Breaking: Shootings at Virginia Tech

[Dianne]

Here we go again... another excuse for the Feds to pass more unconstitutional laws.

[youngbuck]

And since students and teachers can't carry, the shooter will be uninhibited...

[ghengis86]

Link?

[specsaregood]

And since students and teachers can't carry, the shooter will be uninhibited...

yeah this event can't be real, guns aren't allowed there.

[Dianne]

On CNN "live"

[Dianne]

Saying police officer shot and at least one other person.

[Kelly.]

http://www.aljazeera.com/news/americas/2011/12/2011128182130351.html


There have been reports of shots fired at Virginia Tech University in the US, site of a 2007 massacre that left 32 people dead.

A police officer was shot and a second victim was reported on Thursday at the Virginia Tech campus in Blacksburg, Virginia, the university said in its Twitter feed.

"Stay indoors. Secure in place," the message said.

The school described the shooting suspect on its website as a white male in gray sweat pants and a maroon sweat shirt.

MSNBC reported that a campus police officer and a suspect exchanged shots at a traffic stop and that the suspect was still at large.

University officials were not immediately available for comment.

[donnay]

Coincidence?

Virginia Tech to testify in shootings-related case
KIMBERLY HEFLING, AP Education Writer
Updated 07:04 a.m., Thursday, December 8, 2011

WASHINGTON (AP) — As a massacre unfolded on its campus in 2007, Virginia Tech acted appropriately to alert the campus, school officials say.

Wendell Flinchum, the university's police chief, is among the Virginia Tech officials expected to testify Thursday before an administrative judge during the second day of a hearing on whether the school should pay $55,000 in fines in connection to the shooting rampage that left 33 dead, including the shooter.

The Education Department said the school violated the law by waiting more than two hours after two students were shot dead in a dormitory before sending out a warning by email. By that time, student gunman Seung-Hui Cho was chaining the doors to a classroom building where he killed 30 more people and then himself. The department says the email was too vague because it mentioned only a "shooting incident" but not the deaths.

Parents of some of the victims have testified that they think their children would've stayed away from campus if they'd known of a threat, and the Education Department said the school had an obligation to protect the community.

http://www.chron.com/news/article/Virginia-Tech-to-testify-in-shootings-related-case-2379058.php

[jmdrake]

Unreal. Of course the liberals would spin this into another excuse to take away guns. And if the shooter had been Arab then conservatives (fake ones anyway) would spin this into another excuse to profile and move further to a surveillance state. Only small government types will see the truth, that victim disarmament zones only help the perps.

[Dianne]

Probably the first thing McCain and Lieberman will use to highlight why the government needs the green light to indefinitely detain anyone who owns a gun.

[Jingles]

I go to school here. I just got all these text alerts from the school reporting this.

[amy31416]

Quit trying to turn me into a conspiracy theorist! Dammit!

[Todd]

I go to school here. I just got all these text alerts from the school reporting this.

Didn't see this.

It is my alma mater too. Man this is getting crazy down there.

I thought guns were banned there now.

Wouldn't be able to keep me from CC if I still went there.

[freefromchains]

Police offers is dead. 2nd victim at Duck Pond is dead. More shots fired heard on various parts of campus.

[Jingles]

Didn't see this.

It is my alma mater too. Man this is getting crazy down there.

I thought guns were banned there now.

Wouldn't be able to keep me from CC if I still went there.

We just held a rally for concealed carry on campus about a month ago that Larry Pratt came to.

[Jingles]

Police offers is dead. 2nd victim at Duck Pond is dead. More shots fired heard on various parts of campus.

=/

I'm glad I'm not on campus today...

[Todd]

We just held a rally for concealed carry on campus about a month ago that Larry Pratt came to.

I hope this leads to every pro gun student collectively suing the university for failure to protect them. They have a plethora of evidence now.

[donnay]

Va Tech on lockdown, cop killed
http://www.wnem.com/story/16219871/virginia-tech-on-lockdown

Posted: Dec 08, 2011 1:01 PM EST Updated: Dec 08, 2011 1:40 PM EST

A screen grab of the Virginia Tech website. (Source: RNN) A screen grab of the Virginia Tech website. (Source: RNN)

BLACKSBURG, VA (RNN) - There are reports of additional shots fired near the performance arts center on the campus of Virginia tech, approximately one hour after a police officer and a second person were shot.

The police officer has died, according to the campus newspaper, The Collegiate Times.

The school is under lockdown, with law enforcement, the FBI and school officials swarming to the campus.

