Police Officer Shot at Wal Mart

[mrsat_98]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/national/police-say-officer-fatally-shot-at-walmart-in-austin-suspect-in-custody/2012/04/06/gIQApojMzS_story.html

AUSTIN, Texas — A police officer was shot and killed early Friday while responding to a routine call about a drunk man at a Walmart in Central Texas, and a suspect is in custody, police said.

Austin Police Chief Art Acevedo said the officer was shot in the neck and died at the scene.


“This was a routine call. What makes our job deadly is that there is no routine call,” Acevedo said.

Two Walmart employees tackled and held the suspect until another police officer arrived to arrest him. The police chief declined to provide more details, including the officer’s name, citing the ongoing investigation.

[azxd]

This is going to be an unpopular thread ... Too many vocal cop haters on the RPF.

[pcosmar]

This is going to be an unpopular thread ... Too many vocal cop haters on the RPF.

It is the concept of police that I oppose, as well as the effective reality of the Police State.
Not people. Though it seems that some of the worst seem to be drawn to that "profession".

That said,, looking at several stories on this,, there is much that does not make sense. Will be looking for more info on this.

So far,, an Asiatic man,,allegedly highly intoxicated.
Cop shot in the neck at close range (point blank) and two store employees subdued the shooter.

Some questions,,

[echebota]

Police officer is a dangerous job. The thread would not be popular not becouse of cop haters but simply becouse there are no details provided and you can not draw any judgement or lessons here. IF there was no justification for attacking a cop obviously the guy would rightfully go to jail for a long time.

[kcchiefs6465]

Thank you for another perspective. I have had too many horrid experiences with police officers, for lack of a better word :rolleyes:, to ever mourn a cop. My condolences if he was of relations.

[tod evans]

I only wish for the shooter to be tried in the same court under the same laws as the cops are who shoot civilians.

[fisharmor]

This is going to be an unpopular thread ... Too many vocal cop haters on the RPF.

Indeed, and I have learned a couple valuable lessons from this story....

1) When it's a mundane shot in the neck or getting robbed, the cops tell us all to cower in the corner and hope for the best.
When it's a priest of the state-god getting killed, tackling the shooter is DOING WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO.

2) You do not need a six-week training course, body armor, a souped-up cruiser, several firearms, a license to beat up and/or kill anyone you choose, and swarms of backup on command, in order to apprehend criminals.

[kcchiefs6465]

I only wish for the shooter to be tried in the same court under the same laws as the cops are who shoot civilians.
Well put.

[tfurrh]

People of Wal Mart & Police
its almost like the orcs and the uruk-hai - someones bound to die.

[pcosmar]

Police officer is a dangerous job..

Bullshit, not even in the top 10 most dangerous jobs.

[DamianTV]

The Police Officers are Human Beings. We all are.

The Police State is Inhumane and is the source of Police Abuse of the People.

[tfurrh]

nvmnd

[pcosmar]

This is the officer that was shot. Antonio Buehler, the interviewer, is a RP supporter and a friend of mine.

That says he is the police Chief.. Is this the correct guy?

[tfurrh]

That says he is the police Chief.. Is this the correct guy?
Yeah,....I was wrong. They haven't released the name of the officer killed.

[JK/SEA]

replace ..'cop shot in neck dies' with':

teacher
garbage man
welder
fruit picker
store owner
store worker
butcher
baker
candle stick maker
web site owner

etc.

i wonder if any on my list would get round the clock news coverage and a 10 mile long funeral procession with news copters bringing you the event 'live' on your idiot box?

[phill4paul]

Bullshit, not even in the top 10 most dangerous jobs.

Actually I think that last year they made it to the top 10.

Occupations with the highest rate of fatal work injuries (deaths per 100,000 workers):
workers).

