*NOT VETTED* Lawyers For Ron Paul Civil Rights (Voting Rights) Lawsuit FAQ

[RDM]

MOD: It would be advisable for ANY DELEGATE to RNC before giving ANY information identifying you to this unknown group to vett who they are. They have likely run into this concern before and have a way to address it, but Romney has hired actual pollsters to figure out which delegates support Ron in the past, and realistic caution should be used.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=MPt2nlyfmfc

All legal documents that have been filed with the Ninth Circuit Court are now available for perusal.

Here's the links:

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CER...(JPRx).pdf (http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CERTIFICATE_OF_INTERESTED_PARTIES_SACV-12-00927-DOC(JPRx).pdf)

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/1_COM...(JPRx).pdf (http://www.toolsforjustice.com/1_COMPLAINT_SACV-12-00927-DOC(JPRx).pdf)

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CER...(JPRx).pdf (http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CERTIFICATE_OF_INTERESTED_PARTIES_SACV-12-00927-DOC(JPRx).pdf)

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/4_NOT...(JPRx).pdf (http://www.toolsforjustice.com/4_NOTICE_OF_ASSIGNMENT_SACV-12-00927-DOC(JPRx).pdf)

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/5_NOT...(JPRx).pdf (http://www.toolsforjustice.com/5_NOTICE_TO_PARTIES_OF_COURT-DIRECTED_ADR_PROGRAM_SACV-12-00927-DOC(JPRx).pdf)

[Constitutional Paulicy]

This is awesome. :D

[LibertyInJeopardy]

Very happy to hear about this.

[Constitutional Paulicy]

If your as pissed as I am about how we have been disenfranchised by the behavior of the RNC, I suggest you do as much as possible to get this message out to all those delegates who can take action.

I've posted this to a dozen Facebook walls and will continue to rep this as if it were a money bomb. I hope everyone else will do the same.

[LibertyInJeopardy]

Do we know the group is legit and not gathering names? I'm thinking it's likely, but that's just based on hope and a feeling.

[parocks]

can't they put a link in the youtube description?

[Constitutional Paulicy]

bump

[sailingaway]

Do we know the group is legit and not gathering names? I'm thinking it's likely, but that's just based on hope and a feeling.

I agree. They supposedly have spoken to Doug Wead at some point, before they put this suit together, and people who are delegates going to Tampa should definitely check them out before giving info to some outside group.

[ClydeCoulter]

RDM, post this on Ben Swann's facebook page also.

[sailingaway]

RDM, post this on Ben Swann's facebook page also.

but say it isn't vetted

[ClydeCoulter]

Do we know the group is legit and not gathering names? I'm thinking it's likely, but that's just based on hope and a feeling.

Listen to around 6:00 minutes. Then do more research and get Ben Swann on it :)

[ClydeCoulter]

but say it isn't vetted

True, ask Ben Swann to investigate/vet it.

[WhistlinDave]

Bump

[RDM]

RDM, post this on Ben Swann's facebook page also.

Done

[LostNFoundNTx]

Video is a waste of my time. Does someone have a link to text that I can read in 1 minute instead of listening to it for nearly 10?

[WhistlinDave]

Video is a waste of my time. Does someone have a link to text that I can read in 1 minute instead of listening to it for nearly 10?

No, but the entire video consists of text, with a voice-over just reading the text. You can probably get through the entire thing in a few minutes by just pausing the video, reading it for yourself, and then skip ahead by 15 to 30 seconds each time you're finished reading the current slide. Actually seems like more trouble than just watching the thing though. It's only 9 1/2 minutes and I think it's pretty damn exciting.

[PatriotOne]

I just looked around their website and could not find one name, not ONE SINGLE NAME of a person who is running this organization. THAT is troublesome in itself. They are asking our delegates to give them their name and address and delegate status and yet there is no way to vet the people behind this.

If this was legit, there would be the names of the people involved who are running this. Someone else take a look and see if they can find a name to vet:

http://www.electionfraudremedy.com/

[PatriotOne]

If your as pissed as I am about how we have been disenfranchised by the behavior of the RNC, I suggest you do as much as possible to get this message out to all those delegates who can take action.

I've posted this to a dozen Facebook walls and will continue to rep this as if it were a money bomb. I hope everyone else will do the same.

Unpost to facebooks pls. We don't know who is behind this organization and they have not published their names so they can be vetted. Quite possible it is a data mining operation trying to get the names of our delegates.

[CPUd]

the whois for electionfraudremedy.com is private, they should at least make their organization public to the whois registry.

electionfraudremedy.com is also either a mirror or an alias for toolsforjustice.com. we need to confirm that they are both owned by the same organization.

Also, it is important to note that the signup for electionfraudremedy.com does NOT use https, where toolsforjustice.com does.

[PatriotOne]

the whois for electionfraudremedy.com is private, they should at least make their organization public to the whois registry.

electionfraudremedy.com is also either a mirror or an alias for toolsforjustice.com. we need to confirm that they are both owned by the same organization.

Also, it is important to note that the signup for electionfraudremedy.com does NOT use https, where toolsforjustice.com does.

Also, it is important to note that the signup for electionfraudremedy.com does NOT use https, where toolsforjustice.com does

Can you explain why that is important for those of us who aren't that internet savvy?

[RDM]

From their website, I see they are partnered with WTPN(We The People Network)http://wtpnetwork.com/about/ This website is run by a gentleman by the name of Roger Landry. I just posted a thread about a interview that Roger Landry and the band Golden State "Bombs"-(End This War) did with a TV station in Istanbul, Turkey.http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?379724-Building-Bridges-with-Golden-State-Band-and-Roger-Landry-(WTPN)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_rYCLkRSlHQ&feature=player_embedded

[CPUd]

Also, it is important to note that the signup for electionfraudremedy.com does NOT use https, where toolsforjustice.com does

Can you explain why that is important for those of us who aren't that internet savvy?
If you give a credit card/SSN over http, someone in between you and the server can read it. With https, it is encrypted.

[Feelgood]

Hmm they are local to me, I may look into them and see if I can vette them myself. Check this out...the phone number is local to me, I did a reverse look up on it.

http://www.whitepages.com/phone/1-561-747-8496

Randall E White
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

Christina H Henley
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

http://www.whitepages.com/maps/directions?log_listing_id=Telco_QDX%7C9929596a-cf71-42d2-9129-b074c391dd01&lower=0&more_info=1&parent_search_id=23111442843284208549&search_id=22111851278084341733&search_type=findperson&where=Jupiter+FL

[soulcyon]

the whois for electionfraudremedy.com is private, they should at least make their organization public to the whois registry.

electionfraudremedy.com is also either a mirror or an alias for toolsforjustice.com. we need to confirm that they are both owned by the same organization.

Also, it is important to note that the signup for electionfraudremedy.com does NOT use https, where toolsforjustice.com does.Toolsforjustice.com is the original website

electionfraudremedy.com is just a redirect domain

Their website was created over a year ago.

edit: They seem to be using the straight forward path to creating websites (least resistance and most legit) - I'll give them a call later tonight and try to check their credentials.

[bcreps85]

Hmm they are local to me, I may look into them and see if I can vette them myself. Check this out...the phone number is local to me, I did a reverse look up on it.

http://www.whitepages.com/phone/1-561-747-8496

Randall E White
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

Christina H Henley
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

http://www.whitepages.com/maps/directions?log_listing_id=Telco_QDX%7C9929596a-cf71-42d2-9129-b074c391dd01&lower=0&more_info=1&parent_search_id=23111442843284208549&search_id=22111851278084341733&search_type=findperson&where=Jupiter+FL

A quick Google search shows that Christina has given over $2k in donations to Ron Paul's campaign in '08, and Randall gave $500. FWIW

[PatriotOne]

If you give a credit card/SSN over http, someone in between you and the server can read it. With https, it is encrypted.

Does that go for other information like names, addresses, etc.?

[CPUd]

Does that go for other information like names, addresses, etc.?

Yes, any 'requests', including any information submitted via form.

What they need to do is make sure their signup links go to the domain toolsforjustice.com OR set electionfraudremedy.com up to also use https on their signup form. This is trivial to do for any experienced web developer.

[PatriotOne]

Hmm they are local to me, I may look into them and see if I can vette them myself. Check this out...the phone number is local to me, I did a reverse look up on it.

http://www.whitepages.com/phone/1-561-747-8496

Randall E White
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

Christina H Henley
(561) 747-8496
6119 Mullin St
Jupiter, FL 33458-6634

http://www.whitepages.com/maps/directions?log_listing_id=Telco_QDX%7C9929596a-cf71-42d2-9129-b074c391dd01&lower=0&more_info=1&parent_search_id=23111442843284208549&search_id=22111851278084341733&search_type=findperson&where=Jupiter+FL

Good work! Another quick Google Search also shows Randall White as President of Paralegal Service (6119 Mullin Street Jupiter, FL33458-6634) and another company called Monolith VII, Inc. in Palm Beach Gardens, FL. I haven't discovered what this other company does yet.

http://www.corporationwiki.com/Florida/Palm-Beach-Gardens/monolith-vii-inc-5722886.aspx

[PatriotOne]

Yes, any 'requests', including any information submitted via form.

What they need to do is make sure their signup links go to the domain toolsforjustice.com OR set electionfraudremedy.com up to also use https on their signup form. This is trivial to do for any experienced web developer.

Thanks for the explanation. It is a concern indeed even if this website was legit.

[RDM]

On SodaHead, I just received notice the case has been filed today in the Ronald Reagan, Ninth Circuit Court. I have the case number:
The Case Number is
SACV 12- 00927
It appears the case has been assigned to Judge Carter. As soon as I get a confirmation link to verify, I will post.

[CPUd]

Updated 6/7/2012

The legal team is Hope Henley, Jerry Davis, David Callihan, Richard Gilbert who is the actual lawyer filing the case.

UNDERSTAND THIS: THE GOP, RON PAUL, AND ROMNEY STAFF ARE AWARE OF THIS LAWSUIT, THIS HAS BEEN IN THE WORKS FOR MONTHS NOW.

http://www.dailypaul.com/238032/election-fraud-here-is-how-to-help

[PatriotOne]

It appears the case has been assigned to Judge Carter. As soon as I get a confirmation link to verify, I will post.

