MN CD1

[truthdivides]

I'm writing this having been awake for the past 26 hours, hopefully I make some sense. I'll give everyone an update on the MN CD1 convention where I was a delegate.


8:30am start time.
We fought the rules and lost, didn't have the numbers.
Proceeded with business, no hiccups.
11am cast 1st ballot for congressional endorsement between Quist (our guy) and Parry.
2pm cast ballot for national delegates.
We won 2/3 national delegates.
4pm cast ballot for national alternates.
We won 2/3 national alternates.
Quist gaining votes from behind.
CD officers elected. Paul supporter is elected CD1 Chair. Paul supporter is elected State Party Exec Committee Rep.
9pm Quist/Parry confrontation (see below)
12am ballots still being cast
1:30am 23rd and final ballot, Parry at 126, Quist at 137, 158 needed to win (60%)
2am convention adjourned with no endorsement.



The congressional endorsement was not moving at all, so Quist challenged Parry to a debate after Parry said he would never backdown from a fight because he has the backbone to stand up to people. Parry completely ignores the challenge and is booed and jeered at throughout his small speech. Quist gains the lead on the next ballot for the first time all night. Parry comes back acting hurt over the boos, tries to rally his troops, says he never attacked Quist over certain things he had said.

Quist comes back with a piece of paper Parry distributed to all delegates which was attacking Quist over those specific things he had said. Quist proceeds to surgically tear Parry apart about misquoting him, lying to people, etc etc, just destroying Parry. A repeated issue for this congressional endorsement is the ability to beat the incumbent DFL congressman. Parry kept saying he is a winner and electable. Quist described that he would attack Walz (the DFL guy) over his weak points and not give him any ammo to use against him. Quist demonstrated this ability by attacking Parry at his weak points and not giving Parry anything to use against him. I wish I had video of all of these exchanges, it was so intense. Despite this, the establishment voting block would not budge from Parry and kept us all there until 2am with no endorsement. That is 17 1/2 hours of my life I will never get back. Most of it spent voting between Quist and Parry 23 times.

I'm not sure what happens next for the endorsement, there may be a primary. The convention was a big win for liberty though: 2/3 national delegates, 2/3 national alternates, liberty minded CD Chair, and liberty minded State Party Exec Comm Rep.

Overall for MN we have 20/24 delegates (and a boatload of alternates) with 13 more to be elected at the state convention in May. The final 3 delegates are party members.

[sailingaway]

I understand there will be another call to finish the endorsement process. Is there ANY possibility they will be able to undo Ron's delegates?

But congratulations! Ron Paul won a plurality of MN's delegates last night!

[Titus]

I think that is why no one is leaving.

[FSP-Rebel]

That is 17 1/2 hours of my life I will never get back. Most of it spent voting between Quist and Parry 23 times.

Oh my, that sounds like the worst jury deliberation of all time. Good news on the delegate front tho.

[truthdivides]

I understand there will be another call to finish the endorsement process. Is there ANY possibility they will be able to undo Ron's delegates?

I believe if they have a 2/3 majority they can undo any business that was completed yesterday.

[truthdivides]

I understand there will be another call to finish the endorsement process. Is there ANY possibility they will be able to undo Ron's delegates?

I believe if they have a 2/3 majority they can undo any business that was completed yesterday.

[sailingaway]

I believe if they have a 2/3 majority they can undo any business that was completed yesterday.

So our guys REALLY have to know that and be there!!! Let us know when the call comes so we can help GOTV!! I'm sure THEY will!

[truthdivides]

http://mnloon.tumblr.com/post/21559168667/what-a-day-and-night-and-early-morning-in-mankato

[davidkuck]

11am cast 1st ballot for congressional endorsement between Quist (our guy) and Parry.

Despite this, the establishment voting block would not budge from Parry and kept us all there until 2am with no endorsement.



Another CD1 delegate here. First off, I'm a Ron Paul supporter too. I'm also good friends and getting more familiar with what you call "the establishment". Let me just say that these sorts of statements HURT the cause, perpetuating an "us vs. them" mentality.
At the CD1 convention, I even heard accusations of Olmsted County (the largest delegation with 61 delegates) supposedly trying to hurt the chances of Ron Paul delegates (at the BPOU level) and what not. Let me just come out and say that is flat out false. I know the chair of Olmsted county personally and have been in contact with him. He has done nothing to try to prevent Ron Paul supporters from getting involved or whatnot and is hurt by accusations of favoritism, being non-liberty minded, etc. If accusing "the establishment" of anti-Ron Paul action stops and if everyone that's elected delegate actually sticks around and stays involved in the republican party 2012, 2014, and beyond, it will legitimatize the Ron Paul/liberty movement and encourage a sense of unity.
If you sense hurt feelings and apprehension, you're probably right there. Many of the 2008 delegates disappeared after the endorsing conventions and all of the "establishment" was left to pick up the pieces. Those wounds and feelings of betrayal are still in their minds. They're hoping this year will be different, but scared that it won't be. Apprehension? Yes. Bias against Ron Paul? Not that I've seen.