According to a Virginia Tech alert sent to students, the second victim is located in the Cage Lot, an off-campus parking lot where students can park their cars and take a shuttle to campus.

The university's website described the shooter as white male wearing gray sweatpants, a gray hat with a neon brim, maroon hoodie and backpack.

It also said he was headed toward McComas Hall at 12:47 p.m. ET. Law enforcement have blocked the back gates to the campus, according to local law enforcement. The FBI and the school president are also on campus.

Police have requested any unassigned units to report to the south gate.

School officials are telling students to seek shelter and stay where they are. Classes have been suspended until further notice.

Media reports indicate the shooting may be the result of a nearby traffic stop. According to NBC, the shooter fired at the officer who made the stop, and the officer returned fire.

Virginia Tech was the scene of the worst mass shooting by a single gunman in U.S. history when 32 people were killed on April 16, 2007.

The campus was placed on lockdown in August after reports of a gunman were made to campus police. No gunman was ever found.

Copyright 2011 Raycom News Network. All rights reserved.

[Verrater]

Campus ccw could have easily deterred this guy.

[AuH20]

The Brady Center must be loving this.

[Anti Federalist]

Eh, lock it all down, why bother anymore...

[Philhelm]

Saying police officer shot and at least one other person.

In related news, local dog population expected to rise sharply, and local women slightly less likely to be raped in a random encounter with another U.S. citizen.

[Anti Federalist]

Hmm, that fellow that escaped from the Carroll County NH jail last week was last reported wearing gray sweats.

Could he have made it all the way to Virginia and gotten armed as well?

[Jingles]

http://emergencystream.com/video_streams/VA/Roanoke1.html Live stream of the situation.

[AuH20]

Was last seen wearing a Ron Paul sweatshirt? I'm waiting for it. I'm sorry but I don't trust the power structure.

[donnay]

Again, is this a coincidence?

Va. Tech officials expected to testify in hearing

The Roanoke Times
© December 8, 2011

By Tonia Moxley

WASHINGTON

Virginia Tech officials, including the campus police chief, are expected to testify today in Washington about why their handling of two fatal early-morning shootings in a dormitory on April 16, 2007, did not violate provisions of a federal campus safety law.

The university is appealing $55,000 in fines levied by the U.S. Department of Education for two violations of the Jeanne Clery Disclosure of Campus Security Policy and Campus Crime Statistics Act, which spells out notification requirements for criminal incidents and other rules. It is enforced by the Education Department, and violations can result in fines of up to $27,500 per incident.

Tech was found to have violated two provisions of that law on the morning of the shootings - failing to issue a timely warning to the campus community that a shooter was on the loose and failing to accurately disclose in its annual security report how a timely warning would be issued. The department levied the maximum fine possible under the law for those violations.

About two hours after two students were fatally shot in West Ambler Johnston Hall, and minutes after Tech notified the campus of a "shooting incident" but assured that police believed the campus to be safe, the same shooter opened fire in Norris Hall, killing 30 students and faculty members and wounding more than a dozen students.

Regardless of the outcome, the hearing has already set a precedent.

In the 20-year history of the Jeanne Clery campus safety law, an evidentiary hearing has never before been held as part of an appeal, presiding Judge Ernest Canellos said. All other Clery Act appeals have been handled in writing.

Education Department attorney Brian Siegel sometimes struggled while questioning witnesses Wednesday, particularly when rephrasing questions objected to by Tech's attorney Peter Messitt.

Attorney questions and witness testimony from David Bergeron, the department's deputy assistant secretary for policy, planning and innovation on the formation of Clery Act statutes and regulations, and James Moore, who conducted the compliance review of Tech's actions on April16 centered around a handbook disseminated to colleges and universities on how to comply with the Clery Act.

Messitt argued that a Clery compliance handbook published by the department in 2005 gave misleading guidance to Tech and other universities, using examples that measured a "timely warning" of a crime that poses an on-going threat to the campus "in days, not hours."

In those examples, two universities notified their campuses of reported sexual assaults days after the alleged crimes were committed.

Moore testified that he had no role in the writing of the handbook and said the examples cited in it should not be used by universities. He also pointed out that universities have other sources of information to guide their compliance with the act.

Furthermore, Moore said, "it would be hard to contemplate a homicide ... where a timely warning would not be required."

Messitt also questioned the department's statutory authority to overrule Tech officials' determination on April 16 that the first two shootings were a domestic dispute that posed no threat to the wider campus.

