Bachmann Gets To Go To Tampa Thanks To Generous Paul Supporter

[kathy88]

http://www.care2.com/causes/bachmann-gets-to-go-to-tampa-thanks-to-generous-paul-supporter.html




Well, that’s embarrassing.

Supporters of Congressman Ron Paul’s presidential run have already shown off how utterly effective they are at taking over conventions and organizing to win delegate slots to head to the Republican National Convention in Tampa.

[Bern]

...
Paul announced recently that he would no longer be competing in states on primary day, ...

That's not what he announced. Shitty journalism is shitty.

[Zach Vega]

Why do they keep saying he's "not competing" or has "dropped out"?

[kathy88]

Why do they keep saying he's "not competing" or has "dropped out"?

To garner support for Romney. Realistically, there are only 7 or 8 primaries left and he still doesn't have enough delegates. That's got to be embarrassing. If Romney wins the nomination, there will be millions upon millions spent on advertising. If Paul wins, not so much. It's all about the money. It is in the media's best interests for Romney to win. Period.

[jmdrake]

Romans 12:20

“And if your enemy hungers, feed him, and if he thirsts, give him a drink, and if you do these things to him you will heap coals of fire on his skull.”

Bachmann must be feeling the fire about now. ;)

[bcreps85]

It was nice and all, but I'm more of the "don't give an inch" person at this point. These people are all enemies of liberty and there will be no convincing them. It isn't going to change her mind, and it isn't going to make the old guard in MN more "OK" with us...I fail see what giving Romney one extra vote accomplishes.

Wouldn't it be a bummer if he won the first round...with exactly the amount of votes needed?

[JohnM]

I fail see what giving Romney one extra vote accomplishes.


A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

[jbauer]

...um no

[zHorns]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

Yes, I really do think so.

[bcreps85]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

In a perfect world, no. In reality, Bachman will do whatever she thinks she needs to do for her career. She's as conservative as the rest of her party - in words only.

[Danan]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

Do you really think that an establishment warmonger like Michelle Bachmann who said that Ron Paul would be a "dangerous" president and who worked for the IRS will vote for Ron over Romney?

[kahless]

What is the story behind this? Why would a Ron Paul supporter give up their spot for Bachmann who openly endorsed Romney and was attacking Ron in her final days in the race?

Bachmann endorses Mitt Romney: 'The last chance we ...
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/michele-bachmann-endorses-mitt-romney-chance-america-cliff/story?id=16271285


After months of hints, Michele Bachmann finally endorsed her former rival Mitt Romney in his bid for the presidency, calling him "the last chance we have to keep America from going ... over a cliff."

In a statement, the Minnesota congresswoman said she was "honored" to back Romney, describing him as "a man who will preserve the American dream of prosperity and liberty."

She later appeared with Romney at a campaign event in Portsmouth, Va., where she said she was thrilled to introduce "our president."

"I think for all of America, this is a very simple proposition this November: President Barack Obama or President Mitt Romney?" she said. "Very easy."

A tea party favorite, Bachmann ended her own run for president in January, after she placed a disappointing sixth place in Iowa's Republican presidential caucuses. While Romney had lobbied Bachmann for her support for months, she held out, telling reporters in recent weeks that she would endorse on her own timetable, not others'.

While Bachmann emphasized in her decision to back Romney, Democrats are already revisiting the pointed attacks she lobbed against the former Massachusetts governor during the heated GOP primary. In pressing her own case to be the nominee, Bachmann frequently offered the most scathing critiques of Romney of anybody in the GOP field, insisting repeatedly that he could not beat Obama.

"The signature issue of Obama is 'Obamacare.' You can't have a candidate who has given the blueprint for Obamacare. It's too identical. It's not going to happen," Bachmann told ABC News in January. "We have to have a candidate, a bold, distinct candidate, in the likeness of Ronald Reagan."

But on Thursday, she backed off that claim. Joining Romney and Virginia Gov. Bob McDonnell on stage, Bachmann declared, "This is what victory looks like."

While Romney had hoped Bachmann would come off the bench to help him woo conservatives in the heat of the GOP primary, she still has the potential to aid his campaign by convincing social conservatives and other Republicans skeptical of his bid to turn out this fall and vote.

In an interview with CNN last week, Bachmann suggested she was already doing just that, telling the network she had been "working behind the scenes, bringing together all factions of our party" to boost Romney's efforts to beat Obama in November.

[bcreps85]

What is the story behind this? Why would a Ron Paul supporter give up their spot for Bachmann who openly endorsed Romney and was attacking Ron in her final days in the race?