Fishermen (116.0) — In late June, two people died when a 20-foot fishing boat capsized near the top of Alaska’s panhandle. A third person was able to climb on top of the overturned skiff where he waited for rescue. As the BLS states, “this occupation is characterized by strenuous work, long hours, seasonal employment, and some of the most hazardous conditions in the workforce.”
Logging workers (91.9) — This occupation repeatedly takes a spot in the top 10 as not only one of America’s, but the world’s, most dangerous jobs. In one recent example, 61-year-old John Hutt, a Colorado logger, cut off his toes after he became trapped under heavy logging equipment. He then drove himself to an area where there was enough cellphone reception to call an ambulance. In the logging industry, he is considered one of the lucky ones.
Airplane pilots and flight engineers (70.6) — It may be hard to believe that working as a police officer is safer than flying a plane, but according to the BLS, this is true. The bureau states that there were 78 fatal work injuries for this industry in 2010.
Farmers and ranchers (41.4) — In August, a 40-year-old Illinois farmer was crushed to death by his tractor after it fell into a hole on his farm, which he was filling with dirt. And just this month a woman was hit and run over by a skid loader on a farm in Wisconsin. She was pronounced dead on the scene.
Mining machine operators (38.7) — The most infamous accident within this industry is undoubtedly the Upper Big Branch Mine explosion in April of 2010, which claimed the lives of 29 out of the 31 miners on site. The accident was the worst in the United States since 1970, when 38 minters were killed at Finley Coal Company’s mines in Kentucky.
Roofers (32.4) — Just three weeks ago, four roofers in San Francisco were seriously injured when the roof of a six-story apartment complex collapsed under them. And in April, a 56-year-old worker was re-securing metal roof panels on a building at Horenberger Field at Illinois Wesleyan University when he fell from scaffolding. He died in the hospital eight days later and his employer, Union Roofing, was cited by OSHA for two safety violations.
Sanitation workers (29.8) — A tragic accident occurred on Labor Day when a 17-year-old sanitation employee fell off of a moving garbage truck and was run over, killing him instantly.
Truck drivers and delivery workers (21.8) — In March of last year, a commercial truck driver was using his cellphone to make a call when his truck crossed the median in central Kentucky, striking a van that was carrying 12 members of a family. 10 people in the van plus the truck driver were killed. Just this week, the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board, concluding its investigation of the crash, recommended banning the use of mobile phones by commercial drivers except in emergencies.
Industrial machine workers (20.3) — The number of accidents in this field is staggering. In January 2010, a Florida man had his genitals severed off after an accident involving machinery at an Future Foam Carpet Cushion in Orlando. The company was was fined $42,500 by OSHA for 10 serious safety violations.
Police officers (18.0) — In 2010, there was a nearly 40% increase in line-of-duty deaths among U.S. law enforcement. The most recent officer death involved Deputy Sheriff Derrick Whittle of the Union County, Georgia, Sheriff’s Office. He was killed in an automobile accident while responding to a call on September 18th. He is the 48th law enforcement officer to be killed in a traffic-related incident in 2011.

Still, without any accurate tracking, I would say death BY cop is far more likely than death OF cop.

[pcosmar]

Actually I think that last year they made it to the top 10.


Well I stand corrected then, they are at the bottom of the top 10.

I have done several of those jobs.. I started logging at 12 yrs old, and still cut wood for heat all winter long.
I thank God every day that I come out of the woods with all my extremities attached.

[donnay]

This is tragic--regardless. My heart goes out to his children--not sure he has a wife, because they didn't seem to mention it in the article.

One thing that baffles me is why the police chief declined to identify the suspect? What is the point of this?

[phill4paul]

I've done Farmwork, Roofing, Delivery work, Industrial machine operation and a bit of self logging when I cleared some land in Virginia. In none of these positions would I have described what I was doing as 'dangerous' as in 'this is such dangerous work I should be considered a hero.'
And while it is not in the top-ten, and fairly low in terms of fatalities, I'd have to say of any job the one that I considered 'dangerous' would have been bouncing.

[Occam's Banana]

“This was a routine call. What makes our job deadly is that there is no routine call,” Acevedo said.
Ahhhh. That's *exactly* how I like my vacuous platitudes - contradictory, yet non-sensical.

[DerailingDaTrain]

It is the concept of police that I oppose, as well as the effective reality of the Police State.
Not people. Though it seems that some of the worst seem to be drawn to that "profession".

This

+rep

[Anti Federalist]

Well I stand corrected then, they are at the bottom of the top 10.

I have done several of those jobs.. I started logging at 12 yrs old, and still cut wood for heat all winter long.
I thank God every day that I come out of the woods with all my extremities attached.

The majority of those deaths are traffic related as well.

Based on the last few years of stats, they are usually around 11 or 12.

[Revolution9]

Indeed, and I have learned a couple valuable lessons from this story....

1) When it's a mundane shot in the neck or getting robbed, the cops tell us all to cower in the corner and hope for the best.
When it's a priest of the state-god getting killed, tackling the shooter is DOING WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO.

2) You do not need a six-week training course, body armor, a souped-up cruiser, several firearms, a license to beat up and/or kill anyone you choose, and swarms of backup on command, in order to apprehend criminals.

To cut your hair, dye it and do your nails you have to go to school for two years to get certified.

following the numbering paradigm established by FishArmor..

1)Women who get a bad dye job are more dangerous than criminals with guns and bad attitudes.

2)Becoming a cop is much easier than becoming a hair dresser.

