Delegates.. Im confused

[Starfox]

Hi guys,

Im one of these people that is confused on the delegates situation. Can some nice person explain to me how they work? I googled it and as far as i know it varies from state to state and when it comes to the time the delegates actually have to vote for someone, they can still change their mind.

I dont understand how paul has won a landslide win are far as delegates goes in maine, but still came in second

Personally im not sure why there are delegates, doesnt it just leave more room for fraud.. doesnt it?

[DamianTV]

Like you said, it depends on the State. In some states, the number of delegates are bound to the Primary Vote. Other states, however, they are NOT. Its like saying no one elses vote means a damn thing, and only the Delegates get to vote. So say the state has 40 delegates. 2 million people be damned, if 20 of those delegates, just 20, vote for Ron Paul, that is 50% of the state. And that is where we are showing our real strength in numbers. Other states like Florida, where it is a "winner takes all", they get all the delegates regardless of who the delegates themselves want to vote for. Those are states that hurt us.

[Starfox]

Like you said, it depends on the State. In some states, the number of delegates are bound to the Primary Vote. Other states, however, they are NOT. Its like saying no one elses vote means a damn thing, and only the Delegates get to vote. So say the state has 40 delegates. 2 million people be damned, if 20 of those delegates, just 20, vote for Ron Paul, that is 50% of the state. And that is where we are showing our real strength in numbers. Other states like Florida, where it is a "winner takes all", they get all the delegates regardless of who the delegates themselves want to vote for. Those are states that hurt us.

So basically it does not matter that everyone votes? thats big... but not surprised really, would you mind telling me how it works, as in, how does a candidate get awarded delegate slots, if i have that right, why did ron get more if he came second?

[chudrockz]

I caucused for Ron Paul in Minnesota.

In a CAUCUS, people gather to conduct party business. Numerous things happen, among them are a Presidential Preference STRAW POLL (utterly nonbinding and practically meaningless, but it's what the media fixates on) as well as ELECTION of delegates to County Conventions.

The election of delegates to the county conventions from each precinct is what actually, in fact, matters. Because these delegates attend their county conventions, and at THOSE conventions delegates are elected to District Conventions. At THOSE conventions, delegates are chosen to attend the STATE convention, and finally the delegates to the State Convention choose delegates to go to the National Convention.

I'm a delegate to my county convention. I WILL try my hardest to keep progressing up the chain. I will NOT give up my country without a fight.

[PaulConventionWV]

Like you said, it depends on the State. In some states, the number of delegates are bound to the Primary Vote. Other states, however, they are NOT. Its like saying no one elses vote means a damn thing, and only the Delegates get to vote. So say the state has 40 delegates. 2 million people be damned, if 20 of those delegates, just 20, vote for Ron Paul, that is 50% of the state. And that is where we are showing our real strength in numbers. Other states like Florida, where it is a "winner takes all", they get all the delegates regardless of who the delegates themselves want to vote for. Those are states that hurt us.

You left out the fact that our unbound Ron Paul delegates still have to be ELECTED as delegates. You can't just grab a spot and say "I'm a delegate now."

[Starfox]

Thanks, How do you get chosen to be a delegate, and on what grounds? How many states does the primary votes not count, where the delegates only matter? And in the states where the delegates vote only counts, whats the point in the public even voting?

[camp_steveo]

I caucused for Ron Paul in Minnesota.

In a CAUCUS, people gather to conduct party business. Numerous things happen, among them are a Presidential Preference STRAW POLL (utterly nonbinding and practically meaningless, but it's what the media fixates on) as well as ELECTION of delegates to County Conventions.

The election of delegates to the county conventions from each precinct is what actually, in fact, matters. Because these delegates attend their county conventions, and at THOSE conventions delegates are elected to District Conventions. At THOSE conventions, delegates are chosen to attend the STATE convention, and finally the delegates to the State Convention choose delegates to go to the National Convention.

I'm a delegate to my county convention. I WILL try my hardest to keep progressing up the chain. I will NOT give up my country without a fight.

Are you going as an alternate if you have to?

[chudrockz]

Are you going as an alternate if you have to?

I'm attending the County Convention as a Delegate. I was elected as a Delegate, not an Alternate. :)

Edit: should I be elected an alternate, rather than a delegate, to our DISTRICT convention, I'll go as an alternate to THAT!

[Starfox]

So how do delegates get chosen? and if in primaries, if all that counts are the peoples votes, whats the need for delegates there?