Bachmann endorses Mitt Romney: 'The last chance we ...
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/OTUS/michele-bachmann-endorses-mitt-romney-chance-america-cliff/story?id=16271285

Political move. Extending an olive branch and all that. Unfortunately that sort of thing is only worthwhile when your opponents are honorable and decent people.

[DGustafson]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

JohnM, thank you for the complements, I am one of those going to Tampa from MN. Having met MB several times, she's a bold faced liar who is dumber than a bag of hammers. The brains behind the botox is her husband and her country club republican handlers at w00dale church. There's no hope on reforming her mindset. She probably won't even go on the floor unless it's for a ceremony or glamor shot infront of a camera. She'll be too busy pandering to big money to pay off her campaign debt.

[mport1]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

She is a big government statist. Of course she will vote for Romney. She would never even consider Ron Paul.

[Carlybee]

I still dont get why anyone thought this was a political advantage. In a revolution you dont offer bullets to the enemy.

[Cleaner44]

I can't help but remember that on 12/15/2011 Bachmann assured us all that I ran was only a couple of months away from having a nuclear weapon. Given that it she also assured us that Iran would not hesitate to use a nuke on Israel, I am left a bit confused. I figured Iran most certainly would have their nuke by 3/15 or 4/15 tops. Here we are at 5/22 and Israel still has not been wiped from the face of the map... could it be that Michele Bachmann is a fucking idiot that doesn't know what the hell she is talking about... or is she just a lying asshole?

[bcreps85]

I still dont get why anyone thought this was a political advantage. In a revolution you dont offer bullets to the enemy.

Many among us still think we can gain favor by offering these types of things when we can, and that we need to work our way into the party and change it slowly, try to fit in, etc etc. They don't understand that the idea of liberty sickens these people and that they will never come around of their own accord. They'll take any bullets we offer them and shoot us in the back.

[ns1000]

I can't help but remember that on 12/15/2011 Bachmann assured us all that I ran was only a couple of months away from having a nuclear weapon. Given that it she also assured us that Iran would not hesitate to use a nuke on Israel, I am left a bit confused. I figured Iran most certainly would have their nuke by 3/15 or 4/15 tops. Here we are at 5/22 and Israel still has not been wiped from the face of the map... could it be that Michele Bachmann is a fucking idiot that doesn't know what the hell she is talking about... or is she just a lying asshole?

Not only that, she insisted that Iran had threatened to use nuclear weapons against the USA. I really don't understand why any American would even believe that.

[kahless]

Political move. Extending an olive branch and all that. Unfortunately that sort of thing is only worthwhile when your opponents are honorable and decent people.

Just mind boggling. Maybe the delegate had not been paying attention.


She probably won't even go on the floor unless it's for a ceremony or glamor shot infront of a camera. She'll be too busy pandering to big money to pay off her campaign debt.

I disagree, knowing the party and the media I bet she gets more speaking and face time then Ron. I wonder what that delegate was thinking giving up that spot.

[Carlybee]

Why do people think that having a congressional title automatically means that person deserves respect? We dont have royalty here and we dont need to bow and curtsy.

[coffeewithchess]

Why do they keep saying he's "not competing" or has "dropped out"?

See, it's a two way street really.
When you have an inept campaign, and dishonest news media...they kind of fit together perfectly.

[coffeewithchess]

Why do people think that having a congressional title automatically means that person deserves respect? We dont have royalty here and we dont need to bow and curtsy.

This. Michele Bachmann is a lying piece of trash politician IMO. She deserves to get kicked out of D.C. in the next race, and allowing these people to go somewhere when you can stop them...well I don't agree it at all.
She is not entitled to anything, and she ran around Iowa the last 2 weeks flatout lying about RP's positions. She deserves unemployment, not $170K a year job with special benefits. Have RP supporters seriously not learned anything? Bow to the system, and it will continue to step on you.

[jmdrake]

Well personally I wouldn't have stepped aside for MB. But I can't say it was a bad trade. One more delegate vote versus free publicity and goodwill? (Not from MB, but from people that like MB and RS as well as RP). That could be worth something in the long run.

[skyorbit]

In a perfect world, no. In reality, Bachman will do whatever she thinks she needs to do for her career. She's as conservative as the rest of her party - in words only.

Maybe they can convince her voting for Ron Paul is what would be best for her career, given that Ron Paulians now run the MN GOP.

[trey4sports]

so can we primary her in two years if she continues her statist path?

[TheGrinch]

Well personally I wouldn't have stepped aside for MB. But I can't say it was a bad trade. One more delegate vote versus free publicity and goodwill? (Not from MB, but from people that like MB and RS as well as RP). That could be worth something in the long run.

Agreed. We beat them by being better than the people we're trying to beat... I think it's a great story that they were resilient enough to take all the delegates, but threw her a bone to not look like we're just trying to pull something sheisty by demanding them all.... We've got a good thing going in Minnesota, and they probably didn't see it worth messing with that just for 1 delegate, when we took all the other 12.