HTH
Rev9

[mrsat_98]

http://start.toshiba.com/news/read.php?rip_id=%3CD9TVDC900%40news.ap.org%3E&ps=931

AUSTIN, Texas (AP) — A police officer was shot and killed early Friday at a Walmart in Central Texas, and a suspect is in custody, police said.

Austin Police Chief Art Acevedo said the officer was shot in the neck and died at the scene. The department identified him as Senior Police Officer Jaime Padron and said he had two daughters, ages 10 and six.

Padron was responding to a call about a drunk man inside the store around 2:30 a.m., Acevedo said. The suspect attacked the officer as soon as he arrived at the store and Padron didn't have a chance to even pull out his own weapon.

"The suspect produced a semi-automatic pistol and shot the officer at point blank range," Acevedo said. The wounded officer was able to call for help using his police radio, he added.

The police chief declined to identify the suspect, who was being held at the Travis County jail.

"This was a routine call," Acevedo said. "What makes our job deadly is that there is no routine call."

Two Walmart employees tackled and held the suspect and locked down the store until another police officer arrived to arrest him. Acevedo praised their actions, saying they did all they were supposed to do. He said store video captured the entire incident.

"I am heartened that two brave souls took action. They tackled the suspect when they saw the officer was shot unprovoked," Acevedo said. Once the suspect was handcuffed, another officer gave Padron CPR and medics tried to revive him, but they pronounced the officer dead at 2:44 a.m.

Acevedo said Padron worked at the department for more than three years and had previously worked for the Austin airport police and the San Angelo police department.

Wal-Mart Stores Inc. spokeswoman Dianna Gee expressed sympathy for the officer's family and colleagues, and said the Bentonville, Ark.-based retailer is proud of staff at the store.

"The associates displayed courage under these extreme circumstances," Gee said. She declined to provide more details about the shooting, referring questions to the police.

Austin city manager Marc Ott lamented the officer's death.

"It is a sad day for the city of Austin to lose a member of our family," Ott said.

Pedro Garcia and his roommate, Sapna Sharma, who live in the suburb of Pflugerville, told the Austin American-Statesman they were grocery shopping at the back of the store when they heard gunfire.

"I felt like something fell really hard," Sharma said.

They said an employee told them there had been a shooting and that more than a dozen officers swarmed into the store.

[Anti Federalist]

For 2011, 173 total cops died.

For 2012, the number of cops killed by gunfire is down 57% from 2011, BTW.

http://www.odmp.org/search/year

But, guess what, no solid number exists for people killed by cops.

I've seen some older stats, that the links is no longer good for, and some other anecdotal numbers, but, nothing firm.

Based on what I've read, anywhere from 500 to 1000 "arrest related" deaths per year.

I'll keep looking and post solid numbers if I can find them.


Nationally, police killed 1,553 people between 2003 and 2006, the latest federal figures available. Ohio, the seventh-largest state, ranked eighth with 66 deaths. California led with 277, followed by Florida with 157, Texas with 153 and Arizona with 114.

http://www.dispatch.com/content/stories/local/2011/02/06/police_shootings.html

So, about 500 a year, based on figures from 2006.



Actually I think that last year they made it to the top 10.

Occupations with the highest rate of fatal work injuries (deaths per 100,000 workers):
workers).

