Huckabee misrepresenting RP on Fox and Freinds....

[phill4paul]

Huckabee (paraphrased): "Ron Paul stated that he would get rid of S.S., Medicare and medicaid and I hardly think that would go over well with voter."

NO Huckabee he said TRANSITION AWAY from these programs. Dick!

[Bruno]

When ignoring Paul doesn't work they resort to lies.

[bluesc]

Ron needs to be more careful with his wording on the subject in interviews, it wouldn't give these idiots wiggle room to misrepresent his views. He doesn't need to talk about transitioning out, he needs to say those dependent now will receive their money and young people can opt out. That's it.

[pauladin]

he always mischaracterizes ron paul and his supporters.


saying that ron paul thinks iran should get nukes.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vTQyOPVJXI

saying ron paul is not really a republican.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d52hkLZDSkk

[Feeding the Abscess]

Huckabee is fat and a diabetic. It's clear he has issues with personal responsibility, that's why libertarianism and Ron scare him to such a degree.

[AcousticFoodie]

ouch, what's with the hate on diabetics there? :-(

[bluesc]

ouch, what's with the hate on diabetics there? :-(

WE HATE YOU! LEAVE!

[kylejack]

Huckabee (paraphrased): "Ron Paul stated that he would get rid of S.S., Medicare and medicaid and I hardly think that would go over well with voter."

NO Huckabee he said TRANSITION AWAY from these programs. Dick!
What happens at the end of the transition? (They're gone.)

[Verrater]

What happens at the end of the transition? (They're gone.)

It's still intentional misrepresentation to sway potential voters away.

[phill4paul]

What happens at the end of the transition? (They're gone.)

They are either ended in the sense that individuals become, once again, responsible for themselves and therefore do not need the programs or they are taken up by the states. TRANSITION. Semantics on Huckabees part. Intentioned semantics.

[ZanZibar]

Huckabee is fat and a diabetic. It's clear he has issues with personal responsibility, that's why libertarianism and Ron scare him to such a degree.LOL good point. How's that nanny state working out for keeping him in good health?

[LibertyEagle]

Ron needs to be more careful with his wording on the subject in interviews, it wouldn't give these idiots wiggle room to misrepresent his views. He doesn't need to talk about transitioning out, he needs to say those dependent now will receive their money and young people can opt out. That's it.

I have to agree. I think it is absolutely critical he make it abundantly clear that his plan will NOT end SS or Medicare for those currently on it, or those anywhere close to going on it.

[kylejack]

It is not an inaccuracy to say that Ron Paul wants to get rid of SS/Medicare. He really does want to do that. He has a plan to do it in a transitional way. Of course, people who don't want to get rid of it are going to have some resistance to the idea that there can be a good transition.

And Huckabee really is right that it hurts us with some voters, especially seniors. The AARP has trained seniors to recognize the weasel words of a politician who intends to cut benefits. Unfortunately for us, they're very similar to some of the things Ron says, so we take the brunt of that, even though Ron has a different plan.

[iamse7en]

Huckabee misrepresents RP every time he talks about him. It's his M.O.

[Rothbardian Girl]

This is why I was seriously disheartened by Ron's performance on the Huckabee forum. Through all those "umms" and "aahs", the only thing that seniors will get from that is that Ron wants to yank the rug out from under them, thanks to spin doctors like Huckabee. That's not true. I don't see a problem with the transition method. We simply don't really have the (private) infrastructure in place to support a total removal of SS and Medicare, especially with the economy/tax rates and a whole bunch of other factors the way they are now. People are strapped for cash, and I don't think they will be charitable enough to suddenly take on a whole influx of seniors who hadn't saved enough.

[milo10]

ouch, what's with the hate on diabetics there? :-(

That could have been worded more nicely. Huckabee had or has Type-II diabetes, which is associated with obesity and inactivity/laziness. But, you don't know everything that leads to an illness, so I think stuff like that is better avoided.

[kylejack]

This is why I was seriously disheartened by Ron's performance on the Huckabee forum. Through all those "umms" and "aahs", the only thing that seniors will get from that is that Ron wants to yank the rug out from under them, thanks to spin doctors like Huckabee. That's not true. I don't see a problem with the transition method. We simply don't really have the (private) infrastructure in place to support a total removal of SS and Medicare, especially with the economy/tax rates and a whole bunch of other factors the way they are now. People are strapped for cash, and I don't think they will be charitable enough to suddenly take on a whole influx of seniors who hadn't saved enough.
I actually see continuing to pay benefits for people who paid in as the cheap way out. The alternative is to give them back all the money they paid to payroll taxes, inflation-adjusted. The vast majority of people collect far far less in SS/Medicare benefits than they paid in over their life. It only starts to go the other way for people who live a very long time.

[bluesc]

This is why I was seriously disheartened by Ron's performance on the Huckabee forum. Through all those "umms" and "aahs", the only thing that seniors will get from that is that Ron wants to yank the rug out from under them, thanks to spin doctors like Huckabee. That's not true. I don't see a problem with the transition method. We simply don't really have the (private) infrastructure in place to support a total removal of SS and Medicare, especially with the economy/tax rates and a whole bunch of other factors the way they are now. People are strapped for cash, and I don't think they will be charitable enough to suddenly take on a whole influx of seniors who hadn't saved enough.

You made it very clear how much you disliked his performance in chat. You were actually the person that made it seem like he had just pulled out a gun and shot everyone in the room (I wasn't watching at the time). After re-watching it, to say you overacted would be an understatement.