The statute requires that an institute issue a timely warning when its officials determine that a crime poses an ongoing threat; "it does not say the crimes considered by you to be a threat," Messitt told Moore.

Moore responded that universities do not have unbridled discretion in determining what crimes pose a threat and that the department has the authority to second-guess that determination.

Four parents of students killed or wounded in a second shooting in Norris Hall about two hours after the dormitory attack also testified Wednesday. All volunteered to testify but were not subpoenaed or otherwise compelled to appear, Education Department spokeswoman Jane Glickman said.

Lori Haas, mother of wounded student Emily Haas, and Suzanne Grimes, mother of wounded student Kevin Sterne, testified that neither of their children would have remained on campus had they been warned that a shooter was loose on the campus.

Mike Pohle, father of the late Mike Pohle Jr., and Peter Read, father of the late Mary Read, could not say definitively what their children did or did not know about the dormitory shooting.

For Read, that is but one of many lingering questions about his daughter's death.

"We don't know ... how scared she was, and we don't know how much she suffered," he said.

But Pohle testified that his son had immediately left the campus on the first day of fall classes in 2006, when fugitive William Morva, who had shot to death a security guard and a Montgomery County sheriff's deputy, was reported to have been seen near Tech.

On that day, university officials canceled classes and ordered students and employees to shelter in place. Police fanned out in Blacksburg neighborhoods near campus and reminded people to lock their doors.

The other three parents testified that their children heeded university warnings about Morva and likely would have heeded warnings about a shooter on the loose on April 16.

Tech's witnesses, including campus Police Chief Wendell Flinchum, are set to testify this morning.

http://hamptonroads.com/2011/12/va-tech-officials-expected-testify-hearing

[donnay]

Hmm, that fellow that escaped from the Carroll County NH jail last week was last reported wearing gray sweats.

Could he have made it all the way to Virginia and gotten armed as well?

Nah he was apprehended yesterday.

[Todd]

Right now if there is one person on that campus with a gun that other students trust, then I'll guarantee that everyone's over at his place.

[donnay]

Parents testify against Virginia Tech at hearing in connection to 2007 shootings

By Associated Press, Published: December 7

WASHINGTON — Sometimes pushing back tears, the parents of victims in the 2007 Virginia Tech shooting testified Wednesday that they believe their children would have stayed in a safe place far away from where they were later shot if they’d had more information from the university about a safety threat on campus.

That threat was connected to a double shooting in a campus dorm that morning.

An administrative judge is considering Virginia Tech’s appeal of a $55,000 fine levied by the Education Department after the April 16, 2007, shootings, which left 33 dead, including the shooter.

The Education Department says the school violated the law by waiting more than two hours after two students were fatally shot in a dorm before sending out a warning by email. By that time, student gunman Seung-Hui Cho was chaining the doors to a classroom building where he killed 30 more people and then himself. The department also says the email was too vague because it mentioned only a “shooting incident” but did not say anyone had died.

The parents described the chaos of that day as they frantically sought answers about whether their children who had been in the second building where the mass casualties occurred were alive, dead or injured.

They said they believed their kids would’ve stayed away if they’d known about the potential danger because their children had followed instructions to leave campus that same school year when they were told to do so when an escaped convict was on campus.

Suzanne Grimes, the mother of injured student Kevin Sterne, said she thinks what happened to her son could’ve been prevented.

“He was never informed,” Grimes said.

Lori Haas, the mother of injured student Emily Haas, said her daughter only learned about the first set of shootings when she got to class and was told by a fellow student. But she said when she and classmates first heard chaos stemming from the shootings, her daughter described how everyone just thought it was construction noise and didn’t realize initially how much danger they were in. She said her daughter’s head was grazed by two bullets, and she only lived because she played dead.

Representing the university, Peter Messitt, a senior assistant attorney general for Virginia, said police responding to the initial report of shootings in a dormitory believed the victims were “targeted for a reason” in a domestic incident and thought the shooter had left campus.

The university says it acted appropriately in how it notified the campus that day and has exercised its right to the appeals hearing. It says that it followed standard protocols in place on campuses then and that the department is holding it to a higher standard than was in place at the time.

Specifically, the university faces charges of failure to issue a timely warning and failure to follow its own procedures for providing notification.

