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GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-09-2007, 03:13 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

Johnnybags
11-09-2007, 03:17 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

You are the hundreth person to complain, its your right and they will back off, contact them.

thoughtbombing
11-09-2007, 03:19 PM
First and foremost... http://aclu.org/
Immediately contact the ACLU before you take any action.

Second of all, nobody here can make the choice for you. You can either keep the signs there, pay the fines and get over it... you can keep the signs there, DON'T pay the fines and possibly risk jail in Cook County(umm, might wanna avoid that.)

ACLU gets involved, you keep the signs there and you fight it. My guess is that they will change the local statute to ablidge, rather than be sued--which they will be, and they'll lose.

I personally, would keep them there, not pay anything, and tell them to refer to the constitution.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-09-2007, 03:36 PM
thank you both.

weatherbill
11-09-2007, 03:41 PM
all you have to do, is tell them, according to Uniform Commerical Code, sections 1-207 and 1-103.6, it says I may reserve all my rights under the common law and the constitution.

Under "Common Law", you must present an injured person or damaged proprty. If neither can be presented, there is no violation that can be enforced.....

this is the law. If the beaurocrats don't like it, then maybe they want to go to civil court for freuad intimidation and fear mongering, coming in the color of law...... turn the table on them....you play offense and let them play defense!

John of Des Moines
11-09-2007, 03:48 PM
Call the local media paper - from the Daily Herald to the TV and radio - nothing better than some free Ron Paul advertising to boot.

Mrossca
11-09-2007, 04:45 PM
Good luck man!

Hook
11-09-2007, 06:04 PM
Contact the Institute for Justice at www.ij.org. The specialize in eminent domain and first ammendment rights.

kylejack
11-09-2007, 06:18 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.
This has happened all around the country and every single time the city backs down and we win. Every time. Contact BLS here on the forums for our most recent success story.

Your rights as ruled by the courts:
1. You may have a political sign
2. They may not impose date restrictions on your sign
3. You do not have to pay a permit fee
4. They can not fine you for this

Does the ticket reference the specific portion of the city's code that you're violating?

torchbearer
11-09-2007, 06:35 PM
This kind of crap really pisses me off, I'd set up a political sign with a claymore rigged to it.

torchbearer
11-09-2007, 06:38 PM
Remember, you only have the rights you are willing to fight for... ask yourself, are you willing to fight for this right? how far are you willing to go to preserve that right... and after making these value judgments, stick with them... stick to your guns, draw a line in the sand, and have 200 attorneys at your back.

bbachtung
11-09-2007, 06:40 PM
This is yet another unconstitutional action of a city (or, in your case, village) government.

Here is the Village of Wheeling's Sign Code (http://www.vi.wheeling.il.us/Services/CommunityDevelopment/Planning/SignCode.pdf) in its entirety.

It appears that the maximum civil penalty is $1,000 per week (not day). See Section 21.03.200 ("Any person who violates or fails to comply with any of the provisions of this code or the erector, owner or user of an unlawful sign or the owner of property on which an unlawful sign is located shall be subject to a fine of one thousand dollars for each week or portion thereof that the use or display of the unlawful sign has continued").

Here are the now familiar (from BLS' case and those of several other people who have been victimized by their local governments) relevant portions:



21.05.600 Exempt Signs

The following signs are exempt from permit requirements. Such signs shall comply with other regulations in this code and shall be reviewed by the Director of Community Development:

a) Directional and informational signs no larger than three square feet

b) Government or public signs such as traffic control signs, railroad crossing signs, legal notices and signs indicating the location of underground utilities;

c) Garage sale and yard sale signs are permitted in the public right-of-way on the day of sale only, from Thursday at 7:00 AM to Sunday at 6:00 PM, provided that the sign is not more than three square feet in size and is mounted no higher than three feet above grade.

d) Realty signs are permitted in the public right-of-way from dawn to dusk on Friday, Saturday,
Sunday, and the designated listing service day, provided that the sign is not more than three
square feet in size and is mounted no higher than three feet above grade.