Public perception does matter, especially when there will be future slates that we don't want to give any ammo to take it all back.

[ClydeCoulter]

Maybe they can convince her voting for Ron Paul is what would be best for her career, given that Ron Paulians now run the MN GOP.

Yes, that's a good point :)

[jbauer]

Ding Ding!! I love the saying "my way or the highway" but in the long run a simple gesture like this could make a difference. If we loose to Romney by 1 vote we all have the right to be ticked. We will NOT be able to push for liberty without the establishment's voters aka republicans. Why do you think Ron is a republican? He wouldnt' be able to get it done as a 3rd party and neither will we.




Well personally I wouldn't have stepped aside for MB. But I can't say it was a bad trade. One more delegate vote versus free publicity and goodwill? (Not from MB, but from people that like MB and RS as well as RP). That could be worth something in the long run.

[kahless]

She was ruthless on her way out against Ron Paul and burned those bridges. Great way to give her exposure and a face time to trash Ron Paul and his polices again at the Convention. How may times do people need to be burned before they learn a lesson.

[EBounding]

While I wouldn't have given up the slot, it's a good gesture that might help in the long run. Maybe she'll feel enormous guilt about what she said about Ron? Compromising on things like this is much better than compromising on issues and principles.

[jmdrake]

She was ruthless on her way out against Ron Paul and burned those bridges. Great way to give her exposure and a face time to trash Ron Paul and his polices again at the Convention. How may times do people need to be burned before they learn a lesson.

I'll bet you one Klingon warship + a ceremonial batliff that she doesn't do that. As the Ferengi would say "there would be no profit" in that for her.

[Carlybee]

Agreed. We beat them by being better than the people we're trying to beat... I think it's a great story that they were resilient enough to take all the delegates, but threw her a bone to not look like we're just trying to pull something sheisty by demanding them all.... We've got a good thing going in Minnesota, and they probably didn't see it worth messing with that just for 1 delegate, when we took all the other 12.

Public perception does matter, especially when there will be future slates that we don't want to give any ammo to take it all back.

How would it be sheisty by taking what you worked for and earned? Especially given the delegates that have been stolen through the opposition's fraud and theft in other caucuses? The perception is already that Rp delegates are disruptive rabble rousers even when they aren't. Who really thinks this will buy any goodwill in the media or in Tampa when she votes Romney? Oh well too late to worry about it now.

[Carlybee]

Remember when she did this? http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2011/12/29/michele-bachmann-says-ron-paul-paid-key-iowa-staffer-to-switch

[TheGrinch]

How would it be sheisty by taking what you worked for and earned? Especially given the delegates that have been stolen through the opposition's fraud and theft in other caucuses? The perception is already that Rp delegates are disruptive rabble rousers even when they aren't. Who really thinks this will buy any goodwill in the media or in Tampa when she votes Romney? Oh well too late to worry about it now.
It's not sheisty, I'm jsut talking about perceptions, but you're right, they'll paint it negative regardless, but how about gracious winners then... The last thing you want to do is fire up another irate minority to want to take back over, and this might help get people who like Bachman to our side, or at least not against us like they would be if they'd just taken all 13 spots.

Don't read too much into it. It was an extremely small gesture, and as was said above, I'd rather make small concessions on things like this than have to make actual concessions on our ideals.

[Gray Fullbuster]

Gj to the delegates.

and even after Bacchman slapped Paul on the cheek, the supporters turned their other cheek and then held out their hands.
She took the hand.
Very nice gesture.

[singe22]

I can't help but remember that on 12/15/2011 Bachmann assured us all that I ran was only a couple of months away from having a nuclear weapon. Given that it she also assured us that Iran would not hesitate to use a nuke on Israel, I am left a bit confused. I figured Iran most certainly would have their nuke by 3/15 or 4/15 tops. Here we are at 5/22 and Israel still has not been wiped from the face of the map... could it be that Michele Bachmann is a fucking idiot that doesn't know what the hell she is talking about... or is she just a lying asshole?

if i knew how to give rep ++++++for you

[singe22]

The only kind gesture the founders gave was a headstart home across the sea to those that didnt want to take part in the revolution. They didnt offer King George supporters a voice. The one Abstain during the passing of the Declaration of Independance got the hell out of dodge. You people are going to get burned again. Neo cons dont and will not have grassroots to be a irrate minority when the tables turns. All they have are mindless zombies who will vote for the "slick rick" politician who gives lip service to the constitution but their record doesnt follow that.