[Rothbardian Girl]

You made it very clear how much you disliked his performance in chat. You were actually the person that made it seem like he had just pulled out a gun and shot everyone in the room (I wasn't watching at the time). After re-watching it, to say you overacted would be an understatement.
So, should I not criticize him? I'm not trying to troll or be a downer here. I in all likelihood probably did overreact, but you can't say I was the only person critical of his performance, especially in the chatroom that day. The only reason I kept repeating my disapproval (in a slightly joking manner, like how I am in the chatroom) was because it was in response to others saying that Ron did "great". I honestly don't think Ron won anyone over with that interview (which I assume would be the goal of Ron's media appearances). Is it going to torpedo his campaign? No. But I do hope he is able to better condense his message next time.

Kylejack, I don't know much about the financial side of things or the precise ins-and-outs of having to deal with a government program like SS or Medicare, but if you have a better solution (looks like you came up with a perfectly reasonable suggestion in your last post), I'm all ears. Thanks for the clarification.

[kylejack]

I think opt out is the right solution. Unfortunately we have the debt of paying out what's already been promised, but anyone who wants to opt out at any age should be able to.

[bluesc]

So, should I not criticize him? I'm not trying to troll or be a downer here. I in all likelihood probably did overreact, but you can't say I was the only person critical of his performance, especially in the chatroom that day. The only reason I kept repeating my disapproval (in a slightly joking manner, like how I am in the chatroom) was because it was in response to others saying that Ron did "great". I honestly don't think Ron won anyone over with that interview (which I assume would be the goal of Ron's media appearances). Is it going to torpedo his campaign? No. But I do hope he is able to better condense his message next time.

Sure. Criticize him. I did. You definitely took it too far though..

"NOOO!"
"NO RON!"
"OMG NO!"
"NOOO!"
"AHHH NOOO!"

It was one interview. Most of the people watching have probably forgotten it by now. If he did that in every interview, he would be done. He was just tired, and kicked ass in the CNN interview the next day. People overreacting to things is why chat is avoided by a lot of people during debates/interviews. Just a tip for the future (and it goes to others who overreact, although weren't as bad).

[RabbitMan]

So are we going to call up the huckleberry show and complain that they slandered?

[Feeding the Abscess]

This is why I was seriously disheartened by Ron's performance on the Huckabee forum. Through all those "umms" and "aahs", the only thing that seniors will get from that is that Ron wants to yank the rug out from under them, thanks to spin doctors like Huckabee. That's not true. I don't see a problem with the transition method. We simply don't really have the (private) infrastructure in place to support a total removal of SS and Medicare, especially with the economy/tax rates and a whole bunch of other factors the way they are now. People are strapped for cash, and I don't think they will be charitable enough to suddenly take on a whole influx of seniors who hadn't saved enough.

He dropped:

Terrorism is a crime, treat it like such
Everything government does is a mandate; oppose all mandates
Governments cannot do what individuals cannot do is the moral basis for law
The Law
Nullification

In 11 freaking minutes. So he stammered a little. He still kicked major ass

[Feeding the Abscess]

ouch, what's with the hate on diabetics there? :-(

It's hate on Huckabee, who is diabetic because of his life choices.

Type I or Type II diabetes in children is a different issue.

[Rothbardian Girl]

He dropped:

Terrorism is a crime, treat it like such
Everything government does is a mandate; oppose all mandates
Governments cannot do what individuals cannot do is the moral basis for law
The Law
Nullification

In 11 freaking minutes. So he stammered a little. He still kicked major ass
It's great for political junkies like you and me. But to the average American? I don't think so. I don't want to be too harsh on Ron, and bluesc maybe didn't realize that I frequently joke around in the chatroom. I can accept that he was tired, and ordinarily I have been awed at the way he lays down the law in interviews and such. (I watched the CNN interview where he did well, and I was happy about his last debate performance for days afterward.) However, the only argument I have been running into from anti-Ron Paul people is that he isn't presidential enough. While I know that's a stupid criticism, and it's an oft-repeated one, I hate to see negative stereotypes about Ron Paul reinforced.

[ZanZibar]

Could we have a tube of this?

[AGRP]

Ron needs to have a clear and concise response to the SS question so its harder for statists to misconstrue what he says. It takes him a few minutes to answer it and in doing so hes not clear to the average Fox drone.

IE:

Are you in favor of getting rid of SS?

Ron: NO. However, I am in favor of allowing younger people to opt out.

[Sentient Void]

ouch, what's with the hate on diabetics there? :-(

:-(

I'm a diabetic (type-I juvenile 17 yrs ago)... ::goes in the corner and cries::

[cindy25]

Huckabee wants Newt or Perry, resents Romney and Ron maybe because they were opponents 4 years ago

[acptulsa]

It is not an inaccuracy to say that Ron Paul wants to get rid of SS/Medicare. He really does want to do that. He has a plan to do it in a transitional way. Of course, people who don't want to get rid of it are going to have some resistance to the idea that there can be a good transition.

And Huckabee really is right that it hurts us with some voters, especially seniors. The AARP has trained seniors to recognize the weasel words of a politician who intends to cut benefits. Unfortunately for us, they're very similar to some of the things Ron says, so we take the brunt of that, even though Ron has a different plan.

Yeah, but Huckabee is really wrong to insinuate that they will simply be ended, kaput, just like that. And the only reason it hurts us with any significant number of voters is because the how and why of it is completely misrepresented.

Huckabee, in other words, isn't even trying to responsibly fulfill his role as a member of the Fourth Estate. And we need to call him out on it at every opportunity.

[AGRP]

Huckabee wants Newt or Perry, resents Romney and Ron maybe because they were opponents 4 years ago

Huckabee wants whoever he's told to want.