James Moore, an Education Department official, testified that there were shell casings, bloody footprints, no weapon on the scene and no suspect apprehended — all reasons the university should have acted more quickly to notify the campus. Even if it had been a domestic incident, Moore said that shouldn’t have mattered.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/courts-law/judge-to-hear-testimony-on-whether-virginia-tech-should-pay-fines-related-to-2007-shootings/2011/12/07/gIQA3hNhbO_story.html

[Philhelm]

Was last seen wearing a Ron Paul sweatshirt? I'm waiting for it. I'm sorry but I don't trust the power structure.

I was thinking the same thing, since I had ordered a light gray Ron Paul hoodie for the 11/11/11 moneybomb. I'm waiting for it...

In lighter news, my Ron Paul hoodie managed to gain another vote for the primary by my current girlfriend.

[Anti Federalist]

Was last seen wearing a Ron Paul sweatshirt? I'm waiting for it. I'm sorry but I don't trust the power structure.

NVM, ain't gonna say it.

[Dianne]

I go to school here. I just got all these text alerts from the school reporting this.

Thank Goodness you're ok !!

[Dianne]

http://emergencystream.com/video_streams/VA/Roanoke1.html Live stream of the situation.

Thanks !!

[Anti Federalist]

Nah he was apprehended yesterday.

Ah, had not heard that.

[123tim]

Just heard on the live stream (posted in this thread) that all of the schools in the area are in Lockdown mode. Kids won't be getting home anytime soon apparently.

[AuH20]

SWAT arrived on the scene. All big and bad.

[UtahApocalypse]

just remember when in a "Gun Free Zone"....

when seconds count, the Police are only Minutes away.....

[gerryb]

Wonder if the shooters gun came from Obama's Gunrunner program?

[Nirvikalpa]

I just want to bring up and remind people to please be sensitive, as there are many current students that post here as well as alums of Virginia Tech, some who were students during the first incident, who consider RPF their home.

Lets just hope they apprehend the suspect, and that no one else gets hurt... this school and its students have already been through too, too much.

[donnay]

Ah, had not heard that.

*Donnay shudders a bit*

Fugitive captured York County manhunt leads to jail escapee's arrest in N.H.

By Staff Reports
Thursday, December 8, 2011


ALFRED — Jail escapee David Hobson was shocked and surprised when more than a dozen authorities captured him in the parking lot of the Market Basket on Milton Road in Rochester, New Hampshire, on Tuesday evening.

http://www.fosters.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111208/GJNEWS03/712089925/-1/SANNEWS

[Dianne]

This is not going to end pretty :(( .

[Anti Federalist]

SWAT arrived on the scene. All big and bad.

Hut Hut Hut Hut

[donnay]

http://www.rense.com/1.imagesH/prbsolution_dees.jpg

[Dianne]

I just want to bring up and remind people to please be sensitive, as there are many current students that post here as well as alums of Virginia Tech, some who were students during the first incident, who consider RPF their home.

Lets just hope they apprehend the suspect, and that no one else gets hurt... this school and its students have already been through too, too much.

I agree, completely. I wish the guy would just give himself up and get out of there.

[AuH20]

"Stay indoors and secure all doors, sheep. The professionals will keep you safe." Complete bullshit. Empower yourself.

[Todd]

"Stay indoors and secure all doors, sheep. The professionals will keep you safe." Complete bullshit. Empower yourself.

The way it is right now there, if you went out to try to do something you would be risking your own life more with the police than the shooter, as the place has become a War zone

[Dianne]

The way it is right now there, if you went out to try to do something you would be risking your own life more with the police than the shooter, as the place has become a War zone

Yeah, especially when looking for a cop killer; they are all trigger happy at the moment.

[KingRobbStark]

Yeah, especially when looking for a cop killer; they are all trigger happy at the moment.

Imagine if everyone at that school owned a gun?

[Todd]

Imagine if everyone at that school owned a gun?

sad thing about this incident is that the Police officer was armed.

[KingRobbStark]

sad thing about this incident is that the Police officer was armed.

The real sad thing is that the people who were going to potentially be shot at can't defend themselves.

[Aden]

I go to school at Tech too. I made this post a few weeks ago.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?326282-Protest-next-month-at-Virginia-Tech-for-right-to-conceal-carry

Last month there were articles in the school paper, as well protests on campus, calling for students to be able to CC on campus.

I was not on campus today either. But if I were, you can take it to the bank that I'd be out of there when the first alert sounded. No way I listen to silly officials telling me to sit in the classroom like a sitting duck. Sorry. First rule of a panic is be the first one that does it.