e) Memorial signs and plaques, names of buildings and date of erection, when constructed of
bronze or other incombustible material and cut into any masonry surface or inlaid so as to be part of the building. Such signs shall be limited to three square feet;

f) A freestanding memorial sign, as determined by the Director of Community Development, shall be limited to 12 square feet and shall be located at least 10’ from the front property line and 15’ from side lot lines;

g) No trespassing, no solicitation or no dumping signs not to exceed three square feet in area per sign, centered one per 100 feet of street frontage and not to be closer than 100 feet, are granted by the Community Development Director

h) Interior Signs: Any sign inside a building, not attached to a window or door, which is not able to be read by pedestrians or vehicles passing on adjoining streets.

i) Non-sign decoration: Temporary displays, including holiday lights, decorations, painted window areas, works of art, flags (not exceeding 50 square feet), memorial signs, religious or historic symbols, and other displays with no commercial message that do not create a hazard.

j) Free flying flag shall be mounted and displayed below the roofline. Freestanding flag poles are to be limited in height to 35 feet from grade.

k) Political campaign signs: A temporary sign announcing the support or opposition of political
candidates or referenda for any national, state or local election. One sign per candidate per lot
shall be permitted. The signs shall be limited to a maximum of 26” wide by 16” tall per sign and a maximum height of three (3) feet from grade to the top of the sign. The sign shall be located entirely on private property with the owner’s consent. The sign shall be erected no more than thirty (30) days prior to the election and shall be removed within seven (7) days following the election.

l) Real estate signs: An on-premise sign pertaining to the sale or lease of the premises, or any
portion thereof. The sign shall not exceed 12 square feet in area and is to be removed within 7
days after closing. One sign per property is permitted, and may not be attached to the façade of the building.


I've bolded my favorite parts (i.e., the ones that show discrimination based on the content of the sign, including the one that gives you greater free speech rights if you are selling your home or promoting your religion versus having a political view). I love the arbitrary and capricious nature of the classifications of "exempt signs." What is the real difference between a non-sign decoration and a political sign?

Here's what the Illinois Municipal League says about regulation of political signs (while not placing similar restrictions on other types of signs, such as real estate signs):



Municipal ordinances imposing durational limitations on political signs and not on other temporary signs, for example, have been determined to be content-based restrictions and unable to survive exacting scrutiny. In McCormack v. Township of Clinton, and Whitton v. City of Gladstone, the municipal ordinances involved imposed time limits on political and viewpoint signs and not on other temporary signs (e.g. signs advertising yard sales, festivities and events, or the sale of property). The respective courts determined that such restrictions were content-based and subject to exacting scrutiny. The municipality in each case argued that it had a compelling interest in promoting its aesthetic and safety goals. However, each court determined that although a municipality may have a substantial interest in such concerns, it does not have a compelling interest to impose content-based restrictions on a specific topic to achieve that end. (Emphasis added). Therefore, anything short of a compelling governmental interest, a municipal ordinance restricting the content of political speech will not survive exacting scrutiny.

***

In conclusion, a facially content-based restriction on political speech must be subjected to exacting (or strict) scrutiny when under review by the courts. Such scrutiny will most likely apply when temporary signs are prohibited from a traditional public forum, and when consent is required before placing temporary signs on public property. To survive this scrutiny, a local government must have a compelling interest in such regulation. However, because such laws rarely survive such scrutiny, legitimate content-neutral time, place and manner restrictions on all “temporary signs” are more permissive. For an ordinance to be classified as content-neutral, it must not be aimed at any particular topic, and the local government must demonstrate that it had a substantial interest in the regulation. Promoting aesthetic and safety goals, and maintaining or enhancing property values are considered substantial governmental interests. Thus, a municipality may impose size, quantity, placement, spacing, and durational regulations of all temporary signs on private or public property, provided the regulation is reasonable. It may even prohibit the posting of all temporary signs on public property provided the public property is not a traditional public forum. However, for a municipality to deviate from content-neutrality in its regulation of signs, anything short of a compelling governmental interest, the regulation will not pass constitutional muster.

http://www.iml.org/dbs/imllegal/dyncat.cfm?catid=2127

torchbearer
11-09-2007, 06:48 PM
I'm glad we have lawyers on this site. If you are a lawyer with time to help the grassroots please pm me.... i've got an invite for you.

sparebulb
11-09-2007, 06:53 PM
A guy I know gets around the Ladybird Johnson Highway Beautification law against having a billboard within so many feet of the highway by renting a bus and attaching a small billboard to it and parking it on property that he owns right off the highway. I guess that is long for attach the sign to your car and then it becomes just a big bumpersticker.

