"Ron Paul has low support with older caucus goers" who don't no he'd FUND Social Security

[Joe3113]

I read this constantly.

Why not make a pamphlet with big letters with the title "How Ron Paul will save social security and medicare"?

And use that for the old folks instead of the generic pamphlet?

[RickyJ]

That would help. Old people reliably vote, so it would be foolish to ignore them. We got a lot of work to do in that department, but it can and will be done.

[milo10]

Joe, I agree with you. They also need a TV ad for this, and a longer Youtube video to go viral.

[Heath]

This was posted before but Ron Paul has sponsored several important bills to protect the Social Security Trust Fund, lower taxes for seniors, and allow more competition in the prescription drug market:

H.R. 219: Social Security Preservation Act
H.R. 150: Senior Citizens Tax Elimination Act
H.R. 147: Prescription Drug Affordability Act
H.R. 151: Seniors' Health Care Freedom Act

These facts need to be conveyed widely.

[nbruno322]

Probably the MAIN reason Paul doesn't do well with the older demographic is because they generally get their information from the mainstream media and NOT the internet.

Its not that they are averse to Paul, they just in general, have a twisted view of him and his positions thanks to the mainstream media. Gotta be a way we can effectively bypass the MSM without using the internet to reach this crucial demographic......

[Travlyr]

Probably the MAIN reason Paul doesn't do well with the older demographic is because they generally get their information from the mainstream media and NOT the internet.

Its not that they are averse to Paul, they just in general, have a twisted view of him and his positions thanks to the mainstream media. Gotta be a way we can effectively bypass the MSM without using the internet to reach this crucial demographic......
Phone From Home
http://phone.ronpaul2012.com

Become a Delegate
http://ronpauldelegates.wordpress.com/

[bobbyw24]

This is another reason that he does so poorly in Florida

[Jingles]

Probably the MAIN reason Paul doesn't do well with the older demographic is because they generally get their information from the MSM and NOT the internet.

Yeah pretty much this. The other day I just heard my 80something great-grandfather in the distance complaining about how we were losing Afghanistan because the youth of today isn't "man enough". It has nothing to do with policy or anything like that. They rely so much on the MSM and barely question the state. His advice to me was "do as you're told in life and you will be fine". He is a WWII vet, but he doesn't seem to get the fact that WWII is not Korea is not Vietnam is not Iraq is not Afghanistan, etc... I respect the fact that he believes in hard work, but other than that he is just so dense, misinformed, and so convinced he is right that he won't be able to see through anything. He votes Republican. These are the types of people we are dealing with in the older voting population and they are going to be the most difficult.

[bobbyw24]

Oh yeah and many people here blame Baby Boomers for their own economic problems

[CaptUSA]

Probably the MAIN reason Paul doesn't do well with the older demographic is because they generally get their information from the mainstream media and NOT the internet.

Its not that they are averse to Paul, they just in general, have a twisted view of him and his positions thanks to the mainstream media. Gotta be a way we can effectively bypass the MSM without using the internet to reach this crucial demographic......Exactly! Geez, reading the rest of these comments in this thread, you'd think "OLD PEOPLE" were some strange breed of people that can't understand anything unless it's shouted into their hearing aids and spelled out in big letters.

Folks, you have to start seeing people as individuals. If there's any singular reason why older people are not supporting the Paul campaign as much as other individuals, it's because of access. It's not becuase they hold some sort of bias, or there's one issue that can appeal to them. They are individuals just like you. The only difference is not in their world view - they are just as diverse as any other "demographic" - the difference is that for the most part, they are not as active online as the younger generation is. If you actually go out to talk to people, you will see that Paul's views are very appealing across the board. You don't have to tailor your message, you just have to bring them the message.

[ItsTime]

He is 15% with older people in Iowa

[No Free Beer]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

[bobbyw24]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

I don't trust you w/r/t this declaration.

My dad is over 70 and voted Democrat for 50+ years.

Last month he switched to the GOP so he could vote for Ron Paul

[low preference guy]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

nonsense

[Harbinger631]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

This is 9/10 correct.

[JudeJenn]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

Nothing, ever?
Wow, so they're a lost cause then?
I totally and completely disagree.
I think I'll head out and talk to some folks in long-term care and other places in person over the next few weeks/months. In fact, I think I've found a new mission.

[Working Poor]

every older person I talk to says that Ron Paul will end SSI

[Austin]

The question is, how do you attract older voters without alienating your core base, the under 45s? Of course it can be done, and I think the best way is targeted direct mail. I don't say this often, but I trust the campaign on this one.