[Jingles]

I go to school at Tech too. I made this post a few weeks ago.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?326282-Protest-next-month-at-Virginia-Tech-for-right-to-conceal-carry

Last month there were articles in the school paper, as well protests on campus, calling for students to be able to CC on campus.

I was not on campus today either. But if I were, you can take it to the bank that I'd be out of there when the first alert sounded. No way I listen to silly officials telling me to sit in the classroom like a sitting duck. Sorry. First rule of a panic is be the first one that does it.

Did you go to the protest? I was at it. The Libertarian club hosted it with VCDL. Also, JOIN THE LIBERTARIAN CLUB HERE! http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?330499-AN-EVENT-MY-LIBERTARIAN-CLUB-IS-HOSTING-ON-CAMPUS-MADE-IT-ON-THE-YOUNG-TURKS-AND-NPR-LOL

[Dianne]

I go to school at Tech too. I made this post a few weeks ago.

http://www.ronpaulforums.com/showthread.php?326282-Protest-next-month-at-Virginia-Tech-for-right-to-conceal-carry

Last month there were articles in the school paper, as well protests on campus, calling for students to be able to CC on campus.

I was not on campus today either. But if I were, you can take it to the bank that I'd be out of there when the first alert sounded. No way I listen to silly officials telling me to sit in the classroom like a sitting duck. Sorry. First rule of a panic is be the first one that does it.

That's what I was wondering. The students must be terrified !! If the guy was walking around in the dorms, are the doors strong enough that he can't shoot his way in?

[pauliticalfan]

He's dead according to NBC wow.

[Philhelm]

He's dead according to NBC wow.

Cops or self-inflicted?

[Rothbardian Girl]

Cops or self-inflicted?
No one knows for sure yet. They're saying he may have been the second shooting victim. So either he shot himself, or someone else shot him, either a cop or a vigilante.

[Dianne]

They found a gun near the second victim; must have suicided himself (according to G.W. Bush)

[Zippyjuan]

Updates from NBC:
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/08/9306260-virginia-tech-shootings-authorities-believe-gunman-is-second-victim-alert-lifted

Updated at 4:34 p.m. ET: Virginia Tech has lifted the campuswide alert.

Updated at 4:31 p.m. ET: The Collegiate Times reports that there is now "no active threat" at Virginia Tech and that students are being allowed to "resume normal activities."

Updated at 4:25 p.m. ET: Virginia Tech officials say a weapon was found near the body of the second person who was killed on campus.

Original post: Law enforcement officials tell NBC News they believe the second shooting victim at Virginia Tech University was the man who shot and killed the campus police officer.

NBC's Pete Williams reports that authorities say they're awaiting final confirmation but that they believe the campuswide alert for a gunman at large will soon be canceled.


ABC updates:
http://abcnews.go.com/US/virginia-tech-shooter-deadl-lock-lifted/story?id=15114257

A manhunt that locked down Virginia Tech University came to an end today when police determined that a gunman who killed a cop on the campus later died of gunshot wounds.

It was the second time the Blacksburg, Va., school became the scene of a gunfire since the 2007 massacre of 33 students.

Today's shooting, which occurred shortly after noon, triggered sirens and alerts telling students to stay locked inside.

"Stay indoors. Secure in place," the alerts on Twitter and Facebook said.

An alert on the Virginia Tech school's website said: "There is an active campus alert in Blacksburg. Everyone should seek shelter or stay where you are. Blacksburg Transit service is suspended until the alert is lifted."

Virginia Tech spokesman Mark Owczarski said a campus police officer stopped a vehicle shortly after noon today in the school's Coliseum parking lot, near McComas Hall.

"During the traffic stop, the officer was shot and killed. There were witnesses to this shooting," Owczarski said in the statement.


Owczarski said the officer was the first person to be shot.

"Witnesses reported to police the shooter fled on foot heading toward the Cage, a parking lot near Duck Pond Drive. At that parking lot, a second person was found. That person is also deceased," he said.

[Dianne]

Updates from NBC:
http://usnews.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/08/9306260-virginia-tech-shootings-authorities-believe-gunman-is-second-victim-alert-lifted

Wonder why the police officer is now saying "live" that he can't confirm the second guy was the shooter since still under investigation.

[PatriotOne]

Okay. I'm going to say it. Sounding very mk ultrish to me. Cho was def mind controlled. MK ultra's are programmed to off themselves to make sure evidence of mind control doesn't become evident during the course of the investigation/trial (such as is now being disclosed by Sir Han Sir Hans lawyer).