Please do!

[RDM]

Please do!

OK. The person that sent me the info about case being filed, told me there is no link. It was disclosed on the FaceBook page Lawyers for Ron Paul. They have a private invitation to join the site and the person I'm in correspondence with is helping out on the research team. That's the best I can tell you for now. I'm sure the case number in my previous post can be cross checked with the Ninth Circuit Court for more info.

[sailingaway]

OK. The person that sent me the info about case being filed, told me there is no link. It was disclosed on the FaceBook page Lawyers for Ron Paul. They have a private invitation to join the site and the person I'm in correspondence with is helping out on the research team. That's the best I can tell you for now. I'm sure the case number in my previous post can be cross checked with the Ninth Circuit Court for more info.

I had been tracking this for some time. I checked and there are real attorneys doing this who will have some ethical obligation -- if they say they are not connected with Romney or outing our delegates, I'd tend to believe it. The one guy, Gilbert, I think it was, I checked the Bar for ethical charges and there were none, so..... It seems on the up and up. However, I haven't spoken to them and our delegates should make sure they are comfortable before giving information. I don't know if doing this would open them to credentials challenges -- I just have some questions I'd want to ask, if it were me.

[Barrex]

Well mod might want to add that he/she is not for or against it because big red letters are pretty scary ;)
http://wtpnetwork.com/
has this initiative on their front page....
http://wtpnetwork.com/

[PatriotOne]

I'm sure the case number in my previous post can be cross checked with the Ninth Circuit Court for more info.

I've been trying to find a way on the courthouse website but can't find an area to plug in case numbers and search. Since it said the case was filed with Judge Carter, that means it would be in the Santa Anna Courthouse since that is where he works. I did find that much out :).

http://www.cacd.uscourts.gov/locations/santa-ana-courthouse

[WhistlinDave]

On SodaHead, I just received notice the case has been filed today in the Ronald Reagan, Ninth Circuit Court. I have the case number:
The Case Number is
SACV 12-00927
It appears the case has been assigned to Judge Carter. As soon as I get a confirmation link to verify, I will post.

If this was filed in the Ronald Reagan Federal Building, Ninth Circuit, does that mean this is the venue where the case will be tried? (This is in Orange County, 15 minutes from where I live. I want to go watch if I don't find a job before then.) Assuming this is legit--and it's looking more and more like it probably is--I think this is history in the making. Literally.

[PatriotOne]

I had been tracking this for some time. I checked and there are real attorneys doing this who will have some ethical obligation -- if they say they are not connected with Romney or outing our delegates, I'd tend to believe it.

The mafia have lawyers also under ethical obligations. Just sayin :cool:. I don't think they have been vetted enough yet to take the warning away. People seem to be working on it though :)

[WhistlinDave]

I've been trying to find a way on the courthouse website but can't find an area to plug in case numbers and search. Since it said the case was filed with Judge Carter, that means it would be in the Santa Anna Courthouse since that is where he works. I did find that much out :).

http://www.cacd.uscourts.gov/locations/santa-ana-courthouse

I know Orange County Superior Court has a website that allows you to search for case info, but I don't know if Federal court has the same thing. OC Superior Court is for State and Municipal matters, totally separate from Federal court obviously.

If it turns out that there is a website where we can find the docket info, there may be a lag time before it shows up online, possibly a few days and maybe longer.

I wonder how many phone calls the courthouse is going to get tomorrow to verify the details of this case? LOL

[RDM]

I've been trying to find a way on the courthouse website but can't find an area to plug in case numbers and search. Since it said the case was filed with Judge Carter, that means it would be in the Santa Anna Courthouse since that is where he works. I did find that much out :).

http://www.cacd.uscourts.gov/locations/santa-ana-courthouse

You're correct. This was what was sent to me. No further info.

Ron Paul Federal Delegates Case is filed at the Ronald Reagan
Courthouse In Santa Ana, California, The Ninth Federal Circuit. There
are approximately 200 Judges in the Ninth Circuit
The Federal Court randomly assigns the case among the approximately 200 Federal Judges within the Ninth Circuit
The Case Number is
SACV 12- 00927
The
Federal Clerk, after exhaustive review of complicated legal documents
involving hundreds of plaintiffs and defendants, has determined that all
of Plaintiffs' documents were in proper form and has accepted the case
for filing
Judge Carter is known for strict and stern compliance with all Federal Rules. Judge Carter is a no nonsense strict Judge.
I believe what we are seeking is strict compliance with all Federal Laws.
I am pleased with the appointment of Judge Carter.
The Case begins

[PatriotOne]

If it turns out that there is a website where we can find the docket info, there may be a lag time before it shows up online, possibly a few days and maybe longer.



Still searching but no luck yet on finding a place to search docket info. Curious that they are from Florida and this is being filed in California though.

[WhistlinDave]

Still searching but no luck yet on finding a place to search docket info. Curious that they are from Florida and this is being filed in California though.

I find that curious as well... Only two things come to mind:

1. Is there an attorney (for the plaintiffs) who will be substantially involved in the case who is based in OC, maybe?

2. I think the 9th Circuit has a reputation for defending civil liberties of "the little guy" or the minority even when the decision is controversial and/or unpopular with the majority. So maybe the attorneys felt like they would have the best chances of getting a fair shake with the 9th Circuit vs. some other court. ??

These are the only things I can think of.

[RDM]

Still searching but no luck yet on finding a place to search docket info. Curious that they are from Florida and this is being filed in California though.

I'm not 100%, but I think I remember reading in the past, that the Ninth Circuit Court has some of the more Conservative Judges appointed than any other Circuit Court and something about cases are much easier to file there.

[PatriotOne]

I'm not 100%, but I think I remember reading in the past, that the Ninth Circuit Court has some of the more Conservative Judges appointed than any other Circuit Court and something about cases are much easier to file there.

Conservative? California? Did I just stumble through some time travel portal :toady:. What year is it :confused:? Me scared :eek:.

hehe.......j/k.

[PatriotOne]

I find that curious as well... Only two things come to mind:

1. Is there an attorney (for the plaintiffs) who will be substantially involved in the case who is based in OC, maybe?



I think I did read at the Daily Paul it was someone other than it wasn't White or Henley from Florida that was the attorney who actually filed the c ase (still assuming there was a case filed at all...not yet satisfied this is on the up and up). So maybe that may be correct and he is from Cal.

[tangent4ronpaul]

http://www.examiner.com/article/lawyers-for-ron-paul-files-civil-rights-lawsuit

Lawyers for Ron Paul is attempting to gain some semblance of order in the 2012 GOP election cycle by filing a civil rights lawsuit against various state GOP parties and the Republican National Committee for voting rights violations and election fraud committed during the 2012 Republican Presidential primary election phase.

Stating their obvious need for legal and physical protection against the establishment and its minions in Sunday's public press release, Tools for Justice at ElectionFraudRemedy.com joined LRP in filing suit, due to the existence of “overwhelming evidence” that the voting rights of Ron Paul Republican delegates and other voters have been violated by “nearly every state GOP party and the RNC during the 2012 primary election phase, with utter and blatant disregard for any rule of law.”

With the severity and frequency of incidences escalating, the group intends for the proposed court action to somehow aid in the protection of those attending the RNC, despite what candidate they may be ultimately voting for.

Without this type of lawsuit, they feel, “the pattern of abuse is guaranteed to get worse, to the extent that the delegates who attend the national convention will be subjecting themselves to legal and/or physical peril,” for merely exercising their voting rights.

Citing the overall actions by the Republican establishment, in the race for the GOP nomination, as having “devolved into those of an organized criminal enterprise,” the group seeks a “declarative statement” by a court of law that would protect any delegate that attends the RNC from further “coercion, intimidation or threats.”

Anyone continuing to promote or participate in these types of actions against any candidate's delegate, as the suit states, should be held accountable under Title 42, Section 1971.

LRP is encouraging all Ron Paul Republican delegates to participate on the grounds that “all Paul delegates have been significantly disenfranchised and the value of each of their votes has been significantly diminished.

The lawyers and paralegals filing suit have stated these pertinent case law examples as some of the basis for the suit:

Title 42 USC Section 1971:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/1971

Title 42 USC Section 1983:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/42/1983

11 CFR 100.2 - Election (2 U.S.C. 431(1))
http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/11/100.2

47 CFR 64.803 – Definitions
http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/64.803

Morse v. Republican Party of Va. - 517 U.S. 186 (1995)
http://supreme.justia.com/cases/federal/us/517/186

In addition to this civil right lawsuit being filed on behalf of all delegates in the 2012 election, LRP also plans on filing a RICO lawsuit to address a slew of other violations that have also occurred in relation to this particular election cycle.

The included lawsuit FAQ video explains the suit in more detail, including directions as to where to go at the end of the video if you are a Ron Paul delegate or feel you have been victimized by the GOP establishment, in any way, during the 2012 nomination process.

All legal services provided for all plaintiffs in the suit are stated to be “free of charge” by Lawyers for Ron Paul.

Supporting Medium:

(Youtube): Lawyers For Ron Paul Civil Rights (Voting Rights) Lawsuit FAQ

Tools for Justice: Delegate and other victimized voter sign-up location: ElectionFraudRemedy.com

[UtahApocalypse]

Umm??? Is this from the Onion?

[fisharmor]

Umm??? Is this from the Onion?

For real... so we're expected to believe that there's a group of lawyers doing pro bono work filing suit in all 50 states, and that there's a magic pot of gold paying for all of this - when the official campaign can't even afford to be present in all 50 states?

[shane77m]

http://www.examiner.com/article/lawyers-for-ron-paul-files-civil-rights-lawsuit



.Lawyers for Ron Paul is attempting to gain some semblance of order in the 2012 GOP election cycle by filing a civil rights lawsuit against various state GOP parties and the Republican National Committee for voting rights violations and election fraud committed during the 2012 Republican Presidential primary election phase.

Stating their obvious need for legal and physical protection against the establishment and its minions in Sunday's public press release, Tools for Justice at ElectionFraudRemedy.com joined LRP in filing suit, due to the existence of “overwhelming evidence” that the voting rights of Ron Paul Republican delegates and other voters have been violated by “nearly every state GOP party and the RNC during the 2012 primary election phase, with utter and blatant disregard for any rule of law.”

