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View Full Version : So, what if Ron Paul doesn't win in 2012, then what?




SonofThunder
01-03-2012, 10:57 PM
Let's say Ron Paul doesn't win the GOP Primary. I personally don't think he'll run 3rd party, but let's say he does, and then he doesn't win the general election.

Then what? What's next for liberty?

I have the sinking feeling that there won't be a next. We'll go to war with Iran (no matter if it is Obama or Romney or Santorum in the White House). We'll go belly up. All of this police state legislation will be put to full use.

I honestly don't think the US government lasts another 4 years under neo-con leadership.

What do y'all think?

mt4rp
01-03-2012, 11:04 PM
There is always the option to no longer consent.

cindy25
01-03-2012, 11:07 PM
agreed but too early to give up on 2012

and Obama has not started any wars, despite the pressure; a 2nd term president has less pressure, more legacy

Philhelm
01-03-2012, 11:11 PM
Buy a tricorn hat?

Endgame
01-03-2012, 11:26 PM
Then rethink this whole "American" thing. Get ready to run.

SonofThunder
01-03-2012, 11:27 PM
agreed but too early to give up on 2012

and Obama has not started any wars, despite the pressure; a 2nd term president has less pressure, more legacy

Not giving up. I just want to think about what to look forward to if RP doesn't win. I don't think we have a 2016 election. I hate to sound so pessimistic, but I am just not seeing a bright future.

jmhudak17
01-03-2012, 11:29 PM
We look forward to the future. Even if Ron doesn't win, this is a huge long-term victory; he's paved the road for a movement. We can look to Rand Paul or any other candidate that may rise up. All I know is that this movement isn't going away and is only going to continue to grow stronger.

Endgame
01-03-2012, 11:29 PM
Then rethink this whole "American" thing. Get ready to run. Far. It's obvious what this place is becoming.

VanBummel
01-03-2012, 11:33 PM
One last moneybomb? Which is the better option, use the money to GTFO and start our own country, or use it to clone Ron Paul?

RiseAgainst
01-03-2012, 11:33 PM
Come on children youre acting like children, every generation thinks its the end of the world

SonofThunder
01-03-2012, 11:52 PM
Come on children youre acting like children, every generation thinks its the end of the world

I understand this. I also understand that there are so many ominous developments with our government that it is becoming impossible to ignore. The MSM has just propped up an unknown bum to take out Paul in a primary election where he was showing a strong, continuous rise. They are pulling out all the stops to make sure he not only doesn't win, but doesn't get people's attention.

The government has put into place dictatorial powers for the president, allowing him assassinations and indefinite detention camps for American citizens. The government is sanctioning Iran, trying to pick a fight like we did with Japan, leading us into another World War.

If you study history, the parallels are just too obvious. I don't think it is childish to have these thoughts.

bossman068410
01-03-2012, 11:59 PM
Free State Project

TheDrakeMan
01-03-2012, 11:59 PM
Let's say Ron Paul doesn't win the GOP Primary. I personally don't think he'll run 3rd party, but let's say he does, and then he doesn't win the general election.

Then what? What's next for liberty?

I have the sinking feeling that there won't be a next. We'll go to war with Iran (no matter if it is Obama or Romney or Santorum in the White House). We'll go belly up. All of this police state legislation will be put to full use.

I honestly don't think the US government lasts another 4 years under neo-con leadership.

What do y'all think?

If we get another Republican in office, there is a good chance we can steer this country in the right direction. Even if it's a moderate like Romney. Reason being? Tea Party has more influence now. They can't pass big-government bills like they use to. Especially with people in Amash & Rand Paul in Congress.

Assuming Ron Paul loses, what should be next for our movement? Personally I think we should first look if another Paul is interested in running for office. Rallying behind someone with "Paul" in their name is easier for us and gets us a hell of a lot of MSM attention. As we saw with Rand Paul. If not we just have to keep doing what we've been doing. Get liberty-oriented politicians into office. Even if they are only state representative or state senate elections. I think we need to drop this third party nonsense altogether. Ron Paul has zero chance of running third party, and we don't need a third party. We're infiltrating the GOP and we're winning.