Let's all prove them wrong, stay active and involved, and help take back this country in 2012 and beyond! We're on the same side! :) Let's beat Tim Walz in November!

[LKMN]

Another CD1 delegate here. First off, I'm a Ron Paul supporter too. I'm also good friends and getting more familiar with what you call "the establishment". Let me just say that these sorts of statements HURT the cause, perpetuating an "us vs. them" mentality.
At the CD1 convention, I even heard accusations of Olmsted County (the largest delegation with 61 delegates) supposedly trying to hurt the chances of Ron Paul delegates (at the BPOU level) and what not. Let me just come out and say that is flat out false. I know the chair of Olmsted county personally and have been in contact with him. He has done nothing to try to prevent Ron Paul supporters from getting involved or whatnot and is hurt by accusations of favoritism, being non-liberty minded, etc. If accusing "the establishment" of anti-Ron Paul action stops and if everyone that's elected delegate actually sticks around and stays involved in the republican party 2012, 2014, and beyond, it will legitimatize the Ron Paul/liberty movement and encourage a sense of unity.
If you sense hurt feelings and apprehension, you're probably right there. Many of the 2008 delegates disappeared after the endorsing conventions and all of the "establishment" was left to pick up the pieces. Those wounds and feelings of betrayal are still in their minds. They're hoping this year will be different, but scared that it won't be. Apprehension? Yes. Bias against Ron Paul? Not that I've seen.

Let's all prove them wrong, stay active and involved, and help take back this country in 2012 and beyond! We're on the same side! :) Let's beat Tim Walz in November!

I couldn't agree more. I'm an avid Ron Paul supporter BUT I am also attempting be become active in the MN republican party and make a difference in the long term. Many MN repubs are very gun-shy in regards to my support for Ron Paul, since I am also both new and young. Yes we need to be watchful for fairness, but at the same time we need to show them that ultimately we are ON THEIR TEAM, and are not going to abandon the party at the first chance we get. Attend your BPOU meetings and local nominating conventions, make friends, and run for local office if you don't like the way things are being done.
After all - this is a movement for liberty in all aspects of government, not just the Presidency.

[helmuth_hubener]

If accusing "the establishment" of anti-Ron Paul action stops...it will legitimatize the Ron Paul/liberty movement and encourage a sense of unity. Wrong. There are people who hate us. Politics is not a game consisting all of warm fuzzies and nice people. If you think they are nice, they have duped you. This is not too surprising, since duping people is what they have specialized in. That is what it means to be in politics: to be an expert liar, manipulator, and actor.


...[W]e need to show them that ultimately we are ON THEIR TEAM... Wrong. Many of them are opposed to us. They do not think of us as on their team. You can try to be all lovey-dovey with them. They will smile and slap you on the back and act like they are your best friends. But they are not really your friends. They hate you. You are trying to undermine and destroy their power. You are a threat. One of the best ways to neutralize you as a threat is to convince you that they're your friends and get you to "play nice" because after all you're all on the "same team." Convincing enemies that they are really friends is one of the prime skills of a politician or political operative (e.g. a county chairman).

None of this is reason to necessarily be mean or rude to them. You can slap them on the back and joke around with them right back, if you can stomach that kind of thing. Just be sure that you're laughing all the way to the bank by destroying their side in the end. Their side is evil. It really needs to be destroyed.

[enrique]

I would have to respectfully disagree with you helmuth. The "establishment" is certainly behind people they think can win but it is not some all-encompassing Borg that thinks and acts alike. They are all different just as all people are different.

Some are truly friendly and want to grow the party with whomever wants to help. Some are petty and will protect their 'turf' at all costs and will fight every person who wants to challenge anything.

But above all, they want the party to succeed and for people to get involved and be friendly and helpful. My county party is the very definition of establishment but they are happy to have people help out and let me as a known Paul supporter be active. Of course, I contribute to the local party and do a little volunteering but they are fair. The thing that bugs them most is people who come with an agenda which is not one of building and growing the party but just dropping in to cause havoc and then disappearing for two or four years.

I'm sure some dislike my presence but I've had many more appreciate my passion and willingness to get involved and fight government excess, etc.

The key to remember is that the local parties are really just like little social clubs (yes, I realize more is at stake than bingo) and if you try to be a part of it and participate cordially you will be welcomed. And... if you are just a rabble rouser they will look to purge you. And since they have a history of many single issue/candidate people blowing in and out they are going to naturally be a little more wary of new people.

[LKMN]

Wrong. Many of them are opposed to us. They do not think of us as on their team. You can try to be all lovey-dovey with them. They will smile and slap you on the back and act like they are your best friends. But they are not really your friends. They hate you. You are trying to undermine and destroy their power. You are a threat. One of the best ways to neutralize you as a threat is to convince you that they're your friends and get you to "play nice" because after all you're all on the "same team." Convincing enemies that they are really friends is one of the prime skills of a politician or political operative (e.g. a county chairman).