[Mahkato]

When your opponent is bloodied and gasping for breath, you offer them your hand and help them stand up. The move was a very important one for the future of the liberty movement in the MNGOP. It made a big impression on the rank-and-file Republicans who attended the convention, and it will be remembered. We were mistreated when we were in the minority and we acted with honor and integrity when we took the majority. We need them as much as they need us in order to win against Senator Klobuchar this fall, and this move will help make that happen.

[DGustafson]

Part of the plan is to take the Kurt Bills for Senate ECON 101 bus down to Tampa to show party unity. MB will hopefully be pressured into that trip. Then we'll ditch her at a Waffle House in rural Indiana.

[kuckfeynes]

Yeah I can't see any good coming out of this, unless MAYBE some backroom deal was made that IF we somehow get close to half the delegates, her influence could be of use to us. Because if her state party has been taken over, her back is against the wall one way or the other. Siding with us could potentially end up being in her own self-interest. Or if it looks like we are not going to come close to half, she can vote for Romney, stay in good graces with the outgoing establishment, and kiss her local influence goodbye. Personally I think it's a horrible gamble, but what's done is done...

[Carlybee]

Then we'll ditch her at a Waffle House in rural Indiana.

:D

[NoOneButPaul]

I like the show of good faith on our part but Michelle Bachmann is one of those people that no good faith should be shown to.

She's a total moron, or a complete liar, either way she's a disgrace to our party.

[The Free Hornet]

I'll bet you one Klingon warship + a ceremonial batliff that she doesn't do that. As the Ferengi would say "there would be no profit" in that for her.


BATLETH TREKKIE PRODUCTS 48 Inch Traditional Batleth (http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_12605_SPM6188171707P?sid=IDx20101019x00001 a&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=SPM6852742202)
Sears Item# SPM6852742202 | Model# 2ADSPOU2L117549

$150.04

http://c.shld.net/rpx/i/s/pi/mp/13567/6852742202p?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.retailestore.com% 2FODNImages%2FFImages%2FSportsOutdoors%2F31OwuDGmm dL._SL500_AA300_.jpg&d=4e4c1eb5d6ce2cc890472a8fe26d36483fe28b45

Can anybody get in on this action?

[Carlybee]

I like the show of good faith on our part but Michelle Bachmann is one of those people that no good faith should be shown to.

She's a total moron, or a complete liar, either way she's a disgrace to our party.

Plus if she still has presidential ambitions she will butter the side of the bread most likely to support her in the future...which will be the ones who support getting rid of the islamo fascists because thats part of her meme now.

[puppetmaster]

I don't like this move.....no mercy, this is a war. This kind of feel good stuff is BS. I heard someone say it's the "Minnesota way"...... What the hell is that? This is a do or die situation folks, not play day we have to be aggressive and strong without mercy. Deals like this cannot happen at the convention but they will try. We won fair and square and they will only use this type of behavior against us.

[VBRonPaulFan]

I like the show of good faith on our part but Michelle Bachmann is one of those people that no good faith should be shown to.

She's a total moron, or a complete liar, either way she's a disgrace to our party.

+1. she's a political opportunist that could care less about fixing things and is much more concerned with wielding personal power via the government. she isn't to be trusted. This was stupid IMO, we need to show the establishment that they won't be rewarded in any way for the kind of shit that they pull.

[trey4sports]

Part of the plan is to take the Kurt Bills for Senate ECON 101 bus down to Tampa to show party unity. MB will hopefully be pressured into that trip. Then we'll ditch her at a Waffle House in rural Indiana.


bwahahaha that's good~!

[Mahkato]

We didn't GIVE her the spot. She may have won it anyway. Here's why: Up for grabs were 13 delegate spots (the other 27 had already been awarded at district conventions and to party leaders). Candidates needed 50%+1 to get a spot. If fewer than 13 people got 50%+1 on the first ballot, it would go to additional ballots. 12 of our people met that threshhold. MB and one of ours did not. Rather than going to a runoff against MB, he conceded the spot to her. He may have won against her, but that is far from certain.

[JohnM]

I don't like this move.....no mercy, this is a war. . . . This is a do or die situation folks, not play day we have to be aggressive and strong without mercy.

Yeah, it's war. But it is a particular kind of war. It's called politics.

And there are two classic texts. The old one (http://www.amazon.com/The-Prince-Niccolo-Machiavelli/dp/1613821719/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337714488&sr=8-1) has some merit, but the new one (http://www.amazon.com/How-Win-Friends-Influence-People/dp/1439167346/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337714834&sr=8-1) is often more useful.

[BrooklynZoo]

This is a good move not because it influences Bachmann in any way. but because it both shows goodwill to others in the party and makes it less likely that the RNC will try something silly to challenge the Minnesota delegate credentials as they are trying to do with other states. We have one of their Congresswomen and a confirmed senate candidate (Bills) as delegates.

