Rampage by U.S. soldier kills up to 18 Afghan civilians

[moderate libertarian]

Another day of violence in the Obama's good war.


Rampage by U.S. soldier kills up to 18 Afghan civilians
March 11, 2012

REPORTING FROM KABUL, Afghanistan -- A U.S. soldier went on a shooting rampage outside Kandahar city early Sunday, killing up to 18 civilians, Afghan officials said, in yet another devastating blow to Americans’ battered image in the country after 10 years of warfare.


http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/world_now/2012/03/rampage-by-us-soldier-kills-up-to-18-afghan-civilians.html


People who used to hold Bush responsible when incidences like Hadita or when Allen West was accused of war crimes in Iraq will now apply same standards and hold Obama responsible for this also or nobel peace prize makes a difference here?


Correction, later reports say 16 civilians were killed and more than one soldiers maybe involved:


(Reuters) - Western forces shot dead 16 civilians including nine children in southern Kandahar province on Sunday, Afghan officials said, in a rampage that witnesses said was carried out by American soldiers who were laughing and appeared drunk.
One Afghan father who said his children were killed in the shooting spree accused soldiers of later burning the bodies.

Witnesses told Reuters they saw a group of U.S. soldiers arrive at their village in Kandahar's Panjwayi district at around 2 am, enter homes and open fire.

The incident, one of the worst of its kind since the U.S.-led invasion of Afghanistan in 2001, is likely to deepen the divide between Washington and Kabul.



http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311


BBC has released couple of photos on its news site:

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59004000/jpg/_59004027_014230856-1.jpg

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59004000/jpg/_59004481_014231980-2.jpg

http://news.bbcimg.co.uk/media/images/59004000/jpg/_59004757_014231818-1.jpg

[alucard13mmfmj]

This is what will happen if we go into Africa... We kill a bunch of innocent African civilians by mistake... they get pissed off and will want revenge.

[moderate libertarian]

This is what will happen if we go into Africa... We kill a bunch of innocent African civilians by mistake... they get pissed off and will want revenge.

This might help subside their revenge motivation:


In the statement, the United States military raced to head off Afghan outrage. “This is a deeply regrettable incident and we extend our thoughts and concerns to the families involved,” the statement said.

[alucard13mmfmj]

This might help subside their revenge motivation:

Yeah. Like Ron said... apologies doesnt mean shit if you keep doing the same thing over and over again.

[phill4paul]

Yeah. Like Ron said... apologies doesnt mean shit if you keep doing the same thing over and over again.

I sometimes wish Ron Paul would throw in an expletive. It would be so out of character it would be a very condemning statement.

All hell is gonna break loose over this one.

[Cowlesy]

I read this story just now on Drudge. This is going to be a freaking disaster if it was near an urban area.

[awake]

Man goes on a maniacal shooting spree in Afghanistan; we should forgive him, 'our soldiers are under a lot of stress'. The same man shoots up a school or workplace at home; it is an act of absolute mass murder of innocents.

The disconnect is unconscionable. Those who do this sort of apologizing should be ashamed.

[tod evans]

All the more reason to get the hell out!

Unconstitutional wars are a loosing proposition.

[vita3]

& Rand & Mike Lee were the ONLY 2 Republican Senators to sign on a letter to Obama last week urging him to bring the troops home earlier.

We need to vote out every politican in DC who is not working tooth & nail to end this.

[Tyler_Durden]

Sadly, this will lead to more US soldier deaths than the burning of the Koran.

Wouldn't happen if we weren't there.......

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17330205

[rideurlightning]

WE BETTER NOT APOLOGIZE FOR THE KILLING OF INNOCENTS.

[Constitutional Paulicy]

When are people going to pull their heads out of their asses?:mad::mad::mad:

[Kluge]

Man goes on a maniacal shooting spree in Afghanistan; we should forgive him, 'our soldiers are under a lot of stress'. The same man shoots up a school or workplace at home; it is an act of absolute mass murder of innocents.

The disconnect is unconscionable. Those who do this sort of apologizing should be ashamed.

Oh, I'm sure they'll offer them a couple of goats to go along with the apology. No worries.

Imagine that these occupying fools kill your sibling/parent/child and some asshole says "Sorry! Hope these goats make up for your loss! Good luck, and stay away from that pesky Taliban."

[Constitutional Paulicy]

I've lived abroad in various countries for over a decade now and it's humiliating as an American. Expats from countries all over the world discuss politics socially and as an American I have to accept that my country is one fucked up out of control idiotic nation that cant behave. How exactly am I supposed to be proud as an American in this day and age?

[SCOTUSman]

Why is this in grassroots?

[Origanalist]

Afghanistan, where empires go to die.

[Give me liberty]

Yeah i have seen it on CNN to there are comments that are in Ron Paul favor of getting the troops out of there, and i agree with that.

[PaulSoHard]

I don't want to be cruel, but people need to be more exposed to these kinds of innocent killings to understand Ron's policy. We're the ones causing trouble by not leaving them alone in the first place, and now there's a series of Quran burnings and civilian deaths that we have caused.

And then there's Rick Santorum who says we're being attacked because we're a free and prosperous country.

[Tobias2dope]

WE BETTER NOT APOLOGIZE FOR THE KILLING OF INNOCENTS.You are so right.
That's how real men act.

Never forgive , never forget (cries like a girl)

[Tudo]

I've lived abroad in various countries for over a decade now and it's humiliating as an American. Expats from countries all over the world discuss politics socially and as an American I have to accept that my country is one fucked up out of control idiotic nation that cant behave. How exactly am I supposed to be proud as an American in this day and age?

I lived overseas for 3 years and know what you are saying.

[Tyler_Durden]

Why is this in grassroots?

Maybe you should motion to be a Mod.

Wouldn't happen if we weren't there under a Paul Adminstration

[Barrex]

This was all over the news in Croatia but I didnt wnat to post it (some people have interpreted it as att on US)... News here say that there is no plan for Afghanistan just "stay till we decide what next". Croatian soldier in Afghanistan shoot him self in the leg recently (kinda related to topic)....

[Constitutional Paulicy]

I lived overseas for 3 years and know what you are saying.

Every American expat I know, as well as international expats, support Dr. Paul hands down. I only wish we could help our fellow Americans wake-up. I have been away from the propaganda and the MSM influence long enough to become desensitized to it.

[pcosmar]

Why is this in grassroots?

