Must read Grover Cleveland Info

[WIwarrior]

Why Grover Cleveland Vetoed the Texas Seed Bill

hxxp://www.independent.org/publications/article.asp?id=1329

Cleveland believed in keeping government expenditure at the minimum required to carry out essential constitutional functions. “When a man in office lays out a dollar in extravagance,” declared Cleveland, “he acts immorally by the people.”3 He fought to lower tariffs, which the Republicans had hoisted to punishing levels, and to hold back the flood of phony pensions that congressmen were awarding in order to buy votes and to placate the Grand Army of the Republic, the most powerful political pressure group of the late nineteenth century.

[muh_roads]

I knew Ron plans to veto more bills than any president ever. It would be so awesome. Corporate welfare say bye bye. So fricken tired of these 2,000 page bills.

[shadowhooch]

Given this statement in wikipedia:

"Disaster hit the nation a few months into his second term as the Panic of 1893 produced a severe national depression that Cleveland was unable to reverse. It ruined his Democratic party, opening the way for a Republican landslide in 1894, and for the agrarian and silverite seizure of his Democratic party in 1896. The result was a political realignment that ended the Third Party System and launched the Fourth Party System and the Progressive Era.[4]"

and given that Ron Paul seems very similar; how is Ron Paul's plan going to get us out of a recession? What is different?

[newbitech]

Given this statement in wikipedia:

"Disaster hit the nation a few months into his second term as the Panic of 1893 produced a severe national depression that Cleveland was unable to reverse. It ruined his Democratic party, opening the way for a Republican landslide in 1894, and for the agrarian and silverite seizure of his Democratic party in 1896. The result was a political realignment that ended the Third Party System and launched the Fourth Party System and the Progressive Era.[4]"

and given that Ron Paul seems very similar; how is Ron Paul's plan going to get us out of a recession? What is different?

ironically, what is different is that when the bank run occurred after government meddling, there was actually gold and silver in those vaults. Today, that panic has already occurred and the collapse has already happened. There isn't anything else left to collapse. So what is different is that the economy will heal itself, and it will simply be Ron Paul's job to keep the wound clean and make sure nothing festers or infects the wound. That is all. I hope that makes some sense.

[shadowhooch]

ironically, what is different is that when the bank run occurred after government meddling, there was actually gold and silver in those vaults. Today, that panic has already occurred and the collapse has already happened. There isn't anything else left to collapse. So what is different is that the economy will heal itself, and it will simply be Ron Paul's job to keep the wound clean and make sure nothing festers or infects the wound. That is all. I hope that makes some sense.

Cool thanks. Just trying to keep myself educated.

[Jeremy]

Is there a point in breaking the link?

[hammy]

Is there a point in breaking the link?

Hahaha I think it's out of habit at this point

[ShaneEnochs]

Given this statement in wikipedia:

"Disaster hit the nation a few months into his second term as the Panic of 1893 produced a severe national depression that Cleveland was unable to reverse. It ruined his Democratic party, opening the way for a Republican landslide in 1894, and for the agrarian and silverite seizure of his Democratic party in 1896. The result was a political realignment that ended the Third Party System and launched the Fourth Party System and the Progressive Era.[4]"

and given that Ron Paul seems very similar; how is Ron Paul's plan going to get us out of a recession? What is different?

Newbitech did a great job explaining this, but I'll put it a bit more simpler.

At this point, we're prolonging our painful economy. It's already gone, so we don't have to worry about that part. Regardless of what you may hear, we are still in a very deep recession. Jobs are decreasing much faster than they are being created. What Ron wants to do is... well, if you're familiar with computers, it would be like running an antivirus program in safemode, and then rebooting the computer. He wants to clean up the economy by wiping out the virus (corporatism and corruption), and then the computer (economy) should be able to boot up again just fine.

Does that make sense?

[BrendenR]

Cool thanks. Just trying to keep myself educated.

Don't just take people's word on a forum for it. There is certainly plenty of collapse left in the system. Remember, the government bailouts stopped the real collapse from fully occurring. You know how Ron says "you have to liquidate the debt and fix the malinvestment"? That's not healing, that's pain. But no pain, no gain.

[sevin]

It's funny, Peter Schiff was talking about Grover Cleveland on his show. Starts at 3:57.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N7NQO5r9_qk

[unknown]

I knew Ron plans to veto more bills than any president ever. It would be so awesome. Corporate welfare say bye bye. So fricken tired of these 2,000 page bills.

This.

[Stevo_Chill]

Bourbon Democrat

[dfalken]

Ron Paul getting elected will immediately deepen the collapse and he fully understands that. The real collapse hasn't even begun as the largest bubble of all is still alive and kicking and it is the US treasury bond bubble. He has warned us that there will be pain and I think the pain will actually be extreme probably worse than the great depression, but the alternative of not facing that pain is to let the system completely collapse and then we'll have a mad max style anarchy. In 2008 the system almost got there but it was revivied with massive stimulus. I am completely against the stimulus and I think if the too big too fail stupidity had never been born then we would have never gotten to 2008, however the alternative at that point was a complete collapse where banks seize to exist. There is no good way out of 30 years of indebtment, whether Ron Paul is President or not but it would be great to have an honest person who understands the problem leading us through the storm.