Oh and a big one-- we have to find a way to appeal to the evangelical wing of the party. I don't know how we're going to do it. But it needs to be done. There were a few intelligent, well-informed Christians that use to post here that had some good ideas. Unfortunately I don't see them around anymore.

Feelgood
01-04-2012, 12:07 AM
agreed but too early to give up on 2012

and Obama has not started any wars, despite the pressure; a 2nd term president has less pressure, more legacy

What? Seriously? Have you been living under a rock?

http://articles.chicagotribune.com/2011-06-12/news/ct-oped-0612-chapman-20110610_1_generals-war-american

Not to mention the immense war he has against our own civil liberties.

The Grinning Maniac
01-04-2012, 12:33 AM
If he doesn't win, what I'm doing is shutting up about politics around everyone, keeping my head down, start funneling massive (for me) amounts of money from my new business into Yuan, silver, guns and food.. and wait until some idiot decides to bomb Iran. Then hopefully after things have gone to hell and I've made a bunch of money on things going sideways, I can smuggle myself to someplace where I have friends, like Sweden maybe or Japan.

Ugh. I'm 26. Why do I have to be dealing with doomsday?

ClayTrainor
01-04-2012, 12:35 AM
Let's say Ron Paul doesn't win the GOP Primary. I personally don't think he'll run 3rd party, but let's say he does, and then he doesn't win the general election.

Then what? What's next for liberty?

Well the concept of Liberty itself obviously isn't going anywhere, it's more of a question of "what's next for libertarians", which, like all human action, no one can predict with any certainty. My guess would be that, the more conservative-thinking wing of Ron Pauls following will undoubtedly keep engaging in politics and the political process, for as long as it exists, and will try to drag everyone else in with them. Predicting who their favorite candidates is anyones guess, but I'm sure promoting and advancing Rand Pauls political career will be a large area of focus. The more libertarian-thinking wing of Ron Pauls support are less likely to play politics in the future, i think, although a few always will.

The scent of bullshit emerging from politics is just becoming too strong, now that we have the internet. It's really starting to seem nothing more than a bad reality TV show. A total distraction from reality. The reality behind politics is quite simple...

http://content.screencast.com/users/CharlieTango/folders/Jing/media/5d1fa9cd-ca00-408c-82b7-b27c9897985b/2011-12-21_2259.png

In my opinion, as the living torchbearers of liberty, we have a responsibility to ruthlessly, respectfully and intelligently expose the gun in the room, and condemn those who seek to use it. We should not wrestle for control of the gun ourselves. The moral argument (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nKOTqRb5nvg) is stronger than all political and empirical/historical arguments combined. It is the weapon that we, as advocates of liberty, need to unleash to its fullest extent.


I have the sinking feeling that there won't be a next. We'll go to war with Iran (no matter if it is Obama or Romney or Santorum in the White House). We'll go belly up. All of this police state legislation will be put to full use.

I honestly don't think the US government lasts another 4 years under neo-con leadership.

What do y'all think?

Do what you can to protect yourself, those you care about, and find ways to provide value to other people as best you can. The rest is out of our hands. The state is dead, and at this point, it's only a matter of how hard it's going to fall and who's going to go down with it.

kuckfeynes
01-04-2012, 12:39 AM
Come on children youre acting like children, every generation thinks its the end of the world

And eventually, one generation is inevitably going to be right.

thetruthhurtsthefed
01-04-2012, 01:12 AM
There is a BIG hope in Canada for a Ron Paul victory. The Libertarian Party of Canada (small I might add), can only gain a tidal wave of support and following .... ONLY with a Paul win. The sheep follow the herd and the states is a HUGE herd....only with a win and not just a following, will the Liberty movement be mimicked and accepted up north

Doug8796
01-04-2012, 01:19 AM
If Dr. Paul doesnt win, we need to all ensure Gary Johnson does VERY well in the election as LP nominee. We need to destroy the republican party so that it can be reborn (phoenix party if you will) and become a a Grand New Party.

Lothario
01-04-2012, 02:04 AM
There is always the option to no longer consent.

This.