Was it started there? I saw it first it General Politics. Did it get moved here?
Though it may have been to give a heads up to the folks reading there.

[Johnny Appleseed]

worst way to make the best case for the good Drs. message...too bad people still won't be able to put the two together

[moderate libertarian]

Later reports are putting number of civilians dead in the shooting spree at 16 including 9 children and 3 women.


This is going to be a freaking disaster if it was near an urban area.

It would not be a disaster if it were sub-urban area? Not sure what the distinction would be.

[Give me liberty]

Wow check out on CNN the comments were half if not all are saying its time for us to get out.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

[moderate libertarian]

WE BETTER NOT APOLOGIZE FOR THE KILLING OF INNOCENTS.

I think Obama does not apologize for killing of civilians or for urination on dead bodies, not sure if it a matter of some deeply thunk policy.

[Voluntary Man]

Once you've broken into your neighbor's house, can you really call ANYTHING you do there "self-defense"?

[Anti Federalist]

Got his Combat Quals.

He'll land a job as a cop when he gets home.

[moderate libertarian]

Once you've broken into your neighbor's house, can you really call ANYTHING you do there "self-defense"?

That is the kind of reasoning that calls an "enhanced interrogated" suspect hanging himself at gitmo "asymetric warfare".


Not sure asymetric fascism is the root cause for such illogicalities brought into mainstream thinking but their use has increased alongwith the pace of our mental and moral decline.

[Voluntary Man]

I've lived abroad in various countries for over a decade now and it's humiliating as an American. Expats from countries all over the world discuss politics socially and as an American I have to accept that my country is one fucked up out of control idiotic nation that cant behave. How exactly am I supposed to be proud as an American in this day and age?

Shame is the appropriate response. It's like being the son of Adolph Hitler or the father of Ted Bundy.

In reality, though, it's more like waking up one day and realizing your entire neighborhood is populated with serial killers...only they don't even know what they are.

[LCG8928]

It seems like this guy just went insane, unfortunately it happens in war sometimes. He definitely should be dishonorably discharged though.

[nbhadja]

THEY HATE US BECAUSE WE ARE FREE. ANYONE WHO DISAGREES WITH THIS IS ANTI-AMERICAN AND AN ISOLATIONIST.

[Justinfrom1776]

An apology without correcting the policy is like saying "We're sorry but fuck you guys"

[Give me liberty]

already posted in the general section, check back there thread op.

[Tyler_Durden]

Could there be a cover-up? Was it a lone solider or a group of drunken soldiers?


Witnesses told Reuters they saw a group of U.S. soldiers arrive at their village in Kandahar's Panjwayi district at around 2 am, enter homes and open fire.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311

[Tyler_Durden]

Could there be a cover-up? Was it a lone soldier or a group of drunken soldiers?


Witnesses told Reuters they saw a group of U.S. soldiers arrive at their village in Kandahar's Panjwayi district at around 2 am, enter homes and open fire.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311

[moderate libertarian]

Could there be a cover-up? Was it a lone solider or a group of drunken soldiers?



http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311



(Reuters) - Western forces shot dead 16 civilians including nine children in southern Kandahar province on Sunday, Afghan officials said, in a rampage that witnesses said was carried out by American soldiers who were laughing and appeared drunk.
One Afghan father who said his children were killed in the shooting spree accused soldiers of later burning the bodies.

Witnesses told Reuters they saw a group of U.S. soldiers arrive at their village in Kandahar's Panjwayi district at around 2 am, enter homes and open fire.

The incident, one of the worst of its kind since the U.S.-led invasion of Afghanistan in 2001, is likely to deepen the divide between Washington and Kabul.



If this is true, is urinating on dead bodies or burning dead bodies a new thing for some of these alleged war criminals? Their holy books were allegdly burnt accidentally, what is the official line for burning of dead bodies/urination?

Why would they burn bodies afterwards after getting drunk and killing civilains including children and women in house? In an incidence in Iraq in Mahmudiyah killings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings ) when some soldiers were convicted of going into a house after getting drunk, killing civilians including women and children and burning bodies afterwards were also accused of raping a 14 year old girl. There is abolutely no such accusation here, what were they trying to accomplish by burning bodies if they indeed did that?

[Tyler_Durden]

If this is true, is urinating on dead bodies or burning dead bodies a new thing for some of these alleged war criminals? Their holy books were allegdly burnt accidentally, what is the official line for burning of dead bodies/urination?

Let's hope cameras were switched off and no video tapes were made.

One soldier could kill over a dozen and injure others, but it doesn't make sense how that one soldier could burn them too. I am apt to believe the eyewitness reports of a group of drunken soldiers. When I was in the Marines, we did some crazy shit when we were drunk......this is bad news.

[Demigod]

Covering it up would not surprise me.

I once witnessed a drunken NATO soldier from Kosovo ( don't know which country he was from ) make a car accident and hurt a few people.In 10 min 2 or 3 more NATO vehicles came drove the drunk soldier away while leaving another one at the scene to take the fault.

[Okie RP fan]

Could very well be a group. One guy kills 16 of them and injures another five? You figure his mag was probably 30 rounds (not sure about military issue mags)... Did he have more than one mag? Did he put one good shot in them? I mean, these are things to consider.

Anyway you look at it, this doesn't help us and it is tragic.

[Tyler_Durden]

Could very well be a group. One guy kills 16 of them and injures another five? You figure his mag was probably 30 rounds (not sure about military issue mags)... Did he have more than one mag? Did he put one good shot in them? I mean, these are things to consider.

Anyway you look at it, this doesn't help us and it is tragic.

Standard issue is 30 rounds per mag. One guy is certainly capable, but my gut tells me the witness accounts are accurate and the damage control being done now is to make it look like an isolated incident by one soldier. Or perhaps one soldier carried it out and others came along to torch the bodies. Either way, there's alot of unanswered questions. And yes, it's tragic.

[Brian4Liberty]

One psycho or a group of drunks? Big difference, but the penalty should be the same.

[Tyler_Durden]

The more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This was not a one-man incident:


"And he questioned how the soldier left his post in the pre-dawn hours, adding, "I know the Kandahar base. A fly cannot get in without being searched."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

[Tyler_Durden]

I'm telling you - the more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This wasn't a one-man incident. This development of the official story stinks to hell. I'm starting to read articles that don't include the witness reports of multiple drunken and laughing soldiers.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


"We cannot whitewash this and get this young man out of Afghanistan and send him back to the Untied States. That is the worst thing we can do at this time," he said. And he questioned how the soldier left his post in the pre-dawn hours, adding, "I know the Kandahar base. A fly cannot get in without being searched."


how does a soldier walk off a secure base at 3am?

