Electability - Seems simple to me....

[EndTheFed]

Ok They say there are 40% Dems and 40% Rep ans 20% in the middle.

They say to get elected You get your base and then try to get the middle to win...

Well If Ron were to win the nomination, He would get the base (even if they felt they had to hold their nose cause they want to beat obama).

He would pull most indys and some dems too...

So what is the problem...

[ropo]

A good amount of that "base" would support Obama over Paul

[A. Havnes]

Also, people tend not to look at these things logically and save time for themselves by just believing what they're told. I remember when Perry jumped into the race, I was having a conversation with a bunch of guys my grandfather sometimes hangs out with at breakfast. I said that there was no way I'd vote for Perry, pointed out his corruption, and said that I'd vote for Paul. The response was terrible. I was slammed for wasting my vote on an unelectable candidate, that we need someone - anyone - who could beat Obama, even if he was scum, and that Perry "created jobs!" There was no foreign policy debate that day - the big issue was electability, and who could beat Obama.

I asked, "Don't you realize that none of the other candidates are going to save the country? Do you think any of these people will do anything to reverse the harm done during the Obama presidency?" No response. They just want a president with an "R" by their name, even if he/she does nothing of significance during their term, or worse, actually produces more harm. Oh, but I forgot that Republicans can't do any harm and Bush was an amazing leader.

[EndTheFed]

A good amount of that "base" would support Obama over Paul

Hmmm I completely disagree... Polls of these people, the base, (Reps) show the biggest thing they want is to beat obama.

They are not Paul supporters. They are NOT our candidate or no one (mostly).

They would vote for Paul over Obama.

[GunnyFreedom]

Your analysis is good, but Paulhaters are not Paul's base. They are the 'soft' support that we need to build coalitions with, but many of the members of our actual base freaks out every time Paul moves in the direction he needs to to build those coalitions and win.

"ZOMG He just said that in a way neocons understand! SELLOUT SELLOUT SELLOUT" :rolleyes:

We also had problems in 2008 with people who didn't want to do what was necessary to win. That's when the meme started that Paul is like their favorite indy band that when it gets popular their biggest fans start hating them because they aren't "cool" anymore.

It's a real problem. Our strongest support can sometimes be our own worst enemy when it comes to winning the election.

In any case, other than a little misidentification your logic is spot on. The actual number of Paulhaters who will vote Obama is ridiculously small, more than overwhelmed by indys and crossover dems. When we get into the General, victory is much more assured than the Primary.

[EndTheFed]

Your analysis is good, but Paulhaters are not Paul's base. They are the 'soft' support that we need to build coalitions with, but many of the members of our actual base freaks out every time Paul moves in the direction he needs to to build those coalitions and win.

"ZOMG He just said that in a way neocons understand! SELLOUT SELLOUT SELLOUT" :rolleyes:

We also had problems in 2008 with people who didn't want to do what was necessary to win. That's when the meme started that Paul is like their favorite indy band that when it gets popular their biggest fans start hating them because they aren't "cool" anymore.

It's a real problem. Our strongest support can sometimes be our own worst enemy when it comes to winning the election.

In any case, other than a little misidentification your logic is spot on. The actual number of Paulhaters who will vote Obama is ridiculously small, more than overwhelmed by indys and crossover dems. When we get into the General, victory is much more assured than the Primary.

Point taken... When I refer to the base I am talking about republicans in general (not hard core Paulbots :) ).

We will get the Paulbots but if he were the nominee the republicans would mostly vote for Paul to beat Obama or not vote at all but they wanna beat Obama so bad, for the most part, I don't think they would not vote.

[69360]

Your analysis is good, but Paulhaters are not Paul's base. They are the 'soft' support that we need to build coalitions with, but many of the members of our actual base freaks out every time Paul moves in the direction he needs to to build those coalitions and win.

"ZOMG He just said that in a way neocons understand! SELLOUT SELLOUT SELLOUT" :rolleyes:

We also had problems in 2008 with people who didn't want to do what was necessary to win. That's when the meme started that Paul is like their favorite indy band that when it gets popular their biggest fans start hating them because they aren't "cool" anymore.

It's a real problem. Our strongest support can sometimes be our own worst enemy when it comes to winning the election.

In any case, other than a little misidentification your logic is spot on. The actual number of Paulhaters who will vote Obama is ridiculously small, more than overwhelmed by indys and crossover dems. When we get into the General, victory is much more assured than the Primary.

Exactly. Ron would easily win a general election as a GOP nominee. Getting Ron as the GOP nominee is looking unlikely unfortunately, but miracles happen. I will still stand on my principles and vote for Ron.

[RonPaul101.com]

Hmmm I completely disagree... Polls of these people, the base, (Reps) show the biggest thing they want is to beat obama.

They are not Paul supporters. They are NOT our candidate or no one (mostly).

They would vote for Paul over Obama.

I agree.

[EndTheFed]

Now.... it seems crazy to me that people can't see that Paul IS the most electable.

If we can get this across to Dumb Masses (as boortz says), he should be the nominee..

Wish they would make this simple (KISS) and get this message out.

[Edward]

Ok They say there are 40% Dems and 40% Rep ans 20% in the middle.

Per Rasmussen (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/partisan_trends), voters generally self-identify as follows:

Republicans 34%
Democrats 34%
Independents 32%

[EndTheFed]

Per Rasmussen (http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/mood_of_america/partisan_trends), voters generally self-identify as follows:

Republicans 34%
Democrats 34%
Independents 32%

Dang it... I was gonna say between 30-40% for each. I knew it was somewhere around that. Just gives us a bigger indy pool..

[Edward]

Dang it... I was gonna say between 30-40% for each. I knew it was somewhere around that. Just gives us a bigger indy pool..

It's hard to tell, but I think the fact that Romney is closer to Obama than Paul is in head-to-head polling indicates that Romney would draw more independents than Paul. An alternative explanation is that Romney is more able to get out the Republican base that Paul.

[Elwar]

An alternative explanation is that Romney is more able to get out the Republican base that Paul.

This (right now).

Ron Paul polls beating Obama by 7% among Independents.

Paul still does not have full Republican support in head to head polling but if it were him vs Obama, he would have full Republican support. Obama is not even close to being moderate enough to pull in Republican voters.

Ron Paul will win among independents and disgruntled Democrats.

[Edward]

Ron Paul will win among independents and disgruntled Democrats.

Although the following poll does not give figures on Paul vs. Obama head-to-head, it does seem to confirm that Paul would do better than Romney with Democrats. In a three-way match-up, Paul seems to take more of the independent vote from Romney than from Obama but I imagine Paul would do even better among that group with Romney out of the way.

http://www.people-press.org/files/2012/01/1-18-12-6.png