[paulbot24]

When it says "attempting to gain some semblance of order in the 2012 GOP election cycle", does that mean it could impact this primary at all? Do they have enough time to make a difference this time around? If not, let's hope this is influential in keeping the caucus system alive.

[tangent4ronpaul]

//

[devil21]

Let them file the suit and run with it. There's no need for our RNC delegates to provide their information since the suit would be a class action and only needs a couple of actual plaintiffs. Not everyone harmed needs to be a plaintiff to a class action. DO NOT GIVE YOUR INFORMATION TO THEM! They don't need it if they've already filed a federal complaint. If a case really progresses in the court and then they want to know information of delegates for depositions or other discovery purposes they can ask for it at that time. Don't give them any information until the case is proven legit.

eta:
To answer an earlier post, the venue where a federal suit is filed is usually based on if the conduct alleged in the complaint occured in that district and/or if the plaintiff resides in that district. The location of the attorney's office is irrelevent except for the legal costs involved as long as the attorney is licensed to practice law in front of that court.

[devil21]

You're correct. This was what was sent to me. No further info.

Ron Paul Federal Delegates Case is filed at the Ronald Reagan
Courthouse In Santa Ana, California, The Ninth Federal Circuit. There
are approximately 200 Judges in the Ninth Circuit
The Federal Court randomly assigns the case among the approximately 200 Federal Judges within the Ninth Circuit
The Case Number is
SACV 12- 00927
The
Federal Clerk, after exhaustive review of complicated legal documents
involving hundreds of plaintiffs and defendants, has determined that all
of Plaintiffs' documents were in proper form and has accepted the case
for filing
Judge Carter is known for strict and stern compliance with all Federal Rules. Judge Carter is a no nonsense strict Judge.
I believe what we are seeking is strict compliance with all Federal Laws.
I am pleased with the appointment of Judge Carter.
The Case begins

Federal case information has to be accessed through PACER. http://www.pacer.gov/ It's not free to use and requires some hurdles to gain access. I have a login and will look up the case info to the best of my ability and update my findings.

eta: Case number format is usually more like 2012-CV-00927. I just did a case number search in the 9th district and did NOT find this case listed in PACER. That doesn't mean it's fake or hasn't been filed. It could mean it hasn't been entered into the system yet if it was filed in the last day or two. Either way, right now the federal case info website does NOT show this case as being active. Do not provide any info to anyone until this case shows up, at least. I will keep checking PACER daily to see if this case shows up and updating this thread accordingly. DO NOT SUBMIT ANY INFO TO THAT WEBSITE OR SPREAD THAT LINK AROUND UNTIL THE CASE IS VERIFIED AS EVEN EXISTING!!!!!!!! I'd also really like to know is who the listed Plaintiff is.

[devil21]

EDIT: The case has been filed and is available for review on PACER. Ignore the following warnings about participating as they were based at the time on a lack of confirmation that this is a real effort. I still have personal reservations but the case itself is a legitimate federal suit and delegates should decide for themselves if they wish to participate.

[Barrex]

@devil21 I simply can not see that any lawyer would get expelled for life from bar because conflict of interest ,he broke his duty of loyalty, ethical breach of conduct,not following clients directions in handling clients case, acting against clients best interest +100000 more.
I am against people going into this without any thinking but you went waaaay waay too far. They introduced them selfs with their real names and faces and you are (with all due respect) hiding behind your avatar without any personal info.
Personal responsibility! Your posts no matter how well intended is damaging. This is time sensitive issue and you are effectively crippling any lawsuit by depriving it of any evidence and testimony of fraud. I got a lot more to say but I dont have patience or stamina to write it down...

DECIDE FOR YOUR SELF DONT LISTEN TO ME OR devil21 OR SAILINGAWAY OR SANTA-CLAUS.



Wise men don't need advice. Fools won't take it.

[devil21]

Nevermind the fact that I don't understand half of what you wrote....

I SEARCHED THE US FEDERAL COURT RECORDS WEBSITE AND NO SUCH CASE AT THAT CASE NUMBER EXISTS IN THEIR SYSTEM! IT IS NOT THERE AND NO ONE SHOULD SUBMIT ANY PERSONAL INFO BASED ON SOME WEBSITE AND A YOUTUBE VIDEO, WHICH ANYONE CAN CREATE. WAIT UNTIL A REAL CASE IS ATTACHED TO THIS EFFORT. THERE WILL BE PLENTY OF TIME TO SUBMIT INFORMATION AS PART OF THE DISCOVERY PROCESS AFTER PRELIMINARY INJUNCTIVE RELIEF HAS BEEN RULED ON.

FACT!

Besides, you're in Croatia. What do you know about US Federal District Court Civil Procedure? Since you're investing yourself enough to spam up your sig with links to this effort, surely you know a lot about the details. Can you tell me who the Plaintiff(s) is in this filed civil action? Who is the listed Defendant(s)? With your apparent advanced knowledge of this case surely you can provide that simple information. It is public record if a case has indeed been filed.

[Barrex]

What do you know about US Federal District Court Civil Procedure?
Beside that I had to study it (like all other law systems) in my Law school nothing...but hey if it makes you feel good go ahead....

I think that you do understand what I wrote but you just dont like when people contradict you....What dont you understand? What part?
That lawyers have obligations toward their clients?
That they identified them selfs and you didnt?
What?

P.s.
Just to be clear: I dont like tone of your post.

P.p.s.
I dont like when people call others trolls either.

[devil21]

I don't understand what you're talking about with lawyers working against client's best interests, conflict of interest, duty etc etc. What does that have to do with anything? That would imply that these people are telling the truth. You're right, I don't like people contradicting me that haven't done one bit of work to verify the legitimacy of this effort, yet still wish to shill for it.

The only information we have is internet based stuff from no official sources of any sort. Any law firm taking on a huge case such as this would have put out press releases about filing the case just for the publicity! But nope, all we have is a youtube video and links to websites with hidden whois data. NOT GOOD ENOUGH. An actual filed case showing up in PACER would make a world of difference to prove the legitimacy of this case. Federal courts don't like frivolous lawsuits being filed. Until then it could be anybody behind this effort, including those who wish to find out who our delegates are. Are you really suggesting delegates that worked so hard just turn over their personal info to a website promising some lawsuit that has no evidence to even suggest it's legit? I dont care what you think about my tone btw.

Are you going to tell me who the Plaintiffs and Defendants are?

[RDM]

According to Lawyers For Ron Paul Facebook page, toolsforjustice.com will be posting ALL legal documents in .pdf format soon. Patience.

[devil21]

Hopefully that's true because the documents would be able to be cross-checked on PACER for accuracy. I'd think they'd know how to notate their own case number though. If a case was filed yesterday, it'll be in the system in the next day or two. That's all Im saying. Wait for more information showing this to be legit.

[Barrex]

I don't understand what you're talking about with lawyers working against client's best interests, conflict of interest, duty etc etc. What does that have to do with anything? That would imply that these people are telling the truth. You're right, I don't like people contradicting me that haven't done one bit of work to verify the legitimacy of this effort, yet still wish to shill for it.

The only information we have is internet based stuff from no official sources of any sort. Any law firm taking on a huge case such as this would have put out press releases about filing the case just for the publicity! But nope, all we have is a youtube video and links to websites with hidden whois data. NOT GOOD ENOUGH. An actual filed case showing up in PACER would make a world of difference to prove the legitimacy of this case. Federal courts don't like frivolous lawsuits being filed. Until then it could be anybody behind this effort, including those who wish to find out who our delegates are. Are you really suggesting delegates that worked so hard just turn over their personal info to a website promising some lawsuit that has no evidence to even suggest it's legit? I dont care what you think about my tone btw.

Are you going to tell me who the Plaintiffs and Defendants are?
I am really starting not to like you.
If you did your homework you would have found out thet they IDENTIFIED THEM SELFS. YOU DIDNT. You came here and started ordering people not to do anything with your CAPS LOCKS and huge letter formats.
Regarding "what that have to do with anything"part: If they (those lawyers) do any of those things that I listed (any many more) they would be DISBARRED.
You are WRONG when you say "only information we have is internet based stuff". Do your homework. You will find their names, contact info and a lot more. Hint (just in case): watch the vote, dailypaul etc. It is not that hard at all.


According to Lawyers For Ron Paul Facebook page, toolsforjustice.com will be posting ALL legal documents in .pdf format soon. Patience.

Thanks.


Edit: OK: lets stop.

[devil21]

I honestly don't care if you don't like me. This isn't about making friends. This is very serious business. I also don't need to identify myself to anyone. Im not the one claiming to have filed the case nor am I pushing this effort. You're changing the subject and attacking the messenger instead of providing the simple information I asked for that would help verify this effort is legit.

Who are the listed Plaintiffs and who are the listed Defendants in this filed case?

[devil21]

Also, I must have missed the info on what law firm is litigating this case. Please provide the name of the lawyer and his law firm (if applicable) so I can look that info up.

[RDM]

Also, I must have missed the info on what law firm is litigating this case. Please provide the name of the lawyer and his law firm (if applicable) so I can look that info up.

Why don't you read this thread? The info you want is available.

[WhistlinDave]

I agree with Barrex, please simmer down a little bit until we know more. Very soon we should be able to verify whether this is legitimate. In the meantime, advising others to use caution is smart, but freaking out and going overboard with large fonts and all that, and telling people they don't need to participate at all, is unnecessary.

Please stop trying to scare people into not participating in the lawsuit. Personally, if I had anything to throw in myself, I would be chomping at the bit to get justice. I would really want those responsible for cheating to be held accountable. I don't understand why, if you had a chance to bring justice to those guilty of criminal behavior, you would not add your own story to the suit.

If you had a serial killer running around killing people, and you could prove he killed 50 people, why would you be satisfied going into court and only attempting to prove he killed 2 or 3 people? If you have evidence of a lot more, then bring all of it and make sure he gets what's coming to him!

The more evidence presented, the more likely the suit will be successful. I believe the video when it says anyone who is a delegate will be protected by their participation, not put at risk.