[puppetmaster]

This is a good move not because it influences Bachmann in any way. but because it both shows goodwill to others in the party and makes it less likely that the RNC will try something silly to challenge the Minnesota delegate credentials as they are trying to do with other states. We have one of their Congresswomen and a confirmed senate candidate (Bills) as delegates.


any validation of this? less likely?......yea right they wont give it a second thought. They eat their own in politics.

[Feeding the Abscess]

Many among us still think we can gain favor by offering these types of things when we can, and that we need to work our way into the party and change it slowly, try to fit in, etc etc. They don't understand that the idea of liberty sickens these people and that they will never come around of their own accord. They'll take any bullets we offer them and shoot us in the back.

They won't even wait to shoot us in the back. They have no qualms with shooting us in the face.

[puppetmaster]

+1. she's a political opportunist that could care less about fixing things and is much more concerned with wielding personal power via the government. she isn't to be trusted. This was stupid IMO, we need to show the establishment that they won't be rewarded in any way for the kind of shit that they pull.


A IRS goon also folks.....gheesh how soon we forget

[singe22]

Lol goodwill. So when they are calling you crazy just because you choose to be aware of what the government is doing, your ok with that? The refoundation of Liberty needs to be solid, not with holes with upredictables.

If you choose to ignore the crap this woman has said about dr paul just a mere few months ago, her slander on Romney and then endorsing him you are a fool. You are the same fool that would fall for a gesture of a Romney/Paul ticket. Your willing to settle.

No one But Paul.

[puppetmaster]

We didn't GIVE her the spot. She may have won it anyway. Here's why: Up for grabs were 13 delegate spots (the other 27 had already been awarded at district conventions and to party leaders). Candidates needed 50%+1 to get a spot. If fewer than 13 people got 50%+1 on the first ballot, it would go to additional ballots. 12 of our people met that threshhold. MB and one of ours did not. Rather than going to a runoff against MB, he conceded the spot to her. He may have won against her, but that is far from certain.

so whats is your point? what is the real benefit...not a perceived benefit.
If we had not conceded and won then we would have a real benefit not some "maybe they will like us now" idea. We don't need to be liked by the party in fact I know we will never be liked by the party elite.

Some similar shit happened at the last national convention and did NOTHING for us I promise.

[Mahkato]

We don't need to be liked by the party in fact I know we will never be liked by the party elite.

We do need them. The majority of the sitting Minnesota legislators are old-guard types. Until we can convert or replace them, which will be a long process, we need the help of the other half of the party. We can't do everything on our own yet, especially given the MNGOP's sizable debt.

The real benefit is that MB is now fully aware that her party will no longer give her unquestioning support. She knows well what Paul stands for, and she now also knows that she ignores us to her peril. It's not certain at this point of course, but I suspect that her votes will tip toward liberty more often.

[SpiritOf1776_J4]

Sortof like a Frodo wanting to take Gollum along vs Samwise Gamgee decision.

[presence]

It does not require a majority to prevail,
but rather an irate, tireless minority keen
to set brush fires in peoples minds.
- Samuel Adams
http://ronpaulposts.com/2012/05/spy-...-over-america/ (http://ronpaulposts.com/2012/05/spy-drones-over-america/)



Yeah, it's war. But it is a particular kind of war. It's called politics.

And there are two classic texts. The old one (http://www.amazon.com/The-Prince-Niccolo-Machiavelli/dp/1613821719/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337714488&sr=8-1) has some merit, but the new one (http://www.amazon.com/How-Win-Friends-Influence-People/dp/1439167346/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1337714834&sr=8-1) is often more useful.

cheers!

http://www.westegg.com/unmaintained/carnegie/win-friends.html


How to Win Friends and Influence People
This is Dale Carnegie's summary of his book, from 1936
Table of Contents

Part One Fundamental Techniques in Handling People

Don't criticize, condemn or complain.
Give honest and sincere appreciation.
Arouse in the other person an eager want.

Part Two Six ways to make people like you

Become genuinely interested in other people.
Smile.
Remember that a person's name is to that person the sweetest and most important sound in any language.
Be a good listener. Encourage others to talk about themselves.
Talk in terms of the other person's interests.
Make the other person feel important - and do it sincerely.

Part Three Win people to your way of thinking

The only way to get the best of an argument is to avoid it.
Show respect for the other person's opinions. Never say, "You're wrong."
If you are wrong, admit it quickly and emphatically.
Begin in a friendly way.
Get the other person saying "yes, yes" immediately.
Let the other person do a great deal of the talking.
Let the other person feel that the idea is his or hers.
Try honestly to see things from the other person's point of view.
Be sympathetic with the other person's ideas and desires.
Appeal to the nobler motives.
Dramatize your ideas.
Throw down a challenge.