Fishermen (116.0) — In late June, two people died when a 20-foot fishing boat capsized near the top of Alaska’s panhandle. A third person was able to climb on top of the overturned skiff where he waited for rescue. As the BLS states, “this occupation is characterized by strenuous work, long hours, seasonal employment, and some of the most hazardous conditions in the workforce.”
Logging workers (91.9) — This occupation repeatedly takes a spot in the top 10 as not only one of America’s, but the world’s, most dangerous jobs. In one recent example, 61-year-old John Hutt, a Colorado logger, cut off his toes after he became trapped under heavy logging equipment. He then drove himself to an area where there was enough cellphone reception to call an ambulance. In the logging industry, he is considered one of the lucky ones.
Airplane pilots and flight engineers (70.6) — It may be hard to believe that working as a police officer is safer than flying a plane, but according to the BLS, this is true. The bureau states that there were 78 fatal work injuries for this industry in 2010.
Farmers and ranchers (41.4) — In August, a 40-year-old Illinois farmer was crushed to death by his tractor after it fell into a hole on his farm, which he was filling with dirt. And just this month a woman was hit and run over by a skid loader on a farm in Wisconsin. She was pronounced dead on the scene.
Mining machine operators (38.7) — The most infamous accident within this industry is undoubtedly the Upper Big Branch Mine explosion in April of 2010, which claimed the lives of 29 out of the 31 miners on site. The accident was the worst in the United States since 1970, when 38 minters were killed at Finley Coal Company’s mines in Kentucky.
Roofers (32.4) — Just three weeks ago, four roofers in San Francisco were seriously injured when the roof of a six-story apartment complex collapsed under them. And in April, a 56-year-old worker was re-securing metal roof panels on a building at Horenberger Field at Illinois Wesleyan University when he fell from scaffolding. He died in the hospital eight days later and his employer, Union Roofing, was cited by OSHA for two safety violations.
Sanitation workers (29.8) — A tragic accident occurred on Labor Day when a 17-year-old sanitation employee fell off of a moving garbage truck and was run over, killing him instantly.
Truck drivers and delivery workers (21.8) — In March of last year, a commercial truck driver was using his cellphone to make a call when his truck crossed the median in central Kentucky, striking a van that was carrying 12 members of a family. 10 people in the van plus the truck driver were killed. Just this week, the U.S. National Transportation Safety Board, concluding its investigation of the crash, recommended banning the use of mobile phones by commercial drivers except in emergencies.
Industrial machine workers (20.3) — The number of accidents in this field is staggering. In January 2010, a Florida man had his genitals severed off after an accident involving machinery at an Future Foam Carpet Cushion in Orlando. The company was was fined $42,500 by OSHA for 10 serious safety violations.
Police officers (18.0) — In 2010, there was a nearly 40% increase in line-of-duty deaths among U.S. law enforcement. The most recent officer death involved Deputy Sheriff Derrick Whittle of the Union County, Georgia, Sheriff’s Office. He was killed in an automobile accident while responding to a call on September 18th. He is the 48th law enforcement officer to be killed in a traffic-related incident in 2011.

Still, without any accurate tracking, I would say death BY cop is far more likely than death OF cop.

[PaulConventionWV]

Well I stand corrected then, they are at the bottom of the top 10.

I have done several of those jobs.. I started logging at 12 yrs old, and still cut wood for heat all winter long.
I thank God every day that I come out of the woods with all my extremities attached.

I just realized I have the 8th most dangerous job on that list. Scary to think of now. My dad has the 6th most dangerous job on that list.

[PaulConventionWV]

I've done Farmwork, Roofing, Delivery work, Industrial machine operation and a bit of self logging when I cleared some land in Virginia. In none of these positions would I have described what I was doing as 'dangerous' as in 'this is such dangerous work I should be considered a hero.'
And while it is not in the top-ten, and fairly low in terms of fatalities, I'd have to say of any job the one that I considered 'dangerous' would have been bouncing.

Well, they're a lot more dangerous than sitting in an office all day and taking phone calls and doing paperwork.

[John F Kennedy III]

1. Holy sh*t a Rev9 sighting!

2. I'm sure AF posted more than 173 death BY cop stories in 2011.

3. It is FAR more dangerous to be around a cop than it is to be a cop.

[anaconda]

Well put.

Hear hear.

[Anti Federalist]

I just realized I have the 8th most dangerous job on that list. Scary to think of now. My dad has the 6th most dangerous job on that list.

My entire adult life has been spent making all or part of my living in the top three.

And now, I'm feeling it. Aches and pains every day.

[azxd]

Freak'n cry baby cop haters who live in fear are obvious.

[heavenlyboy34]

Freak'n cry baby cop haters who live in fear are obvious. :rolleyes: Come back and talk about it when you've been shot or beaten within inches of your life for "Contempt Of Cop".

[azxd]

:rolleyes: Come back and talk about it when you've been shot or beaten within inches of your life for "Contempt Of Cop".I don't see that happening, ever ;)

[heavenlyboy34]