I sincerely hope that anyone and everyone who has been disenfranchised will submit their statements once this thing is verified to be legit.

If you have a story to tell, but you hide and hope someone else will take care of this election fraud, then you are not fighting for Liberty where you might make the most impact!! This is not the time to back down and hope that others will win the fight!!

Let's all please be patient and stop scaring people until we can verify this is legit or not. I believe it probably is legit, and hopefully we'll know soon. Until then, I agree, proceed with caution and/or don't throw in your info. But don't close the door on it and walk away either. If this effort turns out to be legitimate, they will need every story and piece of evidence they can get to prove the case.

[devil21]

Neither of you must realize how bad Romney wants to know exactly which delegates are Paulites. Maybe your new join dates mean something. The RNC credentials committee would LOVE to know who they can try to fuck over. Let me say it once more. There's little to no reliable information that this case is legit in any way, shape, or form and until there's something confirming this effort is real (not YT vids, not Facebook pages, no anon emails, all of which ANYBODY can create) then no delegate should even consider submitting any personal information. Fortunately Im sure that those that worked hard to get to be RNC delegates aren't morons so I doubt this convo means anything in practice. They're not going to race to submit their personal data to a random website anyway.

I could ask what is to be gained by this lawsuit in the current election cycle but that would be too much for this thread to handle. I remember the "secret billionaire" threads. Do you Dave? No one has even proven there is a lawsuit yet!!! My bs alarm is going off. Going to wait for the next PACER update. If that's a real case number then it will be on the system in a day or so. I'll be happy to support it if it shows up. We shall see.

[soulcyon]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/lawyers-for-ron-paul-filing-suit-against-the-rnc

Vetted?

[tod evans]

http://www.buzzfeed.com/rosiegray/lawyers-for-ron-paul-filing-suit-against-the-rnc

Vetted?

devil21 is right.....

Until this actually shows up on Pacer it's just more internet talk.

An internet "News" feed isn't Pacer...

[Gary W Trott]

devil21 is right.....

Until this actually shows up on Pacer it's just more internet talk.

An internet "News" feed isn't Pacer...
I don't understand why copies of the documents submitted to the court have not already been posted on the internet. Maybe they have and I just missed them and if so I apologize for adding to the confusion.

[UtahApocalypse]

My question for Barrex and those pushing to get OUR delegate information is the following:

Case Number
Law Firm
Lawyer that filed case
Plaintiffs
Defendants

These ALL would be required to have actually filed a Federal Case.

My final question: When No case shows up on the PACER system what will the excuse be?

[RDM]

Also, I must have missed the info on what law firm is litigating this case. Please provide the name of the lawyer and his law firm (if applicable) so I can look that info up.

- Address: Richard Gilbert & Associates, 950 W 17th St Ste C D & E, Santa Ana, CA 92706
- Law School: Western State Univ
- Date of State Bar Admission: 5/31/1979
- Telephone: (714) 667-1038

[PatriotOne]

- Address: Richard Gilbert & Associates, 950 W 17th St Ste C D & E, Santa Ana, CA 92706
- Law School: Western State Univ
- Date of State Bar Admission: 5/31/1979
- Telephone: (714) 667-1038

Wish I could find a picture of him. There's another Richard Gilbert & Associates in London (which is disturbing to me for many reasons) who seems to be involved in fraudulent scamming:

Hello, I am Miss Young. I received the following email. It is a socalled "Advance Fee Fraud" letter, where I am promised millions for my assistance. These stories are all lies, and if I respond, sooner or later I will be asked to pay a fee. If I pay, another fee will quickly come up, and it will continue that way until I give up or run out of money. I will never see the millions, because they never existed.

Date: Mon 25 Aug 2008 06 39 59 -0500 PET
Subject: This is the third and final notice to you..
From: "RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES" <richardgilbert_chambers@yahoo.co.uk>
To: undisclosed-recipients ;




RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES
Phone:+44 702 302 1574
E-mail: richardgilbert_chambers@hotmail.com
Address:33 Bedford Row
London WC1R 4JH, England.

PARTNER MANAGING
RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES
LONDON - UK.

Attention:

On behalf of the Trustees and Executor of the estate of Late Engr.Jürge
Krügger. I once again try to notify you as my earlier letter was returned
undelivered. I wish to notify you that late Engr. Jürge Krügger made you a
beneficiary to his WILL. He left the sum of Thirty Million, One Hundred
Thousand Dollars (USD$30,100.000.00) to you in the Codicil and last
testament to his WILL.This may sound strange and unbelievable to you, but
it is real and true. Being a widely travelled man, he must have been in
contact with you in the past or simply you were nominated to him by one of
his numerous friends abroad who wished you good. Engr. Jürge Krügger until
his death was a member of the Helicopter Society and the Institute of
Electronic & Electrical Engineers.According to him this money is to
support your humanitarian activities and to help the poor and the needy in
our society.

Please if I reach you as I am hopeful, endeavor to get back to me as soon
as possible to enable me conclude my job. I hope to hear from you in no
distant time. Note: You are advise to contact me with my personal email
address: richardgilbert_chambers@hotmail.com

I await your prompt response.

Yours in Service,
BARRISTER RICHARD GILBERT.
PRINCIPAL PARTNERS: Barrister Aidan Walsh Esq, Markus Wolfgang, Mr.
John Marvey Esq, Mr. Jerry Smith Esq.

If you received a similar letter, please ignore it. Do not answer it. If you do, you will end up on more of the mailing lists used by the criminals behind this fraud. Read more....

http://419.bittenus.com/8/8/richardgilbertassociates.html

[RDM]

Wish I could find a picture of him. There's another Richard Gilbert & Associates in London (which is disturbing to me for many reasons) who seems to be involved in fraudulent scamming:

Hello, I am Miss Young. I received the following email. It is a socalled "Advance Fee Fraud" letter, where I am promised millions for my assistance. These stories are all lies, and if I respond, sooner or later I will be asked to pay a fee. If I pay, another fee will quickly come up, and it will continue that way until I give up or run out of money. I will never see the millions, because they never existed.

Date: Mon 25 Aug 2008 06 39 59 -0500 PET
Subject: This is the third and final notice to you..
From: "RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES" <richardgilbert_chambers@yahoo.co.uk>
To: undisclosed-recipients ;




RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES
Phone:+44 702 302 1574
E-mail: richardgilbert_chambers@hotmail.com
Address:33 Bedford Row
London WC1R 4JH, England.

PARTNER MANAGING
RICHARD GILBERT & ASSOCIATES
LONDON - UK.

Attention:

On behalf of the Trustees and Executor of the estate of Late Engr.Jürge
Krügger. I once again try to notify you as my earlier letter was returned
undelivered. I wish to notify you that late Engr. Jürge Krügger made you a
beneficiary to his WILL. He left the sum of Thirty Million, One Hundred
Thousand Dollars (USD$30,100.000.00) to you in the Codicil and last
testament to his WILL.This may sound strange and unbelievable to you, but
it is real and true. Being a widely travelled man, he must have been in
contact with you in the past or simply you were nominated to him by one of
his numerous friends abroad who wished you good. Engr. Jürge Krügger until
his death was a member of the Helicopter Society and the Institute of
Electronic & Electrical Engineers.According to him this money is to
support your humanitarian activities and to help the poor and the needy in
our society.

Please if I reach you as I am hopeful, endeavor to get back to me as soon
as possible to enable me conclude my job. I hope to hear from you in no
distant time. Note: You are advise to contact me with my personal email
address: richardgilbert_chambers@hotmail.com

I await your prompt response.

Yours in Service,
BARRISTER RICHARD GILBERT.
PRINCIPAL PARTNERS: Barrister Aidan Walsh Esq, Markus Wolfgang, Mr.
John Marvey Esq, Mr. Jerry Smith Esq.

If you received a similar letter, please ignore it. Do not answer it. If you do, you will end up on more of the mailing lists used by the criminals behind this fraud. Read more....

http://419.bittenus.com/8/8/richardgilbertassociates.html


Well, how about you call the one in CA that is handling the case and vet his ass, instead of scouring the whole freaking internet looking for every Richard Gilbert in the world and wasting people's time with your redundant posts.

[RDM]

ALL legal documents are available now for perusal. http://www.dailypaul.com/239370/lawyers-for-ron-paul-civil-rights-voting-rights-lawsuit-faq-video

[PatriotOne]

Well, how about you call the one in CA that is handling the case and vet his ass, instead of scouring the whole freaking internet looking for every Richard Gilbert in the world and wasting people's time with your redundant posts.

Good idea! I hear snakes in the grass always admit they are snakes in the grass when asked. Why didn't I think of that? Why do you have such a problem with people trying to vet this guy? It's not like we don't have a boat load of psyops (gov and otherwise) who have infiltrated the grassroots. If this group wants our delegate info, they better damn well expect people to look them over with a magnifying glass. Romney & Co. wants to know who are delegates are. You think they wouldn't use some lawyer to get that info? Time for you to stop being so naive to think that this isn't a possibility :rolleyes:.

[tod evans]

ALL legal documents are available now for perusal. http://www.dailypaul.com/239370/lawyers-for-ron-paul-civil-rights-voting-rights-lawsuit-faq-video

Thanks man!

Here's links;

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CERTIFICATE_OF_INTERESTED_PARTIES_SACV-12-00927-DOC%28JPRx%29.pdf

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/1_COMPLAINT_SACV-12-00927-DOC%28JPRx%29.pdf

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/3_CERTIFICATE_OF_INTERESTED_PARTIES_SACV-12-00927-DOC%28JPRx%29.pdf

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/4_NOTICE_OF_ASSIGNMENT_SACV-12-00927-DOC%28JPRx%29.pdf

http://www.toolsforjustice.com/5_NOTICE_TO_PARTIES_OF_COURT-DIRECTED_ADR_PROGRAM_SACV-12-00927-DOC%28JPRx%29.pdf

These all look above board for those who are interested...The mandatory ADR (Alternative Dispute Resolution) usually turns out to be a time wasting PITA....

[Barrex]

I also don't need to identify myself to anyone. You're changing the subject and attacking the messenger instead of providing the simple information I asked for that would help verify this effort is legit.