seapilot
11-09-2007, 07:28 PM
Glad I live in Alaska where I can put my sign out next to the street..tho it blows over at times.. Couldnt tell you how mad id be if I got a fine for that. Good Luck and dont let them shove you around. Writing letters to state representatives helps as they budget money for districts.

jgmaynard
11-10-2007, 12:00 AM
Get the ACLU, the IJ and the press involved. They'll back down and it will generate publicity for Ron. Course, I can't tell you what to do, but that is the route I would take.
In NH, ALL laws regarding political davertising on private property have been declared unconstiutional and striken from the record. <cough*move to NH*Free state project*> :D

JM

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-10-2007, 12:08 AM
I contacted the daily herald and nbc 5, as well as the A.C.L.U. So I will see what happens.

bbachtung
11-10-2007, 12:18 AM
I contacted the daily herald and nbc 5, as well as the A.C.L.U. So I will see what happens.

When the news contacts you back, direct them to the Illinois Municipal League's website addressing the regulation of campaign signs differently than others. http://www.iml.org/dbs/imllegal/dyncat.cfm?catid=2127

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-28-2007, 02:44 AM
Good news!

The daily herald wants to take a picture of me with my signs!
Go Ron Paul!

free.alive
11-28-2007, 03:03 AM
First thing I would do would be get a bigger sign.

foofighter20x
11-28-2007, 07:26 AM
bump

Sematary
11-28-2007, 07:33 AM
I saved these from another thread in case it ever came up again:

Whitton v. Gladstone, 54 F.3d 1400 (8th Cir. 1995) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited placement or erection of political signs from thirty days prior to the election to which the sign pertains until seven days after the election.

- Dimas v. Warren, 939 F. Supp. 554 (E.D. Mich. 1996) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which prohibited posting of political yard signs earlier than forty-five days prior to any election, and ordering removal within seven days after.

- Orazio v. North Hempstead, 426 F. Supp. 1144 (E.D.N.Y. 1977) - Holding that no time limit on the display of pre-election political signs is permissible under the First Amendment.

- Antioch v. Candidates' Outdoor Graphic Serv., 557 F. Supp. 52 (N.D. Cal. 1982) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited display of political signs to the period of sixty days before election.

- Collier v. Tacoma, 854 P.2d 1046 (Wa. 1993) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited posting of political signs to the period sixty days prior to election and seven days after.

- Christensen v. Wheaton, 2000 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 1737 (N.D. Ill. 2000) - Granting preliminary injunction enjoining enforcement of ordinance the effect of which was to prohibit the display of political signs for more than thirty days.

- Curry v. Prince George's County, Maryland, 33 F. Supp. 2d 447 (D.C. Md. 1999) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional that banned political signs in private residences for all but forty-five days before and ten days after an election.

Dave Wood
11-28-2007, 07:38 AM
Good news!

The daily herald wants to take a picture of me with my signs!
Go Ron Paul!


GoApe, you will win this easily and embarrass a lot of people.

I think we have had the biggest problem in Florida so you might want to e-mail the big meetup heads down there as well, they seem to have it under control.....I do think the ACLU had to get involved once though.

They were even trying to tell a girl down there that she had to take signs off of her own truck! Now thats just flippin crazy imo.

Birdlady
11-28-2007, 07:40 AM
First thing I would do would be get a bigger sign.

Yes. Same here!

James R
11-28-2007, 07:46 AM
You need to decide which of two steps you want to take:
1. Remove within the period stated.

2. Commit to putting 10+ hours into legal research and responding to the city requests. Read the city ordinances. Before you do that, carefully read these related threads:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=23398
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=26791

If you are not willing to put a lot of hours into this my advice is to remove the sign. It will be tough to find someone else who will go through the city ordinances, except for a $100/h lawyer. And, the last thing you want to do is nothing or the city could end up blatantly stealing everything you have (they like doing that to their citizens who want their constitutional rights).

Sematary
11-28-2007, 07:47 AM
You need to decide which of two steps you want to take:
1. Remove within the period stated.