"...a U.S. service member stationed at a U.S. base in the southern Kandahar province walked off the base around 3 a.m. local time......"
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/11/us-offers-condolences-as-us-service-member-investigated-for-alleged-killing/

[heavenlyboy34]

I know a neocon who would just say "good riddance" to this. :(

[Okie RP fan]

Standard issue is 30 rounds per mag. One guy is certainly capable, but my gut tells me the witness accounts are accurate and the damage control being done now is to make it look like an isolated incident by one soldier. Or perhaps one soldier carried it out and others came along to torch the bodies. Either way, there's alot of unanswered questions. And yes, it's tragic.

Yea... capable, but unlikely it seems to me.

[alucard13mmfmj]

Sad to say, but we should take advantage of these deaths to get Ron Paul's message out... that our current foreign policy fails.

Can those soldiers that participated in these murders be integrated back into civilian life style? They went crazy and started killing WOMEN and CHILDREN. They need medical and psychological help.

[BlackTerrel]

I'm seeing this all over now.

Highly tragic. Clearly the guy who did this is mentally ill and need to be prosecuted. I understand why the Afghans are upset. We need to get out now. Nothing good will come of this.

[QuickZ06]

I'm telling you - the more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This wasn't a one-man incident. This development of the official story stinks to hell. I'm starting to read articles that don't include the witness reports of multiple drunken and laughing soldiers.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1



how does a soldier walk off a secure base at 3am?

"...a U.S. service member stationed at a U.S. base in the southern Kandahar province walked off the base around 3 a.m. local time......"
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/11/us-offers-condolences-as-us-service-member-investigated-for-alleged-killing/


Tryst me you can get off that base as well as any other base for the most part.

You can always find a way out or know a certain someone. Everyone has a friend in the service.

[Wineman77]

At what point is the blood on the hands of the people that vote for Bush and Obama or any of these warmonger politicians????

[puppetmaster]

At what point is the blood on the hands of the people that vote for Bush and Obama or any of these warmonger politicians????

since the beginning

[Voluntary Man]

An apology without correcting the policy is like saying "We're sorry but fuck you guys"

"Hey, Honey, I'm sorry I'm sleeping with your sister. Don't wait up."

[puppetmaster]

I'm seeing this all over now.

Highly tragic. Clearly the guy who did this is mentally ill and need to be prosecuted. I understand why the Afghans are upset. We need to get out now. Nothing good will come of this.

and the rest of them prosecuted also.......

[SeanSerritella]

Today would be a good day for Ron Paul to come out and remind every one how he wants to bring all the troops home.

[oyarde]

I read this story just now on Drudge. This is going to be a freaking disaster if it was near an urban area. I am in the woods this evening and do not have my maps , but that is a village , likely , not far from Kandahar City . Please keep in mind , Kandahar and Helmand are not really under NATO control , the natives have the upper hand there and have all along...

[oyarde]

Later reports are putting number of civilians dead in the shooting spree at 16 including 9 children and 3 women.



It would not be a disaster if it were sub-urban area? Not sure what the distinction would be. There , info only passes word of mouth , in the boonies that means tribes / tribal leaders etc

[AGRP]

Should have become a cop. He could have received paid time off and desk duty.

[Cap]

Got his Combat Quals.

He'll land a job as a cop when he gets home.So true, so sad.

[SpicyTurkey]

One on one democracy. One house at a time.

[flightlesskiwi]

Defense Secretary Leon Panetta called Karzai to offer his condolences. "I condemn such violence and am shocked and saddened that a U.S. service member is alleged to be involved, clearly acting outside his chain of command," Panetta said in a statement. "A full investigation is already under way. A suspect is in custody and I gave President Karzai my assurances that we will bring those responsible to justice."

1. read his statement-- put emphasis on "clearly acting outside his chain of command"

2. "a full investigation is already under way" -- i'm sure by an impartial 3rd party. /s

[PaulConventionWV]

Wow. How people can even stomach their own apologies is just outrageous. We are there causing chaos and when something happens the best we can do is say, "Oops, sorry. That's really sad." We don't even take any steps to guarantee it won't happen again (such as getting out). Does anyone really expect anyone to believe that the people who issued the apology are truly sorry or regret this? Hell, they don't give a shit. They couldn't care less. I can't imagine someone letting something like that happen, then saying "Oops, sorry" and really believing what they say. No, there's no way they can feel what they are saying. They're just saving face.

[moderate libertarian]

One on one democracy. One house at a time.

Either that or one one one "village stabilization", one house at a time. More details are coming out:



U.S. Sergeant Is Said to Kill 16 Civilians in Afghanistan

PANJWAI, Afghanistan — Stalking from home to home, a United States Army sergeant methodically killed at least 16 civilians, 9 of them children, in a rural stretch of southern Afghanistan early on Sunday, igniting fears of a new wave of anti-American hostility, Afghan and American officials said.

Residents of three villages in the Panjwai district of Kandahar Province described a terrifying string of attacks in which the soldier, who had walked more than a mile from his base, tried door after door, eventually breaking in to kill within three separate houses. At the first, the man gathered 11 bodies, including those of four girls younger than 6, and set fire to them, villagers said

A senior American military official said Sunday evening that the sergeant was attached to a unit based at Joint Base Lewis-McChord, near Tacoma, Wash., and that he had been part of what is called a village stabilization operation in Afghanistan. In those operations, teams of Green Berets, supported by other soldiers, try to develop close ties with village elders, organize local police units and track down Taliban leaders. The official said the sergeant was not a Green Beret himself, and had been deployed to either Iraq or Afghanistan at least once before his current tour of duty.

In Panjwai, a reporter for The New York Times who inspected bodies that had been taken to the nearby American military base counted 16 dead, and saw burns on some of the children’s legs and heads. “All the family members were killed, the dead put in a room, and blankets were put over the corpses and they were burned,” said Anar Gula, an elderly neighbor who rushed to the house after the soldier had left. “We put out the fire.”

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/12/world/asia/afghanistan-civilians-killed-american-soldier-held.html

[jmdrake]

Sadly, this will lead to more US soldier deaths than the burning of the Koran.

Wouldn't happen if we weren't there.......