The more libertarian-thinking wing of Ron Pauls support are less likely to play politics in the future

We should not wrestle for control of the gun ourselves.

This.

Moo2400
01-04-2012, 03:43 AM
If Ron Paul doesn't win, I'd be happy to do all I can to make the republicans lose in 2012 for it by voting for Gary Johnson on the libertarian ticket and convincing everybody else I know to do the same.

Beyond that, you look at how much the message of liberty resonates with those who are 18 - 29 and I think there is some hope. Give it 20 years to 25 years and we'll see the libertarian wing of the republican party come to dominate. Hard to say what will happen between then and now. Even if something like the dollar collapses, I don't think it would be the end of America, though it would certainly be a huge change and would have big ramifications that would be felt for multiple generations.

Warrior_of_Freedom
01-04-2012, 03:58 AM
The establishment doesn't care. They win both ways, which makes getting Paul in the white house more important.

libertarian4321
01-04-2012, 04:09 AM
The USA is a large and very wealthy nation, despite the vile nature of our politicians.

We aren't going to disappear or collapse in the next 4 years, regardless of who is elected.

However, if we keep on our current path, we are headed for serious trouble at some point. We need to reverse the trend toward ever bigger government.

So let's not give up. Ron finished third in Iowa, but was very close to the top 2. It was a good showing, far better than in 2008.

Let's keep pushing, to make America better, for our future!

libertarian4321
01-04-2012, 04:12 AM
If Dr. Paul doesnt win, we need to all ensure Gary Johnson does VERY well in the election as LP nominee. We need to destroy the republican party so that it can be reborn (phoenix party if you will) and become a a Grand New Party.

If Ron Paul is not nominated (and I'm for damned sure not willing to concede that yet), I will support Gary Johnson as the Libertarian Party nominee. Although we have to remember, Gary Johnson is not assured of the LP nomination- hopefully the Libertarian Party will nominate him rather than picking neocon nuts like they did in 2008 (Barr and WAR).

nobody's_hero
01-04-2012, 06:09 AM
Free State Project

Eh, they're going to have to convince me that New Hampshire deserves to be the place that the FSP should set up shop. I look at Romney @ 40% in New Hampshire and I can't do anything but wonder why in the hell they picked a state so close to Massachusetts.

nobody's_hero
01-04-2012, 06:15 AM
Q: So, what if Ron Paul doesn't win in 2012, then what?

A:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWB7_o6x6DA




(I probably qualify for an all-expense paid trip courtesy of the NDAA for that, lol)

(so if they ask, 'I was referring to singing Irish songs and playing bagpipes')

Elwar
01-04-2012, 06:25 AM
As much as I hope for Ron Paul to win and turn things around, I have already begun arrangements to GET THE HELL OUT.

http://www.seasteading.org

fatjohn
01-04-2012, 06:27 AM
Good news for gold, estimated price 2016: $10,000

nobody's_hero
01-04-2012, 06:28 AM
As much as I hope for Ron Paul to win and turn things around, I have already begun arrangements to GET THE HELL OUT.

http://www.seasteading.org

As cool as that looks, I really don't think there's anywhere to run to.

The international bankers aren't just going to let you walk away if they even suspect you're hiding wealth. They'll just buy influence for the nearest government to invade your tiny ocean villa and then move on to the next guy who thought he could run away.

John F Kennedy III
01-04-2012, 06:35 AM
What everybody on this forum, and everybody in America need to get through their heads is that if Ron Paul doesn't get elected in 2012 there will not be another chance. There will not be a United States in 2016. By then we will be a full blown totalitarian police state that will make 1984 look like Sesame Street. There won't be a chance to support Rand or anybody else in 2016, it will be King Obama/Romney/whoever. The globalists know that if they manage to shut us down this time they have to have everything in place by 2016 because if allowed our movement would be too big to stop.

You think the Patriot Act and NDAA and soft killing us with poison in our food/water/air/soil is bad?

THAT WILL BE NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT HAPPENS TO US IF WE DON'T GET RON PAUL ELECTED IN 2012.

We may or may not be able to change the outcome much, but the least we can do is stop playing pretend.