Who are the listed Plaintiffs and who are the listed Defendants in this filed case?
Your answer:


Why don't you read this thread? The info you want is available.

But it is easier to stay in shadows and spit venom at people. It is easier scream DONT DO IT than find all info that was available. To paraphrase famous economy quote: It is no shame not to be educated in matters of law and this lawsuit, it is after all very specific topic, but it is great shame be uneducated in this matter and try to force your FALSE opinion down other peoples throats.
If you wanted to find that info you could have. You choose to remain ignorant and to insult people who pointed at your mistakes (what could I know; our join dates insinuating what we are Mitts saboteurs ffs.) You are demanding PACER number and then you admit that they couldnt get that number in such short amount of time.... Any other insults you want to throw at me and others who dont bow to you?


My question for Barrex and those pushing to get OUR delegate information is the following:

Case Number
Law Firm
Lawyer that filed case
Plaintiffs
Defendants

These ALL would be required to have actually filed a Federal Case.

My final question: When No case shows up on the PACER system what will the excuse be?
All that information is AVAILABLE. You just needed to investigate a little. I am in Croatia and I found it all in 3 minutes.

My final question: When case shows up on the PACER system what will the excuse be?

My post final question: Will those people who damaged this effort with their witch hunts and false alarms correct their mistakes and damage they have done (not pointed at you Utah)?

People choose easy way: Sit on their chairs and spit venom at others without any fact checking or work done. Final piece of the puzzle: Armed by just 2 things: their ignorance and refusal to do things for them selfs and almost fanatical devotion to the.....: (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uprjmoSMJ-o)


Luckily now we got summa summarum:


ALL legal documents are available now for perusal. http://www.dailypaul.com/239370/lawyers-for-ron-paul-civil-rights-voting-rights-lawsuit-faq-video

[WhistlinDave]

I understand all the caution.

What I don't understand is people saying things like


Let them file the suit and run with it. There's no need for our RNC delegates to provide their information since the suit would be a class action and only needs a couple of actual plaintiffs. Not everyone harmed needs to be a plaintiff to a class action. DO NOT GIVE YOUR INFORMATION TO THEM! They don't need it if they've already filed a federal complaint. If a case really progresses in the court and then they want to know information of delegates for depositions or other discovery purposes they can ask for it at that time. Don't give them any information until the case is proven legit.

Why not just throw in the towel now and concede the nomination to Romney? Everyone has been bitching for months about all the cheating, and about the fact that almost no one in the MSM wants to cover any of it, and now here is your chance to actually do something about it--ALL OF IT--and some people think no one should make any noise? Did I just get dumped into some Bizarro dimension, a parallel Earth? What is going on?

Saying "Don't give them any information until the case if proven legit" is entirely reasonable. The rest of that garbage isn't, not in my opinion. That's like showing up to a baseball game with only one or two players and expecting to win. (Yes I know that would be a forfeit, not the point.)

Again, assuming this turns out to be legitimate--and my mind is made up but I'm not going to twist anyone's arm--this is the time for people to stand up and fight for justice, in the name of Liberty. If you have a story to tell, hold all those cheating bastards accountable! And go buy yourself a firearm if it makes you feel safer. Go buy one for the wife too and learn how to use them.

Just my opinion.

[bcreps85]

Reading the 80+ page document now, good stuff.

[devil21]

Here's the link for the lawyer's website. Appears legit. I can't review the documents right now but Ill check them out later tonite and see if PACER has updated.

http://www.gilbertandmarlowe.com/dynamicattorneys.htm

I am curious how a single attorney is planning on handling a case of this size and scope though. If it's legit I sure hope he's thought that far ahead.

[Barrex]

Reading the 80+ page document now, good stuff.

Most of it is names and RNC rules....

[bcreps85]

Most of it is names and RNC rules....

Observant, you are :) I mostly skipped those parts and just read the "meat" of it. Although it made many of the allegations that I have been hoping would be made, it is not asking for any form of punishment for the perpetrators. It definitely seems to be focusing on unbinding and helping to seat as many delegates as possible. I suspect that the second lawsuit they mentioned they will be filing, the RICO one, will be the one that goes after punishment for these crimes. Logically it seems to make sense to separate them I guess.

[soulcyon]

After reading a couple pages, they seem legit. I wish I was more versed on the legal-speak in some of these documents.

[RDM]

This was just posted on the Lawyers for Ron Paul facebook page. It appears they are looking for process servers in all states in all counties and districts. Here's the post:
URGENT ACTION ITEM FOR GROUP MEMBERS. If you type in Process Servers in a FB Search, tons of Process Server pages come up. I am banned from making public posts, PLEASE GO LIKE THOSE PAGES AND POST THIS:

URGENT: PATRIOT PROCESS SERVERS NEEDED IMMEDIATELY! No matter who you vote for, election fraud affects everyone. A Federal Class Action Civil/Voting Rights Lawsuit was filed on 06/11/12, to view this case, you can go to www.electionfraudremedy.com (http://www.electionfraudremedy.com) If you have witnessed or experienced election fraud or know somebody who has, please also send them to this site to give their testimony. We have a legal team working free of charge to address this most critical issue.

We are in need of PROCESS SERVERS in every state and territory to serve papers to each State Republican Party AND each State Republican Party Chairman.
All defendants in the lawsuit need to be served as soon as possible. Servers CANNOT be party to the lawsuit. If you want to help in this effort, please send an email with your name, state, and contact information and say you want to help get the documents printed and served, to: support@toolsforjustice.com (Type ‘Process Server’ and the name of your state in the subject line.) Thank you!

[tod evans]

Observant, you are :) I mostly skipped those parts and just read the "meat" of it. Although it made many of the allegations that I have been hoping would be made, it is not asking for any form of punishment for the perpetrators. It definitely seems to be focusing on unbinding and helping to seat as many delegates as possible. I suspect that the second lawsuit they mentioned they will be filing, the RICO one, will be the one that goes after punishment for these crimes. Logically it seems to make sense to separate them I guess.

Civil is civil..........RICO is criminal....

Two completely different venues..

[devil21]

The case is up on PACER now! I can support the legal effort now that I have seen that there is actually a filed case and this appears to be legit. Im still not sure why every delegate would need to provide their personal information to this lawyer and Im still a little concerned about having such an important "database" in the hands on one person but each delegate should make their own decision if they want to participate. Either way, I'm glad to see the case is showing up and can now support the effort behind it.

Here's what PACER is showing so far (pertinent text):
8:12-cv-00927-DOC-JPR Delegates to the Republican National Convention et al v. Republican National Committee et al
David O. Carter, presiding
Jean P Rosenbluth, referral
Date filed: 06/11/2012
Date of last filing: 06/11/2012

Cause: 28:1343 Violation of Civil Rights

The Plaintiff and Defendants list is long and no point in publishing delegate names here. Priebus himself is a defendant :)

Docket report:
Date Filed # Docket Text
06/11/2012 1 COMPLAINT against all Defendants. Case assigned to Judge David O. Carter for all further proceedings. Discovery referred to Magistrate Judge Jean P. Rosenbluth.(Filing fee $350 Paid). Filed by all Plaintiffs.(lwag) (Additional attachment(s) added on 6/12/2012: # 1 Part 2) (lwag). (Entered: 06/12/2012)
06/11/2012 2 CERTIFICATION and Notice of Interested Parties filed by all Plaintiffs. (lwag) (lwag). (Entered: 06/12/2012)
06/11/2012 3 NOTICE TO PARTIES OF COURT-DIRECTED ADR PROGRAM filed.(lwag) (Entered: 06/12/2012)
06/11/2012 21 DAY Summons Issued re Complaint - (Discovery) 1 as to all Defendants. (lwag) (Entered: 06/12/2012)


Regarding process servers, process servers should be "disinterested" parties. In other words, the plaintiffs (any RNC delegate) shouldn't do service themselves. They will definitely need help getting service done in the 21 day time limit! Anybody that can participate should do it and enjoy showing up at the state RNC hq office (usually in the capital city of the state) with a copy of the suit in hand. :) Also, there are rules to service that must be followed for service to be valid. I assume the lawyer will brief anybody that volunteers.

[blamx8]

Apparently not every state has plaintiffs yet. Even if there are occurrences of fraud in each state there should be residents of the state named as plaintiffs because it gives standing in that state.

[Gary W Trott]

ALL legal documents are available now for perusal. http://www.dailypaul.com/239370/lawyers-for-ron-paul-civil-rights-voting-rights-lawsuit-faq-video
Thank you.

[Just Another Genius]

Just my opinion, but I don't think this lawyer group is in this for the delegates best interest, and here is why I feel this way. This group seems to want to put most of the serious complaints on the back burner and not resolve them before the convention, while bringing the BOUND subject to the for front, where they want a judge to decide before the convention whether or not these delegates are legally bound or not. Which makes this look like a trap to me. If this judge rules that the delegates are bound, when the delegates actually weren't, then now all these delegates will be going in to the convention with a ruling against them saying they are now bound which the RNC could use AGAINST these delegates if these delegates chose to ignore this judges order.

Where as the way it stands now, the RNC and their legal team have already ruled that these delegates are UNBOUND, this new case could get the RNC off the hook if the judge rules against the delegates which would be my prediction and the reason I feel this way is because this lawyer group seems to be only concerned about resolving the BOUND DELEGATE question before the convention and not these more serious election fraud charges until later after the convention. If this group isn't legit this would be a nice way to get a court ruling AGAINST THE DELEGATES before the convention stating they must vote for whom their bound to, all while silencing the other charges prior to the convention so they can't be brought up before the convention as all the RNC will have to say is they can't discuss these election fraud charges as these charges are under litigation. Do you see what I'm saying. If you do then you need to warn those on the Daily Paul as I'm banned from posting there.

[WhistlinDave]

Just my opinion, but I don't think this lawyer group is in this for the delegates best interest, and here is why I feel this way. This group seems to want to put most of the serious complaints on the back burner and not resolve them before the convention, while bringing the BOUND subject to the for front, where they want a judge to decide before the convention whether or not these delegates are legally bound or not. Which makes this look like a trap to me. If this judge rules that the delegates are bound, when the delegates actually weren't, then now all these delegates will be going in to the convention with a ruling against them saying they are now bound which the RNC could use AGAINST these delegates if these delegates chose to ignore this judges order.

