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View Full Version : Time mag reports on suburban living. You are all selfish and should live in tenements.




Anti Federalist
07-13-2012, 11:04 PM
You're nothing but an asshole for wanting to be financially well off.

And possibly a racist for not wanting to live in "diversity".

So, why the hell not?

You never own anything anyway, you just pay rent to government to squat in your home.

Might as well just all pack into the tenements again.

The scoops are on the way.



Do the Suburbs Make You Selfish?

http://business.time.com/2012/07/09/do-the-suburbs-make-you-selfish/?xid=gonewsedit&google_editors_picks=true

New numbers from the Census Bureau suggest that America’s long love affair with the suburbs may be cooling off just a bit: In the year-long span from July 2010 to July 2011, in the majority of America’s largest metropolitan areas, densely packed urban areas grew faster than suburbs – reversing a trend that has held since the heyday of the Model-T in the 1920s. If this current trend holds, it could be good news for the environment, reducing the time commuters spend in gas-guzzling cars going to and from their jobs in the city. Could it also be good for America’s social ecology?

That’s one of the implications of a new paper by Harvard economist Edward Glaeser, which takes aim at something that many homeowners and would-be homeowners consider as American as apple pie and Apple iPads: the home mortgage interest deduction.

Glaeser argues that the deduction, as well as other governmental policies that encourage homeownership, effectively “bribe” the well-off to segregate themselves from poorer people by abandoning more diverse cities for more homogenous and affluent suburbs.

(MORE: How the Rich Got Rich)

As Glaeser explains:

The most fundamental fact about rental housing in the United States is that rental units are overwhelmingly in multifamily structures. … More than 85 percent of single-family dwellings are owner occupied; more than 85 percent of dwellings in homes with more than three units are rented. When the federal government subsidizes homeownership explicitly, through the home mortgage interest deduction, and implicitly, through the government-sponsored enterprises (GSEs) Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, it is pushing Americans away from dense multiunit dwellings toward sprawling single-family detached homes.

Obviously there are plenty of single-family homes in cities. But dense urban areas can’t exist without a large percentage of multifamily structures, from 2-flats to giant residential skyscrapers.

And as more affluent Americans have moved to the suburbs, they have also moved away from poorer neighbors.

Because poorer people tend to live disproportionately in cities … bribing wealthier people to leave higher density apartments is increasing the physical, and possibly also the social, distance between rich and poor.

Citing the work of economist Erzo F. P. Luttmer, who found that support for redistributionist policies was greater among those who live near poor people of the same race, Glaeser argues that “[i]f proximity breeds empathy … then distance may reduce that empathy.”

(MORE: How to Improve Obamacare)

While Glaeser’s argument here remains speculative, it’s in line with a great deal of recent research that suggests wealth (and the attendant ability to segregate oneself from the poor) may make people more selfish and less empathetic. In a cover story in the latest issue of New York magazine, Lisa Miller uses this research to present a compelling case that “Money Can Make You Mean.” As one money-empathy researcher, Berkeley psychologist Paul Piff, tells Miller:

[T]he rich are way more likely to prioritize their own self-interests above the interests of other people. It makes them more likely to exhibit characteristics that we would stereotypically associate with, say, a**holes.

Some of the most interesting research on what New York magazine calls the “money-empathy gap” comes from another Berkeley psychologist, Jennifer Stellar. In one recent experiment, Stellar showed a group of ethnically and socially diverse students a video depicting a family trying to deal with a child with cancer; while the video tugged at the heartstrings of all those who watched it, lower-class students felt more compassion and empathy for the struggles of those in the video.

As Stellar explains in a statement about her research,

It’s not that the upper classes are coldhearted. … They may just not be as adept at recognizing the cues and signals of suffering because they haven’t had to deal with as many obstacles in their lives.

Are there ways to help decrease this “money-empathy gap” short of having everyone in the suburbs move back into the city? In Forbes, Alice G. Walton turns to Beverly Hills psychiatrist Reef Karim, who has treated a lot of troubled rich folks. “When you massage that money-making muscle for so long, it doesn’t go away,” Dr. Karim tells Forbes. “It informs all of your relationships. CEOs of big companies have some of the most sociopathic traits … because … those personality traits lend themselves so well to business. But the downside is that they’re very hard to shut off.”