John F Kennedy III
01-04-2012, 06:40 AM
If we get another Republican in office, there is a good chance we can steer this country in the right direction. Even if it's a moderate like Romney. Reason being? Tea Party has more influence now. They can't pass big-government bills like they use to. Especially with people in Amash & Rand Paul in Congress.

Assuming Ron Paul loses, what should be next for our movement? Personally I think we should first look if another Paul is interested in running for office. Rallying behind someone with "Paul" in their name is easier for us and gets us a hell of a lot of MSM attention. As we saw with Rand Paul. If not we just have to keep doing what we've been doing. Get liberty-oriented politicians into office. Even if they are only state representative or state senate elections. I think we need to drop this third party nonsense altogether. Ron Paul has zero chance of running third party, and we don't need a third party. We're infiltrating the GOP and we're winning.

Oh and a big one-- we have to find a way to appeal to the evangelical wing of the party. I don't know how we're going to do it. But it needs to be done. There were a few intelligent, well-informed Christians that use to post here that had some good ideas. Unfortunately I don't see them around anymore.

Romney is Obama. And the Tea Party are neocons.

Captain Caveman
01-04-2012, 06:40 AM
What is more important?

Ron Paul

-or-

The message of Liberty?

The message, in my opinion, is more important than the man. I support Dr. Paul 100% because of his message!

Spread the message, no matter what, in all earnestness - all the time.

Let Freedom Ring!

John F Kennedy III
01-04-2012, 06:45 AM
If Dr. Paul doesnt win, we need to all ensure Gary Johnson does VERY well in the election as LP nominee. We need to destroy the republican party so that it can be reborn (phoenix party if you will) and become a a Grand New Party.

I wouldn't support gary johnson if he were Obama's only opponent AND he was holding my pet gold fish Alonzo hostage.

Diurdi
01-04-2012, 06:49 AM
If the Economic situation takes a turn for the worse, I believe Paul's chances increase dramatically.

Sematary
01-04-2012, 06:50 AM
If Ron Paul doesn't get the nomination this time around, I still intend to vote for him and I expect in that case that Rand Paul will run in 16.

Sematary
01-04-2012, 06:52 AM
If Dr. Paul doesnt win, we need to all ensure Gary Johnson does VERY well in the election as LP nominee. We need to destroy the republican party so that it can be reborn (phoenix party if you will) and become a a Grand New Party.

ONLY Ron Paul in 2012 - believe it. Vote it. It's not just for breakfast anymore

Sematary
01-04-2012, 06:55 AM
As much as I hope for Ron Paul to win and turn things around, I have already begun arrangements to GET THE HELL OUT.

http://www.seasteading.org

GLOBAL tyranny is afoot. Exactly where do you expect to go and why would you abandon the cause of liberty in YOUR country?

Sematary
01-04-2012, 06:56 AM
What everybody on this forum, and everybody in America need to get through their heads is that if Ron Paul doesn't get elected in 2012 there will not be another chance. There will not be a United States in 2016. By then we will be a full blown totalitarian police state that will make 1984 look like Sesame Street. There won't be a chance to support Rand or anybody else in 2016, it will be King Obama/Romney/whoever. The globalists know that if they manage to shut us down this time they have to have everything in place by 2016 because if allowed our movement would be too big to stop.

You think the Patriot Act and NDAA and soft killing us with poison in our food/water/air/soil is bad?

THAT WILL BE NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT HAPPENS TO US IF WE DON'T GET RON PAUL ELECTED IN 2012.

We may or may not be able to change the outcome much, but the least we can do is stop playing pretend.

You're being overdramatic. We aren't close to what you believe will happen (yet) and still have an opportunity (or three or four) to turn our nation around

Sematary
01-04-2012, 06:57 AM
What is more important?

Ron Paul

-or-

The message of Liberty?

The message, in my opinion, is more important than the man. I support Dr. Paul 100% because of his message!

Spread the message, no matter what, in all earnestness - all the time.

Let Freedom Ring!

+10

Diurdi
01-04-2012, 06:59 AM
You're being overdramatic. We aren't close to what you believe will happen (yet) and still have an opportunity (or three or four) to turn our nation around

Kyle Bass (Hedge Fund Manager who predicted housing bubble and EU sovereign debt crisis) said that US economically has about 3-5 years.

