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John F Kennedy III
07-12-2012, 01:49 PM
Here Come the Draft-Nappers

by William Norman Grigg


Gen. Stanley McChrystal, former commander of NATO troops in Afghanistan, demands the re-instatement of conscription so that next time Washington commits itself to a needless foreign war "every town, every city [will be] at risk."

"I think we ought to have a draft. I think if a nation goes to war, it shouldn’t be solely be represented by a profession-al force, because it gets to be unrepresentative of the population," McChrystal during a session of the 2012 Aspen Ideas Festival. "I think if a nation goes to war, every town, every city needs to be at risk. You make that decision and everybody has skin in the game."

Of course, when those who presume to rule us decide to go to war, they don’t have any "skin" in the game; instead, they are gambling with the lives of other people.

"This was the first time in recent years that a high-profile officer has broken ranks to argue that the all-volunteer force is not necessarily good for the country or the military," exulted Thomas Ricks of a neo-con think-tank called the Center for a New American Security in a New York Times op-ed column. "Unlike Europeans, Americans still seem determined to maintain a serious military force, so we need to think about how to pay for it and staff it by creating a draft that is better and more equitable than the Vietnam-era conscription system":

"A revived draft, including both males and females, should include three options for new conscripts coming out of high school. Some could choose 18 months of military service with low pay but excellent post-service benefits, including free college tuition. These conscripts would not be deployed but could perform tasks currently outsourced a great cost to the Pentagon: paperwork, painting barracks, mowing lawns, driving generals around, and generally doing lower-skilled tasks so professional soldiers don’t have to. If they want to stay, they could move into the professional force and receive weapons training, higher pay and better benefits.

Those who don’t want to serve in the arm could perform civilian national service for a slightly longer period and equally low pay – teaching in low-income areas, cleaning parks, rebuilding crumbling infrastructure, or aiding the elderly, After two years, they would receive similar benefits like tuition aid."

In words that suppurate scorn, Ricks addresses "libertarians who object to a draft": "Those who declined to help Uncle Sam would in return pledge to ask nothing from him – no Medicare, no subsidized college loans and no mortgage guarantees. Those who want minimal government can have it."

That arrangement would be perfectly satisfactory to those of us who understand the principle of self-ownership – as long as the government makes no demands of us in terms of the institutionalized theft called "taxation." Obviously, Ricks – like other totalitarians of his ilk – doesn’t approve of the idea that we would be permitted to keep everything that we earn. Thus he assumes that those who refuse to become conscripts would still be tax slaves, and be deprived of the right to reclaim any of our stolen wealth in the form of government-provided "benefits."

What Ricks is describing is the enactment of the eighth plank of the Communist Manifesto, which decrees the "equal liability of all to labor" in "industrial armies" controlled by the State. It is also a recapitulation of similar proposals made by numerous Establishment-connected pundits and think tank habitués in recent years.

A very similar approach is found in the plan proferred in Foreign Policy magazine by retired U.S. Army Colonel William L. Hauser, a member of the Council on Foreign Relations, and naval veteran Jerome Slater of the State University of New York, Buffalo.

The program envisioned by Hauser and Slater would "combine a revived military draft with a broader public-service program as already practiced in some European states – a ‘domestic Peace Corps.’" They would permit draftees "to choose between military and nonmilitary service" – that is, to select their preferred form of servitude – at least initially. Given that providing additional military manpower is the entire point of the proposal, the domestic service "option" would probably last just long enough to get the measure enacted by Congress.


Discussing what they consider the ancillary benefits of military slavery, Hauser and Slater list what they consider "a number of positive social consequences." For instance: "Conscription will enable the forces to reflect the full spectrum of American pluralism, in terms of both socioeconomic classes and racial/ethnic groups. It is unacceptable that less than 1 percent of the country’s eligible population serves in the armed forces, with almost no war-relevant sacrifice being asked from the rest of society. It ought to be axiomatic that the hardships and dangers of military service be more widely shared."

What’s really going on here, as the incomparable investigative reporter Anne Williamson has pointed out, is the quiet implementation of a deal that would use American youngsters as human collateral for the foreign loans that fuel Washington’s demented imperial foreign policy.

