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View Full Version : On reddit: Why Libertarians are symptomatic of what's wrong with America




JacobG18
03-12-2012, 03:49 PM
Greed: Libertarianism is based on the "I got mine" idea. It reeks of social darwinism and completely ignores the idea that all people don't start out equal. If "work" translated into "wealth" as libertarians belive, we'd have a lot of rich immigrants who work 2 or 3 jobs. But instead, we have a lot of people born into money and positions of privilege. And you've gotta have money to make money, which further reinforces that social hierarchy. The rich just get richer.
Slacktivism: Libertarian philosophy is based on the idea that our problems will simply be solved if we don't do anything about them. The "invisible hand of the free market" will take care of everything. People don't want to go through the effort of actually solving problems any more, and just expect someone or something else to take care of it.
Inequality: not just money (addressed in point 1) but in race, class, gender, etc. Libertarians don't recognize that we're not all born on an equal footing. Society has inherent biases and inequities that the free market just won't solve.
Irrationality: Libertarians just don't recognize the reality of the human situation. They say that if a corporation is behaving unethically, then people will stop buying from them, right? This is true if the people know about that behavior. And if the corporation voluntarily gives out that information, because most corporate disclosures are due to government requirements. And that the people in general are actually buying their product, instead of a distinct sect of the population (for example, most people don't have the means to boycott Rolls Royce in the first place). And it is an immediately recognized harm instead of something that presents itself years later after the harm is already done (example, lead paint). And the people actually care enough about that wrong to justify spending more on a different or inferior product. And they are able to overcome transaction costs of organizing a large campaign against this wrong. And it will make such an impact on the company's revenues that it will cause them to change that behavior. And if their competitors are not engaging in the same practice.
Uncompromising: Ron Paul is the perfect example of this. They view the world in absolutes and are unwilling to recognize shades of grey. Campaign finance, for example. Citizens United has shown how corrupt and controlled the campaign finance system is, but Libertarians maintain that we need less restrictions on who can donate to campaigns because it's a restriction on speech. Billionaires like the Kochs and Sheldon Adelson could simply buy the candidate they want outright, without going through the disclosure requirements of PACs. They don't recognize that "free speech" is not sacrosanct and there are perfectly valid reasons where something that is barely speech (money) should be restricted for perfectly valid purposes (preventing corruption)
Edit: I didn't think I would need to make this clear, but this is my opinion.


http://www.reddit.com/r/politics/comments/qsxmq/why_libertarians_are_symptomatic_of_whats_wrong/




If anyone wants to counter their arguments. I put this here so more people would see it, because this seems like a debate we should be trying to win, so we can expand libertarian ideas.

Crotale
03-12-2012, 04:02 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4hhSsIpjtzY

noneedtoaggress
03-12-2012, 04:10 PM
Yeah, that's just a massive ton of baseless assertions from someone who has no idea what they're arguing against.

http://pictures.mastermarf.com/blog/2010/100702-strawman.png

NYgs23
03-12-2012, 04:40 PM
Why don't anti-libertarians ever say anything new?

UMULAS
03-12-2012, 05:28 PM
Why don't anti-libertarians ever say anything new?

^^^ Very sad.

heavenlyboy34
03-12-2012, 05:37 PM
Why don't anti-libertarians ever say anything new?
+a bunch

eleganz
03-12-2012, 05:42 PM
Invisible hand of the free market?????! pathetic arguments

heavenlyboy34
03-12-2012, 05:52 PM
If you win a debate on reddit, does anyone really care?

Jingles
03-12-2012, 05:55 PM
The thing that always confuses me about these leftist types is the fact that they generally claim to believe in peace, but then wish to use violence (mostly via the state) to achieve all their goals. They are always willing to loot, but not to create. They are willing to murder if they believe it will bring peace/end bigotry. They are willing to shut down businesses to "help the worker".

Jtorsella
03-12-2012, 06:06 PM
So it is greedy to be entitled to the wealth that you create? If it is, then I'm the greediest man on earth.

Kylie
03-12-2012, 06:20 PM
So it is greedy to be entitled to the wealth that you create? If it is, then I'm the greediest man on earth.


For real. Until you do my work, you don't deserve my money. Now, If I give it to you, then that's one thing. But you have no right to it just by virtue of being in "need".