2. Commit to putting 10+ hours into legal research and responding to the city requests. Read the city ordinances. Before you do that, carefully read these related threads:
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=23398
http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?t=26791

If you are not willing to put a lot of hours into this my advice is to remove the sign. It will be tough to find someone else who will go through the city ordinances, except for a $100/h lawyer.

As I said:
Whitton v. Gladstone, 54 F.3d 1400 (8th Cir. 1995) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited placement or erection of political signs from thirty days prior to the election to which the sign pertains until seven days after the election.

- Dimas v. Warren, 939 F. Supp. 554 (E.D. Mich. 1996) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which prohibited posting of political yard signs earlier than forty-five days prior to any election, and ordering removal within seven days after.

- Orazio v. North Hempstead, 426 F. Supp. 1144 (E.D.N.Y. 1977) - Holding that no time limit on the display of pre-election political signs is permissible under the First Amendment.

- Antioch v. Candidates' Outdoor Graphic Serv., 557 F. Supp. 52 (N.D. Cal. 1982) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited display of political signs to the period of sixty days before election.

- Collier v. Tacoma, 854 P.2d 1046 (Wa. 1993) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited posting of political signs to the period sixty days prior to election and seven days after.

- Christensen v. Wheaton, 2000 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 1737 (N.D. Ill. 2000) - Granting preliminary injunction enjoining enforcement of ordinance the effect of which was to prohibit the display of political signs for more than thirty days.

- Curry v. Prince George's County, Maryland, 33 F. Supp. 2d 447 (D.C. Md. 1999) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional that banned political signs in private residences for all but forty-five days before and ten days after an election.

purplechoe
11-28-2007, 07:52 AM
Good news!

The daily herald wants to take a picture of me with my signs!
Go Ron Paul!

That's what I like to hear, turn a negative into a positive. Congrats!

Even though I live in Arlington Heights, Wheeling starts just behind my fence... :)

foofighter20x
11-28-2007, 08:07 AM
They were even trying to tell a girl down there that she had to take signs off of her own truck! Now thats just flippin crazy imo.

That case I kind of agree with, but only in part...

If she wants to plaster her truck in RP signs, that's fine, but never to the point (like this girl had) where it could obstruct the driver's ability to see.

Goes to that old adage: Work smarter, not harder.

If you are doing to dec out your car, do it wisely.

kimosabi
11-28-2007, 08:10 AM
Everyone needs to learn the difference between Common Law and Statute Law, this is very important...

Sandra
11-28-2007, 08:30 AM
In Livingston Parish we.ve had parish employees do the same thing. A lot of these letters are concocted by self important municipal employees and sent at the request of an aquaintance. The letters usually aren't official and are based on templates. Usually the sender gets in deep doodoo. The news coverage will usually take care to put employees in check - hopefully.

Sandra
11-28-2007, 08:32 AM
Neiborhood associations are getting bad too.

constituent
11-28-2007, 08:35 AM
all you have to do, is tell them, according to Uniform Commerical Code, sections 1-207 and 1-103.6, it says I may reserve all my rights under the common law and the constitution.

Under "Common Law", you must present an injured person or damaged proprty. If neither can be presented, there is no violation that can be enforced.....

this is the law. If the beaurocrats don't like it, then maybe they want to go to civil court for freuad intimidation and fear mongering, coming in the color of law...... turn the table on them....you play offense and let them play defense!

here here!!!!


we need like ten weatherbills right now.

robofx
11-28-2007, 08:38 AM
Your rights as ruled by the courts:
1. You may have a political sign
2. They may not impose date restrictions on your sign
3. You do not have to pay a permit fee
4. They can not fine you for this

Why do we need "the courts" to tell us what our rights are?

The Bill of Rights is pretty clear.

TruckinMike
11-28-2007, 08:43 AM
Avoid the legal hassles and use the previous mentioned Bus/sign technique.

1. Park a car/truck with up to date insurance and registration in your drive way or on the street. (borrow a one if you have to)

2. Mount a HUGE coroplast sign semi-permanently on the roof or sides.


I did this for my business for two years, I had two 3x9 banners mounted on a truck. It works great, they really hate the loss of power. --- :D:eek::D

Now go get'em!!

TruckinMike

me3
11-28-2007, 08:53 AM
This kind of crap really pisses me off, I'd set up a political sign with a claymore rigged to it.
I know this is an old post, but I missed it before. Thanks for the laugh. :D

hopeforamerica
11-28-2007, 09:24 AM
Neiborhood associations are getting bad too.