It's ofcourse just a guess, but the ponzi could hold up pretty long assuming all attention is on EU and Japan.

John F Kennedy III
01-04-2012, 07:11 AM
You're being overdramatic. We aren't close to what you believe will happen (yet) and still have an opportunity (or three or four) to turn our nation around

You're being overly naive.

Sematary
01-04-2012, 07:14 AM
You're being overly naive.

I am fully aware of where this country stands right now. If it's not Ron Paul in 2012 then it's Rand Paul in 2016. The media is strong but together, we are stronger. If we break apart, they win.

Sematary
01-04-2012, 07:15 AM
Kyle Bass (Hedge Fund Manager who predicted housing bubble and EU sovereign debt crisis) said that US economically has about 3-5 years.

It's ofcourse just a guess, but the ponzi could hold up pretty long assuming all attention is on EU and Japan.

The economy is not the country. This country survived the depression for christs sake. You think another one is going to destroy it? Only if we the people are weak and allow it to happen.

nobody's_hero
01-04-2012, 07:23 AM
The economy is not the country. This country survived the depression for christs sake. You think another one is going to destroy it? Only if we the people are weak and allow it to happen.

And the Great Depression accelerated the growth of the state. We can surely survive economic turmoil, but the political turmoil that comes with it will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

Sematary
01-04-2012, 07:30 AM
And the Great Depression accelerated the growth of the state. We can surely survive economic turmoil, but the political turmoil that comes with it will be the straw that breaks the camel's back.

Only if WE allow it. I refuse to just give in.

Son of Detroit
01-04-2012, 07:40 AM
I'll be working to elect liberty candidates to the congress in 2014, and electing Rand Paul in 2016.

Apparently without the help of most of you.

Athan
01-04-2012, 09:56 AM
Then what? What's next for liberty?

I have the sinking feeling that there won't be a next. We'll go to war with Iran (no matter if it is Obama or other in the White House). We'll go belly up. All of this police state legislation will be put to full use.

I honestly don't think the US government lasts another 4 years under neo-con leadership.

What do y'all think?

I've thought about this possibility months ago yet I dislike bringing it up personally because it may sound like a defeatist attitude. We need to establish an organizational trade network with one another. Like a underground railroad to insulate our exposure to the crap that will be going on in the nation. We have the Daily Paul and similar sites for news, but we need something for our own security and economic well being. We can't trust the government to function properly anymore, it is run by morons and special interests at the top. It doesn't matter how many good people work for our government it if the management is corrupt and full of thieves just like any organization or business.

When we find supporters, we assist. When we find enemies, we do the opposite. We may have difficulty protecting ourselves from doing business with regular connections, but we can protect ourselves by having an established guild-like trade network.

falconplayer11
01-04-2012, 10:03 AM
Ron Paul talked about what liberty-lovers are to do with their lives. He said to fight for liberty and you'll sleep better at night. Fight knowing you are in the right. Fight because it's the truth and it is the best thing you can do for your fellow human beings.

iamse7en
01-04-2012, 10:04 AM
Why don't all Ron Paul supporters move to New Hampshire, take over, make it free, push back against the Feds until we secede. If that doesn't work, I may need to expatriate.

Athan
01-04-2012, 10:08 AM
You're being overdramatic. We aren't close to what you believe will happen (yet) and still have an opportunity (or three or four) to turn our nation around
I'm not so sure he is being overdramatic. Let's say your right though and he is being a bit dramatic.

Isn't NOW the time to start implementing contingency plans anyway? It will take years before the right number of babyboomers destroying this country die off. We are putting TOO much at risk by waiting around for them to jump in the grave. The internet came and assisted with circumventing news away from the TV, but why stop at just the internet when they are coming for that too? People are being arrested for ridiculous reasons these days. I mean assults on raw milk co-ops? Next they will use the NDAA on these people.