[airborne373]

I have said this many times to people around me. And it often gets me in trouble. But the simple truth is: our grandparents, aunts and uncles are keeping us enslaved to fund their welfare/warfare systems.

Example: I am a former FFL. When I would call NICS (National Instant Check Systems) who do you think manned the phones and offices of NICS?

Answer: Your grandma and aunts that's who. Not big scary roidheads with black boots and bad attitudes. Through out history the enforcers need someone to administer their tyranny and the sad truth is .... the enforcers are our own family members.

[Travlyr]

I have said this many times to people around me. And it often gets me in trouble. But the simple truth is: our grandparents, aunts and uncles are keeping us enslaved to fund their welfare/warfare systems.

Example: I am a former FFL. When I would call NICS (National Instant Check Systems) who do you think manned the phones and offices of NICS?

Answer: Your grandma and aunts that's who. Not big scary roidheads with black boots and bad attitudes. Through out history the enforcers need someone to administer their tyranny and the sad truth is .... the enforcers are our own family members.
If it wasn't short sighted, then it wouldn't get you in trouble.

[airborne373]

If it wasn't short sighted, then it wouldn't get you in trouble.

short·sight·ed   
1. unable to see far; nearsighted; myopic.
2. lacking in foresight: a shortsighted plan.

I do not understand, please elaborate.

[JudeJenn]

The question is, how do you attract older voters without alienating your core base, the under 45s? Of course it can be done, and I think the best way is targeted direct mail. I don't say this often, but I trust the campaign on this one.

I agree, and in person whenever possible. Gather ye your facts on strong points of concern, social security, investments, etc. and take it to them in their own homes and communities. Another generalization, but this demographic (in my area of rural MT especially so) happens to be politically active and concerned, they vote!

[CaptUSA]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.This is just stupid. First off, you are putting people into a bucket based upon their age. Nice collectivist way of viewing the world. Second, I have had huge success exposing older people to Ron Paul. My 80 year old grandmother is on board. I've spoken to her friends at her retirement community and many of them like Ron Paul. They just don't know if he can beat Obama.

Sounds like the same thing I hear from every other age group. Why? Because people are individuals!!!!

[Travlyr]

short·sight·ed   
1. unable to see far; nearsighted; myopic.
2. lacking in foresight: a shortsighted plan.

I do not understand, please elaborate.
It's baloney. The simple truth is that as long as the mantra is old vs. young then that division makes it easier to keep the young from uniting with the old. Divide and Conquer.

[goldpants]

My dad turns 70, in a few weeks. He will vote Ron Paul just he did 4 years ago. But I will agree a lot of the seniors are MSM sheep.

[PastaRocket848]

well, at least the future looks a lot brighter for us than it does for the "old guard".

[LibertyEagle]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

No, I will NOT trust you. The statement you made is idiotic. Stop insulting the very voters we need to win over.

[Travlyr]

welfare/warfare systems profit the TPTB... not your uncle, aunt, granny or grandpappy.

The ROI on social security is horrible for most people.

[bobbyw24]

No, I will NOT trust you. The statement you made is idiotic. Stop insulting the very voters we need to win over.

Right--this shows that having a good deal of youth in this movement also means having too much immaturity and too many juvenile statements

[LibertyEagle]

My dad turns 70, in a few weeks. He will vote Ron Paul just he did 4 years ago. But I will agree a lot of the seniors are MSM sheep.

:rolleyes:

http://a.abcnews.com/images/Politics/ap_obama_young_supporters_ll_110706_wg.jpg

[airborne373]

It's baloney. The simple truth is that as long as the mantra is old vs. young then that division makes it easier to keep the young from uniting with the old. Divide and Conquer.

So you say it is "baloney" that there is a divide between younger voters and older voters? You say it is "short-sighted" to know the history of the administration of tyrannical governments?

I respectfully dis-agree with you.

[Travlyr]

So you say it is "baloney" that there is a divide between younger voters and older voters? You say it is "short-sighted" to know the history of the administration of tyrannical governments?

I respectfully dis-agree with you.
Your claim that the older generation clings to the welfare/warfare state for security is a bogus claim. That is a very weak argument. I don't buy it.

[Travlyr]

:rolleyes:

http://a.abcnews.com/images/Politics/ap_obama_young_supporters_ll_110706_wg.jpg

Perfect. Who are the real sheep?

[LawnWake]

Everyone is a sheep and a lot of people here are a sheep of Ron Paul. It doesn't matter.