Yep, we got a notice from ours. However, it is for our electric Christmas Lights sign (Ron Paul of course). We'll see how that goes. We haven't taken it down and don't intend to!

TruckinMike
11-28-2007, 09:36 AM
http://www.mondotees.com/ProductImages/bangonicons/fist.jpg
----Ron Paul Power!----

Like I said... Go Get'em! I love the attitude here at the RPforums!:D

TruckinMike

Arklatex
11-28-2007, 09:53 AM
Contact the local paper!

jpinkerton
11-28-2007, 10:09 AM
He stated he contacted the local paper, any resolution to this? Did they come take your picture?

kylejack
11-28-2007, 10:11 AM
Why do we need "the courts" to tell us what our rights are?

The Bill of Rights is pretty clear.
Of course, but The State can still use a different interpretation to oppress you, and everybody has to decide how much pain they're willing to suffer in defense of their rights. MY point is that even The State's interpretation defends him.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-28-2007, 05:06 PM
He stated he contacted the local paper, any resolution to this? Did they come take your picture?

not yet.. I have to set up a date. In between work and stuff. Hopefully it will be thursday or friday.

craezie
11-28-2007, 05:18 PM
My neighborhood association forbids them. Unfortunately courts tend to uphold fascist rules on the part of associations because you agree to them when you move in (I never thought I would ever want to put up a political sign when I moved here).

So according to my husband, the lawyer, the way is to get a REALLY BIG sign and put it in your window. This would work for those of you whose cities forbid the lawn signs if you don't want to deal with the red tape of suing. You have a right to do what you want inside of your house, even if its visible from the outside. So put your Ron Paul signs and christmas lights inside your big picture window, and you can laugh with me at all of the uptight jerks in your neighborhood association police.

Adam Smith
11-28-2007, 05:18 PM
Good Luck, GoApe.

jonahtrainer
11-28-2007, 05:36 PM
This is yet another unconstitutional action of a city (or, in your case, village) government.


bbachtung is right on. This ordinance will not pass Constitutional muster. Nevertheless, to show 'good faith' you may want to march down to a court with appropriate jurisdiction and file for a Temporary Restraining Order (TRO) against the enforcement of the ordinance until its Constitutionality can be determined.

It shouldn't take too long. In the complaint state (1) there is an ordinance (attach a copy of the ordinance as Exhibit A), (2) the city has threatened enforcement of the ordinance (include the letter bearing the city's teeth as Exhibit B), (3) based on all applicable case law the ordinance appears to be blatantly UnConstitutional (throw in some case citations if you want to and several have already been presented in this thread) and (4) pray for relief that in equity that the enforcement of the ordinance be stayed until the Constitutionality of the ordinance can be ruled upon.

Flex Your Rights like any responsible citizen does!

PS. Everyone hates lawyers .... until they need one! :eek:

Richandler
11-28-2007, 05:42 PM
If you don't own the land you don't have a case. Since it's almost impossible to buy land I doubt you are the owner of the land. It is no doubt in your contract somewhere that says you must apply such rules to your house if you wish to own it on that land.

azminuteman
11-28-2007, 05:45 PM
My neighborhood association forbids them. Unfortunately courts tend to uphold fascist rules on the part of associations because you agree to them when you move in (I never thought I would ever want to put up a political sign when I moved here).

So according to my husband, the lawyer, the way is to get a REALLY BIG sign and put it in your window. This would work for those of you whose cities forbid the lawn signs if you don't want to deal with the red tape of suing. You have a right to do what you want inside of your house, even if its visible from the outside. So put your Ron Paul signs and christmas lights inside your big picture window, and you can laugh with me at all of the uptight jerks in your neighborhood association police.


My HOA forbids them too but the windows idea would work and would work well for my neighborhood for my house.

Perry
11-28-2007, 05:52 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

I say keep them up. Don't you want to be a martyr for the cause?:D

jgmaynard
11-28-2007, 06:06 PM
Have I mentioned yet that the NH Supreme Court struck down ALL laws in this state about political advertising on private property? :)

Yeah... Thought so. :D

JM

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-28-2007, 09:49 PM
Another reason I love NH. Much love to New Hampshire. Go Ron Paul!