Honestly, we need to be realistic and not be so quick to brush off what seem to be legitimate concerns of what happens if we don't get control of the executive branch. They aren't exactly outlandish.

dcjones
01-04-2012, 10:11 AM
We may need a new Constitional Convention to "up end" the Government in the near future. I propose we remove the Commerce Clause, the 16th and 17th Amendments, and put sound money in the Bill of Rights.

Dianne
01-04-2012, 10:12 AM
If Ron doesn't win, we need to start working on the Rand 2016 campaign.

Raudsarw
01-04-2012, 10:17 AM
Write in your own name and draw something obsence on the ballot.

LibertyEagle
01-04-2012, 10:19 AM
What everybody on this forum, and everybody in America need to get through their heads is that if Ron Paul doesn't get elected in 2012 there will not be another chance. There will not be a United States in 2016. By then we will be a full blown totalitarian police state that will make 1984 look like Sesame Street. There won't be a chance to support Rand or anybody else in 2016, it will be King Obama/Romney/whoever. The globalists know that if they manage to shut us down this time they have to have everything in place by 2016 because if allowed our movement would be too big to stop.

You think the Patriot Act and NDAA and soft killing us with poison in our food/water/air/soil is bad?

THAT WILL BE NOTHING COMPARED TO WHAT HAPPENS TO US IF WE DON'T GET RON PAUL ELECTED IN 2012.

We may or may not be able to change the outcome much, but the least we can do is stop playing pretend.

I think we should work for the campaign like that, yes, but I don't think everything will completely fall apart that fast. You could be right, but many have been thinking the same thing for the last 50 years and it hasn't completely fallen apart yet. So, it could very well keep spiraling down a lot farther before we are completely out of gas.

That said, I think we should put all our efforts into Paul's campaign like there is no tomorrow.

archangel689
01-04-2012, 10:27 AM
The Economics Professor I talk to frequently on facebook says that the laws of mathematics WILL make them stop spending if there is no politician to do so. Maybe they could do a VAT or whatever, but it's just "kicking the can down the road" and won't avoid the inevitable. He also states a world currency won't do it, either, it's "like trying to reduce the distance between New York and Chicago by measuring in kilometers instead of miles."

"Projecting government spending (using the CBO's numbers), yields Federal bankruptcy in 35 years and operational bankruptcy is 25 years. The numbers assume that the approaching bankruptcy does not affect interest rates. It will cause interest rates to rise, so the actual timeline will be shorter. Bankruptcy occurs when interest on the debt equals annual tax revenue (IOW, all the government's revenue is spent just paying interest). Operational bankruptcy occurs when interest on the debt plus mandatory spending equals tax revenue. At this point, all the government's revenue goes to interest, welfare, Social Security, and Medicare. IOW, the government is reduced to an assisted living facility. If you give me an email address, I can send you a PPT with the details. "

PreDeadMan
01-04-2012, 10:28 AM
If ron paul loses i hope the republican party collapses and actually all political parties i wouldn't mind lol

dcjones
01-04-2012, 10:35 AM
The Economics Professor I talk to frequently on facebook says that the laws of mathematics WILL make them stop spending if there is no politician to do so.

"Projecting government spending (using the CBO's numbers), yields Federal bankruptcy in 35 years and operational bankruptcy is 25 years. The numbers assume that the approaching bankruptcy does not affect interest rates. It will cause interest rates to rise, so the actual timeline will be shorter. Bankruptcy occurs when interest on the debt equals annual tax revenue (IOW, all the government's revenue is spent just paying interest). Operational bankruptcy occurs when interest on the debt plus mandatory spending equals tax revenue. At this point, all the government's revenue goes to interest, welfare, Social Security, and Medicare. IOW, the government is reduced to an assisted living facility. If you give me an email address, I can send you a PPT with the details. "

But societies with a Central Bank can use the bank to buy up gov. debt with 'printed' money'. This can keep the game going and they don't need the tax revenues as much. Just expect the $ to go to its intrinsic value of zero.

xFiFtyOnE
01-04-2012, 10:41 AM
Buy food, guns & ammo, silver & gold. And do nothing. Life goes on until TSHF. I mean really what can you do besides prepare for the worst and keep preaching for the best?

raystone
01-04-2012, 10:46 AM
You're being overdramatic. We aren't close to what you believe will happen (yet) and still have an opportunity (or three or four) to turn our nation around

The same people that correctly predicted the $4T housing bubble crash are predicting the bursting of the QUADRILLION dollar credit/derivatives bubble in 2012. (It has already started in Europe). Relatively speaking, we are very close to the major collapse (it will be an overall stairstep, but rapid decline), and history has never seen the deleveraging of a 60-1 bubble.