You can't lump every single conservative who doesn't have a Ron Paul bumper sticker into some category of political evil and corruption. In doing so - you sound just like them.

Yes - you are correct *many* of them are 'opposed' to us - especially the higher you get in the political heirarchy. But guess what? Many, (particularly the everyday joes at the grassroots conservative level), are also curious. Many have simply been misinformed and are slowly starting to come out of the darkness. But I promise you that by constantly shouting "SNAKE!" every time there's a small rustle in the grass, you will not win these people over, you will simply look like a fanatic. At that point, you will be blacklisted and unable to make a difference anywhere.
When the local 'crazy man' is standing out on the street corner holding a sign, it doesn't matter how much truth there may be in the words on the sign - in the eyes of the passersby he's still just 'a crazy man holding a sign'

[LKMN]

And by they way, I'm obviously not saying that you or anyone else here is crazy. I'm talking about how the media has been trying to brand us, by taking a small sampling of slightly fanatical RP supporters and presenting them as the majority.
Sound familiar?

[JK/SEA]

so, rewarding people in the 'old' guard for helping and enabling to get this country to go down the drain is a good thing?....

fuck that...

there's a new wind blowing, and it wants to replace the dirty air with fresh.

[LKMN]

No-one is talking about rewarding anyone with anything. What I AM talking about is not assuming that every single Rebuplican that's not a Ron Paul supporter is corrupt and out to sabatoge us at every turn. I went into this thing with that mentality. And believe me - there have been plenty of people I have run into who have lived up to this reputation. But for every person who confirmed my suspicion of evil cronyism, there have been at least as many who have pleasantly surprised me with their openness.

Example:
At our district convention we had two young alternates who were clearly RP supporters that initially did not get seated. Halfway through, we had two delegates decide to up and leave without telling anyone. (Just came to rub elbows I suspect) The rest of us RP supporters did not even notice this because there was some intense balloting going on. The person who noticed was our county chairwoman, a Santorum-Romney supporter who has been around forever...you know, one of those 'Establishment' people. She got up and started looking for them. When they couldn't be found she marched right up to the chairman and took him aside. Two minutes later our RP alternates were seated - all of this while an intense battle for delegates was going on, and two more people would have been enough to impact the vote (in OUR favor, by the way). She's not stupid, she just did what she knew was the right thing.

Now don't get me wrong, I don't think the chairman was too happy about it, but he didn't really have a choice since she brought it up.

[helmuth_hubener]

But I promise you that by constantly shouting "SNAKE!" every time there's a small rustle in the grass, you will not win these people over, you will simply look like a fanatic. I do not yell "snake" (to their faces. Except for sometimes). I just quietly and deliberately fight them. And win (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?367245-Ron-Paul-Wins-Another-County-How-We-Did-It-and-You-Can-Too&p=4282170#post4282170).

Expecting to win over sexagenarian political tools is unrealistic. To each his own; if you want to waste your time with that have at it. I'm sure there's things I do which you would see as wasting time.

In reality, I probably have followed your advice far more than you think, more perhaps than even yourself. I have gone to these people's houses and sat down in their living rooms and talked to them one on one. I have convinced them to vote for me for delegate. But I am under no illusions that I will ever persuade them to change their minds about anything. You just fool them. You make them like you. You make them feel like you're on their side. That's the political way.

I'm not saying you need to be angry and confrontational, shouting "War Criminal!" at Dick Cheney, although let's be honest, I'm all for that. I'm just saying have your eyes wide open, understand what's going on, and be the one doing the fooling, not the one being fooled.

[LKMN]

I I'm just saying have your eyes wide open, understand what's going on, and be the one doing the fooling, not the one being fooled.

Cheers to that.

[Bastiat's The Law]

http://cdn.screenrant.com/wp-content/uploads/Tyrion-Lannister-in-Game-of-Thrones-Season-2.jpg

"I understand the way this game is played."

- Tyrion Lannister

[surf]

The key to remember is that the local parties are really just like little social clubs (yes, I realize more is at stake than bingo) and if you try to be a part of it and participate cordially you will be welcomed. And... if you are just a rabble rouser they will look to purge you. And since they have a history of many single issue/candidate people blowing in and out they are going to naturally be a little more wary of new people.
i've been a pco for 5 years now and during that period my local and state parties have not selected any candidates that i would dream of walking my precinct for. i couldn't get an endorsement for the initiative we used to get rid of the red-light cameras, and i've had fellow "social club" members asking me to help them defend marriage. in short, save for a couple of our guys this is not a social club i would ever belong to.

when they come around or we take them over is when i'll see it as a social club i'd have a bit of pride in my membership. not to say that i don't get the point you're making. it may be different where you are.

anyway, congrats to MN. i remember ice-fishing w/my dad as a 5-yr old prior to moving west. good people.