Oh yeah Friday at 10am central time is when they come over to take a pic.. and the interview is prolly sometime later that day.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-30-2007, 07:53 AM
That is when it is slated for.. If any changes ill update :D.

Daily herald of chicago, Illinois
Go go Ron Paul!

mopar.bo
11-30-2007, 07:56 AM
I say pull your wiener out and wave it at the magistrate. Say someting really dry like: "What's the fine for swingin' around a big floppy dong, sir?"

He'll forget all about the signs.

mopar.bo
11-30-2007, 07:59 AM
That's a joke. Don't do that.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-30-2007, 08:07 AM
I say pull your wiener out and wave it at the magistrate. Say someting really dry like: "What's the fine for swingin' around a big floppy dong, sir?"

He'll forget all about the signs.

That is funny. *chuckles*

Mark
11-30-2007, 08:19 AM
Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

Make a BIGGER sign? Put a spotlight on it at night? Add an audio recording to go with it?

Just don't put it where the sun don't shine. Or......

Mark
11-30-2007, 08:20 AM
He'll forget all about the signs.



Yeah, but WHY will he forget about the signs?

american.swan
11-30-2007, 08:22 AM
I say pull your wiener out and wave it at the magistrate. Say someting really dry like: "What's the fine for swingin' around a big floppy dong, sir?"

He'll forget all about the signs.

public exposer of that nature always scares people because they think they'll go to jail, but legally all they can do is charge you 300 bucks or so. so if you want to burn 300 bucks for kicks, run down the street naked.

Adam Smith
11-30-2007, 08:44 AM
I say pull your wiener out and wave it at the magistrate. Say someting really dry like: "What's the fine for swingin' around a big floppy dong, sir?"

He'll forget all about the signs.

Oh my. That is crazy funny.:D

Revolution9
11-30-2007, 08:52 AM
This kind of crap really pisses me off, I'd set up a political sign with a claymore rigged to it.

That is essentially how the oligarchs view an RP sign..LOL!

Best
Randy

Revolution9
11-30-2007, 08:55 AM
PS. Everyone hates lawyers .... until they need one! :eek:

And then need one because of previous lawyers..


Best
Randy

UtahApocalypse
11-30-2007, 09:03 AM
This comes up enough that we should make a standardized paper to send to cities. We have done the research, as Sematary has posted. We should be able to draft a template easily. Then its just a matter of filling in the blanks that apply to each city.

Mortikhi
11-30-2007, 09:14 AM
How to make a political sign not a political sign:

Take your huge Ron Paul for President sign and add:
For Sale
To the top and add:
Memorabilia
to the bottom.

Now its a for sale sign:
--------------------------------------------------------
For Sale
Ron Paul
For
President
Memorabilia
-----------------------------------------------------------


Problem solved.

jpinkerton
11-30-2007, 09:52 AM
That is when it is slated for.. If any changes ill update :D.

Daily herald of chicago, Illinois
Go go Ron Paul!

You'll have to upload a scan!

Second_Tier_My_Ass
11-30-2007, 10:18 AM
How to make a political sign not a political sign:

Take your huge Ron Paul for President sign and add:
For Sale
To the top and add:
Memorabilia
to the bottom.

Now its a for sale sign:
--------------------------------------------------------
For Sale
Ron Paul
For
President
Memorabilia
-----------------------------------------------------------


Problem solved.

BRILLIANT! Yes, I agree, you should do this.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
11-30-2007, 07:29 PM
Bah they pushed it back they say next week probably. Anyways. Ill update with any further info. Go RON PAUL! And donate today is November 30th.

Hurricane Bruiser
11-30-2007, 07:47 PM
First thing I would do would be get a bigger sign.

precisely. :D

tnvoter
11-30-2007, 08:03 PM
You guys are amazing, I'm glad to see a call for help answered with information.

Tidewise
11-30-2007, 08:10 PM
Don't ask for legal advice from strangers on the Internet.

TruckinMike
11-30-2007, 08:11 PM
That is a great idea... put a bunch of signs in the yard and say they are all for sale for $5 each. With a price tag on each one... Maybe hanging off like a minnie pearl Tag...