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-17330205

Even more sad is the fact that most sheeple will pay more attention to Koran burning story and think "Those crazy mooselums just hate us cuz we axeldently burned there holey book".

[Carson]

They aren't under Congressional orders that I know of to even be there.

That is kind of like passing the buck but who is to say what orders they were under or by whom, if any. I think this sort of thing is why we used to have rules to follow.

Just whose military are they?

For that matter who are the ones contriving our government and our borders?


We really have to regain control or someone else will have to.

[JK/SEA]

can anybody tell me why 9/11 happened....just curious.

[AGRP]

Any guesses on how Fox News will spin this?

How about all 18 including an infant were in possession of top secret portable WMDs and the soldier should be awarded a medal of honor? They'll invite Michael Moore on to criticize the soldier and that will make you a socialist if you agree with him?

[ONUV]

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/4760/cvrpbanner.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/829/cvrpbanner.jpg/)

[Kodaddy]

Boy, we sure are freeing the fuck outta that place.

[Brian4Liberty]

Tryst me ...

Hmmmm.

[RickBelmont]

*edit spelling

[RickBelmont]

My pst above is for the a-holes who posted that the Talibans are just defending themselves...Hope it pisses you off!

[pcosmar]

My pst above is for the a-holes who posted that the Talibans are just defending themselves...Hope it pisses you off!

Don't you mean the Afghan Patriots that are resisting the invasion?

[RickBelmont]

Don't you mean the Afghan Patriots that are resisting the invasion?
Don't you mean the Pakistani lead terrorists that overthrew the Afghan government?

[pcosmar]

Don't you mean the Pakistani lead terrorists that overthrew the Afghan government?


*edit spelling

I see you removed that ignorant garbage.

And no, I meant the Afghan Patriots that are resisting the invasion.
We overthrew the government and set up yet another corrupt puppet government.
They are rightfully pissed.
This murderous asshole just did more for the recruitment of resistance fighters than all the CIA inspired Jihad.

[moderate libertarian]

RickBlemont, Obama adminstration ( or Obama's masters maybe the the more accurate term) is secretly in talks with the terrorists, what are your thoughts on that?



Report: U.S., Taliban, Afghans in secret talks - World Watch - CBS ...
Feb 16, 2012 ... Wall Street Journal reports that the Afghans are facilitating secret three-way talks
with U.S. and Taliban, which denies it Read more by ...
www.cbsnews.com/.../report-u.s-taliban-afghans-in-secret-talks/

Even some notorious neocon pimps have endorsed it:


McCain Endorses U.S.-Taliban Talks - National Journal Staff ...
Feb 19, 2012 ... Sen. John McCain, R-Ariz., said on Sunday that he supports talks between the
U.S. and the Taliban, a position that may be out of step with Mitt ...

www.nationaljournal.com/mccain-endorses-u-s-taliban-talks-20120219

By the look of things, they'll be back in power within days of us fully liberating Afghanistan and heading home after declaring it a decade of "quagmire" and spending thousands of lives, trillions of dollars.

[ExPatPaki]

Don't you mean the Pakistani lead terrorists that overthrew the Afghan government?

LOL, Afghan "government".

[Tyler_Durden]

Protect the Afghan Poppy-lation

[moderate libertarian]

Protect the Afghan Poppy-lation

There have been very few attacks on that front and poppy-lation has folurished drastically since we spread our freedom occupation there.

+rep for that.

[angelatc]

And cue the "End The War!" chant from newly minted anti-war neocons, right before the elections. Don't believe me? Check out the comments at HotAir. :http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/11/breaking-us-soldier-held-after-rampage-15-afghan-civilians-killed/comment-page-3/#comments

[TC95]

This is an isolated incident. They hate us because we're free. Blah, blah, blah.

[oyarde]

LOL, Afghan "government". I concur with that.

[ONUV]

And cue the "End The War!" chant from newly minted anti-war neocons, right before the elections. Don't believe me? Check out the comments at HotAir. :http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/11/breaking-us-soldier-held-after-rampage-15-afghan-civilians-killed/comment-page-3/#comments


If a US soldier truly started firing without cause on civilians, they need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of military justice.

That’s all that needs to be said. To those immediately condemning the entire US military(you Ron Paul nuts know who you are, and to those sneering and laughing at the possibility of dead innocent women and children, may you both reap the karmic s**t that your diseased, repulsive souls deserve.

MadisonConservative on March 11, 2012 at 12:31 PM


If a US soldier truly started firing without cause on civilians, they need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of military justice.

That’s all that needs to be said. To those immediately condemning the entire US military(you Ron Paul nuts know who you are, and to those sneering and laughing at the possibility of dead innocent women and children, may you both reap the karmic s**t that your diseased, repulsive souls deserve.

MadisonConservative on March 11, 2012 at 12:31 PM

That sounds about right to me.

ghostwriter on March 11, 2012 at 12:37 PM


If a US soldier truly started firing without cause on civilians, they need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of military justice.

That’s all that needs to be said. To those immediately condemning the entire US military(you Ron Paul nuts know who you are, and to those sneering and laughing at the possibility of dead innocent women and children, may you both reap the karmic s**t that your diseased, repulsive souls deserve.

MadisonConservative on March 11, 2012 at 12:31 PM

Yeah, I can co-sign on this as well.

Esoteric on March 11, 2012 at 12:38 PM


If a US soldier truly started firing without cause on civilians, they need to be prosecuted to the fullest extent of military justice.

That’s all that needs to be said. To those immediately condemning the entire US military(you Ron Paul nuts know who you are, and to those sneering and laughing at the possibility of dead innocent women and children, may you both reap the karmic s**t that your diseased, repulsive souls deserve.

MadisonConservative on March 11, 2012 at 12:31 PM

+1000

Bitter Clinger on March 11, 2012 at 12:41 PM


Assuming what is reported is true, the blame-America-firsters, including Dr Paul, should exercise some intellectual honesty.

They should all blame the Afghans for getting themselves killed because it’s not our fault we have to be there.

If–and it’s a good-sized If–an American acted like a terrorist, let the terrorist-lovers start loving an American for a change.

rwenger43 on March 11, 2012 at 1:32 PM

these people do not understand what we're about. we support the only veteran in the race. we have compassion for innocent people no matter what country or race. these people are full of hate but we're the bad guys?

the last comment is the most disturbing.