[NCGOPer_for_Paul]

Okay, I'm going to be giving this presentation to a Mecklenburg County, NC contingent of Ron Paul supporters this afternoon. I have some time now, so here goes.

The FIRST thing that happens is the PRECINCT meeting. In some states (Iowa, Nevada, Maine, Minnesota, Colorado, any state referred to as a CAUCUS state), this meeting also includes a straw poll. In most states, this is a non-binding (meaning no NATONAL delegates are awarded based upon it) "beauty contest" vote. The media jumps all over them, getting the masses to believe that the vote signifies something. It may point to momentum or "popularity", but has really nothing to do with organizaton. Anyway, at this precinct meeting, people (delegates) are elected to the COUNTY convention. Depending on the size of the precinct, so many delegates can be sent to the county convention.

In a lot of places, if you just show up, you become a county convention delegate. In some places as well, if you get to county convention, you can get to CONGRESSIONAL DISTRICT convention, and to STATE convention. In others, there are elections for who gets to these conventions.

DISTRICT CONVENTIONS are probably the most important to get to. Most states get three NATIONAL delegates from each district. If Paul "delegates" control the floor at these conventions, they can elect NATIONAL delegates that will be pledged to Ron Paul REGARDLESS of what the "straw poll" totals were. These are probably the most "winnable", especially in CDs where Democrats dominate, because the GOP tends to be less organized there, and a few delegate spots can be picked off without too much effort.

STATE conventions are a bit more difficult to control. Iowa MAY be an exception this year because the new party chair is a Paul supporter. At State Convention, depending on the state, the rest of the National delegates are elected. If Paul delegates control the floor, the convention can force a floor vote for those National delegates.

THIS is why winning the small caucus delegate spots is so important. Basically, if we win 66% of the delegate spots, the only thing that can stop a plurality of Paul national delegates is outright fraud.

In a situation that we might have this year, that would potentially also alienate Santorum/Romney (depending on state) supporters.

[Reason]

*edit* perhaps not? (http://projects.wsj.com/campaign2012/delegates)

[NCGOPer_for_Paul]

http://projects.wsj.com/campaign2012/delegates

Mitt has 123

RP has 19

Pure conjecture and estimates.

I could say that Paul has 43 and it would mean just as much as saying 19.

The only ACTUAL first ballot PLEDGED delegates that Paul HAS OFFICIALLY gotten are:

3 from New Hampshire
5 from Nevada
most likely 1 GOP "superdelegate" from Iowa

He likely has at least
7-15 from Iowa
11-20 from Minnesota
3-8 from Colorado
12-18 from Maine

He DOES NOT have any pledged delegates from
South Carolina
Florida

[chudrockz]

http://projects.wsj.com/campaign2012/delegates

Mitt has 123

RP has 19

Just the briefest glance at this website to know it's complete and total TRIPE.

They claim Santorum got 37 delegates by winning Minnesota. NOTHING could be further from the truth.

Classic media BS.

[Starfox]

Thanks allot for the explanation :)

[bluesc]

http://projects.wsj.com/campaign2012/delegates

Mitt has 123

RP has 19

That count is false. The only accurate count is one that doesn't include any of the caucus states except for Nevada - although that may change too.

[Invi]

in the states where the delegates vote only counts, whats the point in the public even voting?

Are you familiar with the Electoral College?
Pretty close to the same idea.
You elect your delegates under the assumption that they will vote as the area voted, but they are not required to do so.

[Starfox]

Are you familiar with the Electoral College?
Pretty close to the same idea.
You elect your delegates under the assumption that they will vote as the area voted, but they are not required to do so.

so whats the needs for delegates.. does not make any sense to me. And from the above posts it seems the general consensus on the delegate count is confusion, i mean it should be clear and open for everyone to see

[DamianTV]

This may help. Even though I am not a fan of MadCow...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=2OkN2npJR-4

[bluesc]

Maddow was being respectful because no other campaign will send even a surrogate to do an interview with her. Huntsman literally ran away from her in NH :D.

[brandon]

Every state has their own rules on delegates. This is the best site I've found for explaining the rules state by state. It is a bit advanced though.

http://www.thegreenpapers.com/

[Reason]

Interesting...

[oyarde]

You left out the fact that our unbound Ron Paul delegates still have to be ELECTED as delegates. You can't just grab a spot and say "I'm a delegate now." Saw through my plan huh ? :)