Great IDEA!:D:D:D

TM

edit: OOPS.. it may be illegal to sell things from your yard without permits etc

GoApe4RonPaul2008
12-14-2007, 05:06 PM
This Monday it will be in the Daily herald (Chicago newspaper)

December 16th is right around the corner...

GoApe4RonPaul2008
12-17-2007, 06:04 PM
bump

RPinSEAZ
12-17-2007, 06:12 PM
What has this country turned into? Good god. Oh noes, there's sign clutter. Nobody needs to use their 1st amendment rights more than 30 days before an election. Fascists.

Mark Rushmore
12-17-2007, 06:24 PM
Before this case came up, "we've never had anyone not comply," he said.

...he said to the sound of cracking bone as he slipped the gear on the Rack back a pin.


Interim Wheeling Village President Judy Abruscato said political signs have been getting out of control in the village.

The peasants are speaking! Things are out of control! Order is failing! Anarchy will strike your children down! We must act! Burn the dissenters!

NewEnd
12-17-2007, 06:29 PM
uh, yeah!

fight the power!

uh yeah!

http://www.daveyd.com/Flavwsambo.jpg

justinc.1089
12-17-2007, 06:34 PM
This kind of crap really pisses me off, I'd set up a political sign with a claymore rigged to it.

ROFL! Thats awesome....

GoApe4RonPaul2008
12-21-2007, 05:36 PM
http://wbez.org/Content.aspx?audioID=16568
http://audio.wbez.org/848/2007/12/848_20071218a.mp3

This radio show had a segment on this Yard sign issue. And what is happening is truly amazing. It could change everything for our free speech rights and private property rights!

TwiLeXia
12-21-2007, 05:38 PM
Call the local media paper - from the Daily Herald to the TV and radio - nothing better than some free Ron Paul advertising to boot.

Agreed. Get some press on this, people will support you, no matter which candidate they currently do, and then they will convert once they realize how awesome ron paul is.

jonahtrainer
12-21-2007, 05:49 PM
http://wbez.org/Content.aspx?audioID=16568
http://audio.wbez.org/848/2007/12/848_20071218a.mp3

This radio show had a segment on this Yard sign issue. And what is happening is truly amazing. It could change everything for our free speech rights and private property rights!

Great job! Keep Flexing Your Rights (http://www.flexyourrights.org). The more we Flex them the Stronger they get.

fortilite
12-21-2007, 05:52 PM
Challenge the city on it, AND leak it to the local media to get more press for Ron Paul.

Voluntaryist
12-21-2007, 05:55 PM
First thing I would do would be get a bigger sign.

+++++++++++++++++++++++++1 :cool:

nc4rp
12-21-2007, 06:14 PM
First thing I would do would be get a bigger sign.

god bless Ron Paul supporters, some of the most humourous and creative people on the planet.

I personally would take this legal info posted here, print it out, make a plywood sign, and post the law on it in a rainproof cover, with the words across the top 'NOTICE' signed by a notary. (actually get 2 copies notorized and stash one copy in a safe place) and finnaly photograph the Posted Notice beside your signs for evidence.


good luck.

Mike S.
12-21-2007, 06:19 PM
Unbelievable! I guess they never read the Constitution. It's EXACTLY what the First Amendment was written for.

tmg19103
12-21-2007, 06:48 PM
These cases are a slam dunk. You should be able to get any good first amendment attorney to take it on a contingency basis as the attorney will be able to collect his attorney fees from the town/city when he wins.

Usually a letter from a lawyer will work to get them to change the ordinance to one without a time limit (worked for me), but they certainly will back down the moment a lawsuit is filed because they know that's when the dollars start adding up against them as your attorney bills.

slantedview
12-21-2007, 06:54 PM
it's common for local communities to have statutes or laws that violate rights like this.

make no doubt, these statutes do violate your rights. whether you fight it or not is up to you.

Melissa
12-21-2007, 07:14 PM
Don't ask for legal advice from strangers on the Internet.

well i think there were some great advise on here I would use some of it not the naked thing don't care if it is only 300 bucks it is snow and cold here

itsnobody
12-21-2007, 07:15 PM
Get this out to the media

Its your constitutional right to have whatever kind of sign you want on your property

hawks4ronpaul
12-21-2007, 07:18 PM
21.05.600 Exempt Signs ...

a) Directional and informational signs no larger than three square feet


A
"Vote Ron Paul
for President 2008"
supporter lives here.



http://hawks4ronpaul.blogspot.com/

pikerz
12-21-2007, 07:27 PM
fight the bastids.

user
12-21-2007, 07:37 PM
So what happened with this?