Can someone get the ball rolling to make a pro-Ron Paul pamphlet about social security and all those entitlements people think he will get rid of specifically for the 55+ crowd? Short and to the point. We'll need to spam NH and Florida with those.

[Travlyr]

The point is: Lay to rest the false collective paradigms about people.

It's not: Rich vs. Poor; Old vs. Young; Men vs. Women; Right vs. Left; Conservative vs. Liberal; Red vs. Blue; Republican vs. Democrat

It's Honesty vs. Dishonesty; War vs. Peace; Real vs. Fake; Liberty vs. Tyranny; Truth vs. Lie.

[CaptUSA]

The point is: Lay to rest the false collective paradigms about people.

It's not: Rich vs. Poor; Old vs. Young; Men vs. Women; Right vs. Left; Conservative vs. Liberal; Red vs. Blue; Republican vs. Democrat

It's Honesty vs. Dishonesty; War vs. Peace; Real vs. Fake; Liberty vs. Tyranny; Truth vs. Lie.Exactly! + rep

[Shane Harris]

My grandpap likes Romney, grandma likes Newt. They didn't want to talk about it though:rolleyes:. dense indeed. My great aunt however is wonderful to talk to about politics. About 2 or 3 months ago she liked Cain (big surprise) but after a long car ride she said I had her leaning Paul :)

[LawnWake]

Naw, the point is to get Ron Paul elected. Why spend time and energy arguing about how to pigeonhole people with a fellow Ron Paul supporter on some thread that, at the end of the day, doesn't really matter, if you could band together and actually elect someone who's mear presence in the white house would do much more to sway the mass opinion on collectivism?

[vechorik]

When I saw the new ad: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?342890-NEW-and-OFFICIAL-TV-Ad-for-Iowa-and-N.-Hampshire!-quot-Machine-quot/page5

First thing I thought was "Wiah they'd include that he won't slash Medicare/SS etc (government assistance) as he cuts 1 trillion etc."

It has been known for YEARS that Dr. Paul is against these welfare programs. They need to know that HE WON'T CUT THEM IMMEDIATELY -- that he knows people depend on the money and there must be a very gradual change.

[LibertyEagle]

Folks, if you think the older voters get more of their news from the MSM, then that is all the more reason for you to be participating in the campaign's PHONE-FROM-HOME program. Are you? Have you also been going around your cities and towns doing lit drops, door-to-door?

If they don't see the truth about Ron Paul, how do you expect them to vote for him?

The answer begins with YOU.

[LibertyEagle]

When I saw the new ad: http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?342890-NEW-and-OFFICIAL-TV-Ad-for-Iowa-and-N.-Hampshire!-quot-Machine-quot/page5

First thing I thought was "Wiah they'd include that he won't slash Medicare/SS etc (government assistance) as he cuts 1 trillion etc."

It has been known for YEARS that Dr. Paul is against these welfare programs. They need to know that HE WON'T CUT THEM IMMEDIATELY -- that he knows people depend on the money and there must be a very gradual change.

Yeah, I agree.

[JamesButabi]

Both of Florida grandparents are voting Ron Paul who were establishment voters. I personally think Phone from Home and on the ground activism has brought us from barely any support with the 60+ crowd to a low level support (which is huge and why we are now polling well).

[Fredom101]

This is a really tough issue. Many elderly are terrified of someone ripping their social security checks from them. They see Ron Paul as that person and reason and evidence don't convince them otherwise usually. This is why FL is really tough.

[roversaurus]

Please, please all you Iowa Caucus goers.

Remember to tell people that cutting a trillion in spending is Ron Paul's plan to SAVE social security and it's pretty much the only way to do it.

[Adrock]

From my experience:

Silent Generation - Email has limited effect. If you are going to email just copy and paste the body of the article in the email itself with a link to the article itself. Actually clipping the articles out of newspapers or the super brochure may be the most effective. With these voters we need to get around the cable outlets and the print media. Calling or door to door is always best, but be ready to provide information to support what you are telling these voters. We have made inroads here, getting these voters to talk about RP in their social circles will definitely help. I have also noticed a lot of chain emails. I am going to but The Revolution and sent it to my Grandparents today.

Baby Boomers - Email with links and video is more acceptable. Many of these voters are also into the cable news outlets. Not sure if the campaign buying spots on these outlets to address issues would be worth while. again, talking on the phone or face to face is best, but be ready to sent a follow up email with supporting information.