[oyarde]

these people do not understand what we're about. we support the only veteran in the race. we have compassion for innocent people no matter what country or race. this person sounds full of hate but we're the bad guys? Correct , we are the good guys.

[ONUV]

Correct , we are the good guys.

edited to add more

[pcosmar]

edited to add more

Wasn't really necessary.
It's HotAir..that explains it.

They are the worst sort of knuckle dragging hate mongers, right along side of the SPLC bunch.

You can't have an intelligent conversation with them,, they are ill equipped.

[angelatc]

Wasn't really necessary.
It's HotAir..that explains it.

They are the worst sort of knuckle dragging hate mongers, right along side of the SPLC bunch.

You can't have an intelligent conversation with them,, they are ill equipped. Yes, but ONUV cherry picked quotes to bring back specifically to make the whole conversation about us, which is self-serving, vain and off topic. Apparently it's hard to have a conversation with us, even when it's us.

If you go over there, there are 3 pages of comments, with about 60% of them suddenly leaning towards the "it's time to come home!" message.

There's a well spoken gentleman (Tom_Shipley) there saying the things we say, and getting people to agree with him.


This is what I don’t get. People on the right always talk about American exceptionalism. How we’re a “christian” nation with a unique moral center.
But when something like this happens, that’s all out the window. Apologize? That’s for pu$$ies. The other side not acting to our standards? Throw our standards out the window and sink to their level.
If you really want to be exceptional… if you really want to be christian, this is where you prove it. You don’t give into blood lust. You don’t give up your morals because your opponent doesn’t live up to theirs.

Tom_Shipley on March 11, 2012 at 10:51 AM (http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/11/breaking-us-soldier-held-after-rampage-15-afghan-civilians-killed/comment-page-1/#comment-5593523)




Sorry, being ‘christian’ doesn’t mean we allow ourselves to be killed without response.By your standards, it should be OK for afghans to kill US troops for quite some time.
http://cursor.org/stories/civilian_deaths.htm

Tom_Shipley on March 11, 2012 at 11:13 AM (http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/11/breaking-us-soldier-held-after-rampage-15-afghan-civilians-killed/comment-page-1/#comment-5593620)



Now you’re just being a douchebag.If being a douche bag means poking a hole in an incredibly thin argument, count me as one.
But honestly, if you guys are this incensed over two U.S. troops being shot and killed by our afghan allies, then I think you would have some empathy for the afghan people who have seen thousands of civilians killed in their own country by an occupying force over the past ten years.

Tom_Shipley on March 11, 2012 at 11:20 AM (http://hotair.com/archives/2012/03/11/breaking-us-soldier-held-after-rampage-15-afghan-civilians-killed/comment-page-2/#comment-5593653)

[moderate libertarian]

they are ill equipped.

From what I had been told, this is an undoctored photo.

http://www.100monkeystyping.com/wlog/m5.jpg

[Kluge]

Even if some of these people are rallying to get out of Afghanistan, it's not for the right reasons and they still aren't thinking for themselves.

The cynic in me thinks that there may be an Afghanistan pullout because the troops are going to be sent elsewhere.

[moderate libertarian]

Even if some of these people are rallying to get out of Afghanistan, it's not for the right reasons and they still aren't thinking for themselves.

The cynic in me thinks that there may be an Afghanistan pullout because the troops are going to be sent elsewhere.



Beginning of the end of Obama's masters' ill conceived "escalation" ?

Civilian deaths spark calls for exit, Afghan lawmakers demand US soldier face public trial

http://www.channelnewsasia.com/stories/afp_asiapacific/view/1188501/1/.html

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/12/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120312

[flightlesskiwi]

Even if some of these people are rallying to get out of Afghanistan, it's not for the right reasons and they still aren't thinking for themselves.

The cynic in me thinks that there may be an Afghanistan pullout because the troops are going to be sent elsewhere.

glad to see a fellow cynic!

we need to face what seems to be the reality of our times: absent a Ron Paul presidency, the troops aren't ever "coming home". they just aren't.

the King and his Council will not have it.

[jmdrake]

Don't you mean the Pakistani lead terrorists that overthrew the Afghan government?

You mean the CIA funded Pakistani led terrorists that overthrew the Soviet backed Afghan government?

http://www.takeoverworld.info/images/bin_laden_brzezinski1.gif

[Massachusetts]

I think he should be in custody of the Afghan government. If somebody did this on American soil, they would be held by American forces. Fact.

[Voluntary Man]

can anybody tell me why 9/11 happened....just curious.

"They hate us because we're rich and free." -Dubya

So, now that we've adopted the governing style of the former Society Union and allowed China to overtake us as the #1 industrial nation, we should be safe.



...unless they hate us because we're RICH enough to buy all sorts of fancy weapons, and consider ourselves FREE to kill whomever we want.

[Voluntary Man]

I know a neocon who would just say "good riddance" to this. :(

That's pretty much the definition of neocon.

[Voluntary Man]

Boy, we sure are freeing the fuck outta that place.

...BUT, we went into Iraq to free THEM from Hussein. We went into Afghanistan to get Osama. "Mission accomplished."//


Just noticed that our president's middle and last names have only a one letter difference between those two names. Also...

bar·rack 1 (b r k)
tr.v. bar·racked , bar·rack·ing , bar·racks
To house (soldiers, for example) in quarters.
n.
1. A building or group of buildings used to house military personnel. Often used
in the plural.
2. A large, unadorned building used for temporary occupancy. Often used in the
plural.

Weird.

[Voluntary Man]

these people do not understand what we're about. we support the only veteran in the race. we have compassion for innocent people no matter what country or race. these people are full of hate but we're the bad guys?

the last comment is the most disturbing.

These people are spoon fed propaganda 24/7. They underwent a slow motion, 12 year, scholastic lobotomy. It's a wonder they can still tie their own shoes.

What you see there is those too weak-minded to recognize or resist their own enslavement. Pity them. When/if they finally wake up, their sins will be piled too high for them to overlook. They will hang themselves in their cells, out of shame for their own complicity.


As for that last guy, I thought he was joking. I HOPE he was joking.

[JK/SEA]

Lets see..hmmm...all this 'get the troops home talk'..end the war talk...hmmm...how can we get around this??...i know...hey bubba, remember that hut with the kids inside we passed earlier today?...yeah...your orders are to go back there late tonight and light em up...thats it. Then you can get some dinner and R&R and we can get you back home early to see your family and kids...OK...oh, and thats an order, but you didn't hear it from me.

