convention floor which IMO is significant.

[enjerth]

this is a good. I am really supportive of this. They are trying to go to Tampa. I support that a hundred percent. I don't care what they have to say in this one vid about being against legal action to unbind the delegates.

For all we know at the convention they were go back on there pledge to vote Mitt. Or they might not, depending on the rules. still its more RP strength on the convention floor which IMO is significant.

That'd be great. I hope for the best. This is a political campaign, the likes of which frequently pits us against each other. We should be trying to overcome that.

[Cinderella]

this is a good. I am really supportive of this. They are trying to go to Tampa. I support that a hundred percent. I don't care what they have to say in this one vid about being against legal action to unbind the delegates.

For all we know at the convention they were go back on there pledge to vote Mitt. Or they might not, depending on the rules. still its more RP strength on the convention floor which IMO is significant.

Ahh a voice of reason!! Apparently some here think that the only business taking place in Tampa is the nomination. You know there are other things delegates will be voting on. Would you rather see interviews from a select few of Romneys insider friends? Or would you rather see LIBERTY folk be there spreading the message?! It's always been known that Massachusetts has the most strict binding laws in the country. Why is this a surprise to you people that they are going to uphold their oath? Some people gave their word in front of over 200 people, at their caucus. Are you people suggesting they go back on their word? What would RP say about those tactics?

[jcannon98188]

Ahh a voice of reason!! Apparently some here think that the only business taking place in Tampa is the nomination. You know there are other things delegates will be voting on. Would you rather see interviews from a select few of Romneys insider friends? Or would you rather see LIBERTY folk be there spreading the message?! It's always been known that Massachusetts has the most strict binding laws in the country. Why is this a surprise to you people that they are going to uphold their oath? Some people gave their word in front of over 200 people, at their caucus. Are you people suggesting they go back on their word? What would RP say about those tactics?

So what is the goal then? Get some planks? The GOP doesn't even follow the Constitution, you think they will care about planks? You want a voice of reason? Stop believing that the GOP is not every bit as evil as Obama is.

[jcannon98188]

Ahh a voice of reason!! Apparently some here think that the only business taking place in Tampa is the nomination. You know there are other things delegates will be voting on. Would you rather see interviews from a select few of Romneys insider friends? Or would you rather see LIBERTY folk be there spreading the message?! It's always been known that Massachusetts has the most strict binding laws in the country. Why is this a surprise to you people that they are going to uphold their oath? Some people gave their word in front of over 200 people, at their caucus. Are you people suggesting they go back on their word? What would RP say about those tactics?

Also, they shouldn't have made those oaths in the first place.

[Cinderella]

Also, they shouldn't have made those oaths in the first place.

Had they not given the oath, they wouldn't have been allowed to run as delegates.
Am I speaking to a brick wall? I doubt you have taken the time to actually read the rules in Massachusetts.
Rule 4.5 : "Each nominee for election as a pledged Congressional District delegate or alternate delegate shall express a commitment to a qualifying Presidential candidate and agree to be bound to vote for that candidate on the first such roll-call unless released by such candidate, as required by law. c. 53 § 70(I)"
Hence the verbal pledge given at the caucus. However, the affidavits that followed are not required in the rules.

[cajuncocoa]

So what is the goal then? Get some planks? The GOP doesn't even follow the Constitution, you think they will care about planks? You want a voice of reason? Stop believing that the GOP is not every bit as evil as Obama is.+rep

[Natural Citizen]

Perhaps it should be expected that a flood of "occupy" this and that news is in our future as well. Who knows....

:rolleyes:

[Carehn]

Fuck Romney & Fuck the GOP!

[sailingaway]

Ahh a voice of reason!! Apparently some here think that the only business taking place in Tampa is the nomination. You know there are other things delegates will be voting on. Would you rather see interviews from a select few of Romneys insider friends? Or would you rather see LIBERTY folk be there spreading the message?! It's always been known that Massachusetts has the most strict binding laws in the country. Why is this a surprise to you people that they are going to uphold their oath? Some people gave their word in front of over 200 people, at their caucus. Are you people suggesting they go back on their word? What would RP say about those tactics?


the NOMINATION is a separate thing from the vote on the first ballot. Just the NOMINATION gets Ron an unedited speech on our own strength. Nevada, for example, should be able to be a state that puts Ron in NOMINATION to be put on the ballot to begin with. The 'first vote on the ballot' where binding would kick in comes later. Regardless, we don't have a majority in MASS so it was never going to be a full state for Ron, regardless, and as Cinderella says the ballot vote isn't everything.

and note, nominating Romney might be the will of the voters in a bound state in MASS, but there are other states where delegates will be voting for Romney where the state did NOT vote for him. The establishment spins it whichever way works for them.

[sailingaway]

Had they not given the oath, they wouldn't have been allowed to run as delegates.
Am I speaking to a brick wall? I doubt you have taken the time to actually read the rules in Massachusetts.
Rule 4.5 : "Each nominee for election as a pledged Congressional District delegate or alternate delegate shall express a commitment to a qualifying Presidential candidate and agree to be bound to vote for that candidate on the first such roll-call unless released by such candidate, as required by law. c. 53 § 70(I)"
Hence the verbal pledge given at the caucus. However, the affidavits that followed are not required in the rules.

Yeah. The oaths aren't anywhere in the rule, but that isn't your fault. This was one way to go, and who knows if you would have gotten in the other way. I'm not about to second guess those on the ground, however, I'm not second guessing our delegates in other states who may have found it better to go a different way, either. You each had your own circumstances and personalities to work with. Somewhere they were arresting our delegates when they were outvoted and were breaking our delegates bones might have reacted differently.

[sailingaway]

I've been avoiding watching that. I should have continued. I feel sick now. Thanks Massachusetts "Liberty" Caucus.

well, I'm not going to watch it, to be honest.

It is what it is, and Tampa isn't long ahead of us, now.

[Origanalist]

well, I'm not going to watch it, to be honest.

It is what it is, and Tampa isn't long ahead of us, now.

Same here, I passed.