"In his misbegotten quest for empire, George W. Bush faces two potentially decisive shortages – money and soldiers," wrote Williamson in early 2005. "The deficits in boots and dollars are becoming acute…. But it is America’s Blanche DuBois economy, whose debt levels – public and private – have gone parabolic, that threatens the entire imperial enterprise. Without the ready funds normally forthcoming from the Treasury bill market … the president would have to rely upon a highly-indebted population that simultaneously has no savings and yet retains great expectations of the public purse. Clearly such a people cannot carry the imperial standard. At least, not alone they can’t."

With the Empire going bankrupt, the liquidation sale is already quietly underway. Seizing young people to use as human "capital" – both as imperial coffin-stuffers, and drones of the domestic redistribution machinery – is the logical next step:


"Thanks to the enterprising left, a palatable framework of "universal service" is evolving, in which all of America’s young people will be registered for national service and, drawing on personal information gleaned from the giant government data bases now being built, will be assigned to community service, combat service, or homeland defense. The kicker may be a requirement of completed service before access to higher education and government financing for it will be granted. It is not improbable to see a ‘deal’ over Social Security reform on the horizon, i.e. in exchange for reduced benefits and an increase in the retirement age Boomer seniors will be guaranteed the services of [conscripted] ‘community brigades’ for home care."

The system outlined by both Ricks and the duo of Hauser and Slater is all but indistinguishable from the one predicted by Williamson: A dystopia in which the Regime claims unqualified ownership of everybody living under its rule, and disposes of their lives as it sees fit.


original article here:
http://lewrockwell.com/grigg/grigg-w266.html

Zippyjuan
07-12-2012, 02:01 PM
The arguement for the draft "putting more skin in the game" is right. One reason there has been less opposition to wars since Vietnam is the absence of the draft. "Well, they volunteered to go. " Start drafting people's kids and friends and they will care more.

In the Iraq War we were told we would not have to make any sacrifices. Instead of raising taxes to pay for it, taxes were cut and the deficit exploded. So we would not have to pay financialy and since the military was voluntary, no unwilling sacrifices there either. (I think GW was looking at how his father GHWB was able to get the first Gulf War over with quickly and have the "coalition of the willing" pay all of the costs made him believe he could do the same thing- we are still paying that terrible miscalculation and will do so for decades).

Unless people bear the brunt of the costs of war, they will be too willing to send others in to fight it for them.

jkr
07-12-2012, 02:02 PM
touch my kids and ill touch YOU

Acala
07-12-2012, 02:23 PM
He is right about the people making the decision having skin in the game, but wrong about how to go about achieving it because he glosses over WHO makes the decision. The correct way to make sure that those who make the decision have skin in the game is to allow everyone to decide for themselves what, if any, involvement they wish to have in any conflict. If you don't want to pay for, or otherwise participate in, a war, you don't.

John F Kennedy III
07-12-2012, 02:25 PM
He is right about the people making the decision having skin in the game, but wrong about how to go about achieving it because he glosses over WHO makes the decision. The correct way to make sure that those who make the decision have skin in the game is to allow everyone to decide for themselves what, if any, involvement they wish to have in any conflict. If you don't want to pay for, or otherwise participate in, a war, you don't.

Right. The people who want to go to war should fund and fight it themselves. They literally should be the only people going over there to fight.

Dr.3D
07-12-2012, 02:28 PM
Right. The people who want to go to war should fund and fight it themselves. They literally should be the only people going over there to fight.
I've often thought it would be right if the leaders of the two countries were put on an island to fight it out and whichever one left standing would be the winner.

John F Kennedy III
07-12-2012, 02:37 PM
I've often thought it would be right if the leaders of the two countries were put on an island to fight it out and whichever one left standing would be the winner.

Works for me. If this was required then there would never be a war. The leaders of governments don't want to die. They want to use their citizens to die for them.

bunklocoempire
07-12-2012, 02:46 PM
Man, this one really burned me up.:mad:

Here is what I posted on another forum when the 'country first' buffoons tried to defend this crap:


Maybe the guy who swore to protect and defend our Constitution might want to first demand that the politicians shirking their responsiblities get some "skin in the game" and follow the Constitution before suggesting who is to be fodder.

WW2 was the last time congress declared war.

Then there is the advice of our first General, General George Washington: "It is our true policy to steer clear of permanent alliance with any portion of the foreign world"

Hey Stanley, I'm less free than I was at the start of, and at the end of, your career of blindly following orders from various kings who trample the Constitution and sell U.S. force to the highest bidder -now why do you suppose I'm less free Stanley?

Stanley is a bit confused as to who the real enemy is therefore negating any and all of his strategies that deal with waging war. I wonder if Pat Tillman would have agreed with that assessment.