BLS
12-21-2007, 07:41 PM
When the news contacts you back, direct them to the Illinois Municipal League's website addressing the regulation of campaign signs differently than others. http://www.iml.org/dbs/imllegal/dyncat.cfm?catid=2127


Listen to this guy.

He helped me defeat my city's ordinance, and now they are FORCED to change the law.

No...I'm not kidding.

westmich4paul
12-22-2007, 12:17 AM
I live in a manufactured housing community and they just sent me a letter stating the same thing as far as time limits on sign posting. They also put a limit on size of sign as well. Is it different if I am leasing the property as to if I own the said property? I am wondering if I should pursue mine also

jasonoliver
12-22-2007, 12:23 AM
I say leave them there and "lock & load"

JGalt
12-22-2007, 12:42 AM
I'd definitely put up another sign that says Μολὼν λαβέ (molon labe, or come and take it)

GoApe4RonPaul2008
01-03-2008, 05:55 PM
If anyone lives in wheeling Illinois and you have a Ron Paul sign up.. Please let me know. I am currently speaking w/ the lawyer so. I could use the info.

jasonjasonjason1
01-03-2008, 05:59 PM
aa

parke
01-03-2008, 06:01 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

Contact the ACLU. This is a right to free speech issue. Do not get fines though... play the game, but sue for your right to free speech.. Contact your local news outlets and tell them you plan to sue (after you contact the ACLU)

Jeremy
01-03-2008, 06:02 PM
Take it to court. They will (hopefully) loose.

walt
01-03-2008, 06:08 PM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=DMjMPosvhTk send the city of wheeling this video - what is the city's email contact info?

Sematary
01-03-2008, 06:13 PM
I was given a ticket from the city of wheeling, Illinois for having two political signs in my front lawn (private property) and having them up 30 days prior to an election. I have 10 days to fix these or else the fines go up. I don't know how much per day but the maximum is 1,000.00 per day and a District Court of Cook County appearance. Please let me know what I should do.

Thanks.

Whitton v. Gladstone, 54 F.3d 1400 (8th Cir. 1995) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited placement or erection of political signs from thirty days prior to the election to which the sign pertains until seven days after the election.

- Dimas v. Warren, 939 F. Supp. 554 (E.D. Mich. 1996) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which prohibited posting of political yard signs earlier than forty-five days prior to any election, and ordering removal within seven days after.

- Orazio v. North Hempstead, 426 F. Supp. 1144 (E.D.N.Y. 1977) - Holding that no time limit on the display of pre-election political signs is permissible under the First Amendment.

- Antioch v. Candidates' Outdoor Graphic Serv., 557 F. Supp. 52 (N.D. Cal. 1982) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited display of political signs to the period of sixty days before election.

- Collier v. Tacoma, 854 P.2d 1046 (Wa. 1993) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional which limited posting of political signs to the period sixty days prior to election and seven days after.

- Christensen v. Wheaton, 2000 U.S. Dist. LEXIS 1737 (N.D. Ill. 2000) - Granting preliminary injunction enjoining enforcement of ordinance the effect of which was to prohibit the display of political signs for more than thirty days.

- Curry v. Prince George's County, Maryland, 33 F. Supp. 2d 447 (D.C. Md. 1999) - Ordinance deemed unconstitutional that banned political signs in private residences for all but forty-five days before and ten days after an election.
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slantedview
01-03-2008, 06:13 PM
find a first amemndment lawyer who will work with no money up front (this case would be a slam dunk so it's safe enough for someone to take) and have him draft a letter. that should be all you need to do.

GoApe4RonPaul2008
01-03-2008, 06:22 PM
Just wondering if there was anyone specifically who lived in wheeling to where I could get some pics of their Political signs who this law would be violating is all. I do appreciate all the comments y'all have made.. And no it is not 1000.00 dollar per day fine. That is the maximum penalty which I doubt they would do because of the publicity it would generate for dr paul. Anyways if someone does live in wheeling Illinois.. Please send me a message.