Part Four Be a Leader: How to Change People Without Giving Offense or Arousing Resentment
A leader's job often includes changing your people's attitudes and behavior. Some suggestions to accomplish this:

Begin with praise and honest appreciation.
Call attention to people's mistakes indirectly.
Talk about your own mistakes before criticizing the other person.
Ask questions instead of giving direct orders.
Let the other person save face.
Praise the slightest improvement and praise every improvement. Be "hearty in your approbation and lavish in your praise."
Give the other person a fine reputation to live up to.
Use encouragement. Make the fault seem easy to correct.
Make the other person happy about doing the thing you suggest.

[puppetmaster]

This country has been compromising for the last 200+ years and that is one the reasons we are so far from where we should be in regards to freedom. NO MORE COMPROMISE.

[speciallyblend]

We do need them. The majority of the sitting Minnesota legislators are old-guard types. Until we can convert or replace them, which will be a long process, we need the help of the other half of the party. We can't do everything on our own yet, especially given the MNGOP's sizable debt.

The real benefit is that MB is now fully aware that her party will no longer give her unquestioning support. She knows well what Paul stands for, and she now also knows that she ignores us to her peril. It's not certain at this point of course, but I suspect that her votes will tip toward liberty more often.

well played, i/we could of swept ron paul in our precinct but i played nice to some santorum alternates. Then at our cd1 we swept 100% for ron paul:) why would i play nice to santorum alt or delegates? Because that is exactly how i became a ron paul delegate back in 2008:) Did i mention we swept cd1 in denver for Ron Paul:) woot , play the game, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl1O_Y8TD1U<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl1O_Y8TD1U">
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl1O_Y8TD1U (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl1O_Y8TD1U)

[singe22]

Yep that is the game that was played on the "Pure" Tea Party. Now those people for the most part dont need your vote, they got special interest backing them to get reelected.



cheers!

http://www.westegg.com/unmaintained/carnegie/win-friends.html

[TheGrinch]

This country has been compromising for the last 200+ years and that is one the reasons we are so far from where we should be in regards to freedom. NO MORE COMPROMISE.
No one is suggesting comprimising our ideals, so settle down already. All this is is a small concession for her to save face, and maybe just maybe to not have people like her fighting us every step of the way... We control the Minnesota GOP now, so let her have her delegate spot if they felt it was appropriate.

It's their decision to make after they took control and all the delegates, so stop hyperbolizing as if anyone is selling out or something, when they've done better than anyone... Sometimes you have to make a token concession or two (that have nothing to do with ideals) if you don't want to make more enemies than you've already got. It's conceding a minscule battle to help continue to win the war.

[puppetmaster]

well all this is being promoted as a we may get them to play on our side.....and that is a a slim chance I believe.
..
I see that fact that is we had not conceded and won we would have a definite vote for RP. I always like a bird in hand vs two in a bush.
we got the job done here in NV and we did not compromise delegate positions.
There is more than one way to skin a cat I know but these delegate positions are so so very critical and cannot be squandered away on a whim

[Dogsoldier]

ok so we gave a delegate away?wtf is this?

[kahless]

I'll bet you one Klingon warship + a ceremonial batliff that she doesn't do that. As the Ferengi would say "there would be no profit" in that for her.



BATLETH TREKKIE PRODUCTS 48 Inch Traditional Batleth
Sears Item# SPM6852742202 | Model# 2ADSPOU2L117549

$150.04

http://c.shld.net/rpx/i/s/pi/mp/13567/6852742202p?src=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.retailestore.com% 2FODNImages%2FFImages%2FSportsOutdoors%2F31OwuDGmm dL._SL500_AA300_.jpg&d=4e4c1eb5d6ce2cc890472a8fe26d36483fe28b45

Can anybody get in on this action?

I will raise you a bottle of Klingon Blood Wine that she will stab us in the back at or by the Convention.



DEEP SPACE NINE KLINGON COLLECTOR BLOOD WINE~ORIGINAL~​RARE! NO LONGER PRODUCED OR FOR SALE $99.99
http://thumbs4.ebaystatic.com/m/mi8lvlkjCjfSTLkeyd9Z72w/140.jpg

http://www.ebay.com/itm/DEEP-SPACE-NINE-KLINGON-COLLECTOR-BLOOD-WINE-ORIGINAL-RARE-/280881700915?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4165daa033

[puppetmaster]

No one is suggesting comprimising our ideals, so settle down already. All this is is a small concession for her to save face, and maybe just maybe to not have people like her fighting us every step of the way... We control the Minnesota GOP now, so let her have her delegate spot if they felt it was appropriate.