NEWS ALERT: Taliban vows revenge for killing of innocents by U.S....MISSION ACCOMPLISHED..

the beat goes on.

[Anti Federalist]

Love those inconvenient pictures that pop up at the most opportune times.


You mean the CIA funded Pakistani led terrorists that overthrew the Soviet backed Afghan government?

http://www.takeoverworld.info/images/bin_laden_brzezinski1.gif

[Athan]

This might help subside their revenge motivation:
It's a usual reminder: "We at the US gov are fucking incompetent. Don't expect our public statements to be truthful or Hallmark quality sentimental either."

[Tudo]

Correct , we are the good guys.


LOL and there are those who actually believe that

[Barrex]

Few minutes ago on news in Croatia:

US army on highest alert. Talibans preparing revenge because of killings of women and children.

[DerailingDaTrain]

Oh, I'm sure they'll offer them a couple of goats to go along with the apology. No worries.

Imagine that these occupying fools kill your sibling/parent/child and some asshole says "Sorry! Hope these goats make up for your loss! Good luck, and stay away from that pesky Taliban."

I don't know what they get for the death of a family member but in the documentary Restrepo (embedded journalists film soldiers in battle. its a really good film) they killed a guys cow because it got tangled in some barbed wire and cut up really bad. He wanted the money he would have gotten for selling the cow and instead they offered him the weight of the cow in sugar, beans, rice, and flour. He did not accept the offer.

[Endgame]

That's pretty much the definition of neocon.

Look at any right-wing forum and you'll see whole threads full of apologists and sympathizers, comments along the lines of "fuck the Afghan civilians, it's not like Afghan soldiers haven't been going on shooting sprees in our bases" etc. Lots of Lieutenant Calley wannabes.

[olehounddog]

I don't know what they get for the death of a family member but in the documentary Restrepo (embedded journalists film soldiers in battle. its a really good film) they killed a guys cow because it got tangled in some barbed wire and cut up really bad. He wanted the money he would have gotten for selling the cow and instead they offered him the weight of the cow in sugar, beans, rice, and flour. He did not accept the offer.

they killed a guys cow because it got tangled in some barbed wire and cut up really bad.

They killed the cow to eat. Wire was an excuse. Or that was the impression I got because of the sacastic voice during the report to higher up. And didn't they fly in a cook for the special occasion?

[angelatc]

Even if some of these people are rallying to get out of Afghanistan, it's not for the right reasons and they still aren't thinking for themselves.

The cynic in me thinks that there may be an Afghanistan pullout because the troops are going to be sent elsewhere.

Yeah, don't mistake my remarks for optimism. If Bush was still CIC, they'd be drooling at the opportunity to take it up a notch. This is politically expedient - nothing more.

[angelatc]

Few minutes ago on news in Croatia:

US army on highest alert. Talibans preparing revenge because of killings of women and children.

Meh - because the public opinion has been swayed. We've been bombing women and children for at least a decade now.

[moderate libertarian]

Meh - because the public opinion has been swayed. We've been bombing women and children for at least a decade now.

Deaths of civilians there rose sharply since Obama took charge of that war.

[DerailingDaTrain]

they killed a guys cow because it got tangled in some barbed wire and cut up really bad.

They killed the cow to eat. Wire was an excuse. Or that was the impression I got because of the sacastic voice during the report to higher up. And didn't they fly in a cook for the special occasion?

Yeah, they did have the cook from the base come up the OP and cook it.

[Barrex]

What does your media reports today about it?

In Croatia there are pictures on Afghan people burning puppet that represents Obama. Talibans promising beheading of US soldiers. Thousands of protesters screaming "Death to US". Karzai brothers shoot at. Situation was never so hostile since invasion/liberation.

[moderate libertarian]

Don't know. Seems like prime time US media has moved on to hot shows like fashion reality show featuring Jessica Simpson.

[Goodspeed]

USA army should have been given a time-frame to end the Afghanistan war by year 2005.

Success or failure, withdraw by december year 2005 from Afghanistan.

[Tyler_Durden]

It appears the Afghanis aren't buying the "one man shooting spree" story...

http://rt.com/news/massacre-kandahar-soldier-american-705/



Could there be a cover-up? Was it a lone solider or a group of drunken soldiers?



http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311


If this is true, is urinating on dead bodies or burning dead bodies a new thing for some of these alleged war criminals? Their holy books were allegdly burnt accidentally, what is the official line for burning of dead bodies/urination?

Why would they burn bodies afterwards after getting drunk and killing civilains including children and women in house? In an incidence in Iraq in Mahmudiyah killings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings ) when some soldiers were convicted of going into a house after getting drunk, killing civilians including women and children and burning bodies afterwards were also accused of raping a 14 year old girl. There is abolutely no such accusation here, what were they trying to accomplish by burning bodies if they indeed did that?


One soldier could kill over a dozen and injure others, but it doesn't make sense how that one soldier could burn them too. I am apt to believe the eyewitness reports of a group of drunken soldiers. When I was in the Marines, we did some crazy shit when we were drunk......this is bad news.


Standard issue is 30 rounds per mag. One guy is certainly capable, but my gut tells me the witness accounts are accurate and the damage control being done now is to make it look like an isolated incident by one soldier. Or perhaps one soldier carried it out and others came along to torch the bodies. Either way, there's alot of unanswered questions. And yes, it's tragic.


The more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This was not a one-man incident:



http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


I'm telling you - the more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This wasn't a one-man incident. This development of the official story stinks to hell. I'm starting to read articles that don't include the witness reports of multiple drunken and laughing soldiers.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1




how does a soldier walk off a secure base at 3am?

"...a U.S. service member stationed at a U.S. base in the southern Kandahar province walked off the base around 3 a.m. local time......"
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/11/us-offers-condolences-as-us-service-member-investigated-for-alleged-killing/

[bluesc]

Support the troops.

[moderate libertarian]

It appears the Afghanis aren't buying the "one man shooting spree" story...

http://rt.com/news/massacre-kandahar-soldier-american-705/

Yea, there are various reports in world media. Even US media stories in general are all over the place as happens in the fog of a war crime.


In other news, soldier accused of Afghan civilians massacre has retained high profile defense lawyer who had defended serial killer, rapist Ted Bundy.