-In the future the consequences of unpayable debt could include indentured servitude, debtor's prison or being drummed into the military
-Early withdrawals from pension plans will be prevented and almost all pension plans will eventually default
-We will see a systemic banking crisis that will result in bank runs and the loss of savings
-Real estate prices are likely to fall by at least 90% on average (with local variation)
-The essentials will see relative price support as a much larger percentage of a much smaller money supply chases them
-Government spending (all levels) will be slashed, with loss of entitlements and inability to maintain infrastructure
-Centralized services (water, electricity, gas, education, garbage pick-up, snow-removal etc) will become unreliable and of much lower quality, or may be eliminated entirely
-People with essentially no purchasing power will be living in a pay-as-you-go world
-Modern healthcare will be largely unavailable and informal care will generally be very basic
-Universities will go out of business as no one will be able to afford to attend
-There should be no lasting market bottom until at least the middle of the next decade, and even then the depression won't be over
-A sense of common humanity will be lost as foreigners and those who are different are demonized
-There will be war in the labour markets as unempoyment skyrockets and wages and benefits are slashed
-We are headed for resource wars, which will result in much resource and infrastructure destruction
-Energy prices are first affected by demand collapse, then supply collapse, so that prices first fall and then rise enormously
-Ordinary people are unlikely to be able to afford oil products AT ALL within 5 years
-Taxation will rise substantially as the domestic population is squeezed in order for the elite to partially make up for the loss of the ability to pick the pockets of the whole world through globalization
-Repressive political structures will arise, with much greater use of police state methods and a drastic reduction of freedom
-The rule of law will replaced by the politics of the personal and an economy of favours (ie endemic corruption)

http://theautomaticearth.blogspot.com/2009/06/june-17-2009-40-ways-to-lose-your.html

RickyJ
01-04-2012, 10:48 AM
The USA will collapse or be so close to collapse that it doesn't matter. If Paul loses, get of the USA while you can.

Echoes
01-04-2012, 10:54 AM
What's next ? Only one word is needed:

Secession

falconplayer11
01-04-2012, 10:55 AM
The liberty movement is not about one man. Rallying around Rand for 2016 is not the way to promote liberty. Promote it issue by issue, county by county, state by state. We don't have to win the presidency to bring liberty to this land. Yes, Rand may have a real shot at winning in 2016. But don't get all wrapped up in one man. He's sure to disappoint if you do.

Liberty is a philosophy of government and life. Live it out. Be entrepreneurial. Start a business. Educate your kids about liberty. Avoid the public schools. Spread truth on the internet. Expose the lies of government whenever and wherever you can. Don't vote unless you are 100% in support of your candidate. Read, write, speak, learn. This is how liberty grows. Not through electing libertarians to office.

xFiFtyOnE
01-04-2012, 10:57 AM
The USA will collapse or be so close to collapse that it doesn't matter. If Paul loses, get of the USA while you can.

And go where? This will be global. Third world countries will be the only places that don't see a major change in their standards of living. Why bother leaving? You going to Africa?

TheBlackPeterSchiff
01-04-2012, 10:59 AM
Rand 2016?

JackieDan
01-04-2012, 11:06 AM
Then Rand Paul (his son) might run for president in 2016. He's a little more moderate libertarian so I think he has a great chance of winning.
Anyways, Ron Paul will do well even after this election is done. Imagine all the people he attracted, and the number of supporters will always grow and stay the course.

We must focus on this election, give it a 110%. We can still make this folks, don't give up!

Lothario
01-04-2012, 12:05 PM
It's nauseating how addicted some people are to politics and having rulers. "If not Ron Paul, then Gary Johnson is for me!!! If not Gary, then Rand Paul 2016, get ready!!! If not Rand, then in 2020 there'll be somebody....!!!)