It's their decision to make after they took control and all the delegates, so stop hyperbolizing as if anyone is selling out or something, when they've done better than anyone... Sometimes you have to make a token concession or two (that have nothing to do with ideals) if you don't want to make more enemies than you've already got. It's conceding a minscule battle to help continue to win the war.

Main Entry: compromise  [kom-pruh-mahyz] Show IPA
Part of Speech: noun
Definition: agreement, give-and-take
Synonyms: accommodation, accord, adjustment, arrangement, bargain, compact, composition, concession, contract, copout, covenant, deal, fifty-fifty, half and half, half measure, happy medium, mean, middle course, middle ground, pact, sellout, settlement, trade-off, understanding, win-win situation

Yes I understand it was their decision but one I do not agree with and do not recommend. We fought for it, Won it, now lets keep it.

[TheGrinch]

ok so we gave a delegate away?wtf is this?
They gave 1 delegate away, after they took all of them. That's their choice after what they were able to accomplish.

I'd imagine those who made this happen would not appreciate reading this thread where others are criticizing and nitpicking the great thing they accomplished. If any are reading this, I apologize for our peers who can't recognize that.

[TheGrinch]

Yes I understand it was their decision but one I do not agree with and do not recommend. We fought for it, Won it, now lets keep it.
They fought for it there to take them all. They have to live with consequences if they cause a big embarassment for Bachman and turns others against them, rather than being the bigger man like they were. I for one am extremely pleased that they relegated a former presidential candidate to begging for scraps, as we took the whole T-bone.

[Krzysztof Lesiak]

What the fuck, after how they treat us, we're just going to be generous to them and send this goddamn idiot and enemy of freedom to the convention when we could have had a RP guy? That's just dumb.

[Carlybee]

There are obviously two trains of thought on this and voicing an opinion on it does not negate the victory of the delegates. History will tell if there are regrets.

[puppetmaster]

They fought for it there to take them all. They have to live with consequences if they cause a big embarassment for Bachman and turns others against them, rather than being the bigger man like they were. I for one am extremely pleased that they relegated a former presidential candidate to begging for scraps, as we took the whole T-bone.

I am happy with the results but strive for perfection......

[TheGrinch]

After all that Dr. Paul has spoken about blowback, and some people really can't see why they'd make one small concession after they just took the whole pie... Clearly it's because they don't want to give it back to them by burning bridges. Rather, Bachman can now see that we can make life very difficult for her going forward, so she better take that olive branch.

This is not to expect that she'll become a friend of liberty, but this certainly won't embolden her as an enemy like she would have been if they really embarassed her and pissed of her supporters.

Seriously people, you don't make enemies in politics when you're in a position of power. You use your leverage, which is exactly what they're doing (and again, with a net positive of at least 12 delegates out of 13. Show your love for that!)

[TheGrinch]

I am happy with the results but strive for perfection......
And clearly they had their reasons (as was stated earlier in this thread, it's not even entirely clear if they would have succeeded in replacing her).... Obviously they did not take over the state GOP and all the delegate spots just to bow down to the establishment, so give them credit that they see what's going to be in their best interests to stay in power in their own state.

You might think that "no compromise" is most important, and perhaps in your state is the best strategy, I don't know, but what is obviously important is to not do things that can get in the way of us maintaining power (i.e., pissing off those who can make their lives as difficult as they now can theirs). You don't have to comprimise your ideals to use your leverage and show mercy to your opponents when they know you could crush them. It's called strategy and leverage.

Now if we get to a brokered convention and Dr. Paul loses by one vote, then we can point the finger a lot of different ways of how we could have gone different, but they're preparing for the mroe likely reality that we'll either have numbers or we won't, and absent the unlikely scenario that one delegate changes things, they're helping ensure they stay in power I'm sure. There's no other reason they would.

[ClydeCoulter]

I, for one, do not approve or disapprove of what they did concerning Bachman, that was their call. I'm just glad they did what they did overall and say Thank You For All of Your Efforts !

[LKMN]

No one is suggesting comprimising our ideals, so settle down already. All this is is a small concession for her to save face, and maybe just maybe to not have people like her fighting us every step of the way... We control the Minnesota GOP now, so let her have her delegate spot if they felt it was appropriate.

It's their decision to make after they took control and all the delegates, so stop hyperbolizing as if anyone is selling out or something, when they've done better than anyone... Sometimes you have to make a token concession or two (that have nothing to do with ideals) if you don't want to make more enemies than you've already got. It's conceding a minscule battle to help continue to win the war.

+rep. You do NV YOUR way. We'll do MN OUR way. Afterall, it seems to be working out pretty well for us so far.

[TheTexan]

It is in the media's best interests for Romney to win. Period.