And Kuwaitis were pissed when he was flown to base there without their knowledge:



Afghanistan: U.S. soldier accused of killing civilians was drinking, official says


The details emerged as the Taliban suspended peace talks with the United States and Afghan President Hamid Karzai demanded that NATO withdraw forces from the small, rural outposts that are at the heart of its military mission here. The double blows represented a major setback to the Afghanistan end game that U.S. President Barack Obama outlined this week.

The developments are the latest in a cascade of challenges to the measured exit the administration and its coalition partners are planning, including a gradual turnover of security responsibility to Afghan troops, paced U.S. and NATO withdrawal and a negotiated peace with the Taliban. Thursday’s statements sparked new concerns that the U.S.-led operation here could unravel as trust erodes between Afghans and the U.S.

The American military was preparing to move the sergeant to a prison in the U.S. as early as Friday, just a day after he was flown to a detention site in Kuwait from Afghanistan. The sudden transfer is the result of a behind-the-scenes diplomatic uproar with Kuwait, which learned of the sergeant’s move to an American base on Kuwaiti territory from news reports before the U.S. government could alert them, the senior U.S. official said.

“When they learned about it, the Kuwaitis blew a gasket and wanted him out of there,” the official said.

http://www.thestar.com/news/world/article/1146518--afghan-president-tells-nato-to-pull-troops-out-of-rural-areas-taliban-breaks-off-talks

[AnythingButPaper]

One word, IMPEACH! This is 100% Obama's fault. He alone has the power to take out troops out of Afghanistan. Now let us rub the Obama supporter's noses in the bullshit we call American Foreign Policy.

[TheTexan]

I'm surprised something like this hasn't happened sooner,,,, actually, it probably has.


(totally stole pcosmar's commas)

[moderate libertarian]

Yea happened and reported are not always same.

By the way, if this was done by same "stressed out" or "drunk" sniper or some other soldiers using a drone, would same civilians killings have been dismissed by declaring them suspected militants or it would have got same attention?

Neither of the two would probably take Obama or his masters in front of international war crimes court but public reaction seems very different.

[A Son of Liberty]

I am so SICK of this GOD DAMNED empire. Pardon my language - I seldom say things like that here, but it is eminently appropriate, here.

I will not link to it, for it is too, too awful, but Michael Rozeff posted a link to some Iraq war pics at the LRC Blog today. I'll leave it at that, other than to say that prepare yourself.

The people who have brought this, and who have perpetuated it, deserve every punishment they can get. I am appalled. I'm so sick and tired of this.

In honor of St. Patrick's day, Young Ned of the Hill - and when they say Oliver Cromwell, replace it with Bush, Obama, and the rest:


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n-y2ox2HPnc

[moderate libertarian]

That beat just grows on you.

Going to check out Michael Rozeff blog. Sanitized coverage has desensitized people about violence overseas they fund and support.

[Tyler_Durden]

The latest news is that Sgt. Bales doesn't recall (not surprising to me) the incident at all. At the same time, the News is reporting how he was a con man who bilked people out of money before joining the military 10yrs ago. They are shaping public opinion to show this guy as a scum bag.

I believe Sgt. Bales is a fall guy. Simple as that. They couldn't publicize that a group of soldiers killed these civilians. Not after the damage control they were going through after the Koran burnings.....


It appears the Afghanis aren't buying the "one man shooting spree" story...

http://rt.com/news/massacre-kandahar-soldier-american-705/



Could there be a cover-up? Was it a lone solider or a group of drunken soldiers?



http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/11/us-afghanistan-civilians-idUSBRE82A02V20120311


If this is true, is urinating on dead bodies or burning dead bodies a new thing for some of these alleged war criminals? Their holy books were allegdly burnt accidentally, what is the official line for burning of dead bodies/urination?

Why would they burn bodies afterwards after getting drunk and killing civilains including children and women in house? In an incidence in Iraq in Mahmudiyah killings (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mahmudiyah_killings ) when some soldiers were convicted of going into a house after getting drunk, killing civilians including women and children and burning bodies afterwards were also accused of raping a 14 year old girl. There is abolutely no such accusation here, what were they trying to accomplish by burning bodies if they indeed did that?


One soldier could kill over a dozen and injure others, but it doesn't make sense how that one soldier could burn them too. I am apt to believe the eyewitness reports of a group of drunken soldiers. When I was in the Marines, we did some crazy shit when we were drunk......this is bad news.


Standard issue is 30 rounds per mag. One guy is certainly capable, but my gut tells me the witness accounts are accurate and the damage control being done now is to make it look like an isolated incident by one soldier. Or perhaps one soldier carried it out and others came along to torch the bodies. Either way, there's alot of unanswered questions. And yes, it's tragic.


The more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This was not a one-man incident:



http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


I'm telling you - the more I read into this, the more I smell a cover-up. This wasn't a one-man incident. This development of the official story stinks to hell. I'm starting to read articles that don't include the witness reports of multiple drunken and laughing soldiers.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/11/world/asia/afghanistan-us-service-member/index.html?hpt=hp_t1




how does a soldier walk off a secure base at 3am?

"...a U.S. service member stationed at a U.S. base in the southern Kandahar province walked off the base around 3 a.m. local time......"
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2012/03/11/us-offers-condolences-as-us-service-member-investigated-for-alleged-killing/

[flightlesskiwi]

The latest news is that Sgt. Bales doesn't recall (not surprising to me) the incident at all. At the same time, the News is reporting how he was a con man who bilked people out of money before joining the military 10yrs ago. They are shaping public opinion to show this guy as a scum bag.

I believe Sgt. Bales is a fall guy. Simple as that. They couldn't publicize that a group of soldiers killed these civilians. Not after the damage control they were going through after the Koran burnings.....

bump

[Noblegeorge]

The latest news is that Sgt. Bales doesn't recall (not surprising to me) the incident at all. At the same time, the News is reporting how he was a con man who bilked people out of money before joining the military 10yrs ago. They are shaping public opinion to show this guy as a scum bag.

I believe Sgt. Bales is a fall guy. Simple as that. They couldn't publicize that a group of soldiers killed these civilians. Not after the damage control they were going through after the Koran burings.....

Im in total agreement. Since when have several eye witness accounts been disregarded so quickly. Not only that but the circumstantial evidence points to a group. Its a cover up plain and simple.

[Stupified]

I agree that it's likely a cover up.


How is Al Jazeera reporting it?