Where as the way it stands now, the RNC and their legal team have already ruled that these delegates are UNBOUND, this new case could get the RNC off the hook if the judge rules against the delegates which would be my prediction and the reason I feel this way is because this lawyer group seems to be only concerned about resolving the BOUND DELEGATE question before the convention and not these more serious election fraud charges until later after the convention. If this group isn't legit this would be a nice way to get a court ruling AGAINST THE DELEGATES before the convention stating they must vote for whom their bound to, all while silencing the other charges prior to the convention so they can't be brought up before the convention as all the RNC will have to say is they can't discuss these election fraud charges as these charges are under litigation. Do you see what I'm saying. If you do then you need to warn those on the Daily Paul as I'm banned from posting there.

Wrong. Absolutely wrong. The RNC did not already rule these delegates are unbound. There is a legal opinion from 2008 from a RNC lawyer that appears to say delegates may vote their conscience, but that does not change the fact that GOP officials in several states have threatened and intimidated Ron Paul delegates in 2012, telling them they will be thrown out of the national convention if they attempt to abstain or vote against the Romney vote they are "bound" to. The RNC's position, with Ron Paul delegates who are "bound" to vote for some other candidate is, the delegates are "bound." Period.

In some states they tried to force Ron Paul supporters to sign affidavits agreeing that they will vote how they are "bound" to vote, and if they don't, then they will be removed from the National convention AND will be subject to criminal and civil penalties!! Some delegates who were elected fair and square were unseated and replaced when they refused to sign these affidavits!

The RNC most definitely has NOT said delegates this year are unbound.

If the judge rules against the plaintiffs (the good guys), and says, "Well in spite of this overwhelming evidence of election fraud, I just don't interpret this Federal statute to apply to your primaries, and sorry, but you have to vote for whoever the RNC tells you to," in other words, if the judge says "yes the delegates are BOUND," then NOTHING CHANGES.

On the other hand, if he says, "Yes the delegates are unbound," then that is a huge difference and a good one.

So we truly have nothing to lose from this lawsuit and everything to gain.

And if you think the GOP would want to deliberately shine a spotlight in a Federal courtroom on all the election fraud that has occurred, in the hopes they might get a legal ruling to officially bind all the delegates when they already hold all the control to bind the delegates, while risking that there could be a ruling that will UNBIND all the delegates... Then you are either very, very misinformed, or you are not really a Ron Paul supporter and you are trying to fool people into not participating. (And if it's the latter, I can't even say "nice try" because it wasn't even close.)

[devil21]

It's a risk to take any case to court, particularly federal, because of the possible wide-reaching future implications of a decision. This is why nearly all federal lawsuits (95%+) are settled prior to trial. Parties (particularly the likely losers) don't want to establish case law if at all possible. However, this is the 9th district and even if the judge in this case rules in favor of either side, that ruling will not apply to every other district in the US as future precedent. It would only apply to that district and even then, district rulings are rarely used as case law for setting precedent. A decision would pretty much affect this case ONLY. Also, it is very likely that if the Plaintiff's win at the district level that the RNC would appeal to the Federal Appeals court and request a stay (not enforcing district court ruling) until the appeal is heard. The convention would be long over by the time the Appeals court heard it. The election itself would likely be over by then too. Where case law becomes established as precedent is generally when the Appeals court and SCOTUS make rulings on appeals.

[Just Another Genius]

It states right in the video, What negative consequences might happen if we lose the lawsuit, their answer IN GENERAL, NONE.

The key words are IN GENERAL, which these lawyers refused to explain, my guess because they don't consider it important that this ruling could be used against any delegate who wishes to vote for someone other than the candidate their bound to. But will losing this lawsuit cost these delegates money or counter lawsuits, no, so the lawyers answer to this question was IN GENERAL NONE. Any delegate who joined this lawsuit is free to call these lawyers and ask if I'm wrong. I don't believe I am.

And as for the delegates who refused to sign these bound statements as they were requested and loss their seats because of it, well that's what they get for listening to the likes of Doug Wead and others who told them not to sign, these delegates should have listened to me and my post on the Daily Paul which told these delegates to have an under age person fill out and sign the delegates name to these junk mail requests, that way they would still have their convention seats and would still be able to vote for whomever they choose, because they could have proven to the RNC that the writing and signature on the bound statement wasn't theirs and therefor was invalid. But that's what you get when you ignore the genius in the room and instead listen to con artist.

[Barrex]

There is not one single project or action on this forum that wasnt spit on and went on without someone trying to sabotage it. This one is no exception. First "we dont know these people"...well if anyone tried to find out who they are they would find out who they are. Then it was there is no PACER number. There is PACER number. Now there is "question" how will this all end?.....and so on and so on... No matter what evidence, what reassurance, who gives it there will always be people who will actively try to sabotage any project that is presented on this forum. Why? I dont know. I can only guess. This is one of the reasons why there is no successful project tied with this forum. Sad and discouraging.

[RDM]

There is not one single project or action on this forum that wasnt spit on and went on without someone trying to sabotage it. This one is no exception. First "we dont know these people"...well if anyone tried to find out who they are they would find out who they are. Then it was there is no PACER number. There is PACER number. Now there is "question" how will this all end?.....and so on and so on... No matter what evidence, what reassurance, who gives it there will always be people who will actively try to sabotage any project that is presented on this forum. Why? I dont know. I can only guess. This is one of the reasons why there is no successful project tied with this forum. Sad and discouraging.

I've said it in the past and I'll say it again. RPF is probably about 80% to blame for why Ron Paul pretty much lost. Too much infighting and too many egos getting in the way of progress. Instead of being strength in numbers, this forum was pretty much a army of sabotage.

[soulcyon]

so why is this still "NOT VETTED"?

:\

[devil21]

There is not one single project or action on this forum that wasnt spit on and went on without someone trying to sabotage it. This one is no exception. First "we dont know these people"...well if anyone tried to find out who they are they would find out who they are. Then it was there is no PACER number. There is PACER number. Now there is "question" how will this all end?.....and so on and so on... No matter what evidence, what reassurance, who gives it there will always be people who will actively try to sabotage any project that is presented on this forum. Why? I dont know. I can only guess. This is one of the reasons why there is no successful project tied with this forum. Sad and discouraging.

Naaa you're right....there was no blimp, no moneybombs, no Rally for the Republic, no delegate convention coordination, no project on this forum has ever succeeded. /sarcasm

Don't be so melodramatic just because not everyone 100% blindly supports whatever you support. Every effort had voices of dissent and concern so get used to it. If an effort is worthwhile then the movement as a whole will get behind it. This has been shown over and over. If it fails then it's due to a failure of the idea (Ron Paul Racing, ie), not a few people that voice concerns.

[sailingaway]

so why is this still "NOT VETTED"?

:\

has anyone of authority said it is ok? It is intended as 'use at your own risk' because a delegate has to check it out. the minimal checking I did, Gilbert's name with the bar association, came up clean. But does a delegate jeapardize himself with credentials committee if he does this? I have no clue. Why they are not going for penalties is a question, if they aren't, but I'm not looking into it in that depth. Each person simply has to satisfy themselves, the forum is neither vouching for, nor trashing this. I hope it is on the up and up, from what I know I personally think it is in good faith, but delegates are the ones who have to be satisfied.

[Barrex]

Naaa you're right....there was no blimp, no moneybombs, no Rally for the Republic, no delegate convention coordination, no project on this forum has ever succeeded. /sarcasm

Don't be so melodramatic just because not everyone 100% blindly supports whatever you support. Every effort had voices of dissent and concern so get used to it. If an effort is worthwhile then the movement as a whole will get behind it. This has been shown over and over. If it fails then it's due to a failure of the idea (Ron Paul Racing, ie), not a few people that voice concerns.

Yeeaaaa riiighttt.....all those things are done thanks to this forum /sarcasm
Just for the record on money-bomb worked about (lets be generous....waaayyy too generous) 40 people. Most work was done by 2-3. This forum didnt
Rally for the Republic??? This forum organized it? No. That was Ron Paul.
Blimp? For this one I am not 100% sure but pretty sure that is not because RPF.

And you miss the point.
I am not melodramatic. I dont ask anyone to support what I support. I am just sad because if you dont support one project you dont have to sabotage it .... and there is always at least one person that is actively opposing any single project that anyone tried to start. From phone from home, sign waving, Paulfestival, this lawsuit and so on and so on....

If you dont like it dont be a part of it. Simple. You dont have to.... ahhh... Sad sad sad situation.


(you as in x person)

[Feelgood]

Guys I have not had a chance to yet, because I have been slammed at work. These people are about 15 miles from where I live, and I plan to meet them in person, and see what is up. I am no lawyer, however I am a damn good judge of character. :D I will let you know what I learn, if anything.

[soulcyon]

has anyone of authority said it is ok? It is intended as 'use at your own risk' because a delegate has to check it out. the minimal checking I did, Gilbert's name with the bar association, came up clean. But does a delegate jeapardize himself with credentials committee if he does this? I have no clue. Why they are not going for penalties is a question, if they aren't, but I'm not looking into it in that depth. Each person simply has to satisfy themselves, the forum is neither vouching for, nor trashing this. I hope it is on the up and up, from what I know I personally think it is in good faith, but delegates are the ones who have to be satisfied.I guess the documents with legitimate stamps means nothing, even though they come from the real "authority". I'm sure its illegal to forge those documents, so they wouldn't risk posting them to the public. As for your delegates contention, I do agree as well.

+rep @ vetting anything doesn't require an authority to verify - you can research the truth yourself..

[devil21]

Yeeaaaa riiighttt.....all those things are done thanks to this forum /sarcasm
Just for the record on money-bomb worked about (lets be generous....waaayyy too generous) 40 people. Most work was done by 2-3. This forum didnt
Rally for the Republic??? This forum organized it? No. That was Ron Paul.
Blimp? For this one I am not 100% sure but pretty sure that is not because RPF.