[Dianne]

This whole things sounds like bs to me for some reason. They either know by now or not the second victim was the shooter.. balistics, powder on hands .. They should be referring to him as the suspect. They won't say if the rest of the city is safe; just the campus. Sounds fishy to me. Won't even tell if hand gun or shot gun. As Judge Judy says "They are just making it up as they go along", lol.

I could understand if victim no. 2 was still alive; and the Police Department was worried about a lawsuit... but perp is dead, so why can't they say he's a suspect.

[Zippyjuan]

Of course testing like ballistics will take time but the campus officer shooting was witnessed and the suspect described. The victim probably matches that description and was found with a weapon next to him which would make it highly likely that this was indeed the shooter. Probably at first reports came in of a victim found without any description of him to compare with the suspect (the person finding the body maybe did not yet have the description).

[Dianne]

What's interesting is the police officer in the press conference would not answer if police officer no. 2 shot victim two or not. I'm starting to believe police office no. 2 killed victim #2; that is why they are so tight mouthed and keep saying it is under investigation.

[youngbuck]

Yea, he could have easily exchanged rounds with the cop, killed the cop while being hit himself, ran away on adrenaline, and ended up bleeding to death in the other parking lot.

[GunnyFreedom]

Why do these always happen in gun free zones? :(

[Jingles]

What's interesting is the police officer in the press conference would not answer if police officer no. 2 shot victim two or not. I'm starting to believe police office no. 2 killed victim #2; that is why they are so tight mouthed and keep saying it is under investigation.

Who knows. We'll just have to wait and see. My assumption is it was someone with a warrant out on them/stolen car/etc... and figured they would be going to jail for a long, long time. So they shot the cop and fled. From there my assumption is that he "blow he brain in" (To quote Toki Wartooth). That would make the most sense to me. Its just rather sad that this police officer had to die over something he probably knew nothing about.

I really don't think its some weird conspiracy stuff going on here (I've seen a few posts suggesting something like that). Just probably a guy that had a warrant out on him and he didn't want to go to jail. This kind of stuff happens often enough in the US (I don't mean that it happens everyday, but you know what I mean). It was more of the location that it occurred that there was such a huge reaction to it (i.e. Virginia Tech).

[AuH20]

Apparently, a police officer in the area is relaying info on Hot Air that he acquired:


This should be my final report before I head to a shower and a much needed The Feast of the Immaculate Conception Mass followed by a night out with some friends to wash away the 4+ year old pain that this brought up.

The officer was a 4 year veteran of the Virginia Tech Police Department (VTPD) not Blacksburg Police (BPD)

The officer was NOT shot by the person he pulled over. He pulled over someone and a THIRD PARTY walked over his vehicle and executed him.

That person then fled to The Cage (parking lot I referenced earlier) and was apparently confronted by a police officer. The officer turned away for a moment for some reason and the person was dead. A weapon was recovered from the second scene and the police refuse to confirm that the 2nd crime scene is that of the shooter from earlier.

SgtSVJones on December 8, 2011 at 5:12 PM

[Todd]

Who knows. We'll just have to wait and see. My assumption is it was someone with a warrant out on them/stolen car/etc... and figured they would be going to jail for a long, long time. So they shot the cop and fled. From there my assumption is that he "blow he brain in" (To quote Toki Wartooth). That would make the most sense to me. Its just rather sad that this police officer had to die over something he probably knew nothing about.

I really don't think its some weird conspiracy stuff going on here (I've seen a few posts suggesting something like that). Just probably a guy that had a warrant out on him and he didn't want to go to jail. This kind of stuff happens often enough in the US (I don't mean that it happens everyday, but you know what I mean). It was more of the location that it occurred that there was such a huge reaction to it (i.e. Virginia Tech).

That's my take. It's what happened 5 years ago with William Morva. Didn't want to go to prison, escaped, and killed two people near the campus

[seraphson]

Imagine if everyone at that school owned a gun?

"An armed society is a polite society." Of course this doesn't quite apply to the mentally ill but at least these outliers will be neutralized in a much quicker time span.

[Aldanga]

Why do these always happen in gun free zones? :(
The answer is in the question.

But, of course, you know that.

[UtahApocalypse]

They found a gun near the second victim; must have suicided himself (according to G.W. Bush)


Of course testing like ballistics will take time but the campus officer shooting was witnessed and the suspect described. The victim probably matches that description and was found with a weapon next to him which would make it highly likely that this was indeed the shooter. Probably at first reports came in of a victim found without any description of him to compare with the suspect (the person finding the body maybe did not yet have the description).

and it took FOUR hours to notice a gun next to the body?