Horse and then cart Stanley, horse and then cart

Zippyjuan
07-12-2012, 03:00 PM
I've often thought it would be right if the leaders of the two countries were put on an island to fight it out and whichever one left standing would be the winner.

Reminds me of this great 80's song and video- USA vs USSR:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RTOQUnvI3CA

cindy25
10-19-2012, 09:42 PM
update regarding this

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/allan-brawley/reinstate-the-draft_b_1976194.html

Anti Federalist
10-19-2012, 10:59 PM
"A revived draft, including both males and females

He's right, but probably expecting a different outcome than what is likely.

Danke
10-20-2012, 07:09 AM
Can't we just outsource our soldiering to cheap third world labor?

KCIndy
10-20-2012, 07:20 AM
Can't we just outsource our soldiering to cheap third world labor?

Yeah, just like the Roman Empire did! Um... right before it collapsed..... while the "citizens" enjoyed their bread and circuses.... uh.... kinda like the U.S. today ... and... uh.... :( :(

KCIndy
10-20-2012, 07:25 AM
The arguement for the draft "putting more skin in the game" is right. One reason there has been less opposition to wars since Vietnam is the absence of the draft. "Well, they volunteered to go. " Start drafting people's kids and friends and they will care more.



I would really like to believe you're right. Unfortunately, that didn't hold true in WWI, WWII, Korea, or Vietnam. Take Vietnam as the most recent example of a war fought by draftees.

Anyone not serving was derided as a coward. Those who fled to Canada rather than be conscripted were called traitors.

Given the flag waving, rah-rah, "let's chant U-S-A! U-S-A!" nationalistic fervor that still seems to grip most of the nation, I can only imagine that those who resist a new draft will be given largely the same treatment as those poor guys who were trying to avoid 'Nam in the sixties.

I hope I'm wrong in thinking this. But I'm very cynical about the idea of the patriotic fevered citizens of the U.S. rising up against a draft if it means more troops to kill them thar terrorists. :(

Working Poor
10-20-2012, 07:38 AM
Right. The people who want to go to war should fund and fight it themselves. They literally should be the only people going over there to fight.

Yep it should not have to come out of the tax payers hide hell most people are not even sure what is going on in the ME. I try to keep up but it makes no sense what so ever all I know for sure is that people are getting killed

awake
10-20-2012, 07:54 AM
A draft army is a slave army. Not only is it a less effective fighting force, it is symbolic of a totalitarian nation. Slavery is what government is. The moral argument is always the most effective at gaining attention and when you present government and the state as an institution of modern slavery, one is presenting the purest moral case for the abolishment of the state.

Philhelm
10-20-2012, 08:34 AM
A draft army is a slave army. Not only is it a less effective fighting force, it is symbolic of a totalitarian nation. Slavery is what government is. The moral argument is always the most effective at gaining attention and when you present government and the state as an institution of modern slavery, one is presenting the purest moral case for the abolishment of the state.

I don't think that argument would be all that effective. It seems that the only definition of slavery that Americans accept is the sort found in our earlier history.

Origanalist
10-20-2012, 08:41 AM
I don't think that argument would be all that effective. It seems that the only definition of slavery that Americans accept is the sort found in our earlier history.

That is the only one taught to them since childhood.

thoughtomator
10-20-2012, 09:17 AM
put the children of those who vote for war on the front lines, that will put a stop to the nonsense

JK/SEA
10-20-2012, 10:07 AM
i remember hearing for the first time ''hell no, we won't go'' when i was in the 8th grade in 1964...my awareness shot up 100%...and ever since that day, my being against un-declared wars has been my main focus issue over everything else. A draft?....yea, we'll see some real shit go down if this happens...guaranteed.

tod evans
10-20-2012, 10:48 AM
I'm dead set against undeclared war.

However having lived through the "Nam era" I can say Americans did behave differently when kids where ordered to the slaughter.

Could be what's needed to get Joe Citizen off his ass, I honestly don't know...

What we have isn't working.

Barrex
10-20-2012, 11:35 AM
Can't we just outsource our soldiering to cheap third world labor?


Yeah, just like the Roman Empire did! Um... right before it collapsed..... while the "citizens" enjoyed their bread and circuses.... uh.... kinda like the U.S. today ... and... uh.... :( :(

You already are. Your officially not government owned companies are recruiting people in Croatia to fight in Iraq....