And you miss the point.
I am not melodramatic. I dont ask anyone to support what I support. I am just sad because if you dont support one project you dont have to sabotage it .... and there is always at least one person that is actively opposing any single project that anyone tried to start. From phone from home, sign waving, Paulfestival, this lawsuit and so on and so on....

If you dont like it dont be a part of it. Simple. You dont have to.... ahhh... Sad sad sad situation.


(you as in x person)

The moneybombs, Rally, blimp,etc had at least as much to with do RPF on development as this lawsuit does and in the case of the moneybomb and blimp, were purely RPF products. You equate voicing concern with "sabotage" and that's not fair or accurate. It's been said many times that this movement is like herding cats. You won't get everyone to go along with everything and since we're generally smart people we'll see where the potential pitfalls are and call them out. I don't mind if you push this effort till you're blue in the face. I mind it when you suggest anyone that isn't on board with it as wholly as you are, or at all, is a saboteur.


Guys I have not had a chance to yet, because I have been slammed at work. These people are about 15 miles from where I live, and I plan to meet them in person, and see what is up. I am no lawyer, however I am a damn good judge of character. :D I will let you know what I learn, if anything.

Let us know what you find out. Keep in mind that the lawyer that filed the case is in California though.

[Barrex]

First it was: We dont know these people.
Because you didnt even try to spend few min to find out who they were.
Then it was "they didnt provide any information".
WRONG: They did people were just to lazy to look it up.
"We dont know if case is legit dont cooperate."
You dont know because you didnt try to find out. It was everything there if you wanted to find it out.
Then there is no "PACER" number.
Well now there is. They couldnt speed bureaucrats.
Now even when they identified them selfs, provided all info, all paperwork, PACER number is there too, when they are verified Ron Paul supporters, real Lawyers... Now when they did everything in they power to do right thing and do it the right way (and lets forget about fact that any lawyer who would try to pull out what you guys are suggesting that might be going on would be disbarred) ....well now "It's a risk to take any case to court". WOW. Of course it is. Every single one. You miss 100% of chances you dont take.

This is same scenario that happens in every grassroots action thread. (Since you keep mentioning money bomb: during money bomb we had guy who refused to take 1 min to educate him self stalking us and screaming on Facebook and forums "THIS IS FRAUD! DONT DONATE!!!". Sounds familiar? I am not going into further details. If you want to find out there is google and there is search function.) This kind of attitude is not helping. If you are going to do what you do (ok not sabotage...what then?) at least you could educate your self in matter at hand before you start (not sabotaging what then?) doing what you do.

Rhetorical question: What do you call persons who are actively trying to stop other people from participating in initiative?

(you as in x person)

Like you said "Besides, you're in Croatia." What do I know....


@Feelgood Good to hear.

[devil21]

Barrex, what is your personal investment in this lawsuit? You seem to be taking things a little too personally to just be an interested outside viewer, not even an American. Im curious why you're pushing so hard. Are you personally involved in this project in any way?

But on topic, yeah like I said, potential pitfalls and concerns will be pointed out and myself and others have done a good job of doing it in this thread and others. It's called the vetting process. Or are you suggesting everyone just take your word for it from the word GO?



This is same scenario that happens in every grassroots action thread. (Since you keep mentioning money bomb: during money bomb we had guy who refused to take 1 min to educate him self stalking us and screaming on Facebook and forums "THIS IS FRAUD! DONT DONATE!!!". Sounds familiar? I am not going into further details. If you want to find out there is google and there is search function.) This kind of attitude is not helping. If you are going to do what you do (ok not sabotage...what then?) at least you could educate your self in matter at hand before you start (not sabotaging what then?) doing what you do.

That is that person's right to do so. And maybe you missed it but most everyone agreed that it was legit and his concerns were ignored. The moneybomb idea didn't fail because it was a good idea that stood on its own merits. All projects face the same dynamics. If something fails, it's not because of a lone voice. It fails because it's not a good idea and most people see it as such. Not sure if this project is good or bad. That will be decided the same way every other project is.

[RDM]

UPDATE!!!

Just listened in on conference call pertaining to the lawsuit with Richard Gilbert (Attorney) and one other attorney working on the case (sorry forgot name). Bare with me, for I am going to paraphrase the highlights. The call was recorded and when they provide link for recorded call, I will provide the link. So here goes:

First, I would like to say, I am personally impressed with what I heard tonight and the professionalism displayed by the two lawyers on the call. There were a few very important questions asked by listeners of the call (me being one of them, thank you) and they were addressed very well IMO.

First question that was asked concerning Doug Weads comment that the courts will not hear the case. Mr. Gilbert clearly said this comment was completely "off base" and then he proceeded to describe the judge who is handling the case (Judge Carter). He said Judge Carter is a former Marine and a straight up by the book Judge who does not skirt around the law. Mr. Gilbert said the evidence that they have compiled to date along with precidented rulings from previous cases involving likewise cases has given him without a shadow of doubt this case will move forward and be ruled upon before the convention.

The next question (from me) was: If the judge rules in our favor that ALL delegates are unbound, can the RNC appeal the case and extend it beyond the convention to disrupt the ruling. Mr. Gilbert stated with confidence that knowing Judge Carter's reputation he will rule on this case in a timely manner allowing enough time for our lawyers to take the case to a Appellate Court or State Supreme Court if necessary and have the case heard in plenty of time before the convention. The ultimate goal of the case is to have it ruled that at the time of the convention, Romney, Gingrich, Santorum and Ron Paul will have NO Bound delegates and every candidate will walk in with a ZERO count to face delegates that will be totally FREE to vote their conscience (for any candidate).

Let me clarify a statement that Attorney Gilbert made concerning this ruling. He is not strictly doing this (in favor) of Ron Paul even though he is 110% for Ron Paul, but doing this for ALL delegates. Whether they are a Santorum delegate or a Gingrich delegate, a favor in a unbound ruling would allow even those delegates if they are bound to Santorum or Gingrich to vote their conscience (even if they wish to cast their vote for Romney). He also made a comment that he even feels Ron Paul would approve this statement and by making that clear upfront, it may persuade those delegates to Gingrich, Santorum and even Romney to actually "see the light" of the Romney corruption and get behind Ron Paul and see this lawsuit was all about preserving our freedoms and bringing back integrity in the voting process.

Also, some other points that were made. He stated there is a team of upwards 60 lawyers all working for FREE and devoting many hours in preparing this case and that's not counting the score of paralegals and other volunteers. They have been overwhelmed with 100's upon 100's of people coming forward with numerous evidence of fraud and irregularities and this team of lawyers have all stated in their professional experience that this case could be monumental and could possibly shame Romney right out of the race.

I'm sure I missed a few points that were covered, but when you listen to the recorded call, I truly believe many of you will be impressed. I will update as soon as I get the link.

[RDM]

As promised, Here is the link: http://www.talkshoe.com/talkshoe/web/audioPop.jsp?episodeId=635553&cmd=apop

[bcreps85]

UPDATE!!!

Just listened in on conference call pertaining to the lawsuit with Richard Gilbert (Attorney) and one other attorney working on the case (sorry forgot name). Bare with me, for I am going to paraphrase the highlights. The call was recorded and when they provide link for recorded call, I will provide the link. So here goes:

First, I would like to say, I am personally impressed with what I heard tonight and the professionalism displayed by the two lawyers on the call. There were a few very important questions asked by listeners of the call (me being one of them, thank you) and they were addressed very well IMO.

First question that was asked concerning Doug Weads comment that the courts will not hear the case. Mr. Gilbert clearly said this comment was completely "off base" and then he proceeded to describe the judge who is handling the case (Judge Carter). He said Judge Carter is a former Marine and a straight up by the book Judge who does not skirt around the law. Mr. Gilbert said the evidence that they have compiled to date along with precidented rulings from previous cases involving likewise cases has given him without a shadow of doubt this case will move forward and be ruled upon before the convention.

The next question (from me) was: If the judge rules in our favor that ALL delegates are unbound, can the RNC appeal the case and extend it beyond the convention to disrupt the ruling. Mr. Gilbert stated with confidence that knowing Judge Carter's reputation he will rule on this case in a timely manner allowing enough time for our lawyers to take the case to a Appellate Court or State Supreme Court if necessary and have the case heard in plenty of time before the convention. The ultimate goal of the case is to have it ruled that at the time of the convention, Romney, Gingrich, Santorum and Ron Paul will have NO Bound delegates and every candidate will walk in with a ZERO count to face delegates that will be totally FREE to vote their conscience (for any candidate).

Let me clarify a statement that Attorney Gilbert made concerning this ruling. He is not strictly doing this (in favor) of Ron Paul even though he is 110% for Ron Paul, but doing this for ALL delegates. Whether they are a Santorum delegate or a Gingrich delegate, a favor in a unbound ruling would allow even those delegates if they are bound to Santorum or Gingrich to vote their conscience (even if they wish to cast their vote for Romney). He also made a comment that he even feels Ron Paul would approve this statement and by making that clear upfront, it may persuade those delegates to Gingrich, Santorum and even Romney to actually "see the light" of the Romney corruption and get behind Ron Paul and see this lawsuit was all about preserving our freedoms and bringing back integrity in the voting process.

Also, some other points that were made. He stated there is a team of upwards 60 lawyers all working for FREE and devoting many hours in preparing this case and that's not counting the score of paralegals and other volunteers. They have been overwhelmed with 100's upon 100's of people coming forward with numerous evidence of fraud and irregularities and this team of lawyers have all stated in their professional experience that this case could be monumental and could possibly shame Romney right out of the race.

I'm sure I missed a few points that were covered, but when you listen to the recorded call, I truly believe many of you will be impressed. I will update as soon as I get the link.

Nice update, +rep

[WhistlinDave]

As promised, Here is the link: http://www.talkshoe.com/talkshoe/web/audioPop.jsp?episodeId=635553&cmd=apop

Thanks for posting the link and for staying on top of this!! I really think this is history in the making.... Big time.

[Barrex]

Thanks for update RDM.
@davil21
I just did my "homework". I knew facts and facts were saying that you were wrong. That is it. People who point to pitfalls that didnt exist (because they didnt do their homework) annoy me and their "efforts" to point on mistakes that simply werent there harm projects... and I am first one to point on mistakes when I see them...BUT before I do that I do my homework....and then I dare to speak. (check my started topics about money bomb.)
Same story was during money bomb and some other projects.