:rolleyes:

[Todd]

Apparently, a police officer in the area is relaying info on Hot Air that he acquired:

Lot of knuckleheads on there trying to push the Anti gun meme.

http://hotair.com/archives/2011/12/08/breaking-police-officer-shot-on-virginia-tech-campus/

[Anti Federalist]

Apparently, a police officer in the area is relaying info on Hot Air that he acquired:


This should be my final report before I head to a shower and a much needed The Feast of the Immaculate Conception Mass followed by a night out with some friends to wash away the 4+ year old pain that this brought up.

The officer was a 4 year veteran of the Virginia Tech Police Department (VTPD) not Blacksburg Police (BPD)

The officer was NOT shot by the person he pulled over. He pulled over someone and a THIRD PARTY walked over his vehicle and executed him.

That person then fled to The Cage (parking lot I referenced earlier) and was apparently confronted by a police officer. The officer turned away for a moment for some reason and the person was dead. A weapon was recovered from the second scene and the police refuse to confirm that the 2nd crime scene is that of the shooter from earlier.

SgtSVJones on December 8, 2011 at 5:12 PM



nvm...

[PatriotOne]

Who knows. We'll just have to wait and see. My assumption is it was someone with a warrant out on them/stolen car/etc... and figured they would be going to jail for a long, long time. So they shot the cop and fled. From there my assumption is that he "blow he brain in" (To quote Toki Wartooth). That would make the most sense to me. Its just rather sad that this police officer had to die over something he probably knew nothing about.

The guy that the police officer pulled over wasn't the same guy who shot him:

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-501363_162-57339562/va-tech-police-officer-1-other-killed/

The officer was killed after pulling a driver over in a traffic stop. The gunman — who was not involved in the traffic stop — walked into the parking lot and shot the officer, Sgt. Robert Carpentieri said. Police wouldn't talk about a motive.

[damiengwa]

I just want to bring up and remind people to please be sensitive,....

Sensitive? Hows about angry. They still ban weapons. Maybe if they were permitted this would be deterred. Of course its too early to say, but enough of this "sensitive" shit. They take gun rights away and people get hurt. Its inexcusable.

[DamianTV]

Taking away gun rights only hurts people who would use guns to defend themselves. It doesnt do one damn thing about the people that would use guns to impose their will on others in any form of aggression.

Someone needs to quickly post the news story about the idiot that tried to hold up an NRA Convention...

[PatriotOne]

December 9, 2011 6:13 PM

Va. Tech shooter was student at nearby college
Ross Truett Ashley (VA State Police)
(CBS/AP) Updated 10:52 p.m. ET
http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-201_162-57340636/va-tech-shooter-was-student-at-nearby-college/
BLACKSBURG, Va. - A dean's list student who killed a Virginia Tech police officer had no ties to the university and did not know the patrolman, authorities said Friday without offering a motive for a crime spree that spanned two days and ended in suicide.


Ross Truett Ashley, 22, first drew authorities' attention when he robbed his landlord's office at gunpoint Wednesday. He took the keys to a Mercedes-Benz sport utility vehicle later found in Blacksburg, home to Virginia Tech, about 10 miles away.


Ashley, a part-time business student at Radford University, was described by those who knew him as a typical college student, though he could be quiet and standoffish. He liked to run down the hallways and recently shaved his head, a neighbor said.


Police said he walked up to officer Deriek W. Crouse on Thursday and shot him to death as the patrolman sat in his unmarked cruiser in the midst of a traffic stop. Ashley was not involved in the stop and did not know the driver, police said.


Ashley then took off for the campus greenhouses, ditching his pullover, wool cap and backpack as police sent out a campus-wide alert that a gunman was on the loose, terrorizing students on a campus still coping with the nation's worst mass slaying in recent memory.


A deputy sheriff on patrol noticed a man acting suspicious in a parking lot about a half-mile from the shooting. The deputy drove up and down the rows of the sprawling Cage parking lot and lost sight of the man for a moment, then found Ashley shot to death on the pavement.


Ashley lived in an apartment on top floor of a gray, three-story brick building that looked a little beaten up on the outside.


On Friday night, students popped in and out of the building visiting friends. Mandy Adams, a Radford grad student, said had Ashley had recently shaved his head. Other than running down the hallways, he was quiet, she said.


