Constitutional Republic Vs. Representative Democracy

[lib3rtarian]

I know the whole distinction between Republic vs. Democracy and what we are etc, but when we elect a representative by popular vote, isn't it democracy at play? For example, a Senate/House Rep. election. So is it correct to say that this is a Constitutional Republic which functions as a Representative Democracy?

[FrankRep]

The United States was founded as a Constitutional Republic.


Years of corruption later:

Now the system is called "Constitutional Republic," looks like a "Representative Democracy," but behind the scenes it operates like a Oligarchy.

[lib3rtarian]

In a "Constitutional Republic", how are the members of the Congress, Senators & the President elected? How is it different from the current "Representative Democracy"?

[Philosophy_of_Politics]

The country was technically a Constitutional Republic, but in reality it was a Representative Constitutional Republic.

[FrankRep]

The country was technically a Constitutional Republic, but in reality it was a Representative Constitutional Republic.

"Representative" is implied by being a Constitutional Republic.

[thoughtomator]

The difference between republican and democratic forms of government is that the former respects inalienable rights while the latter knows no such boundaries to its exercise of power.

[FrankRep]

Republic vs. Democracy


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DioQooFIcgE
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DioQooFIcgE

[lib3rtarian]

The country was technically a Constitutional Republic, but in reality it was a Representative Constitutional Republic.

What is the difference between a "Representative Constitutional Republic" and a "Representative Democracy"? That is the part I am not clear on. If we are not a "Representative Democracy", how does a "Representative Democracy" work?

[KenInMontiMN]

We didn't start out as a representative democracy in principle but have certainly moved in that direction, the biggest structural change being the surrendering of statehouse control over the US Senate. The US House was to be the body where representative democracy ruled directly; not the Senate and not the Presidency.

[pcosmar]

Representative Socialism v Democratic Socialism
+Authoritarianism

:(

[heavenlyboy34]

The difference between republican and democratic forms of government is that the former respects inalienable rights while the latter knows no such boundaries to its exercise of power.
Tell that to the folks who lived in the Roman and Soviet republics. ;)

[heavenlyboy34]

The United States was founded as a Constitutional Republic.


Years of corruption later:

Now the system is called "Constitutional Republic," looks like a "Representative Democracy," but behind the scenes it operates like a Oligarchy.
It was founded as a Confederation. (hence the Articles of Confederation)

[LibertyEagle]

What is the difference between a "Representative Constitutional Republic" and a "Representative Democracy"? That is the part I am not clear on. If we are not a "Representative Democracy", how does a "Representative Democracy" work?

I think you know the answer to this from what you said in your first post. Think about it. A republic is rule by law, where the rights of the minority, or the one, are protected against the force of the majority. In a democracy, even if duly elected, whatever the majority says, goes. To heck with the rights of the minority, or the one. Democracy is majority rule.

[thoughtomator]

Tell that to the folks who lived in the Roman and Soviet republics. ;)

Something can call itself a republic without actually being one. North Korea calls itself "democratic", heh.

[pcosmar]

Something can call itself a republic without actually being one. North Korea calls itself "democratic", heh.

"You can make your mouth say anything"

[FrankRep]

The difference between republican and democratic forms of government is that the former respects inalienable rights while the latter knows no such boundaries to its exercise of power.


Tell that to the folks who lived in the Roman and Soviet republics. ;)

Thoughtomator, a *Constitutional* Republic respects inalienable rights, but a "Republic" just means rule of law so you can have a Soviet republic with tons of evil laws.

[heavenlyboy34]

I think you know the answer to this from what you said in your first post. Think about it. A republic is rule by law, where the rights of the minority, or the one, are protected against the force of the majority. In a democracy, even if duly elected, whatever the majority says, goes. To heck with the rights of the minority, or the one. Democracy is majority rule.

Only in very specific sorts of republics. Even China uses a form of Republicanism. (I don't say this to be mean-I'm just a nit-picker. :) )

A republic is a form of government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_of_government) in which the government is officially apportioned to the control of the people and thus a "public matter" (Latin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin): res publica) and where offices of state are subsequently directly or indirectly elected or appointed.[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-0)[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-Britannica-1) In modern times, a common simplified definition of a republic is a government where the head of state is not a monarch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarch).[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-WordNet-2)[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-M-W-3) The word republic is derived from the Latin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin) phrase res publica (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Res_publica), which can be translated as "the public affair", and often used to describe a state (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_(polity)) using this form of government.


ETA: looks like Frank effectively beat me to this one. Oh, well. /shrugs

[lib3rtarian]

We didn't start out as a representative democracy in principle but have certainly moved in that direction, the biggest structural change being the surrendering of statehouse control over the US Senate. The US House was to be the body where representative democracy ruled directly; not the Senate and not the Presidency.

So if I read this correct, the US House is elected by Representative Democracy even in a Constitutional Republic? How is the US Senate and the Presidency elected in a Constitutional Republic?


It was founded as a Confederation. (hence the Articles of Confederation)

So it was not a Constitutional Republic at all? :confused:

[LibertyEagle]

Only in very specific sorts of republics. Even China uses a form of Republicanism. (I don't say this to be mean-I'm just a nit-picker. :) )

A republic is a form of government (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_of_government) in which the government is officially apportioned to the control of the people and thus a "public matter" (Latin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin): res publica) and where offices of state are subsequently directly or indirectly elected or appointed.[1] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-0)[2] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-Britannica-1) In modern times, a common simplified definition of a republic is a government where the head of state is not a monarch (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monarch).[3] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-WordNet-2)[4] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Republic#cite_note-M-W-3) The word republic is derived from the Latin (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latin) phrase res publica (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Res_publica), which can be translated as "the public affair", and often used to describe a state (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_(polity)) using this form of government.


ETA: looks like Frank effectively beat me to this one. Oh, well. /shrugs

:rolleyes:

Yes, yes, hb, we have all watched the video.

[LibertyEagle]

So it was not a Constitutional Republic at all? :confused:

He's just unintentionally confusing you. Before we had the Constitution, we had the Articles of Confederation and a few here wish we still had it instead of the Constitution.


So if I read this correct, the US House is elected by Representative Democracy even in a Constitutional Republic? How is the US Senate and the Presidency elected in a Constitutional Republic?

Prior to the 17th amendment, U.S. senators were elected by state legislatures. This ensured that the power resided with the states. If a senator stopped doing what they wanted, they could be yanked out. Likewise, our attention was on the state government. If we didn't like what the state or federal government was doing, we would replace the state legislators. It was a lot easier to do in the smaller pond of the state. The U.S. House was where all the monetary appropriations (purse strings) existed, so they were elected every 2 years and were chosen directly by the people.

The 17th Amendment was a very bad amendment, because it essentially neutered the states and led to this massive federal government that we have now.

The President is not elected by a mere popular vote, either. In reality, they are chosen by the electoral college. And you have seen how it is the delegates that matter; not the popular vote.

[Proph]

In a constitutional republic, the people's rights are (supposedly) protected by rules/laws written in said constitution. In a representative democracy, popular vote rules. Just break it down word by word.

^^My thoughts, at least.