This debate went long enough. I will no longer participate. It is off topic and doesnt contribute to this project.

[devil21]

Thanks for update RDM.
@davil21
I just did my "homework". I knew facts and facts were saying that you were wrong. That is it. People who point to pitfalls that didnt exist (because they didnt do their homework) annoy me and their "efforts" to point on mistakes that simply werent there harm projects... and I am first one to point on mistakes when I see them...BUT before I do that I do my homework....and then I dare to speak. (check my started topics about money bomb.)
Same story was during money bomb and some other projects.

This debate went long enough. I will no longer participate. It is off topic and doesnt contribute to this project.

Ill remember in the future to never ask you to reveal the results of your research for the purpose of expediency. Ill just "take your word for it" from now on or waste time researching the same stuff all over again. :eyeroll

[Barrex]

Ill remember in the future to never ask you to reveal the results of your research for the purpose of expediency. Ill just "take your word for it" from now on or waste time researching the same stuff all over again. :eyeroll

WTF is wrong with you? ALL INFORMATION WAS AVAILABLE!!!THERE WAS NO NEED TO TAKE ANYONES WORD FOR IT. YOU WAS JUST TOO LAZY TO LOOK FOR IT! YOU WERE IGNORANT AND LAZY AND DECIDED TO SPREAD YOUR IGNORANCE ON OTHERS ORDERING PEOPLE NOT TO TAKE PART IN THIS ACTION!
Lazy, ignorant, uneducated people who and impose their FALSE uneducated views and on others grind my gear.
I offered you to stop (This debate went long enough. I will no longer participate. It is off topic and doesnt contribute to this project. ) since this doesnt contribute to this project but you had to keep poking... What hte hell is wrong with you?ffs.ALL INFORMATIONS WERE THERE ONLY IF YOU TOOK 2-3 MINUTES TOO LOOK UP FOR THEM. YOU CHOOSE NOT TO AND YOU CHOOSE TO SPIT ON THIS PROJECT WITH YOUR UNEDUCATED GUESSES ADS ASSUMPTIONS (THAT WERE WRONG).

Dishonest, unfair, unethical, lazy.

I am ignoring you from now on. Congratulations. You are first.

Just stay away from me and my posts. I honestly think that is not too much to ask.

[KerriAnn]

//

[Barrex]

:D

[RDM]

Trying to see what I can find out about these lawyers, I found this, and posted this in another thread...

Thought this was interesting:
While digging around the internet about the lawyers who started this lawsuit, I found some info about David Callahan.
According to wikipedia, he is the co-founder of a US think tank named "Demos", and guess who was a board member of that same small group? Obama!

from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demos_(U.S._think_tank):

In the late 1990s, Demos was conceptualized by Charles Halpern, President of the Nathan Cummings Foundation (1989–2000). Halpern wanted to create a counter-argument to the growing influence of the many right-wing think tanks and establish a multi-issue organization that would focus on progressive policy development and advocacy. David Callahan, a Fellow at the Century Foundation, and Stephen Heintz, Vice-President of the EastWest Institute, joined Halpern in helping to found Demos. Founding Board members included Arnie Miller, of Isaccson Miller, an executive search firm; David Skaggs, a Colorado Congressman; and Barack Obama, an Illinois State Senator.



interesting.

It would be interesting if the David Callihan that is working with Lawyers for Ron Paul were the same David Callahan you are referencing.

[KerriAnn]

It would be interesting if the David Calihan that is working with Lawyers for Ron Paul were the same David Callahan you are referencing.
ha!!! well im embarrassed! :p

[Barrex]

ha!!! well im embarrassed! :p
Dont worry it happens ;)

[devil21]

WTF is wrong with you? ALL INFORMATION WAS AVAILABLE!!!THERE WAS NO NEED TO TAKE ANYONES WORD FOR IT. YOU WAS JUST TOO LAZY TO LOOK FOR IT! YOU WERE IGNORANT AND LAZY AND DECIDED TO SPREAD YOUR IGNORANCE ON OTHERS ORDERING PEOPLE NOT TO TAKE PART IN THIS ACTION!
Lazy, ignorant, uneducated people who and impose their FALSE uneducated views and on others grind my gear.
I offered you to stop (This debate went long enough. I will no longer participate. It is off topic and doesnt contribute to this project. ) since this doesnt contribute to this project but you had to keep poking... What hte hell is wrong with you?ffs.ALL INFORMATIONS WERE THERE ONLY IF YOU TOOK 2-3 MINUTES TOO LOOK UP FOR THEM. YOU CHOOSE NOT TO AND YOU CHOOSE TO SPIT ON THIS PROJECT WITH YOUR UNEDUCATED GUESSES ADS ASSUMPTIONS (THAT WERE WRONG).

Dishonest, unfair, unethical, lazy.

I am ignoring you from now on. Congratulations. You are first.

Just stay away from me and my posts. I honestly think that is not too much to ask.

I asked you to post certain pieces of information that you supposedly already knew but your response was "research it for yourself" instead of just providing the information. Oh well, some people don't get what "vetting" means and entails and its obvious that it will not change. Usually the person presenting an argument (or project) is responsible for providing the information to support the argument (or project), not tell everyone else to go research it.

[RDM]

Please copy and paste this into your groups and share it far and wide! Thank you!
Please join the lawsuit against the RNC and the GOP. It is necessary to have as many Delegates join the Case as possible. The more delegates, the stronger the case. All Delegates are public record. There is a myth on the Daily Paul that delegates have a secret identity. Every delegate knows that is false. We represent delegates for ALL candidates no matter who they are intending to vote for. If you are a "stealth" delegate we do not need to know that. We never ask that question. You just become a Plaintiff and that's it. If you are bound to Santorum you just say that. It is already a public record. Every delegate has a duty to protect the sanctity of voting your conscience by asking a Federal Judge to order it. No one needs to know if you are stealth.

In addition, all plaintiffs are fully protected by the "Litigation Privilege". This means the Judge will not permit any Plaintiff to be harassed or intimidated in any way. There can be no fine or penalty of any kind and the Judge will protect you. It is my understanding that it is mathematically impossible for Dr. Paul to win without this Case. As of now, Dr. Paul is not having his name in nomination and is not being permitted to speak. If anybody has information otherwise, please let us know. This case can fix that. Please go to www.electionfraudremedy.com (http://www.electionfraudremedy.com) and join us in our effort to make ALL delegates UNBOUND prior to the convention in Tampa! THANK YOU!

[TrishW]

I am loving this!!! I knew Ron Paul would be President!

(warning to anyone quoting me, and throwing cold water on my enthusiasm ... DON"T!)

[WhistlinDave]

I am loving this!!! I knew Ron Paul would be President!

(warning to anyone quoting me, and throwing cold water on my enthusiasm ... DON"T!)

:D I feel the same way. People can throw all the cold water they want on my enthusiasm; it just vaporizes into steam instantly.

If someone turns a fire hose on me I'll generate enough steam to power a town. They could put a whole glacier on top of me right now and I'll melt the whole thing in a couple hours.

[RDM]

I am loving this!!! I knew Ron Paul would be President!

(warning to anyone quoting me, and throwing cold water on my enthusiasm ... DON"T!)

I believe the "cold water showers" will come to a halt shortly. It looks like our man Ben Swann is about to "do his thing" with this news. Here's what he posted on FB.

Ben Swann WXIX shared a link.
33 minutes ago
Taking a week off to chill with my family. But this is a story I just have to put up. Lawyers For Ron Paul taking over Paul campaign?
This would have to be a first...
Trying to get more info on this and I will share with you as it comes in.

[Barrex]

Maybe title should be: Will never get vetted :D

[parocks]

Just my opinion, but I don't think this lawyer group is in this for the delegates best interest, and here is why I feel this way. This group seems to want to put most of the serious complaints on the back burner and not resolve them before the convention, while bringing the BOUND subject to the for front, where they want a judge to decide before the convention whether or not these delegates are legally bound or not. Which makes this look like a trap to me. If this judge rules that the delegates are bound, when the delegates actually weren't, then now all these delegates will be going in to the convention with a ruling against them saying they are now bound which the RNC could use AGAINST these delegates if these delegates chose to ignore this judges order.

Where as the way it stands now, the RNC and their legal team have already ruled that these delegates are UNBOUND, this new case could get the RNC off the hook if the judge rules against the delegates which would be my prediction and the reason I feel this way is because this lawyer group seems to be only concerned about resolving the BOUND DELEGATE question before the convention and not these more serious election fraud charges until later after the convention. If this group isn't legit this would be a nice way to get a court ruling AGAINST THE DELEGATES before the convention stating they must vote for whom their bound to, all while silencing the other charges prior to the convention so they can't be brought up before the convention as all the RNC will have to say is they can't discuss these election fraud charges as these charges are under litigation. Do you see what I'm saying. If you do then you need to warn those on the Daily Paul as I'm banned from posting there.

Interesting. Typically grassroots plans have glaring errors. This might be that one. The fraud is the more interesting element. I'm not sure that a court is going to help us now with un/bound. But on the other hand, it might be exclusively good. I haven't looked at it that closely. It seems to be causing some shaking in boots.

OK, I think that I just prefer right now the possibility of this being a black swan. I don't want to think about this too much. Could be black swan? We do need a black swan to win. If the msm doesn't talk about this, it's impossible to predict. Has up and down sides, but I would think that we would like this as a group.

[parocks]

There is not one single project or action on this forum that wasnt spit on and went on without someone trying to sabotage it. This one is no exception. First "we dont know these people"...well if anyone tried to find out who they are they would find out who they are. Then it was there is no PACER number. There is PACER number. Now there is "question" how will this all end?.....and so on and so on... No matter what evidence, what reassurance, who gives it there will always be people who will actively try to sabotage any project that is presented on this forum. Why? I dont know. I can only guess. This is one of the reasons why there is no successful project tied with this forum. Sad and discouraging.

Back in November 2007, there was a collaboration on an ad which ran in USA Today. That was successful.