"He would just run down the hallway, never walk, always run," said Adams, who was out on a rear fire escape with a glass of white wine and a cigarette to calm her nerves. "It's going to be really creepy when they come to take his stuff out of here."


Ashley's apartment was above a yogurt shop, consignment store, barber shop and a tattoo parlor. It overlooked the business section of Radford's main drag.



Neighbor Nan Forbes, a Radford senior, said he was rarely seen or heard from. She said she knew he was in trouble when she saw two police officers guarding the door to Ashley's apartment


"It does freak us out because we live in this building, but there was not one peep of trouble, nothing unusual," she said.


Ashley made the dean's list in 2008 at the University of Virginia-Wise, which is located in southwest Virginia. Officials at Radford or UVA-Wise were not immediately able to talk in detail about Ashley.



Crouse, 39, the slain officer, was a trained firearms and defense instructor with a specialty in crisis intervention. He had been on the force for four years, joining about six months after 33 people were killed in a classroom building and dorm April 16, 2007.


Ironically, Crouse was killed across the street from the dormitory where the 2007 massacre began, reports CBS News correspondent Elaine Quijano. He was to be buried at a memorial service Monday.



8 Photos
Students report Va. Tech shooting
View the Full Gallery »

At the Virginia Tech campus, thousands of people silently filled the Drillfield for a candlelight vigil Friday night to remember Crouse, a firearms and defense instructor with a specialty in crisis intervention. He had been on the force for four years, joining about six months after a student gunman killed 32 and himself on April 16, 2007.


The vigil included a moment of silence and later closed with two trumpeters stationed across the field from each other playing "Echo Taps" as students raised their candles.


"Let's go!" one student then shouted. "Hokies!" everyone else responded.


Kathleen O'Dwyer, a fifth-year engineering majors, said it was important to come for Crouse's family.


"Also it's for the community, to see the violence that happens isn't what we're about," said O'Dwyer, who will be graduating next week.


Her plans when she leaves school?


"First, go home and hug my mom," O'Dwyer said.



Nobody answered the door at Ashley's parents' home in Spotsylvania County in the northern part of the state. The house was dark and no vehicles were in the driveway. The two-story, log cabin-style home in a semi-rural area sits about 200 yards off the road up a narrow gravel drive.


Billie Jo Phillippe, who lives three houses down, said she didn't really associate with the family.


"They stay off to themselves a lot," she said. "He was a clean-cut young guy but standoffish."

[acptulsa]

'The school described the shooting suspect on its website as a white male in gray sweat pants and a maroon sweat shirt.'

A University of Chicago student?

[osan]

First rule of a panic is be the first one that does it.

Oh shit that made me laugh. Spot on true.

When the shit hits, to hell with "officials". Let them die. I'm doing what is best for me and nobody is going to stop me.

Man how the world has changed. In '79 I had a rifle on campus at UC Davis. Had to keep it at the security office, but was still able to have it. Not no mo'. That really needs to change. I would add that young people armed also provides one and all with very valuable experiences in being an adult. When you have a gun on your hip or in your purse there is no room for acting like an imbecile as is so common among young people these days. There is NOTHING wrong with growing up and being responsible. Having a firearm on tap helps this greatly because the consequences of misbehaving are not even worth considering. I say arm them all and let us see how things shape up. I am willing to be such massacres become things of the past. Completely.

[acptulsa]

So, they don't know if the second victim is the perpetrator? And won't even say if he was wearing a maroon shirt and gray sweats? You people haven't been worried long enough to suit us, is that what they're saying? Is everyone in town dressed the same way?

And speaking of which, what does SWAT do at a campus that insists on uniforms? Shoot everyone?


Why do these always happen in gun free zones? :(

Well, where else could they happen, Gunny? You think this crap could possibly happen in my Oklahoma neighborhood? Ever see a psycho turn into swiss cheese? The main differences between cops and Oklahoma homeowners are that Oklahoma homeowners tend to be better shots and can tell a perp from a dog.

[Aden]

Man how the world has changed. In '79 I had a rifle on campus at UC Davis. Had to keep it at the security office, but was still able to have it. .


When I was in 6th or 7th grade, a redneck kid named Jimmy got on the bus with either a 12- or 16-gauge shotgun. Bright orange cables and small padlocks decorated it, showing that it was disabled. He mumbled one sentence to the bus driver and was let on with no problem. Half the kids on the bus got excited and went to sit by Jimmy and his gun. He explained to us that he was going to use it for his demonstration (we had to do a glorified show-and-tell). Nobody got hurt. No school officials freaked out. We all survived.