Dr. Karim finds that teaching his patients meditation and mindfulness are effective ways to develop what he calls the “empathy muscle.” I’m guessing not many of Karim’s patients follow the Buddha one step further, giving up their worldly possessions to live amongst the poor. But if the research of Piff, Stellar and others holds true, such practices could teach more than a few Scrooges a lot of empathy, very quickly.

Brian4Liberty
07-14-2012, 12:55 AM
the home mortgage interest deduction

Federal Reserve debt dealer corporatism at its best.

A Son of Liberty
07-14-2012, 03:30 AM
Citing the work of economist Erzo F. P. Luttmer, who found that support for redistributionist policies was greater among those who live near poor people of the same race, Glaeser argues that “[i]f proximity breeds empathy … then distance may reduce that empathy.”

Could Mr. Luttmer explain to me in a logically consistent manner what exactly empathy has to do with redistributionist policies?

I'd like to see the tax returns of people like this. I'd be willing to bet that a larger percentage of my income goes to charity than theirs. I'm by no means wealthy, but I AM one of these slack-jawed yokels who apparently thinks it is okay to not live in a major metropolitan area.

It's bad, and it's getting worse.

Austrian Econ Disciple
07-14-2012, 03:39 AM
Cities are the worst. I abhorr the cattle stocks.

tod evans
07-14-2012, 03:47 AM
Gosh, my little piece of paradise wouldn't work for most of the folks in that article.

It's miles to a gas station, the government freebee office is two towns away, you help your neighbor by bucking hay or rotating a breeched calf, not by writing checks. Children learn terrible things like skinning rabbits and picking wild berries in tick/snake infested berry patches. Jeans with holes are worn to work in, new ones are for church or school...Money doesn't come in the mail, it's earned by producing something that requires sweat. Family ties are important, much more so than political affiliation or what car you drive. In my home there's no cable TV, not even rabbit ears....However kids are permitted as many library books as they can read.

Nope, I'm afraid here in the sticks neither the wealthy or those dependent on government handouts have a place...Instead of wasting time and money trying to push homogenization how about the city folk with the time to worry about such tripe get off their collective asses and make something.

Origanalist
07-14-2012, 04:00 AM
Maybe the LVT folks are having a impact? Cities suck.

agitator
07-14-2012, 04:57 AM
So get rid of deductions for apartment owners too. Watch rents go up.

ghengis86
07-14-2012, 05:21 AM
Big cities suck. Every time I move, it's farther into the country. It's sooooo much better out here based on any statistic you like; cost of living, crime, etc

moostraks
07-14-2012, 06:55 AM
Big cities suck. Every time I move, it's farther into the country. It's sooooo much better out here based on any statistic you like; cost of living, crime, etc

That is subjective. We lived in NE Alabama and it was the most horrendous place I have ever lived through. When the neighbors shoot AT you the day you move in, you know it was a bad move. The bastard did the same thing to the guy who bought the property to the backside of us (also adjoining psycho neighbor's property) but that guy shot back. We were moving out at the time and it sounded like we were in a war zone with the gunfire going back and forth as they both shot at each other. Also there is a good deal of drug production that goes on out there driving them to be paranoid and volatile. We chose right off of downtown in a medium to small city on the decline but live in an industrial area and it has gone well so far for the last 4 years. So for us it has been better than the suburbs or the country were, but we chose very carefully according to our needs....

Beorn
07-14-2012, 07:15 AM
Lol. I'm no fan of the suburbs, but seriously, it's the exact opposite that's true. White yuppies who move to the city to seek "diversity" (though never really developing neighborly relations with people different from them) usually just end up causing gentrification and rising rents which cause lower class blacks to lose their homes.

Noob
07-14-2012, 07:28 AM
The only problem with suburb is that now tend to build the houses all most the same, have small yards, and little spacing between the houses. They should have more acres of land to each house.

oyarde
07-14-2012, 11:07 AM
Yes , I am selfish , no I do not wish to live in a tenement . And yes ;) they can all kiss my ass . Commies.