The bottom line is we have to get better on getting around the media machine with these voters. Just bitching about it will not help anything.

[erowe1]

The campaign should definitely do whatever it can to sell Ron Paul to older voters, even if that means pretending they're justified in thinking they are entitled to other peoples' money and that saving social security is a worthy goal.

Meanwhile, those of us who aren't involved in the campaign should try to do our part to shift public opinions away from that mindset. There ought to be some shame that goes along with depending on taxpayers, and we're a long way from that.

[JohnM]

Geez, reading the rest of these comments in this thread, you'd think "OLD PEOPLE" were some strange breed of people that can't understand anything unless it's shouted into their hearing aids and spelled out in big letters.


Yup.


"Ron Paul has low support with older caucus goers" who don't no he'd FUND Social Security

And Ron Paul apparently has high support among younger caucus goers who kant spel.

[Suzu]

I don't think a huge campaign of pamphlets, phone calls and newspaper ads will be as helpful as:

1.) RADIO ADS
2.) CAUCUS SPEECHES that includes the strong assurance about no cuts for seniors.

It's a waste of time - of which there isn't enough left before caucuses to even do a phone/direct mail campaign. Radio ads are very effective. But if the budget is low (even if it's not), ensure that your caucus speech covers the topic and make good eye contact with the older folks in the crowd.

[erowe1]

It's a waste of time - of which there isn't enough left before caucuses to even do a phone/direct mail campaign.

No it isn't. Phone from home works. Yes, it takes time. But there is no shortcut out there. It's a big part of how Ron Paul took the lead in Iowa, and we need to keep doing it. It's also a great way to help the campaign other than donating money.

[LibertyEagle]

The campaign should definitely do whatever it can to sell Ron Paul to older voters, even if that means pretending they're justified in thinking they are entitled to other peoples' money and that saving social security is a worthy goal.

That is complete and utter bullshit. They were forced to pay into Social Security for years and years and were promised that the money would be put in a Social Security Trust Fund. Of course, the government stole the money some years ago, leaving an IOU in its place. It was not supposed to be funded from "other peoples' money" at all. So, to imply otherwise is a huge distortion of the truth.

So, yes, just as many knew at the time it was started, the program would become a complete mess. By the way, do you know the government began it as an optional program and then segued into making it mandatory. Nonetheless people were FORCED to pay into it; being told that they were too stupid to save for their own retirement so the government would extract their money and save it for them. Considering that a whole generation PAID INTO THIS for years and included it in their retirement plans that they would receive that money back, it would be akin to grand theft to change the rules at this point in the game and say, too bad, so sad. Out in the streets you go.

The program indeed needs to be phased out, but you have to do it in stages; just as Ron Paul plans to do. In fact, only Paul has a viable plan to ensure Social Security is solvent for those currently on it, or anywhere even close to starting it; while ensuring that the dollar maintains its purchasing power.


Meanwhile, those of us who aren't involved in the campaign should try to do our part to shift public opinions away from that mindset. There ought to be some shame that goes along with depending on taxpayers, and we're a long way from that.
Maybe the biggest favor you could do for Ron Paul is to NOT campaign on his behalf, on the issue of Social Security.

[LibertyEagle]

I don't think a huge campaign of pamphlets, phone calls and newspaper ads will be as helpful as:

1.) RADIO ADS
2.) CAUCUS SPEECHES that includes the strong assurance about no cuts for seniors.

It's a waste of time - of which there isn't enough left before caucuses to even do a phone/direct mail campaign. Radio ads are very effective. But if the budget is low (even if it's not), ensure that your caucus speech covers the topic and make good eye contact with the older folks in the crowd.

Suzu, a major contributing factor to Rand's success in his campaign was the calling program. It was hugely successful. I cannot begin to tell you how many very old Kentuckians I spoke to, who didn't know one thing about the candidates before I called. But, they planned to vote.

There is nothing like the personal touch.

[erowe1]

That is complete and utter bullshit. They were forced to pay into Social Security for years and years and were promised that the money would be put in a Social Security Trust Fund.

What they were forced to pay into for all those years was not a trust fund for them to get back in the future. What they paid into was money for all the people who were then collecting it. They did this on the promise that some other unsuspecting generation of workers would be forced to do the same thing for them in the future.