True, but the reason they marginalize Paul is not for the money. Maybe some in the media marginalize him for the money. Most just do it for free though.

[majormike]

As a Minnesota delegate I agreed with the decision. Yes we would have won on a second ballot but there was a lot gained. We need Michele to help Kurt Bills beat Amy in the Senate race. A touch of class will go along way.

[Bilgefisher]

I applaud the Minnesota folks for their decision. Many of the old guard view us as usurpers. This is a statement saying "we are here to improve the party, we are not here to slash and burn." Its also a powerful statement that we have the power to remove anyone. You have been warned. This olive branch may yield us many victories down the road.

[Matt Collins]

Maybe they can convince her voting for Ron Paul is what would be best for her career, given that Ron Paulians now run the MN GOP.
so can we primary her in two years if she continues her statist path?Uh, her political existence is now completely dependent upon the Ron Paul supporters in Minnesota. There are already plans in the works to have someone run against her next time if her voting doesn't become 100% liberty between now and then.

[Matt Collins]

I applaud the Minnesota folks for their decision. Many of the old guard view us as usurpers. This is a statement saying "we are here to improve the party, we are not here to slash and burn." Its also a powerful statement that we have the power to remove anyone. You have been warned. This olive branch may yield us many victories down the road.Bingo!

[Matt Collins]

JohnM, thank you for the complements, I am one of those going to Tampa from MN. Having met MB several times, she's a bold faced liar who is dumber than a bag of hammers. The brains behind the botox is her husband and her country club republican handlers at w00dale church. There's no hope on reforming her mindset. She probably won't even go on the floor unless it's for a ceremony or glamor shot infront of a camera. She'll be too busy pandering to big money to pay off her campaign debt.Since when did you start paying attention to Ron Paul Forums? ;) :p :D

[Matt Collins]

We didn't GIVE her the spot. She may have won it anyway. Here's why: Up for grabs were 13 delegate spots (the other 27 had already been awarded at district conventions and to party leaders). Candidates needed 50%+1 to get a spot. If fewer than 13 people got 50%+1 on the first ballot, it would go to additional ballots. 12 of our people met that threshhold. MB and one of ours did not. Rather than going to a runoff against MB, he conceded the spot to her. He may have won against her, but that is far from certain.No, our voting strength at that point in the MNGOP Convention was between 53-55%. She would've lost that re-balloting which is what I wanted to happen. But I have come around to seeing the benefits of ceding the seat to her. Not to mention she probably won't be on the floor of the RNC Con in Tampa much at all (especially since she'll be surrounded by RP supporters) which means we'll have an alternate take her slot.


Representative Bachamann's political career is in our hands, and she will only be reelected in 2 years at our pleasure.

[satchelmcqueen]

bachman called paul dangerous and tried to make him look like a liar at one of the debates. theres no way she will vote for ron.

[Matt Collins]

Part of the plan is to take the Kurt Bills for Senate ECON 101 bus down to Tampa Guess who will be driving?


:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x93/sonicspikesalbum/MNGOPStateCon/CIMG0082-e.jpg

[Matt Collins]

theres no way she will vote for ron.If her future political career depends on it, she very well might. Just sayin'

[Eric39]

A vote for Romney?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who has said "I believe that abortion should be safe and legal in this country"?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for a guy who supported the bailouts?

Do you really think that a nice conservative lady like Michelle Bachmann will vote for the guy who wrote the blueprint for Obamacare?

Do you really think that the eloquent Ron Paul delegates on Minnesota delegation will not be able to convince her that the good doctor is the best candidate, not only to beat Obama, but also to stand up for conservative principles?

;)

If I thought politicians meant what they said I'd vote for Obama, shit, I'd be a full blown communist if you could count on what people say, but people in government say things for power, and that's why I'm a libertarian.

[FSP-Rebel]

Guess who will be driving?


:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x93/sonicspikesalbum/MNGOPStateCon/CIMG0082-e.jpg
Oh my..

[FSP-Rebel]

Guess who will be driving?


:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

http://i185.photobucket.com/albums/x93/sonicspikesalbum/MNGOPStateCon/CIMG0082-e.jpg
Oh my..

[brushfire]

Oh my..

...the candy man

[puppetmaster]

If her future political career depends on it, she very well might. Just sayin' somepeople just don't get it. Just sayin
with friends like these who needs enemies? She will absolutely sell us out first chance she gets. Anyhow guess we will just disagree and keep working for the best

[Matt Collins]

somepeople just don't get it. Just sayin
with friends like these who needs enemies? She will absolutely sell us out first chance she gets. Anyhow guess we will just disagree and keep working for the bestRead this, and then you'll understand: http://training4liberty.org/facl/important_info.html