[Anti Federalist]

http://img829.imageshack.us/img829/4760/cvrpbanner.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/829/cvrpbanner.jpg/)

+rep

[Anti Federalist]

Protect the Afghan Poppy-lation

Full understanding of this, combined with a highly visible media presence, is what got Pat Tillman whacked.

[moderate libertarian]

Full understanding of this, combined with a highly visible media presence, is what got Pat Tillman whacked.

Military was able to cover up Tillman incidence for quite a while, it took more than a year before real story came out if I recall correctly.

[flightlesskiwi]

is this strange to anyone else?

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/20/10781517-army-sgt-robert-bales-lawyer-questions-evidence-in-afghanistan-killings


FORT LEAVENWORTH, Kan. – The lawyer for Robert Bales, the Army staff sergeant suspected of killing 16 Afghan civilians, says U.S. authorities lack proof of what occurred that fateful night.

[moderate libertarian]

is this strange to anyone else?

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/20/10781517-army-sgt-robert-bales-lawyer-questions-evidence-in-afghanistan-killings

It is strange.


In latest news:


US military sniper Bales charged with murder in Afghan killings

Afghans are demanding that the accused killer of 17 civilians including at least 9 children/women be handed over to them for a trial in jurisdiction where war crime occured but Obama apparently wants to try him in the US:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/military/story/2012-03-22/bales-charges-afghanistan-killings/53712206/1

[Tyler_Durden]

is this strange to anyone else?

http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/03/20/10781517-army-sgt-robert-bales-lawyer-questions-evidence-in-afghanistan-killings

MKultra much?

[moderate libertarian]

TD, I think most won't know what you meant, care to elaborate?

[qh4dotcom]

US government pays $50,000 per shooting spree Afghan death
http://news.yahoo.com/afghans-us-paid-50-000-per-shooting-spree-093131248.html

[moderate libertarian]

US government pays $50,000 per shooting spree Afghan death
http://news.yahoo.com/afghans-us-paid-50-000-per-shooting-spree-093131248.html


Life is cheap there or so we think. 9/11 victims familiies were given few million dollars each in compensation?


In related news:


Wife of Sgt. Robert Bales breaks silence

http://www.nwcn.com/home/?fId=144163445&fPath=/news/local&fDomain=10212

[ExPatPaki]

Robert Bales: Mass Murderer
and PTSD Poster Boy
The medicalization of wartime atrocities (http://original.antiwar.com/justin/2012/04/10/robert-bales-mass-murderer-and-ptsd-poster-boy/)


The story of Robert Bales, mass murderer, has pretty much disappeared from the headlines: news of the grisly killing spree, during which he slaughtered nine children and eight adults, has been displaced by the sudden “discovery” that 100,000-plus US soldiers are heavily medicated with anti-depressants and other drugs, as well as much talk of “PTSD” and discussion of how multiple deployments are “unfair” to those who have signed up to fight America’s imperialist wars.

In short, the excuse-making has begun. In a signal that the case may never even come to trial – an outcome the US military is no doubt desperately hoping for – it has been announced that a “sanity hearing” will precede the actual trial. This is unusual in itself: normal procedure is to go ahead with the court martial first, and determine if the perpetrator was mentally incapacitated at the time of the crime later.


Making Taliban (http://www.antiwar.com/blog/2012/04/03/making-taliban/)


Via Malou Innocent [1], embedded journalist Neil Shea writes in The American Scholar [2] about the mistreatment perpetrated on Afghans by U.S. soldiers, which the media (including himself, he admits) never include in the war coverage. From shooting valuable animals and pets to demolishing a family’s house and physically abusing civilians, Shea wonders how many “Taliban” were created as a response to this treatment.

Many times I have watched soldiers or Marines, driven by boredom or fear, behave selfishly and meanly, even illegally, in minor ways. In a few searing moments I have wondered what would come next, what the men would do to prisoners or civilians or suspected insurgents.

…The soldiers of Destroyer talked about how their house searches had become demolition parties. They shattered windows and china, broke furniture, hurled civilians to the ground. Earlier that day, they had blown up a building.

In reference to an Afghan prisoner:

“I think he remembers we were the ones who fucked him up last night,” the soldier said to Givens. “I think he’s starin’ at you.”

“Fuck him,” Givens said. “The only reason he’s still alive is because the United States of America holds 25 to life over my head.”

…”Yeah, we definitely made some Taliban out here,” he said. “It was like a week-long Taliban recruiting drive. And we had fun doing it. I love recruiting for the Taliban. It’s called job security.”

[phill4paul]

From shooting valuable animals and pets to demolishing a family’s house and physically abusing civilians, Shea wonders how many “Taliban” were created as a response to this treatment.

Many times I have watched soldiers or Marines, driven by boredom or fear, behave selfishly and meanly, even illegally, in minor ways. In a few searing moments I have wondered what would come next, what the men would do to prisoners or civilians or suspected insurgents.

…The soldiers of Destroyer talked about how their house searches had become demolition parties. They shattered windows and china, broke furniture, hurled civilians to the ground. Earlier that day, they had blown up a building.

In reference to an Afghan prisoner:

“I think he remembers we were the ones who fucked him up last night,” the soldier said to Givens. “I think he’s starin’ at you.”

“Fuck him,” Givens said. “The only reason he’s still alive is because the United States of America holds 25 to life over my head.”

Good lord. It is like the play book to create a patriot movement in America!

[Danke]

Whatever "moderate libertarian" may have done, I hope it is a temp ban. Josh, this site is being ruined by these bans, do you not see it?

[Kluge]

Whatever "moderate libertarian" may have done, I hope it is a temp ban. Josh, this site is being ruined by these bans, do you not see it?

I don't know what's going on with this hardcore bullshit, but I agree--it's ruining this site.

[Danke]

I don't know what's going on with this hardcore bullshit, but I agree--it's ruining this site.

My bad, I take that back, we have a thread "**OFFICIAL** Hockey Thread."

That is some serious discussion.

[Kluge]

My bad, I take that back, we have a thread "**OFFICIAL** Hockey Thread."

That is some serious discussion.

Thank god, Wayne Gretzky was being neglected. He is very important in our push to gets our freedoms back.

[Danke]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJ4pSzgMpAU&feature=relmfu

[Warrior_of_Freedom]

US government pays $50,000 per shooting spree Afghan death
http://news.yahoo.com/afghans-us-paid-50-000-per-shooting-spree-093131248.html

*taxpayers

Using our money to fix their oopsie is a sacrifice they're willing to make.