The only way people can continue this self-flagellation is if its somehow tied the psychological need of having a team to root for...which is ok in sports, not as great when dealing with rulers and the superstition of authority.

It's as if in the movie Matrix, before anyone was freed, they first tried to get permission from the Agents to be free.

I completely get that this need for permission to be free is buried somewhere deep in the subconscious, but it's time to acknowledge its existence. "Permission to be free" is a completely, philosophically contradictory concept.

I think Ron Paul is still in a great position, but if he doesn't pull through for a win, please don't waste away the rest of your life and money trying to elect a leader who will give you permission to be free. Just unplug yourself from the Matrix.

oyarde
01-04-2012, 12:12 PM
I wouldn't support gary johnson if he were Obama's only opponent AND he was holding my pet gold fish Alonzo hostage. What has Alonzo done to bring this wrath ?

oyarde
01-04-2012, 12:12 PM
I'll be working to elect liberty candidates to the congress in 2014, and electing Rand Paul in 2016.

Apparently without the help of most of you. Count me in

Shane Harris
01-04-2012, 12:20 PM
Not giving up. I just want to think about what to look forward to if RP doesn't win. I don't think we have a 2016 election. I hate to sound so pessimistic, but I am just not seeing a bright future.

not that things aren't bad, but a lot of people said the same thing about 2012

specialK
01-04-2012, 12:33 PM
Come on children youre acting like children, every generation thinks its the end of the world

I don't see anyone mentioning anything about the world ending. Read your history. Empires ALWAYS end.

realtonygoodwin
01-04-2012, 12:38 PM
We aren't at the point of no return yet. I will support whatever candidate is closest to my beliefs (probably Constitution Party). Then I will prepare for 2016. I will continue to raise my kids, continue to learn. When I get out of the military, I will get a great paying job, live within my means, and when I see an opening, run for office.

RickyJ
01-04-2012, 12:43 PM
We aren't at the point of no return yet.

To be honest we probably have already past that point about 4 years ago. If not then this surely is America's last chance.

chickensguys
01-04-2012, 12:44 PM
RON PAUL OR BUST!!!! SPREAD THE MESSAGE

RickyJ
01-04-2012, 12:45 PM
When I get out of the military, I will get a great paying job, live within my means, and when I see an opening, run for office.

I hope things work out for you, but the prospects are bleak, very bleak.

Czolgosz
01-04-2012, 01:48 PM
Q: So, what if Ron Paul doesn't win in 2012, then what?

A:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aWB7_o6x6DA





(I probably qualify for an all-expense paid trip courtesy of the NDAA for that, lol)

(so if they ask, 'I was referring to singing Irish songs and playing bagpipes')


Let our generation be the one singing Irish songs and playing bagpipes.

Harald
01-04-2012, 02:42 PM
Easy.

If Ron Paul is not nominated. Obama wins, since a significant chunk of Ron Paul supporters will vote for Gary Johnson or stay home. Then Rand Paul wins in 2016. Alternatively, Rand Paul is chosen as VP to Mitt Romney and Obama loses, then Rand Paul becomes president in 2020.

John F Kennedy III
01-04-2012, 04:50 PM
I'm not so sure he is being overdramatic. Let's say your right though and he is being a bit dramatic.

Isn't NOW the time to start implementing contingency plans anyway? It will take years before the right number of babyboomers destroying this country die off. We are putting TOO much at risk by waiting around for them to jump in the grave. The internet came and assisted with circumventing news away from the TV, but why stop at just the internet when they are coming for that too? People are being arrested for ridiculous reasons these days. I mean assults on raw milk co-ops? Next they will use the NDAA on these people.

Honestly, we need to be realistic and not be so quick to brush off what seem to be legitimate concerns of what happens if we don't get control of the executive branch. They aren't exactly outlandish.

+rep for being realistic

CaptainAmerica
01-04-2012, 04:59 PM
CAN we not talk about this right now?thanks.............

Lets focus on winning!

libertybrewcity
01-04-2012, 09:43 PM
I would hope for a Rand Paul ticket in 2016. I don't know who else there is. After that...let's hope things are better by then.