[Stevo_Chill]

Ron Paul getting elected will immediately deepen the collapse and he fully understands that. The real collapse hasn't even begun as the largest bubble of all is still alive and kicking and it is the US treasury bond bubble. He has warned us that there will be pain and I think the pain will actually be extreme probably worse than the great depression, but the alternative of not facing that pain is to let the system completely collapse and then we'll have a mad max style anarchy. In 2008 the system almost got there but it was revivied with massive stimulus. I am completely against the stimulus and I think if the too big too fail stupidity had never been born then we would have never gotten to 2008, however the alternative at that point was a complete collapse where banks seize to exist. There is no good way out of 30 years of indebtment, whether Ron Paul is President or not but it would be great to have an honest person who understands the problem leading us through the storm.

liquidation of malinvestment will set us free. in 12 months time, we can all be back to work without King Kong on our shoulders.

[osan]

I knew Ron plans to veto more bills than any president ever. It would be so awesome. Corporate welfare say bye bye. So fricken tired of these 2,000 page bills.

Constitutional amendment time:


"No Legislative Body, whether State or Federal, shall pass into law any instruments greater than 250 words in total length."

...or something to that effect.

This makes the passage of convoluted, arcane, and obfuscatory legislation almost impossibly tedious as every provision of, say, the PATRIOT act would essentially have to be broken out into a large numbers of separate legislative issues to be separately voted upon. That would not only make the chore murderously miserable for Congress, it would force votes on nearly each and every specific issue such that a congressman would be able to be held more convincingly accountable for his vote on very specific points. That would end the "I was unaware that this provision was in the legislation" and "compromise" excuses so often offered by these criminal ill-adepts.

Opinions?

[BrendenR]

Constitutional amendment time:


"No Legislative Body, whether State or Federal, shall pass into law any instruments greater than 250 words in total length."

...or something to that effect.

This makes the passage of convoluted, arcane, and obfuscatory legislation almost impossibly tedious as every provision of, say, the PATRIOT act would essentially have to be broken out into a large numbers of separate legislative issues to be separately voted upon. That would not only make the chore murderously miserable for Congress, it would force votes on nearly each and every specific issue such that a congressman would be able to be held more convincingly accountable for his vote on very specific points. That would end the "I was unaware that this provision was in the legislation" and "compromise" excuses so often offered by these criminal ill-adepts.

Opinions?

How about instead "The author of any legislation must read the text of said legislation, in its entirety, before the legislative body in session.".

Then see how many 200 page bills we get.

[hazek]

There is major pain ahead of us no matter what happens. All that can change is how long it will last and who will be blamed.

The fear I have is that the MSM will spin the liquidation of the malinvestment occurring because of Ron's presidency though I have hope that in this day and age of internet and social media we will have a fighting chance in the propaganda war.

I mean it's for this precise reason why we can expect inflationary policies if Ron doesn't win because it's so hard to blame inflation on president's actions.

[Travlyr]

Ron Paul getting elected will immediately deepen the collapse and he fully understands that. The real collapse hasn't even begun as the largest bubble of all is still alive and kicking and it is the US treasury bond bubble. He has warned us that there will be pain and I think the pain will actually be extreme probably worse than the great depression, but the alternative of not facing that pain is to let the system completely collapse and then we'll have a mad max style anarchy. In 2008 the system almost got there but it was revivied with massive stimulus. I am completely against the stimulus and I think if the too big too fail stupidity had never been born then we would have never gotten to 2008, however the alternative at that point was a complete collapse where banks seize to exist. There is no good way out of 30 years of indebtment, whether Ron Paul is President or not but it would be great to have an honest person who understands the problem leading us through the storm.
The collapse is being felt by a lot of people across America already. If you are not feeling it yet, then you will unless you are royalty. The stimulus bailed out the privileged people and left others to fend for themselves... it is trickling up as we type.

Accurate predictions into the future are very difficult, but my personal opinion is that the economic collapse will deepen much more before election day. A lot of you people who have not yet felt it will understand much more clearly when it hits your table.

[GeorgiaAvenger]

Constitutional amendment time:


"No Legislative Body, whether State or Federal, shall pass into law any instruments greater than 250 words in total length."

...or something to that effect.

This makes the passage of convoluted, arcane, and obfuscatory legislation almost impossibly tedious as every provision of, say, the PATRIOT act would essentially have to be broken out into a large numbers of separate legislative issues to be separately voted upon. That would not only make the chore murderously miserable for Congress, it would force votes on nearly each and every specific issue such that a congressman would be able to be held more convincingly accountable for his vote on very specific points. That would end the "I was unaware that this provision was in the legislation" and "compromise" excuses so often offered by these criminal ill-adepts.

Opinions?

That seems a little arbitrary to me.

Also, they could just create new and longer words.