Brian4Liberty
07-14-2012, 11:14 AM
Harvard economist Edward Glaeser

Wonder what neighborhood this selfish a**hole lives in? ;)

VIDEODROME
07-14-2012, 11:27 AM
Meh. Haved lived in the city in both good and bad parts.

I do really enjoy all the conveniences of the city like shopping and entertainment. I really liked the big IMAX screen in town.

But it is really patchwork. For a while I tried to live within my means in a cheap place and the other residents seemed to be criminals or people where involved in drugs. I was really embarrased when a friend from work came over to hangout and someone broke into his car.

It does seem like you need to work your way out of crummy neighborhoods to a decent area.

oyarde
07-14-2012, 11:55 AM
Wonder what neighborhood this selfish a**hole lives in? ;) Was born in Manhattan

Anti Federalist
07-14-2012, 12:05 PM
Wonder what neighborhood this selfish a**hole lives in? ;)

I'll wager a $750,000 single family home in Cambridge.

Fucking hypocrites.

Tod
07-14-2012, 12:05 PM
Was born in Manhattan

but appears to now live in a suburb of boston on a nice estate surrounded by trees, with a housing development nearby probably hidden by his trees?

http://www.whitepages.com/name/Edward-L-Glaeser/Weston-MA/45qn4qc?site_id=15277

Keith and stuff
07-14-2012, 12:06 PM
I lived in a suburban area of a city when I was a kid. It was fantastic. I now live in an urban downtown area in NH and love it. Since I live in NH, even though I live downtown, there isn't a lot of skin color diversity. However, it isn't a great place to raise a family. If that even happened to me, I'd likely move to a suburb or the county because it is important to try to raise kids in the best environment possible.

Anti Federalist
07-14-2012, 12:16 PM
but appears to now live in a suburb of boston on a nice estate surrounded by trees, with a housing development nearby probably hidden by his trees?

http://www.whitepages.com/name/Edward-L-Glaeser/Weston-MA/45qn4qc?site_id=15277

Not Cambridge, but, close enough.

Cheapest home for sale in Weston?

A 728 SF cottage for $275,000.

Everything rapidly goes up to the half million mark from there.

http://www.homes.com/Real_Estate/MA/City/WESTON/?TemplateToView=List&orderby=price+asc

Meatwasp
07-14-2012, 12:44 PM
The Bible and the old hermit said they were going to herd us in the great new city.
No wildlings allowed.

kuckfeynes
07-14-2012, 01:06 PM
I grew up on a city block in the 80's and was moved to the suburbs at age 10 in the 90's. For good reason, in hindsight I can tell that that neighborhood was crashing and burning. But man did we have fun running around and being kids. Coincidentally or not, that's right around the same time I became chronically bored, best friends became screens, and started displaying symptoms of what is today conveniently labeled ADD.

Soon as I turned 18 I moved to an even bigger city and didn't look back. Now approaching 30 and watching society grow ever more volatile, I wouldn't mind getting out of the city, but it would really have to be all the way to the sticks -- in search of reasonable self-sufficiency. To this day the sterility of suburbia just gives me the creeps.

musicmax
07-14-2012, 01:08 PM
Wonder what neighborhood this selfish a**hole lives in? ;)

"Edward L. Glaeser grew up on the East Side of Manhattan, went to school in Princeton, N.J., and Chicago, lived for a time in Cambridge, Mass., and Palo Alto, Calif., and recently moved with his wife and young son to a house on six and a half acres in the affluent suburb of Weston, Mass. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/05/magazine/305glaeser.1.html?pagewanted=all

Anti Federalist
07-14-2012, 01:29 PM
"Edward L. Glaeser grew up on the East Side of Manhattan, went to school in Princeton, N.J., and Chicago, lived for a time in Cambridge, Mass., and Palo Alto, Calif., and recently moved with his wife and young son to a house on six and a half acres in the affluent suburb of Weston, Mass. "

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/03/05/magazine/305glaeser.1.html?pagewanted=all

Cambridge.

See?

Told ya.

oyarde
07-14-2012, 04:16 PM
The Bible and the old hermit said they were going to herd us in the great new city.
No wildlings allowed.

Good , that exempts me ;)