I don't see that happening, ever ;)
btw, Dial 911 and die (http://Family Says 911 Tape Caught Cops Planning Cover-Up After Shooting).
PHOENIX (CN) - A homeowner says a Phoenix police officer shot him six times in the back during a 911 home-invasion call, and the 911 tape recorded the officer's partner saying, "That's all right. Don't worry about it. I got your back. ... We clear?" The family says the officers were not aware that the 911 call was still recording as they spoke about covering up the shooting.
In their complaint in Maricopa County Court, Anthony and Lesley Arambula say an armed intruder "crashed through the front window" of their home on Sept. 17, 2008 and ran into one of their son's bedrooms.
Anthony, worried about his son who was still in his bedroom, says he "held the intruder calmly at gunpoint" and called 911.
Phoenix Police officers already in the neighborhood heard the crash of the Arambulas' window. When they approached the house, Lesley says, she told Sgt. Sean Coutts that her husband was inside holding the intruder at gunpoint. Lesley says Coutts failed to pass on that information to the two other officers.
Inside the house, the Arambulas say, Officer Brian Lilly shot Anthony six times in the back while he was still on the phone with the 911 operator - twice when he was on the ground.
The officers ran into the bedroom after Anthony told them, "You just killed ... you just killed the homeowner. The bad guy is in there."
The complaint states that Officer Lilly "admitted that it was only after Tony was laying, bullet-ridden, on the ground that he assessed the situation. The 911 tape continued to record what happened even after Officer Lilly unloaded his weapon into Tony, including Officer Lilly's post-shooting, one-word 'assessment': 'Fuck.'
"Tony believed he was going to die; the 911 tape records his plaintive goodbye to his family: '... I love you ... I love you.' Then Tony made what he believed was a dying request to the officers; he did not want his young family to see him shot and bloodied. Officers callously ignored his request and painfully dragged Tony by his injured leg, through the home and out to his backyard patio, where they left him bloodied and shot right in front of Lesley, Matthew and Zachary."
The Arambulas say the officers later dragged Anthony onto gravel, then put him on top of the hot hood of a squad car, and "drove the squad car down the street with Tony lying on top, writhing in pain."
According to the complaint, Lilly can be heard on the 911 tape telling Coutts, "We fucked up."
Lilly says on the tape that he did not know where Anthony's gun was when he shot him and that he "opened fire because he heard loud noises and saw someone who looked like he might be the 'Hispanic' male they were pursuing" before getting to the Arambulas' house, according to the complaint.
The complaint states: "Sgt. Coutts knew that officers has just shot up and likely killed an innocent homeowner and the husband of Lesley, with whom he had spoken before entering the home, instead of the armed intruder. Sgt. Coutts was quick to commence the cover-up of their terrible mistake. Sgt. Coutts asked Office Lilly where Tony's gun was at the time Officer Lilly had opened fire on Tony. Officer Lilly admitted that he did not know where Tony's gun was: 'I don't know. I heard screaming and I fired.'"
Lilly later told a police internal affairs investigator that Anthony had pointed his gun in his direction, "in the 'ready' position," the complaint states. But Anthony Arambula says he was facing away from the officers, who could not have even seen his gun.
The complaint continues: "Still not knowing that he is being recorded n the 911 tape, Sgt. Coutts interrupted Officer Lilly's admission and apology with his assurance that the cover-up would commence: 'That's all right. Don't worry about it. I got your back. ... We clear?'"
After the shooting, the Arambulas say, the Phoenix Police Department treated them "like suspects in a drug bust," denying Lesley, Michael and Zachary information about Anthony's condition and denying friends and family members access to him at the hospital.
Anthony Arambula survived, but continues to suffer pain, which he expects will last for the rest of his life.
The City of Phoenix and Officer Dzenan Ahmetovic also are named as defendants.
The Arambulas seek punitive damages for gross negligence, civil rights violations, failure to supervise, excessive force, deliberate indifference to medical needs, false arrest, and emotional distress. They are represented by Michael Manning with Stinson Morrison Hecker.

[azxd]

btw, Dial 911 and die (http://Family Says 911 Tape Caught Cops Planning Cover-Up After Shooting).
This means nothing to me :D

Tactical error on the families part ;)

[cstarace]

Police officers have a dangerous job, but not a difficult job. There is a difference. Firemen have both a dangerous and difficult job. 90% of the time a police officer is sitting in his climate controlled cabin shooting radar at approaching vehicles and enjoying jelly donuts.

[heavenlyboy34]

This means nothing to me :D

Tactical error on the families part ;)
Not funny if you're kidding. :p

[wannaberocker]

Sad to hear.

[Anti Federalist]

Freak'n cry baby cop haters who live in fear are obvious.

LOL - There is a meme face for everything...I love these things.

http://i0.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/000/200/420/BRTky.jpg?1321408042

[fisharmor]

But, guess what, no solid number exists for people killed by cops.

This is why you're the man. I went looking this afternoon, and found the same thing, briefly contemplated the futility of life on this planet, and decided to put that task away lest I despair.

[Anti Federalist]

This is why you're the man. I went looking this afternoon, and found the same thing, briefly contemplated the futility of life on this planet, and decided to put that task away lest I despair.

The turn of phrase is repworthy just by itself.

[pcosmar]

I don't see that happening, ever ;)

^^
"Get Out of Jail Free" Card ??

[Anti Federalist]

^^
"Get Out of Jail Free" Card ??

FoC, I'd wager.

[azxd]

Not funny if you're kidding. :pGlad you understand :o

[azxd]

^^
"Get Out of Jail Free" Card ??Lifestyle ... I don't run around scared, nor do I hide, nor do I do stupid things to draw additional attention to self.
I also don't act nor look like a punk kid, or thug who has spent their entire life running from the law.