It never should have started. It has to end some time. And the sooner it does the better. Not a single person is entitled to a single penny from Social Security, no matter what they paid into or think they paid into in the past. Every penny they do get is stolen money. If we acknowledge that it was wrong to steal their money in the past, then we should also acknowledge that the best thing to do now is to stop the theft, not to continue stealing other people's money to somehow makeup for other theft that already happened. We need to hammer that point home loud and often, until there aren't any more people out there talking about this trust fund nonsense and everybody accepts that Social Security is and always has been nothing but a welfare program that takes from the poor and gives to the rich.

[A. Havnes]

Joe, I agree with you. They also need a TV ad for this, and a longer Youtube video to go viral.

TV is better. Most older folks complain that they don't know how to use a computer. Depending on how old you're talking, a lot of them don't go on youtube.

[Tod]

Listen,

You are not going to sway the older group to Ron Paul. That is just the truth. Trust me, when you are above 65, your mind is made. Nothing will ever change it. Forget it. Forget that vote and focus on anyone younger than that. Trust me.

Oh, come on....quit being so ageist. Decisions are based upon perception, and perception is based upon information received. Our job is to get the information out there, as with ANY voter, and to do that we need to understand the different sources that people draw on to get their information and use it to our advantage.

[heavenlyboy34]

The point is: Lay to rest the false collective paradigms about people.

It's not: Rich vs. Poor; Old vs. Young; Men vs. Women; Right vs. Left; Conservative vs. Liberal; Red vs. Blue; Republican vs. Democrat

It's Honesty vs. Dishonesty; War vs. Peace; Real vs. Fake; Liberty vs. Tyranny; Truth vs. Lie.
This^^ We've all been sold a bill of goods. Don't fall for their trap-they want us fighting each other so they can continue manipulating the system and the world.

[heavenlyboy34]

TV is better. Most older folks complain that they don't know how to use a computer. Depending on how old you're talking, a lot of them don't go on youtube.
My parents are 70+ and use the webbernet rather regularly. If it's possible, it would be smart to survey demographics to see who uses which media in the various districts.

[LibertyEagle]

What they were forced to pay into for all those years was not a trust fund for them to get back in the future. What they paid into was money for all the people who were then collecting it. They did this on the promise that some other unsuspecting generation of workers would be forced to do the same thing for them in the future.
Actually, that is not true at all. That is what is happening now, yes. The Social Security Trust Fund was looted some years back.


It never should have started. It has to end some time. And the sooner it does the better.
I agree that it should never have been started, and many people at the time didn't want it, either.


Not a single person is entitled to a single penny from Social Security, no matter what they paid into or think they paid into in the past. Every penny they do get is stolen money. If we acknowledge that it was wrong to steal their money in the past, then we should also acknowledge that the best thing to do now is to stop the theft, not to continue stealing other people's money to somehow makeup for other theft that already happened. We need to hammer that point home loud and often, until there aren't any more people out there talking about this trust fund nonsense and everybody accepts that Social Security is and always has been nothing but a welfare program.

It's not nonsense. You don't know what you are talking about.

Like I said before, do Ron Paul a favor and don't campaign for him on this issue. All you will do is hurt him.

[erowe1]

Actually, that is not true at all.

It was true from the very beginning.

[erowe1]

Like I said before, do Ron Paul a favor and don't campaign for him on this issue. All you will do is hurt him.

I'm not connecting anything I'm saying here to his campaign. And if I were campaigning for him on this issue, I'd be sure to sell him in a way that would make the SS-recipients like him.

But we have to separate what we do in the way of educating people about this issue so that we can change what goes for acceptable opinion so that some future candidate can take it on in the way that needs to be done and what we do when we're campaigning for someone running in 2012.

[Tod]

Not a single person is entitled to a single penny from Social Security, no matter what they paid into or think they paid into in the past.

Oh, baloney. We the people have a contract with people who have paid in and it is our responsibility to fulfill it. That does NOT mean that we should enter into such contracts with people in the future or that the contract SHOULD have been entered into in the past.

[Adrock]

The campaign needs to focus on this. Any time spent addressing the Social Security issue is well spent. It will help in the primary and inoculate RP in the General against the Liberal attacks.

[erowe1]

Oh, baloney. We the people have a contract with people who have paid in and it is our responsibility to fulfill it. That does NOT mean that we should enter into such contracts with people in the future or that the contract SHOULD have been entered into in the past.
I never signed any contract.

[No Free Beer]

I think you guys need to stop calling people names.

[heavenlyboy34]

I read this constantly.

Why not make a pamphlet with big letters with the title "How Ron Paul will save social security and medicare"?

And use that for the old folks instead of the generic pamphlet?
It's in the literature I've been handing out. It does need to be emphasized more, though.