[pcosmar]

Lifestyle ... I don't run around scared, nor do I hide, nor do I do stupid things to draw additional attention to self.
I also don't act nor look like a punk kid, or thug who has spent their entire life running from the law.

Say what??

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3386/5693814909_6118e5e85f_b.jpg

[John F Kennedy III]

Lifestyle ... I don't run around scared, nor do I hide, nor do I do stupid things to draw additional attention to self.
I also don't act nor look like a punk kid, or thug who has spent their entire life running from the law.

The worst part about that is you think that matters. We are all a Combat Qual waiting to happen.

[Anti Federalist]

Lifestyle ... I don't run around scared, nor do I hide, nor do I do stupid things to draw additional attention to self.
I also don't act nor look like a punk kid, or thug who has spent their entire life running from the law.

Sell that shit to the family of Erik Scott.

[Anti Federalist]

Thug.

With f a g g o t s.

ETA - When the hell did the censor software get turned on????

******s < look at that...


Say what??

http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3386/5693814909_6118e5e85f_b.jpg

[azxd]

The worst part about that is you think that matters. We are all a Combat Qual waiting to happen.Then live the life of a scared individual ... COP ... RUN !!!

[azxd]

Sell that shit to the family of Erik Scott.Challenging your personal belief system is very easy when you expose it so easily ;)

Who's Erik Scott ?
I'm to lazy to Google the name.

[Anti Federalist]

Then live the life of a scared individual ... COP ... RUN !!!

Seems to me you are the one living life scuttling from one little hidey hole to the next, never raising hell, never speaking out, never drawing attention to yourself.

[Anti Federalist]

Challenging your personal belief system is very easy when you expose it so easily ;)

Who's Erik Scott ?
I'm to lazy to Google the name.

Forget it, doesn't matter, you'd just say it was his fault anyway.

Carry on.

[donnay]

Lifestyle ... I don't run around scared, nor do I hide, nor do I do stupid things to draw additional attention to self.
I also don't act nor look like a punk kid, or thug who has spent their entire life running from the law.

Tell that to Oscar Grant!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q2LDw5l_yMI


Police officer Johannes Mehserle, served half of a two year sentence for murdering Oscar Grant!

[SL89]

Somebody accused AF of propagating fear earlier. And he handled it well saying that he was just sharing so we all can be informed. Sorry, I fear the pigs. I don't have thousands of dollars for defense , How can we stick up for people and how can we prevent being victims?? AF can you answer this conundrum? Don't get me wrong. So far the cops here are cool, they really want to protect and serve. It is just a matter of time before DHS converts them to these perverts I see here. But, what then??? I really don't live in fear but, this nagging feeling that they can come at anytime. They have budgets that need justifying....

[TheTexan]

This is why you're the man. I went looking this afternoon, and found the same thing, briefly contemplated the futility of life on this planet, and decided to put that task away lest I despair.

I was actually looking for the same a few days ago. Zilch. Nada.

[tod evans]

Somebody accused AF of propagating fear earlier. And he handled it well saying that he was just sharing so we all can be informed. Sorry, I fear the pigs. I don't have thousands of dollars for defense , How can we stick up for people and how can we prevent being victims?? AF can you answer this conundrum? Don't get me wrong. So far the cops here are cool, they really want to protect and serve. It is just a matter of time before DHS converts them to these perverts I see here. But, what then??? I really don't live in fear but, this nagging feeling that they can come at anytime. They have budgets that need justifying....

Not AF............The only way to hold cops accountable is to elect local prosecutors and judges that will not continue protecting them when they overstep their bounds.

Civilian review boards can help if you remove the political element.

It'll be a hard row to hoe fighting entrenched establishment.

[John F Kennedy III]

Then live the life of a scared individual ... COP ... RUN !!!

Why be scared?

[kcchiefs6465]

What is your profession azxd? Feel free not to answer, but it would definitely provide insight into many of your posts.

[azxd]

Why be scared?I have no idea why some would be scared, but they are, none the less.

[azxd]

What is your profession azxd? Feel free not to answer, but it would definitely provide insight into many of your posts.Over the years, many ... But currently working in education.

[kcchiefs6465]

I have no idea why some would be scared, but they are, none the less.
Probably because they don't carry around a tin badge and stick. Unlike some :toady:

[azxd]

Probably because they don't carry around a tin badge and stick. Unlike some :toady:Try Avaition/Aerospace and you'll be on the right track ... And I've never had a badge and stick ;) Those things are not needed to do design work.

[Anti Federalist]

Somebody accused AF of propagating fear earlier. And he handled it well saying that he was just sharing so we all can be informed. Sorry, I fear the pigs. I don't have thousands of dollars for defense , How can we stick up for people and how can we prevent being victims?? AF can you answer this conundrum? Don't get me wrong. So far the cops here are cool, they really want to protect and serve. It is just a matter of time before DHS converts them to these perverts I see here. But, what then??? I really don't live in fear but, this nagging feeling that they can come at anytime. They have budgets that need justifying....

Well, look at it this way:

Is it an irrational fear to not stick your fingers into an electrical outlet?

I have no reason to doubt you when you say that the local cops are "good guys", trying to protect and serve.

At the same time, you are precisely correct, they have budgets that need justification and new military toys that need using.

Not to mention the risk you take in drawing the random, 'roided up psychopath that has just been itching all shift to light somebody up.

How to prevent being victims?

Actually, for all his snark, azxd is correct. Try not draw cop attention to yourself, learn to toe the line as best you can while at the same time letting everybody know that living like that should not be what happens in a free society. Above all else, do whatever you can to suppress the Pavlovian response that we all have to dial 911 the first time something goes wrong. Be as self sufficient as you can possibly be with regard to anything that might prompt a 911 call and bring unwanted cops into your situation, I'm speaking specifically about having first aid and fire fighting skill and equipment ready and people who are willing and know how to use it.

Avoid at all costs calling cops for any reason.

And never forgot this core truth: if everything that we are all, in the backs of our minds, considering and preparing for; a currency and economic collapse, the cops will be the front line enforcers of the regime's tyranny.

The mask will come off, orders will be followed, and it will be defend yourself and your neighbors as best as you possibly can at that point.

[mad cow]

My entire adult life has been spent making all or part of my living in the top three.

And now, I'm feeling it. Aches and pains every day.

I just retired last year from a lifetime of commercial fishing,100% of my income since 1977,an occasional land job in the 10 or so years before that.

The aches and pains finally got to me.

[azxd]

Well, look at it this way:

Is it an irrational fear to not stick your fingers into an electrical outlet?

I have no reason to doubt you when you say that the local cops are "good guys", trying to protect and serve.

At the same time, you are precisely correct, they have budgets that need justification and new military toys that need using.

Not to mention the risk you take in drawing the random, 'roided up psychopath that has just been itching all shift to light somebody up.

How to prevent being victims?

Actually, for all his snark, azxd is correct. Try not draw cop attention to yourself, learn to toe the line as best you can while at the same time letting everybody know that living like that should not be what happens in a free society. Above all else, do whatever you can to suppress the Pavlovian response that we all have to dial 911 the first time something goes wrong. Be as self sufficient as you can possibly be with regard to anything that might prompt a 911 call and bring unwanted cops into your situation, I'm speaking specifically about having first aid and fire fighting skill and equipment ready and people who are willing and know how to use it.

Avoid at all costs calling cops for any reason.

And never forgot this core truth: if everything that we are all, in the backs of our minds, considering and preparing for; a currency and economic collapse, the cops will be the front line enforcers of the regime's tyranny.

The mask will come off, orders will be followed, and it will be defend yourself and your neighbors as best as you possibly can at that point.Yea, I can be snarky :D

And well stated on your part ... We are on the same team !!!

ETA
I'll just add that ... If you intend to carry, or even just have a firearm for home protection,
Find a good lawyer, give them a retainer, and memorize their phone number.

ETA2:
And to clarify this,
I don't mean just any lawyer ... Find one that specializes in the defensive use of firearms.

[Anti Federalist]

I just retired last year from a lifetime of commercial fishing,100% of my income since 1977,an occasional land job in the 10 or so years before that.

The aches and pains finally got to me.

It adds up quick, doesn't it?

[SL89]

Well, look at it this way:

Is it an irrational fear to not stick your fingers into an electrical outlet?

I have no reason to doubt you when you say that the local cops are "good guys", trying to protect and serve.

At the same time, you are precisely correct, they have budgets that need justification and new military toys that need using.

Not to mention the risk you take in drawing the random, 'roided up psychopath that has just been itching all shift to light somebody up.

How to prevent being victims?

Actually, for all his snark, azxd is correct. Try not draw cop attention to yourself, learn to toe the line as best you can while at the same time letting everybody know that living like that should not be what happens in a free society. Above all else, do whatever you can to suppress the Pavlovian response that we all have to dial 911 the first time something goes wrong. Be as self sufficient as you can possibly be with regard to anything that might prompt a 911 call and bring unwanted cops into your situation, I'm speaking specifically about having first aid and fire fighting skill and equipment ready and people who are willing and know how to use it.

Avoid at all costs calling cops for any reason.

And never forgot this core truth: if everything that we are all, in the backs of our minds, considering and preparing for; a currency and economic collapse, the cops will be the front line enforcers of the regime's tyranny.

The mask will come off, orders will be followed, and it will be defend yourself and your neighbors as best as you possibly can at that point.

I have never called the cops. But, my neighbors draw their attention. I stated in a previous thread how I ran a deputy off by being armed and demanding court orders before they could search my absent neighbors house. Someone has to stand up to this encroachment. It is a matter of time before I am locked up....I am willing to stand up, is anyone else??? I don't break the law and I stick up for my rights but, damn...... they can make anyone of us guilty of something. 99% of us are felons if they look hard enough. If "they" want you, you are screwed.

When do we stop hiding and towing the line. I have had enough but, I have kids to take care of. I guess they win. No one is truly standing up, outside of a martyr or two. I guess I will vote,for RP again and just disappear after the fact. We are fucked and anyone is a fool that thinks we have until 2016. After this election, I will fire on anyone that tries to take what is mine. Period. I will not die on my knees.

[azxd]

I have never called the cops. But, my neighbors draw their attention. I stated in a previous thread how I ran a deputy off by being armed and demanding court orders before they could search my absent neighbors house. Someone has to stand up to this encroachment. It is a matter of time before I am locked up....I am willing to stand up, is anyone else??? I don't break the law and I stick up for my rights but, damn...... they can make anyone of us guilty of something. 99% of us are felons if they look hard enough. If "they" want you, you are screwed.

When do we stop hiding and towing the line. I have had enough but, I have kids to take care of. I guess they win. No one is truly standing up, outside of a martyr or two. I guess I will vote,for RP again and just disappear after the fact. We are fucked and anyone is a fool that thinks we have until 2016. After this election, I will fire on anyone that tries to take what is mine. Period. I will not die on my knees.“Brandishing a Weapon will Bring a Tense Situation to a Complete Halt” Sheriff Mack (http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?370907-“Brandishing-a-Weapon-will-Bring-a-Tense-Situation-to-a-Complete-Halt”-Sheriff-Mack)

[Philosophy_of_Politics]

Do cops encounter dangers? Yes. Do they grossly exaggerate how dangerous their job is? Yes. Does the increasing police state and overall stress of society due to poverty increase the dangers they will face? Yes.

Are they doing anything to help themselves, or Americans, by abusing the law and not taking their Oath seriously as well? No.

[heavenlyboy34]

What is it about promotion to detective that mellows cops out? I was once interviewed by a police detective (I've related the story before, I think), and he was very polite. Just sat in front of me with the clipboard and tape recorder and asked questions about a series of crimes that had happened recently at a school I once attended. I never got any hostile vibes at all. Practically a non-event.

[Revolution9]

This means nothing to me :D

Tactical error on the families part ;)

Well ... aren't you a little whiz banged, snot nosed git about it. Loser. People died, yer grinning, and you like cops.. I got yer number. Ya oughta get yerself one of them there blue light specials. You have the requisite disrespect for human beings and their God given lives. I m positive you would be the swinest in flaw reinforcment in whatever town you chose to jackboot about in. <no smilies because it ain't funny>



Rev9

[pcosmar]

Yea, I can be snarky :D

And well stated on your part ... We are on the same team !!!

ETA
I'll just add that ... If you intend to carry, or even just have a firearm for home protection,
Find a good lawyer, give them a retainer, and memorize their phone number.

ETA2:
And to clarify this,
I don't mean just any lawyer ... Find one that specializes in the defensive use of firearms.

Some of that is good advice. But of my personal interaction with Lawyers in the past has never done me any good.
I have very little faith in the legal system, as a whole.

And I am yet to be convinced that you are on the same team.(based on post history).

And to be clear,, I am opposed to the very concept of Police. not to individual People..

Government is an evil, a necessary evil perhaps,, but still an evil.
Government should be limited to limit it's inherent evil.
Police (as a concept) are the enforcement branch of that evil. They should simply not exist in a free society.

I recommend reading,
http://www.constitution.org/lrev/roots/cops.htm

A free society should be self policing.

Perhaps it is just miscommunication.
It seem like folks are missing some basic principles of liberty

[noneedtoaggress]

Indeed, and I have learned a couple valuable lessons from this story....

1) When it's a mundane shot in the neck or getting robbed, the cops tell us all to cower in the corner and hope for the best.
When it's a priest of the state-god getting killed, tackling the shooter is DOING WHAT YOU'RE SUPPOSED TO.

2) You do not need a six-week training course, body armor, a souped-up cruiser, several firearms, a license to beat up and/or kill anyone you choose, and swarms of backup on command, in order to apprehend criminals.

QFT